Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

[Cosmored]

Loungelizard

What you posted is second-hand info that might or might not be true. It's useless when it comes to proving something. The only thing that can actually prove or disprove a theory is the physical evidence such as this.


https://codoh.com/library/document/t...r-illusion/en/
(excerpt)
-------------------------------
In 1988 the scientific team of Fred Leuchter (a US execution-expert "Mr Death" in gas-chamber technology) visited Poland, and concluded that the Auschwitz "gas chambers" could not possibly have functioned in the alleged manner – i.e., they were not gas chambers[2]. In the following years, others would confirm the accuracy of his seminal, "Leuchter Report" . The German chemist Germar Rudolf, who worked at the Max Plank institute for Solid State Physics, is now in jail, because he likewise measured the high levels of the cyanide in the walls of the de-lousing chambers. It happens that this gas bonds permanently with iron, and iron is present in all the cement etc of stone walls. Whereas, he found none in the walls of what were supposed to be the "gas chambers" which were mainly shower units. He thereby confirmed the work of Leuchter who likewise only found remains of the cyanide gas-insecticide in the de-lousing chambers

[loungelizard]

Posted by Cosmored (here)
Loungelizard

What you posted is second-hand info that might or might not be true.

You’ve got that the wrong way round.

My post references first hand information - a primary source - from the Report of the International Committee Of The Red Cross On Its Activities During The Second World War, Volume 1, page 594
as proof that the excerpt you posted is misleading and deceptive.

Your post, on the other hand, is an article about a report - a discredited, pseudo-scientific report - which makes that a secondary (if not tertiary) source.

Posted by Cosmored (here)
It's useless when it comes to proving something.

How can secondary sources be "useless"?

Posted by Cosmored (here)
The only thing that can actually prove or disprove a theory is the physical evidence such as this.
https://codoh.com/library/document/t...r-illusion/en/

Kollerstrom’s article is not “physical evidence”.

And physical evidence is obviously not the only way in which we can understand historical events.

Posted by Cosmored (here)
In 1988 the scientific team of Fred Leuchter (a US execution-expert "Mr Death" in gas-chamber technology) visited Poland, and concluded that the Auschwitz "gas chambers" could not possibly have functioned in the alleged manner – i.e., they were not gas chambers[2]. In the following years, others would confirm the accuracy of his seminal, "Leuchter Report" . The German chemist Germar Rudolf, who worked at the Max Plank institute for Solid State Physics, is now in jail, because he likewise measured the high levels of the cyanide in the walls of the de-lousing chambers. It happens that this gas bonds permanently with iron, and iron is present in all the cement etc of stone walls. Whereas, he found none in the walls of what were supposed to be the "gas chambers" which were mainly shower units. He thereby confirmed the work of Leuchter who likewise only found remains of the cyanide gas-insecticide in the de-lousing chambers

You have posted this excerpt no less than FOUR times on this thread Are you on commission from Fraudulent Fred??!

Please show a little more respect for the members here: that report has been discredited time and time again. Even the title is a lie: the London edition of was entitled "Auschwitz:The End of the Line: The Leuchter Report - The First Forensic Examination of Auschwitz."

The truth is that the first forensic examinations were done in 1945 by the Cracow Forensic Institute.

Leuchter has been exposed as a charlatan and a thief: he finally confessed "I am not and have never been registered as a professional engineer".
His report is junk. Simples. Let's move on.


So. Any more thoughts about your claim that ICRC report found "no evidence whatever at the camps in Axis-occupied Europe of a deliberate policy to exterminate the Jews" which has been proven to be untrue?

[Cosmored]

Your post, on the other hand, is an article about a report - a discredited, pseudo-scientific report - which makes that a secondary (if not tertiary) source.

I've seen people try to obfuscate it to make it look like it's been discredited, but I've never seen it actually discredited.

Documents and written testimonies of witnesses can't be used as conclusive proof as the people who write documents can lie and witnesses can be bribed or threatened. Your attitude is authoritarian and patronizing but your actual argument is very weak.

I'm mainly continuing to post stuff I find here for the viewers' sake. I don't think your arguments are having much impact on what the viewers think.

I might as well say it. I think you're a paid sophist who doesn't even believe his own arguments.
https://www.clubconspiracy.com/count...ues-t4702.html

[The Moss Trooper]

Posted by Cosmored (here)

Your post, on the other hand, is an article about a report - a discredited, pseudo-scientific report - which makes that a secondary (if not tertiary) source.

