The 'Shroud of Turin' is FAKE..!

[jackovesk]

The Turin Shroud is a fake… and it’s one of 40: Historian claims linen cloths were produced 1,300 years after crucifixion

10 June 2012

Not only is the Turin Shroud probably a medieval fake but it is just one of an astonishing 40 so-called burial cloths of Jesus, according to an eminent church historian.

Antonio Lombatti said the false shrouds circulated in the Middle Ages, but most of them were later destroyed.

He said the Turin Shroud itself – showing an image of a bearded man and venerated for centuries as Christ’s burial cloth – appears to have originated in Turkey some 1,300 years after the Crucifixion.


The Turin Shroud was believed to have covered Jesus, but a leading Church historian says it is one of many produced over a thousand years after his death

Lombatti, of the Università Popolare in Parma, Italy, cited work by a 19th century French historian who had studied surviving medieval documents. ‘The Turin Shroud is only one of the many burial cloths which were circulating in the Christian world during the Middle Ages. There were at least 40,’ said Lombatti.

‘Most of them were destroyed during the French Revolution. Some had images, others had blood-like stains, and others were completely white.’

The Turin Shroud is a linen cloth, about 14ft by 4ft, bearing a front and back view of the image of a bearded, naked man who appears to have been stabbed or tortured. Ever since the detail on the cloth was revealed by negative photography in the late 19th century it has attracted thousands of pilgrims to the Cathedral of St John the Baptist in Turin.

In a research paper to be published this month in the scholarly journal Studi Medievali, Lombatti says the shroud was most likely given to French knight Geoffroy de Charny as a memento from a crusade to Smyrna, Turkey, in 1346. The de Charny family are the first recorded owners of the shroud.


The image has bewitched believers and sceptics alike since the negative image, right, was revealed in the late 19th century

Lombatti found that Geoffroy was unable to join a pilgrimage to Jerusalem after liberating Smyrna, so he was given the shroud as a symbol of his participation in the crusade to Turkey.

The Catholic Church has never officially commented on the shroud’s authenticity, but has made samples available to scientists for testing.

In 2009 a Vatican researcher said she had found the words ‘Jesus Nazarene’ on the cloth, while two years later Italian government researchers claimed the image of a man had been caused by a supernatural ‘flash of light’.

But carbon tests carried out in Oxford in 1988 firmly dated the material to 1260-1390.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ucifixion.html

PS - Before I start my Rant, I just want to say I 'Never' believed the 'Shroud of Turin' belonged to Jesus in the 1st place..!

Aren't you getting tired of all the the Elite & their Minions continue to 'Spew' all around the world..? Well I am...

Lie after Lie after Lie - Deception after Deception after Deception (A revolving door)..!

Well the 'Sh#t' that's a stickin, is on the Elite/Minion decievers themselves. They (Reek of the the Smelly Stench) and it will be the culmination of the (Neverending Story of Lies) that will be their undoing..!

I am starting to get really Sick & Tired of living in a world where LIERS & CROOKS run the show..!

[Chuck]

Many believe that the image on the Shroud of Turin was that of Jacques de Molay, the last Grand Master of the Order of Knights Templar.

[kreagle]

jackovesk,

Isn't is amazing how the "truth" always comes out,.....eventually?

Luke 8:17
King James Version (KJV)

17 For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad.

It was always obvious to me that God would never allow such a "Holy Event" as the Crucifixion, to be dragged around in such a "carnival-type" fashion, as we have all seen from this "fraudulent" display.

I am "really interested" in your final comment on your OP,.....which states,....."I am starting to get really Sick & Tired of living in a world where LIERS & CROOKS run the show..!

Approximately 32 years ago,.....I, too, became "Sick & Tired" of the "garbage" that "this world" was trying to "shove down my throat"!

Believe it or not,....."this is exactly" the "first step" a person needs to take, in order to be "spiritually persuaded" to "eat off of another type of plate"!!!

I hope you are "really" as Sick & Tired as you say you are.

