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    Default Electronic Heroin

    China’s Web Junkies

    New York Times
    January 19, 2014


    Quote This video is part of a series produced by independent filmmakers who have received support from the nonprofit Sundance Institute.

    Quote Compulsive Internet use has been categorized as a mental health issue in many countries, including the United States, but China was among the first to label “Internet addiction” a clinical disorder.

    In this Op-Doc video, we show the inner workings of a rehabilitation center where Chinese teenagers are “deprogrammed.” The Internet Addiction Treatment Center, in Daxing, a suburb of Beijing, was established in 2004. It was one of the first of its kind – and there are now hundreds of treatment programs throughout China and South Korea.

    (The first inpatient Internet addiction program in the United States recently opened in Pennsylvania.)

    The program featured in this video admits teenagers, usually male, whose parents typically take them there against their will. Once inside, the children are kept behind bars and guarded by soldiers. Treatment, which often lasts three to four months, includes medication and therapy, and sometimes includes parents. Patients undergo military-inspired physical training, and their sleep and diet are carefully regulated. These techniques (some of which are also used in China to treat other behavioral disorders) are intended to help the patients reconnect with reality.

    Yet after four months of filming in this center (for our documentary “Web Junkie”), some vital questions remained: Are the children being accurately evaluated? And is the treatment effective? In many cases, it seemed parents were blaming the Internet for complex social and behavioral issues that may defy such interventions. (For example, we noticed that some patients experienced difficult family relationships, social introversion and a lack of friends in the physical world.) Tao Ran, the center’s director, claims a 70 percent success rate. If that’s true, perhaps China’s treatment model is something other nations should embrace, however disturbing it may seem to outsiders. There is still no real global consensus among experts about what constitutes addiction to the Internet, and whether the concept even exists, particularly in a strict medical sense.

    What is clear is that this issue is not confined to China. With millions (if not billions) glued to screens and electronic devices, the overuse of technology is becoming a universal, transnational concern. While treatment methods may vary, one way or another, we will need to find effective ways to moderate our use of technology and provide help to those who need it.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/20/op...kies.html?_r=1

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Ouch -- in France, there's a curfew (at least for MMOs)!
    Why can't the Chinese just regulate the time spent rather than torture the kids more?

    Our country doesn't really address it much; the fixation is treated as normal as long as the content is "mainstream" or Hollywood related.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    I blame sh!tty parenting...at least in my case. It's hard to teach your kids moderation on the shiny screens when you're an addict yourself.

    "YOU, ALRIGHT...I LEARNED IT BY WATCHING YOU!!"

    Parents who use screens, have children who use screens.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by Tesla_WTC_Solution (here)
    Ouch -- in France, there's a curfew (at least for MMOs)!
    Why can't the Chinese just regulate the time spent rather than torture the kids more?

    Our country doesn't really address it much; the fixation is treated as normal as long as the content is "mainstream" or Hollywood related.
    I'm thinking you can't regulate addiction … stories like this terrify me for some reason …

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by donk (here)
    I blame sh!tty parenting...at least in my case. It's hard to teach your kids moderation on the shiny screens when you're an addict yourself.

    "YOU, ALRIGHT...I LEARNED IT BY WATCHING YOU!!"

    Parents who use screens, have children who use screens.
    That, and the degradation of the entertainment sector!

    Ex: Bugs Bunny vs. Fairly Oddparents... if you thought Bugs was ADHD, just watch what's on Nickelodeon.

    it's a systematic attack on the intellect.

    (but you are right, lots of us who played WoW and other addictive games had a hard time getting offline -- it's not like a forum where the post is done and you get up and make coffee -- Wow was like... well, the OP compares this to heroin, that's close -- I had a psychiatrist tell me that casino games release chemicals in the brain that mimic coke.)

    LOL!



    Hopefully most of us here are addicted to smart and not to stupid!

    @ Dianna sorry I didn't see your post (was in between).
    In France they knew they couldn't regulate the addiction but they cut off the supply lines at a certain hour of day/night.

    Since some games can't work with TOR or VPNs, it did work to "cure" some people of at least the insomnia part.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by donk (here)
    I blame sh!tty parenting...at least in my case. It's hard to teach your kids moderation on the shiny screens when you're an addict yourself.

    "YOU, ALRIGHT...I LEARNED IT BY WATCHING YOU!!"