I've seen people try to obfuscate it to make it look like it's been discredited, but I've never seen it actually discredited.

Documents and written testimonies of witnesses can't be used as conclusive proof as the people who write documents can lie and witnesses can be bribed or threatened. Your attitude is authoritarian and patronizing but your actual argument is very weak.

I'm mainly continuing to post stuff I find here for the viewers' sake. I don't think your arguments are having much impact on what the viewers think.

I might as well say it. I think you're a paid sophist who doesn't even believe his own arguments.
https://www.clubconspiracy.com/count...ues-t4702.html

Oh dear.

You weren't doing too badly, up until this point. Once you start to assume things it's a slippery slope.

[loungelizard]

Posted by The Moss Trooper (here)

Posted by Cosmored (here)

Your post, on the other hand, is an article about a report - a discredited, pseudo-scientific report - which makes that a secondary (if not tertiary) source.

I've seen people try to obfuscate it to make it look like it's been discredited, but I've never seen it actually discredited.

Documents and written testimonies of witnesses can't be used as conclusive proof as the people who write documents can lie and witnesses can be bribed or threatened. Your attitude is authoritarian and patronizing but your actual argument is very weak.

I'm mainly continuing to post stuff I find here for the viewers' sake. I don't think your arguments are having much impact on what the viewers think.

I might as well say it. I think you're a paid sophist who doesn't even believe his own arguments.
https://www.clubconspiracy.com/count...ues-t4702.html

Oh dear.

You weren't doing too badly, up until this point. Once you start to assume things it's a slippery slope.

Isn't it always the case? If you can't refute the evidence, attack the person

[loungelizard]

Here's question 5 for you, Cosmored.

In your own words rather than just cutting and pasting someone else's, what do you understand by these extracts from Himmler's secret Posen Speeches to the SS on 4th & 6th October 1943?

There are transcripts and recordings available, but in case you've never heard of them, here are a couple of excerpts:


4th October 1943
“I am now referring to the evacuation of the Jews, the extermination of the Jewish people. It's one of those things that is easily said: 'The Jewish people are being exterminated', says every party member, 'this is very obvious, it's in our program, elimination of the Jews, extermination, we're doing it, hah, a small matter.' And then they turn up, the upstanding 80 million Germans, and each one has his decent Jew. They say the others are all swines, but this particular one is a splendid Jew. But none has observed it, endured it. Most of you here know what it means when 100 corpses lie next to each other, when there are 500 or when there are 1,000. To have endured this and at the same time to have remained a decent person — with exceptions due to human weaknesses — has made us tough, and is a glorious chapter that has not and will not be spoken of. Because we know how difficult it would be for us if we still had Jews as secret saboteurs, agitators and rabble-rousers in every city, what with the bombings, with the burden and with the hardships of the war. If the Jews were still part of the German nation, we would most likely arrive now at the state we were at in 1916 and 17 […]”


6th October 1943
"I ask of you that that which I say to you in this circle be really only heard and not ever discussed. We were faced with the question: what about the women and children? – I decided to find a clear solution to this problem too. I did not consider myself justified to exterminate the men – in other words, to kill them or have them killed and allow the avengers of our sons and grandsons in the form of their children to grow up. The difficult decision had to be made to have this people disappear from the earth. For the organisation which had to execute this task, it was the most difficult which we had ever had. [...] I felt obliged to you, as the most superior dignitary, as the most superior dignitary of the party, this political order, this political instrument of the Führer, to also speak about this question quite openly and to say how it has been. The Jewish question in the countries that we occupy will be solved by the end of this year. Only remainders of odd Jews that managed to find hiding places will be left over."

[Cosmored]

So. Any more thoughts about your claim that ICRC report found "no evidence whatever at the camps in Axis-occupied Europe of a deliberate policy to exterminate the Jews" which has been proven to be untrue?

I'm a bit busy now but here's something that the viewers can check out.
file:///C:/Users/David/Downloads/Report%20ICRC%201939-1947%20-%20scan%20&%20summary.pdf

[loungelizard]

Posted by Cosmored (here)

So. Any more thoughts about your claim that ICRC report found "no evidence whatever at the camps in Axis-occupied Europe of a deliberate policy to exterminate the Jews" which has been proven to be untrue?

