Armed Avalonians?

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by pie'n'eal (here)
I suppose I'll just have to shout...BANG!

When I was in the army, we used to joke that the australian army was a brown paper bag with the word BANG written on it.
That was back in the days when we used to mind our own business.

[Fred Steeves]

Posted by DNA (here)

Posted by vibrations (here)
Reading all the posts in this thread, one question starting to emerge. All this people, gun lovers are the same people seeking for so called "ascension"?

Just because some one owns a gun and believes in owning them doesn't per se make them a gun lover. This doesn't have to be us vs them. This doesn't need to be the lotus holding pacificsts versus the Kill em all and let god sort em out militia men.

If you feel gun owning does something to you that is undesirable, then I applaud your choice in not owning one.

You beat me to it DNA. I find it rather amusing drinking my coffee this morning being referred to as a gun lover. Jeez, you would think I pull the old 12 gauge out every day just to lament on it's magnificence, then maybe fondle some various ammo for a while. I think not. For me, a gun is a tool, a defense tool for myself and possibly others, and nothing else. I've owned firearms since 2003, and other than those closest to me, no-one I encounter in daily life since then even has a clue. It's not something I go around flaunting or talking about, that would be ridiculous.

I own and drive a truck, but that doesn't make me a truck lover.

I own a wide display of carpentry tools, but I wouldn't consider myself a tool lover.

Please do be careful with labels vibrations, just because one makes a well thought out decision to own firearms to protect their family, does not not make them morally or spiritually inferior. It just is.

Cheers,
Fred

[taurad]

it is not black and white, ppl!!!

150% grey area!!!

and please, please do not draw your magnums out...yet...we can settle this peacefully

[mahalall]

Last night i sat in depth, and saw the chasing violent rage of Maul.
Faced with wrath,
but present in serenity.
I expanding out,
together we sat,
sharing truth.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=q8TWPNUBafQ

[161803398]

Having said all that I had a friend whose brother was living in South America. They were an interesting family -- definitely each of them walked to a different beat. It was always mind expanding being around them, even for tea, because they never did anything normal. My friend told me that once her brother in South America was chased by a gang of men carrying machetes. He started running fast. He got tired. Then he just stopped, sat down and started to meditate. The gang caught up to him but didn't seem to know what to do and left him alone.

Now, not one of them would have even touched a gun saying it would be "bad Karma". To give an example, my friend had a bike without a lock for it. She rode it everywhere. She used to take it to Vancouver, leave it leaning unlocked up against a parking meter or a pole, and go shopping for a couple of hours. It never got stolen. Her boyfriend kept telling her to get a lock for it. Finally, one day she did....and you know what happened, right?

[Lost Soul]

The Second Amendment of the United States Constitution was not written for hunting purposes. When the Second Amendment was written, if you did not hunt, you did not eat.

The Second Amendment was included in the Bill of Rights to reserve in the people the power to defend themselves against tyranny. It's not about duck hunting.

While all members of Avalon here believe in peace, that does not mean that one must sit idly by and be victimized. Anyone with any sense of self respect and dignity will want the means to protect themselves and their family - that is, unless they feel the lives of murderers and rapists are more important that the lives of their loved ones or themselves.

There has been at least one instance where a military medic picked up a gun to defend his patient. The medic had no desire to be a combatant and that is why he became a medic, but when the compelling need to defend a defenseless and injured patient arises, that medic overcame his own desire not to take a life.

A decent person would do the same for their spouse, children and parents. It's not about taking a life, it's about defending oneself and others.

Pray it doesn't happen and do your best to avoid it, but when violence comes your way, be prepared to deal with it.

[Calz]

Will do a "dangerous" thing here and post based on the OP without reading through the thread ...

I am an Avalonian.

I wish no one anywhere any harm.

I understand completely that we are all connected (not just humans).


....


Someone breaks into my home with the intent to harm my family will receive as many rounds of buckshot as necessary.

Knock on the door and say you need food or water ... then we shall talk

[Calz]

Posted by Ivanhoe (here)
Even though I hate violence, if my home or my family or friends were threatened with violence I would respond in kind, even knowing the resultant karma.

No ... all about intent ... you have no karma to incure if you are defending you or your family.

IMHO

[Lazlo]

Let's be honest here, I stated in my previous post that I believe an armed populace is a bulwark against tyranny. That is true.

But, in a TEOTWAKI scenario, I expect to use my gun to feed myself and my family. I do not expect to die in an Alamo style blaze of glory fighting the good fight.

For all intents and purposes, my guns are fishing poles.

[1159]

Guns are for taking life, or causing exteme injury. They are outdated, technology that should never be used by enlightened people. If you need to prevent an agressor overpowering you, there are other methods and other devices that temporarly paralyse them without loss of life or injury. Killing one another for defense, or to gain supremacy is so ... passe and primative.

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by 1159 (here)
Guns are for taking life, or causing exteme injury. They are outdated, technology that should never be used by enlightened people. If you need to prevent an agressor overpowering you, there are other methods and other devices that temporarly paralyse them without loss of life or injury. Killing one another for defense, or to gain supremacy is so ... passe and primative.

I disagree totally.
I would carry the karma to protect those I love if I had no option other than to ''kill'' the aggressor.

