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Thread: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

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    Sweden Avalon Member Slorri's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by Slorri (here)
    It is reported now that they have radar tracking of Flight 370 further north and east of Vietnam.

    Busted! Flight Radar Caught Changing Flight Path of Malaysia Flight 370!
    It is possible that this radar playback is from the day after.
    That is, the 9th local time, and the 8th UTC.
    In that case it is another plane. And it might in fact be followed by another plane. Perhaps they were looking for debris.

    It does match the radar from the 9th.

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    Scotland Avalon Member aranuk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by Tesseract (here)
    It turns out those stolen passports were on the interpol database - and yet the carriers were still allowed to get through security.

    Another thought I had - why don't they ever use satellites for these kind of searches, or to track the planes?
    You make great sense Tesseract!
    I also agree.

    Stan
    If you don't follow your spirit without hesitation, you end up following your hesitation without spirit.

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by mariposafe (here)

    I'm a little puzzled about how it is that a plane could crash into a very busy shipping lane without being noticed.
    Yeah X2

    I'm not sure the body of water we're taking about (for the crossing) is that huge
    Providing they didn't go too far off course.

    As a side note : there have been cases of planes and ships disappearing without a trace in the past.

    Going out on a limb here, but I'm starting to believe there were no plane crashes on
    911 So WTF happened to those planes.

    Our media is capable of spinning this story or faking it to fit there agenda.

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    Avalon Member Operator's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by Nick Matkin (here)
    All this discussion of two passengers on stolen passports, without any mention of how common this is. I mean - it might be that 50 per cent of flights have passengers with dodgy documentation.

    How often does it occur? Is this very unusual, or fairly common, but only revealed on this flight due to media interest?

    Nick
    I had the same questions ... however if there is one person other than them buying their tickets then this ties them together.

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    Avalon Member sdv's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by Cardillac (here)
    Hi all,

    there's been an absolute DEARTH of info about this incident; just a few articles (precious few)- WHY?- is something going on that we don't yet know about?-

    three days after incident: countless sources from various countries searching ocean/land but no sign of wreckage anywhere-

    normally MSM would be all over/spinning articles on this subject but something has obviously happened that not even MSM/nor alternative media will touch with a ten foot pole-

    according to my latest sources (whatever they're worth) the plane first curved (1st source) then curved 180 degres to go back to/from original source (2nd source) then...

    blackout on radar screen; no SOS, no nothing;

    it's known the South China Sea contains its own version of the Bermuda Triangle but is this area included?-

    please state thoughts fellow Avalonians- and please be well all-

    Larry
    Until they find the wreckage and the flight recorders, investigators have nothing to work with and cannot determine the causes of the crash outside of speculative theories, especially as there was no mayday call from the cockpit or no indication of any problem communicated to air traffic controllers from the cockpit.

    Recently, as a person who has always been apprehensive about flying, I watched everything I could find about aircraft accidents and investigations.

    It is not unprecedented for an airplane to suddenly plunge in a nose dive to sea or the ground. An inexplicable problem with the plane (if pilots know what has gone wrong, they know how to deal with the situation) or a mistake in maintenance or pilot error (some bum pilots who do all the wrong things in an emergency) are the usual causes. Pilots will usually fight like hell to get back control of the plane (and probably why no emergency call was made, especially if the loss of control was drastic and sudden). So, basically, sometimes no mayday call is made.

    What happened seems to have been catastrophic and sudden, because a crew in trouble would alert air traffic control that they need to land as soon as possible.

    Don't fly on a 77 if you have an alternative. There might be a problem with the airplane that happens infrequently, but until there is an aircrash where there is wreckage and flight recorders to examine, the cause will not be identified.

    The Lockerbie investigation was exclusively focused on finding evidence for a bomb because of the involvement of one individual. If the FBI is involved in the investigation, they will have tunnel vision and will look only for evidence of a terrorist bomb.

