Your thoughts on free masons

[Pixie]

I recently met a free mason and I felt like I should not trust him and yet when I research about masons I don't find anything too bad... What do you think

[Moemers]

I think that no one can do anything to you unless you step out of love.

[Dale]

Hello,

I'd recommend reading the book "The Secret Teachings of All Ages," by Manly Palmer Hall. He was a 33rd degree Freemason as well as a brilliant spirit.

I have nothing against Freemasonry; I know several Masons and find them to be very intelligent and spiritual people. I'm not saying that all Masons are like this, however. I'm sure there are corrupt individuals in the organization, like anywhere else.

There is a thread on this forum addressing the issue directly, started by a Freemason we have as a member on Avalon. It's quite interesting, as well, and would probably clear up a good many misconceptions.

-Cipher

[Pixie]

Thank you very much cypher

[tone3jaguar]

If he is 32 degree or lower he is probably just a good guy who is a member of a fraternal organization. If he is 33rd degree then look out.

[norman]

My thoughts on Freemasons, for you.

I know 2 Freemasons.

I know of many more and much 'higher' than the 2 I know.

I get a mental nausia whenever I meet either of the 2 freemasons I know. There is something fundamentally "corrupt" about their whole presence.

Whenever I have got into conversation with them about their being freemasons I get the same stock replies. They just "joined to do the best they could for their families and themselves".

When I look closely at the affairs of just one of them I see a trail of corrupt dealings going back beyond the time I've known him. All the way from snapping up cheap land that couldn't be built upon and then mysteriously COULD!.... be built upon, who was the planning officer at the local council?, yes you can guess, another or his beehive mates..... to..... getting himself and 2 of his 'children' extreemly well paid subcontractor work on huge money sink operations like the decomissioning of the Trawsfunydd neuclear Powerstation in North Wales ( particularly disgusting news for me personally because I was very heavily involved in the campaign/operation to get the place shut down in the first place ) [ and when I met his son and told him that, he laughed and bought me a pint ]

THe other freemason I know is very 'sheepish' about it with me and tries to avoid allowing it to come up as an issue with us in conversation.

I'm in no doubt at all that the sort of 'energy' and 'brotherliness' going on with freemasons is ( even at it lowest levels ) fully complicit with the greatest crimes and lies and corruption going on in the whole world. It not unlike becoming a member of a large political party excedpt that this one never actually goes through the pretence of trying to get elected and function "publicly".

I believe that the higher masons are so accustomed to being 'on the winning side' that they have confidence in their corruption that in infectious for the ones lower down who try it out gently at first and discover that it really 'works' and so they become more confident and convicted to the brotherhood, believing that it really is the all powerful seeing eye etc...etc... and nothing outside of the brotherhood can ever really 'touch' the affairs of the brothers, even when they blatantly break the rules of the land.

I pondered all of this for years and at one time i put together an audio CD project and tried to put into words my best alternative to the 'power' of the secrecy of the brotherhood. What I tried to single out was the simple fact that the power of the brotherhood really lies in the deeply personal relationship and comitment between them. It seems as if we, the rest of us, have to play by the stunted 'public' rules of the state while these brothers secretly only pretend to do so and actually carry on the real business of their lives in a personal and very non public relationship with each other.

My intention was to suggest that we, the rest of us, need to, well, I'll say it here just like I said it on the back of the CD in 2004.....


( after a quote from Vaclav Havel anda quote from Theodore Roszak )

I added a 'quote' from myself......:

"........We shouldn't believe in anything Public, Commercial or Political. I think we should all get personal and first set about solving the biggest crimes and dispelling the biggest lies of I time......."



ok, I think,and you did ask for thought here, that we, the rest of us, have to apply the same method they use to counteract what they do and possibly even round them up and take them out of circulation altogether. We have to use the "personal" principle and side step any and nearly all accountability to stupid made up rules that the makers of those rules don't even live by themselves.

I DO realise that THAT COULD be interperated as a Bloody Revolution. After all, that's sort of what the French Revolution was like really. I mean, when a crowd of people swarm down an avenue in a capitol city grabbing anyone and everyone that has ever played a part in their oppression, and sloughtering them without a 'public' trial, just purely on the basis that "WE all know they're guilty", that's suddenly playing the game by the samr kind of rules that the 'brotherhood' has been getting it's own way by. TIT for TAT mate!

err... sorry if that was more than you'd expected. Just thought I give you my thoughts.

[Fredkc]

Posted by tone3jaguar (here)
If he is 32 degree or lower he is probably just a good guy who is a member of a fraternal organization. If he is 33rd degree then look out.

Thank you T3J.

As it happens the most intelligent, moral, and self-giving man I have met in this life, happened to have gone through 32 degree, and then dropped participation. He still carried on every one of the high ideals set forth in their credo, and never spoke of his acts, or his previous involvement.

He mentored people around him.
He helped people from other countries get to the US, for education, then employed them.
He was a tireless friend to his neighbors.
A tireless enemy to abusers of any kind.
A tireless educator, adviser and confessor to my friends.
He was my father.

On the day of his funeral, I never saw so many complete strangers, people he had helped and worked with, and mostly men openly weeping. I was envied for how lucky I had been, being his son, and told repeatedly there would never be another like my father.

It's 42 years later, and I know they weren't just saying it for me.

Organizations of all kinds can, and do bring out the faithful.

Fred

[bluestflame]

i hear ya fred , me great uncle was one

[One]

You don't need to look at individuals. You can't have secret societies with power and influence in a democracy. The potential for corruption is massive. Its as simple as 1+1=2 to be honest. I really can't see the difficulty here. Thats another thread though.

