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Thread: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

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    Avalon Member Shadowman's Avatar
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    Default Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    This is an account of the direct experience of awakening.

    What can be said, or written, of itself cannot reveal the truth.

    Words and language are themselves an illusory tool, an aspect of the relative dream, and can only indicate or hint towards the totality, or reality, or that which is.

    Upon the moment of awakening not only does the illusion of the relative self or ego vanish like a shadow exposed to light, but all “other” egos, or relative selves, disappear. All separation disappears, and the absolute Self is realized. All is then enlightened and whole, for there never really were separate entities that could become individually enlightened. There then is no relative doer, nor even an absolute doer, for all doing implies separation. Or something to do, or somewhere to go. And not just other humans, but the entire creation is enlightened and whole.

    Now nothing can be judged, or observed, or transcended, as there is no separate observer, nor separate objects observed, nor even separate observing.

    Here even the concept of pure awareness, the witness, unidentified with that which is observed, has dissolved into the totality. Herein lies the meaning of samsara is nirvana. The slightest separation into observer, observed and observing and samsara appears. When observer, observed and observing is an undifferentiated whole, the Self is self evident, and far more evident, than the illusory ego self.

    All that is, then is, as it really is, here descriptions do not apply.

    Now, what is missing from the above description of the direct experience of enlightenment?

    It is the pronoun, I, for in truth there is no I, either relatively or absolutely. I implies a separation from totality, as the first person singular. Whereas the adjective Self, implies being the same throughout, as the self evident united reality/totality/all that is, and is more appropriate at hinting towards the truth.

    You are in reality this Self, all else is illusion.
    Relatively, this is the end of suffering. This is the beginning of endless bliss.
    Absolutely, all suffering is unreal. Only the blissful Self is real.
    This is the eternal Truth.


    Edit to add on 2/5/12

    Insha’Allah (God willing), a response will be offered to the first comment/question of each poster, in due course.

    Due to time restraints and circumstances, subsequent comments and questions may or may not receive a response, preference will be given to authentic enquiries.

    The more heartfelt the first question/comment, the more earnest the seeker, the greater the likelihood of deriving benefit.

    Your first question/comment should cover that which you consider to be of paramount importance to your own awakening/enlightenment.

    With Love/Namaste
    tim


    PS To clarify the definition of enlightenment, in the context that the term is applied in the title of this thread, an examination of the following links may prove helpful, for those with more than just a casual interest;

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlight...28spiritual%29
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self_realization
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhi
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daigo_%28Zen%29
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turiya
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahman
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C4%80tman_%28Hinduism%29]
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nirvana..._and_True_Self
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hesychasm
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigpa
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzogchen
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satori
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhahood#Ten_Epithets
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tath%C4%81gata
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upanishads
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nirvana_%28concept%29
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tathata
    Last edited by Shadowman; 5th May 2012 at 03:31.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Nothing Real Can Be Threatened,
    Nothing Unreal Exists!
    Therein Lies The Peace Of GOD!!

    From A Course In Miracles!

    HUGS...........Godiam

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Thank you, Tim.

    Succint....I like it

    A simple, uncluttered and uncomplicated description.

    Jeanette

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Yes yes yes. That was really really good! That's a good solid attempt to explain the unexplainable. I'm sure he was laughing when he wrote it.
    Even a minute of that experience changes everything about you.

    But it's only not explainable because it's so personal, and so not what you'd think. How do you express how simple and how ordinary reality is? It's ordinary because something is finally real. It's normal to be in joy. Nothing opposes it.
    It's normal to be free. There is no such thing as not free. Your Self is an experience of that, not an identity. Your experience of everything is of knowing it. But as soon as you begin to observe and interpret and analyze again it's gone.
    So you see you make a choice in how you think, not what you think but 'how'.
    And realize that you hadn't made a choice to be 'enlightened' or whatever term you like,
    because you were just full of ideas and could never have known.
    It's the one single thing that you couldn't have imagined was your hearts only desire, that had never left you.

    But here's the thing that messes with the conditioned mind; you're still you, and your outer life might not change in any regard.

    So now that you know all about it, is it attractive enough? What would you exchange for that?
    Last edited by markpierre; 28th March 2012 at 13:27.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    This is a picture taken of an event................



    Endless, nah........

    Eternal, well.........

    All is well


    Jorr

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    All that can be said is--- thanks for firsthand sharing Tim.
    Almost said "by "ME"
    The pronoun is becoming redundant.

    Chris
    A charity to help African Children become self sufficient. :attention:

    http://www.learningtoolsforselfdevelopment.co.uk/

    Be kind to all life, including your own, no matter what!!

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by markpierre (here)
    So now that you know all about it, is it attractive enough? What would you exchange for that?
    Ev'rything.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by meeradas (here)
    Quote Posted by markpierre (here)
    So now that you know all about it, is it attractive enough? What would you exchange for that?
    Ev'rything.
    I believe you.

    You know how devastation tends to sort out the value of things? I don't advocate devastation because I don't believe that it's necessary.
    But devastation isn't a problem, recovering is a problem. Don't recover.
    Last edited by markpierre; 29th March 2012 at 12:11.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by tim (here)
    and the absolute Self is realized

    Self is Spirit is God


    saints and sages are immersed in Spirit

    while men are immersed in mind


    it is the grace of God that turn men into saints


    what most men think of as Self is just self or mind

    imaginations


    God is in complete control

    and there is nothin we can do about it


    mind must go if Self is to be realized

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    You have to be willing to give it all up only to get it all back in the end...

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Samadhi is what breaks us free from so many lies. Even though I had my experiences some decades ago I'll disagree on a couple of points.

