Overpopulation-Dr. Albert A. Bartlett

[trenairio]

This is a lecture by Dr. Bartlett explaining that population growth is unsustainable. Energy resources he said, will eventually become incredibly scarce due to exponential growth in the global population. He points out reports by officials over-exaggerating the amount of resources availabe, and disproves them with simple exponential models.

This is a Malthusian theory, but I believe that technology has come to a halt because of the suppression of free energy. So the data and predictions explained by Dr. Bartlett are actually possible in the near future. This may be why "Depopulation" is such an important goal for the powers that be.

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umFnrvcS6AQ

[RMorgan]

This is a really interesting video indeed. I´ve seen it before.

Well, the point is that even with free energy, if we continue to breed like this, there wont be enough resources for us all.

The world´s population has doubled in the last 40 years and now it´s growing at an even faster rate. If it continues to grow like this, it will probably triplicate in the next 30 years and quintuple in the next 50 years.

There simply is no water, food and space for so many people. This is a fact.

I´m totally against depopulation, which means killing people, but we must find some way to prevent people to have so many children.

I´m talking about prevention, not abortion. How are we supposed to do it? I simply don´t know.

Raf.

[Carmen]

Many species, if not all! self regulate. For instance, goldfish only breed to the point that their pond can sustain them. Wolves in the wild, only the alpha male and female breed. The alpha male does not breed with other females. I'm sure there are many other examples. Animals do this by instinct/knowingness. They put on extra fur when the winter is going to be harsh. They know ahead of time. Why do humans not self regulate? We are like a cancer on the face of the earth, out of control and devastating our environment! Is it because we are separated from the instinctive intelligence that guides us in all ways?

[Carmody]

The record shows that we self regulate our population...when the quality of life for the individual, takes place. This seems to take a few generations to set in, mentally and physically. How we would endure such a phase is debatable.

We do have alternative plans taking place, though. GMO corn, for example. Mice fed it, cease to be able to reproduce at the third generation.

[Wind]

Nature will be always be the balancing force. But the so called "elite" have taken the depopulation of human race as their mission. They see it as a necessary evil. They also believe in natural selection, the survival of the fittest. They see this life as a race and they think they're the fittest and the smartest. But they're only mere psychopaths who do not care about human life because they cannot see the bigger picture.

[Maunagarjana]

Posted by RMorgan (here)
This is a really interesting video indeed. I´ve seen it before.

Well, the point is that even with free energy, if we continue to breed like this, there wont be enough resources for us all.

The world´s population has doubled in the last 40 years and now it´s growing at an even faster rate. If it continues to grow like this, it will probably triplicate in the next 30 years and quintuple in the next 50 years.

There simply is no water, food and space for so many people. This is a fact.

I´m totally against depopulation, which means killing people, but we must find some way to prevent people to have so many children.

I´m talking about prevention, not abortion. How are we supposed to do it? I simply don´t know.

Raf.

With free energy comes massive water desalination operations. We could green the deserts if they would only let us. Not enough space? Take a look at Google Earth sometime. There's lots of space that could be used that we don't use now. Every time I fly over the western United States I see huge sections of empty land. How many billions of people could the Amazon basin itself support if need be? I've heard figures in the area of 20 billion. Also, we could be way more efficient with the way we design our communities, grow our food and allocate our resources.

[The Truth Is In There]

even without the expected worldwide disasters in 2013 and subsequent natural depopulation we're well on our way to depopulate the earth. most people just haven't realized yet what long-term impact events like fukushima or deepwater horizon have on health and reproduction, to say nothing of the vaccination-craze, chemtrails, fluoride, bromine, exitotoxins, gmo or the estrogen-like compounds in plants (soy, first and foremost) and plastics (bisphenol a, etc.) that disrupt the endocrine system and make you infertile.

make no mistake, the depopulation agenda has already been implemented decades ago. none of the things that later turned out to be unhealthy, even in terms of nutritional recommendations, happened by mistake. it's all part of the plan to make the population sicker, infertile and at the same time make tons of money through prescription drugs and useless/harmful medical treatments.

depopulation is already taking place, most of us just don't know it yet. the official population counts are fake, just like pretty much everything else that comes from "official" sources. the population is dropping since the 90s in most western countries and in those territories where it may still be growing they use vaccines, wars and other means to make sure the depopulation stays on course.

