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Thread: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Christine, Thank you for your reply . . . I only have a quick minute before meeting others to harvest apples and pears for turning into butter, chutneys and other wonderful foods, but I wanted to clarify a couple quick aspect of my first post to you.

    When I mentioned about there being a distinction in wealth and favoring different wealth status I WAS referring directly from your website and your Community Living Prices. The distinction and favoring comment is from those with more money are offered private rooms and showers and those with very little get to sleep on the floor. Also too with the offer to those with little money the can ‘earn’ their stay by working . . . and so again that sets up negative monetary haves and have not status within your own retreat or community . . . . those with plenty money don’t have to work while those who do not, have to work their stay. While it is good you offer this choice, it is my opinion, it perpetuates a destructive negative paradigm designed by the global ‘elite’.

    Also, It would be helpful for me if you could clarify a bit more if this is only a ‘spiritual retreat’ or a true functional community. Reading quickly through your posts I see families are not welcome at this time, you grow very little of your own food and it appears your main sustainability or resources will come from financial or monetary contributions.

    For me in designing forming the community here in the mountains one of my first thoughts is can we as a whole community Thrive within the framework we are forming or another way to look at it is how dependent are we as a whole on financial means, outside resources (all types) and/or how much will individuals have to work outside the community . . . at least in the first few year or how much can we totally support ourselves while maintaining balance within the community and eco systems

    I may just be really confused on this whole thread . . . but Bill started this thread with the title as an opportunity to live in Ecuador that was “totally in line with Avalon’s mission” and maybe I am assuming way too much here or again just way out of line or confused.

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Hello Christine

    I wondered if you could please explain the relationship between the university and the Wisdom of the Heart Church?
    I couldn't quite work it out from the website.

    Thanks
    Kathie

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    Ecuador Avalon Member Christine Breese's Avatar
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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    In order to have a spiritual school, University of Metaphysical Sciences, in the USA, it is required that a church 501(c)3 be the parent company of that school. Otherwise you cannot have a spiritual school in the USA that offers spiritual degrees. Wisdom of the Heart Church is the parent organization of University of Metaphysical Sciences, University of Metaphysical Sciences is a subsidiary of the church.
    Save the planet, it's the only one with chocolate!

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    BlueFire,

    I have tried varius communities from the 1960s. I deeply admire what you are trying to do. You as a leader and a woman maybe more successful than those I have known. In the 60s all the leaders were men. None of the communities who attempted what you are survived. Of the groups on the internet who are the most successful, nonw of them function as you do.

    I myself lost a million dollars plus trying to give people second chances. I have come to the conclusion that no skin in the game means it really does not matter to people whether or not you succeed. Maybe much more progress has been made since the dozen years I last tried this. The next time I am separating out a small place for myself that I can sustain so if the bigger project goes down I don't loose everything.

    I was the oldest woman resident at Occupy LA, most people have no idea how to cooperatively live. So I know how much you are teaching. I would be very interested in knowing how you screen for those you include and those you don't.

    When I attempt to do this again for the last time, I also will not even consider children for at least five years.
    Beware the axis of sanctimony.

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by Christine Breese (here)
    So David, what is your story? What brought you to Ecuador, and Loja in particular? Are you farming and own a place there?

    Yum! Chocolate! But it won't grow well at this elevation, Avacado, tomato trees, figs, the angular type of papaya, those all grow well here (although we have a lot of avacado and tomato trees already). We are curious about figs! yum!

    Yes, one of the cottage industries we have planned here is to make tinctures and oils with things like pine and eucalyptus in them. Did you notice that sometimes the honey has an ever so slight taste of eucalyptus in it? It's really nice!
    I currently do not own a farm Christine, I would like to though.
    I came to Ecuador because I was called to do so. I have spent the first 6 months volunteering in Vilca and the surrounding area. I worked in farming, constructions, cleaning, maintenance and electric wiring.It was while I was at M.T. as a volunteer that I recognized you in one of the meetings that took place over there.
    I have noticed there was a different taste in the Honey, but I didn't know why.
    I love figs, if you ever go to Turkey check out their gigantic and extra yummy figs.
    Have you thought of growing olives? I was told that cashew and olives are a commodity in Ecuador because they are very tricky to cultivate in such climate, however some have successfully grown both plants.

