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Thread: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

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    United States Avalon Member onawah's Avatar
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    Default Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Quote Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Stephen: The man best known as Archbishop Desmond Tutu has written this personal piece below exclusively for London’s The Observer newspaper, which is The Guardian’s sister Sunday paper.

    In it, he says that former US President George W Bush and former British Prime Minister Tony Blair and their cohorts in the Iraqi War “destabilised and polarised the world to a greater extent than any other conflict in history”. (I remember attending a rally with Anthony and over 250,000 other Sydneysiders to protest against Australia’s involvement in this war courtesy of our former PM, John Howard!)

    His article follows his decision a few days ago to decline an invitation to a major conference at which Tony Blair was speaking – and with whom Tutu said he could not share the same stage as. Bravo, Desmond Tutu!

    While we can each choose to be angered by what Bush and Blair et al did, we should also be aware that they got us to the point we are at today – where, like Desmond Tutu, we can see them for what they did, hold them accountable and make sure it never happens again. Thanks to Allen for the lead.

    Why I Had No Choice But to Spurn Tony Blair

    I couldn’t sit with someone who justified the invasion of Iraq with a lie

    By Desmond Tutu, The Observer – September 2, 2012

    The immorality of the United States and Great Britain’s decision to invade Iraq in 2003, premised on the lie that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction, has destabilised and polarised the world to a greater extent than any other conflict in history.

    Instead of recognising that the world we lived in, with increasingly sophisticated communications, transportations and weapons systems necessitated sophisticated leadership that would bring the global family together, the then-leaders of the US and UK fabricated the grounds to behave like playground bullies and drive us further apart.

    They have driven us to the edge of a precipice where we now stand – with the spectre of Syria and Iran before us.

    If leaders may lie, then who should tell the truth? Days before George W Bush and Tony Blair ordered the invasion of Iraq, I called the White House and spoke to Condoleezza Rice, who was then national security adviser, to urge that United Nations weapons inspectors be given more time to confirm or deny the existence of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

    Should they be able to confirm finding such weapons, I argued, dismantling the threat would have the support of virtually the entire world. Ms Rice demurred, saying there was too much risk and the president would not postpone any longer.

    On what grounds do we decide that Robert Mugabe should go the International Criminal Court, Tony Blair should join the international speakers’ circuit, bin Laden should be assassinated, but Iraq should be invaded, not because it possesses weapons of mass destruction, as Mr Bush’s chief supporter, Mr Blair, confessed last week, but in order to get rid of Saddam Hussein?

    The cost of the decision to rid Iraq of its by-all-accounts despotic and murderous leader has been staggering, beginning in Iraq itself. Last year, an average of 6.5 people died there each day in suicide attacks and vehicle bombs, according to the Iraqi Body Count project.

    More than 110,000 Iraqis have died in the conflict since 2003 and millions have been displaced. By the end of last year, nearly 4,500 American soldiers had been killed and more than 32,000 wounded.

    On these grounds alone, in a consistent world, those responsible for this suffering and loss of life should be treading the same path as some of their African and Asian peers who have been made to answer for their actions in the Hague.

    But even greater costs have been exacted beyond the killing fields, in the hardened hearts and minds of members of the human family across the world.

    Has the potential for terrorist attacks decreased? To what extent have we succeeded in bringing the so-called Muslim and Judeo-Christian worlds closer together, in sowing the seeds of understanding and hope?

    Leadership and morality are indivisible. Good leaders are the custodians of morality. The question is not whether Saddam Hussein was good or bad or how many of his people he massacred. The point is that Mr Bush and Mr Blair should not have allowed themselves to stoop to his immoral level.

    If it is acceptable for leaders to take drastic action on the basis of a lie, without an acknowledgement or an apology when they are found out, what should we teach our children?

    My appeal to Mr Blair is not to talk about leadership, but to demonstrate it. You are a member of our family, God’s family. You are made for goodness, for honesty, for morality, for love; so are our brothers and sisters in Iraq, in the US, in Syria, in Israel and Iran.

    I did not deem it appropriate to have this discussion at the Discovery Invest Leadership Summit in Johannesburg last week. As the date drew nearer, I felt an increasingly profound sense of discomfort about attending a summit on “leadership” with Mr Blair.

    I extend my humblest and sincerest apologies to Discovery, the summit organisers, the speakers and delegates for the lateness of my decision not to attend.
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...ony-blair-iraq
    "It takes courage to push yourself to places that you have never been before... to test your limits... to break through barriers.
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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Desmond Tutu is a political man himself and about as trustworthy as the others in his profession/professions.

