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Thread: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

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    Avalon Member Lifebringer's Avatar
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    There's good and bad in everyone and everything and Creator created all. That's why I like being a Progressive, because WE are all sides that make the best solution, but we don't force it. WE bring evidence, pro and con, and let all take a sound thought on it, before bringing it for a vote. All sides, every state, all people, it's great practice.
    Love don't hurt, it lifts. Our Dem party had become a corporate cesspool that allowed Glass Steigel to be dissolved, under Barney Franks and that other blue dog Chris Dodd. We tossed Dodd after letting him think he'd be able to run for President, by putting out who was responsible, because he brought the scam to Franks, and Franks had the Gay vote. We needed all the votes, they needed their civilian rights to leave inheritance to their loved partner and visit them in the hospitals when they are sick or dying. Franks had failed miserably because he took the greedy way and not the people's way.

    Gained more voter/steam and found the bluedogs had a roster of crap against the people, if either a Dem or Repub got in, but the Dem side wasn't planetarily or monetarily as destructive as the Republican bills we had to stop. A few million calls breaking the switchboards in DC, and we got it done.
    WE still got work to do, but we're working with the people who work with "we/the/flesh and blood people/voters to get 'er done.

    Case in point, this is our new mission and I've been riding Democrat Rosa De Lauro who's hubby is a Monsanto MONSTERVEGGIE maker, and she put a bill in 2005 up for vote HR 875 which bans small organic farming, without permits that are out the gazoo now in some Monsanto influenced states. Dem Mark Begich and R Lisa Murkowski are fighting Monsanto now for their 3 gene splice salmon to have to have a label before hitting the grocery shelves, after Republicans and Rosa voted banning the GMO altogether.
    Granted she did it 2005 before the recession and probably didn't realize (oops thatCorpBLdog agenda crap I mentioned) that gardening would become some people's only way to feed their families with prices so high.

    She's also a women's civilian/rights champion Liberal. You may have to pull teeth of TP, but you can talk to a Liberal, and when their are caught red handed being a hypocrite and face having their greedy little seat removed, they pull the bills the people don't want. Can't say that for the otherside anymore.

    She's in the party I vote people out of and put others into, I've been doing it since I watched the idiots on the left (corpBLdoggonits) vote for the war to Iraq. Most of them have lost their seats of power to be bribed in the people's houses. I did it and I'll do it again. I'm all for small and large businesses, as long as I can have a clean glass of water, breath clean air, educate the masses to encourage solutions through creativity and design, be able to love who I feel loved by, take care of my needs in life without all the drama and stress that brings on most diseases, and have medicine that doesn't make crap worse,.I'm not someone who will not act when people are being lied to are harmed into a war. I love my Vietnam Veterans because they didn't know what they were fighting for then, and military has YET TO TELL US what the hell they went there for still today. Lives lost for what? Yes, I am and I will not allow this deception to be played my families future for someone's money coffers. Another orphan for a LIE? I think not.

    To jack:
    "And who gave the info for those liesJack?"
    CIA.
    Don't believe the HYPE, was something inbred in African American families, because those who scream the loudest are usually filled with the most bs info to stir the masses/blood/emotions, and slip one in on the people.
    Weapons of Mass Distraction have been around a long time. Track the info, and see where it leads, and if it gives you a headache, ask within. Don't you trust your gut? I don't think you really believe this, do you jack?
    Last edited by Lifebringer; 23rd March 2014 at 10:51.

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    Aaland Avalon Member Agape's Avatar
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by Eram (here)
    a bit of a side step here, but...

    This underlines perfectly why the democratic model of government (which most people, even here on Avalon, think of as the only working model) is not and will never be working.
    At least, not as long as the consciousness of the average Joe is at it's current level.

    Most people (from which ever way you look at it) are wise nor knowledgeable.
    They don't know the difference between a power hungry, ruthless man who will lie and kill to get his way or a wise man (or woman) who is willing to place his life in service of mankind to elevate society to new height's.

    A Psychopath can rely on the ignorance of the masses to get him into a position of power, by means of persuasion, lies, selling of dreams he never intends on following up and more.

