Possible reason why so many people believe in lies.

[DeDukshyn]

Posted by kreagle (here)
... <snip> ...

Kreagle ... I took a look at everything again and really hard at the scripture you wrote.

Firstly, there is no context for me to grab from that about the word "belief" as it is intended in that script ... so I'm handicapped ... I'll make the safest assumption possible - The belief in Christ's teachings of Love and Forgiveness:

The word in that scripture is "belief". But that "belief" that is indicated there is the "belief" (I'm assuming as I have no context), that honoring forgiveness always, loving every moment from the heart, etc (as Jesus Preached) - is the proper way. Those concepts are all only available in the present moment - they are ways to shift you into the Present Moment. One cannot be "forgiving" yesterday. For love to have any "reality" whatsoever - it has to be in the present moment. "Don't worry, I'll love you tomorrow!" just doesn't work

So I present that my message is pretty much the same, just expressed differently.

[ghostrider]

the church doesn't teach the truth, the masses believe the lies, easy to believe the lie , the truth hurts. The truth Jesus and God are the same person. Jesus (flesh) God (spirit) not two seperate God's but one and the same. flesh and spirit are one, father and son are one. the father loves the son, the spirit loves the flesh, replace Jesus with flesh and God with spirit, now you have the hidden mystery the straight gate and narrow way and few there be that find it. I and my father are one. the flesh and the spirit are one. the father in me , he doeth the works. the spirit of God became flesh. Low the kingdom of God is WITHIN you .

[Unified Serenity]

Posted by kreagle (here)

Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
You can't believe in any lies if you stop believing in "things" and start experiencing the present moment. Anyone who wishes to escape the lies needs to stop believing - believing requires a link to something external - considering and experiencing do not ... consider religion, yes. Believe it, no.

This is what God is asking of us (IMHO) - start living in the present - it will be the only way to escape the delusions of "beliefs"

BTW that biblical consideration of the OP -- a true gem with value!

DeDukshyn,

I don't think you fully understand what you are saying here,.....in relation to the Sacred Word of God and the concept to "believe".

Mark 16:14-17
King James Version (KJV)

14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.

15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

As I pointed out, in my previous post, the "Holy Ghost experience" will fully help you "identify" the many lies that Satan bombards humanity with on a daily basis, and then be able to take the proper evasive measures to avoid the lie before it becomes "embedded in our psyche".

#1) Believe the Scriptures,.......#2) Obey the "Gospel Message" Peter preached in Acts 2:38,.........#3) Receive the "promise",...the gift of the Holy Ghost,.....and you'll be well on your way to living a "victorious and overcoming life".

May God bless you abundantly,.......kreagle

I'm curious, what tongues did they speak as you understand it?

[ghostrider]

if I can jump in, speaking in tongues is the spirit speaking through you, the non-believers will hear a man of another country speaking their home language and know it has to be God working through them. It's also a heavenly language not understood by carnal minds only understood by God because he controls it . the spirit needs a body, a vessel . God works through man , taming the tongue is the outward sign of inward submission to his spirit . forgive me if I butting in your conversation. this kind of stuff is near and dear to me . I was an un-believer in all this, God's spirit found me, I was baptized in Jesus name and a fire came into my soul and I spoke in tongues before religion could tell me that people aren't doing that anymore, only in bible days, oops they told me too late. the spirit showed me everything that a baby needs to know to grow , I didn't eat food for three days and didn't know what was happening, i found out later the spirit was breaking the will of the flesh.

[kreagle]

Posted by Lettherebelight (here)
The reason why so many believe in lies is because they are not really searching for the Truth. They have other motives propelling them toward an illusion. There are many reasons for this, a lot of them have to do with the false ego. And so there will be the Cheaters and the Cheated.

On the up side...

Those who seek Truth will be guided by the Inner Voice. There is no need to fear. But it does require making that connection.

As a reflexologist, we understand that all nerve endings terminate in the hands, feet and head. The body is a bio electric vehicle. When we clasp our hands together, the circuit (energy), is closed and directed inward, to the Self. Looping round, instead of dissipating energy outward. (I hope I have explained this ok).

When we put our hands together, we will experience that connection to the Self and Super Self (God). Then we will experience the Truth, according to our nature, and then, no one will be able to cheat us. It is 'a knowing'. No two people are identical, and so this 'knowing' may differ from one person to another, but that does not mean we cannot respect each other's Truths.