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    yummmmm! cashews and olives, I love those too, and those gigantic figs of Turkey sounds awesome! I don't think that olives and cashews would grow here though, as they are meant for warmer and drier climates, I think. Since we are just starting out with the gardens and everything, we probably have to go with sure bets on what is known to grow here though. We don't have much in the way of funds for experiments right now. Later we can try the experiments though! That is something I've always wanted to do, experiment with the impossible! Does anyone grow the olives or cashews (two of my favorites!) at the 8500 ft elevation in Ecuador? I know Loja is a lot lower, and it's warmer there, so maybe that's why it works there. I just have a hard time imagining those dry, hot climate things doing well here. Maybe we could pull it off in a greenhouse?

    That must have been really nice to volunteer at MT. That place is really beautiful. When we were first in Ecuador looking at land, that place was for sale and we went to check it out as a possibility because there was another guy who was interested in creating community there and had the dough, but he only wanted to do that one, he wasn't interested in Cuenca, but it was way out of our budget and we didn't get a good hit on being in Vilcabamba with this spiritual community we wanted to create. It was just an energy hit we didn't understand at the time, we always follow the inner guidance, but I just loved that place, it is really beautiful! It was sooooo tempting!

    Yes, I was there to do a talk back in February, I did a talk on "Working with Pre-Matter" and we did an exercise for pulling the energy out from under the minions' dark creation and reassigning the raw creation material to positive manifestations as energy support underneath physical reality. There is nothing more powerful than working with pre-matter, the place where things in physical reality manifest FROM! It was a powerful experience for everyone, were you there for that? Actually, I have yet to release the video for the talk I did on that, will do shortly, it's edited and ready to go. Forgot to upload it, ooops! I've just been so busy!

    Well now you know why the honey tastes so great! It's the eucalyptus!
    Save the planet, it's the only one with chocolate!

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by write4change (here)
    I have tried varius communities from the 1960s. I deeply admire what you are trying to do. You as a leader and a woman maybe more successful than those I have known. In the 60s all the leaders were men. None of the communities who attempted what you are survived. Of the groups on the internet who are the most successful, nonw of them function as you do.

    I myself lost a million dollars plus trying to give people second chances. I have come to the conclusion that no skin in the game means it really does not matter to people whether or not you succeed. Maybe much more progress has been made since the dozen years I last tried this. The next time I am separating out a small place for myself that I can sustain so if the bigger project goes down I don't loose everything.

    I was the oldest woman resident at Occupy LA, most people have no idea how to cooperatively live. So I know how much you are teaching. I would be very interested in knowing how you screen for those you include and those you don't.
    To Write4change: Communities have come a long way since the 60's, and there are a lot of successful intentional communities now. Almost every different kind of format that can be imagined is in existence now, being worked out, tried, and having it's own success and failures to some extent or another. A lot has been learned about intentional community over the decades and there is a way that these can work now more than ever, given humanity's new direction which is in the process of unfolding. I think the difference now is that humanity has a lot more tools to work with for conflict resolution, more knowledge about spiritual methods and techniques, and I believe that there is more support for this sort of thing happening at the energy level. In the 60's, it was a brand new idea, and with all new ideas there is a period of trial and error until the correct ways of doing things are found. I also believe that we are headed for being a different kind of human in the near future. We are all becoming humans who are more interested in getting along than we used to be. We're still pretty flawed, but hey, that's what the next thousand years or so is for, eh? Also, living in community USED to be the mode of operandus for humanity long ago, and really we are just relearning it. Kings with their peasants farming the lands were a form of community long ago, and everyone knew each other and each person had a place in the community. Small villages were not any different from what is being attempted as community today, and small towns were literally, say, 500 people all getting along in some way or another and having a community. Sooooo... trying to go back to that is something that is not new, we just have to relearn it. If you go all the way back to the tribal and caveman days, those were the first communities ever!