    Too many cheerleaders is problem of every society ... there are 'leaders' and 'teachers' about everywhere you look now ,

    and it's not difficult to notice how human vocabulary , the use of terms and symbolics itself degraded , like cascade of falling cards .
    Yes every leader nowadays is pro-democratic, progressive and has Master Degree in one or more science fields .

    Words, terms are being thrown around like pieces of paper .. they don't keep their original values .

    There's steep inflation of values taking place .. quality is being replaced with quantitative approach, large numbers , huge machines .. global solutions .

    There's this attempt to organise growing ecosystems of human society .. prevent the degradation taking place in future, secure the course of mankind's destiny .

    ....

    Remember one thing ... in benevolent societies, whether it concerns family, group of friends, any group of people after all .. and I've met with this all around the world .. people do not need that many 'leaders' .

    I'm saying that in benevolent society who respect common and uncommon wisdom, man is an instrument of the wisdom, not wisdom is always instrument of man .
    Even the dumbest member of a group has some unique qualities that can serve others , and anyone can be a leader in particular situations, under different circumstances etc .
    Agressive type of clans , gangs, cults ..yes they depend strongly on leaders because force requires force .

    The reason why benevolent societies install leaders is more often for the need to maintain structure and protect themselves from organised, aggressive groups and gangs .

    But what I mean is ... that todays society .. is becoming very aggressive , say 'progressive' from within with everyone wanting to be 'the leader' , the 'top man' , does it make sense to them all how this can not work out ?

    I don't claim to know the answer here .. but in old times, people would search for their seers and kings .. before they asked them for wise decisions . History repeats itself on grand scale ..
    the search for wisdom has to continue ..

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    United States Avalon Member ghostrider's Avatar
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Watch the ptb sell the idea that we need a woman president and that will fix it all ... but Hillary will do exactly what those before her have done , use the smokescreen of peace while planning the next false flag WAR ...I think there is a prophecy where Russia attacks America while Hillary is president ... I must verify but I'm pretty sure ... On how bad it is , just walk around and speak to a stranger , he will probably be holding a sign that says anything helps ...
    Raiding the Matrix One Mind at a Time ...

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    United States Administrator ThePythonicCow's Avatar
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by jackovesk (here)
    WTF is wrong with putting all the cards on the table, open for discussion...

    Gutless is as Gutless does...
    I suspect that it's the tone that matters, not whether one has the guts to say it.

    Imagine the following story (pure fiction):
    • A large group of people gather peacefully to show their support for some issue.
    • A car backfires, or a child lights a small firecracker ... Bang (like the sound of a gun) !
    • Within minutes of the sound, all hell breaks lose.
    As this thread so aptly demonstrates, the bastards in power have gotten most of us, most of the time, to be labelling the "other" guy (another one of us, just of a different stripe) as the bad guy.

    So when strong emotions are poured onto this fire of humanity, it is our own house that the flames burn down. Strong emotions are just more gasoline on the fire.

    ===

    It's not the emotions we're short of; it's the subtle awareness of what are the underling causes of humanity's sickness.

    We're more short of the ability to see through the smoke than we are of gasoline to fuel the flames.

    We're more short of the guts of intuition than we are of the guts of courage.

    ===

    Pouring gasoline on the fire inflames those who have some part of their identity close to that part of the fire (as in threads like this), and the resulting smoke (as in threads like this) obscures further the vision of the rest.
    My quite dormant website: pauljackson.us

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by jackovesk (here)


    March 20, 2014

    On Wednesday it was reported that <ping> enemies within, mainly those who are part of the "progressive movement," are very close to their ultimate goal of the complete demise of the <ping> has envisioned by the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Today there is even more disturbing news.

    An "ex-spook" as they are known, in other words a retired member of the CIA , stated concerning the effort to destroy the <ping>. "You have no idea how bad it is." The enemies of freedom and the Constitution within the country, he said, have now succeeded in putting most of their goals in place. "Think of how far they have come since 2008," he continued, "Most <ping> don't even recognize their own country anymore. They feel like foreigners in their own land."

    "If we continue down the present path," he concluded, "Our liberties will be dust in the wind by 2016. These people are organized, relentless, persistent, and dangerous. And they have been at it since the early 1900s."