A good analogy is when a hungry man eats, he experiences satisfaction. No amount of argument will be able to convince him that he is still hungry.

It is a very good thread topic. Since the start of last year with the 'Charles' thing, people have realised how easy it is to be duped by charlatans and the material energy, and that includes myself.

I hope this isn't a tl;dr

Good luck to everyone on their path toward Truth. As our friend Jorr would say, ]'All is well.'

Lettherebelight,

What a "befitting" forum name you have! As you have "shed a little light" to us all here on the "natural man",......it has enabled me to obtain an even greater understanding on the "spiritual man". As a reflexologist, I'm sure you, along with everyone else, would agree that we are "all" made up, and consist of,....."body" and "soul".

As you've pointed out,....."The body is a bio electric vehicle",.......likewise,......."The soul is a spiritual vehicle"!

As you've also pointed out,.....once "we put our hands together, we will experience that connection,......". It's here that I will have to slightly disagree with you, in that,...."yes" a connection is made with "yourself",.....but we cannot touch God with our "nerve endings", or flesh! It will take "our spirit" in order to be able to do that!

The "body", bio electric vehicle that it is,.....will die one day,.....and return to the dust of the ground.

The "soul", spiritual vehicle that it is,......will never die,.....but will face "eternal consequences",.....whether good,....or bad.

You've shown in your post "where the connection begins" in the "body"

I spoke of, in my earlier post, (post #11),....."where the connection begins" in the "soul"

Please note,....especially,.....v.16 in the following text.......

Romans 8:15-17
King James Version (KJV)

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

As verse 16 points out, so beautifully and eloquently,....."The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit,....."

Now,......"that's" a connection!!!!,.....one you sure don't want to miss out on!!

Love and Peace,........kreagle

[Unified Serenity]

Thank you for sharing. I will share what I know briefly. Biblically speaking, the evidence of the Holy Spirit indwelling in Acts chapter 2 was speaking in an anointed language where anyone hearing it understands it in their own dialect no matter how many hearers are present. The babbling tongue of many charismatic churches is not a form of tongues spoken of in the bible except in a mocking way in the old Testament. Paul spoke many languages and wished the believers spoke as many as he did, but there was a problem going on in the early church. Travelling believers would visit a place where they did not speak the common language and try to give a message on their heart, and no one could understand them except God and the Angels. They were as a clanging cymbal, noise in the assembly of believers. At the same time, if you knew you were going to travel take an interpreter with you, but that to has it's drawback.

It's cumbersome to listen to someone speak and then wait for interpretation, so Paul said, no more than 2 or 3 at the most do this in a meeting of believers. I can go into this word by word, scripture upon scripture if you like. There is one benefit to the "babbling" tongue and that is as a meditation device similar to the rosary or worry beads. The purpose is to have the mind occupied in another means while you meditate upon the Lord, and thus enter more easily into Alpha and Delta brainwaves were real spiritual illumination can take place. Please do not take offense, I mean none. Those who practice the babbling tongue do enter into a divine meditation, but it is not a special angelic language per my bible.

Peace

[turiya]

Simply put...

The lie itself is not the real issue. Its the believing that it is the real issue, here.

The reason why people want to believe is because people are lazy, they want a shortcut through this life.
Most don't want to have to make the effort to find the truth themselves, they don't want to do the work to find out what is true for themselves.
Believing in what someone else says as being the truth is easier. It requires no risk being taken. There is no chance of being a failure.
Just believe in what others are saying is the truth, and nothing else need be done.

Believing what others say, what others have written, and calling it the truth, is fooling oneself. It is a self-deception.
So don't go pointing fingers at others as being deceivers. You are the biggest deceiver of yourself.

Believing in what others tell you, and accepting it as being the truth. Nobody else is responsible but you. You are the great pretender!
Then you believe you are alive, you believe you are living a life. Nothing could be further from the truth.

In believing, you have stopped searching to find out the truth for yourself.
In doing so, you have, in a way, stopped living your life. In reality, you have started dieing.
You may believe you are alive, but in reality you have dropped out of being alive, and have begun living a lie...
just living a dead life.

Drop whatever borrowed knowledge you think is your treasure.
Come out of your grave, stop believing, and start living once again.
Stop trying to take shortcuts through this life.
Stop believing in what others are saying as being the truth.
And Start finding out for yourself what is truth.

