Avalon is being monitored by 4 different groups.

[thunder24]

Posted by firstlook (here)
LAND. This is the issue I am at struggle with right now. How to safely occupy "public land" and hold off force from enforcement to vacate that land through my right as a human being. im pretty sure others have done so by simply discussing with "authorities" that I am not actually claiming to own the land I live on but more am upholding my right to survive and live. The language will come to me one day I suppose.

You hit on a very crucial topic IMO. I am in agreement with that direction.

do you hike, I hear the Appalachian trail is beautiful... do you know your flora and fauna? that might b helpful to b on public land and not pay for nothing... if you want to eat... do you eat meat? you can hunt and fish... own some rope, or a tent, or a hammer?

The best way to hold off force, is not to b seen... a friend told me one time "its better to b a live dog, then a dead lion"
You can remain in one spot in the national forests for upto thirty days if im not mistaken.... just don't b taken....lol

peace

[BrianEn]

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)
LAND. This is the issue I am at struggle with right now. How to safely occupy "public land" and hold off force from enforcement to vacate that land through my right as a human being. im pretty sure others have done so by simply discussing with "authorities" that I am not actually claiming to own the land I live on but more am upholding my right to survive and live. The language will come to me one day I suppose.

You hit on a very crucial topic IMO. I am in agreement with that direction.

do you hike, I hear the Appalachian trail is beautiful... do you know your flora and fauna? that might b helpful to b on public land and not pay for nothing... if you want to eat... do you eat meat? you can hunt and fish... own some rope, or a tent, or a hammer?

The best way to hold off force, is not to b seen... a friend told me one time "its better to b a live dog, then a dead lion"
You can remain in one spot in the national forests for upto thirty days if im not mistaken.... just don't b taken....lol

peace

I'd love to be able to stuff like that again. Hoping for one day.....soon I hope. Right now things is the way they is.

[Justintime]

"The mass of men serve the state thus, not as men mainly, but as machines, with their bodies. They are the standing army, and the militia, jailers, constables, posse comitatus, etc. In most cases there is no free exercise whatever of the judgment or of the moral sense; but they put themselves on a level with wood and earth and stones; and wooden men can perhaps be manufactured that will serve the purpose as well. Such command no more respect than men of straw or a lump of dirt. They have the same sort of worth only as horses and dogs. Yet such as these even are commonly esteemed good citizens. Others- as most legislators, politicians, lawyers, ministers, and office-holders- serve the state chiefly with their heads; and, as they rarely make any moral distinctions, they are as likely to serve the devil, without intending it, as God"

This is a passage from "Civil Disobedience," by Henry David Thoreau he certainly says it better than me. If you read through Walden and Civil Disobedience you"ll begin to see scores upon scores of references to the system as serving the devil. Quite surprising that some people throughout history have always been aware of this.

A PDF link to Thoreau's Civil Disobedience: http://tamut.edu/faculty%20web%20pag...%20Thoreau.pdf

Starts on page nine and is a short read.

[thunder24]

well the "they" that are monitoring us, are also , studying for astuteness.... one must assume that they are always being watched or listened too... and that doesn't have to b by what we term "technology" but it can also b that...

the groups that are monitoring us most likely have a list or group of lists... mayb color codes....of ones abilities, and or knowledge base within certain fields... and this can all b done, but observeing us here, and then doing proper channel checking to find someone.... its all known, we just dont' know it...
peace

Posted by BrianEn (here)

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)
LAND. This is the issue I am at struggle with right now. How to safely occupy "public land" and hold off force from enforcement to vacate that land through my right as a human being. im pretty sure others have done so by simply discussing with "authorities" that I am not actually claiming to own the land I live on but more am upholding my right to survive and live. The language will come to me one day I suppose.

You hit on a very crucial topic IMO. I am in agreement with that direction.

do you hike, I hear the Appalachian trail is beautiful... do you know your flora and fauna? that might b helpful to b on public land and not pay for nothing... if you want to eat... do you eat meat? you can hunt and fish... own some rope, or a tent, or a hammer?