    The former agent did not wish to be more specific about what he knows due to the fact that if he did so, it would be easy enough to figure out his identity based upon the in-depth knowledge he has of certain facts.

    These "enemies within" are generally known as progressives, although the term has fallen in and out of vogue based upon changing perceptions of the public. Progressives are known under a variety of names. Liberals, collectivists, statists, Marxists, neo-Marxists, socialists, and "democratic consensus builders" are some of the more common terms that people who stand for freedom and liberty have used to describe progressives. But it all boils down to the same thing. In order for them to achieve their self-described utopia, human freedom and liberty must be severely restricted and controlled, and the power of the centralized government must be greatly strengthened.

    In the previous report issued Wednesday it was noted how the enemy within has gone about attempting to reach their goals. Today we go further in making some eye-opening disclosures that shed more light on this most dangerous scenario.

    The progressives/Marxists/collectivists are willing to do anything to advance their agenda, even if it means lying incessantly to the public, or even toying with the lives of citizens, using them as guinea pigs for mass social experimentation.

    An example of one of the most despicable of these experiments is to be found during the mid-1960s under President Lyndon Baines Johnson (LBJ). Very few except those with high security clearances within the government and LBJ's inner circle knew about this program. Even fewer know about it today. It was never reported or acknowledged. And most who knew the details are now deceased. A few, however, are still alive and well, and they know the full story.

    One of these persons, an attorney who worked with one of the entities involved in this scheme, explained in very simple language what, exactly, took place. This is his story verbatim:

    QuoteWhen LBJ became president after the assassination of John F. Kennedy in 1963, most of us who were in the know were aware of the ominous turn of events this would signify. --THIS IS THE GUY WHO PULLED THE TRIGGER ON KENNEDY, INDIRECTLY, BTW!!! I WONDER WHY? LBJ was one of the most despicably wicked human beings who ever occupied the Oval Office. He would do anything to get elected on his own right in 1964. Barry Goldwater, the <ping> who would oppose him, had been looking forward to having a series of debates with Kennedy across the country. They had already worked it out. But when Kennedy was killed and it became clear that he would face LBJ instead, he privately told his aides that the election was already over, that LBJ was perhaps the most vile and dishonest character in American politics at the time.

    LBJ wanted the support of the egg and dairy farming industry. Being from Texas, he felt it would look very bad if did not get the support of this significantly large portion of the farming industry. But the egg and dairy farmers, for various reasons, balked. They would not throw their support behind LBJ. Well, Johnson was furious. So, he courted and won the support of the grain farmers. But that was not all. After the election he wanted revenge on the egg and dairy farmers, and he wanted to reward the grain farmers for supporting him.

    “This is where things get downright spooky, but I can vouch for its truth. Johnson decided that he and his administration would issue a new concept -- a "food pyramid" that would "help" children and their parents make good food choices, not to mention those who are older and suffering from various maladies. The problem for the milk and egg industry is that the pyramid recommended that citizens severely restrict their intake of dairy products, particularly eggs. But to the delight of the grain farmers, the pyramid recommended a dramatic increase in the consumption of grain products such as bread, cereal, crackers, and the like.

    “Johnson leaned on his government physicians to place their stamp of approval on this scheme by claiming that if <ping> ate according to the recommendations of the pyramid, they could eradicate heart disease, strokes, and other cardiovascular diseases. Soon everyone had jumped on the bandwagon. Doctors were telling their patients that they needed to cut way back on eggs and dairy and eat lots of grains, vegetables, and fruits. Some went so far as to tell their heart patients that they were restricted to one or two eggs per week, but an even better choice was to eliminate them altogether.

    “Most <ping> who grew up in the 50s, 60s, and 70s are well aware of this infamous government food pyramid. The problem was that none of it, not one word, was true.”
    It turned out that after multimillions of <ping> were beset with obesity, early onset diabetes and a myriad of other dangerous diseases that come from it, that all those grains the government had been pumping down their throats was not such a good idea after all. And lo and behold, it turned out that eggs will not, in themselves, cause heart disease. A person can eat two eggs per day, along with milk, meats, cheeses, and some non-starchy vegetables, and not only will they keep their weight under check but they will avoid most of the diseases that afflict millions of Americans, including heart disease and diabetes. This is, of course, provided that you do some exercise and severely restrict sugar intake. That means grains and starchy vegetables as well as sweets.

