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Thread: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    David Irving seems to be a bit of bigot and a racist and embellisher,and he has
    made several remarks that made me squirm. It maybe his age 76 and some of his
    views seem from another era. Aprox 35 mins they mention a poem he wrote
    adulating Hitler, then he says (paraphrasing) he was walking in a park with his 9
    month old child and saw a 'half cast' child which he said was a tragedy to inflict on
    civilisation. When the interviewer starts to question him about it Irving laughs and
    shrugs him off..( A must listen to reflect on Irvings character ) Listening to his
    comments in the two interviews I just posted and others he does not come over
    very well. But that does not disqualifying from expressing his views and
    researching, and he is not alone in his views, there are many that seem to share
    them.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    THE IRVING V LIPSTADT TRIAL - 2000 - BBC R4



    Published on 26 Feb 2013


    The 2000 libel trial in which David Irving decided to single-handedly sue Deborah
    Lipstadt for defaming him as a Holocaust denier, employing the principle that,
    if there was no Holocaust, then he couldn't be one!

    The trial lasted 32 days during which he employed revisionist evidence he clearly
    wasn't too familiar with, or at least had not fully investigated the veracity of, and
    a series of courtroom ploys, feints and traps which, if no-one spotted, he openly
    announced the pending arrival of. The rest is history.

    This is posted for educational interest, as commentary and news footage from
    the trial is rare.

    ================================================== ==


    David Irving's Holocaust Denial Libel Trial - Newsnight



    Published on 15 Feb 2014


    April 2000. Report on the case and live interviews with David Irving and Deborah Lippstadt.
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 24th August 2014 at 02:02.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    According to David Irving these holocaust survivors are LIARS !!!!!

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    CBS - 50 Million Holocaust records become public



    Published on 16 Feb 2013


    CBS 60 minutes report on the opening to the public of 50 million nazi Holocaust records.
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 5th December 2014 at 22:59.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Quote Posted by Cidersomerset (here)
    CBS - 50 Million Holocaust records become public
    I know that Gio may have wanted to keep the thread about the videos but when the sources used by the videos are tainted by an agenda, I feel the agenda is wanting to called out......

    The first time I heard about deniers of the intentional genocide perpetrated by the National Socialist German Workers' Party, my friend who was arguing the "numbers" and "did the "Holocaust" really happen?" was listening to people like David Irving. IMO, it is really important to call out denial of the intentional elimination of millions of people. IMO we cannot excuse inhumane actions of any person or group and ignore what leads up to genocide itself. This "genocidal" impulse is definitely NOT old history.

    In the archives released as shown in the video above, "professionalism" was demonstrated. Precise records kept, the desire to show how well one completed one's tasks. The professionals

    Quote are provided with ideologies that alter perceptions of reality in order to justify their lethal behavior. As my colleague Jeff Ferrell reminds us, “authority operates not only through prison cells and poverty, but by constructing and defending epistemologies of universality and truth.” [12]

    The state creates popular perceptions of right and wrong, good and evil, and works vigorously to reinforce and defend them. Ideological power is a formidable instrument in the creation of public support or condemnation. It provides a patina of legitimacy that serves to deflect much criticism. “Evil,” as Frank Hagan warns, “often gilds itself with an ideological gloss.” [13]

    In closing, we must ask why do these professionals serve genocide so well?

    First, we must recognize that many agree with the policies of destruction. Highly educated people are not immune to the biases and prejudices of the society in which they live.

    Second, we must understand that many see cooperation as a vehicle to advancement and professional development. Just as scholars today often tailor their research based on opportunities, resources, and “hot” topics, so too do professionals in genocidal societies.

    Third, it is important to note that science and bureaucracy are supposed to be amoral. Decisions and actions are supposed to be taken without reference to morality. Science is supposed to be objective, technical, rational, but not moral.