It may be take more effort, it will take having real life experiences, instead of reading about the life experiences of others.
But this is where wisdom comes from. This is where true understanding is found.

Cheers -*-

Posted by humanalien (here)
2 Thessalonians 2:9-12 (King James Version)

9. Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan
with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10. And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them
that perish, because they received not the love of the truth,
that they might be saved.

11. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that
they should believe a lie:

12. That they all might be damned who believed not the truth,
but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

[ghostrider]

it's amazing when you pray and then be quiet and listen and wait on the Lord. He will enter , and you wil be changed forever. Have Faith as a grain of mustard seed. say unto the mountain be removed and be cast into the sea, with God nothing is impossible .

[kreagle]

Posted by Unified Serenity (here)

Posted by kreagle (here)

Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
You can't believe in any lies if you stop believing in "things" and start experiencing the present moment. Anyone who wishes to escape the lies needs to stop believing - believing requires a link to something external - considering and experiencing do not ... consider religion, yes. Believe it, no.

This is what God is asking of us (IMHO) - start living in the present - it will be the only way to escape the delusions of "beliefs"

BTW that biblical consideration of the OP -- a true gem with value!

DeDukshyn,

I don't think you fully understand what you are saying here,.....in relation to the Sacred Word of God and the concept to "believe".

Mark 16:14-17
King James Version (KJV)

14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.

15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

As I pointed out, in my previous post, the "Holy Ghost experience" will fully help you "identify" the many lies that Satan bombards humanity with on a daily basis, and then be able to take the proper evasive measures to avoid the lie before it becomes "embedded in our psyche".

#1) Believe the Scriptures,.......#2) Obey the "Gospel Message" Peter preached in Acts 2:38,.........#3) Receive the "promise",...the gift of the Holy Ghost,.....and you'll be well on your way to living a "victorious and overcoming life".

May God bless you abundantly,.......kreagle

I'm curious, what tongues did they speak as you understand it?

Unified Serenity,

Great to hear from you!,....and thanks for the question.

First I will supply the "text" and then answer your question.

Acts 2:1-12
King James Version (KJV)

2 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.

2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.

3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.

6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.

7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?

8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?

9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia,

10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes,

11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.

12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?

Verses 9-11 inform us that there were approximately 17 different nationalities, all Jewish, present on this "Day of Pentecost".

When the Holy Ghost was "initially" poured out, in verse 4, and they (the 120) began to "speak in other tongues", as the Spirit gave them the utterance,.....it obviously appears that the "listeners" of what was gloriously happening could "hear" some of the 120 speaking in the Parthian dialect,.....some in the Mede dialect,....some in the Elamite dialect,.....some in the Mesopotamian dialect,....and so on,.....and so on. As a result, we once again see the "listeners" proclaiming,.....in verse 11,......"we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God."(It should be equally noted, here, that "all" of the 120 in the "upper room" were Galilaeans, (v. 7), but did not speak in their "native tongue" when they were filled with the Holy Ghost.) I, personally, am convinced that this particular "order of events" and the way it was carried out and performed, was God "highlighting" His glorious event in a very special way!

This is perfectly in line with many, many accounts of people being filled with the Holy Ghost today! A Missionary from Africa came through our state and recently visited with our Church. The wife of the missionary,(he and she are Caucasian), gave the most beautiful testimony of a revival service that they were in. It seems at the conclusion of the service,...an altar call was given. (Let me interject here that they were in a "very primitive" location of Africa.) There was literally "hundreds and hundreds" of local "natives" that were present at this altar call as they began to pray in earnest. The missionaries' youngest daughter had pressed through the throng of people, as they were praying, in an effort to pray with a group of "young African girls,....about her same age. The wife began, at this point, to describe what happened to her daughter next. It appeared to her that a "bee", common in the area, had perhaps attacked her daughter,.....flown up her dress,.....and was stinging her repeatedly. All the mother could see, from the pulpit area, was her daughter adamantly jumping about and hollering. Being a "concerned mother", she quickly worked her way through the crowd of worshippers, to her daughter and shouted,......"don't worry,....Mama's here,....let me help you get the bee out from under your dress!" The little girl,....about 12 years old at the time, responded to her mother by saying,....."Mama,......there's no bee,.....I'm fine, Mama,.....you don't understand!,.....Mama,....this little girl (African) has just received the Holy Ghost,......and Mama,.......she's speaking in "perfect English" as she is praising God, Mama!