    In short, Johnson was willing for multimillions of <ping> to die prematurely and become afflicted with dangerous diseases all because he wanted power and would punish anyone or any industry that got in his way.

    This is the essence of the progressive/Marxist/collectivist. Citizens are not human beings to be respected. They are slaves, subjects, vermin on which to conduct their experiments and if necessary, kill them.

    This lesson is also a good example of the mindset of the progressive/collectivist -- <ping that too>. Government is here to tell us what to eat, how much of it we are allowed to have, what to drink and how much, and who knows how many other directives that are "for our own good." Try telling that to the countless numbers of Americans who got diabetes and died from it simply because they were doing what their government told them to do in order to "be healthy."

    And if we happen to lose a million people here or a million people there in the process, that is no major price to pay for finding out how human beings react to certain experiments government wishes to conduct on them, "for their own good."

    However, the really disturbing factor in all of this is that these ideas, concepts, and proposals that seem to have come straight out of Hitler's Germany or Stalin's USSR are still being utilized today by <ping>'s enemy within. Collectivists still want to meddle in our eating and drinking habits, to the point that citizens are forbidden from eating too much fat in NYC restaurants and school kids increasingly are not allowed to bring their own lunches to school unless they pass "the food police test," that is, what they will be eating is acceptable to the government educational complex.

    In addition, citizens all across America are being told that they are barred, by law, from growing their own food. Why?

    It is all about power. You, the individual citizen, must have none. But government and the elitists that run it must have all of it.

    But another obvious problem is the government's Fascist collaboration with the mega-food corporations who want a monopoly on what the citizens eat. And even more disturbing is America's complicit scheming with one of the most evil organizations that has ever existed -- the United Nations.

    http://www.examiner.com/article/you-...truction-of-us

    PS - There it is again that "Word" ((PROGRESSIVE))...

    Formed from the "Left-Leaning Liberal (Psychopaths) who literally want to (Kill & Mame) you any which they can...!!!
    Let's get back to the base of this thread. Raise your hands everyone who actually read the whole thing?
    How much it would take to read it twice?
    or do I need to cross-post something I wrote on the thread about Ukraine and Crimea? About the undiluted honesty part?

    BTW, we are aware of who did nothing to prevent Kennedy's assassination. So only that in its own is enough to make me ... return my breakfast only when thinking of him. And I am not even <ping> American.
    So, I would suggest, if it would help to see (REALITY) easier and better, to drop the flag under you avatar, and just read on.

    We are in our base human beings, are we not? Or do we always think of ourselves with the names someone else have given us along the way?

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    And for anyone ready to jump on my throat -->
    There is one saying that goes in this way: ( a free quote )

    You don't see THE THINGS the way THEY ARE,
    you see them the way YOU ARE.

    So I guess, the compassionate among us (people like jacko) still care enough to share information here.

    The stone-hearted (pointing to myself) have given up on the whole idea.

    This is my one and only exception of logging in here, after I decided it is better for my own sanity to never come back.

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    United States Administrator ThePythonicCow's Avatar
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by chocolate (here)
    The stone-hearted (pointing to myself) have given up on the whole idea.
    I share ... that sharing by us is for me the most valuable part of this forum. That's not to say that there are not other values of this forum, even parts more valuable for some, quite properly so. That's just me speaking for myself, on what I find valuable.

    However, I recommend speaking with minimal emotionally intensifying hooks, so that others may, at their own pace and choosing, find scattered about this forum a few more nuggets of useful information, analysis, insight, understanding, awareness or support ... which will fuel their own inner energies to drive their passions in the directions of their choosing.

    Trying to directly transfer the high heat of the passion destroys more than it empowers. It drives the readers insane (as you just noticed.)

