Sun is not visible outside the upper Atmosphere?

[Isserley]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Stoc91H2snE

I watched the video above where Peter is talking about our inability to see light rays and only seeing reflected light (rays). He also says that in Space you would be blinded by the Sun even though you would not see it because our Atmosphere is what provides the refraction, thus making it visible. So I'm a bit puzzled at this.
He also said that there is not one nasa photo of the Sun taken from the out side of our Atmosphere in the visible spectrum..

Can we not see the light sources in the visible spectrum? Our photoreceptors in the eyes detect those wavelengths and we can see the source (at least here on the Earth).

Does our eye's lens and the vitreous humour not provide for the medium for the light to travel through and refract, thus allowing us to detect light radiations falling on the photoreceptors, while in the outer space, too?

Even if we did not have the medium between the light source and the photoreceptors, should we still not be able to "see" the source as it's being detected by the photoreceptors.

After all, aren't our instruments that detect Gamma, X-rays and IR in Space also working on the same principles and they are in the Vacuum of Space without a medium in-between? Why would visible light be any different than the other higher/lower wavelength radiations (Peter said that light is not transmitted in the visible spectrum in Outer Space)?
What are everyone else's meditations on this specific subject?
I think this is one big fat "Truman Show"

[TargeT]

think about it this way:

when you shine a flash light and look at the "beam" (no dust in the air etc..) what do you see? can you see "light" or nothing? is the light there?

Perhaps our understanding of light is not quite right, perhaps we should refer to it more as "energy" or "photon creating energy" as all we see is the photon's created by the energy striking matter.

Some matter creates many more photons than other mater (reflective / absorbent") is this refraction or photon creation?

An interesting discussion on this topic is held in this thread:

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...light=7redorbs

hope that helps a bit to answer your question.

[RMorgan]

Well, this is not possible, mostly because the sun itself is a big combustive sphere that provides its own fuel.

The sun is literally a big burning ball. So, we can´t see the photons themselves, but we can see the source.

If his statements were truth, our experiments with spacial telescopes, which are located in the very extreme limits of our upper atmosphere would be a failure.

[TargeT]

Posted by RMorgan (here)
Well, this is not possible, mostly because the sun itself is a big combustive sphere that provides its own fuel.

The sun is literally a big burning ball. So, we can´t see the photons themselves, but we can see the source.

If his statements were truth, our experiments with spacial telescopes, which are located in the very extreme limits of our upper atmosphere would be a failure.

I Do not think the sun is a big combustive sphere, I do not think there is any "combustion" going on at all.

What is seen as "combustion" is just plasma on large scale, the sun is an electro-magnetic focal point, an "electric phenomenon" not a combustive one.. this is why the Corona is MILLIONS of degrees hotter than the surface, and why we see "sun spots" that are black when the plasma flows off.


for more on this see:
http://www.holoscience.com/wp/

[WanderingRogue]

So, am i getting this right.... we can see the source of light, but not the light itself? And if that's true, then you can't see the sun because the light blinds us from seeing it? Or is he saying you could look directly at it from space and see nothing? I'm thinking its more like a light bulb...you can't see the parts that create the light unless it is off...but I'm also using my simple mind for this thought process.

[Fred Steeves]

I have serious doubts as to whether the sun is actually that hot at all. Doesn't it take planetary atmosphere to focus a star's energy, thus turning it into heat? Like how focusing a magnifying glass outside onto a piece of paper will burn it, whether the day is hot or cold?

Of course a simple experiment, which I'm certain has already been done, could solve the question. Is the area of space around Earth hotter than the area of space around Mars? If not, then me thinks "Houston, we have a problem". Because with the big ball of fire story, it had better be.

If I'm missing some crucial piece of basic solar physics here, then someone please dial me in.

Cheers,
Fred

[norman]

Ok, Fred, it's you and me off on a recci'

Set the controls for the heart of the sun.