    I would say try again with the community thing if you are drawn to that, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, but I don't think someone should have to put bunches of money in if that is not something they are drawn to. I hesitate at the "put in your nest egg life savings" kind of thing. I personally would just rather rent, stay as long as it works for me, and then move on when my life changes. Life just doesn't stay the same forever, and it's taking quite a chance on doing something "permanent." I could see moving from one community to another as life goes on, not because things don't work out, but just because life changes and sometimes we need a new environment just for the fun of it, or want to live in a different area on the planet for a while, so I personally would rather rent in a community for a while, and then when the winds blow a different direction I am free to roam and see where I land next.

    That's why we're doing it as a month to month thing, so people can come and go as they please, more like renting in a community rather than sinking in your nest egg and then losing it if it doesn't work out. For some that's better way to go. Others want to own their plot of land, build their house, live there forever, and are pretty confident with the people who will be in the community, and that is completely valid too. Usually that is an older person who is ready to settle down and stay somewhere for good, but for the younger ones, well, life is about wandering for a while, isn't it? For those without much money, it's better to go with a smaller investment, like just renting. That's not a high risk situation. And if it's not the right situation, a person can walk away without feeling like they lost everything. I hear the heartbreak that must have been for you.

    As for screening, well, we have an application form and look for red flags in the questions people might ask, like "hey, can I bring my 30 guns and keep them in my room and do target practice every Wed at noon?" or "are there gonna be lots of hot half naked hippie chicks there who are just looking for a horny hound dog like me?" teehee! Just joking! Anyway, for the most part we are going to be giving everyone a chance since it's a month to month thing, and if someone isn't working out we can afford to refund them and drive them to the bus terminal or airport if they aren't fitting in and everyone really wants them to go. I think that will be a pretty low percentage, but there is always the chance that one in a thousand that might be a little nuts, or unacceptable to the community. We reserve the right to bounce someone onward if they are out of line and disturbing other people in the community without making changes after we have asked them to change what they are doing. While tolerance is the name of the game in this new unconditional love era we are entering, we still need people to respect others, and if they don't they have to go. We'll give everyone a chance unless we see a red flag during the application process. Since this is not an "invest your life savings nest egg" kind of thing we are willing to be a bit flexible in giving everyone a chance to see if they fit in. It is mutual. We are all trying them on for size, and they are trying Gaia Sagrada on for size. It's fair to have a "let's meet and we'll see" attitude. Great if it works out, no hard feelings if it doesn't. That seems fair.

    OH! Whoops! I just realized you addressed your comments to Blufire! Ooopsie! Well, anyway, I figure people will want to know this about Gaia Sagrada, sooo.... sorry I didn't see who it was addressed to! If this information is useful to anyone, it's here. I wish anyone who wants to start a community the best of luck! There will be these small communities all over the world riding out the rough times ahead, and it takes people like us starting them!
    Last edited by Christine Breese; 2nd October 2012 at 23:22.
    Save the planet, it's the only one with chocolate!

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by Davidallany (here)
    Quote Posted by Christine Breese (here)
    So David, what is your story? What brought you to Ecuador, and Loja in particular? Are you farming and own a place there?

    Yum! Chocolate! But it won't grow well at this elevation, Avacado, tomato trees, figs, the angular type of papaya, those all grow well here (although we have a lot of avacado and tomato trees already). We are curious about figs! yum!