    We don't transfer the high heat of exploding gasoline or diesel to our vehicles. We transfer cold liquids. The vehicle then determines if it is an auto, a motorcycle or a backhoe.
    My quite dormant website: pauljackson.us

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    Australia Avalon Member panopticon's Avatar
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    I absolutely love these sort of articles. They give me a glimpse into the mind of someone who thinks so differently to me. That's a genuinely beautiful thing. People who rail against these sort of articles I reckon should be taking advantage of the opportunity they offer not decrying them.

    Often I read here how people can't understand how the "elite" or "powers that be" think. If you've read this article and reacted in a negative way then maybe start with it as a first step. (To be clear I don't think Anthony Martin is an acolyte of an elite cabal or similar, just a Reaganite declaring his allegiance to his dead hero).

    This sort of article is exactly what I would expect from the author, who describes himself as "an original foot-soldier in 'the Reagan Revolution' that led to the election of Ronald Reagan" (source). Anthony Martin, the author of this piece, said back on September 19th, 2013 that his readership was dropping off (source) so maybe he's upped the ante to try an increase his readership. This is typical conservative/neo-con rhetoric and while I am not overly familiar with his writings or his evangelical church (there are so many writers in the US who present extreme views that it's hard to know them all) his techniques are so familiar that I feel comfortable with his style.

    Martin writes to his audience and in so doing hopes that by "word of mouth" (in modern parlance that would mean "social networking") he is able to increase his readership. Notice how he targets a specific audience in his first paragraph and then talks to that audience. This is a well trod path that develops on the initial theme (the US has enemies that have almost succeeded in destroying it) which has been used by US writers and politicians for a very long time (Reagan was an expert at it). The introduction of an "inside source" who declares it is all a long conspiracy that will destroy the US of A by 2016 if you, my dear reader, does nothing to challenge them. Then in typical Reaganite fashion forgets that the cold war is over and blame those Commies/Ruskies/Reds.

    I've read a number of his articles now and they are almost all the same: progressives/Marxists/collectivists have almost taken over the good ol' US of A and they want to increase centralised government and taxes while restricting your freedom, free speech, free enterprise, capitalism, bill of rights, etc... Watch out for the Nazi's and Communists, they're almost here. It's like he looks back fondly and has forgotten the Reagan administrations support of the Contras through the CIA...

    There actually is an enemy and it has been focused on. There is growing evidence that a ruling elite govern with almost complete impunity. There definitely are a small number of corporations (147 at last report, though that number may have decreased of late) that have a major influence on financial markets and from that exert power and control (source). The problem with Mr Martin is he has focused on his old enemy and thinks his comrades (irony) are the answer. In reality he is just misleading/misdirecting his audience and as they become more aware of the situation they are going elsewhere to find answers/truth. There is no free enterprise, it is an illusion promoted by those who rule. There is no free market beyond that allowed by those who rule.

    Mr Martin is right though. The progressive agenda has been high-jacked. Unfortunately the conservative agenda was re-written long ago (even before Ayn Rand) and now there is really only the one platform, just with a couple of sides to it...

    So, read and try to understand Mr Martin or someone who has a completely different view on the world to you (I like to read Gina Rinehart's diatribes periodically just for this reason). That way you might be able to view the world briefly in a similar, though limited, way to them.

    Once you can do that then try the mindset of some of those who are in positions of power.

    Remember: It's all about Money, Control and Power.
    Kind Regards,
    Panopticon
    "What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence.
    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by Carmody (here)
    Note, in this article, that one cannot tell the difference between a Marxist, a communist, a capitalist, a liberal, a republican, a neocon, or a fascist.

    There is a sound reason for that.
    Yeah, they are ALL Collectivists.

    Some of you are off base about your labels. You are too focused on how you associate yourselves. I used to think of myself as a progressive until I gained enough knowledge and experience to see that 1) the label didn't fit and 2) many people who called themselves progressive really weren't and 3) the powers that be use and encourage these labels JUST to keep us bickering over irrelevant bull**** instead of understanding we are on the SAME team.
    The Power in this world doesn't adhere to any political lables. Well, maybe, Haves and Haves not.

    My guess is that if you put aside your labels and just look at your interests and beliefs, you will see that your label category is inadequate and we have far more similar than different.