And yes, the "little African girl" returned to her "native tongue" once again, at the conclusion of this glorious event in her life when she was "born again" and likewise had received the Holy Ghost. She had never been taught anything else, other than her "native African language".

God has a "miracle" in store for those who will "believe on me as the Scriptures has said,...."

In fact,.......it's a "promise"!

God bless you,.....Unified Serenity,.....and everyone else!,.........kreagle

[kreagle]

Posted by Unified Serenity (here)
Thank you for sharing. I will share what I know briefly. Biblically speaking, the evidence of the Holy Spirit indwelling in Acts chapter 2 was speaking in an anointed language where anyone hearing it understands it in their own dialect no matter how many hearers are present. The babbling tongue of many charismatic churches is not a form of tongues spoken of in the bible except in a mocking way in the old Testament. Paul spoke many languages and wished the believers spoke as many as he did, but there was a problem going on in the early church. Travelling believers would visit a place where they did not speak the common language and try to give a message on their heart, and no one could understand them except God and the Angels. They were as a clanging cymbal, noise in the assembly of believers. At the same time, if you knew you were going to travel take an interpreter with you, but that to has it's drawback.

It's cumbersome to listen to someone speak and then wait for interpretation, so Paul said, no more than 2 or 3 at the most do this in a meeting of believers. I can go into this word by word, scripture upon scripture if you like. There is one benefit to the "babbling" tongue and that is as a meditation device similar to the rosary or worry beads. The purpose is to have the mind occupied in another means while you meditate upon the Lord, and thus enter more easily into Alpha and Delta brainwaves were real spiritual illumination can take place. Please do not take offense, I mean none. Those who practice the babbling tongue do enter into a divine meditation, but it is not a special angelic language per my bible.

Peace

Unified Serenity,

Unfortunately, there continues to be confusion about "speaking in tongues"

The reality, and truth, behind this Biblical event, is as follows.......

The Scripture actually teaches and relays "two separate types" of "speaking in tongues"

#1) "speaking in other tongues",.....which every "new born" believer will do when they receive the Holy Ghost.

Mark 16:16-17
King James Version (KJV)

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;


AND


#2) "speaking in an unknown tongue",.....which is listed as one of the "9 Spiritual Gifts", as specified in 1 Corinthians 12:10. This "Spiritual Gift", actually #8 on the list, is only given, by God, to a "seasoned,....or trusted" believer,....one who has already, earlier, been filled with the Holy Ghost and spoke with "other" tongues as they were "initially filled" with the Spirit. This "Gift" would then be used, as you pointed out, for the edification of the "entire Church assembly", as God would choose and dictate.

1 Corinthians 12:1-11
King James Version (KJV)

12 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.

2 Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.

3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.

5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.

6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.

7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;

9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;

10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

I hope this somewhat "clears" the topic on "speaking in tongues" up for you.

I would also like to give you a "word of caution", here, to be a little more careful in the wording you have chosen to describe this Holy event,......"babbling tongue". To your credit, you have stated that you mean no offense,.....and I believe you. Most of the time, that this "term" has been used, has certainly been with "ill intent" by the "mockers of the world".

Acts 2:12-16
King James Version (KJV)

12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?

13 Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine.

14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.

16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

Also,....to your credit,.....you spoke about the "charismatic" movement and tied in the comment "babbling tongue" in connection with them,....as in a "mocking" fashion,... precisely as I have spoken about and equally referenced in the above Scripture.

To that, I will have to say that I sadly agree. Satan has always seen to it that for "every genuine Holy movement of God",....to put a "counterfeit" in place that will take away from, or "mock", the genuine experience.

For the love of God,.....don't let yourself be deceived by the "imposter's of this world"

I'm telling you,....Unified Serenity,.....the "experience" is REAL!

The Apostle Peter will tell you,..........the "experience" is REAL!

Mary, (Jesus' mother), will tell you,....the "experience" is REAL!

The "120" will all tell you,.................the "experience" is REAL!

Open your heart,....and the "BIBLE" will also tell you the "same thing",.....it's REAL!