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Did you read what this man wrote, or did you perhaps summarily reject the message, based on the source?

    To judge a man using his past or what you think you know about his past, has proven to be not only inaccurate and unfair, it is to disrespect the profound possibility of redemptive transformation in all of us. There are a lot of people undergoing rapid transformation at this time. Regardless of your good intentions, if you are not able to actively employ your own discernment with any degree of accuracy, you will be unable to participate in meaningful change, and will in fact risk become an impeding force. Because now is the time to move beyond what we think we know about "them", beyond who we thought "they" were, and more to the point, out beyond who we used to imagine ourselves to be.

    Pay no attention to the man if you must, but hear the words- spoken from the heart. The message is impeccable.

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Yes, the two need to be tried for Genocide, etc. However, they'd somehow find a way to win.
    “There is no coming to consciousness without pain. People will do anything, no matter how absurd, in order to avoid facing their own soul. One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious.” -- Carl Jung

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Quote Posted by Rozzy (here)
    Desmond Tutu is a political man himself and about as trustworthy as the others in his profession/professions.
    Wow it must be interesting to live where you do

    gigha

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    We have to keep in mind that we are all actors in this play and we accept the roles, we have all had ample opportunity to experience both sides of the track and full marks to these guys, because they pushed it to the max and very nearly got away with it. In fact it is breathtaking in all of its negative glory. What a story this will make for the future.

    Thank goodness that we had some outside help, because we were on the express slide to oblivion.

    In humility pete

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Gee, there's an idea. (My sarcasm just can't stay bottled up.)...More games and fireworks. More conniving and bribery, false reports, fake commissions, confusion, argument, sides, classes, profits...
    Last edited by Erich; 4th September 2012 at 08:43.

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Quote Posted by Rozzy (here)
    Desmond Tutu is a political man himself and about as trustworthy as the others in his profession/professions.
    Just like you to know that, as a South Africa. who has gown up with Desmond Tutu, and having seen his contribution in the long struggle we had against the apartheid regime, and the compassionate way which he headed the truth and reconciliation council. that he is a man of great spiritual integrity and he is loved by everyone in our country. And we stand right behind him because we all love him.
    Unconditional Love is the key to world peace

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    I wonder how the main media are going to ignore this!

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    and follow up article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...hague-iraq-war

    "We're one crucial step closer to seeing Tony Blair at The Hague
    Desmond Tutu has helped us see the true nature of what the former prime minister did to Iraq and increased pressure for a prosecution"

    honestly...
    OOB NOOB

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    I would like to see Mandela back him up....I think he's getting kinda old now but just a simple statement might be helpful

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    I met him once, when he was here in the US. He is a really funny guy, he does not make excuses for his faith and strives to change it from the inside as he assisted ending the hate that grew from apartheid.
    Hi, I will look you directly in your eyes and tell you wholeheartedly that I love you.

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Quote Posted by pie'n'eal (here)
    I wonder how the main media are going to ignore this!
    The same way they ignore any of the other hundreds of stories we should be seeing. "Now, back to to tits on parade".
    The quantum field responds not to what we want; but to who we are being. Dr. Joe Dispenza

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    I am not a fan of Tutu however he is right on this one...

    But if they were ever to stand trial, Blair would talk them stupid... perhaps in the end they may lock him up just to shut him up...
    The other, well he has too many friends going a long way back... he will never be locked up for anything...

    Good luck

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Desmond can also include Daddy Bush as well. As the list could get expanded very easily here.
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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Maybe it was a simple oversight, that Mr.Tutu neglected to mention the two country's current leaders? Hmmmmm, me thinks not so much. The destruction, mass murder, and occupation of other nations, did not suddenly cease starting in 2009. I'll join the unpopular dissenter on this one.

    Cheers,
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    Last edited by Fred Steeves; 4th September 2012 at 18:32.
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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Quote Posted by Fred Steeves (here)
    Maybe it was a simple oversight, that Mr.Tutu neglected to mention the two country's current leaders? Hmmmmm, me thinks not so much. The destruction, mass murder, and occupation of other nations, did not suddenly cease starting in 2009. I'll join the unpopular dissenter on this one.