    I also recommend you learn about Collectivism. Here is G. Edward Griffin explaining:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAdu0N1-tvU

    Matt
    Last edited by Matt P; 23rd March 2014 at 13:23.
    Fear is simply a consequence of a lack of information.

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    United States Avalon Member Dennis Leahy's Avatar
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    This article and Jack's opening post underscores one of the main reasons I have begun to use the terms "citizen-centric" and "eco-centric" to identify thinking that is based on the perspective of the ordinary citizen and of the environment/ecosphere, and use the term "corporate-centric" to identify thinking that is Elite-based, greed-based, oppressive, top-of-the-pyramid thinking.

    It is no longer possible to use terms like "progressive" without dredging up the deliberately misapplied ideological views of neoliberal oppression.

    One way I have explained the war of labels is to say that in the original sense of the words, there was a linear, 2D, straight line that could be used to describe a polar scale: on one end of the line was "liberal", which in the US (that word means different things regionally, and has for many years) meant pro-citizen, and the other end of the line was "conservative" and meant pro-business. "Conservative" (I believe) was the first of the two terms to be hijacked, and was successfully hijacked by religious fundamentalists. To distinguish the thinking of the militaristic, oppressive, greed-based Elite - who want everything privatized to make a buck off of everything, and imperialistically see the entire planet as their property - the term "neo-conservative" came into vogue. Of course, this term needed its polar opposite, so it begat "neo-liberal", and rather than be applied to some new ("neo") twist on liberal thinking, it really was better suited to describe the covertly militaristic, oppressive, greed-based Elite who pretend to be citizen-centric (in speech only.) This leads to a new way for us regular folks to visualize what was once an ideological divide that could be shown as a 2D polar scale. Now, the "divide" between these words can best be described as:

    Visualize the 2D liberal/conservative scale. Add "neo-liberal" to the extreme left end (beyond liberal), and "neo-conservative" to the extreme right end. Now, grab both ends and bend them into a 3D hoop shape where the ends are nearly touching. Actually, the ends are not just touching, they overlap and merge, but that reality is only for eyes that truly see - most people would have a difficult enough time visualizing that neoliberal and neocon are, in effect, the same thing.

    Cognitive dissonance prevents many US citizens from recognizing that the foreign and domestic policy of the current neoliberals in power is identical to the foreign and domestic policy of the neocons they displaced. Value judgments of policy and action are tied to the labels: when a missile from a drone blows a number of innocent Arabs to bits, it then only becomes wrong if someone from the opposite ideology from my own ordered the hit.

    The author of the article is completely confused about terminology, and cannot figure out who the enemy really is. Note the erroneous attribution that these words are interchangeable: "Liberals, collectivists, statists, Marxists, neo-Marxists, socialists, and "democratic consensus builders""

    Quote Posted by (from the article)
    Progressives are known under a variety of names. Liberals, collectivists, statists, Marxists, neo-Marxists, socialists, and "democratic consensus builders" are some of the more common terms that people who stand for freedom and liberty have used to describe progressives. But it all boils down to the same thing. In order for them to achieve their self-described utopia, human freedom and liberty must be severely restricted and controlled, and the power of the centralized government must be greatly strengthened.
    It would be comedic if not so serious in its implications. All of these labels are now worthless, deliberately used to describe their own opposites to confuse people - and the author of that article is mighty confused. If citizens actually did unite and throw-off the common enemy (the Elite), we would be left with an ideological divide that, it appears to me, may not have a gray/overlap zone. With the Elite out of power, I suspect the US would need to divide into 2 countries: one for those espousing true anarchy (no government at all), utter individualism, complete privitization of all land and all resources, no taxes or any form of forced/structured sharing or co-ownership, and another country for those that espouse true democratic socialism (government of the people), privatized/ownership of personal property and collective/social co-ownership of resources and infrastructure - maintained through taxation. From what I have gleaned, I suspect that these two countries will need to form, that these ideas and ideals need to be played-out in real-world reality (theorizing won't be enough.)

