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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    I purchased my uranium from a very nice lady that hand made the piece for me & hopefully will be making two more for my mom and wife.
    Why don't you purchase some for your children too ?

    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    did you know uranium is naturally occurring? I'm wearing unrefined uranium ore, same as you find laying on the ground in mountainous areas.
    I'm not saying it's dangerous, I'm saying there are no proven benefits.

    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    what has been told to us by what I postulate is a deliberate cover up of an important resource for health and energy
    I'm sure I have plenty to learn from you, my beliefs are not as strongly held as you think, but let us continue this discussion on the appropriate threads so that those concerned with Fukushima can express themselves here.


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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    I have researched this subject very little so far, but I do at least understand what Target is saying, and Buares, you don't seem to understand.
    Please correct me if I'm wrong, Target, but I think what you are saying is that studies have been referenced which profess to prove highly dangerous properties of even low doses of radiation, but the ACTUAL DATA of those studies, if it really exists, has NOT been provided to the public.
    I am thinking, as a comparison, of the current situation with fluoridated water, which I HAVE researched quite a lot, and what I have found, as many others have, is that many organizations have come out in favor of fluoride, but when you look into WHY they are in favor, it's simply because OTHER organizations came out in favor fluoride years ago, when very little research had actually been done, and very little research has been done up to this day.
    And what has been done has been proven to be very questionable, other than the research showing that fluoridating water is a very, very dangerous practice. .
    So it's been a question of the blind leading the blind all along, people accepting without questions the lies that were fed to them, simply because they didn't believe that such huge lies would be told on such a huge scale, or because they were being paid or bribed or pressured to do so.
    911 is another example.
    The truth is right in front of your face if you are willing to look at the FACTS and stop assuming.
    Because we all know what asses assuming can make out of us...
    I seem to have been one of the rare people that Target does "not expect to convince those with strongly held beliefs for I know the neurological effects that have to be over come for this to happen (and I know very few people capable of it), but you see; this is a public forum and more than just you and I are reading this; that is my audience."
    I'm opening my mind to the possibilities, if only because I have been reading the information on Avalon long enough to know by now that there are conspiracies within conspiracies within conspiracies, up to the very highest levels of government, science, industry, you name it.
    It's not comfortable knowing this, but if the Truth can set us free, then I think it's worth the price.
    I thank Target for keeping his cool and having the integrity and commitment to continue posting his views and research results here, despite the resistance to it that I and other Avalonians have put up so far.
    I no longer have the dire sense of urgency I used to have about radioactivity, and I am really grateful for that.
    Thanks again to Target, Kimberly, Dawn and others who have persisted in making this kind of information available.
    That is a very good comparison onawah, I think I will steal it for future use

    I think the phenomenon we are seeing here is a strong weakness in the human mind, we are conditioned from BIRTH to accept authority (the Nuclear Regulatory Comities are an example of "authority") as the ultimate information gate keepers, they know all and are infallible... This type of authority indoctrination is reflected in the parent-child, child-teacher, child-police (and adult-police) and many many other relationships that deeply ingrain this response of blind trust, blind faith in authority that what they tell us is beyond question & should be accepted just because of the source (which is a logical fallacy: Appeal to Authority)

    This is very very difficult to over come, I think if one looks at the past threads on this radiation topic you can see this logical fallacy pop up again and again and there is almost no way around it; even trying to counter with what I perceive to be very very strong facts (a 20 year exposure of around 10,000 people) only triggers further appeal to authority arguments and I think engages the ego in the response ( you can see some of that here in this thread).

    I'm not quite sure which is the bigger revelation here, that we have been so strongly (and are completely unaware of) indoctrinated to this Authority-is-always-right concept, or that Nuclear radiation is not the terrifying thing we have been told, that it apparently is very good for us (which has interesting implications I could expand on further at another time).




    Quote Posted by buares (here)
    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    I purchased my uranium from a very nice lady that hand made the piece for me & hopefully will be making two more for my mom and wife.
    Why don't you purchase some for your children too ?
    My 6 year old can’t even keep track of her glasses… children, like young plants, are very robust and while I do my best to see they are healthy it’s not as urgent of an issue as it is for those of us who’s bodies are in decline (30+) I have presented this information in a very neutral way to my 16 year old daughter and she has expressed the desire for a pendant, I will get her one after the more vulnerable in my family have one for themselves.

    Quote Posted by buares (here)
    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    did you know uranium is naturally occurring? I'm wearing unrefined uranium ore, same as you find laying on the ground in mountainous areas.
    I'm not saying it's dangerous, I'm saying there are no proven benefits.
    A post in this thread here shows very conclusive benefits, very dramatic results


    Quote Posted by buares (here)
    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    what has been told to us by what I postulate is a deliberate cover up of an important resource for health and energy
    I'm sure I have plenty to learn from you, my beliefs are not as strongly held as you think, but let us continue this discussion on the appropriate threads so that those concerned with Fukushima can express themselves here.