    So, what did happen that incapacitated those in the cockpit so that there was no control and the plane plummeted? What would do that? Not decompression because they have emergency oxygen masks. Perhaps instruments going haywire because pilots are very dependent on flying a plane according to information given by instruments (so they may trust what instruments are saying even if it contradicts what they are physically experiencing, especially at night or in bad weather ... not night or bad weather?). The crew know how to get out of a nosedive or stalling, but if they responded inappropriately (has happened, and I think of one crash where the co-pilot was pushing the nose down when the pilot was trying to push the nose up) they would have probably been so panicked and confused that they would not have sent out a distress call (really, a lot of crew do not send out a distress call in those last few frantic minutes).

    An airplane that loses all engines can glide and there is time for the crew to speak to air traffic control, so if it was sudden loss of all engines then only an incompetent crew would not send out an alert before the plane crashed.

    My prediction is that a terrorist bomb will be blamed and if there is a fault in the aircraft, we may only find out when the third or fourth 777 crashes. I think there is very little chance that we will find evidence of the truth (theories, speculation, but no evidence) and that if a missile (physical or energetic) brought this plane down, we will never have that conclusion from an investigation nor have the evidence to challenge the conclusions of the investigation.

    From what information is available, it seems that the airplane broke up before it hit the water or hit the water at an angle that resulted in complete break up on impact (this does not always happen). The former scenario is more likely because an airplane that breaks up on impact does leave a lot of physical evidence, which has not yet been found.

    Radar records do seem to indicate a sudden loss of altitude so the airplane probably suddenly nosedived into the sea and it was catastrophic so the crew did not send a mayday call.

    Not necessarily a bomb I say, but the FBI will want it to be a terrorist bomb and this may become the official story unless evidence is found to prove them wrong. The news about the stolen passports may be a common occurrence that we only find out about when a plane crashes. A lot of people probably travel with false passports. Were those people using false passports economic spies or saboteurs? As Europeans travelling on European passports, they must have stuck out like a sore thumb on that plane. Does not the CIA prefer to use false identities? The false passports may be a red herring that have nothing to do with the plane crash, but an interesting side story.

    Unfortunately if there is a problem with the 777 that crops up occasionally (and often a problem with the plane is often the cause of accidents), then we will probably have to wait for the third or fourth crash to find out what it is.
    Sandie
    Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known. (Carl Sagan)

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    True story about how a 727 disappeared but then came back 10 minutes later.

    It's about a Boering 727 that disappeared on approach to Miami International Airport only to reappear at exactly the same position ten minutes later -- except that every clock and watch on board was ten minutes behind ground time.

    10 minutes later when they came back onto the radar, once they landed, they noticed that their watches were 10 minutes behind ground time.

    The air traffic controllers told the crew that they went missing but the crew didn't have any knowledge of that. They did not notice any time lost at all.

    The controllers told them that when they disappeared off the radar, several airliner's flew through the same space that airliner had occupied before they came back, 10 minutes later.




    Here's more information on that:

    There was a book out by Martin Caidin called "Ghosts of the Air" http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...521886-1160721. One of the incidents he detailed was the 10-minute disappearance of that NAL 727 on approach to MIA. I would suggest this book to any aviation enthusiast as he details many odd phenomenon with airplanes. One of the things that makes this book so much more interesting is that Martin Caidin acknowledges he received literally hundreds of "ghost stories" but only included those where he could find corroborating testimony from many participants and/or official documentation.

    One of my favorite stories from the book was about a group of British Bombers that went out on an early WWII night bombing raid over Germany. Hours passed and, when it was approximately time for the bombers to return to the base, the base commander heard one of the bombers returning. He advised the field chief to have that crew report to the commander's office immediately on arrival. A few minutes later, the crew of the bomber came into the commander's office and wrote down their reports - heavy resistence, high allied losses (afterall, something like 12 bombers out, only 1 back). Before the crew left, the commander had each one of them sign their reports with their service number and then sent the off to the O-Club for a well-deserved drink.

