Questions and Answers about the Gulf Oil Catastrophe

[Bill Ryan]

Hi, All:

This thread is for questions (and maybe some answers) about the Gulf Oil Catastrophe.

I'm NOT an engineer, and I don't have any experience in the oil business. I do have a math and physics background and have been spending a lot of time researching this situation. I feel I know a little now about what we're up against.

Because of the updates and summaries I've been posting recently I feel some responsibility in making sure that members (and visitors) understand what's happening - and also don't accidentally misunderstand aspects of the situation.

I know that many Forum members do NOT have science or engineering backgrounds, and some are also fairly young. I'll be happy to answer questions - if I can - in ways that will be as easy as possible to understand. Being informed is better than being frightened because one does not understand the problem.

Others may have better answers than I do, and I want to learn from anyone out there who knows more. If I don't know the answer to something, I'll say so. If I have an opinion, I'll make that clear. If I can cite a fact, I'll give references if and when I can.

If there ARE members who have engineering, geophysics, or oil industry experience, please help me out here publicly or privately. I know there are one or two. There may be quite a few more. If you have experience or information and want to jump in, send me an e-mail and we'll make sure we process your membership as fast as we can.

Bring it on... this is an experimental thread, and if it doesn't work, then we'll soon find out! This kind of thing (in my opinion) is one of the core purposes of the forum - to educate, raise awareness, inform, and grow a feeling of community in a world which may present a few more challenges before we can all return to wherever we came from.

Love to all, Bill

[lightblue]

hi bill
i keep chasing you around with this question, so if you answer it here,please ignore it at your other thread: do you keep in touch with gordon novell and do you know how his project is progressing?

once this leak is contained and touch wood it will, instead of having to go through a massive economic hardship that the elites may choose to impose by manipulating oil prices resulting in shutting down strata of economy and chain affecting different industries, wouldn't it be super timely to have something like release of free energy in place...it's my fantasy at present, but mey be it's not too far off...what do you think?

can't we get novell to sign up for this forum? that would be great.. thanks l

bashi knows a lot about these things, but he's not been around much ...hope he gets back soon..

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by lightblue (here)
do you keep in touch with gordon novel and do you know how his project is progressing?

once this leak is contained and touch wood it will, instead of having to go through a massive economic hardship that the elites may choose to impose by manipulating oil prices resulting in shutting down strata of economy and chain affecting different industries, wouldn't it be super timely to have something like release of free energy in place...it's my fantasy at present, but mey be it's not too far off...what do you think?

Kerry is in occasional contact with Gordon Novel. As best I know he has not yet engineered anything tangible and workable. He's hit a LOT of problems since we first talked with him three years ago.

The positive spin-off from this kind of shared problem (which affects everyone) is that it can bring people together. It can in theory make people angry enough to be proactive (see my Time to get angry thread), and also motivate 'white hat' insiders to come forward and take action. We and they cannot wait forever.

I'm not talking about anger as in the urge to violence (physical or verbal). I'm talking about anger that creates a personal 'tipping point' to decide to make a change, or to do something positive. Anger can change lives, change the world, and get things done.

The relevance to your question is that in my opinion this MIGHT motivate some insiders to come out with the classified technology they already know about and which is already operational... a step ahead of Gordon Novel. Many of the people who are appalled at what has happened are engineers in all disciplines.

In addition: while ETs may not experience anger as animalistic humans do, they might be propelled by a new sense of urgency and decide to help out in unseen ways. This has to be possible. If this does occur, of course, we may never know about it. In a Sci-Fi movie, however, we'd see them coming over the Gulf to dissipate the oil and cauterize the leaks. (Don't hold your breath for that sight... any possible ET fix is likely in my opinion to be far more subtle than that.)