[HaveBlue]

Why not indeed Carmen? I think it is called social welfare. look whos doing all the breeding. Non producing 3rd generation welfare types who believe work is a 4 letter word! Yes, as in 'that' sort of 4 letter word!

[wavydome]

The "collective societies" (many if not most local or nearby ETs) would seem to agree on all decisions and outcomes unanimously. They would tend to suppress any possibility of creativity and then get locked into highly-regulated and materialistic lives-- Yet highly advanced technological lives which seek to expand by conquest of nearby planets. Rumaging the solar systems to extend their alliances and powers... (It has seemed to me: According to commentators like Marshall Vian Summers, George Kavassilas, George LoBuono)--- However such population expansion of collectives would seem to be mathematically increased in precise increments, based on very fixed, man-to-land ratios.

By contrast humanity seems to be a cosmic experiment with "an individualist society potential"... Potential because it is so difficult to mature an individualist-society, as a unified society... How would individuals unify? This seems to be the question. (I'd love to discuss that at length, in and of itself). Here we are under siege, more or less, paralyzed by more advanced, collectivist, highly technical ET societies-- Yet such collectivist ETs are possibly self-blocked in their spiritual development... Apparently doubtful there is any advantageous potential (for them) in spiritual development beyond the collective mindset -- However plotting a take over of earth through breeding of hybrids-- With some minor interest in acquiring insights to this spirituality which humans do loudly express---Yet they perhaps only see the politicized spirituality (orthodox religions as a means to brainwash). They do not see individualized spiritual attainments. While individual humans have attested unique spiritual experiences.

So, which spiritual experience sheds light on population stability? For a long time i felt that The Urantia Book had a very-noteworthy monologue on this subject. My limited understanding of this is: It had to do with a needed human realization, that breeding needed to be licensed, based on educational achievements (of applicant parents)... That the case of unwanted children is a cosmic crime, committed by shear ignorance, on the part of humanity. That the current state of children breeding children is a hopeless habit which needs a big wake-up call. That many if not most children do become 'unwanted' grown ups-- Proven by the huge discord at every human level. To be seen in broken families, cultural clashes, corporate-clashes and waring nationalism, world wide.

PS-- I tend to lean towards a preference for vast, undeveloped regions of the planet. I do not like the stack and pack concepts for human development. I have no children and feel life has been beautiful, despite the nearly unsurmountable tasks i set for myself. Quests and tasks can provide very meaningful and rich lifestyles for humans. We do not all need to produce children and then find that there are huge limitations in our challenging world. Many parents have found that for themselves and see it repeat for their children. I think that qualitative living needs to be provided before each birth is gestated. I do expect that individualism, is a gift from creation, to mount on a self-styled quest for the ultimate truths.

[RMorgan]

Posted by Maunagarjana (here)

Posted by RMorgan (here)
This is a really interesting video indeed. I´ve seen it before.

Well, the point is that even with free energy, if we continue to breed like this, there wont be enough resources for us all.

The world´s population has doubled in the last 40 years and now it´s growing at an even faster rate. If it continues to grow like this, it will probably triplicate in the next 30 years and quintuple in the next 50 years.

There simply is no water, food and space for so many people. This is a fact.

I´m totally against depopulation, which means killing people, but we must find some way to prevent people to have so many children.

I´m talking about prevention, not abortion. How are we supposed to do it? I simply don´t know.

Raf.

With free energy comes massive water desalination operations. We could green the deserts if they would only let us. Not enough space? Take a look at Google Earth sometime. There's lots of space that could be used that we don't use now. Every time I fly over the western United States I see huge sections of empty land. How many billions of people could the Amazon basin itself support if need be? I've heard figures in the area of 20 billion. Also, we could be way more efficient with the way we design our communities, grow our food and allocate our resources.

What are the consequences of taking that huge amount of water from the oceans? What are the consequences for the making all deserts green? What are the consequences of moving a lot of people to Amazon? How much space would be needed to plant crops and basic resources like cotton and wood to supply all this people? How much water would be needed to raise those crops? How to properly process so much excrement? How many new roads would have to be built? How much iron ore and other mineral resources would have to be extracted to supply such a huge demand? How many industries would have to triplicate their size and production? If people continue to eat meat by then, how much space would be needed for livestock? How much water and grains would be required to feed the livestock? How much methane gas the livestock would expel in the atmosphere? What would be the consequences of taking so many fish from the oceans?

There are too many questions without answer.