    Maybe both countries could work, I don't know. But, neither will work if the Elite sink their neoliberal/neoconservative, militaristic, oppressive, greed-based Elite claws in and start back up with siphoning to the top of the pyramid. Yeah, I know who the enemy is.

    Dennis


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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Its extremely difficult to debate the (Progressive) issue, when not one of you can set out...

    Quote
    a) What being a (Progressive) actually means..? (In your 'Own' words)

    &

    b) What kind of (Policies) you are supposed to support..?
    PS - The only (Progressives I Know) are the (Criminal Politicians) who wave the (Progressive Flag) every chance they get, whilst gladly (Throwing Money Down the Drain) while they're at it...

    If you want me to answer your queries on an individual basis, could you please keep your questions short and to the point and I will reciprocate likewise...
    Last edited by jackovesk; 23rd March 2014 at 14:23.

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    sgr4gvferf
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by mpennery (here)
    ... deleted ...
    I had replied to your question here, but just to say I didn't make sense of it.

    Then I saw you wanted that post deleted. Only forum admins and mods can actually delete posts, so I've just now deleted that post of yours.

    ¤=[Post Update]=¤

    Quote Posted by mpennery (here)
    sgr4gvferf
    er - eh - could we have a translation ?
    Last edited by ThePythonicCow; 23rd March 2014 at 14:09.
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    [...]sgr4gvferf[...]

    er - eh - could we have a translation ?
    ... adds up to 10 random "characters"... for being able to post the "edit."
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Dialog abounds, in circles it flows, when wisdom says self, the misgiven say foe!

    Peace!
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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)
    Actually, the ends are not just touching, they overlap and merge, but that reality is only for eyes that truly see - most people would have a difficult enough time visualizing that neoliberal and neocon are, in effect, the same thing.
    That's a good point Dennis. Neo-liberalism has nothing to do with liberalism. It's a version of free market economics that supports deregulation etc. popularised by Friedman/Hayek and first trialled in Pinochet's Chile. There are good documentary's by Pilger and particularly The Trap by Adam Curtis (pt 1) that touch on this for anyone who's interested. So, someone can be a neo-conservative who practices neo-liberal economics.

    -- Pan
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    The only consequence is what we do."

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by mpennery (here)
    sgr4gvferf
    That's an easy one 'mpennery'...

    Back at ya...

    ewyaunikdetr...

    There's actually an Aussie message in there for you to decipher...
    Last edited by jackovesk; 23rd March 2014 at 14:43.

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by jackovesk (here)
    Its extremely difficult to debate the (Progressive) issue, when not one of you can set out...

    Quote
    a) What being a (Progressive) actually means..? (In your 'Own' words)

    &

    b) What kind of (Policies) you are supposed to support..?
    PS - The only (Progressives I Know) are the (Criminal Politicians) who wave the (Progressive Flag) every chance they get, whilst gladly (Throwing Money Down the Drain) while they're at it...

    If you want me to answer your queries on an individual basis, could you please keep your questions short and to the point and I will reciprocate likewise...
    Jack, I think the difficult part is that you seem to be critiquing the PTB power structure as a whole, and then mis-attributing the conspiracy to "progressive ideology."

    Do you think that these power-hungry psychopaths are unique to the "left-leaning" political spectrum? Do you harken back to the halcyon days of good conservative values, like when George W. Bush was President?

    The problem is not "progressive ideology," or conservative ideology, it's that both parties are controlled by the same interests.

    These articles read like fear-porn for stuck-in-the-Matrix conservatives to me, and it's only intended to keep people firmly stuck there. As long as they're running around blaming "the MARXIST, KENYAN, SOCIALIST, MUSLIN, KENYAN, COMMUNIST" for all of America's problems, well -- it's painfully clear, they're just as asleep as anyone else.

    This is all just a side-show, meant to keep you arguing in circles about what brand of political oppression you're experiencing as they throw on your shackles.
    Last edited by outerheaven; 23rd March 2014 at 14:42.

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Good Night all...

    I'm now going to (Progressively) navigate my way to yet another blissful slumber...

    Don't worry, I've put together a couple of (Ice Cold - Ear Packs ) to stop the burning whilst absent...