Lotsa love and Peace,...........kreagle

[kreagle]

Posted by ghostrider (here)
the church doesn't teach the truth, the masses believe the lies, easy to believe the lie , the truth hurts. The truth Jesus and God are the same person. Jesus (flesh) God (spirit) not two seperate God's but one and the same. flesh and spirit are one, father and son are one. the father loves the son, the spirit loves the flesh, replace Jesus with flesh and God with spirit, now you have the hidden mystery the straight gate and narrow way and few there be that find it. I and my father are one. the flesh and the spirit are one. the father in me , he doeth the works. the spirit of God became flesh. Low the kingdom of God is WITHIN you .

ghostrider,

you bring up some "extremely interesting points",.....in not only this post but also in your "next post",...#24


(per ghostrider)
Re: Possible reason why so many people believe in lies.
if I can jump in, speaking in tongues is the spirit speaking through you, the non-believers will hear a man of another country speaking their home language and know it has to be God working through them. It's also a heavenly language not understood by carnal minds only understood by God because he controls it . the spirit needs a body, a vessel . God works through man , taming the tongue is the outward sign of inward submission to his spirit . forgive me if I butting in your conversation. this kind of stuff is near and dear to me . I was an un-believer in all this, God's spirit found me, I was baptized in Jesus name and a fire came into my soul and I spoke in tongues before religion could tell me that people aren't doing that anymore, only in bible days, oops they told me too late. the spirit showed me everything that a baby needs to know to grow , I didn't eat food for three days and didn't know what was happening, i found out later the spirit was breaking the will of the flesh.

I find "both" of these posts very fascinating, in that, they both say a "lot more" than the "average person" might originally see!

I am going to get back with you, tomorrow,.......I must retire to bed for some rest at this late hour.

Before I go,.....I'd like to share this "passage" with you and get your "initial" thoughts on its meaning,......what do you think Jesus was relaying here?


Matthew 28:16-20
King James Version (KJV)

16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.

17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.

18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.


(Note: this is not a "trick" question, at all. The "insight" that you displayed on the "two posts" I have referenced here tells me that you probably "also" have a greater insight into this passage than "most" have, too.)

Look forward to conversing with you again,........kreagle

[RedeZra]

Posted by kreagle (here)

Posted by RedeZra (here)
when we see that the ptb

has debunked the Bible


and the alarm bells are not ringing

then how will we wake ?

RedeZra,

But the "alarm bells" are ringing,......loud and clear,....to those who have "believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, as the Scripture has said,...."

yes Kreagle i know the alarm bells rang for you

but how many believe the Bible today ?


the ptb has totally debunked it in the eyes of the masses

so without a personally visitation from Jesus


how will they wake ?


and we have not yet seen the signs and lying wonders of satan

which will cause the Great falling away from the Gospel


so not one of us must be complacent in our insights

[RedeZra]

Posted by ghostrider (here)
The truth Jesus and God are the same person.

you're right when you say Jesus is God

but He is not God alone

the Father is also God

and so is the Holy spirit


this is the Trinity of the Godhead

[kreagle]

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by ghostrider (here)
The truth Jesus and God are the same person.

you're right when you say Jesus is God

but He is not God alone



the Father is also God

and so is the Holy spirit


this is the Trinity of the Godhead

RedeZra,

"If", your scenario, the "trinity" is correct,......then "how" do you explain the following passage?.........

1 Timothy 6:14-16
King James Version (KJV)

14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;

16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.


po·ten·tate   /ˈpoʊtnˌteɪt/ Show Spelled[poht-n-teyt] Show IPA
noun
one who possesses great power, as a sovereign, monarch, or ruler.


"If" Jesus is the "blessed and only Potentate", as the Scripture so accurately describes Him as,.....where does that leave the "trinity's" concept of.....

#1) "God the Father",.....is He then "inferior" to the Son, in that the Son is undeniably the "only Potentate"?

#2) "God the Holy Ghost",.....I guess this also leaves Him out also?

RedeZra,........

Our Lord was "our Father",........when He created us.

Our Lord became "the Son of Man/God",......when He "robed Himself in flesh" and consequently redeemed us at Calvary with the shedding of His Blood,.....the "perfect sacrifice"!

and finally......

Our Lord becomes "the Holy Ghost",.....when He comes to "dwell" in our "earthly tabernacles", (namely "us"), as the Comforter,.....fulfilling the "rest" that He promised and preparing us for the day that He returns!

And He is more than capable of "fulfilling these roles",.....and at the same time retaining His valence of "1" Deity!!!