I'm a bit busy now but here's something that the viewers can check out.
file:///C:/Users/David/Downloads/Report%20ICRC%201939-1947%20-%20scan%20&%20summary.pdf

You already posted that and I told you it's not available ... https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1384088

That makes me suspect you don't read anything I post here

[Cosmored]

You already posted that and I told you it's not available

When I click on the link, it doesn't work. When I copy and paste it, it works.

[loungelizard]

Posted by Cosmored (here)

You already posted that and I told you it's not available

When I click on the link, it doesn't work. When I copy and paste it, it works.

It isn't a link so there's no point in clicking on it. Copy and paste? Nope - you get this:



But don't worry - it won't be worth looking at ...

[Cosmored]

I just copied and pasted it again and it worked.
file:///C:/Users/David/Downloads/Report%20ICRC%201939-1947%20-%20scan%20&%20summary.pdf

I'm not very technical. I can't explain it.

[The Moss Trooper]

Posted by Cosmored (here)
I just copied and pasted it again and it worked.
file:///C:/Users/David/Downloads/Report%20ICRC%201939-1947%20-%20scan%20&%20summary.pdf

I'm not very technical. I can't explain it.

I'm getting the same result with the links you post, I get the "Page Failed to Open" message each time I copy and paste your links.

[Cosmored]

It has photocopies of pages 641 to 657 of the Red Cross report.

The title page:

Report of the International Committee of the Red Cross on its activities during the Second world War(September 1, 1939 - June 30, 1947) Volume 1 GENERAL ACTIVITIES

This is below those pages.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A Factual Appraisal of the 'Holocaust' by the Red Cross
The Jews and the Concentration Camps:
No Evidence of Genocide
There is one survey of the Jewish question in Europe during World War Two and the
conditions of Germany's concentration camps which is almost unique in its honesty and
objectivity, the three-volume Report of the International Committee of the Red Cross
on its Activities during the Second World War, Geneva, 1948.

This comprehensive account from an entirely neutral source incorporated and expanded
the findings of two previous works: Documents sur l'activité du CICR en faveur des
civils détenus dans les camps de concentration en Allemagne 1939-1945 (Geneva,
1946), and Inter Arma Caritas: the Work of the ICRC during the Second World War
(Geneva, 1947). The team of authors, headed by Frédéric Siordet, explained in the
opening pages of the Report that their object, in the tradition of the Red Cross, had been
strict political neutrality, and herein lies its great value.

The ICRC successfully applied the 1929 Geneva military convention in order to gain
access to civilian internees held in Central and Western Europe by the Germany
authorities. By contrast, the ICRC was unable to gain any access to the Soviet Union,
which had failed to ratify the Convention. The millions of civilian and military internees held
in the USSR, whose conditions were known to be by far the worst, were completely cut off
from any international contact or supervision.

The Red Cross Report is of value in that it first clarifies the legitimate circumstances under
which Jews were detained in concentration camps, i.e. as enemy aliens. In describing the
two categories of civilian internees, the Report distinguishes the second type as "Civilians
deported on administrative grounds (in German, "Schutzhäftlinge"), who were arrested for
political or racial motives because their presence was considered a danger to the State or
the occupation forces" (Vol. III, p. 73). These persons, it continues, "were placed on the
same footing as persons arrested or imprisoned under common law for security reasons."
(Vol. III, p. 74).

The Report admits that the Germans were at first reluctant to permit supervision by the
Red Cross of people detained on grounds relating to security, but by the latter part of 1942,
the ICRC obtained important concessions from Germany. They were permitted to distribute
food parcels to major concentration camps in Germany from August 1942, and "from
February 1943 onwards this concession was extended to all other camps and prisons"
(Vol. III, p. 78). The ICRC soon established contact with camp commandants and launched
a food relief programme which continued to function until the last months of 1945, letters of
thanks for which came pouring in from Jewish internees.

Red Cross Recipients Were Jews
The Report states that "As many as 9,000 parcels were packed daily. >From the autumn
of 1943 until May 1945, about 1,112,000 parcels with a total weight of 4,500 tons were
sent off to the concentration camps" (Vol. III, p. 80). In addition to food, these contained
clothing and pharmaceutical supplies. "Parcels were sent to Dachau, Buchenwald,
Sangerhausen, Sachsenhausen, Oranienburg, Flossenburg, Landsberg-am-Lech, Flöha,
Ravensbrück, Hamburg-Neuengamme, Mauthausen, Theresienstadt, Auschwitz, Bergen-
Belsen, to camps near Vienna and in Central and Southern Germany. The principal
recipients were Belgians, Dutch, French, Greeks, Italians, Norwegians, Poles and stateless
Jews" (Vol. III, p. 83).