Remember, we´re talking about 30 years from now, which is not enough to solve all these problems and, since we´re talking about exponential population growth, these problems will also grow exponentially.

Eventually, the world´s population will double every decade, then at every five years, than every year and so on.

By extending our life expectation with modern medicine, we aren´t part of the natural process of balance anymore. Each one of us should assume responsibility and think a thousand times before having more than one child and eventually think about not having children at all.

Raf.

[778 neighbour of some guy]

Isnt the problem over concentration of population rather then over population in its self, how come the planet suddenly became overcrowded when people moved into cities??

I think we shoot to many movies and documentaries in cities, this seems to amplify the problem when actually the case is the rural areas become depopulated. This mass exodus to the cities is exactly playing into the hands of tptw, we are are nice and bunched up on a few square miles and easy to control.

Water, there is plenty of it there cannot be less water then there is, is harvesting the water thats the issue, food, with current day grows systems food can be produced vertically on the same square foot you previously could only harvest what was on that exact spot, even water consumption by crops can be drasticly reduced by organic container gardening.

I see no issues whatso ever, ok one, infrastructure, thats a whole other issue but it can be adressed.

Wasnt it Jim Marrs who said "the entire population of the earth at this moment can be comfortably housed in the state of Texas" .

[RMorgan]

I think you guys are underestimating this problem.

How much trouble do we have right now with consumerism, poverty, inequality, misery, water pollution, etc...

Ideally, an overcrowded world could work but we don´t live in an ideal world. You know it.

Currently we live within a terrible system. What guarantees do we have that this system will ever change, or at least change fast enough to avoid all these problems?

Also, again, I must say we´re dealing with exponential growth. We will need to find a way to stabilize the human population with preventive techniques. This is an undeniable fact.

There´s no way such a huge number of humans could coexist harmonically with the world, its environment and all other species that also have the right to live on this planet.

The world isn´t ours to do whatever we want. It´s completely selfish to think that we can keep having as many children as we want, ignoring the consequences.

Also, we can´t forget that the highest birth rate is among people who don´t have enough resources to properly raise their children. These children are already born into misery.

I don´t know where you guys live, but here in Brazil ( and I live in one of the richest cities of the country), you get used to see 17 years old crack addicted homeless girls with five or more starving children, begging for money at every traffic light.

Each of these five poor children, if they survive, will probably have other five children of their own when they´re 17 years old as well, and so on, like it´s been happening here for a long time.

We have huge favelas that grow at an alarmingly rate, which also increases inequality and criminality.

We´re not talking about middle-class families having a lot of kids. Most middle class families have no more than 2 children, statistically, and it only represents about 7% of the world´s population.

We´re talking about about poor and miserable families, which represent about 89% of the world´s population and each of these families having and average of 4 children, which are condemned to poverty and misery at the moment they are born.

This problem is incredibly more complex than you think. This is not only an environmental problem; it´s the most complex social-political problem humanity ever faced.

I think people who live in the so called "first world" countries should at least try to look to this problem by a broader angle. Have a trip to Africa or to any poor region of any "developing" country, then you´ll know what I´m talking about.

It´s too easy to talk about this subject and come up with utopian solutions when you haven´t seen people living in places like this. This are the places where the population is really growing:







Now tell me. How to convince people who can barely write their own names, to stop having children and use contraceptive methods? If you have any practical and feasible idea, you just saved the future of the world.

If we don´t find a way to prevent population growth, the people in charge of the system will just choose the "easy" way and just murder a lot of people, to prevent the system from collapsing.

Raf.

[Kindred]

Here's an item I offer in the understanding that our species has not reached the first Syllable of the word 'Civilization'. I encourage reading this in full, as it will provide a wonderful example of how a Truly Civilized society exists and Flourishes with a population Way beyond our current levels. It's our lack of Efficiency in all areas of society, and the outrageous disparities in distribution of the necessities of life that cause our current problems.

We Can Do Better - If We Choose To.

But, First and Foremost, is to get RID of the 'monetary control' aspect, from the top, down, as well as the MIC in ALL it's embodiments.

http://www.galactic.no/rune/iarga.html

In Unity, Peace and Love

[Agape]

I'd fully condone this message as factual and something that needs to be taken to consideration faster than the civilisation train, running already full speed , derails and turns belly up .

Life is precious, our lives and intelligence is all our equipment in the race against time and powers of nature . If mankind can not embrace responsibility for their evolution , it will exhaust not only planetary reserves but its own biological reserves .
Population growth has to be controlled by education , not by meeting the wrong ends of aggression, stress resulting from lack of privacy, poverty, noise, pollution .