    My discussion in this thread is barely related to the topic, you are correct, however since the title of this thread and the content of the first post espouse fear from the low levels of radiation that are present I think it is a valid contribution.

    Another thinig to consider: There are several studies showing that people of a certain political slant will only read material that agree's with that slant, and that the gap between the two parties (in the US) is only widening; this is a basic flaw in how the human mind works & so sometimes slightly off topic information needs to be brought up where it is not wanted just to expose information to those who would not normally seek it.

    at least that's my own rationalization, it could be very wrong; but it is supported by my observation and several case studies I have read.


    Fukushima needs to be cleaned up, I definately don't want to come across as denying that; however, so far no one out side of the small area around fukushima need be concerned about the plant (now, another large earthquake could quickly change the situation, but it still would not be a "death of the planet" ).

    One other thing to note: according to Epigenetics, our thoughts shape our gene expressions, and living in fear, panic or terror are litterally physically bad for you; these stresses cause very negative effects. You could say I'm trying to save people's health with my line of thought and research. (again, this is probably just more rationalization for my actions... but it rings true to me at least..)
    Last edited by TargeT; 9th September 2013 at 16:54.
    Hard times create strong men, Strong men create good times, Good times create weak men, Weak men create hard times.
    Where are you?

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by buares (here)
    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    the numbers from the chart I posted are from two men that worked for years as nuclear engineers; the numbers you posted I have never seen validated or backed up by anything.. so we have nothing in one hand and first hand testimony in the other, I'm leaning to first hand testimony.
    Are you sure you know what you're doing ? If Galen Winsor & Ben Williams numbers are incorrect as panopticon just pointed out, you might be poisoning yourself with radioactive material...

    The numbers I provided are backed up by the world scientists and they usually avoid making mistakes.
    I never realised the source of the information.
    It was probably a typo. Doesn't bother me either way.

    As for Target poisoning himself...

    I don't think Uranium ore presents much of a risk, as long as he's not sitting there sucking on it or with open wounds underneath it. Uranium ore is an alpha emitter (that's if it's predominantly U-238) and wont penetrate below the skin layer.

    Glad the TBI information was helpful.

    Anyway, lunch is over so back to the fields...
    -- Pan
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    1,800 mSv/h : Radiation sickness (risk of death)

    TEPCO: "although 1,800 mSv/h was detected at 5cm above the floor, the radiation level at 50cm above the floor was 15 mSv/h. Thus, the figure of 1,800 mSv/h does not represent the radiation level of the whole area.

    Some articles reported that "if a person were exposed to this amount of radiation for four hours continuously, it would lead to death," by comparing with the radiation level that would result in death (7,000 mSv), or "it would take only one minute to reach the annual radiation exposure limit for workers," by comparing with the annual radiation exposure limit for workers (50 mSv).

    However, we believe that simply comparing the 1,800 mSv/h figure with these standard levels is inappropriate, since the standard levels represent the cumulative effective dose (not equivalent dose) upon the whole body."

    TEPCO
    data below:


    EDIT: already posted by Cidersomerset here
    Last edited by Atlas; 10th September 2013 at 09:19.

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    From RT.com:

    #######



    TEPCO detects high levels of groundwater radiation at Fukushima plant
    Published time September 10, 2013

    A new hotspot of radiation has been detected in groundwater from an observation well next to one of the leaking tanks at Japan’s Fukushima nuclear plant, the operator of the facility announced.

    Some 3,200 becquerels per liter of radioactive substances were recorded in a well next to a faulty water storage tank, Kyodo News Agency reported, citing Tokyo Electric Power Co. (TEPCO)’s Sunday readings.

    The probe revealed that strontium and other malicious beta rays were discovered in the groundwater 20 meters north of the tank, which is located in the H4 area. According to TEPCO, this indicates that radioactive water from leaking tanks mixed with groundwater in the area. Last week, the company announced the discovery of 650 becquerels per liter of radioactive waste in another well, located about 20 meters south of the storage tank.

    On Monday, the Japanese government urged the operator to propose a plan of action by next month designed to remove contaminated water to safer tanks. The plan is to replace 300 of approximately 1,000 tanks present on the site which store 400 tons of contaminated water daily.

    According to Japanese industry minister Toshimitsu Motegi, the leaks have affected an area of 0.3 square kilometers within the bay around the plant, Jiji Press reported. The minister added that removing polluted water is the most urgent task for Japan.

    The UN’s nuclear watchdog also voiced concerns on Monday about the situation at the Fukushima-1 plant. Director General of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), Yukiya Amano, said the leakage is "a matter of high priority that needs to be addressed urgently,” promising to send an international mission to help the situation.

    The Japanese government announced last week a plan to create a wall of ice under the plant to stop drainage of contaminated water by the end of March 2015. Meanwhile, TEPCO wants to pump the water out of the wells before it reaches the Pacific Ocean.

    But the measures taken by the government have not been received well by the public.

    A survey conducted by Asahi Shimbun newspaper revealed on Monday that 72 percent of those surveyed considered the government's response to be “late" and the situation on the ground to be "very serious." Eighty-nine percent said that the government - not TEPCO - should take charge of the situation.