[Peace of Mind]

Ok, I’m game…but first, I must say thanks for everything, your sacrifices and good heartedness is well appreciated…

What are your thoughts on the Sea bed collapsing? When the leak subsides will there be a sink hole? Or could it be a volcano? Someone mentioned the seabed was rising, if so…could it be related to a shift in the planet? I'm also hoping this dosen't have the potential to become a natural bomb…

The following, is a copied and paste of one of my replies I made in another thread…

How thick is this oil? If it is thicker than the surrounding water...will it make the area highly combustible? If it was set a blaze will it look like a whole state is on fire? If so, could the fire reached down thru the funnel of fast spewing oil/methane, and through the leak/tube into the sea bed and blow up the oil reserve? What if the pressure of this leak is so strong that it is pushing away the water from mixing with the gushing oil and methane? Can fire flow through the center of this gushing funnel of oil? Could the dispersants being used aid in this (hopefully inaccurate) theory?

It seems so, because the chemical dispersants (which separates water from oil) are making underwater curtains of oil globs. They mis-calculated a lot already in dealing with this disaster, so I’m hoping I’m wrong in thinking this too…

AND...

Am I the only one thinking the live footage of the leak is a recording being played back continuously, could the leak be much worse than they want us to know so they show us this (looped) live feed to kind of keep us at bay?


Peace

[lightblue]

bill:

The positive spin-off from this kind of shared problem (which affects everyone) is that it can bring people together. It can in theory make people angry enough to be proactive (see my Time to get angry thread), and also motivate 'white hat' insiders to come forward and take action. We and they cannot wait forever.

thanks
and you are right...there's bound to be other people in the know...maybe with more advanced ideas than novel's was at the time that interviews was released..i was impressed as he sounded so determined..but as you say, time is short and many more good people around....l

[LindyLou22]

Thank you for this, Bill. Has there been any official reason given for why the oil-metabolizing microbes have not been used?

[Celine]

Great thread Bill!

This should help keep things clear and concise.

Do you believe boycotts will have an effect? if not what other course of action do you suggest we (general population )take?

[HORIZONS]

It looks to me that the oil is one problem, and we have a general idea what can happen from that, but what about all the gas that is escaping? Is not that even more of a problem, maybe even a more devastating problem in the long term? Then there is all the chemicals that are being used - even more of a problem - short term and long term - but not much info on that issue is out yet??? It seems that the oil is just the tip of the iceberg, and the butterfly effect will be a major issue in the long term. Your thoughts?

[kriya]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
In addition: while ETs may not experience anger as animalistic humans do, they might be propelled by a new sense of urgency and decide to help out in unseen ways. This has to be possible. If this does occur, of course, we may never know about it. In a Sci-Fi movie, however, we'd see them coming over the Gulf to dissipate the oil and cauterize the leaks. (Don't hold your breath for that sight... any possible ET fix is likely in my opinion to be far more subtle than that.)

Sorry no question, just an observation. Maybe we should all put the call out for some assistance! And before people start on about its our mess etc....Sometimes people just need help, and an advanced race could do just that.

Love,

Kriya

[Operator]

Posted by LindyLou22 (here)
Thank you for this, Bill. Has there been any official reason given for why the oil-metabolizing microbes have not been used?

A possible answer could be that they are deliberately not used ... (conspiracy based answer)

The next question I have is: Can they be used since BP sprays a lot of toxic dispersant over the contamination ? Will this kill the microbes too ?

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
What are your thoughts on the Sea bed collapsing? When the leak subsides will there be a sink hole? Or could it be a volcano? Someone mentioned the seabed was rising, if so…could it be related to a shift in the planet? I'm also hoping this dosen't have the potential to become a natural bomb…

I don't see this happening at all. No qualified engineer or geologist has mentioned this as a possibility. I don't see how it can occur.

If we play this fast-forwards to some point when the leak subsides, this would happen naturally when the pressure EQUALIZES. In other words, when the oil/gas pressure falls to be the same as the water pressure at the wellhead, then the oil won't come out any more... and the water won't get in either. It'll be a kind of pressure stalemate.