    Parents who use screens, have children who use screens.
    I'm not sure its completely a parenting problem … part of it maybe, but not the whole nefarious story ...

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    I wouldn't call it "the degradation of the entertainment industry", it's more of a refinement of the owners' programming and tech.

    Heroin is refined opium...Hannah Montana is refined Mickey Mouse Club...
    Last edited by donk; 23rd January 2014 at 22:33.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by donk (here)
    I wouldn't call it "the degradation of the entertainment industry", it's more of a refinement of the owners' programming and tech.
    USA Today covered that stuff a little; I picked up a moldy copy of it in our car, and there was an article in Business section about the company "Optimizely" and how the founders got Obama elected by using their efficient "A/B" live testing to "improve conversion rates of visitations to donations" for Senator Obama. They claimed that they were up against the new "SUPER-PACs" who are conglomerate entities formed by megacorps working together. They can do things like run a commercial campaign or a website for a political candidate; the only thing they cannot do is give them money directly. Which means that if a Super PAC gave enough money, Obama could have had half the people in Hollywood running his campaign, lol... but the story is, he was working against these Super PACs via the internet and is the Internet Messiah, lmao.

    Omg.

    Anyhow about what Donk said about refinement of the tools at the disposal of the merchants and gatekeepers, it's the truth and it's why we have this president, too.

    For example. if you are not a libertarian, Optimizely should be able to keep you from seeing media that could change your mind, lol.
    That's the power of the controlling the information at its source, like Bing.

    Bing, fries are done, pretty much

    Welcome to McWorld

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Jeez. I wish I knew how to retrieve a New Yorker article from some years ago about the science of creating gambling machines/slot machines for Las Vegas. It was all about how to make online gambling addictive, about response times and positive feedback. It is a science, and well practiced.

    And everything the article says plays perfectly into the new internet environment for everything.

    Yes, the internet is addictive. Yes.

    If you, as a parent doubt this, just try to extract that smartphone/mouse from your child’s hands and forbid its use for 24 hours.... hah!

    The screaming, pleading and excuses will be revelatory.

    Or try it yourself.

    Cheers (not really...)

    Selene

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by donk (here)
    I blame sh!tty parenting...at least in my case. It's hard to teach your kids moderation on the shiny screens when you're an addict yourself.

    "YOU, ALRIGHT...I LEARNED IT BY WATCHING YOU!!"

    Parents who use screens, have children who use screens.
    Children will never do what you tell them, but they will grow up always doing what you did ... This is the number 1 consideration that must be heeded by every parent. To be is to teach. We are behooved to mind how we be - particularly while training children.

    While not the whole aspect of these addictions, it can definitely be a major part.

    I have seen many videos of kids going absolutely psycho because mom cancelled their WOW account that they were racking up 6 hours a day on while trying to go to school. Err... why would you let your kid do that in the first place? It's the training in self management that almost all parents lack, because they themselves are poor self managers.
    Last edited by DeDukshyn; 24th January 2014 at 01:38.
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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    I dont understand why this is being shown as such a bad thing - "addiction" to computers. Is it because it's not your stereotype of what a teenager/adult should be doing? like going out, getting into trouble - or going to bar's and clubs etc?


    I'm an internet and computer "addict" if you will.

    I'm 28 now, but my love of computer's started from when i was a child and was able to pull apart the old comodoor 64 when my parents upgraded to a 486.

    I was badly bullied all throught school, i had difficulties making friends. To me the computer, and the internet, was a place i could be me without being crucified. People dont care who you are, what you look like, or what your interests are - you get along because you have common interests. that also has an oposite - ie online harasment - but thats something that you - the user can choose to opt out of by not participating in it and avoiding it.


    My parents started having issues with the ammount of time i spent on the computer and started taking steps to combat it. They'd take the modem - i saved up pocket money and bought an internal one. When they figured that out, they took the power cord for the PC instead. I grabbed the kettle cord as a work around. Then finally, they beat me by taking the entire box with them to work in the boot of their car. No way around that one!

    What realy shat me to tears about that - was it felt like my parents had an obscession against me being on the computer. I could not see the difference personaly between being on the PC , and sitting infront of the TV. They'd be perfectly ok with me spending the same ammont of time - if not more - in front of the TV.