The best way to hold off force, is not to b seen... a friend told me one time "its better to b a live dog, then a dead lion"
You can remain in one spot in the national forests for upto thirty days if im not mistaken.... just don't b taken....lol

peace

I'd love to be able to stuff like that again. Hoping for one day.....soon I hope. Right now things is the way they is.

bri hopefully one day you can come down and visit.... Ill show you

[firstlook]

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)
LAND. This is the issue I am at struggle with right now. How to safely occupy "public land" and hold off force from enforcement to vacate that land through my right as a human being. im pretty sure others have done so by simply discussing with "authorities" that I am not actually claiming to own the land I live on but more am upholding my right to survive and live. The language will come to me one day I suppose.

You hit on a very crucial topic IMO. I am in agreement with that direction.

do you hike, I hear the Appalachian trail is beautiful... do you know your flora and fauna? that might b helpful to b on public land and not pay for nothing... if you want to eat... do you eat meat? you can hunt and fish... own some rope, or a tent, or a hammer?

The best way to hold off force, is not to b seen... a friend told me one time "its better to b a live dog, then a dead lion"
You can remain in one spot in the national forests for upto thirty days if im not mistaken.... just don't b taken....lol

peace

Good advice. I guess the issue im trying to overcome is instead of going against authority I can sustain myself while still exiting out in the open......all that running around could make this dog tired and without his playfulness that brought him to such places like Avalon.

I know how to survive if I really had and wanted to by living off of the land, its the sneaking around that breaks my spirits and issue I have. Im working on it. Anyway I truly believe that our ability to communicate is what has brought about whatever peace and joy we have in this world, and I believe more of it will continue that progress when it comes to living with and at the same time without others. Its tricky and mind numbing this process.

[Dennis Leahy]

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
(with FAR too many people deliberately held in a state of need by the same Puppet Masters that write the paychecks of the paid agents who "monitor" us.)

Dennis

No offense but anyone who pays federal taxes can actually be labeled as an "agent" / "Member" of these groups. I would assume that is the biggest procrastination in this forum. Again, no ill will meant.

peace

No offense taken - but I don't understand what you're saying. Can you elaborate?

Dennis

Hello,

Well I read in your profile that you work as a programmer. As someone working in the states, you must pay federal taxes along with other general taxes. These funds include you as a participant in something you voice disagreement against (monitoring by government agents at different levels in the chain of command). At one end you can disagree with the "puppet masters", but in relation you participate along the same lines. You mentioned the state of need and so this is the issue I had to address.

peace

OK, now I get what you're saying, and I totally disagree. I reject your premise as false logic.

If a robber comes up to me in the street, and holds a gun to my head, and I acquiesce (rather than become a brain splatter pattern on the sidewalk) and hand over my money, I'm not responsible whether the guy uses the money to buy organic food for his starving children or methamphetamine for himself. The US government IS that thug, plain and simple. Rather than a gun, it is a prison cell that awaits those who don't pay taxes in the US (and if any of you are not paying, and no one noticed yet, please don't be silly enough to type it on a public forum - I know a few who do not pay and have not yet been caught. And of course I know the amendment wasn't really ratified yadda yadda yadda...)

In fact, even if a government became democratic socialist, the pooled resources (money) would almost undoubtedly not be used exactly the way I would want. That is NOT the same as chipping in some money so Obomber can purchase depleted uranium to tip a Hellfire missile and send it at a wedding party.

People who take a position at the NSA or similar and receive a paycheck for monitoring citizens or for delivering the Elite agenda are paid with blood money, extracted from citizens (and probably from opium, cocaine, black market weapons sales, etc.) by coercion. You can conflate that since my wallet is a source for the thugs' money to pay the agents, that I share the onus, but I don't - and won't.

Dennis

[Justintime]

Dennis,

We all have the option of trying to live elsewhere, independent of money, the government, etc, etc, the world is still big enough for us to forge a life out in the wilderness somewhere. Our quality of life would most likely go down dramatically though if we did this and I suspect fear holds us back. So in a sense we are all selling out to the man so to speak. However, if we just refused to play the game and we did so in large numbers, as a majority, the game would be over. Also, if enough us refused to pay our taxes,eventually we would clog the system and it would break down. It's not as simple as us being forced to do something against our will. And unlike a random thug stealing our money, we pretty much know where our money is going to. Fear, Rape, Torture, Mind F...ing, welfare programs, schools, roads( if we're lucky) development of covert technology(black magic), war, drones, Fear, Rape, Murder, Torture, and Sex.

http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?release=2751697

[firstlook]

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
(with FAR too many people deliberately held in a state of need by the same Puppet Masters that write the paychecks of the paid agents who "monitor" us.)