Bringing new children to the society should really mean welcoming them to liveable space . Not to the middle of wars threatening them with extinction,
placing them to endless competition - consumption chain where only those who are willing to ignore others have real chance to win .


There are still so many orphan children in this world and those dying in dirt , in poverty , do they have to.

Are they better or worse than your own children , you think ?


If they were given a chance, they would grow to little wise men and ladies , artists, scientists and folks you will never meet because we're losing them on the way .

They might be people with more solutions .


I can't imagine why would intelligent civilisation lose everything if they have a choice .

[Delight]

Posted by RMorgan (here)
This is a really interesting video indeed. I´ve seen it before.

Well, the point is that even with free energy, if we continue to breed like this, there wont be enough resources for us all.

The world´s population has doubled in the last 40 years and now it´s growing at an even faster rate. If it continues to grow like this, it will probably triplicate in the next 30 years and quintuple in the next 50 years.

There simply is no water, food and space for so many people. This is a fact.

I´m totally against depopulation, which means killing people, but we must find some way to prevent people to have so many children.

I´m talking about prevention, not abortion. How are we supposed to do it? I simply don´t know.

Raf.

I know this is going to be a strange question. It was for me when i first considered it.
HOW do we know that the world IS overpopulated.

In driving through the US this summer, I saw very few people really.
The same source that lies about everything else conducts census.
By the way, in my own life and maybe because of my age, more people in my life are dying than babies being born.

My point here to me is that I never even questioned this "fact" until just recently. Some "facts" like global warming have been seen to waver in the sun like the glare off pavement. And now I question what reeally is the population, how can I check? I cannot physically count everyone.

Sure the cities and exurbs are crowded but even then, who's to really know what the REAL population may be in truth?

[RMorgan]

Posted by Delight (here)

Posted by RMorgan (here)
This is a really interesting video indeed. I´ve seen it before.

Well, the point is that even with free energy, if we continue to breed like this, there wont be enough resources for us all.

The world´s population has doubled in the last 40 years and now it´s growing at an even faster rate. If it continues to grow like this, it will probably triplicate in the next 30 years and quintuple in the next 50 years.

There simply is no water, food and space for so many people. This is a fact.

I´m totally against depopulation, which means killing people, but we must find some way to prevent people to have so many children.

I´m talking about prevention, not abortion. How are we supposed to do it? I simply don´t know.

Raf.

I know this is going to be a strange question. It was for me when i first considered it.
HOW do we know that the world IS overpopulated.

In driving through the US this summer, I saw very few people really.
The same source that lies about everything else conducts census.
By the way, in my own life and maybe because of my age, more people in my life are dying than babies being born.

My point here to me is that I never even questioned this "fact" until just recently. Some "facts" like global warming have been seen to waver in the sun like the glare off pavement. And now I question what reeally is the population, how can I check? I cannot physically count everyone.

Sure the cities and exurbs are crowded but even then, who's to really know what the REAL population may be in truth?

Well, there are several ways to point the population growth.

First, advances in medicine allow people to live longer than ever. Even if the birth rates were a constant, which they are not, if people are born and and people remain alive longer, the population is always growing.

The problem is that, every decade, people are able to live longer and more children are born than the previous one.

Also, just look at the growing production and demand of commodities. Each year, more food is produced, more resources are mined, more homes are built, more cities are expanded, more houses are demolished and replaced by apartment buildings, we have more traffic jams, etc...compared to previous years.

Your question is interesting, but population growth is a fact. Just look at the numbers. How many people used to live in your city ten years ago? How many people live there now? It´s easy for anyone to check it locally. With fewer exceptions, like vast rural areas, every city in the world is growing.

Raf.

[Delight]

Posted by RMorgan (here)
Well, there are several ways to point the population growth.

First, advances in medicine allow people to live longer than ever. Even if the birth rates were a constant, which they are not, if people are born and and more people remain alive longer, the population is always growing.

The problem is that, every decade, people are able to live longer and more children are born than the previous one.

Also, just look at the growing production and demand of commodities. Each year, more food is produced, more resources are mined, more homes are built, more cities are expanded, more houses are demolished and replaced by apartment buildings, we have more traffic jams, etc...compared to previous years.