As far as trustworthiness goes. I'd say less than average. Joining would most likely be a self serving consideration in most cases I would think.

[Ixopoborn]

I have had contact with many Freemasons. A notable freemason is a member of this forum, Rimbaud. There is little doubt that Rimbaud is caring and honest. This is my clear impression from the way he writes. I like people like Rimbaud.

I agree though that the current structure of freemasonry is wrong and is in need of reform. Systematically approved secrecy is, in general, unnecessary, harmful and bad.

Freemasonry at its best is populated by people like Rimbaud and Fred's father. Most freemasons having nothing close to their integrity and good behaviour.

I understand resistance to abandoning the vail of secrecy which distinguishes freemasonry. In my determined opinion, the secrecy aspect should be dumped as soon as possible or else Freemasony will be left without any worthwhile role or good thinking members in the future.

Sorry Rimbaud if this upsets you. I mean no upset. The so called 4th density existence that we are being drawn towards will have no place for secrecy. Freemasonry must decide to drop this aspect of it's culture if it wants to survive.

[Teakai]

Posted by tone3jaguar (here)
If he is 32 degree or lower he is probably just a good guy who is a member of a fraternal organization. If he is 33rd degree then look out.

I agree, tone3jaguar.

They might make a jolly good brother, but a bloody awful human being.
If you're not one of us, you're nothing.

[MariaDine]

Those one chose a path or those the path choses you ?!
...that sound awful...Ehehehhe !

[MariaDine]

Dear Pixie ! ...never mind all what is said here. Follow your heart.

These encounters happen for a reason. Must of us have them all the time. This «things« come to us because we have to question what is «presented» to us. Like homework. We have to explore, question..and come to our own conclusions. Don't be afraid ....of anything. Free mansons, templars, rosecrucians...etc
Ask youself... Why do I need »this» ?...Why have I need to find out side of myself , validation ,assurrance , .............that I am on the right track?

It?s not a silly question.

But NO ONE is going to the homework for you. Freedom of choice. Chose wisely.

Namaste
MD

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=IKOckpO1WA8

[Kulapops]

I think they should all be free... I'm not paying for a single one of them...

[Zook]

Posted by norman (here)
My thoughts on Freemasons, for you.
I know 2 Freemasons.
I know of many more and much 'higher' than the 2 I know.
I get a mental nausia whenever I meet either of the 2 freemasons I know. There is something fundamentally "corrupt" about their whole presence.
Whenever I have got into conversation with them about their being freemasons I get the same stock replies. They just "joined to do the best they could for their families and themselves".
[...]

A telling tale of two masons. I agree for the most part, Norman. IMO, a fraternal organization should be a free association of like-interested individuals. If those interests are not sinister, then there is no harm. But if those interests extend into control of the clergy, the polity, or the laity - and human nature invariably brings about such extensions - then what fraternal organizations really represent are vehicles for fascist insurrection.

That being said, I'm being visited by cat 1 Hurricane Earl as I type. Power may go off at any time. Satellite imagery of Earl provides the perfect context for my own views on human organization (fraternal and otherwise). Think of a calm sea. Now think of eddies in the calm sea. Now think of a giant whirlpool spinning the sea. My point is this. A calm sea is beautiful
in itself, but eventually the eyes crave for something different, something that stirs the calm sea. Enter eddies. Eddies give sprite to the calm sea. And when the eddies dissipate, the calm sea soothes our eyes again. Now suppose the eddies don't dissipate but, rather, superimpose. And later still, the superimpositions themselves superimpose, and still again ... We now have a whirlpool. Plant the satellite image of Hurricane Earl in your mind (I realize that it's a wind vortex, but we can apply it to a water vortex as well; here, I'm guessing that most of you have read Edgar Allan Poe's 'Descent into The Maelstrom').

But here's my point, calm seas (representing individuals) are nondestructive; reversible eddies (representing small groups) are nondestructive; irreversible eddies are vectored towards the formation of whirlpools, and these (representing large groups) are destructive.

In short, my argument is an argument of scale. Human nature does not permit nondestructive human organization beyond a threshold group size. This threshold size is usually quite small, perhaps smaller than that which can fit in a pub. Certainly, freemasonry, being an international brotherhood is well beyond the nondestructive threshold. In short, freemasonry is necessarily destructive.

Anyways, my preliminary thoughts on the matter. More after Hurricane Earl passes through.

Cheers
Uncle Zook

[Kulapops]

Eddie's a freemason ?

I'd never have guessed...

[Humble Janitor]

I don't know enough masons to make a judgment. I've always believed they were guys in funny hats that liked to get together to drink beer and play pool.

Only until I found this site did I learn about the influence of the higher-level masons on politics and societies around the world.

[Swami]

We must be getting CLOSE

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=MbvSemVgF28

[Zook]

Hi Humble J,

Posted by Humble Janitor (here)
I don't know enough masons to make a judgment. I've always believed they were guys in funny hats that liked to get together to drink beer and play pool.

Only until I found this site did I learn about the influence of the higher-level masons on politics and societies around the world.

Well, I've read enough about 'em to make a judgment.

I'd like to lock 'em up ; throw away the key; give 'em a cookie 'n a cup of water on a daily basis, each.

I'm just sayin'.

[Lost Soul]

Posted by tone3jaguar (here)
If he is 32 degree or lower he is probably just a good guy who is a member of a fraternal organization. If he is 33rd degree then look out.

Concur. Anyone who is 32nd degree or lower is in ignorance of what happens at higher levels. These lesser masons are the front men who put a good face onto the face of masonry.