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Thread: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Both Arctic & Antarctic Sea Ice Now at Historic HIGH Levels

    by Robert January 8, 2019

    Contrary to claims that modern day sea ice changes are “unprecedented”, alarming, and well outside the range of natural variability, biomarker proxies used to reconstruct both Arctic and Antarctic sea ice conditions since the Early Holocene increasingly reveal that there is more extensive Arctic and Antarctic sea ice during recent decades than for nearly all of the last 10,000 years.

    Antarctic Sea Ice Extent
    According to Comiso Et Al., 2017, “Antarctic Sea Ice Extent Has Been Slowly Increasing Contrary To Expected Trends Due To Global Warming And Results From Coupled Climate Models.”

    ‘After A Record High Extent In 2012 The Extent Was Even Higher In 2014. … [T]He Trend In Sea Ice Cover Is Strongly Influenced By The Trend In Surface Temperature [Cooling].”




    When you look at the graph above, you will see that the increase in Antarctic sea ice extent since 1979, no surprise, has coincided with a decline in southern ocean temperatures (graph below).



    And when you look at the following graph, you will see that Arctic sea ice extent is higher today than it has been during most of the last 10,000 years.


    Arctic Sea Ice Extent


    Graph adapted from Yamamoto et al, 2017 Other Arctic reconstructions also indicate more extensive sea ice today than during most of the Holocene.

    https://principia-scientific.org/arc...c-high-levels/
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    The bottom of Pacific Ocean is getting colder

    by Robert January 21, 2019

    Scientists say the cooling “is likely due to the Little Ice Age.”
    _______


    Cold waters that sank in polar regions hundreds of years ago during the Little Ice Age are – supposedly – still impacting deep Pacific Ocean temperature. Photo by: Larry Madin, Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution
    “As a significant part of the ocean responds to the rising temperatures of the today’s world, the deep, dark waters at the base of the Pacific Ocean seem, by all accounts, to be doing the exact inverse,” says this article on techexplorist.com (link below).
    But why are the deepest parts of the Pacific Ocean getting colder?

    A pair of scientists – one from the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution, the other Harvard University, built a computer model meant to mimic the circulation of water in the Pacific Ocean over the past century and a half.

    The model showed that the Pacific Ocean cooled over the course of the 20th century at depths of 1.8 to 2.6 km (1.1 to 1.6 miles).

    How could the scientists explain such cooling in a world that is supposedly warming?

    They decided that “cold waters that sank in polar regions hundreds of years ago during the Little Ice Age must still be impacting deep Pacific Ocean temperature trends.”

    So there you have it:
    Ocean warming, we’ve been told, is caused by humans, but ocean cooling “is likely due to the Little Ice Age.”
    The study, entitled “The Little Ice Age and 20th Century and deep Pacific Cooling,” was published in Science magazine on 4 Jan 2019.
    https://www.techexplorist.com/bottom...ice-age/19904/

    http://www.whoi.edu/news-release/the...-pacific-ocean

    http://science.sciencemag.org/content/363/6422/70
    Thanks to David Hartley and Jay Hope for these links
    “Sadly, they (the scientists) immediately ruin an interesting paper by ensuring they mention AGW,” says David.

    “They can see the natural cycles but chuck the elephant in the room before the discussion begins.”
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    Exclamation Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Just a short remark on this. I am getting tired to see and hear this. There is no major melting or freezing. It is all propaganda only. If you look on temperature maps...you have to look at severall 100/1000 of years in history and you will see, it is and was always going on. The ice is melting and then freezing and building up again - which is normal and it always been like this. We are going slowly into a little ice age again...and not the opposite.

    It has to do with the activity of the sun and we have no influence into this what so ever.

    All the blabla of it is human fault the ice is melting....is totaly only propaganda....just like the "global warming BS" which they changed quickly into global changing when it did leak through that there is no major warming.

    There been times in history, earth temperatur was way higher than it is today. Do your research and you will see the facts!!

    And Global changing always been part of the earth history also.....so it is another word game being played by the Officials.

    20 Years ago they talked about a "global weather and temperature shifting" and did panick out the people......this never happened either. Sorry, but this is all a big money machine running this propaganda thing and a lie to back up new taxes and stuff they want to charge all of us.....because it is all our fault???