    Fourth, we must also remember that the complicity is not necessarily deliberate. Genocidal states are adept at picking, choosing, and manipulating the theories and concepts of scholars.Justifying Genocide: The Role of Professionals in Legitimizing Mass Killing
    This picking/choosing/manipulating is still at work on several world fronts IMO. And what about a trajectory of stages "theoretical and conceptual" that lead up to genocide and can we see them recurring??

    Denial is considered to be a phase of the stages of genocide itself:

    Quote The first is Classification, when we classify the world into us versus them.
    The second is Symbolization, when we give names to those classifications like Jew and Aryan, Hutu and Tutsi, Turk and Armenian. Sometimes the symbols are physical, like the Nazi yellow star.
    The third is Dehumanization, when perpetrators call their victims rats, or cockroaches, cancer, or disease; so eliminating them is actually seen as “cleansing” the society, rather than murder.
    The fourth is Organization, when hate groups, armies, and militias organize.
    The fifth is Polarization, when moderates are targeted who could stop the process, especially moderates from the perpetrators’ group.
    The sixth stage is Preparation, when the perpetrators are trained and armed, victims are identified, transported and concentrated.
    The seventh stage is Extermination, what we legally define as genocide, the intentional destruction, in whole or in part, of a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group...
    There is an eighth stage in every genocide: Denial. It is actually a continuation of the genocide, because it is a continuing attempt to destroy the victim group psychologically and culturally, to deny its members even the memory of the murders of their relatives.The Cost of Denial
    How does "denial" operate? This is taken from an article about denial of the Armenian genocide at the hands of the Turks in 1915 but fits the prototype of denial after the fact....

    Quote The tactics of genocide denial are predictable.....
    Question and minimize the statistics. Attack the motivations of the truth-teller. Blame “out of control” forces for committing the killings. Claim that the massacres don’t fit the legal definition of genocide, even if over a million people were killed.
    Blame the victims. Claim that the killings were in self-defense against people who were disloyal
    Claim that "the other side" also suffered many deaths......
    Claim that the deaths were inadvertent, due to lack of food and water, not due to intentional destruction
    Claim that current peace and reconciliation are more important than blaming past perpetrators for genocide.
    Most importantly, don’t tell the truth because to do so would not be in current political, economic, and military interests. www.genocidewatch.org/aboutus/thecostofdenial.html

    Edit Post


    I do not agree with what the US is doing now or the Israelis and I am not sure how we keep the focus off "Us against Them"? It is so seemingly ingrained but it has to stop somewhere.

    But I wanted to add this Trudell piece because he is talking about a "pro nuclear oppressor". So maybe any one who has loyalty to the power of the "system" is played by this oppressor.

    Last edited by Delight; 24th August 2014 at 03:29.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    As John Trudell say the war cycle seems to be becoming intencified again.
    the US in particular seems to be para militerising . There is already a
    National Guard and various militia groups. The military coup is already
    happening with the militarisation of the police and the division of the
    haves and have nots .As he points out America was built on the gun
    and the indigenous population was systematically fought and reduced
    in spirit and will for the first 200 years and now those not assimilated
    are scattered on various reservations.


    David Icke has been putting up articles for ages about all these
    events that seem manipulated certainly in the ever increasing
    severity of the response by authorities all over the US....

    The US are lining up to take action against in Iraq against ISIS.
    This includes possibly attacking them in Syria ,he also says
    borders are no barrier if US lives are at stake. Reffereing to
    the murder of the US journalist. This is in stark contrast to
    the wests views on Russia responding in the Ukraine, who
    have had deaths of it citizens in the border area by stray shells.....


    I just saw these articles on Davids site and they are all linked to
    current events imo. Classic Problem Reaction Solution. We are
    being manipulated again by the TPTB to further their agendas.