In the course of the war, "The Committee was in a position to transfer and distribute in the
form of relief supplies over twenty million Swiss francs collected by Jewish welfare
organizations throughout the world, in particular by the American Joint Distribution
Committee of New York" (Vol. I, p. 644). This latter organization was permitted by the
German Government to maintain offices in Berlin until the American entry into the war. The
ICRC complained that obstruction of their vast relief operation for Jewish internees came
not from the Germans but from the tight Allied blockade of Europe. Most of their purchases
of relief food were made in Rumania, Hungary and Slovakia.

The ICRC had special praise for the liberal conditions which prevailed at Theresienstadt up
to the time of their last visits there in April 1945. This camp, "where there were about
40,000 Jews deported from various countries was a relatively privileged ghetto" (Vol. III, p.
75). According to the Report, "'The Committee's delegates were able to visit the camp at
Theresienstadt (Terezin) which was used exclusively for Jews and was governed by
special conditions. From information gathered by the Committee, this camp had been
started as an experiment by certain leaders of the Reich ... These men wished to give the
Jews the means of setting up a communal life in a town under their own administration and
possessing almost complete autonomy. . . two delegates were able to visit the camp on
April 6th, 1945. They confirmed the favourable impression gained on the first visit" (Vol. I,
p. 642).

The ICRC also had praise for the regime of Ion Antonescu of Fascist Rumania where the
Committee was able to extend special relief to 183,000 Rumanian Jews until the time of
the Soviet occupation. The aid then ceased, and the ICRC complained bitterly that it never
succeeded "in sending anything whatsoever to Russia" (Vol. II, p. 62). The same situation
applied to many of the German camps after their "liberation" by the Russians. The ICRC
received a voluminous flow of mail from Auschwitz until the period of the Soviet
occupation, when many of the internees were evacuated westward. But the efforts of the
Red Cross to send relief to internees remaining at Auschwitz under Soviet control were
futile. However, food parcels continued to be sent to former Auschwitz inmates transferred
west to such camps as Buchenwald and Oranienburg.

No Evidence Of Genocide
One of the most important aspects of the Red Cross Report is that it clarifies the true
cause of those deaths that undoubtedly occurred in the camps toward the end of the war.
Says the Report: "In the chaotic condition of Germany after the invasion during the final
months of the war, the camps received no food supplies at all and starvation claimed an
increasing number of victims. Itself alarmed by this situation, the German Government at
last informed the ICRC on February 1st, 1945 ... In March 1945, discussions between the
President of the ICRC and General of the S.S. Kaltenbrunner gave even more decisive
results. Relief could henceforth be distributed by the ICRC, and one delegate was
authorised to stay in each camp ..." (Vol. III, p. 83).

Clearly, the German authorities were at pains to relieve the dire situation as far as they
were able. The Red Cross are quite explicit in stating that food supplies ceased at this time
due to the Allied bombing of German transportation, and in the interests of interned Jews
they had protested on March 15th, 1944 against "the barbarous aerial warfare of the Allies"
(Inter Arma Caritas, p. 78). By October 2nd, 1944, the ICRC warned the German Foreign
Office of the impending collapse of the German transportation system, declaring that
starvation conditions for people throughout Germany were becoming inevitable.

In dealing with this comprehensive, three-volume Report, it is important to stress that the
delegates of the International Red Cross found no evidence whatever at the camps in Axis
occupied Europe of a deliberate policy to exterminate the Jews. In all its 1,600 pages the
Report does not even mention such a thing as a gas chamber. It admits that Jews, like
many other wartime nationalities, suffered rigours and privations, but its complete silence
on the subject of planned extermination is ample refutation of the Six Million legend. Like
the Vatican representatives with whom they worked, the Red Cross found itself unable to
indulge in the irresponsible charges of genocide which had become the order of the day.
So far as the genuine mortality rate is concerned, the Report points out that most of the
Jewish doctors from the camps were being used to combat typhus on the eastern front, so
that they were unavailable when the typhus epidemics of 1945 broke out in the camps
(Vol. I, p. 204 ff) - Incidentally, it is frequently claimed that mass executions were carried
out in gas chambers cunningly disguised as shower facilities. Again the Report makes
nonsense of this allegation. "Not only the washing places, but installations for baths,
showers and laundry were inspected by the delegates. They had often to take action to
have fixtures made less primitive, and to get them repaired or enlarged" (Vol. III, p. 594).