(point)

"If" I, "kreagle", can "completely fulfill" the role of 1) father,( and I am!),....2) son,( I'm that, too!),.....and 3) spirit,( there's one "in" me).......AND STILL BE ONE PERSON!

then "why" is it so hard to believe that God can't "do the same"?


To Moses and Israel,......He was known as "I AM"

To Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob,.....He was known as "Jehovah"

Today, we call His name,........."JESUS",.....which "literally" means "Jehovah has become our Saviour"!

Ephesians 4:4-6
King James Version (KJV)

4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

The "trinity" concept was "manufactured" by the Vatican at the Council of Nicaea, 325 A.D., along with many "other" diversions.

RedeZra,......your "still" by friend/brother!,.....but your Catholic "foundation" is not nearly as "sound" as you might think it to be!

As a "matter-of-fact",......it "sounds" broken, to me!

Love and Peace,......kreagle

[rgray222]

The reason that so many people "believe" lies is because the mainstream media is complicit in telling, spreading and supporting lies. That is a very broad statement so let me give you a specific example from today's news reports.

I was reading a column on CNN this morning written by LZ Granderson, the title was Don't be so Nosy about Fast and Furious.

The bottom line is that 200 Mexican Souls were murdered, one American Law enforcement soul was murdered and Granderson takes the position that we don't have a right to know what the government is doing. He goes on to say this sort of behavior has been going on through many administrations, both republican and democrat and we should essentially look the other way! It is that age old story from the media "that is the way it has always been done, therefore it is OK".

He says we can't handle the truth and we should not be so nosy! In essence he is asking us to look the other way, ignore the murder and death that the American Government was directly involved in.

He is not even being indirect, he is simply asking to his readers, please be complicit in these murders and help hide the truth from the public. He has no concern for the husbands, wives, children, aunts, uncles, grandparent of the murdered victims. He is saying.........let us ignore this so we can do it another day! He does not even bring up the impact of this botched program on the lives of hundreds if not thousands of souls!

The purpose of this example is not to be political but simply to point out that the mainstream media is complicit in the lies, in this case they are asking people to sweep it under the carpet and ignore "the truth"

I am very sure I could go to Fox, NBC, BBC, CBS, NYTimes, Boston Globe, The Independent etc and find a very similar argument on a completely different subject.

For whatever reason many people still believe that the media provides us with honest reporting. They craft their thinking around dishonest or horribly slanted stories and spew out what the media tells them.

The question this thread asks is "Why do so many people believe in lies?" the answer is because we are being fed lies (about government, religion, even science etc) by organizations that reach millions of people everyday. They are not only asking us to believe their lies but they are asking us to be party to their lies and help spread the lie to other people.

It is extremely sad and disheartening that no matter how much you point out the media's blatant lying, many people (including friends and family) just go on believing what the media says. They are too deeply rooted in their political ideology or they adopt and attitude of, if it is on TV or in the newspaper it must be true, even though they say they do not believe what the media says. How sad.

Now the issue of how and who started these horrible programs and wars is an entirely another matter for another thread!

[Unified Serenity]

We have entered the days of lawlessness when men call good evil and evil good. One reason why so many people believe in lies is that the truth is uncomfortable, and at least here in America we are completely focused on our comfort. I like the saying, "I have come to comfort the afflicted and to afflict the comfortable." Some on Avalon think I only post negative posts. They put me on ignore and that is their right to do so. I have put a select few on ignore because of personal ad hominem attacks over and over which mods seem to think is appropriate behavior by ignoring it though they participate in the same thread, they actually thank the personal attacks at times, and such so I end up putting some on ignore.

Sadly, I can't put mods on ignore, I have tried with a couple, LOL. The point is that the ignore button is a double edged sword if you are here to learn. How much are you going to learn from those who you know agree with you? But, people would rather be comfortable than read with an open mind and heart asking for wisdom and discernment. They choose to stop seeking truth, and it's ok really because one day we will all know the truth from the least of us to the greatest of us. No one will have to teach their neighbor. What a day that shall be!

[mexrph]

There is a high degree of cognitive dissonance (inability to accept new knowledge that will cause mental anguish) prevalent in American society. People wold rather believe that "it can't happen here". A signifcant percentage of Americans are delusional and want to keep on living in their dream world. Recognizing the truth would require them to do something about it and they do not have the integrity to get involved and do something to make this world a better place to live. Don't bother them. Let them watch American Idol or whatever seems to be their world. Dedicated minorities have always made the difference. Our minority cannot allow the NWO to bring about the "New Dark Ages" that they seek.