    What they should talk about and has a major effect on earth is the cutting down of the rainforests and the pollution of the air by industrial companies and chemtrails sprayed out of military reasons. So the destroying of our clean air is going on daily, but who does this and who is responsibe for this? Who makes the profit out of this...you should ask.

    And about the plastic trash which ends up in our oceans..&....waters killing wild life around the globe and it ends up in our food later on ........?? Do you like to eat plastic?

    This I think are the things we all should pay more attention to, insteed of a propaganda machine which is just spreading false informations to keep the people brain washed and silly.

    By the way, many scientist are getting paid by this propaganda machine to keep the illusion alive....you have to pay attention on how they talk....It could be if this happens...it could have this effect...and so on.....

    Right - if I win the lottery I could be rich....hahah.....(this about the same style..)

    Maybe you should watch the documentation : The big climate swindel...where is explained by nutral scintists and others...how this huge fake story got created at the beginning in England.

    My advice :

    Dont let them fool you. Do your own research and pay attention to the real problems which do exist and not to the fake ones.

    --------- do something positive - plant a tree!!
    Last edited by Seabreeze; 21st January 2019 at 19:26.

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Quote Posted by Whisper (here)
    We are going slowly into a little ice age again...and not the opposite.
    We know.

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    ups, sorry about it. Yes, I bet you know. I just read the titel....and thought I must say something to this. Ok, good to know - you know. Hopefully many more people find out soon too.

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Not arguing anything here. As interesting data only, in Linda Howe's recent 23 Jan livestream, at 1:45, she cites a 14 January 2019 report from the National Academy of Sciences to the effect that the Antarctic is melting more than 6 times as fast as it was in the 1980s. The melting was initially almost all in West Antarctica, but the report states that now it's manifest in East Antarctica as well.



    Linda (who is still a proponent of global warming), discusses what this might mean, and what may happen if the reported melting continues.

    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 25th January 2019 at 13:04.

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Down in the deep, beneath the Antarctic ice, a new strange world is rapidly forming

    Under the Antarctic ice, in the pitch-black depths of the ocean, Australian scientists have discovered animals are evolving into strange and sometimes monstrous new shapes and forms.

    Life, these scientists believe, is using the frigid Antarctic waters to experiment, and animals there are evolving at a much faster pace than anywhere else in the world.

    And the weird creatures are riding deep-sea currents to migrate to other parts of the world ...

    https://www.theage.com.au/national/d...23-p50t2p.html

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Targeted individuals... targeted nations... and the voices in their skulls:



    Quote Maxime Bernier‏Verified account @MaximeBernier

    Remember that Environment Canada study that came out a few weeks ago, on the same day Trudeau’s carbon tax took effect, saying Canada is warming twice as fast as the rest of the planet? Seems like everyone around the world got the same memo from Climate Alarmism HQ.


    9:33 AM - 26 Apr 2019
    52 replies 198 retweets 319 likes
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    11 of 11 Coastal Antarctic Stations Show ZERO Warming Over Past Decades

    June 2, 2019 by Robert

    Also, Antarctic Ocean COOLING, not warming!
    ________________
    Butler Island and Neumayer Stations
    Both show a clear downward trend.
    ………..
    Halley Station
    Halley as well shows a downward station since 1956.
    ………..
    Syowa and Casey Stations
    Data from the Japan operated Syowa station and the Australia Casey stations both show no trend since 1961. Here we see no signs of any warming.
    ………..
    Davis Station
    The Davis station data go back 35 years and show a flat trend (very slight cooling in fact). No warming has been detected there since the great global warming scare began in the 1980s.
    ………..
    Zhongshan Station
    This Antarctic station shows a definite cooling trend over the past 30 years.
    ………..
    Mirnyl Station
    The Mirnyl station has been recording temperature data since 1967, more than half a century. It too is statistically flat, even showing a very slight cooling trend.
    ………..
    Dumont D’Urvi and Mawson Stations
    Both D’Urvi and Mawson Antarctic stations have recorded data going back to the 1950s. As the following chart tells us, there’s been no warming at these two long term stations as well.
    ………..
    Novolazarevsk Station
    This station has not seen any warming in 40 years. Instead the trend has been cooling.
    ………..
    In summary, not a single Antarctic coastal station shows warming, with most showing cooling.
    ………..
    South Shetland Islands
    Next we look at the annual temperatures of the 5 stations of the South Shetland Islands (located in the Antarctic Ocean).
    They too show no warming since 1993. Marsh has had a no warming trend since 1977. Where’s the warming? There certainly isn’t any at the South Pole.