Dennis

No offense but anyone who pays federal taxes can actually be labeled as an "agent" / "Member" of these groups. I would assume that is the biggest procrastination in this forum. Again, no ill will meant.

peace

No offense taken - but I don't understand what you're saying. Can you elaborate?

Dennis

Hello,

Well I read in your profile that you work as a programmer. As someone working in the states, you must pay federal taxes along with other general taxes. These funds include you as a participant in something you voice disagreement against (monitoring by government agents at different levels in the chain of command). At one end you can disagree with the "puppet masters", but in relation you participate along the same lines. You mentioned the state of need and so this is the issue I had to address.

peace

OK, now I get what you're saying, and I totally disagree. I reject your premise as false logic.

If a robber comes up to me in the street, and holds a gun to my head, and I acquiesce (rather than become a brain splatter pattern on the sidewalk) and hand over my money, I'm not responsible whether the guy uses the money to buy organic food for his starving children or methamphetamine for himself. The US government IS that thug, plain and simple. Rather than a gun, it is a prison cell that awaits those who don't pay taxes in the US (and if any of you are not paying, and no one noticed yet, please don't be silly enough to type it on a public forum - I know a few who do not pay and have not yet been caught. And of course I know the amendment wasn't really ratified yadda yadda yadda...)

In fact, even if a government became democratic socialist, the pooled resources (money) would almost undoubtedly not be used exactly the way I would want. That is NOT the same as chipping in some money so Obomber can purchase depleted uranium to tip a Hellfire missile and send it at a wedding party.

People who take a position at the NSA or similar and receive a paycheck for monitoring citizens or for delivering the Elite agenda are paid with blood money, extracted from citizens (and probably from opium, cocaine, black market weapons sales, etc.) by coercion. You can conflate that since my wallet is a source for the thugs' money to pay the agents, that I share the onus, but I don't - and won't.

Dennis

well the issue I see with your comparison is that you agreed to certain conditions by using an id, agreed to a contract when you bought your home and have signed documents when you enlisted a job say you would pay the..."thugs". While I appreciate your analogy it is a simple one that does not account for your actual choices in the matter.

Indeed force is used, but again, you yourself came into a bond and attachment by participating and entering into the dragons lair in the first place. I understand the survival aspect and why these choices are made, but again, we have to examine the irony of our complaints while at the same time working against them. So to use another simple analogy I would say you invited the thug in for dinner and said help your self to what you like while at the same time complaining about his actions and talking with your friends about how you wont support his actions. Its silly when you think about it. Im not trying to instigate anything just intelligently trying to analyze the situation.

[SKAWF]

does it matter? if they are watching i mean......

just remember, that at all times we can walk tall and proud

but if they show themselves, its all over for them.

i would rather walk in the sunlight than skulk around in the shadows like a peeping tom.

realise your strength

[Tesseract]

I've thought for some time that registering one's business (if one has one) in the Cayman islands (for example) instead of the USA, a la Mitt 'No one will ever think I'm doing this to screw the military' Romney, is not necessarily a selfish thing to do.

For the record, I do see the moral downsides too...

[TigaHawk]

Posted by gripreaper (here)
hang on, I'll go check it out.

Pretty picture! But how does the door close? :D


With taxes... i can understand their purpose. To pay for roads and public infastructure and all that jazz. I would not mind paying them if the money was actually used for those things, and properly spent.

Currently the taxes are over the top, they are nothing more than petty excuses for the government to be able to stick their hand in and take more money from your pockets. The blatant misuse and waste of it all is even more appauling. I do definately do mind paying tax with the current way the system is setup.


In regards to going off the grid, i'd love to do it, but it seems an impossible task without aleniating/isolating myself from everything. Even when you buy a plot of land, its not yours, you are leasing it from the Government. X feet below the ground on that plot of land doesnt belong to you either - the government owns it and should they discover that your house sits ontop of something they want, they'll take it from under you and leave you with nothing - all through "legal" means.

If you were to go out to the bush, find a piece of land thats seemingly un-owned and setup shop there (even if in just a tent) - i dont think it would be too long untill you would be found, and people of authority come to remove you.... and fine you, for being there. It doesnt matter to them if you were hurting noone, disturbing noone, and living 100% green (not polluting or wrecking the area that you settled) - they seem to be entitled to tell you what you can and cannot do - and punish you according to whatever they feel like should they think you've done something they dont agree with.