[kreagle]

Posted by DeDukshyn (here)

Posted by kreagle (here)
... <snip> ...

Kreagle ... I took a look at everything again and really hard at the scripture you wrote.

Firstly, there is no context for me to grab from that about the word "belief" as it is intended in that script ... so I'm handicapped ... I'll make the safest assumption possible - The belief in Christ's teachings of Love and Forgiveness:

The word in that scripture is "belief". But that "belief" that is indicated there is the "belief" (I'm assuming as I have no context), that honoring forgiveness always, loving every moment from the heart, etc (as Jesus Preached) - is the proper way. Those concepts are all only available in the present moment - they are ways to shift you into the Present Moment. One cannot be "forgiving" yesterday. For love to have any "reality" whatsoever - it has to be in the present moment. "Don't worry, I'll love you tomorrow!" just doesn't work

So I present that my message is pretty much the same, just expressed differently.

DeDukshyn,

Don't be deceived,.....there, quite frankly, are a "lot" of differences in our "messages"!

However,........

I certainly sense an attitude of sincerity from your post, which is excellent. God can easily take a "platform like this" and consequently "open one's understanding" where they can make it to the "next level".

Even the disciples, who walked "shoulder to shoulder" with Him on a daily basis, reached a point where they required a "greater revelation" in order to fully perceive what His will and direction was!

Luke 24:44-45
King James Version (KJV)

44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

It, somewhat, appears that you are trying to delve into the Scriptures without a Bible at your disposal.

I gathered that from your response to me,....as follows,...."Firstly, there is no context for me to grab from that about the word "belief" as it is intended in that script ... so I'm handicapped ...

If that is the case, I will "first" share with you an excellent Bible website,.....one I use quite often, myself,......and that's www.biblegateway.com

You will be able to "click" on the selection "Available Versions", to the left of the website. Once there you will find a "drop down box" with many "versions" to select from.
You will find that I "exclusively" use the "King James Version". Many of the "newer versions" are entirely to "watered down" to my liking and preference.

Better yet,....find the time and money to "buy" yourself your own "personal" Bible.
You'll be glad you did,.....and it will "prove to be" the best buy you ever made,....I promise!

Last, but not least,.....I want to "personally" offer my assistance to you,....."if" you should require or need any. Don't be afraid to ask, my friend,......for I "care".

You are more than welcome to "PM" me if you feel more comfortable in doing that!

Your servant,.......in Christ Jesus,.......kreagle

[DeDukshyn]

Posted by kreagle (here)
.... <snip> ...
DeDukshyn,

Don't be deceived,.....there, quite frankly, are a "lot" of differences in our "messages"!

However,........

I certainly sense an attitude of sincerity from your post, which is excellent. God can easily take a "platform like this" and consequently "open one's understanding" where they can make it to the "next level".

Even the disciples, who walked "shoulder to shoulder" with Him on a daily basis, reached a point where they required a "greater revelation" in order to fully perceive what His will and direction was!

Luke 24:44-45
King James Version (KJV)

44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

It, somewhat, appears that you are trying to delve into the Scriptures without a Bible at your disposal.

I gathered that from your response to me,....as follows,...."Firstly, there is no context for me to grab from that about the word "belief" as it is intended in that script ... so I'm handicapped ...

If that is the case, I will "first" share with you an excellent Bible website,.....one I use quite often, myself,......and that's www.biblegateway.com

You will be able to "click" on the selection "Available Versions", to the left of the website. Once there you will find a "drop down box" with many "versions" to select from.
You will find that I "exclusively" use the "King James Version". Many of the "newer versions" are entirely to "watered down" to my liking and preference.

Better yet,....find the time and money to "buy" yourself your own "personal" Bible.
You'll be glad you did,.....and it will "prove to be" the best buy you ever made,....I promise!

Last, but not least,.....I want to "personally" offer my assistance to you,....."if" you should require or need any. Don't be afraid to ask, my friend,......for I "care".

You are more than welcome to "PM" me if you feel more comfortable in doing that!

Your servant,.......in Christ Jesus,.......kreagle

Religion is not the next level for me, I'm sorry, But I have already traveled that road. Born and raised christian myself, realized that forced interpretations from the Church were designed. They used to behead people for trying to read the bible and interpret it yourself .. did you know?