    Source

    #######

    Tack onto this that I've also been reading reports that Tepco will probably run out of tanks to store the contaminated water in by mid-November (unless they build more of the temporary ones they are using atm) and I'm left wandering how much worse this is going to get...

    -- Pan
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    From The Japan Times:

    ##########

    Water highly irradiated near leaky tank
    September 10, 2013

    Tokyo Electric Power Co. said groundwater at an observation well near the site of a leaky storage tank at the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear plant has shown high levels of radiation.

    Tests found 3,200 becquerels per liter of beta ray-emitting materials, including strontium. As a result, it “now seems more likely” that radioactive water from leaking tanks at the crippled facility became mixed with groundwater in the area, Tepco said Monday.

    The level of contamination far exceeds the government limit of just 10 becquerels of strontium per liter in drinking water and 100 becquerels per kilogram for food. If ingested, experts say, strontium accumulates in bones and can cause cancer.

    Many of the tanks were used to cool molten fuel in the No. 1 plant’s three reactors that experienced core meltdowns from the March 2011 earthquake and tsunami.

    Last week, the government unveiled a ¥47 billion plan to stem the leaks by creating a wall of ice under the plant. Tepco also plans to use wells to pump out groundwater before it seeps into the Pacific Ocean.

    The latest findings could affect that plan, as the nearest pumping well is only 130 meters from the monitoring site where the highly irradiated water sample was taken.

    Source
    ##########
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Data from Tepco releases on above reports:

    ####################

    Fukushima Daiichi NPS Prompt Report (Sep 09,2013)
    Water Leak at a Tank in the H4 area in Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station (Follow-up Information 35)


    This is follow-up information on the "water leak at a tank in the H4 area in Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station" found on August 19.

    On September 8, we performed the analyses of γ nuclide and all β for the first time in an observation hole (E-1: in north of a dike of the tank No.5 in I Group in the H4 area with water leakage) around H4 tank area. The results are as follows.

    <Observation hole: E-1>
    - Sampled on September 8
    Cesium-134: 2.5Bq/L
    Cesium-137: 5.1bq/L
    All β: 3200Bq/L

    We performed the analysis of tritium (sampled on September 7) and the analyses of γ nuclide and all β (sampled on September 8) in water in an observation hole (E-2: in south of a dike of the tank No.5 in I Group in the H4 area with water leakage) around H4 tank area. The results are as follows.

    <Observation hole: E-2>
    - Sampled on September 7
    Tritium: 300Bq/L

    - Sampled on September 8
    Cesium-134: 0.64Bq/L
    Cesium-137: 0.74Bq/L
    All β: 67Bq/L

    The result of tritium in water sampled on September 7 this time was 300Bq/L, and has increased compared to the previous result sampled before at the same point (190Bq/L sampled on September 6).

    The result of all β in water sampled on September 8 this time was 67Bq/L, and has increased compared to the previous result sampled before at the same point (35Bq/L sampled on September 7).

    We are determined to continue analyses and to monitor the situation.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    (Reference)
    <Observation hole: E-2>
    - Sampled on September 4
    All β: 650Bq/L
    Tritium: Below the detection limit value (detection limit value: 120Bq/L)

    - Sampled on September 5
    All β: 330Bq/L
    Tritium: Below the detection limit value (detection limit value: 120Bq/L)

    - Sampled on September 6
    All β: 180Bq/L
    Tritium: 190Bq/L

    - Sampled on September 7
    All β: 35Bq/L

    Source

    ####################

    Fukushima Daiichi NPS Prompt Report (Sep 10,2013)
    Water Leak at a Tank in the H4 area in Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station (Follow-up Information 36)


    This is follow-up information on the "water leak at a tank in the H4 area in Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station" found on August 19.

    On September 8, we performed the analyses of γ nuclide and all β for the first time in an observation hole (E-1: in north of a dike of the tank No.5 in I Group in the H4 area with water leakage) around H4 tank area. The results are as follows.

    <Observation hole: E-1>
    - Sampled on September 8
    Tritium: 4200 Bq/L
    Cesium-134: 2.5Bq/L (previously announced on September 9)
    Cesium-137: 5.1bq/L (previously announced on September 9)
    All β: 3200Bq/L (previously announced on September 9)

    The result of tritium in groundwater (E-1) in H4 area (sampled on September 8 for the first time) was 4200Bq/L, and was higher than the radioactive concentration measured at the observation hole E-2, likewise the result of all β measured on the same day (on September 8).

    We performed the analysis of tritium (sampled on September 8) in water in an observation hole (E-2: in south of a dike of the tank No.5 in I Group in the H4 area with water leakage) around H4 tank area. The results are as follows.