    Shortly after, the field chief came into the commander's office and advised him of the tally for that evening's raid - 12 bombers out - NONE returned! Wow! Reports in the following day confirmed that all of the bombers sent out were destroyed over Germany however, the "debriefing report" the commander had gotten from his "returned crew" accurately matched the intelligence reports received the following day (with the obvious exception of the one aircraft returning to England). Handwriting analysis of the debriefing reports signed by that crew, matched the handwriting of the crew that was KIA over Germany that night!

    http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo....main/1088847/


    ----
    I have that book and that's where I found out about the incident I told at the beginning of this post.
    Last edited by Roisin; 10th March 2014 at 21:04.

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    You have to figure that likely every one had a cell phone on them too and no one managed to make one call to anybody stating that something was wrong....this whole thing just seems way to bizarre.
    SilentFeathers

    "The journey is now, it begins with today. There are many paths, choose wisely."

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    M from Canada.... with more

    "A nation which has forgotten the quality of courage which in the past has been brought to public life is not as likely to insist upon or regard that quality in its chosen leaders today - and in fact we have forgotten. "John F. Kennedy


    Peace, Love and Consiousness
    Referee

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Sandie
    Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known. (Carl Sagan)

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Seems 10 different countries are looking for it /them/parts. Latest from British news http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...e-missing.html

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    Moderator (on Sabbatical) Harley's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by SilentFeathers (here)
    You have to figure that likely every one had a cell phone on them too and no one managed to make one call to anybody stating that something was wrong....this whole thing just seems way to bizarre.
    Try using your cell phone while you're out over the middle of an ocean.
    Let me know how that works out for ya! LOL!

    (Not picking on ya SF! )
    Harley

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Wow, the conspiracy theories! LOL!
    Great entertainment though!

    Now it's my turn!!
    (Just a story)

    The plane is cruising normally with the Autopilot engaged.

    Hijackers/Terrorists, probably with little to no knowledge of flying this aircraft, entered the Flight Deck and overwhelmed the Flight Crew.

    In order for them to take control of the plane so they could do whatever they planned to do they would have to disconnect the Autopilot. So with little to no knowledge of how to operate the plane, they disconnected the AC Electrical Buses on the Overhead Panel (Think of it as the Main Breaker in your house.)


    Note: Disconnecting the Busses would kill virtually all of the electronics equipment onboard the aircraft (This would account for the loss of all contact by the ground), however the aircraft is still flyable manually (requiring training and experience!) through backup systems which are powered from the batteries.

    When the Autopilot disengaged the aircraft immediately dropped in altitude some 200 feet before the (hijacker) could recover and stabilize. Once stabilized they could fulfill their plan, whatever that may be.

    It wasn't until they attempted to make contact with the ground to announce themselves and their demands/intentions (after all, what good is it to hijack or terrorize if no one knows about it?) that they discovered they had no communications.

    At this point the main part of their plan has already failed so they attempted to change course (possibly for a new destination - 'Plan B'), but in doing so the aircraft made an abrupt 180. When the Hijacker attempts to correct for this maneuver, he probably over-corrects which causes the aircraft to perform even more wild maneuvers.

    By this time the Hijacker has lost control and he knows it. Their plan is lost. So he simply sends the plane down into the sea.

    Because of the semi-shallow AOA (Angle of Attack), the aircraft struck the sea and sank quickly (mostly intact, which would account for the lack of a debris field). The plane now lies at the bottom in about 65 feet of water. There are no survivors.


    Note: The above is a fictional account!

    I hope you enjoyed it!

    Harley

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    Puerto Rico Avalon Member Virma De Ris's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by Harley Hawkins (here)
    Quote Posted by SilentFeathers (here)
    You have to figure that likely every one had a cell phone on them too and no one managed to make one call to anybody stating that something was wrong....this whole thing just seems way to bizarre.
    Try using your cell phone while you're out over the middle of an ocean.
    Let me know how that works out for ya! LOL!

    (Not picking on ya SF! )
    Let's assume that the back of the seats still have a telephone device, the one that you use a credit card to make a very costly phone call from mid air. Someone inside that airplane must have thought of using it, assuming that such device was available. Still this is all speculation.