    Antarctic seas cooling, new study shows
    Finally a fresh comprehensive study by Zhous et al also tells us that summertime sea surface temperatures (SSTs) all around Antarctic coast have been COOLING.


    See comprehensive maps and graphs:
    https://notrickszone.com/2019/05/31/...eed-to-resign/
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    NASA – Largest glacier in Greenland is growing for third year in a row

    by Robert June 18, 2019

    The height of Jakobshavn glacier in western Greenland has increased by as much as 30 meters (98 feet) per year in some areas.

    That’s about the height of a 10-story building … per year!The thickening is occurring across an increasingly wide area.

    Although the glacier has spent decades in retreat, scientists observed an unexpected advance between 2016 and 2017. In addition to growing toward the ocean, the glacier was found to be slowing and thickening.



    The image above, acquired on June 6, 2019 by the Operational Land Imager (OLI) on Landsat 8, shows a natural-color view of the glacier.

    Scientists attribute the change to cool ocean waters
    “The third straight year of thickening of Greenland’s biggest glacier supports our conclusion that the ocean is the culprit,” said Josh Willis, an ocean scientist at NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory and principal investigator of the Oceans Melting Greenland (OMG) mission.
    The maps below show how the glacier’s height changed between March 2016 and 2017 (top); March 2017 and 2018 (middle); and March 2018 and 2019 (bottom). The elevation data come from a radar altimeter that has been flown on research airplanes each spring as part of OMG. Blue areas represent where the glacier’s height has increased, in some areas by as much as 30 m (98 feet) per year.



    The change is particularly striking at the glacier’s front (solid blue area on the left) between 2016 and 2017. That’s when the glacier advanced the most, replacing open water and sea ice with towering glacial ice. The glacier has not advanced as much since then, but it continues to slow and thicken.

    Willis and colleagues think the glacier is reacting to a shift in a climate pattern called the North Atlantic Oscillation, which has brought cold water northward along Greenland’s west coast. Measurements of the temperatures collected by the OMG team show that the cold water has persisted.

    The team will go back to Greenland in August.
    NASA Earth Observatory images by Joshua Stevens, using Landsat data from the U.S. Geological Survey, and data courtesy of Josh Willis/NASA JPL and the Oceans Melting Greenland (OMG) Program.

    https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/im...ier-is-growing
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Saw this the other day and thought it worth sharing. Marc Morano is an entertaining and lively speaker, IMHO.

    Note: I copy/pasted one-by-one the links for the time stamps so they are a little off, by about 0:01, because that's how long it took me to stop the video and copy the link. If there is a better way to do this, please let me know

    How to Destroy the Climate Change Hoax

    Published on Aug 12, 2019
    Celebrities, activists, environmentalist organizations, the UN, government entities and sadly, even the Vatican support the theory that humans cause climate change. However, in this exclusive interview, “global warming” expert and author Marc Morano gives you hard-hitting arguments and facts that dispel the artificial fear propagated by “climate emergency” alarmists.

    Marc Morano talks about:
    #Climate #change (min 2:58)
    Population control (min 14:24)
    Global warming (min 17:12)
    Medieval warm period (min 19:37)
    Best arguments against climate change (min 33:03)
    The fake 97% scientific consensus (min 34:17)
    The Green New Deal (min 38:23)
    Pope Francis and Laudato Si (min 48:11 )
    Socialism and environmentalism (min 51:27)
    His book, Politically Incorrect Guide to Climate Change (min 57:38)

    Download show audio: https://tfpsa.podbean.com/

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Yesterday, in the middle of Summer, Greenland Gained a Record-Smashing 4 Gigatons of Snow and Ice

    August 11, 2020 Cap Allon


    Articles Extreme Weather GSM

    Usually in mid-August, Greenland’s surface mass balance (SMB) is LOSING 4 Gigatons of snow & ice a day. Not yesterday, however — on Aug 10, 2020, the ice sheet GAINED a record-smashing 4 Gigatons of global warming goodness (and just listen to the silence coming from the MSM, it has so much to say).

    Before this year, the Greenland ice sheet had never grown anywhere-close to 4 Gigatons in any of the months of June, July, or August, according to DMI records (which go back to 1981). In addition, the DMI record books also reveal that yesterday’s 4 Gt GAIN smashed the previous mid-Aug record by over 2 full Gigatons.