Not All Were Interned
Volume III of the Red Cross Report, Chapter 3 (I. Jewish Civilian Population) deals with the
"aid given to the Jewish section of the free population," and this chapter makes it quite
plain that by no means all of the European Jews were placed in internment camps, but
remained, subject to certain restrictions, as part of the free civilian population. This
conflicts directly with the "thoroughness" of the supposed "extermination programme", and
with the claim in the forged Höss memoirs that Eichmann was obsessed with seizing
"every single Jew he could lay his hands on."

In Slovakia, for example, where Eichmann's assistant Dieter Wisliceny was in charge, the
Report states that "A large proportion of the Jewish minority had permission to stay in the
country, and at certain periods Slovakia was looked upon as a comparative haven of
refuge for Jews, especially for those coming from Poland. Those who remained in Slovakia
seem to have been in comparative safety until the end of August 1944, when a rising
against the German forces took place. While it is true that the law of May 15th, 1942 had
brought about the internment of several thousand Jews, these people were held in camps
where the conditions of food and lodging were tolerable, and where the internees were
allowed to do paid work on terms almost equal to those of the free labour market" (Vol. I, p.
646).

Not only did large numbers of the three million or so European Jews avoid internment
altogether, but the emigration of Jews continued throughout the war, generally by way of
Hungary, Rumania and Turkey. Ironically, post-war Jewish emigration from Germanoccupied territories was also facilitated by the Reich, as in the case of the Polish Jews who
had escaped to France before its occupation. "The Jews from Poland who, whilst in
France, had obtained entrance permits to the United States were held to be American
citizens by the German occupying authorities, who further agreed to recognize the validity
of about three thousand passports issued to Jews by the consulates of South American
countries" (Vol. I, p. 645).

As future U.S. citizens, these Jews were held at the Vittel camp in southern France for
American aliens. The emigration of European Jews from Hungary in particular proceeded
during the war unhindered by the German authorities. "Until March 1944," says the. Red
Cross Report, "Jews who had the privilege of visas for Palestine were free to leave
Hungary" (Vol. I, p. 648). Even after the replacement of the Horthy Government in 1944
(following its attempted armistice with the Soviet Union) with a government more
dependent on German authority, the emigration of Jews continued.

The Committee secured the pledges of both Britain and the United States "to give support
by every means to the emigration of Jews from Hungary," and from the U.S. Government
the ICRC received a message stating that "The Government of the United States ... now
specifically repeats its assurance that arrangements will be made by it for the care of all
Jews who in the present circumstances are allowed to leave" (Vol. I, p. 649).

Biedermann agreed that in the nineteen instances that "Did Six Million Really Die?" quoted
from the Report of the International Committee of the Red Cross on its Activities during the
Second World War and Inter Arma Caritas (this includes the above material), it did so
accurately.

A quote from Charles Biedermann (a delegate of the International Committee of the Red
Cross and Director of the Red Cross' International Tracing Service) under oath at the
Zündel Trial (February 9, 10, 11 and 12, 1988).

The above is chapter nine from the book "Did Six Million Really Die?"

For the entire book "Did Six Million Really Die?", click here.
http://www.vancouver.indymedia.org/n.../03/122056.php

[Cosmored]

loungelizard just plays dumb when I post something important so I'm mainly just going to post stuff for the viewers to check out.

https://www.clubconspiracy.com/count...ues-t4702.html
(excerpt)
--------------------------------------------------------
9. Play Dumb. No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues with denial they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maximum effect.
--------------------------------------------------------


Here's something.

https://codoh.com/library/document/t...-holocaust/en/
(excerpt)
---------------------------------------------------------
As time passed and with the loosening of travel restrictions and communistic rigidity, the former concentration camps evolved some tourist trappings. People could travel to them - both west and east, tour their museums, and be guided through their facilities, both original and in postwar mockup. They could ask questions and ponder the significance of their surroundings. A small but determined sub-category of visitor known as 'revisionist' also inspected some of these camps, particularly Auschwitz, and even took forensic samples of the original structures which supposedly served as gassing facilities. The resultantly published work of Fred Leuchter, Germar Rudolf, and others, demonstrated that the chemical residues analyzed from these facilities were not consistent with the official account. Or put another way, the alleged mass gassings almost certainly did not take place. In consequence, the process of historical revisionism dictated that the numbers be dramatically reduced. A wide variety of other objections, not just the chemical residues of Zyklon B, necessitated the change in number, but at least the change did occur.