    You can do this most days and the best way to hide most agenda's
    is in plain site, so that events that do not seem linked are in fact
    a direct result of others. The mainstream would say they are
    coincidental but I don't.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    http://www.storyleak.com/swat-team-d...h-boat-paddle/

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Missouri Police Officer Brands Ferguson Protesters 'Rabid Dogs'



    Published on 23 Aug 2014


    Source: https://www.youtube.com/user/videosptv

    August 23, 2014 - An American police officer in Missouri has used some harsh
    words to describe protesters in Ferguson, calling them rabid



    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Pentagon Hypes ISIS Terror Attacks As It Readies War With Syria



    Published on 23 Aug 2014


    Air Date: August 23rd, 2014

    This video may contain copyrighted material. Such material is made available for educational purposes only. This constitutes a 'fair use' of any

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Gov't Fear Factory: ISIS Is Here, Just in Time for Another 9/11 Anniversary



    Published on 22 Aug 2014


    The lunatics are running the asylum...

    The government has been doing a whole lot of talking lately about the
    9/11-style threat ISIS poses on American soil, how ISIS is like 'nothing

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    FBI agents to guard UK airports against jihadi fanatics

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:47 By david-icke





    ‘Dozens of FBI agents are to be posted at UK ­airports amid fears that Britain’s anti-
    terrorism efforts are failing to keep track of jihadi fanatics.

    Three US officers from a specialist FBI counter-terror unit are expected to land at
    Heathrow on Tuesday, with another 10 arriving within the week and dozens more
    over coming months.

    They will monitor suspect passengers as well as ­investigate “terror hot-spots”
    across Britain in the wake of the beheading of American James Foley in Iraq. Last
    night, however, critics claimed their arrival was an admission that cuts to police and
    the UK Border Force had left Britain out of its depth and overwhelmed in the war on terror.’

    Read more: FBI agents to guard UK airports against jihadi fanatics


    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/502...ihadi-fanatics


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Obama Buggers Europe: Sanctions Deepen the Recession




    http://www.intifada-palestine.com/20...pen-recession/

    http://www.davidicke.com/headlines/

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Spanish Farmers Burn EU Flags Over Brussels’ Policy Toward Russia



    http://en.ria.ru/world/20140823/1922...cy-Toward.html


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    CDC Whistleblower .......US NASI Health Experiments on poor black Americans,
    and are still doing similar experiments ....





    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 24th August 2014 at 17:31.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    This article is a echo of events 70 years ago...Ironically the
    other way round , this time Germany are the peace makers
    and the west/Nato the aggressors...



    Published on 23 Aug 2014


    German Chancellor Angela Merkel met with Ukraine's President Petro Poroshenko in
    Kiev. Willy Wimmer, the former State Secretary of the Minister of Defence of
    Germany, joins RT for analysis of the joint statements by the leaders of both
    countries.





    -------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Russian convoy exits Ukraine

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:04 By david-icke



    ‘A total of 184 vehicles from the Russian aid convoy, which crossed into Ukraine on
    Friday without permission, have returned to Russia from rebel-held Ukranian
    territory, a Ukrainian military spokesman said Saturday.

    Meanwhile, German Chancellor Angela Merkel said on Saturday the standoff over
    Ukraine could be solved but only if control was tightened over the Ukraine-Russia
    border across which, the West alleges, Russia has been funnelling arms to help a
    separatist rebellion.’

    Read more: Russian convoy exits Ukraine

    http://america.aljazeera.com/article...oy-merkel.html

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Shelling Kills Hundreds in Besieged Luhansk in East Ukraine





    ‘Hundreds have died in artillery attacks on eastern Ukraine’s key city of Luhansk as
    government troops continue to lay siege to the militia stronghold, according to a
    senior official of the self-proclaimed Luhansk People’s Republic.

    “As of today, the death toll has climbed into the hundreds. Hundreds of homes have
    been torn down, including more than a dozen of apartment blocks and hundreds of
    private houses,” LPR Deputy Prime Minister Vasily Nikitin told RIA Novosti Saturday.
    Luhansk has been left without running water, electricity and pho

    e communications for 20 days as government troops continue to besiege it,
    pounding indiscriminately militia positions and residential quarters in and around
    the city. All deliveries of food, medication and fuel had long been stopped due to
    heavy shelling.’