Besides, long before that the fall in pressure to manageable levels would mean that engineering solutions can be found.

The problem is that [in theory] many years might pass before we get to that point.

The talk of a volcano is uninformed. I certainly don't see that, either. All that's happened (all!! ) is that they have punctured into a natural oil 'artery'. It's like cutting an artery on your arm or leg. The blood would be spurting out all over the place.

The hot, extremely-high-pressure oil and gas has nothing to do with anything volcanic - but it has its own unimaginable elemental force, and does its own huge damage. The oil pressure may be as high as 70,000 psi [4,800 bar], way more than anything ever before encountered in oil exploration. There's no human public-sector technology that can handle that.

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
The following, is a copied and paste of one of my replies I made in another thread…

How thick is this oil? If it is thicker than the surrounding water...will it make the area highly combustible? If it was set a blaze will it look like a whole state is on fire? If so, could the fire reached down thru the funnel of fast spewing oil/methane, and through the leak/tube into the sea bed and blow up the oil reserve? What if the pressure of this leak is so strong that it is pushing away the water from mixing with the gushing oil and methane? Can fire flow through the center of this gushing funnel of oil? Could the dispersants being used aid in this (hopefully inaccurate) theory?

It seems so, because the chemical dispersants (which separates water from oil) are making underwater curtains of oil globs. They mis-calculated a lot already in dealing with this disaster, so I’m hoping I’m wrong in thinking this too…

This is a good question. I'm not sure of my answer, but I THINK that the oil separates into different compounds which are different densities.

The oil film on the water is very thin indeed - way less than a millimeter. But there is also more dense tar which does not always float. There's a lot of oil IN the water, too, not just on the surface. And you're right - the chemical dispersants disguise the problem. It's like using a chemical aerosol spray to get rid of a smell in your house, rather than opening the windows. You've actually ADDED to what's there - not taken anything away.

And the additional chemical may well cause its own knock-on problems. (With the oil dispersants, they CERTAINLY make things worse. And (see later question below) the use of the dispersants certainly kills off all bacteria or microbes that could be dispelling the oil naturally. (Remember, oil is a natural substance and nature CAN deal with it... but not in huge, intense quantities.)

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
Am I the only one thinking the live footage of the leak is a recording being played back continuously, could the leak be much worse than they want us to know so they show us this (looped) live feed to kind of keep us at bay?

You're not the only person who thinks this! Personally, I'm reasonably convinced that the film is live. One reason for this is that the inclinometer measuring the angle at which the BOP (Blowout Preventer) is LEANING is - as far as I understand - increasing its reading. My understanding is that this can be seen on the streaming live video.

This increasing angle, by the way, at which the BOP is leaning, is another cause for concern... there is a risk that it may topple over (causing further problems), and SOMETHING is causing it to lean... probably one aspect of the combination of the high pressures and the damaged well casing (damaged giant pipe). It's evidence that the situation down there is changing all the time and is unstable and not yet controlled (as if we need a reminder...).

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by LindyLou22 (here)
Thank you for this, Bill. Has there been any official reason given for why the oil-metabolizing microbes have not been used?

Not that I'm aware of.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by céline (here)
Do you believe boycotts will have an effect? if not what other course of action do you suggest we (general population )take?

Important question!

My personal opinion is that several things will now happen:

1. -- For many ordinary people -- AND THIS IS HAPPENING ALREADY -- this will be a wake-up call: that we are in deep trouble and we cannot rely on the politicians to fix things up for us. THIS WAKE-UP CALL IS A GOOD THING.
2. -- A lot of people will get very upset and angry and fearful (or a combination of all three).
3. -- There will be demonstrations, riots, even (maybe) domestic terrorism. For a lot of people, what has happened (as it plays out) will be just too much.
4. -- A lot of good people on the 'inside' (including engineers and scientists) will be appalled at what has happened and will start breaking ranks and speaking out. The situation will become more and more volatile. I think we'll see people in Congress yelling at one another - and at the President and Speaker. Good guys in the military will also be appalled and their instinct will be to take action.
5. -- There will be clampdowns of all kinds as the Controllers try to keep the lid on the box.
6. -- As a distraction, we may see a strike against Iran. (Or, more likely, there may be a strike against Iran while everyone is traumatized domestically.)