May God bless you on your "journey"!,........kreagle

[Anchor]

Posted by kreagle (here)
It was always obvious to me that God would never allow such a "Holy Event" as the Crucifixion, to be dragged around in such a "carnival-type" fashion, as we have all seen from this "fraudulent" display.

I admire the passion, but question the logic: God "permits" a number of things which do not seem, on the surface all that nice. Why should dragging around a "holy event" be any different?

I think it more likely that the fakes are an early medieval disinformation campaign to discredit a burial shroud which contains the image of a dying human. The shroud which has had imprinted within it, an image of that person in a mysteriously accurate manner.

Such things should never see the light of day should they?

Heaven forbid that this convinces anyone that we are eternal!!!

Note also that I did not say the shroud was that of Jesus.

[danceblackcatdance]

sorry....

[Lifebringer]

Darn Jack, you didn't know that. They make the most money on the fakes in tourism.

It's the reason for so many being hoodwinked. When they first tested it on history channel's investigation, they had stated there was a problem with carbon dating, and the type of linen used back in Christ's day. Just goes to show you, they'll sell Jesus for a buck.
Religious leaders, go figure.

Epitome of greed and phychological mind manipulation of the masses. Hope it didn't hurt to bad to find it out. Just another part of the matrix...

[Lifebringer]

Not being facetious, but has there ever been an ancient tribe that is connected to the Caucasian Race? I haven't seen anything other than the Roman empire cemetary scenerio, but I'm talking about way back in the day? I just wonder because they are still even after Hitler, continuing the search, and so far, tis still a mystery. When did the tribe arrive and from whom did they spring forth. There are certain parts of history, that are unknown to me, but I stills search. The caveman with matted hair and skins, was all I was able to come across, so still I search, but if you could relay on just where these people originated, i would apprieciate it. I simply can't trust a religious person, they spin tales. Please elaborate on where such origins occurred and the dated tribe from whom they sprung.

I can't help but wonder, if this mystery is the reason for all the archaeologic diggings over the past three or so centuries.
Really am curious, and serious. Neanderthal...?? I mean when the tower of Bable was knocked down and the languages and tribes scattered, where did they come from. This all happened in Middle East or whole continent when connected. You have the Sumerians, Aztecs, Myans, Asian, but like I said, I have not found any of the missing blanks in my search for origins of history.

If there is someone who can assist me with connecting the dots, I would very much appreciate it.

One of the reasons I come to Avalon, is because the answers are in someone's knowledge to be shared, and its not a place to be ashamed to ask, if done so humbly and respectfully.

[kreagle]

Posted by Anchor (here)

Posted by kreagle (here)
It was always obvious to me that God would never allow such a "Holy Event" as the Crucifixion, to be dragged around in such a "carnival-type" fashion, as we have all seen from this "fraudulent" display.

I admire the passion, but question the logic: God "permits" a number of things which do not seem, on the surface all that nice. Why should dragging around a "holy event" be any different?

I think it more likely that the fakes are an early medieval disinformation campaign to discredit a burial shroud which contains the image of a dying human. The shroud which has had imprinted within it, an image of that person in a mysteriously accurate manner.

Such things should never see the light of day should they?

Heaven forbid that this convinces anyone that we are eternal!!!

Note also that I did not say the shroud was that of Jesus.

Anchor,

I understand your point of view. My view,....as you have alluded to in your reply,....is that,....in reality,....."this Holy Event" has not been drug through the muck mire of public scrutiny,......only an "impostor", conjured up in the hearts of evil men inspired and directed by satanic forces.

Certainly, at one point, a "real shroud", or burial cloth, existed,.....but I agree wholeheartedly that it "never saw, or would see, the light of day".

I am convinced that the only reason a "Shroud of Turin" suddenly surfaced, years ago, was to present "something tangible" to the people, as to bolster their belief in God, and at the same time to add further "manufactured" credence to the belief system coming out of the Vatican.