    <Observation hole: E-2>
    - Sampled on September 8
    Tritium: 290 Bq/L
    Cesium-134: 0.64Bq/L (previously announced on September 9)
    Cesium-137: 0.74Bq/L (previously announced on September 9)
    All β: 67Bq/L (previously announced on September 9)

    - Sampled on September 7
    Tritium: 300Bq/L (previously announced on September 9)

    The result of tritium obtained on September 8 in an observation hole E-2 was 290Bq/L, and this is approximately the same as the result of tritium (300 Bq/L) at the same point sampled on September 7.

    We are determined to continue analyses and to monitor the situation.

    Source

    ####################

    Just for later possible reference.
    -- Pan
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Quote Posted by Cidersomerset (here)
    Last year I went to London with a few workmates for a trade unions march which was a good day out.

    This year we have just finished ind action at our local sorting office where I work. We have had 9 days action and was due to be out for six days starting tomorrow Mon 9th Sept. But after intense negotiations last Tues the strike has been called off and an attempt to reconcile differences will be tried again this week between Workers & management.
    Good on ya Steve.
    Hope the negotiations are fruitful!

    Just as a question...
    We (Australia) now have a Conservative (Liberal) Government.

    There is much debate about whether the UK's "Big Society" is going to be adopted down here. While at first look the devolution of power into the hands of local groups is admirable I have read (and met) a few people who claim that it actually increases power and control within the Government through a combination of techniques (eg limited targeted/ funding, coercive power, minimising activism through bringing everyone under the same tent).

    Have you had any experience in this in relation to the Nuclear facility and Union movement in the area?
    Kind Regards & Deepest of Respect,
    Panopticon

    Sorry Panopticon ..........just saw the question...The 'Big society' is just another gimmick as can be seen on the news daily with the 'Banksters' , healthcare
    the gap between rich and poor is getting wider, we have the 'bedroom tax' on council houses just yesterday on the local news it said the council are looking
    to start court action & evictions because of benefits being cut to the low paid and those out of work, who are falling in arrears.

    Everything is targeted we have it in work , a lot of full time jobs have been lost to part time. Zero contract hour workers which is a hot topic
    at the moment with estimate figures of 5 million. There maybe a place at the niche end for students and very small buisnesses, but companies
    like amazon have been taking advantage of it, as well as not paying appropriate tax's. You could start anywhere, in principle smaller government
    is fine, but we have a long way to go yet.

    The trouble is most politicians speak 'double talk' especially when in power, you rarely get a straight answer they usually fudge it.
    The TUC conference started yesterday and Labour Leader Ed Milliband was trying to woo them. I am not a militant unionist
    and thought the balance of the sixties and seventies had got out of hand , but Trades unions are essential to the working man/woman
    and hard fought rights would soon disappear if the movement were to decline much more. Like everything there has to be a balance
    and activism has definitely got its place. Words like , modernisation, efficiency, productivity, quotas ,targets etc are all part of
    of the world we seek to change on forums like this in our idealism. But we all have to live and earn a 'crust' in this reality
    So don't let the B------'s grind us down ...LOL

    I'm not sure if I answered your question ...Steve


    Labour was created by the unions, but since Tony Blair
    and co, created 'New Labour' there is definitely a identity
    crises that has lingered for 20 years.




    Published on 10 Sep 2013


    Delegates to the TUC conference in Bournmouth met Ed Miliband's low-key speech
    with what you might call polite indifference.



    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I just saw this on David Ickes site.....The American
    dream is becoming a nightmare to many. This is
    the same in many countries , Equality = privilege,
    or sucking up to the privileged elites.


    Record gap between US one percenters and the rest

    Wednesday 11th September 2013 at 05:58 By David Icke





    ‘A new study has shown that the income gap between the richest 1 percent in the
    United States and the rest of the American people reached its widest point in 2012
    since 1928.

    An analysis of the Internal Revenue Service’s data by economists at the University
    of California, Berkeley, the Paris School of Economics, and Oxford University has
    shown that the richest 1 percent in the US collected 19.3 percent of household
    income in 2012, their biggest share since 1928.

    The wealthiest 10 percent also collected 48.2 percent of the total earnings in 2012.’

    Read more: Record gap between US one percenters and the rest

    http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/09...-1-since-1928/

    http://www.davidicke.com/headlines/
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 11th September 2013 at 16:37.

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by Cidersomerset (here)
    Quote Just as a question...
    We (Australia) now have a Conservative (Liberal) Government.

    There is much debate about whether the UK's "Big Society" is going to be adopted down here. While at first look the devolution of power into the hands of local groups is admirable I have read (and met) a few people who claim that it actually increases power and control within the Government through a combination of techniques (eg limited targeted/ funding, coercive power, minimising activism through bringing everyone under the same tent).

    Have you had any experience in this in relation to the Nuclear facility and Union movement in the area?
    Kind Regards & Deepest of Respect,
    Panopticon
    Sorry Panopticon ..........just saw the question...The 'Big society' is just another gimmick as can be seen on the news daily with the 'Banksters' , healthcare the gap between rich and poor is getting wider, we have the 'bedroom tax' on council houses just yesterday on the local news it said the council are looking to start court action & evictions because of benefits being cut to the low paid and those out of work, who are falling in arrears.