What all the above means is that the game has been permanently ramped up to the next level - and/or the next stage.

Personally, I'm thinking and feeling: THIS IS IT. WE'RE ON A WAR FOOTING NOW. (This is a metaphor.) I've not felt like this at any time since starting Camelot. Others I know feel the same.

To summarize, I believe we may have entered a new phase of the game, in which

1. -- the stakes are higher
2. -- the Controllers will seize on this to further their agenda, and
3. -- good people will be waking up and mobilizing everywhere.

When I use the word 'mobilizing', I mean that people will be strongly motivated to make some change. For some, this might mean political or social action. For others, it may mean spiritual 'action'. Both forms of response may be valuable and needed.

Note also that many people will feel traumatized and unable to act at all. This will be temporary... but each person will respond differently. As you talk to others, remember that each person will have a different personal response 'strategy' and may need to be supported in different ways (including with patience and understanding).

[Etherios]

So far we have huge amounts of oil being spilled in the gulf and from what is being reported the oil has started moving in the atlantic stream. So how we stop it from polluting all the seas of earth? Has anyone come up with any ways to stop it? Or we can start realizing that in the next years we will start seeing only dead seas all over the planet?

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by HORIZONS (here)
It looks to me that the oil is one problem, and we have a general idea what can happen from that, but what about all the gas that is escaping? Is not that even more of a problem, maybe even a more devastating problem in the long term? Then there is all the chemicals that are being used - even more of a problem - short term and long term - but not much info on that issue is out yet??? It seems that the oil is just the tip of the iceberg, and the butterfly effect will be a major issue in the long term. Your thoughts?

Oil and gas are natural, and Mother Earth CAN handle, disperse AND absorb these - in time. At the moment, of course, she is overwhelmed with the sheer quantity that's there all at once.

My personal opinion is that although the 'natural' chemicals are definitely a theoretical health hazard (see the EPA report graphically described by Lindsey Williams talking with Alex Jones on 10 June), there will be some natural dispersion and dilution and it might not be quite as dangerous as Lindsey was describing.

Having said that, there may possibly be some toxic rains, and already there may be effects on plants, crops, insects and birds in the Gulf - which are not physically affected by oil. I saw a video (which may have been a news report) in which farmers were reporting strange spots appearing on all plants and crops [unselectively]... and birds dying. This looked pretty alarming.

I don't have the link for the video, but an article is here.

Note, of course, that Corexit, the highly toxic oil dispersant used by BP, may be responsible for this. It is totally unclear at the moment.

[JoshERTW]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
Important question!

My personal opinion is that several things will now happen:

1. -- A lot of people will get very upset and angry and fearful (or a combination of all three).
2. -- There will be demonstrations, riots, even (maybe) domestic terrorism. For a lot of people, what has happened (as it plays out) will be just too much.
3. -- A lot of good people on the 'inside' (including engineers and scientists) will be appalled at what has happened and will start breaking ranks and speaking out. The situation will become more and more volatile. I think we'll see people in Congress yelling at one another - and at the President and Speaker. Good guys in the military will also be appalled and their instinct will be to take action.
4. -- For many ordinary people -- AND THIS IS HAPPENING ALREADY -- this will be a wake-up call: that we are in deep trouble and we cannot rely on the politicians to fix things up for us. THIS WAKE-UP CALL IS A GOOD THING.
5. -- There will be clampdowns of all kinds as the Controllers try to keep the lid on the box.
6. -- As a distraction, we may see a strike against Iran. (Or, more likely, there may be a strike against Iran while everyone is traumatized domestically.)