I tend to think that if I chucked something into the sun, it would burn up pretty damn quick.



edit:

Which has been around for the longest time?

1) convincingly real CGI techniques.

2) NASA movies of the roaring sun?

[RMorgan]

Posted by TargeT (here)

Posted by RMorgan (here)
Well, this is not possible, mostly because the sun itself is a big combustive sphere that provides its own fuel.

The sun is literally a big burning ball. So, we can´t see the photons themselves, but we can see the source.

If his statements were truth, our experiments with spacial telescopes, which are located in the very extreme limits of our upper atmosphere would be a failure.

I Do not think the sun is a big combustive sphere, I do not think there is any "combustion" going on at all.

What is seen as "combustion" is just plasma on large scale, the sun is an electro-magnetic focal point, an "electric phenomenon" not a combustive one.. this is why the Corona is MILLIONS of degrees hotter than the surface, and why we see "sun spots" that are black when the plasma flows off.


for more on this see:
http://www.holoscience.com/wp/

Well, it´s combustive if we realize the hydrogen and helium work as its fuel; These gases are heated to extreme high levels until they get ionized and become plasma emitting extreme radiation that we feel as heat...lol...That´s it, as far as my limited knowledge of astrophysics go.

[TargeT]

Posted by Fred Steeves (here)
I have serious doubts as to whether the sun is actually that hot at all. Doesn't it take planetary atmosphere to focus a star's energy, thus turning it into heat? Like how focusing a magnifying glass outside onto a piece of paper will burn it, whether the day is hot or cold?

Of course a simple experiment, which I'm certain has already been done, could solve the question. Is the area of space around Earth hotter than the area of space around Mars? If not, then me thinks "Houston, we have a problem". Because with the big ball of fire story, it had better be.

If I'm missing some crucial piece of basic solar physics here, then someone please dial me in.

Cheers,
Fred

I think your mostly wrong and a little right


The sun itself is hot, very hot, but that heat does not "radiate" out to us like a space heater does in a home. This energy we call "light" is transmitted through space (vacuum) & does not atrophy at all until it strikes an object, an asteroid, or planet for example. It needs "matter" to interact with; now the earth benefits from having an atmosphere by equalizing the temperature, sort of "stabilizing" it, as the dark side stays warm and the light side is buffered so its not too hot, the moon for example. The temperature of the Moon can dip down to -153°C during the night, in the day can rise to 107°C; there is no atmosphere to buffer the temperature, no "insulation".

Posted by RMorgan (here)
Well, it´s combustive if we realize the hydrogen and helium work as its fuel; These gases are heated to extreme high levels until they get ionized and become plasma emitting extreme radiation that we feel as heat...lol...That´s it, as far as my limited knowledge of astrophysics go.

I do not think this is the case either (burning of hydrogen and helium, though there may be some of that happening too).

I see it more like a lightning rod or sort of like a magnifying glass for the galactic energies that are always present, these are what create Nebula and other phenomenon’s, we are awash in energy, and at certain points it concentrates...

the "vacuum" is anything but, it is FULL of energy, vacuum is the worst term for it (unless you are simply talking about breathable air, then there should be a caveat noted).

I think the sun is a focal point for energy & the plasma is just a byproduct of all those energies converging, sort of like a magnifying glass collecting and redirecting the suns energy here on earth.

[RMorgan]

Posted by TargeT (here)

Posted by RMorgan (here)
Well, this is not possible, mostly because the sun itself is a big combustive sphere that provides its own fuel.

The sun is literally a big burning ball. So, we can´t see the photons themselves, but we can see the source.

If his statements were truth, our experiments with spacial telescopes, which are located in the very extreme limits of our upper atmosphere would be a failure.

I Do not think the sun is a big combustive sphere, I do not think there is any "combustion" going on at all.