The authorities maintaining the Auschwitz camp indeed ultimately responded by revising the numbers downward. Suddenly the four million murdered dropped to an official figure of a little over a million. This is where the overall Holocaust story underwent another major evolution. In this latest twist, the Six Million figure somehow was retained - relating to a sort of mystic symbolism that seemingly has to be retained at all costs - and a shifting of how the figure was arrived at occurred. Suddenly the 3 million Jews killed within that 6 million figure, perished 'in the east' with little explanation and no statistical backing. While the Einsatzgruppen or ‘action groups’ (or ‘squads’) has grown in its significance the typical estimate of victims of these groups are between 1.3 and 2.2 million. As the story continues to shift and evolve it appears that the missing “victims” may yet be attributed to the Einsatzgruppen or even the German army.
---------------------------------------------------------------


edit
--------------------------------------------------

This is just second-hand info but who knows what really happened if we weren't there.

https://downwithjugears.blogspot.com...auschwitz.html
(excerpt)
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Supposedly the most dreaded of German camps, Auschwitz was repeatedly visited by Red Cross inspection teams who were allowed to speak to prisoner representatives alone, in order to hear first-hand of any mistreatment, chicanery, interruption of mail and parcel delivery, health concerns, food and ration matters etc. No such visits took place - ever! - to Soviet Gulag camps.

Auschwitz, the supposed "death camp," had many facilities amongst which were;

* A camp hospital to which expert surgeons even from the famous Berlin
"Charité" surgical clinic were dispatched to deal with difficult cases -

* Camp sick barracks, attended by camp inmate doctors and nurses to deal with the inmates' health problems - much like the now common walk-in clinics in modern US communities -

* A camp diet kitchen, one of the largest service buildings in Auschwitz, with state-of-the-art cooking facilities. (This building had 12 chimneys and can be visited today...)

* The caloric content of the diet was carefully monitored by camp and Red Cross delegates. It only deteriorated in Auschwitz and other camps towards the end of the war when German railroads and the entire transport system collapsed under constant aerial attacks -


edit
---------------------------------------------------

Look at the top post on this forum.
https://www.reddit.com/r/****thealtr...44_saying_the/


The above link doesn't work because of that dirty word it contains. Copy and paste this and close the spaces.

reddit (dot) com/r/F u c k thealtright/comments/ebqrby/a_letter_from_the_red_cross_in_1944_saying_the/


edit
---------------------------------------

https://truedemocracyparty.net/2012/...olocaust-hoax/
https://www.thinkinghousewife.com/20...-at-auschwitz/
https://codoh.com/library/document/a...al-account/en/
https://codoh.com/library/document/t...r-illusion/en/
https://codoh.com/library/categories...-gas-chambers/

[Cosmored]

In your own words rather than just cutting and pasting someone else's, what do you understand by these extracts from Himmler's secret Posen Speeches to the SS on 4th & 6th October 1943?

This doesn't make the physical evidence go away. It's second-hand info so it may or may not be bogus.

Here's one possible explanation.

https://allthatsinteresting.com/holocaust-deniers
(excerpt)
-------------------------------
First, they highlight what they view as translation errors — namely that the word “ausrottung” in Himmler’s speech does not mean exterminate, but deport. From there, Holocaust deniers say that Himmler did not talk about “exterminating” Jews, but “deporting” them.

While German language experts concede that there is flexibility in the term’s meaning in an abstract sense, when taken in the context of his subsequent remarks, they add that there is no way that Himmler could have meant anything besides extermination.
-------------------------------

This looks pretty heavy but physical proof trumps written or spoken words.