    Everything is targeted we have it in work , a lot of full time jobs have been lost to part time. Zero contract hour workers which is a hot topic at the moment with estimate figures of 5 million. There maybe a place at the niche end for students and very small buisnesses, but companies like amazon have been taking advantage of it, as well as not paying appropriate tax's. You could start anywhere, in principle smaller government is fine, but we have a long way to go yet.

    The trouble is most politicians speak 'double talk' especially when in power, you rarely get a straight answer they usually fudge it.

    The TUC conference started yesterday and Labour Leader Ed Milliband was trying to woo them. I am not a militant unionist and thought the balance of the sixties and seventies had got out of hand , but Trades unions are essential to the working man/woman and hard fought rights would soon disappear if the movement were to decline much more. Like everything there has to be a balance and activism has definitely got its place. Words like , modernisation, efficiency, productivity, quotas ,targets etc are all part of the world we seek to change on forums like this in our idealism. But we all have so live and earn a 'crust' in this reality
    So don't let the B------'s grind us down ...LOL

    I'm not sure if I answered your question ...Steve

    Labour was created by the unions, but since Tony Blair and co, created 'New Labour' there is definitely a identity crises that has lingered for 20 years.
    Thanks for the response Steve.

    From our discussions (previous to this thread) we seem to have a shared interest in worker rights and the rise of social movements to present alternative positions on issues within society.

    It was within this context that I was enquiring about the rise of the 'Big Society' in the UK. It has a relevance to this thread insofar as it directly affects the way in which control and power can be exerted by those in positions of power on these grass root organisations/movements.

    For example, by isolating a group of activists and allocating a rudimentary element of power to them (by including them in the societal discussion) it is possible for the Government to then say "we had discussions with this group and they agree that this plan is the best for the region". This may or may not be a misrepresentation of what has occurred as the grass root group may agree that certain actions are of more importance that other actions within the region. By including them in the discussion it is possible to illicit a positive response to one area of policy in preference to another and from this gain their approval for only one part of what is needed. For example it can be easily argued that health care for homeless people is less important than providing safe lodgings for them, as many of the health issues are associated with living rough. The Governments actual goal was removing homeless people from the streets so they can say they've reduced homelessness. The community group may have been concerned with providing health care to homeless people. As a result the government can turn around and say that not only have they reduced homelessness but also improved health care to the homeless (due to the fact that there are less people living rough to require health services). The actual provisioning of health services for the target group may not have altered just the statistical classification under which they appear. So the government can say they have reduced the number of homeless persons requiring health care by, for example, 27%. This is true because that 27% are now requiring health care services under another classification.

    Alternatively they can allocate a small amount of funds to a community based organisation to tackle a specific problem. It is often much less than is required to actually do anything about the problem but in allocating funding it first keeps the grass root organisation busy trying to do something (anything) to sort out the situation (whether it is to do with local health facilities. environmental issues that are region specific, homelessness, etc), then it also stops the people who are actively campaigning for improvements by tying them to an unworkable system.

    People who are actively working for change try to do what they can with what is provided and then become part of the system. As a result they may compromise in certain areas to be able to fund other areas that are in greater need (homeless shelters versus health care for homeless persons) and are stopped from actually fulfilling the goals that they set out to achieve because they are trying to do the most important thing first on insufficient funding. They are "bought into the tent" as it were and given insufficient funding to carry out a single project let alone a broader program.

    Finally the Government can step in and say "well it looks like you can't sort this out after all so we'll take over and fix it for you". Very paternalistic and reinforces the control and power of the State.

    That is what I've been hearing has been going on in the UK and I dread a similar approach being used in Australia. BTW this is not the same as funding a community based movement to carry out a program. It is providing insufficient resources to undertake the program that is one part of the problem.

    Oh, and one inspirational story that has come out of our election is the campaign instigated by a grass root organisation in the electorate of Indi (Voice for Indi) and its grass root campaign to gain representation by Cathy McGowan in the previous safe conservative seat. Very interesting story and an approach I have advocated in the past.

    Cheers,
    Pan
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by Cidersomerset (here)
    The wealthiest 10 percent also collected 48.2 percent of the total earnings in 2012.’
    Keep shopping in the mall and driving those gas based cars folks, don't produce your own power or even thinkabout it... it's working out really great (for some people)


    I'm about to spend 37,000 on solar (via loan... so I'm basically helping fund banks) isn't it funny how even the methods to escape "TPTB" help "TPTB" ?


    The lack of a real Fukushima clean up effort is the same thing here... it's not being done because A) it's probably known that it's not that big of a deal by the corporation at the head of it and B) it saves money to "store water" and create an "ice wall" when compared to actual clean up costs....

    Big corporations win again either way....
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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    From Reuters:

    ##################

    Tritium levels spike at stricken Fukushima nuclear plant
    September 11, 2013

    The operator of the wrecked Fukushima nuclear plant said levels of tritium - considered one of the least harmful radioactive elements - spiked more than 15 times in groundwater near a leaked tank at the facility over three days this week.