What is seen as "combustion" is just plasma on large scale, the sun is an electro-magnetic focal point, an "electric phenomenon" not a combustive one.. this is why the Corona is MILLIONS of degrees hotter than the surface, and why we see "sun spots" that are black when the plasma flows off.


for more on this see:
http://www.holoscience.com/wp/

Well, it´s combustive if we realize that hydrogen and helium (there´s a little bit of oxygen, carbon, neon and iron as well) work as its thermonuclear fuel; These gases are heated to extreme high levels of temperature under impressively huge pressure until they get ionized and become plasma, emitting extreme radiation that we feel as heat...lol...That´s it, as far as my limited knowledge of astrophysics go anyway.

Posted by Fred Steeves (here)
I have serious doubts as to whether the sun is actually that hot at all. Doesn't it take planetary atmosphere to focus a star's energy, thus turning it into heat? Like how focusing a magnifying glass outside onto a piece of paper will burn it, whether the day is hot or cold?

Of course a simple experiment, which I'm certain has already been done, could solve the question. Is the area of space around Earth hotter than the area of space around Mars? If not, then me thinks "Houston, we have a problem". Because with the big ball of fire story, it had better be.

If I'm missing some crucial piece of basic solar physics here, then someone please dial me in.

Cheers,
Fred

Fred,

The sun emits tons of radiation, which gladly is filtered by our atmosphere and what´s left we are able to feel as heat.

Only the fact that its gases being transformed into plasma under such extreme thermonuclear process and external pressure makes it extremely hot.

Anyway, there are several methods of measuring planets and starts temperature, including color and spectrum analyzes.

Raf.

[norman]

My double glazing has a partial vacuum to cut down the transmission of heat.

I'm not absolutely sure space is a 'vacuum' but I think it would be hard to feel direct "heat" from the sun even if it's incredibly hot.

[RMorgan]

Posted by norman (here)
My double glazing has a partial vacuum to cut down the transmission of heat.

I'm not absolutely sure space is a 'vacuum' but I think it would be hard to feel direct "heat" from the sun even if it's incredibly hot.

In fact, vacuum is a great radiation conductor. Our air and atmosphere, on the contrary, are very good insulators, gladly.

[norman]

Posted by RMorgan (here)

Posted by norman (here)
My double glazing has a partial vacuum to cut down the transmission of heat.

I'm not absolutely sure space is a 'vacuum' but I think it would be hard to feel direct "heat" from the sun even if it's incredibly hot.

In fact, vacuum is a great radiation conductor. Our air and atmosphere, on the contrary, are very good insulators.

Aah... ok, so the vacuum in my window panels is more about keeping noise out.

[RMorgan]

Posted by norman (here)

Posted by RMorgan (here)

Posted by norman (here)
My double glazing has a partial vacuum to cut down the transmission of heat.

I'm not absolutely sure space is a 'vacuum' but I think it would be hard to feel direct "heat" from the sun even if it's incredibly hot.

In fact, vacuum is a great radiation conductor. Our air and atmosphere, on the contrary, are very good insulators.

Aah... ok, so the vacuum in my window panels is more about keeping noise out.

Exactly, vacuum is the perfect sound insulator, because sound is a mechanical wave. Mechanical waves don´t propagate in the vacuum.

Radiation, however, are either energetic particles or energetic waves and don´t require a medium to travel.

[TargeT]

Posted by norman (here)

Posted by RMorgan (here)

Posted by norman (here)
My double glazing has a partial vacuum to cut down the transmission of heat.

I'm not absolutely sure space is a 'vacuum' but I think it would be hard to feel direct "heat" from the sun even if it's incredibly hot.

In fact, vacuum is a great radiation conductor. Our air and atmosphere, on the contrary, are very good insulators.

Aah... ok, so the vacuum in my window panels is more about keeping noise out.

A thermos keeps hot beverages hot and cold beverages cold by separating the contents from the outside world with a vacuum. Heat is conducted by three modes, conduction, convection, and radiation. A vacuum prevents conduction and convection, and a reflective coating (your "glaze") serves to reflect radiated heat back where it came from. The VIG (vacuum-insulated glass) works the same way, with a vacuum between two panes of glass, and a low-E coating to prevent radiant heat from escaping.