Look at post #2 of this forum to see some physical evidence.
http://www.flinttalk.com/viewtopic.php?t=12196&start=0

[Cosmored]

https://codoh.com/library/document/t...uth-or-lie/en/
(excerpt)
--------------------------------------
In this confession, the description of the actual gassing is remarkably short and vague. However, it is essential to realize that all those others who claim to have been present at this sort of an operation are also vague and brief and that their statements are full of contradictions on certain points. Rudolf Höss writes, "Half an hour after having released the gas, the door would be opened and the fan turned on. The bodies immediately began to be removed."[10] I call your attention to the word "immediately"; in German the word is sofort. Höss then adds that the crew in charge of handling and removing 2,000 bodies from the "gas chamber" and transporting them to the crematory ovens did so while "eating or smoking"; therefore, if I understand correctly, these duties were all performed without gas masks. Such a description runs counter to all common sense. It implies that it is possible to enter an area saturated with hydrocyanic acid without taking any precautionary measures in the barehanded handling of 2,000 cyanided cadavers which were probably still contaminated with the fatal gas. The hair (which was supposedly clipped after the operation) was undoubtedly impregnated with the gas. The mucous membranes would have been impregnated also. Air pockets between the bodies which were supposedly heaped one on top of the other would have been filled with the gas. What kind of superpowerful fan is able to instantly disperse so much gas drifting through the air and hidden in air pockets? Even if such a fan had existed, it would have been necessary to perform a test for the detection of any remaining hydrocyanic acid and to develop a procedure for informing the crew that the fan had actually fulfilled its function and that the room was safe. Now, it is abundantly clear from Höss' description that the fan in question must have been endowed with magical powers in order to be able to disperse all of the gas with such flawless performance so that there was no cause for concern or need for verification of the absence of the gas!

What mere common sense suggested is now confirmed by the technical documents concerning Zyklon B and its usage.[11] In order to fumigate a barrack, the Germans were constrained by numerous precautionary measures: specially trained teams which were licensed only after an internship at a Zyklon B manufacturing plant; special materials including especially the "J" filters which when used in gas masks were capable of protecting an individual under the most rigorous toxic conditions; evacuations of all surrounding barracks; warnings posted in several languages and bearing a skull and cross-bones; a meticulous examination of the site to be fumigated in order to locate and seal any fissures or openings; the sealing of any chimneys or airshafts and the removal of keys from doors. The cans of Zyklon B were opened at the site itself. After the gas had apparently killed all the vermin, the most critical operation would begin: this was the ventilation of the site. Sentries were to be stationed at a certain distance from all doors and windows, their backs to the wind, in order to prevent the approach of all persons. The specially trained crew equipped with gas masks would then enter the building and unclog the chimneys and cracks, and open the windows. This operation completed, they had to go outside again, remove their masks and breathe freely for ten minutes. They had to put their masks on again to re-enter the building and perform the next step. Once all of this work was completed, it was still necessary to wait TWENTY hours. Actually, because Zyklon B was "difficult to ventilate, since it adheres strongly to surfaces," the dispersion of the gas required a long natural ventilation. This was especially important when great volumes of the gas were employed as in the case of a barrack containing more than one floor. (When Zyklon B was used in an autoclave with a total volume of only 10 cubic meters, ventilation (forced or artificially) was still necessary.) After twenty hours had elapsed, the crew would return with their masks on. They would then verify by means of a paper test (the paper would turn blue in the presence of hydrocyanic acid) as to whether or not the site was indeed again fit for human habitation. And so we see that a site which had been gassed was not safely accessible until a minimum of 21 hours had elapsed. As far as French legislation is concerned, the minimum is set at 24 hours.[12]

It becomes, therefore, apparent that in the absence of a magical fan capable of instantly expelling a gas that is "difficult to ventilate, since it adheres strongly to surfaces," the "human slaughterhouse" called a "gas chamber" would have been inaccessible for nearly a full day. its walls, floors, ceiling would have retained portions of a gas which was highly poisonous to man. And what about the bodies? These cadavers could have been nothing less than saturated with the gas, just as the cushions, mattresses and blankets discussed in the same technical document on the use of Zyklon B would have been saturated also. These mattresses, etc., had to be taken out of doors to be aired and beaten for an hour under dry atmospheric conditions and for two hours when the weather was humid. When this was accomplished, these items were then heaped together and beaten again if the paper test revealed any further presence of hydrocyanic acid.

[loungelizard]

Posted by Cosmored (here)
A Factual Appraisal of the 'Holocaust' by the Red Cross
The Jews and the Concentration Camps:

You're always dismissing things as being "second hand information": this is a report of a report ... that makes this THIRD hand.
This report-of-a-report was not written by the Red Cross, despite its misleading title.

It's written by a Holocaust denier and white nationalist, Richard Verrall, under the pseudonym Harwood. He is the former
deputy chairman of the rather nasty far right British National Front.