    Yes, one of the cottage industries we have planned here is to make tinctures and oils with things like pine and eucalyptus in them. Did you notice that sometimes the honey has an ever so slight taste of eucalyptus in it? It's really nice!
    I currently do not own a farm Christine, I would like to though.
    I came to Ecuador because I was called to do so. I have spent the first 6 months volunteering in Vilca and the surrounding area. I worked in farming, constructions, cleaning, maintenance and electric wiring.It was while I was at M.T. as a volunteer that I recognized you in one of the meetings that took place over there.
    I have noticed there was a different taste in the Honey, but I didn't know why.
    I love figs, if you ever go to Turkey check out their gigantic and extra yummy figs.
    Have you thought of growing olives? I was told that cashew and olives are a commodity in Ecuador because they are very tricky to cultivate in such climate, however some have successfully grown both plants.
    Oh Gosh don't I remember those figs. I kept eating and eating and Turkish friends were telling me to stop because it could cause diarrhea with too much of it. Guess what, I did not stop, it was so good, I did not care for the rest. Olives were great too, just not as much as the figs. Heirloom (original) turkish tomatoes are also extraordinary. They turned to the tennis ball tasting one we have in America right now, but in 95 it was still good.

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Christine, that was an excellent post when you have done so many and so much service. I did learn a lot from it and I think it is helpful to those who are considering all this. Like I said I intend to program giving it a whirl. First, I need to get a passport letting mine expire in 05. I will be coming to learn from you before I take the next intentional community I try to legal status. I would also like to visit blue flame.

    You perception about small towns is somewhat true. Driving across the US on backroads most of the towns were from 300 to 3000 people. I had reserched several of them before I went. Who the leaders are is reflected in the entire town's attitude. Almost all of these towns no matter how small had at least one mansion in them compared to the rest. One I was interested in I went into the bank to see about a loan and the experience was so negative....I simply left.

    Another town I was welcomed and regarded as clean credit. I had my credit report with me among other legal papers. My superficial observations are the small towns that are stagnant or dying very slowly are very rigid about everything. I have seen small towns of less than a quarter mile on the downtown drag with three churches. The towns that are stable and properus have a much stronger tolerance for diversity.

    The town I chose because of its affoardability is about 3,200. People get along well and there is a culture of manners and respect. Calling someone a boy would not be acceptable at all. On the other hand, the state road down the middle of town--one side is black and one side is white. Part of the low price for realestate is that many whites will not live in a 50% black town period. I think we have a far harder time in the US being cooperative that just about any other part of the world. I do not think it is coincidence that a high gringo impact on Vilacambra has resulted in much resentment among the indigenous. Also many comments here of those that have experienced it note the level of distain in some forms.

    And if I can't get there, I am going to enjoy exploring your courses and looking out of your eyes at a different part of the world. Hopefully, we will be building different kinds of permaculture in a parallel way. Thank you so much for putting so much opportunity of different thinking on Avalon.
    Beware the axis of sanctimony.

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by Christine Breese (here)
    In order to have a spiritual school, University of Metaphysical Sciences, in the USA, it is required that a church 501(c)3 be the parent company of that school. Otherwise you cannot have a spiritual school in the USA that offers spiritual degrees. Wisdom of the Heart Church is the parent organization of University of Metaphysical Sciences, University of Metaphysical Sciences is a subsidiary of the church.
    The reason for this is then the PTB can't control it ,so 501(c)3 is not a spiritual school.
    Also your spirit goes to a spiritual school in the spiritual realm and second it is not controlled in the phsyical by money.(Not many are in this school BTW)

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    Ecuador Avalon Member Davidallany's Avatar
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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by Christine Breese (here)
    yummmmm! cashews and olives, I love those too, and those gigantic figs of Turkey sounds awesome! I don't think that olives and cashews would grow here though, as they are meant for warmer and drier climates, I think. Since we are just starting out with the gardens and everything, we probably have to go with sure bets on what is known to grow here though. We don't have much in the way of funds for experiments right now. Later we can try the experiments though! That is something I've always wanted to do, experiment with the impossible! Does anyone grow the olives or cashews (two of my favorites!) at the 8500 ft elevation in Ecuador? I know Loja is a lot lower, and it's warmer there, so maybe that's why it works there. I just have a hard time imagining those dry, hot climate things doing well here. Maybe we could pull it off in a greenhouse?