    Read more: Shelling Kills Hundreds in Besieged Luhansk in East Ukraine

    http://en.ria.ru/world/20140823/1922...t-Ukraine.html

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    MH-17 ‘Investigation’: Secret August 8th Agreement Seeps Out

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:15 By david-icke





    ‘Regarding what caused the downing of the Malaysian airliner MH-17 in Ukraine on
    July 17th, the Ukrainian news agency UNIAN, reported in a brief Russian-language
    news story on August 12th, that four days earlier (August 8th) a representative of
    that nation’s Prosecutor General office, Yuri Boychenko, had said that (as auto-
    translated by google), “the results [of the investigation] will be announced upon
    completion of the investigation and with the consent of all the parties who signed
    the corresponding agreement.”

    This UNIAN report said that, “As part of the four-party agreement signed on August
    8 between Ukraine, the Netherlands, Belgium and Australia [all of which nations are
    allies of the United States and are cooperating with its new Cold War against
    Russia], information on the investigation into the disaster Malaysian ‘Boeing-777’
    will not be disclosed.”’

    Read more: MH-17 ‘Investigation’: Secret August 8th Agreement Seeps Out




    http://rinf.com/alt-news/editorials/...reement-seeps/

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Wall Street Whistleblower Reveals Subliminals Added to TV

    Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:00 By david-icke




    http://www.davidicke.com/headlines/
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 24th August 2014 at 11:35.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Then there is Israel, which has obvious links to the theme of this thread.
    I am sorry if this seems like I'm derailing the thread , but looking
    on David site as I do most days , this stuck out like a sore thumb.
    I know many of the members on here will see the link, but I thought
    it worth the effort of posting all these articles for people looking in to
    digest.....

    The common link is a police state in America and the continuation
    of TNWO agenda against Syria, Iran and stifling Russia's increasing
    influence on global affairs, thru BRICS and other forums.

    You could say Hitler was a tool used by TPTB in a earlier era...??


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Israel shells southern Lebanon after rocket attack

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:27 By david-icke





    ‘The Israeli regime has shelled southern Lebanon following rocket fire from
    the country into northern parts of occupied Palestinian territories.

    On Saturday, the regime fired artillery shells into southern Lebanon after
    rockets were launched against the northern city of Akko, slightly hurting
    two children.

    The rocket was reportedly fired from the Christian-populated village of
    Alma in the Zgharta District and hit a building in eastern Akko.’

    Read more: Israel shells southern Lebanon after rocket attack

    http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08...thern-lebanon/

    ==================================================



    Israeli air strikes level 12-floor apartment block in Gaza after giving
    residents just ten minutes’ warning to get out

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:19 By david-icke





    ‘Israeli airstrikes levelled a 12-floor apartment block in Gaza City, injuring
    at least 18 people including four children, after residents were reportedly
    given just ten minutes’ warning to get out.

    The tower block, containing 44 flats, collapsed in a cloud of fire and smoke
    after it was hit by at least two missiles, and was followed just hours later by
    the bombing of a seven-storey office building as well as a shopping centre in
    the southern town of Rafah early this morning.

    The latest strikes have signalled a new escalation in seven weeks of fighting,
    with the targeting of large buildings apparently a new military tactic by Israel.’

    Read more: Israeli air strikes level 12-floor apartment block in Gaza after
    giving residents just ten minutes' warning to get out

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...rning-out.html

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Israeli F-16 Missile Attacks Venezuelan Humanitarian Aid Mission in Gaza

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:18 By david-icke





    ‘Venezuelan ambassador to Egypt, Juan Antonio Hernandez, said Wednesday
    that an Israeli aircraft attacked the Venezuelan humanitarian delegation in
    Rafah along the border post between Egypt and Palestine. The delegation was
    delivering twelve tons of aid to the Palestinian people. No one was injured
    during the attack.

    The F-16 airplane dropped a missile very close to the humanitarian site, though
    it did not explode. The ambassador confirmed that the missile fell approximately
    50 to 70 meters from the site.’