The very concept of "having something tangible",....something the people could now "see and feel",.....actually goes against what Jesus endeavored to, not only teach Thomas, but to teach "all of us" today!

Notice the following text,......

John 20:24-31
King James Version (KJV)

24 But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came.

25 The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe.

26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you.

27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.

28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

30 And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:

31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

You see, there is no substitution for "faith"!

"Faith", when properly employed,.... goes into all of the hidden "crevices" of mankind's heart and validates your "experience in God"!!

Hebrews 11:6
King James Version (KJV)

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

I think we could all gain a lot of wisdom from God's Word,.....in not waiting around like Thomas did in order to "feel and touch" Him,....in order to "believe",.....or to rely upon someone to "manufacture" a fraudulent burial shroud for us to "see and handle".

God bless you,....my friend,..........kreagle

[kreagle]

Posted by danceblackcatdance (here)
sorry....

danceblackcatdance,

Saw your original post, prior to your "edit". No offense taken,......my friend.

May God bless you,......Love and Peace,......kreagle

[danceblackcatdance]

aw, thx and to you... i feel all warm and fuzzy now

[sdv]

Jackovesk, I saw a video about an investigation into the Turin shroud (actually made by a Roman Catholic) that gave evidence of the shroud being a fake and explanations of the history of the trade in holy relics. There is also speculation that Leonardo Da Vinci created this particular fake (however, the dates don't match up). What fascinates me is how the shroud was made, because it does have special qualities. What has made it difficult to make a comploete analysis is the Roman Catholic church restgricting access to the relic.

Christianity is a cult, and just like any cult one of the characteristics is that members of the cult try to recruit others, blind belief is another, (hence all the propogation of preaching posts on a thread such as this). There is so much evidence that the Bible and the whole Christian movement are human-made (the recent Vatileaks scandal gives more evidence of this), yet no evidence that Jesus ever existed as a real person (the scanty evidence put forward by the Christian cultists just does not stand up to reasonable scrutiny).

Any yes I do agree with you that it is all deliberate lies of manipulation (those who created the Bible and the religion and the myth of Jesus were well aware of what they were doing). Look at how powerful and wealthy the Roman Catholic church still is!

Believers in the cult will not have any interest in threads such as this, other than for preaching and trying to convert, but I am interested in the how the Turin Shroud was made so hopefully that information will soon be published.

[foreverfan]

Never looked to the shroud for faith. It's more of a bizarre oddity of history. It is most likely a fake, but from what I understand, it cannot be proven either way. Still the 3D image is bizarre and from what I understand, the do not know how the image got there.

[witchy1]

"If there is someone who can assist me with connecting the dots, I would very much appreciate it."

Hi Lifebringer - this should resolve your issue...........

http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/journey/

Sorry its not on yt, but does show where we began......

"Who were our ancestors? From where did we originate? If we came out of Africa, what governed our migration routes? And when? Finally this interactive map reveals the epic journey.

From Proffessor Stephen Oppenheimer and Bradshaw http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/ and http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/st...ppenheimer.php He wrote out of Eden

[Mike Gorman]

There was an exhaustive re-analysis of the Shroud only a couple of years back. The original tests where the Carbon 14 dating was carried out
were actually using a section of the cloth that had been repaired in the 13th Century, following a fire that nearly destroyed the shroud.
I claim no Catholic, or Christian bias here. The researcher who recently died, discovered that the image is actually 3D, and a negative image.
There seems to be a contingency that seeks to re-hash old arguments about the shroud to discredit it. Yes, there have been many fakes, but No, this shroud
has not been 'proven a fake'-I challenge this church historian to refute the most recent findings. If you can account for the fact that the image as rendered
is Holographic, and has more in common with the Crop circles than it does with photography, or clever image creation-there are no pigments. I have no idea if this image is of Jesus,
but it is damned uncanny, and has most certainly not been proven to be a fake. This BBC documentary discusses this: http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rc...b1Gy1EU0fVVvbQ