Why not just go to the original report?

https://archive.org/details/ReportOf...7%29%20Vol%201

Verrall/Harwood has, of course, omitted all the key sections of this ICRC report which state that the Nazi regime was systematically
exterminating the Jews.


For anyone who is in any doubt that the roots of Holocaust denial lie in anti Semitism, here are few of the comments written under
Verrall/Harwood's article that show the audience this material is directed at (apologies for the vile nature of these - mods, please
remove if unsuitable):

• I WISH 6MM DID DIE
• The ONLY solution is to enforce The Plan.Now if you'll excuse me i'm off to polish my jackboots.
• The jews time is up.
• The Holocaust is evidence of what happens when jew liars fill us with fear and hate.
• does anyone doubt every last one of them deserves death?
• I'm in favor of murdering all the women (because of their "laws") so that never again will a disgusting, lying, murderous khazar squeeze out
• from a foul jewess' c**t ever, ever again.....let the effeminate males live to reap what they've sewn.....we can live without ecstacy, porn,
• debt, racial strife, hollowhoax movies......We can make our own corned beef sandwiches.
• Tattoos prove that they were NOT subject to genocide. You don't go to the trouble to tattoo people your are going to kill.
• KILL THE "JEWS" AND then we can get back to business
• Auschwitz Jews on their knees.
  

[loungelizard]

Posted by Cosmored (here)

In your own words rather than just cutting and pasting someone else's, what do you understand by these extracts from Himmler's secret Posen Speeches to the SS on 4th & 6th October 1943?

This doesn't make the physical evidence go away. It's second-hand info so it may or may not be bogus.

Call me dumb (again ) but I don't understand what you're saying here. What second hand info are you talking about?

[Cosmored]

Verrall/Harwood has, of course, omitted all the key sections of this ICRC report which state that the Nazi regime was systematically
exterminating the Jews.

Do you have the page numbers of the parts that say that? I'm kind of busy right now.

What do you think of post #336?

What do you think of all this info?
https://codoh.com/library/categories...-gas-chambers/

[loungelizard]

Posted by Cosmored (here)

Verrall/Harwood has, of course, omitted all the key sections of this ICRC report which state that the Nazi regime was systematically
exterminating the Jews.

Do you have the page numbers of the parts that say that? I'm kind of busy right now.

Certainly. I'll do more than that - using the excellent search facility, it took me all of 2 minutes to find a couple of examples:

"Under National Socialism, the Jews had become in truth outcasts, condemned by rigid racial legislation to suffer tyranny, persecution and systematic extermination...
They were penned into concentration camps and ghettos, recruited for forced labour, subjected to grave brutalities and sent to death camps, without anyone being
allowed to intervene in those matters which Germany and her allies considered to be exclusively within the bounds of their home policy. "(Volume 1, p. 641)

"In Germany and the countries occupied by her, or under her domination, especially Hungary, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Rumania and Jugoslavia 1, no other section of the population endured
such humiliation, privation and suffering. Deprived of all treaty protection, persecuted in accordance with the National-Socialist doctrine and threatened with extermination, the Jews were,
in the last resort, generally deported in the most inhuman manner, shut up in concentration camps, subjected to forced labour or put to death." (Volume 3, 513)

"At 7 a.m. the first group of one hundred women arrived - it was a terrible and pathetic sight to see these poor creatures, famished, dirty, frightened and suspicious - they could not believe
they were to be set free, and took me for an agent of the SS, sent to fetch them for the gas chamber."
(Volume 1, p. 625)

Posted by Cosmored (here)
What do you think of post #336?

Before we look at that, could you please respond in your own words to the evidence - in Himmler's Posen speech post 326 - of a plan to exterminate the Jews.

These extracts from the article you posted ( https://allthatsinteresting.com/holocaust-deniers ) suggest that you are finally beginning to understand what the Third Reich was actually doing:

"...there is no way that Himmler could have meant anything besides extermination."

"These speeches, which Himmler delivered in Posen, Poland, came to be known as the Posen speeches. Beyond survivors’ accounts and site remains, they provide some
of the most definitive proof that the German government consciously engaged in the systematic slaughter of millions of Jews."

"While German language experts concede that there is flexibility in the term’s meaning in an abstract sense, when taken in the context of his subsequent remarks,
they add that there is no way that Himmler could have meant anything besides extermination."

Posted by Cosmored (here)
What do you think of all this info?

You know what I think