    Read more: Israeli F-16 Missile Attacks Venezuelan Humanitarian Aid Mission in Gaza


    http://venezuelanalysis.com/news/10861


    ================================================== ==


    The Goal of the ISIS Psyop is World War 3

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:44 By david-icke





    ‘ISIS is everywhere and America should be paralyzed with fear. ISIS is in Ferguson,
    they are on Twitter, they are in Iraq and Syria, they are crossing our undefended
    southern border. TheY could be carrying Ebola into the country. Stop, stop, stop!
    Here is a phrase that I would like all Americans to memorize and recite often:

    “ISIS is everywhere, because the CIA is everywhere”.

    America is both shocked and horrified at the video posted on August 19th, on
    YouTube, showing American Journalist, James Foley kneeling next to a man dressed
    in black. Foley reads a message, presumably written by his captors, that his “real
    killer” is America.’

    Read more: The Goal of the ISIS Psyop is World War 3

    http://www.thecommonsenseshow.com/20...world-war-iii/

    ================================================== =

    White House edges closer to strikes on Syria as pressure grows on Obama to act on ISIS

    new Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:40 By david-icke





    ‘In the aftermath of James Foley’s beheading, President Barack Obama is weighing
    up how to increase his military campaign against ISIS as the US edges closer to
    strikes in Syria.

    Having already conducted limited air-strikes against ISIS positions in northern Iraq
    to aid Kurdish fighters for humanitarian reasons, the White House is examining its
    legal options to launch raids across the border to hit the terror groups stronghold.

    Preferably Congress would pass a resolution to provide the domestic legal
    justification for attacks against the Sunni Muslim group that now operates its
    Islamic State that ranges nearly from Baghdad to Damascus.’

    Read more: White House edges closer to strikes on Syria as pressure grows on
    Obama to act on ISIS

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...kes-Syria.html

    ================================================== ==

    Israel’s Democratic Party leader echoes Netanyahu’s new theme: Hamas equals ISIS

    Sunday 24th August 2014 at 11:28 By david-icke





    ‘A few weeks after the Israeli prime minister accused Hamas of piling
    up “telegenically-dead Palestinians for their cause,” Benjamin Netanyahu has found
    a telegenically-dead victim for his propaganda purposes: James Foley, the brave
    American journalist killed by ISIS in Syria. Netanyahu is using Foley’s gruesome
    beheading to equate ISIS and all its horrors to… Hamas.’

    Read more: Israel's Democratic Party leader echoes Netanyahu’s new theme: Hamas equals ISIS

    http://mondoweiss.net/2014/08/democr...us-equals.html


    ================================================== ==


    We have seen this psyop very recently......


    The myth of Al Qaeda



    Uploaded on 19 Mar 2011


    Uploaded and mirrored with approval of the author.
    This documentary interrogates the notion that Osama Bin Laden single-handedly
    ran the pervasive Al Qaeda terrorist network by examining its inception, its links to
    Western intelligence, the double agents and fictitious characters that populate its
    ranks, and the fraudulent ways the Al Qaeda myth is propagated in the controlled
    corporate media. The documentary also offers ways that citizens can become
    involved in helping to spread understanding about the true government-sponsored
    terror paradigm.

    For more information about the documentary, please visit:

    http://www.alqaedadoesntexist.com
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 24th August 2014 at 17:45.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Hello Andrew


    Quote I got the same feeling after listening to Hitler speeches and just looking at both sides of the coin…
    In all our discussions, you have given me no reason to believe that you look at both sides of the coin, Andrew. Have you ever watched any of the excellent videos Cidersomerset has taken the trouble to post for us, on this thread and the one we both engaged in a while ago? http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...ghlight=hitler

    Have you ever even glanced at any of the millions of pages of archives, articles, documentation about the holocaust by survivors, liberators, historians? What about the transcripts of the Nuremberg trials? Or the meticulous records of the Germans? In case you haven't, this is quite a useful selection http://crln.acrl.org/content/71/2/80.full

    I've listened to many speeches and read many essays by the likes of Irving, Carto, Faurisson, Zundel, Duke, Weber… I'm familiar with sites such as Codoh and IHR. I've analysed their claims and cross referenced their theories.