    Tokyo Electric Power Co (Tepco) said tritium levels in water taken from a well close to a number of storage tanks holding irradiated water rose to 64,000 becquerels per liter on Tuesday from 4,200 becquerels/liter at the same location on Sunday.

    Tepco said last month that 300 metric tons of highly radioactive water leaked from one of the hastily built steel tanks at the plant, which was crippled by a massive earthquake and tsunami in March 2011.

    A Tepco representative told reporters on Wednesday the company was investigating the high tritium reading and could not rule out the possibility that last month's leak had contaminated the groundwater.

    The elevated readings of radioactive elements at the plant come just days after Japan's Prime Minister Shinzo Abe told the International Olympic Committee that the situation at the Fukushima facility, 230 km (140 miles) from Tokyo, was "under control", with contamination limited to the area immediately surrounding the plant. Tokyo was chosen over the weekend to host the 2020 Olympic Games.

    Tritium, which has a half-life of around 12 years, is less harmful to humans than cesium and strontium. A becquerel is a measure of the release of radioactive energy.

    The spike in radioactive elements in groundwater near the tanks threatens to scuttle Tepco's plans to build a bypass to route groundwater away from the plant and release it into the Pacific Ocean. The tank that leaked is in an area around 130 meters above the proposed bypass.

    Tepco Vice President Zengo Aizawa stressed the importance of the bypass on Wednesday, saying the company will continue to try and win support from local fishermen - who oppose the release of contaminated water into the sea- for the bypass.

    Source

    ##################

    Here's the referenced Tepco report (page 2 shows the 64000 Bq/L H-3 figure for 10th September) :



    Source

    -- Pan
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    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Interesting article I came across on fish caught off the US coast:

    ##############

    Woods Hole Scientist: Fukushima Leak Not Affecting U.S. Seafood
    SEPTEMBER 12, 2013

    Despite the recent admission from the Japanese government that the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant has been leaking radioactive water since it was badly damaged in the 2011 earthquake and tsunami, U.S. seafood has not been affected, according to Ken Buesseler, a senior scientist at the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution.

    Buesseler has published an FAQ section on the organization’s website to address the issue and writes that fish contaminated with cesium exceeding Japanese limits are not being sold internally or exported.

    He also explains that “because of the dilution that occurs even a short distance from Fukushima, we do not have a concern about the levels of cesium and other radionuclides in fish off the West Coast of the U.S.”

    As for fish such as the Pacific bluefin tuna that can swim long distances, Buesseler says they will begin to flush out the cesium “soon after they enter waters less-affected by Fukushima. By the time tuna are caught in the eastern Pacific, cesium levels in their flesh are 10-20 times lower than when they were off Fukushima.”

    By June, FDA investigators had tested 1,313 samples of food imported from Japan — 199 which were seafood or seafood products — and found that only one sample of ginger powder contained cesium, but at levels lower than could pose a health concern.

    When Michael Conathan, director of ocean policy at the Center for American Progress, contacted the FDA about domestically caught seafood, a spokesperson told him that “the FDA is not aware of any evidence suggesting that the domestic seafood catch contains harmful levels of radiation.”

    Source
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by panopticon (here)
    Interesting article I came across on fish caught off the US coast:

    ##############

    Woods Hole Scientist: Fukushima Leak Not Affecting U.S. Seafood
    SEPTEMBER 12, 2013

    Despite the recent admission from the Japanese government that the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant has been leaking radioactive water since it was badly damaged in the 2011 earthquake and tsunami, U.S. seafood has not been affected, according to Ken Buesseler, a senior scientist at the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution.

    Buesseler has published an FAQ section on the organization’s website to address the issue and writes that fish contaminated with cesium exceeding Japanese limits are not being sold internally or exported.

    He also explains that “because of the dilution that occurs even a short distance from Fukushima, we do not have a concern about the levels of cesium and other radionuclides in fish off the West Coast of the U.S.”

    As for fish such as the Pacific bluefin tuna that can swim long distances, Buesseler says they will begin to flush out the cesium “soon after they enter waters less-affected by Fukushima. By the time tuna are caught in the eastern Pacific, cesium levels in their flesh are 10-20 times lower than when they were off Fukushima.”

    By June, FDA investigators had tested 1,313 samples of food imported from Japan — 199 which were seafood or seafood products — and found that only one sample of ginger powder contained cesium, but at levels lower than could pose a health concern.

    When Michael Conathan, director of ocean policy at the Center for American Progress, contacted the FDA about domestically caught seafood, a spokesperson told him that “the FDA is not aware of any evidence suggesting that the domestic seafood catch contains harmful levels of radiation.”