But this is the same with everything in the system. Conform or they'll make your life miserable, through harasment, fines, threats, physical and psycological abuse, defamity, you name it, they'll do it - all with the legal system's blessings and turning blind eyes to people of authority when they overstep the line.

Focusing on living outside the system is a waste, should be focusing on tearing down the system and erecting one designed by the people, built for the peoples best interests - rather than a system built by the few, for the few, with emphasis only for the few, at the expense of everyone else.

[gripreaper]

Energy around here runs in "themes". This post is appropriate for this thread.

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...492#post703492

I might add, we are all slaves. Our birth certificates hypoticated, pledged, and collateralized us, and we volunteered to get SS numbers, licenses, and registrations. We are under contract by adhesion, and very few have stepped outside the system and become sovereign. It's not an easy thing to do and requires years of research and understanding.

Those who do exit cannot step back in, or have any contact with those still in the system. They risk it all if they do. The break has to be clean and final. You step back in and they will single you out. They don't mind you leaving, just be sure you understand what it means to do so.

[mosquito]

Posted by Nanoo Nanoo (here)
Id like to bring to your attention that there is a total of 36 ( possibly more ) operatives here on Avalon from 4 sepperate groups of compartmentalised factions.

Obviously you aren't going to name names, but could you at least enlighten us as to who these "groups" or "factions" are ?

It baffles me that intelligent, thought-provoking threads (getting scarcer by the way) can go totally unnoticed, yet another one of these tedious accusatory threads now has 5 bloody pages after 7 odd hours.

[Wind]

I just had to share this here, it's too funny. NSA, please don't get mad, I'm just joking!

[mojo]

Sure they are watching and not likely to change a system of data mining and using operatives if it works, but maybe we use that to our advantage and help shape public opinion or more importantly changing tptb's attitude to us. Another concern might be to avoid propagating an 'us vs them mentality,' lest we forget we are the ones doing these things to ourselves.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=rrbnbmA3n5o

[Dennis Leahy]

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
(with FAR too many people deliberately held in a state of need by the same Puppet Masters that write the paychecks of the paid agents who "monitor" us.)

Dennis

No offense but anyone who pays federal taxes can actually be labeled as an "agent" / "Member" of these groups. I would assume that is the biggest procrastination in this forum. Again, no ill will meant.

peace

No offense taken - but I don't understand what you're saying. Can you elaborate?

Dennis

Hello,

Well I read in your profile that you work as a programmer. As someone working in the states, you must pay federal taxes along with other general taxes. These funds include you as a participant in something you voice disagreement against (monitoring by government agents at different levels in the chain of command). At one end you can disagree with the "puppet masters", but in relation you participate along the same lines. You mentioned the state of need and so this is the issue I had to address.

peace

OK, now I get what you're saying, and I totally disagree. I reject your premise as false logic.

If a robber comes up to me in the street, and holds a gun to my head, and I acquiesce (rather than become a brain splatter pattern on the sidewalk) and hand over my money, I'm not responsible whether the guy uses the money to buy organic food for his starving children or methamphetamine for himself. The US government IS that thug, plain and simple. Rather than a gun, it is a prison cell that awaits those who don't pay taxes in the US (and if any of you are not paying, and no one noticed yet, please don't be silly enough to type it on a public forum - I know a few who do not pay and have not yet been caught. And of course I know the amendment wasn't really ratified yadda yadda yadda...)

In fact, even if a government became democratic socialist, the pooled resources (money) would almost undoubtedly not be used exactly the way I would want. That is NOT the same as chipping in some money so Obomber can purchase depleted uranium to tip a Hellfire missile and send it at a wedding party.

People who take a position at the NSA or similar and receive a paycheck for monitoring citizens or for delivering the Elite agenda are paid with blood money, extracted from citizens (and probably from opium, cocaine, black market weapons sales, etc.) by coercion. You can conflate that since my wallet is a source for the thugs' money to pay the agents, that I share the onus, but I don't - and won't.

Dennis

well the issue I see with your comparison is that you agreed to certain conditions by using an id, agreed to a contract when you bought your home and have signed documents when you enlisted a job say you would pay the..."thugs". While I appreciate your analogy it is a simple one that does not account for your actual choices in the matter.