    That must have been really nice to volunteer at MT. That place is really beautiful. When we were first in Ecuador looking at land, that place was for sale and we went to check it out as a possibility because there was another guy who was interested in creating community there and had the dough, but he only wanted to do that one, he wasn't interested in Cuenca, but it was way out of our budget and we didn't get a good hit on being in Vilcabamba with this spiritual community we wanted to create. It was just an energy hit we didn't understand at the time, we always follow the inner guidance, but I just loved that place, it is really beautiful! It was sooooo tempting!

    Yes, I was there to do a talk back in February, I did a talk on "Working with Pre-Matter" and we did an exercise for pulling the energy out from under the minions' dark creation and reassigning the raw creation material to positive manifestations as energy support underneath physical reality. There is nothing more powerful than working with pre-matter, the place where things in physical reality manifest FROM! It was a powerful experience for everyone, were you there for that? Actually, I have yet to release the video for the talk I did on that, will do shortly, it's edited and ready to go. Forgot to upload it, ooops! I've just been so busy!

    Well now you know why the honey tastes so great! It's the eucalyptus!
    Green house is the way to go in Ecuador when it comes to Olives and Cashew, Christine. I know of no other way.
    I do not know about working with pre-matter yet. I have recently been practicing Jana Yoga. It's a powerful yoga.
    Last edited by Davidallany; 3rd October 2012 at 19:55.

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by write4change (here)
    BlueFire,


    When I attempt to do this again for the last time, I also will not even consider children for at least five years.
    Smart move imo, given that introducing children introduces liability and the attention of "authorities" who could determine that you have less than pure motivations ( i.e., David Koresh, etc). Children would be an excuse for them to invade your retreat. " They " want your children in their schools, being indoctrinated into their way of thinking.

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Christine,

    I have questions regarding Ecuador.

    * If one has vehicles licensed in the US, how difficult is it to obtain titles for those vehicles?
    * Is there a quarantine process involved regarding bringing animals into the country? ( horses, goats, dogs)
    * Are there any cooperative farming intentional communities, preferably run by locals?
    * How difficult is it to obtain a business license or is it even necessary?
    * Has the "gringo" community done anything to reach out to the locals in the spirit of cooperative living? ( sponsor events, assist with harvest, etc)

    Thank you in advance for your advice!

    Ari

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by AriG (here)
    Are there any cooperative farming intentional communities, preferably run by locals?
    Some intentional communities in Ecuador and worldwide can be found on:

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Quote Posted by AriG (here)
    Christine,
    I have questions regarding Ecuador.
    * If one has vehicles licensed in the US, how difficult is it to obtain titles for those vehicles?
    * Is there a quarantine process involved regarding bringing animals into the country? ( horses, goats, dogs)
    * Are there any cooperative farming intentional communities, preferably run by locals?
    * How difficult is it to obtain a business license or is it even necessary?
    * Has the "gringo" community done anything to reach out to the locals in the spirit of cooperative living? ( sponsor events, assist with harvest, etc)
    Ari
    Can't bring a vehicle into Ecuador less than 6 months old, and it can't be more than 6 months old by the time it actually lands on the ground here from boat, so basically, it has to be a new car, AND you have to pay 48% import tax on it. It's just not reasonably priced to bring a car, can't do it unless you buy it new off the lot and pretty much immediately stick it on a boat. They want you to buy a car here, basically.

    We brought cats on the plane with us, no quarantine, wasn't too complicated, it worked out fine. I don't know about other animals, check with the consulate in your country.

    I don't know about any farms, coops, etc run by locals, and if so, not sure how open they would be, unless you speak fluent Spanish.