    Cheers,
    Fred
    Hi Fred
    It may be a little wiser to consider the context in which this statement was written in before making your mind up using limited knowledge of the situation.
    He was clearly not addressing the current leaders, or any general world condition, when he wrote this, merely the era in which Blair was in, and the call for his arrest around the world, because Blair was visiting South Africa at the time he wrote this. Bush was an accomplice at the time.
    If you read this you might get a better idea of the situation during his visit.
    http://www.ciibroadcasting.com/2012/...im-if-you-can/
    Regards
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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Brits Hunting for Tony Blair

    September 5, 2012 • 1:36PM

    There are British knives out for international war criminal Tony Blair, the British Monarchy's assigned controller of mass killer Barack Obama, and members of the hunt piled it on, following South African Bishop Desmond Tutu's weekend call for Blair to be hauled before the Hague to face charges

    "We're one crucial step closer to seeing Tony Blair at The Hague," celebrated the London Guardian's George Monbiot, who in 2010 set up a bounty fund for people attempting to serve citizens' arrests on foul Tony, for his "mass murder" in Iraq. Wrote Monbiot:

    "For years it seems impregnable, then suddenly the citadel collapses. An ideology, a fact, a regime appears fixed, unshakeable, almost geological. Then an inch of mortar falls, and the stonework begins to slide. Something of this kind happened over the weekend.

    "When Desmond Tutu wrote that Tony Blair should be treading the path to The Hague, he de-normalised what Blair has done. Tutu broke the protocol of power — the implicit accord between those who flit from one grand meeting to another — and named his crime. I expect that Blair will never recover from it..."

    Monbiot adds that he created his bounty fund in order to "de-normalise an act of mass murder, to keep it in the public mind and to maintain the pressure for a prosecution. That looked, until this weekend, like an almost impossible prospect. But when the masonry begins to crack, impossible hopes can become first plausible, then inexorable. Blair will now find himself shut out of places where he was once welcome. One day he may find himself shut in."

    For British international law expert, Toby Fenwick, the Hague wasn't the right place to try Blair for the Nuremberg crime of launching a war of aggression; that job belongs to the British courts. "Is Tutu right on Tony Blair?" Fenwick wrote in the Liberal Democratic Voice, which claims to be the "most-read website by and for" supporters of that UK party. I "revere" Bishop Tutu, he wrote. "It was therefore with great interest I awoke on Sunday to Tutu's call for Tony Blair to face the International Criminal Court on charges of aggression resulting from the 2003 Iraq invasion."

    Blair "enjoys personal immunity from prosecution for as long as he has an international job that requires him to have immunity to conduct his role... Blair can and should be stripped of his moribund role in the Middle East, and with it, his personal immunity from prosecution. He can — and should — then be tried for aggression before a British court. As Blair keeps insisting that the 2003 Iraq invasion was legal, presumably he would welcome prosecution in order to clear his name. His failure to resign from the [Mideast] Quartet or waive his immunity tells a different story."

    Fenwick's ties to the British military establishment are notable. Amongst his other attributes, Fenwick served in the Royal Air Force intelligence service from 1995-2009, and in March 2012, he wrote a study for the CentreForum, arguing that Britain should not spend billions on upgrading its Trident nuclear capability while cutting its conventional forces down to levels not seen since the Napoleonic Wars. Becoming a "Switzerland with rockets" serves no purpose, when Britain does not face any threat, including from Iran, Pakistan, or North Korea, in either the near or medium term, in which Britain's Trident force provides any additional security to that provided by U.S. strategic forces, Fenwick argued, adding that "many in the military privately agree."

    Even the Fabian Society's New Statesman joined the anti-Tony Blair fray, albeit with a milk-toast article agreeing that Desmond Tutu has more moral authority than Tony Blair ever will.

    From larouchepac.com

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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Scottish MSP's back war crime move on Blair

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/h...air.1347016258



    A parliamentary proposal to prosecute Tony Blair for "waging aggressive war against Iraq" has been backed by Scottish nationalists.

    Independent MSP Margo MacDonald lodged a motion at the Scottish Parliament seeking "a simple amendment making illegal the waging of aggressive war with the intention of regime change so that Tony Blair could be brought to trial in Scotland".

    It gained early support from SNP backbenchers Annabelle Ewing, Gordon MacDonald, John Finnie, Chic Brodie and Jim Eadie.

    Ms MacDonald, a former SNP deputy leader, said Scotland has a unique opportunity to incorporate international criminal law into Scots law which is historically distinct.
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    Default Re: Desmond Tutu Writes: “Bush and Blair Must be Tried for War Crimes”

    Ten characters
    Last edited by Rozzy; 16th September 2012 at 01:16.

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