What all the above means is that the game has been permanently ramped up to the next level - and/or the next stage.

Personally, I'm thinking and feeling: THIS IS IT. WE'RE ON A WAR FOOTING NOW. (This is a metaphor.) I've not felt like this at any time since starting Camelot. Others I know feel the same.

To summarize, I believe we may have entered a new phase of the game, in which

1. -- the stakes are higher
2. -- the Controllers will seize on this to further their agenda, and
3. -- good people will be waking up and mobilizing everywhere.

I've had this same feeling for a few months now - it started as a feeling of unease - then the spill started and the unease turned a bit fearful - at this point I've gona beyond the fear and realize the best thing I can do is try to stay informed, and keep others informed via posting video's from youtube, interviews / articles from this forum and others, and hope for the best.

I have a background in fluids engineering, nothing this complicated by a long shot but it is certainly making me think that I may have taken that path educationally and professionally for a reason - and maybe this is it.

Bill, thank you for your most recent blog post with the PDF. The author speaks like a "teacher" with a good grasp of how both hydraulics and specifically oil well construction and operation are handled.

Has the original author listed his qualifications at all (engineer, rig worker, etc.)? As frantic as his message seemed it wasn't as bad as some of the things out there - i.e. collapse of the sea floor etc. I don't personally see how this would work, and if it happened it would be a gradual process - proportional to the flow of the oil.

I also appreciated his description of why they are opening up the well to allow more flow - this makes perfect sense from a perspective of reducing the risk of a catastrophic blow-out somewhere down-pipe. Under this situation a seafloor collapse might be possible depending on the pressure buildup and the surrounding soil/bedrock porosity (void spaces) and mass.

In response to the microbe question I believe the reason they are not using them is simple: Their affiliates do not own the microbe companies - they do however own the dispersant companies - as such the money is moving from the left hand to the right instead of BP having to pay out cash to some "third party" for cleanup. My understanding is they have refused EPA requests to use something less toxic for precisely this reason.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Operator (here)
Can the oil-metabolizing microbes be used since BP sprays a lot of toxic dispersant over the contamination ? Will this kill the microbes too ?

Yes, as far as I am aware Corexit will kill all the beneficial microbes and bacteria.

Three [of many] references about Corexit:

Toxic Oil Spill Rains Warned Could Destroy North America

Are Dispersants Killing Natural Oil Eaters?

Dispersants add to Gulf spill’s toxic threats

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Etherios (here)
So far we have huge amounts of oil being spilled in the gulf and from what is being reported the oil has started moving in the atlantic stream. So how we stop it from polluting all the seas of earth? Has anyone come up with any ways to stop it? Or we can start realizing that in the next years we will start seeing only dead seas all over the planet?

Here's where to see the current size of the oil slick...

http://ifitwasmyhome.com

A neat new site which enables you to 'drop' the slick on to wherever you are right now to see how big it really is.

Like this...



There's an interesting [theoretical!] debate about whether the oil should be concentrated in the Gulf, or allowed to spread further.

In practice, I know of no conceivable engineering way to stop the spread into the Atlantic and beyond.

The 'good news' is that this may allow some dilution and natural dispersal. Much depends on the volume and the duration of the uncontrolled flow.

At the moment (my own calculations) the oil is entering the Gulf at a rate of one Exxon Valdez every three days. Some say every six days. It may be every two days. But it doesn't matter if it goes on until 2011... that could easily be 100x the Exxon Valdez.

AND THE FLOW IS LIKELY TO INCREASE as the well casing becomes eroded through the natural extreme-high-pressure sandblasting, as the flow of oil contains rocks and sand under extreme pressure.

It's important to understand two things:

1 -- The well casing will only last weeks or months before it's worn down to nothing in some places and starts to leak catastrophically. As best I understand, there is no engineering solution for this.