    Registering a biz is necessary if you plan to make money, takes a few months and a LOT of paperwork, running around, etc, need a lawyer, and you have to be a resident to register a biz, so you have to attain residency.

    I know WE have reached out a lot to our local area, I don't know about others. I believe there are plenty who do at their local levels but if they aren't trying to get people from the states or overseas to be involved, which most aren't since they are just a couple or a family with a small place and some neighbors they want to help, or just reach thieir local areas, I'm not sure you can connect with them unless you are actually here on the ground meeting people yourself at the coffee shops and seeing who is who. You pretty much have to be here to connect with that, I think. Honestly, I just don't have time to try to find out what everyone else is doing, we are pretty busy trying to get our things going and working with our own local area. The links Christian gave in the previous post sounds like a good place to start. Also, try the woofing sites, that might be a good place to find something besides what we're doing. We will be having an organic farm as well, starting in Jan.
    Save the planet, it's the only one with chocolate!

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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Hey, check this out, I just found this link! Other people starting communities in Ecuador, maybe one of these is your thing instead. Most of these are in Vilcabamba, and I know a few of these to be dreams that never really got off the ground yet and the listing is a few years old, but still, worth checking out! http://directory.ic.org/intentional_communities_Ecuador

    Also, if you go to that Intentional Communities site, they have a big directory with communities all over the world listed. When I was young and this directory was in its infant stages, I used this book to find communities to do work exchange at since I was a have-not all my life and that was the only way I could be at any of these. I saw what worked firsthand and what didn't work in these communities. The Intentional Communities team that started this directory nowadays do seminars and stuff like that on how to build and start a community, they even have instruction guides they sell, I think.

    here's some of their conferences http://fic.ic.org/conferences-events/ and if you do a google search, you'll probably find lots of things like this and workshops on how to successfully create or join community. Here's the events listings on their site with workshops on community http://communities.ic.org/events/
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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Wow. 48% import tax. Can you drive in on vacation in a personal vehicle?

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    Ecuador Avalon Member Christine Breese's Avatar
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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    AriG: I'm not sure if you can drive a car in here or not and just be on vacation. I think you can. I asked someone today and they said they read somewhere that a person can come with a car, but they MUST leave with it when their tourist visa is up in 3 months, or however long you get extensions for. That means that even if the car is totally junked or totalled, was in an accident, whatever, it still has to be taken out of here when you leave. You can't leave without the car, from what I understand and it's even stamped in your passport that you have a car in the country. I'm just relaying that, none of it is anything I know as fact, just heresay. You'll have to check on that. Let us all know what you find out!

    Blufire said: . . . those with plenty money don’t have to work while those who do not, have to work their stay. While it is good you offer this choice, it is my opinion, it perpetuates a destructive negative paradigm designed by the global ‘elite’.

    For me in designing forming the community here in the mountains one of my first thoughts is can we as a whole community Thrive within the framework we are forming or another way to look at it is how dependent are we as a whole on financial means, outside resources (all types) and/or how much will individuals have to work outside the community . . . at least in the first few year or how much can we totally support ourselves while maintaining balance within the community and eco systems

    I may just be really confused on this whole thread . . . but Bill started this thread with the title as an opportunity to live in Ecuador that was “totally in line with Avalon’s mission” and maybe I am assuming way too much here or again just way out of line or confused.


    I had to let this sit for a couple days, as this comment hurt my heart when I worked so hard to make this possible for everyone, particularly the have-nots (and dirt cheap for the haves with no risk to their nest eggs!). I sacrificed what little I have instead of taking care of only myself, (and I could have had a much easier time of it for the past three years if I just took care of myself!) then to have this beautiful creation that straddles the gap between the old and new paradigm labeled in someone’s opinion, “it perpetuates a destructive negative paradigm designed by the global ‘elite’”

    Ouch! Girlfriend! What a punch to the heart! Ooooh. I had to put some ice on that one!