I still read my bible occasionally, but while I do it I listen to the Christ from within me. I'll take that anyday over an external belief. My 2 cents - and I will never waver from this. Much love

[kreagle]

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by kreagle (here)

Posted by RedeZra (here)
when we see that the ptb

has debunked the Bible


and the alarm bells are not ringing

then how will we wake ?

RedeZra,

But the "alarm bells" are ringing,......loud and clear,....to those who have "believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, as the Scripture has said,...."

yes Kreagle i know the alarm bells rang for you

but how many believe the Bible today ?


the ptb has totally debunked it in the eyes of the masses

so without a personally visitation from Jesus


how will they wake ?

and we have not yet seen the signs and lying wonders of satan

which will cause the Great falling away from the Gospel


so not one of us must be complacent in our insights

RedeZra,

In your "original" post on this topic, you quoted,....."then how will we wake ?",.....leading me to believe that perhaps, even you, had somewhat "pushed the snooze button",....or something.

Consequently, your "follow up" post now states,......"how will they wake ?"

To answer this I must go back in time and visit a "young man". This "young man", RedeZra, had "played by the rules" of this world for the entire 26 years, to date, of his young life,.....but "something dramatic" was beginning to occur in this "young man's" life. Suddenly this "young man" had become "sick and tired" of the hypocrisy of this world,....and the way the "game was being dictated" to play, or live by. It had become "painfully obvious" to this "young man" that he could no longer rely upon "key individuals" that he had once looked up to. They had all, systematically, let him down,....one by one. There had been "extreme pressure" from many of these "key individuals" put upon this "young man". Their message was clear! "Come and be like us,....they said,......and we will make you successful!",.....to which this "young man",.....finally woke up one day,.......and said,........NO!"

RedeZra,.....on that "fateful day", this "young man" made a monumental decision. To the astonishment of his "business peers" he said NO. He said NO to a "mapped out" plan that had been especially designed for him,....that would have made him wealthy,....by "this world's standards",....because he wanted to be able to look in the "eyes of his three children" and tell them that "honesty and integrity" were the values their Daddy lived by.

On that "fateful day",.....this "young man" also experienced a "complete dietary change"! He,....from this day forward,....would never again,....let this world cram their garbage "down his throat"!!!

It was now time,.....for this "young man",.....to "eat off of another plate"! He had finally developed a "new hunger" for a "different type of meal"!

Matthew 5:6
King James Version (KJV)

6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.

Within less than a month from this "drastic turnaround" in this "young man's" life,.....he found that his new-found "hunger" was leading him to an "old fashion altar",....where he began to "pour out his heart in repentance" to a loving and forgiving God.

On Dec. 30, of 1981, this "young man" was baptized in the beautiful name of "Jesus Christ" for the remission of his sins.

Twenty-three days later, on Nov. 22, 1981,....this "young man" was then filled with the Holy Ghost and began to "speak in other tongues",....exactly like they did on the Day of Pentecost in the Book of Acts chapter 2.

This "young man",.......was "now" eating, literally,.......off of "another plate"!

By now,.....I'm sure you know,.....that this "young man",.......was......."ME"!

(point)

RegeZra,....you and others may be asking yourself, about right now,....."just why has kreagle "dragged us all down memory lane"?,.....He "still" hasn't answered the "question",......"how will they wake?",..........or..........has he?

Everybody wants a "short cut" answer. Nobody wants to "take the time" to arrive at a complete and lasting solution to the complexity of life and what it throws at us each day.

Folks,....."this" is what I had to do "personally", in order to "wake up". Your "individual story" may be written and recorded differently,.....but the "similarities" will still be the same.

Before you will,....."wake up",.......you'll have to "realize that something is wrong" with the "current situation" you are in,.........just like I did!

Before you will,....."move on",.......to "bigger and better" things,.....your going to have to undergo a "dietary change",.............just like I did!

Was the "journey" long that it took,....in order to be "awakened"?,.....well, yes it was,.....but it was "certainly worth" the time it took. I "only have one lifetime",.....and so do each of you,......might as well use the time wisely!

And, yes,......I concur with you completely, RedeZra,....that "complacency" must be guarded against at "all times"

And "that's another" benefit one acquires when you "receive the gift of the Holy Ghost"

John 16:12-14
King James Version (KJV)

12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.

13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

Love and Peace,........kreagle