    Quote what agendas do you actually refer?
    Everyone has an agenda - I've never trust anyone who says they don't!

    I think there are some out there who hope to rehabilitate Nazism and fascism. I think there are some who wish to re-establish supremacist and/or separatist rule. I think denialism is ancient antisemitism promoted through distortions of history, and as such, must be combated. It is a rhetoric of hatred.

    To see their agenda you only have to look at the fringe-group audiences for Irving et al: white supremacist rallies, Neo Nazis gatherings, Aryan Nations get togethers, Klan tea parties, black nationalist events, skinhead conventions….

    As to the agenda in denialism itself: in the words of Deborah Lippstadt, the woman whom Irving chose to sue in 2000 for referring him as a holocaust denier (he lost): "...denial of the Holocaust is not really about the facts of the Holocaust, and is not benign nuttiness, but rather a new antisemitic canard which abuses history in order to demonize Jews."

    As long as there are people out there who make statements such as "more women died on the back seat of Edward Kennedy's car at Chappaquiddick than ever died in a gas chamber in Auschwitz." (Irving) it's necessary to respond. They have every right to their belief system - and other people have every right to point out the errors in their assertions.

    Quote But then you raise questions about the Holocaust…and get thrown in jail…"
    Raise questions? You actually think the holocaust denial is about "raising questions"?!
    Scholars and professors of history worldwide are constantly 'raising questions' and many have serious disagreements about several aspects of the Holocaust (exactly when was the "final solution" decided upon, for example), but they all agree that the evidence of genocide, many in purpose-built gas chambers and carried out by the Nazis and their collaborators, is not only incontrovertible, but overwhelming.

    Quote People dont dedicate their lives to something like this topic just for a bit of cash when there is far easier ways to make money with less hassle.
    And that, Andrew, is precisely my point. They dedicate so much time to this topic because it supports their belief system. They start with an idea - in this case, that the holocaust did not happen - and then go out and try desperately to find some proof - and then not pay any attention to the evidence that destroys their claims. They are ideologues, rather than people with a genuine fascination for historical events throughout all the ages.

    A "bit of cash"? I agree that money is not their prime motivation, but Ernst Zundel, in 2005, earned approximately $50,000 per year in donations as well as $100,000 from sales of his materials: evidence for this was presented by the prosecution at his trial. Not too shabby.

    If we deny the reality of the holocaust, then which other genocides are we then free to deny? Just because the holocaust deniers say, "Oh, it's all a fabrication", are we then going to believe the supporters of Pol Pot when they claim that 1.7 million Cambodians were not murdered? Or the government in Rwanda when they deny slaughtering a million Tutsi? What about the Armenian genocide? Darfur? And Mao? Etc. Etc. Etc.

    We've spent many happy hours in this type of discussion, Andrew, and I've noticed a pattern . You post a video with a flourish, as if it's going to prove the undeniable truth, and then run away I then spend a long time going through that video, and present a counter argument. You then ignore this completely and post another video. I don't want to play this game any more - but as long as you post half-baked lies, I have to refute them by choosing examples from the mountains of evidence available to the contrary.

    Yes, my posts are long. Because I believe that these matters deserve commitment and comprehensive replies, and take a lot of time and care over mine. Because, to me, it's important to reply fully to people who have questions. Because, much as you would like to, you can't unravel the lies and deceit in one little soundbyte, Andrew. Lies and deceit eat away goodness in ourselves and in society as a whole.

    You mention propaganda - here's one person's philosophy on that subject:
    “If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed.” Adolf Hitler

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Hitler the man of peace.......This is from the other thread and It
    illustrates how fast things escalated when Hitler became
    Chancellor / fuhrer . In just over a decade Europe and the
    world was a battle ground with multi millions killed & murdered....