    In the next paragraph you contradict yourself and say you need “haves” with jobs or resources like life savings outside of your community bringing in money who will invest in your business idea that eventually (maybe) everyone can live off of after few years of work and investing to build something on your land with their money (a long shot in a down economy during a paradigm shift). And where do the have-nots fit into your plan? You didn’t mention them at all. The have-nots will need to have a job outside your community and become haves, right? At least for the first few years until you get this huge successful business off the ground that is making enough money to support an entire community, right? That’s a tall order!

    I definitely had to take a pause and get deep into my heart to answer this one, so here goes in the most compassionate way possible! I hope you read this with the love it is delivered with. This is actually in support of your dream and I want to see you succeed, but you haven’t thought this out thoroughly enough. You are just beginning to think about this, so please do follow all possible resources you can find on the internet about how to avoid common pitfalls that people make who are trying to start a community.

    I’m sure there are lots of people on this post thinking about community in some way or another, or at least curious, so I want to help steer you into situations that are healthy for your wallet and your mind, how to identify a community that has sustainable energy or that which is a pipe dream, and how to go about this in a financially balanced and logical way. There is a certain financial sanity needed in this era of change where we have to straddle two paradigms, the old run by money and the new run by… well, we have to yet see how that is going to work out and invent it as a species wide project!

    The Cold Hard Facts: Money

    Humanity isn’t out of the old paradigm yet, must have money to pay for things like electric, water, gas, insurance, maintenance, food… the list goes on. Until the new paradigm is solidly in place, perhaps in a few decades, generations, or even millennia, then there will no longer be haves and have-nots or disparity in their levels of housing.

    Money still has to be part of the equation on earth. PG&E isn’t accepting happy thoughts and good intentions for electric bills! New paradigms are not born overnight. This is a process. That means for now we have to contend with the money system, and that includes the disparity between haves and have-nots, while we reach for a utopian reality at the same time. It is the act of literally straddling two paradigms.

    Is It Fair To Have-Nots To Do Work Exchange?

    A person doing work exchange (have-not) is earning money at a retreat center while they are at the retreat center. Those who are paying (haves), they got the money before they came to the retreat center. So what’s the difference? It all equals the same thing. One way or another everyone has to carry their own financial weight while we still live in an old paradigm. Some have money to carry their weight with, and others have work trade to carry their weight with. Either way, it equals the same thing.

    Just Rent, No Risk, Freedom to Come and Go, Better Solution For Some

    What better solution than to have a spiritual community where everyone just pays cheap rent for a spiritual experience? That is basically what this is, and you don’t even have to pay a security deposit! What a deal!

    To add even more benefit, people can come and go as they please. If life takes you in a different direction, you don’t have to go through the rigamarole of trying to get your money back out of a community or simply losing it. No one is financially locked in, ever. Settling permanently into a community is valid for some people, buying the land, investing, building a house, but that is usually for middle aged or older people who are ready to settle down. For those in their younger years, life can change directions in an instant, right? This is a chance for those people to experience community too. They can enjoy it for how long it works for them and move on when life takes them in the next direction.

    A lot of growth would happen while a person is at Gaia Sagrada so life is going to change a lot for anyone who comes here. While here, a person will have spiritual inspiration, with lots of time to reflect within, and not go broke doing it. I have to say I see this place as a sanctuary where people of ordinary means can rest from the rat race for a while if they have a small savings they are trying to stretch out over time. Yes, a person will need to have a little bit, even if it’s not a lot. This isn’t a homeless shelter and we are not able to carry other people financially. They have to carry their weight. If any billionaires want to step up as sponsors for some totally have-nots, feel free to let me know, though!

    Utopian Fantasies, Can They Work In This Reality Right Now?

    Utopian fantasies are not implementable in this reality at this time. BRIDGING THE GAP between the old and new paradigm is at the crux of the dilemma, of course, and compromise between what is reality and what we want in the future has to be made. Maybe someday that utopian fantasy of everyone being financially equal will come true, but it’s not here yet. If anyone knows how to bypass all of the steps between one paradigm to another, completely eradicating the money situation between the haves and have-nots and solve this world problem overnight, please share! We would love to know!