    Games that i play/ed from childhood to now range from harmless puzzell games, to WW2 shooters (to which i was damn good at for a 13yo girl thank you ) to 100 tonne machine's beating eachother up with futuristic weapons, to online only fantasy MMO's where i'd hack and slash goblins and dragons. Few racing games, very few strategy games, i guess the main ones are shooters and MMO's. I guess from the eyes of some DR's and Professors i should be quite an angry and violent person considering the game's ive played... When in reality i'll avoid violence unless it absolutely must be used for self defence - Hell i'd still rather hurt myself than another person or animal.

    As an Adult... i work in IT. I still love computers. I still prefer to come home each evening and jump on the PC, either to play games, simply surf the web, read forums, or watch youtube video's.

    I personally feel that with the introduction of computers and the internet - it opend up another avenue of things you can choose to do in life - as in spend your time on. But because this is new, different.... not what society expects you to do... it's seen as a problem, not right... something that needs fixing... wait a minute... you can make money out of this too by calling it an "Addiction" and frowning apon it, and then setting up therapy, pills and councelling to "Fix the problem"


    So what if i prefer to spend my time differently to others? Is the industry angry - and fighting back - that im not out in pub's and clubs pissing away my money? That im not out with other people investing my money into resteraunts and other venues's that people my age are allmost expected to go to because it's the "thing everyone else does" at that age?


    Does it worry people that im content, find happyness and friendship primarily through digital means instead of your conventional face to face stuff - purely because it's different to what you were raised to expect and see as normal?


    Has anyone considered that people are chosing to spend their time on a PC as it is such a fantastic escape from the BS of bullying, opression, and general crap that society likes to force on people as part of getting you ready to be a working class adult?

    And most importantly - why do you care so much about what people like me choose to spend their time doing? Why is it a problem? Why does it need Fixing?

    and that's my 2c


    P.S - on another note i'd like to point out that computer games themselves are being changed and shaped to be another form of achieving "programming". Let's take WOW as an example. It's changed drematically since it first came out - to the point now that i feel it's soul purpose is to get people to accept - and like - boring, repetative tasks with pissant rewards. The same can be seen with games such as call of duty and battlefield - you will like - accept - and want more - of the exact same thing. repeat repeat repeat. Really seems like they are trying to stamp out the fun and creativity and turn it into something that makes you like boring, repetative things. (ie - work day to day for most people - lol) thus someones taking notice and trying to turn things around to benefit the system. Hense my comments above inquiring if the industry was upset im not spending money where they want it.


    p.p.s - to further my point more - this "Epidemic" is rampant in China. See my notes about the internet being an escape for opression. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
    Last edited by TigaHawk; 24th January 2014 at 02:13.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Choosing to be self destructive is still destructive ...

    It has nothing to do with using computers or having a job in IT ... this issue is psychological one. And it is real. I also work in IT as director of MIS for my company. I love computers too!


    Look at this .. this is not normal, people ... and this is not china ...

    Last edited by DeDukshyn; 24th January 2014 at 02:26.
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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Fascinating vid. Does anyone else get the distinct impression the kid is hosting another entity? Certainly my guess would be an entity feeding off the child's emotion as he plays the game…. just a thought.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    Choosing to be self destructive is still destructive ...

    It has nothing to do with using computers or having a job in IT ... this issue is psychological one. And it is real. I also work in IT as director of MIS for my company. I love computers too!

    Look at this .. this is not normal, people ... and this is not china ...

    If anyone has a better description of this child other than purefaced Addiction Withdrawal, I'd be fascinated to hear it, teenage tantrums notwithstanding. So sad to watch. S*x, but true.

    You've been warned.

    regards,

    Selene

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by ahamkara (here)
    Fascinating vid. Does anyone else get the distinct impression the kid is hosting another entity? Certainly my guess would be an entity feeding off the child's emotion as he plays the game…. just a thought.
    Perhaps a different topic, but I'd say not quite "hosting" but there are entities that will influence and encourage all sorts of situations were extreme emotional output is created ... he was providing food ... as all extreme emotional output provides food for certain entities. Is it bad? it is the way it is ... I for one, would like to have control over when and if I provide emotional food. Humans can feed on it too (likely more common) --- look at his brother ...
    When you are one step ahead of the crowd, you are a genius.
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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    Choosing to be self destructive is still destructive ...

    It has nothing to do with using computers or having a job in IT ... this issue is psychological one. And it is real. I also work in IT as director of MIS for my company. I love computers too!