    Play Hard - Be Fair - But 'Above All' be kind to one another...
    Last edited by jackovesk; 23rd March 2014 at 14:45.

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    Default Re: ‘You Have No Idea How Bad It Is,’ Says 'Ex-Spook' On Destruction Of US..!

    Quote Posted by panopticon (here)

    This sort of article is exactly what I would expect from the author, who describes himself as "an original foot-soldier in 'the Reagan Revolution' that led to the election of Ronald Reagan" (source). Anthony Martin, the author of this piece, said back on September 19th, 2013 that his readership was dropping off (source) so maybe he's upped the ante to try an increase his readership. This is typical conservative/neo-con rhetoric and while I am not overly familiar with his writings or his evangelical church (there are so many writers in the US who present extreme views that it's hard to know them all) his techniques are so familiar that I feel comfortable with his style.
    I take no issue with the author's affiliations. I don't see him advocating for an ideology consistent with Ronald Reagan or the evangelical church, mainly because he doesn't say so or even advance any such implication, even subtly (and to be fair to your conclusion, I have not read any of his other articles). Any connection to neo-conservatives or even Reagan-esqe conservatism would be purely inferential based on what we think we know about the author. The ideas in this article are just as much a critique on Reaganism (as long as we can't escape labels) and on the evangelical church, as far as I'm concerned, as they are a critique on collectivism. How do I know this? Because Ronald Reagan was a collectivist.

    Quote Posted by panopticon (here)

    I've read a number of his articles now and they are almost all the same: progressives/Marxists/collectivists have almost taken over the good ol' US of A and they want to increase centralised government and taxes while restricting your freedom, free speech, free enterprise, capitalism, bill of rights, etc... Watch out for the Nazi's and Communists, they're almost here.
    I wouldn't necessarily use his terms, or point to any one group or ideology (save for maybe collectivists), but..ahh...what he's saying here happens to be true. I can't fault the author for that. Whatever you want to call it, those who have commandeered government do "...want to increase centralised government and taxes while restricting your freedom, free speech, free enterprise, capitalism, bill of rights, etc.."

    Quote Posted by panopticon (here)

    It's like he looks back fondly and has forgotten the Reagan administrations support of the Contras through the CIA...
    Another inference? Again, I haven't read any of his other articles so maybe I'm not reading into to this as much as you are. Even so, if he is secretly advocating for the policies of Reagan (I do not see this explicitly implied, but I'll assume this is the tacit motive based on your judgement) then he is fully a hypocrite and very misguided. But even so, that doesn't invalidate the ideas in this article. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

    Quote Posted by panopticon (here)

    There actually is an enemy and it has been focused on. There is growing evidence that a ruling elite govern with almost complete impunity. There definitely are a small number of corporations (147 at last report, though that number may have decreased of late) that have a major influence on financial markets and from that exert power and control (source). The problem with Mr Martin is he has focused on his old enemy and thinks his comrades (irony) are the answer. In reality he is just misleading/misdirecting his audience and as they become more aware of the situation they are going elsewhere to find answers/truth. There is no free enterprise, it is an illusion promoted by those who rule. There is no free market beyond that allowed by those who rule.
    Yep. Agree here. You have zeroed in on the target. I'm still confused, however, and fail to see how the ideas in this article don't specifically zero in on the same enemy.

    The bottom line is all ideologies have been highjacked and are quite easy to commandeer through the auspices of centralized government. This is just the residue of human nature. I take little issue with any ideology, in the abstract. I've read plenty of Marx. I've read plenty of Ayn Rand. The ideas at each end of the political spectrum and anywhere in-between are not the problem. But centralized government, on the other hand, and collectivism in general, are not humanity's friend.

    For anyone who may disagree, or still maintain a belief that is somehow possible to employ government, as a tool, to advance a benevolent agenda or perhaps make the world a better place, I highly recommend watching the Netflix television series, House of Cards, with Kevin Spacey/Robin Wright. It is only a television series, but an elevated one that accurately explores the dialectic between the sociopathic and empathic aspect of human nature. This is certainly the Arts at its best attempt at depicting the political reality of human nature.
    Last edited by T Smith; 23rd March 2014 at 16:12.

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