    Source
    Since when do we believe what the FDA tells us.????????????????/

    ¤=[Post Update]=¤

    In case you haven't heard, there is a "future" Typhoon headed for Japan. Isn't that convenient?????
    http://www.accuweather.com/en/weathe...ather/17685515

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Report from Reuters on the ground water observation hole (known as E-1), near one of the leaking tanks, having Tritium levels reached a new high of 97,000 Bq/L (can't find a source document yet from Tepco but if someone does please post it [posted as addendum below]):

    ####################

    Tritium levels reach new high at wrecked Fukushima nuclear plant
    September 12, 2013

    The operator of the wrecked Fukushima nuclear plant said on Friday it found elevated readings of tritium in groundwater near tanks that are holding hundreds of metric tons of contaminated water at the site.

    Tokyo Electric Power Co (Tepco) said tritium levels in water taken from a well close to a number of storage tanks holding irradiated water rose to 97,000 becquerels per liter on Wednesday from 64,000 becquerels/liter measured at the same location a day earlier.

    All beta readings of groundwater at the same location, however, declined slightly to 1,500 becquerels per liter on Thursday from an earlier measurement of 2,000 becquerels/liter, Tepco said.

    Elevated radiation readings at the Fukushima plant come as Prime Minister Shinzo Abe and his government try to reassure the international community that the facility, 230 km (140 miles) from Tokyo, is "under control".

    Tepco said last month that 300 metric tons of highly radioactive water leaked from one of the hastily built steel tanks at the plant, which was crippled by a massive earthquake and tsunami in March 2011.

    That leak followed an earlier statement by the company that hundreds of metric tons of contaminated water was flowing out from the plant into the ocean every day.

    More than two and a half years since the 2011 disaster, Tepco is struggling to pump out, treat and store massive amounts of contaminated water that continues to increase at a rate of 400 metric tons a day.

    Tritium, which has a half-life of around 12 years, is less harmful to humans than cesium and strontium. A becquerel is a measure of the release of radioactive energy.

    Nuclear plants in Japan are allowed to release water with up to 60,000 becquerels/liter of tritium.

    The latest spike in radioactive elements in groundwater near the tanks threatens to scuttle Tepco's plans to build a bypass to route groundwater away from the plant and release it into the Pacific Ocean. The tank that leaked is in an area around 130 meters above ground from the bypass.

    Source

    ##############

    Addendum... Information from Tepco news release containing Tritium increase:

    Water Leak at a Tank in the H4 area in Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station (Follow-up Information 38)

    This is follow-up information on the "water leak at a tank in the H4 area in Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station" found on August 19.

    We performed the analyses of water sampled yesterday (on September 11) in observation holes (E-1: in north of the tank No.5 in Group I in the H4 area (outside of a dike) where water leakage was found; E-2 in south of the tank No.5 in Group I in the H4 area (outside of a dike) where water leakage was found) around H4 tank area.

    The result of E-1 was higher than the result obtained on September 10 (64000Bq/L).

    Based on the probability of influence on these results by leakage in H4 area tanks, we continue to analyze the observation holes nearby and investigate the area of leakage.

    <Observation hole: E-1>
    - Sampled on September 11
    Tritium: 97000Bq/L
    All β: 1500 Bq/L

    <Observation hole: E-2>
    - Sampled on September 11
    Tritium: 300Bq/L
    All β: Below the detection limit value (detection limit value: 20Bq/L)

    Source
    Last edited by panopticon; 14th September 2013 at 12:02. Reason: addendum
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by Sidney (here)
    In case you haven't heard, there is a "future" Typhoon headed for Japan. Isn't that convenient?????
    http://www.accuweather.com/en/weathe...ather/17685515
    The typhoon season in Pacific is from May to October with most activity in August and September.

    Here's a quick reference of storms this season so far:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Pa...typhoon_season

    The main point of my adding the article was to re-enforce what I was saying a few pages ago about the biological half-life of radioactive isotopes within organisms. Not to forget that there is also a cumulative effect via the food chain (caesium -> plankton -> fish -> humans/seals) that needs to be taken into account when eating anything that may be contaminated (fish, mushrooms, milk, cheese, etc). The article is about Ken Buesseler's impression as an expert in the field of the dangers associated with radioactive isotopes entering the food chain and travelling across the Pacific. The FDA reference was of little importance. For more information on Buesseler's study into the movement of radioactive isotopes through the Pacific as a result of the Fukushima reactors accident see:

    http://www.whoi.edu/main/news-releas...622&cid=133509

    There's also this video from a conference presentation he made:


    Source: Watch on Vimeo


    http://vimeo.com/66442400

    -- Pan
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    but what levels of contamination are they suggesting "may eventually, possibly" arise?
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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by buares (here)
    From nuclearfreeplanet.org/prof-mitsuhei-murata


    The critical situation at Fukushima requires the mobilization of human wisdom on the widest possible scale. The pressing need for setting up a neutral assessment team as well as an international technical cooperation team is evident.

    The fuel rods in the decaying cooling pool of unit 4 must be moved to another place as soon as possible. It is a global security issue requiring maximum efforts which regrettably are not being made.
    HOW practically can the damage be picked up and transferred?

    I understand the freeze it gig, to stop water migration, but the fuel rods, the contaminated soil, concrete, every bit of mud.

    One of our nuclear safety engineers on the Forum would be able to explain that action a whole lot.