    Look at this .. this is not normal, people ... and this is not china ...


    That video... you do realise that person has a mental disability - and is from a VERY spoilt family. His parents bought him a used ute as his first car - as your first car should be 2nd hand as chances is you'll have an accident. That kid goes psycho, grabs a baseball bat and starts beating the crap out of the car putting on a very similar display to the one in the video you linked. His underlying issues i'd lean more towards bad parenting, his disability and the medications he's on. Not to mention how this could also be staged - it became an internet hit and the 2nd video was a followup - then they started making money from merchandise.



    But it's far easier to blame a videogame than put parenting in the firing line, right?



    P.S - You've said choosing to be destructive is still destructive. Are you hinting that im destructive because i choose to spend my time on the PC and internet? IF so - how is that destructive? Again - im thinking its because im not spending my time in a way that you would want or expect to spend yours. Thus that kinda puts you in the same boat as people who demand that muslim's should not wear a Burkhah when in America or Australia becuase you see it as a symbol of opression when they can see it as a symble of committment to their religon... Just saying...
    Last edited by TigaHawk; 24th January 2014 at 03:08.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    I do not know that child so I can't say he is disabled, or spoilt. Can you provide evidence?

    I do know this problem is called extreme emotional addiction - and it is extreme. compare to the "addictions" people had 50 or 100 years ago.

    Emotional disease is not good a "first car" in my opinion. But poor parenting can make it inevitable.

    Quote "Are you hinting that im destructive ... "
    -- hehe - I wasn't thinking about you at all.
    Last edited by DeDukshyn; 24th January 2014 at 03:11.
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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Quote Posted by DeDukshyn (here)
    I do not know that child so I can't say he is disabled, or spoilt. Can you provide evidence?

    I do know this problem is called extreme emotional addiction - and it is extreme. compare to the "addictions" people had 50 or 100 years ago.

    Emotional disease is not a "first car" in my opinion.

    So you've gone from showing a video as evidance that computer games mess people up to - i dont know the kid i cant say he's disabled give me proof that that's why he's doing it. Please give me proof that video games did make him like that and not bad parenting and being spoilt rotten?

    What does a car have to do with emotional diseas as well? Sorry im not getting you there. I did say however - a first car should be 2nd hand - as chances are whilst learning to drive you're going to have some accidents and mistakes and damage the car - you generally go for a car in alot better condition once you've learnt to drive and have your license...



    In regards to china - i used them as an example because they're i guess the ground 0 of where "rehab" for internet addiction was born. The internet is one of the few way's to get free information - that's not controlled or censored - in china. A link to the outside world - and a getaway from the reality of life.

    The same happens around the world tho. I mean.. America.. . your schools are more like prisons.... you are treated as a prisoner, you're having the rules of authority drummed into you... your continually faced with conflict while you're being indoctrinated with the system as it's changing your morals and thought process, and having to deal with how harsh children can be to eachother, parents and their financial situation as well.

    Can we also look at stats about parenting? The world has changed from having the 1 person in the family being the breadwinner, and the other being the stay at home type to look after the kids - to both parents must work to bring in enough money to put food on the table - less time for the kids - hell parents want less time with kids especially after a long hellish day at work. With the drop of attention from parents - kids being kids has turned into kids having disabilities or mental problems that need to be fixed with medication. Then kids are just being unruly and problematic for parents - rather than just being and doing things that kid's should do.

    How has that impacted today's youth? I wonder if this has anything to do with the greater problem? Or are we still looking at blaming computers and the internet?
    Last edited by TigaHawk; 24th January 2014 at 03:19.

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    What disturbs me it the disconnect from nature: it seems to me the more digitally we immerse ourselves, the more alienated we become from the natural world around us.
    We don't know the phase of the moon,
    we don't read the weather in the clouds,
    we cannot hear the animals/ birds,
    and we cannot feel the Earth's heartbeat.

    It disturbs me greatly.

    Pamela

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    Default Re: Electronic Heroin

    Have cut all digital media with the exception of the computer (which I limit
    No TV or radio (paper subscription to newspaper)
    Keep phone on silent and check messages/voice mail 2x per day.
    Today I'm on computer a bit more because staying in with a cold.
    I feel like an alien species.
    As a culture, we have surrendered without a fight.
    It disturbs me greatly, as well.

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