[WanderingRogue]

If the sun is so hot, then why is space cold? I am sure it is warmer in our atmosphere than outside of it....space shuttles and satellites don't burn up when they are on the sunny side of our planet...and lots of comets are made of ice...maybe people will say that it depends on how far you are from the sun, like getting closer or farther from a fire or any other heat source...but then maybe it isn't hot at all and it works in a whole different way. They have those fancy stoves that you can touch with your hand and not get burned, but use a pan and you can boil water or fry eggs just like a conventional stove.

I want one of these by the way!

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=PWFBXslEI24

[Ammit]

This is a question from my mind, not a dig at your theories....

How do we know the sun is as you say" Well, it´s combustive if we realize that hydrogen and helium (there´s a little bit of oxygen, carbon, neon and iron as well) work as its thermonuclear fuel;", what if it is not what we all think, know or have been told by our trusted scientists........

If in the memory of chat here before, the sun is a portal, then, why would all these space travellers try to pass through something as hot as our sun is supposed to be.......

Things are not what they seem to be, people are perplexed by the strangeness of " I think the sun is a focal point for energy & the plasma is just a by product of all those energies converging, sort of like a magnifying glass collecting and redirecting the suns energy here on earth."............what if this was correct????

I personally have no idea so any teachings would help me to understand...
Ammit

[TargeT]

Posted by WanderingRogue (here)
If the sun is so hot, then why is space cold? I am sure it is warmer in our atmosphere than outside of it....space shuttles and satellites don't burn up when they are on the sunny side of our planet...and lots of comets are made of ice...maybe people will say that it depends on how far you are from the sun, like getting closer or farther from a fire or any other heat source...but then maybe it isn't hot at all and it works in a whole different way. They have those fancy stoves that you can touch with your hand and not get burned, but use a pan and you can boil water or fry eggs just like a conventional stove.

Heat is conducted by three modes, conduction, convection, and radiation. A vacuum prevents conduction and convection but is very condusive to radiation.

Conduction is the transfer of heat between substances that are in direct contact with each other.

convection, is the transfer of heat from one place to another by the movement of fluids or gasses (anything but solids, as that is conduction).

Both conduction and convection require matter to transfer heat.

Radiation is a method of heat transfer that does not rely upon any contact between the heat source and the heated object. For example, we feel heat from the sun even though we are not touching it. Heat can be transmitted though empty space by thermal radiation. Thermal radiation (often called infrared radiation) is a type electromagnetic radiation (or light). Radiation is a form of energy transport consisting of electromagnetic waves traveling at the speed of light. No mass is exchanged and no medium is required.



Satellites and shapce shuttles get VERY hot in space, the shuttles have large amounts of insulation and cooling equipment, the satellights are just built to "take" it.


So, I think we have circled back to our original question... What is LIGHT?

is it just electromagnetic waves that interact with objects, causing them to produce photons (which are visible to to the human eye) ?

[skamandar]

Posted by WanderingRogue (here)
If the sun is so hot, then why is space cold? I am sure it is warmer in our atmosphere than outside of it....space shuttles and satellites don't burn up when they are on the sunny side of our planet...and lots of comets are made of ice...maybe people will say that it depends on how far you are from the sun, like getting closer or farther from a fire or any other heat source...but then maybe it isn't hot at all and it works in a whole different way. They have those fancy stoves that you can touch with your hand and not get burned, but use a pan and you can boil water or fry eggs just like a conventional stove.

I want one of these by the way!

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=PWFBXslEI24

Very good questions indeed...

[norman]

Posted by TargeT (here)

is it just electromagnetic waves that interact with objects, causing them to produce photons (which are visible to to the human eye) ?

Light is scattered so we see it coming from all around us, as long as there are atoms/molecules to scatter the light. If there is nothing there to scatter the light, the only light we'll see is by looking directly at the source.