2 -- The failure of the well casing underground (which is why they abruptly halted the 'top kill' operation) MEANS THAT THEY CANNOT NOW EVEN TRY TO SEAL THE WELL HEAD. THEY HAVE TO LET THE OIL FLOW OUT FREELY IN ORDER TO STOP THE WELL CASING FROM BEING FURTHER DAMAGED.

Meanwhile, the only thing they can do is try to collect the oil as it pours out. THEY CANNOT CAP IT NOW. THIS IS ALMOST CERTAINLY IMPOSSIBLE.

To visualize this, imagine a garden hose with holes or rips in it. Most (but not all) of the water is emerging from the nozzle.

But if you block the nozzle, this will force the water (under pressure) out of the holes and rips - making the holes and rips bigger, and maybe destroying the hose. YOU HAVE TO LET THE WATER KEEP FLOWING TO MAINTAIN THE HOSE IN ONE PIECE.

This is the problem. There's no solution for this apart from to try to collect the oil as it streams out. Meanwhile, the natural sandblasting will destroy the well casing anyway, within weeks or months.

After the well casing is destroyed, then the oil really WILL pour out uncontrollably. Then the question is how much is there, and how long the oil will flow for. The bad news is that it could be for a VERY long time.

My personal opinion is that there will be increasing engineering pressure for a nuke to be used. This is not QUITE as crazy as it sounds. The Russians used nukes five times to solve similar problems... in deep wells, on land. Four times out of five it worked. That's close to Russian Roulette. [bad joke, but impossible to resist]

The problem with using a nuke to seal the reservoir seems to me to be - and please note that I am not a geologist - that there could be seismic effects (a tsunami to you and me)... combined with the risk that the strata might be fractured, not sealed, and then ALL the oil would flood out.

That's one of the doomsday scenarios. But I'm pretty sure that this is being debated by engineers behind closed doors right now. (Interestingly, the Russians might offer help.... and I believe they would genuinely want to.)

The problem THERE is that if this situation has been hijacked by the Controllers for their own agenda, as I believe is very likely, then a REAL catastrophe in the Gulf (such as that caused by a nuke failure) might be exactly what they would like to further their own ends.

So while the science suggests that a nuke may be worth considering, the politics suggests that it may be way too likely to be used to create the mother of all 9/11s.

[frank samuel]

Bill for a couple of years now I have thought about viable energy sources to break away from our dependence on oil.
As the gas prices went up people began to become desperate about finding alternative solutions, once the price of the barrel came back down things went back to normal. This recent blunder will create a public outcry the likes of which we have not seem in a very long time.
My question to you is, from your point of view, what practical alternative energy sources do you think we can implement now to break away from our oil dependence ?

Blessings to you Bill and thank you for this thread..

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by JoshERTW (here)
Bill, thank you for your most recent blog post with the PDF. The author speaks like a "teacher" with a good grasp of how both hydraulics and specifically oil well construction and operation are handled.

Has the original author listed his qualifications at all (engineer, rig worker, etc.)? As frantic as his message seemed it wasn't as bad as some of the things out there - i.e. collapse of the sea floor etc. I don't personally see how this would work, and if it happened it would be a gradual process - proportional to the flow of the oil.

I also appreciated his description of why they are opening up the well to allow more flow - this makes perfect sense from a perspective of reducing the risk of a catastrophic blow-out somewhere down-pipe. Under this situation a seafloor collapse might be possible depending on the pressure buildup and the surrounding soil/bedrock porosity (void spaces) and mass.

In response to the microbe question I believe the reason they are not using them is simple: Their affiliates do not own the microbe companies - they do however own the dispersant companies - as such the money is moving from the left hand to the right instead of BP having to pay out cash to some "third party" for cleanup. My understanding is they have refused EPA requests to use something less toxic for precisely this reason.

Josh, I agree with you 100% on all counts.

The author of the PDF didn't list his credentials... but he very clearly knew exactly what he was talking about. I learned a great deal from going through it carefully.