    ~Praying for all involved to find their peace.~
    Last edited by Virma De Ris; 10th March 2014 at 21:28.
    "Nothing is true; everything is permitted."
    --from AC Series.

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    Moderator (on Sabbatical) Harley's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by Virma De Ris (here)
    Let's assume that the back of the seats still have a telephone device, the one that you use a credit card to came a very costly phone call from mid air. Someone inside that airplane must have thought of using it, assuming that such device was available. Still this is all speculation.
    See my post just preceding yours, Virma.
    (We posted at the same time).

    Harley

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    Aaland Avalon Member Agape's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    I dare to say this much : the search and rescue operation is damn slow . It's only today when China announced deployment of their satellites , if they've done it on Saturday they could have saved someone .
    The same goes for all the other countries and their satellites .. of course, tell me the taly of how expensive the technologies are and how difficult to operate .

    They have to be drowning till now, even if they 'landed on water' and did not quite nose dive , it could be few people getting out somewhere .. between the East coast of Vietnam and the Phillipines . The China South Sea is pretty deep there .

    Of course .. in case of landing on water ... the door is not always easy to open ... and the plane is not really meant to float for long so it goes down anyway .




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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Stolen passports on flight MH370 linked to people-smuggling network

    The disaster that befell flight MH370 has thrown fresh light on a sophisticated illegal immigration network that uses stolen passports to smuggle people from South-East Asia to Europe, experts said last night.

    When it emerged that two of the 239 passengers on board the flight between Kuala Lumpur and Beijing had been travelling on stolen Austrian and Italian passports, it was initially feared that the flight may have been the victim of a hijacking or bomb attack. [...]

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/w...cle4029137.ece

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Quote Posted by Harley Hawkins (here)
    Quote Posted by SilentFeathers (here)
    You have to figure that likely every one had a cell phone on them too and no one managed to make one call to anybody stating that something was wrong....this whole thing just seems way to bizarre.
    Try using your cell phone while you're out over the middle of an ocean.
    Let me know how that works out for ya! LOL!

    (Not picking on ya SF! )
    The looks of the radar they may of had service, text off satellites (if that's possible) I'm just trying to think of everything and so far most of what I've thought of doesn't quite add up.

    Also:

    This is a bit suspicious too..

    Real-time flight trackers seek missing Malaysian Air flight 370, find only holes
    Last edited by SilentFeathers; 10th March 2014 at 21:51.
    SilentFeathers

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    A IBM executive from Texas was on the plane that was not supposed to be on it,
    and look in South Vietnam. I am just listening to the 8 pm segment of last
    weeks 'Payday' Bobs weekend radio shows that goes on from 12 to 18 hours
    depending on the atmosphere of the show live. The last couple of weeks Ion ( The
    voice of the Guf ) has come back livevia JW ( human) and great interaction and
    knowledge has been imparted and fun had by all listening both live and in the
    archive. 10 mins in Ion comes on and the first question by Gregg one of the
    regulars is about the missing plane , and Ion gives ones of his usual cryptic
    answers, only five minutes before Sarah takes the conversation in another
    direction. So it will be interesting to see if the all knowing voice of the Guf is right
    on this one...LOL

    Sometimes someone else will go back to a previous topic and if they add more in a
    later segment. I will add, since its a current event I thought it worth a mention.




    ===================================================

    latest from BBC

    China urges Malaysia to intensify search for flight MH370





    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-26513506


    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 10th March 2014 at 22:23.

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    United States Avalon Member Elainie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    It gets even weirder:

    "Selamat Omar, a Malaysian whose 29-year-old son Mohamad Khairul Amri Selamat was a passenger on the flight, told of getting a call from the airline saying the plane was missing."

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    Default Re: Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

    Not sure if true or not but there has been a couple of articles about people calling some of the missing passengers cell phones and they are ringing but no one answers. Probably hogwash but then again, stranger things have happened.
    Last edited by SilentFeathers; 10th March 2014 at 22:12.
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