[Jean-Marie]

Posted by 1159 (here)
Guns are for taking life, or causing exteme injury. They are outdated, technology that should never be used by enlightened people. If you need to prevent an agressor overpowering you, there are other methods and other devices that temporarly paralyse them without loss of life or injury. Killing one another for defense, or to gain supremacy is so ... passe and primative.

I completely disagree with the "Guns are for taking of Life, or causing extreme injury" I am an excellent shot with a 12 gauge! I spend all my free time up at boyscout camp at the shotgun range. For me it is a sport and I have only shot clay or skeet flying in the air.

[Zampano]

Why do you disagree on that? Would you prefer to kill someone instead of using a device, where a lethal end would not (or hardly) be possible?
Defending yes-killing no!

[Calz]

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)

Posted by 1159 (here)
Guns are for taking life, or causing exteme injury. They are outdated, technology that should never be used by enlightened people. If you need to prevent an agressor overpowering you, there are other methods and other devices that temporarly paralyse them without loss of life or injury. Killing one another for defense, or to gain supremacy is so ... passe and primative.

I disagree totally.
I would carry the karma to protect those I love if I had no option other than to ''kill'' the aggressor.

My family means everthing to me.

I wish no harm to anyone ... but threaten my family and all bets are off.

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by Zampano (here)
Why do you disagree on that? Would you prefer to kill someone instead of using a device, where a lethal end would not (or hardly) be possible?
Defending yes-killing no!

I did six years in the army and I have training in the killing arts.
Whilst you are messing around trying to disable someone to stop them, they have already killed you.
Could you tell me what device you are going to use?

[Unified Serenity]

I don't think consensus will be reached here, and doubt many of us expect that to happen. There are those who will never support firearms and others who will stand by their firm belief that having a firearm for defense is a smart thing to do given the possibility of facing an assailant any given time who has no problem harming others. Had we never discovered gun powder, the power of the atom, metallurgy, we would probably be having the argument over the possession of dangerous rocks and sticks. Some within society choose to solve their problems by means of violence. Very few people are going to just let someone assault them or their friends and family nor do I believe they should.

The fact of the matter is men are generally stronger than women. A handgun is an amazing equalizer in the case of a man attacking a woman. Many men also do not want to get into physical confrontations with an attacker and they are protective of their children and families. What is he to do if several men are breaking into his home and threatening his family? Should he try to take them all on like he's Jackie Chan? It is sound to consider the possibilities and take precautions to protect your home and family in the best means possible. Whether you live out in the country or in the city there is a chance you will have to protect yourself from an attacker. I live in the country and we have bears, puma's, snakes, dogs, and people of all temperaments. Most people in the country do have a firearm and therefore there are few people breaking into homes out here. When I worked in law enforcement we talked about the lack of crime out in the county vs. the city. It was our clear viewpoint it was simply because everyone has a gun in the country while in the city a criminal is less likely to face an armed victim.

Cops who protect the public are wonderful, but sadly they are usually on scene after a crime is committed gathering information and writing a report. I agree with the person who said, "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6". I pray I never have to harm another, but if I am confronted with that situation I will protect my friends and family to my dying breath.

[Zampano]

electric shock bullets, bean bags, rubber bullets, pepper pistol, rock salt shotgun...

It depends on the situation where you have to use the weapon. I think when somebody is in your house and you have to defend yourself, this devices mentioned above would be suitable.
If there is chaos on the streets and an angry mob wants to get you, well I guess you will not come far with a rubber bullet.

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by Zampano (here)
electric shock bullets, bean bags, rubber bullets, pepper pistol, rock salt shotgun...

It depends on the situation where you have to use the weapon. I think when somebody is in your house and you have to defend yourself, this devices mentioned above would be suitable.
If there is chaos on the streets and an angry mob wants to get you, well I guess you will not come far with a rubber bullet.

And what do you do when you meet someone like me who has a very high pain threshold and a high tolerance too?
Or someone on PCP?
My sensei used me as the guinea pig when the school got together for weekend training because he could actually hit and kick me without it hurting me.
And I can take a lot of damage without being taken down.
If you shot me with a bean bag round, even at point blank, if it didn't take out my eye or something like that, you would make me so angry I would feel nothing.
And I would probably turn your shotgun into a suppository.

[Unified Serenity]

Posted by Zampano (here)
electric shock bullets, bean bags, rubber bullets, pepper pistol, rock salt shotgun...

It depends on the situation where you have to use the weapon. I think when somebody is in your house and you have to defend yourself, this devices mentioned above would be suitable.
If there is chaos on the streets and an angry mob wants to get you, well I guess you will not come far with a rubber bullet.

I understand your point about not needing excessive force. I just don't think we live in a very sane time. We will see an increase in home invasions especially as the holidays get closer. Most of the home invasions have two or more assailants to deal with the people inside the home. They are also prepared for confrontation. I would not want to put my families life on the line with a bean bag gun. Now until I master my latest Jedi moves of telekinesis and molecular attacks, I think I will trust in the trusty shotgun or other home defense weapon. The punji sticks hidden in holes outside are also useful j/k.

[Calz]

All due respect ... and I mean that quite sincerely as I wish no harm to anyone ... if an "angry mob" (read hungry) mob is breaking into your home ... I don't think rubber bullets or other "non lethal" means will "save the day".

Let me be clear. I have never struck anyone in my life (much less killed or wounded them).

I will not give up that mark unless necessary.

6 rounds of buckshot can do a whole lotta damage to a whole lotta folks.

I will not go there unless given no choice.

Cal