    Humanity’s Great Awakening: Just the Beginning

    Humanity’s Great Awakening is only the tip of the iceberg. Removing the minions from places of power by realizing what they are doing, firing them by not going along with their plans, that is only the first step. The REAL work comes after that. It’s one thing to awaken, but then you have to get the coffee, roll up the shirt sleeves, and do some serious work to change a reality. To attain a utopian reality is going to take decades, generations, maybe even a millennium or two. Humanity is getting a “get out of jail free” card pretty soon, but we don’t get an overnight “humanity lives happily ever after” card. It ain’t gonna be THAT easy! We wish!

    Conclusion

    As for being in alignment with the mission at Avalon, yes, we are of the same energy. I hope you can see that. I’m sure everyone can understand it is better than nothing to offer housing for every budget so everyone can participate, haves and have-nots included. It’s the best any community can do in this death and birth process moving through time right now, when the old paradigm still rules and the new paradigm isn’t born yet.

    Gotta pay the bills while reaching for the stars!
    Last edited by Christine Breese; 5th October 2012 at 06:38.
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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    Blufire said: It would be helpful for me if you could clarify a bit more if this is only a ‘spiritual retreat’ or a true functional community.

    Gaia Sagrada opens January 20, 2013 and yes, it is both a retreat and a functional community. It is already functioning with 20 working Ecuadorians, both men and women, who are all family with us. Lunch is made daily, everyone eats together and then they play soccer for a half an hour. Each workday is fun! We joke around and come up with creative solutions to everything. Being a retreat center and allowing people to come for a week or two for that particular week’s spiritual topic, this is part of the functioning of the community. The people who live here for a month or a few months or even more, they are taking more time.

    Blufire said: Reading quickly through your posts I see families are not welcome at this time, you grow very little of your own food and

    We didn’t say children aren’t welcome; We said we aren’t ready yet! That’s a tall order to create 1–12K school for kids, daycare, for toddlers, completely kid proof all the land so they don’t drown in reservoirs, fall off cliffs, make sure everything is perfect, find something to keep them busy and hire people to do that if there aren’t qualified teachers in the community, all while the adults go off and do their spiritual search, yikes!

    One thing at a time my friend! We’re just starting! We have to take it slow and let this thing unfold. Most communities don’t get to the point of having kids in community until it’s been going for a few years. Whoever said 5 years before doing the kid thing at a community, that’s about right. People need to develop their group systems before adding that difficult and complicated organizational task.

    Communities are built in steps. Small steps. That’s what it takes. One thing at a time. You don’t just come out of the starting gate on your first day with everything in place. Gardens are the same thing, they take time to develop, years actually.

    Blufire said: it appears your main sustainability or resources will come from financial or monetary contributions.

    We’re in the old paradigm where money rules. You yourself said you would need outside money to run a community, everyone would have to have a job to be at your center. You already understand that money comes from outside of these communities when they first begin. It takes years for communities to become full fledged business entities producing money, product and income for its members.

    Thanks Blufire!

    Blufire has brought up a really important subject indeed, a deeper subject about haves and have-nots, how we are all tired of it, the structures of communities and the disparity between those who have money and those who do not, and it got me writing… Thanks for the writing catalyst, Blufire! You were my inspiration for the articles I’m working on right now, So You Wanna Be In A Community? and another called Bridging the Paradigm Shift Gap. I like to write about challenging spiritual issues and dilemmas! Thanx for the jab in the writing arm! I’ll let you guys know when I post them if you want. Also, these are all fair issues to bring up and I hope I addressed each one of your concerns.
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    Default Re: An Opportunity to Live in Ecuador

    It sounds like a great place to live amongst like minded people. I may drop by in the near future to get a taste of it for a few weeks.

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