Your question is interesting, but population growth is a fact. Just look at the numbers. How many people used to live in your city ten years ago? How many people live there now? It´s easy for anyone to check it locally. With fewer exceptions, like vast rural areas, every city in the world is growing.
Raf.

I may live in an anomalous area?
In my "community" lots of real estate is empty. This is a rural area and it did have a boom earlier but some basic things like the local gas station closed recently. It had been here since 1988. Yes, it could be the economy but there is no mass transit here. There are lost of stores that used to have retail and I noticed the other day all the storefronts next to a local coffee shop were realtors.

I am very willing to admit I DO NOT KNOW.
Again, HOW DO YOU KNOW the world is gaining population?
Is this from your own experience?

Not intending to beat this concept into the ground but it was such a slap in the face to question this so rock bottom assumption I had to share it.

[RMorgan]

Posted by Delight (here)

I may live in an anomalous area?
In my "community" lots of real estate is empty. This is a rural area and it did have a boom earlier but some basic things like the local gas station closed recently. It had been here since 1988. Yes, it could be the economy but there is no mass transit here. There are lost of stores that used to have retail and I noticed the other day all the storefronts next to a local coffee shop were realtors.

I am very willing to admit I DO NOT KNOW.
Again, HOW DO YOU KNOW the world is gaining population?
Is this from your own experience?

Not intending to beat this concept into the ground but it was such a slap in the face to question this so rock bottom assumption I had to share it.

Well, at least where I live, there are new neighborhoods being built every year where it used to be just woods.

There are entire neighborhoods which used to have only houses, being demolished to give place to hundreds of 12+ store apartment buildings.

The traffic jams are getting worse every year.

My fiancee has a furniture, decoration and accessories for babies company , which is growing exponentially every year. She´s recently moved her factory to a much larger place.

My father has a building company. He´s never built so much in his life. His company is growing more than ever.

Recently, one of the biggest maternity hospitals in South America was built here.

It´s ok to be suspicious about the government and its numbers, but population growth is pretty much a fact and can be independently verified by a huge number of different sources.

Raf.

[therealslimady]

Please check out this article folks, it may put a slightly diff slant on this thread.
from 2 billion to 7 in 60 odd years does sound crazy.
I too used to worry about there being too many people, I guess I believed all i heard in all these docu's and TV,
on tv! it must be true?

but then i heard you could fit the world population in Texas and there'd be 10m between every man, woman and child.
of course I didnt believe it, so as best i could i worked it out and it's spot on, try it out see for yourself.
it was a while ago now and can't rem exactly how i did it, but when I've got 10min to spare I'll try to rem.

then i heard that in places like china, who have a fair few people, are gonna have big prob's because
most chinese are now male due to the 1 child policy.

and firtility is also taking a dive, in both sexes.

anyway check it out and see what the other side says, then make ur mind up.

http://overpopulationisamyth.com/

http://pop.org/projects/debunk-overpopulation-myth

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...my-good-planet

[trenairio]

MIT Predicts That World Economy Will Collapse By 2030

http://www.popsci.com/science/articl...-collapse-2030

Forty years after its initial publication, a study called The Limits to Growth is looking depressingly prescient. Commissioned by an international think tank called the Club of Rome, the 1972 report found that if civilization continued on its path toward increasing consumption, the global economy would collapse by 2030. Population losses would ensue, and things would generally fall apart.
The study was — and remains — nothing if not controversial, with economists doubting its predictions and decrying the notion of imposing limits on economic growth. Australian researcher Graham Turner has examined its assumptions in great detail during the past several years, and apparently his latest research falls in line with the report’s predictions, according to Smithsonian Magazine. The world is on track for disaster, the magazine says.
The study, initially completed at MIT, relied on several computer models of economic trends and estimated that if things didn’t change much, and humans continued to consume natural resources apace, the world would run out at some point. Oil will peak (some argue it has) before dropping down the other side of the bell curve, yet demand for food and services would only continue to rise. Turner says real-world data from 1970 to 2000 tracks with the study’s draconian predictions: “There is a very clear warning bell being rung here. We are not on a sustainable trajectory,” he tells Smithsonian.
Is this impossible to fix? No, according to both Turner and the original study. If governments enact stricter policies and technologies can be improved to reduce our environmental footprint, economic growth doesn’t have to become a market white dwarf, marching toward inevitable implosion. But just how to do that is another thing entirely.

The image below can be found at: http://www.smithsonianmag.com/scienc...f-Growth.html#