    Here are the latest (Aug 10, 2020) measurements:


    Crucial to the survival of a glacier is its surface mass balance (SMB)–the difference between accumulation and ablation (sublimation and melting). Changes in SMB control a glacier’s long-term behavior, and are its most sensitive climate indicators (wikipedia.org).

    Yesterday, Greenland’s SMB hit truly-historic levels for the time of year:


    Blue line (Gt/day): total daily contribution to the SMB from the entire ice sheet. Grey line: mean value from 1981-2010 (DMI).

    These astonishing gains add to those witnessed over the past few years.

    The tide has turned in Greenland.

    And that trend of GROWTH has ACCELERATED in 2020 — this is BIG news.

    This is how GLACIERS build.

    This is also how ICE AGES begin.

    The COLD TIMES are returning, the lower-latitudes are refreezing, in line with historically low solar activity, cloud-nucleating Cosmic Rays, and a meridional jet stream flow. Even NASA agrees, in part at least, with their forecast for this upcoming solar cycle (25) seeing it as “the weakest of the past 200 years,” with the agency correlating previous solar shutdowns to prolonged periods of global cooling here.



    Don’t fall for bogus, warm-mongering political agendas — prepare for the COLD — learn the facts, relocate if need be, and grow your own.

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    On both caps there is a significant difference between old ice and new ice for how much heat it holds and how much damage its loss causes to the ice cap in the case of the Arctic. The Antarctic ice has been growing in area because of a change to the circumpolar ocean currents, which have changed to lock Antarctica in a closed weather system. The result is that the water close to the cap is colder, and water further out is warmer than it used to be.

    That is a different phenomenon from the melting of certain glaciers there. There is a lot of water trapped in the ice cap, and it could be releases by such plases as the WAIS breaking off. Unlike the Arctic, Antarctica has a land mass beneath it. There is similar concern in Nepal, where the government has been preparing for the worst for some years now, they have subglacial lakes that are filling due to the warming, and when they let go it will be a large scale natural disaster.

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Interesting article re hotter or cooler climate change debate.

    What does Trump know?

    Biden Calls Trump 'Climate Arsonist' After President Says Weather 'Will Start Getting Cooler'
    03:30 GMT 15.09.2020

    On Monday, the US president travelled to Phoenix, Arizona, where he talked to Governor Gavin Newsom concerning the climate situation and wildfires ravaging across the US West Coast.

    Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden has slammed President Donald Trump over "climate denial" and his handling of the wildfires in the United States.

    Biden vowed to invest more in green policies to help the economy recover after the coronavirus pandemic.

    "If we have four more years of Trump's climate denial, how many suburbs will be burned in wildfires, how many suburban neighborhoods will have been flooded out, how many suburbs will have been blown away in superstorms?", Biden said during a campaign speech in his home state of Delaware on Monday.

    The former vice president claimed that if the president remains in the office for another four years, they will have "more of America ablaze".

    "If you give a climate arsonist four more years in the White House, why would anyone be surprised if we have more of America ablaze … when more of America is under water?", he said.

    Biden's comments followed Trump's visit to Phoenix for the "Latinos for Trump" roundtable, where Governor Newsom told him that Arizona had the hottest August in the state's history and that they "obviously feel very strongly that the hots are getting hotter", and "the dries are getting drier".

    "Something's happened to the plumbing of the world, and we've come from a perspective, humbly, where we submit the science and observed evidence is self-evident that climate change is real and that is exacerbating this", Newsom said.

    Trump, however, suggested relying on the natural weather instead, which he claimed would soon improve the situation.

    "It will start getting cooler. Just watch. I don't think science knows actually", he said.

    Trump has repeatedly blamed poor forest management for the blazes covering the West Coast, including the most furious fires in California.

    Back in 2018, Trump tweeted that there is no reason for deadly fires in California "except that forest management is so poor" and said that wildfires intensified due to bad environmental legislation "not allowing massive amounts of readily available water to be properly utilised".

    https://sputniknews.com/us/202009151...etting-cooler/
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Astrophysicist – Mini Ice Age accelerating – New Maunder Minimum has begun – Video

    by Robert

    September 20, 2020


    Astrophysicist Piers Corbyn “We are plunging now into a deep mini ice age,” says astrophysicist Piers Corbyn. “And there is no way out.”