[SKAWF]

i'm one of those that believes the bible is largely symbolic, and not to be taken literally.

what got me onto that was the christmas thing.

how the sun died, was dead for three days, and then resurrected
(oops, i mean the son dont i!?)

and how this relates to the actual sun's 'high point' being lower and lower in the sky until the 21st of december, staying at its lowest point for three days, and then on the 25th, rising slightly higher again.

and how the three kings, are the three stars in orions belt,
and if you were to draw a line from the star of the east,
and take it through orions belt,
and bring it down to the horizon, that would be where the new sun/son would be born.

also this.....



being a symbolic representation of the sun, and the four seasons....
see how there are 4 groups of three disciples.

just lately i have been looking at presentations by santos bonacci.

erm....... and dean clifford (but thats something else)

so its not that i'm saying the shroud is fake.....
but i am saying that there was no actual man called jesus christ.

its all about the movements of celestial bodies, being encoded into symbolic stories.

the Sun of God

[SKAWF]

Posted by Chuck (here)
Many believe that the image on the Shroud of Turin was that of Jacques de Molay, the last Grand Master of the Order of Knights Templar.

friday 13th 1307 ,

that tallies up with the carbon dating results

[Kindred]

fake... real... fake... real...

Does it truly matter?

I feel it's more about What YOU are Doing... NOW... Not about what others 'discover' or claim.

Are You becoming, taking the Action, to be the Change you wish to see in this world?

True Change Begins Within... Not from without.

In Unity, Peace and Love

[RedeZra]

in the Bible Jesus was wrapped in strips of linen cloths and furthermore there was a head covering as well

so the Shroud of Turin does not fit the description given in the Bible

Posted by SKAWF (here)
its all about the movements of celestial bodies, being encoded into symbolic stories.

references to planets stars and constellations in the Bible

are fortelling future events


you see God did not only inspire the Bible

He also confirmed His story in the sky


and like clockwork

time is ticking down

[Cartomancer]

The purpose of the shroud is different than what is obvious. It is meant to lead to a conclusion that has nothing to do with the burial shroud of Christ. Its a metaphor that once studied will enlighten you to its true purpose. Its a clue. Why if there are so many burial shrouds is this one the most well known? Its a mystery.

[SKAWF]

Posted by Lifebringer (here)
Not being facetious, but has there ever been an ancient tribe that is connected to the Caucasian Race? I haven't seen anything other than the Roman empire cemetary scenerio, but I'm talking about way back in the day? I just wonder because they are still even after Hitler, continuing the search, and so far, tis still a mystery. When did the tribe arrive and from whom did they spring forth. There are certain parts of history, that are unknown to me, but I stills search. The caveman with matted hair and skins, was all I was able to come across, so still I search, but if you could relay on just where these people originated, i would apprieciate it. I simply can't trust a religious person, they spin tales. Please elaborate on where such origins occurred and the dated tribe from whom they sprung.

I can't help but wonder, if this mystery is the reason for all the archaeologic diggings over the past three or so centuries.
Really am curious, and serious. Neanderthal...?? I mean when the tower of Bable was knocked down and the languages and tribes scattered, where did they come from. This all happened in Middle East or whole continent when connected. You have the Sumerians, Aztecs, Myans, Asian, but like I said, I have not found any of the missing blanks in my search for origins of history.

If there is someone who can assist me with connecting the dots, I would very much appreciate it.

One of the reasons I come to Avalon, is because the answers are in someone's knowledge to be shared, and its not a place to be ashamed to ask, if done so humbly and respectfully.

i have often thought that the white man, seems to lack some of the charateristics than the erm.... more indigenous races,
such as african, aboriginal, native american, and southern american etc.

(as an aside, i'm minded of a dan quayle quote
"I was recently on a tour of Latin America, and the only regret I have
was that I didn't study Latin harder in school so I could converse with
those people." lol)

the nearest i got to the origins of the white man, was in the american use of the word caucasian, and its possible connection the the caucasus mountains.
though i didnt look into it too much.