    If I recall Chernobyl, the whole thing was encased in concrete, with many dying in the process.

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by Bobd (here)
    HOW practically can the damage be picked up and transferred?
    That's an issue, it seems like the only way to deal with nuclear waste is to bury it underground, or in concrete as in the case of Chernobyl...

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    Quote Posted by TargeT (here)
    but what levels of contamination are they suggesting "may eventually, possibly" arise?
    That's a really interesting question TargeT.

    From what I've read if there are no problems with the upcoming spent fuel removal process (from the reactor #4 spent fuel pool) then there is very little risk of any problems arising from the leaks on-site. While there is a daily flow of contaminated water into the ocean off the Fukushima Port area it mostly gets diluted to below dangerous levels in the ocean. There are recorded levels on the sea bed where it has settled however this only poses a threat to the immediate area in relation to seafood contamination (hence the no-fishing zones within the more concentrated areas at and adjacent to the site).

    However the removal of the spent fuel assemblies (last I heard this was scheduled for November) is reported as being a risky job with just over 1300 stored in the pool. Each assembly is 4.5 metres long and weigh about 300 kilograms. Below is a picture of the structure that was finished 29th May to make it possible:


    Source

    If there is an accident with one of these assemblies then it will increase both the contamination on-site and the difficulties involved in the clean-up process. In addition to this 'Arnie Gundersen, a veteran U.S. nuclear engineer and director of Fairewinds Energy Education, who used to build fuel assemblies' said:

    Quote "There is a risk of an inadvertent criticality if the bundles are distorted and get too close to each other," Gundersen said.
    ...
    "The problem with a fuel pool criticality is that you can't stop it. There are no control rods to control it," Gundersen said. "The spent fuel pool cooling system is designed only to remove decay heat, not heat from an ongoing nuclear reaction."
    The rods are also vulnerable to fire should they be exposed to air, Gundersen said.
    Source
    Also if the pool itself suffers a structural failure it could release the water in the pool that is heavily contaminated with caesium and release the equivalent amount of caesium as would be released by '14000 Hiroshima atomic bombs' (source) on-site. This is not saying a nuclear explosion, just the release of the equivalent caesium as would be released in that number and size of detonation. The fire would happen after the water no longer covers the assemblies.

    If we can trust Tepco and the Japanese Government nuclear agency to do that job then all should be good.

    Even if something happened with the rods and spent fuel pool there is little likelihood of it causing any problems in the US unless there was a catastrophic failure on-site similar to the one Gundersen mentions.

    This is a localised disaster and in all likelihood, as best as I understand the situation, the only people who will be affected in the future by the contamination either live within the area or work at the facility.

    The reactors are being cooled and everything seems to be ok at the facility (whether that is the case of course is debatable given Tepco's track record) however if water stops being pumped or any number of other situations occur (earth quake, tsunami, etc) or if the worst case scenario Gundersen mentions occurs then buggered if I know what could happen.

    That's just my thoughts on it though, anyone got a realistic assessment of the situation?

    -- Pan

    BTW here's the latest progress report from Tepco on the decommissioning process (in particular page 14 mentions required increase of tank capacity to 440,000 m3 by October and the further increase to 800,000 m3 required by 2016):


    Source
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: Japan nuclear agency upgrades Fukushima alert level

    The Japanese nuclear authority is planning to increase off-shore monitoring sites from 200 to 600,000 as a means of getting an idea as to the extent of contamination spread and concentration (AFP report via yahoo news):

    ################

    Japan to boost surveys off Fukushima: report

    TOKYO — Japan's nuclear authority plans to conduct radiation contamination surveys at 600,000 points on the seabed off the crippled Fukushima nuclear plant, up from 200 places so far, a report said Saturday.

    The Nuclear Regulation Authority is to survey the spots in a 1,000 square-kilometre (about 385 square-mile) area stretching 50 kilometres north-south and 20 kilometres east-west off Fukushima, the Yomiuri newspaper said.

    The survey is to measure caesium levels to assess the long-term effect on marine resources of radiation that has been leaking from the stricken plant since it was struck by a tsunami in 2011, the daily said.

    No immediate comment was available from the authority on Saturday.
    Tokyo Electric Power (TEPCO) has been struggling to contain contaminated water at the plant.

    It has poured thousands of tonnes of water on the plant's reactors to tame meltdowns sparked by the quake-tsunami disaster.

    The utility says the reactors are now stable but need to be kept cool to prevent them running out of control again.

    Much of the now-contaminated water is being stored in temporary tanks at the plant, and TEPCO has so far revealed no clear plan for it.

    The problem has been worsened by leaks in some of the tanks that are believed to have seeped into groundwater, which runs out to sea.

    The continuing nuclear catastrophe at Fukushima has come under the international spotlight in recent weeks as Tokyo fought off challenges from Madrid and Istanbul for the right to host the 2020 Games.

    South Korea has banned imports of fisheries products from Fukushima and seven other Japanese prefectures over fears of contamination.

    Source
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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