    For the next 20 years it’s going to get colder and colder on average, says Corbyn.
    The jet stream will be wilder. There will be more wild temperature changes, more hail events, more earthquakes, more extreme volcano events, more snow in winters, lousy summers, late springs, short autumns, and more and more crop failures.
    “Carbon dioxide levels do not have any impact – I repeat, any impact – on climate,” says Piers. “The CO2 theory is wrong from the start.”

    “The fact is the sun rules the sea temperature, and the sea temperature rules the climate.”

    “The basic message is that the sun is controlling the climate, primarily via the sea.”

    “What we have happening – NOW! – is the start of the mini ice age…it began around 2013. It’s a slow start, and now the rate of moving into the mini ice age is accelerating.”

    “The best thing to do now is to tell your politicians to stop believing nonsense, and to stop doing silly measures like the bird-killing machines of wind farms in order to save the planet (they say), but get rid of all those things, which cost money, and reduce electricity prices now."
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDBbfDbaiA4


    Thanks to Argiris Diamantis and Eric9027 for this link

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Adapt 2030 Ice Age Report: Ocean current disrupted Arctic Basin not freezing

    Adapt 2030
    Thu, 29 Oct 2020 19:49 UTC


    © YouTube/Adapt 2030 (screen capture)

    The Arctic Ocean has not refrozen in October the first time in "recorded history". The new incredible fast moving current that is blocking water circulation is coming from the Gakkel Ridge where the Earth's crust has split and water in the planet's crust is pouring out like a pressurized aquifer, disrupting the Murman and Spitzbergen Currents in the Laptev and Kara Seas.

    Sources

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  32. Link to Post #457
    United States Moderator Karen (Geophyz)'s Avatar
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    I dislike and distrust any report tied to a sales pitch, so I must admit I stopped listening when he starting trying to sell me gold. But here are my thoughts....

    There is no doubt in my mind that the earth is experiencing great change. I doubt that this climate change is man made, probably influenced by man but it would have happened anyway. It has happened before, we see that in the rock record. The Artic ice does appear to be in decline. Can we stop it? No is the simple answer. Will it affect the climate as well as currents in the ocean, most definitely. But the same time the Antarctic appears to be growing. My feeling is that this is all connected to the magnetic reversal that is occurring. Another phenomena that has happened many times in the past. This process seems to take some time and will not be an immediate switch.

    Will stopping the use of fossil fuels help this situation? No, even if we stopped tomorrow. "Several life-cycle analyses published in recent years confirm that wind, solar, and hydropower regularly require more raw materials, including iron, copper, aluminum, and cement per unit of energy produced than coal- and gas-fired electric generation. Solar photovoltaics (PV) can require 10 to 40 times more copper per megawatt-hour than fossil fuel-fired plants. Onshore wind generation can need five to 15 times more iron"1. Renewable technologies become “relatively less attractive” once indirect emissions are taken into account.

    So what is the solution? No one really knows a solution, those that say they do are in it for the money. I think we all need to take care of our Earth and learn to adapt.




    1. Integrated life-cycle assessment of electricity-supply scenarios confirms global environmental benefit of low-carbon technologies, Edgar G. Hertwich et al. https://www.pnas.org/content/112/20/6277
    "If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, Infinite. For man has closed himself up, till he sees all things thro' narrow chinks of his cavern.” William Blake

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    United States Avalon Member thepainterdoug's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    Bill I have a scientist friend, very brilliant, with one of our ABC agencies. A Jason scientist.
    he explained to me something I wouldnt have thought of.

    Certain countries burn fossil fuels etc and the soot and burn off gets high up into the atmosphere, then being carried by the winds and they settle down over areas over the ice caps.
    The thin covering of soot is undetectable by eye but raises the temperature of the glaciers absorbing more sunlight and thus accelerates the melt.

    Its not the temp raising but the soot.
    Attached Images  

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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    ...

    ... volcanic ashes do even more "damages" than soot to a point the latter can be negligible excepted, maybe, for areas downwind from China's pollution like in northern Canada/Alaska:


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    United States Avalon Member thepainterdoug's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Arctic is melting, the Antarctic is freezing. What does this mean?

    gwin ru. yes thanks im no scientist. but the point is most people only hear "global warming" and see fires on the news and melting icebergs and associate the two.
    its misleading and far more complicated

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