Indeed force is used, but again, you yourself came into a bond and attachment by participating and entering into the dragons lair in the first place. I understand the survival aspect and why these choices are made, but again, we have to examine the irony of our complaints while at the same time working against them. So to use another simple analogy I would say you invited the thug in for dinner and said help your self to what you like while at the same time complaining about his actions and talking with your friends about how you wont support his actions. Its silly when you think about it. Im not trying to instigate anything just intelligently trying to analyze the situation.

All hail those who are in prison for tax evasion, (ironically, feeding cash into the prison industrial complex), who refuse to pay taxes, for they are the only ones who really oppose the US Empire! hahahaah sorry, I'm not buying what you're selling.

Please feel free to personally accept the onus if you feel you are willingly paying for the Evil Empire to do its dirty deeds, or feel free to stop filing US federal income tax. Brag about it publicly if you feel the need. I will personally do what I feel holds my strongest possibility of actually affecting the future in a positive way - and disassembling Empire.

If you are alive, you are breathing. By breathing you exhale carbon dioxide. A tree takes in the carbon dioxide that you exhaled, and through photosynthesis, forms wood. Someone comes along and harvests the tree and makes arrows. An army of sociopathic mercenaries is assembled by the ruling psychopaths. 10,000 people are ambushed and killed with the arrows. Will you accept that onus too? You helped to bring about the death of 10,000 innocent people. It's true whether you pay taxes or not, whether you expatriate, or whether you hide in the forest. (It's a hypothetical, but as long as you are alive, some bad logic can be created that labels you as responsible for some atrocity. It's a word game.)

Dennis, not an "agent" nor "member" of the Psychopaths of Empire, in spite of firstlook's false logic.

(this is off topic, and if the mods want to split it off, that's fine)

[Sierra]

Posted by firstlook (here)

Indeed force is used, but again, you yourself came into a bond and attachment by participating and entering into the dragons lair in the first place. I understand the survival aspect and why these choices are made, but again, we have to examine the irony of our complaints while at the same time working against them. So to use another simple analogy I would say you invited the thug in for dinner and said help your self to what you like while at the same time complaining about his actions and talking with your friends about how you wont support his actions. Its silly when you think about it. Im not trying to instigate anything just intelligently trying to analyze the situation.

There is no irony. There is no analysis to be done. We are all slaves, but some of are awake, and discussing the situation. That we are slaves, does not presuppose there should be no discussion.

[T Smith]

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
(with FAR too many people deliberately held in a state of need by the same Puppet Masters that write the paychecks of the paid agents who "monitor" us.)

Dennis

No offense but anyone who pays federal taxes can actually be labeled as an "agent" / "Member" of these groups. I would assume that is the biggest procrastination in this forum. Again, no ill will meant.

peace

No offense taken - but I don't understand what you're saying. Can you elaborate?

Dennis

Hello,

Well I read in your profile that you work as a programmer. As someone working in the states, you must pay federal taxes along with other general taxes. These funds include you as a participant in something you voice disagreement against (monitoring by government agents at different levels in the chain of command). At one end you can disagree with the "puppet masters", but in relation you participate along the same lines. You mentioned the state of need and so this is the issue I had to address.

peace

I guess when the Corleones come to my coffee shop for a shake-down that makes me part of the mob?

[Dennis Leahy]

Posted by T Smith (here)

Posted by firstlook (here)

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
(with FAR too many people deliberately held in a state of need by the same Puppet Masters that write the paychecks of the paid agents who "monitor" us.)

No offense but anyone who pays federal taxes can actually be labeled as an "agent" / "Member" of these groups.

at the end of the day you are correct.

If firstlook had said we all have some responsibility (for not uniting and effectively dealing with Empire), that would be one thing, but he has conflated the paying of taxes to being an NSA agent! It is beyond hyperbole, it is incorrect, it is false logic. There is a clear difference between a paid agent and the victims of a shakedown.

And with that, I'll drop it. Anyone can accept as much onus as they want. Oh, and by the way, you shouldn't have worn that short skirt - you were asking to be raped. It's all your own fault. (that's what I think of these word games)

Dennis

[marlowe]

Posted by REILLY (here)
The danger is in mistaking the merely misguided for the moles.

I have problems with posters that say "chemtrails don't exist"..........I don't see how anybody can be THAT misguided...

Or all crop circles are made by earth born human beings....
I wasn't planning to post on this thread but there it is..