    Suffering is real while in a human mind and human consciousness, else you would have no compassion when you see someone that is suffering. You care to walk by a child with a bone sticking through the skin and tell him/her that it does not hurt and continue walking on your way?

    Also, I may be taking this incorrectly but while in the experience (at least mine), there was not an overpowering love involved....you simply were God (all that is, ever was, and ever will be). You are the most hideous creature that ever existed or will exist, .......plus you are the highest saint. To take only the love portion of an experience means you fail to see the contrasting parts as well. God is not only good, but it is evil as well.

    Rich

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by Oouthere (here)
    To take only the love portion of an experience means you fail to see the contrasting parts as well. God is not only good, but it is evil as well.

    Rich
    So how do you separate love from the rest of totality, so that you can take only that portion?

    Love IS dispassionate, or you couldn't accept evil. Evil is just a mistaken idea.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    "God brings good and evil" is stated in the OT somewhere. But after a lifetime of searching I now believe that we were created by the "gods" mentioned in the OT and Sumerian tablets and other places.

    But what created them and all of creation. There's no way of knowing that. If we spoke with the advanced celestial ancestors they might have some idea, or not, as even they can not know endless space and time. imo.

    There is evil in existence and may be a creation of our consciousness or just inevitable which is easy to see. Our concern is to end it to the extent that we can, or at least give it our best shot.

    P.S. Or maybe nothing was created and everything came about and comes about through an always-was force that just set off reproduction and cycles in everything. And one somewhat intelligent group set itself up as being superior to other groups and so it goes on with life teeming is unending space.
    Last edited by East Sun; 28th March 2012 at 14:27. Reason: To add P.S.
    Question Everything, twice or maybe trice..........

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by East Sun (here)
    "God brings good and evil" is stated in the OT somewhere. But after a lifetime of searching I now believe that we were created by the "gods" mentioned in the OT and Sumerian tablets and other places.
    God of the OT used both the Assyrians and later the Babylonians to humble His people

    so the lesson is that when men choose to forget God and follow their own minds

    then men will descend into unrighteousness

    which is not at all pleasin to God


    the gods of old are fallen finite spirits

    and they made some hybrids with humans


    and it is possible that the PTB are hybrids

    in league with their fathers the fallen spirits


    but we are not all hybrids

    most are human

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by RedeZra (here)
    Quote Posted by East Sun (here)
    "God brings good and evil" is stated in the OT somewhere. But after a lifetime of searching I now believe that we were created by the "gods" mentioned in the OT and Sumerian tablets and other places.
    God of the OT used both the Assyrians and later the Babylonians to humble His people

    so the lesson is that when men choose to forget God and follow their own minds

    then men will descend into unrighteousness

    which is not at all pleasin to God


    the gods of old are fallen finite spirits

    and they made some hybrids with humans


    and it is possible that the PTB are hybrids

    in league with their fathers the fallen spirits


    but we are not all hybrids

    most are human
    You can personify it and call it God if you like. But in that particular example you can also call it cause and effect or karma. Nothing real that was ever seemingly 'fallen' has ever been in anything other than a state of return.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Hiya Mark,

    If you separate love from the rest of totality....it is simply love and not God as a whole (or not as God is everything that is and is not). I don't believe love is dispassionate, imo it is the highest attribute of God. And even if evil is a mistaken idea it is also part of god but in that context....everything is God.

    Rich

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Any members here who consider themselves to be enlightened?

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Enlightenment is fully appreciating the fact that there is no such thing as enlightenment.

    No human has ever been enlightened, nor are we here to "get enlightened".

    We're here to learn how to do the right thing (imho).


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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by markpierre (here)

    You can personify it and call it God if you like. But in that particular example you can also call it cause and effect or karma. Nothing real that was ever seemingly 'fallen' has ever been in anything other than a state of return.

    i'm sure there is intelligence behind karma dispensation


    i view God as the Almighty Spirit

    imperial impartial but not unpersonal


    fallen spirits and demons are as real as the angels and us

    they fell as low as they were heigh in the spiritual hierarchy


    they knew God and still they chose to rebel

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    Default Re: Enlightenment - A direct, succinct account of what occurs...

    Quote Posted by RedeZra (here)
    fallen spirits and demons are as real as the angels and us

    they fell as low as they were high in the spiritual hierarchy
    Hierarchical power structures, also known as pyramid schemes, are set up so that all of the wealth and resources flow to the few at the top, while those at the bottom struggle and compete for the scarcity which is implicit in such a design. Also implicit in this design, is that those who are competing with their brethren need to adopt the mandates of those at the top of the pyramid, and surrender their will and power to them.

    To say that the spiritual realms are set up hierarchically, is derived from the same elite power mongers who wrote such a patriarchal pyramid into their instruction book, the bible, at the Roman Elite Council of Nicaea, and designed it to propagate their hierarchical power pyramid, which has nothing to do with spirituality, enlightenment, or unity with the divine in all things.

    Fallen angels and spirits means that these souls fell from the top of the power pyramid and needed to subjugate themselves to those at the top in order to redeem their place in the hierarchy? I think not. BOTH polarities of light and dark, Yin and Yang, positive and negative, male and female, left and right etc. are part of the universal matrix of all things and to judge such energies as "evil" and separate only serves the patriarchal structure which has spent eon's trying to sell us that the opposite is to be severed from the whole and that the higher dimensions are hierarchical.

    That is a lie in my opinion, and I'm not afraid to expose it for what it is
    Last edited by gripreaper; 28th March 2012 at 19:13.

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