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    What the Nazi knew very early on was the power of propaganda , and Goebbels
    set up a flourishing industry. The Brown shirts para military thugs were a vital
    factor used in the cities to counter act communist worker parties and later
    morphed into the SS and other unsavoury unit of the Nazi military/police arm.
    Himmler expanded this after a coup within the organisation itself forcing
    Rohm to shoot himself. Now you either believe history as we have be taught
    or you do not , and as it is usually written by the winners and their sometimes
    biased views interpretation can be everything.

    Poland only came into existence after WW1 and had to stave of invasion from
    Soviet Russia in 1920 and was fully aware historically of the dangers of her
    neighbours from the east and west, so had a large army, but it was not
    as modern as Germanys who had been frantically rearming since the mid
    1930's.Poland knew Germany was going to attack her sooner or later and
    pointed this out as loudly as she could, without much success so tried to
    negotiate with Germany. Whos 'None aggressive' policies had already
    remilitarised the Rhine land , annexed Austria and the Sudatenland
    part of Czechoslovakia so Poland knew she was next, especially with Danzig
    and the west Prussia issue.

    Territorial changes began soon after Hitler came to power, so to say Hitler
    was not aggressive is a myth, even before he started the main conflict.







    What did Denmark ,Norway, Holland, Luxemburg, Belgium , Yugoslavia & Greece
    have to do with ethnic German disputes ??




    If there were atrocities against ethnic Germans in Poland pre 1939, they are
    to be condemned, as well but we need more proof they existed to the extent
    claimed. No doubt there were tensions leading up to the invasion particularly
    in Danzig as Poland knew it was next on Hitlers eastward expansion plan
    for 'Living space'.




    http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/gcsebit...iefsrev1.shtml

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    I apologize in advance for my vehemence but as passionate as others feel about "their issues", I feel passionate about mine.....

    There is one point of agreement that I share with all who feel powerless, all who feel victimized, all who have suffered, all who feel anger or despair or rage: There IS IMO a common enemy. IMO it is global human SUICIDE

    However, it is not any group of human beings and in my humble opinion, it is not a "a parasite" or an alien inserting itself. It is not any other than disconnection from reality and dependence on artificial systems that have been superimposed. We have been starved of and confused about the/ \our living connection to power and capacity to think. This fracture is destroying our ability to live.

    Generational holocausts do not "go away". they fester and wait to erupt again IMO. This pattern is really SUICIDE IMO of the future of humanity. Hate is perpetually stimulated and like a ping pong ball that is volleyed back and forth, passed back and forth, we see the same mechanisms and we never cooperate to deal with the truth that modern civilization (6000 years of it) is insane.

    The hate we have for the perceived enemy drains us of our capacity for survival, much less THRIVING IMO. The GAME is the problem and maybe it has a purpose...to awaken from this madness???

    The game creates the playing field. IMO, we who refuse to play the game are the winners.

    Quote John Trudell:
    I would like to talk tonight in honor of all of us in the struggle who have lost our relations to the Spirit World. I would like to talk in honor of the wind, one of the natural elements. This is a survival gathering and one of the things I hope you all learn while you're here is ... to appreciate the energy and power that the elements are, that of the sun, the rain and the wind. I hope you go away from here understanding that this is power, the only real, true power. This is the only real, true connection we will ever have to power, our relationship to Mother Earth.

    We must not become confused. We must not become confused and deceived by their illusions. There is no such thing as military power. There is only military terrorism. There is no such thing as economic power. There is only the economic within these illusions so we will believe they hold power in their hands. But they do not. All they know how to do is act in a repressive, brutal way.

    The power. We are a natural part of the earth. We are an extension of the earth; we are not separate from it. We are part of it. The earth is our mother. The earth is a spirit, and we are an extension of that spirit. We are spirit. We are power. They want us to believe that we have to believe in them, that we have to assume these consumer identities and these political identities, these religious identities and these racial identities. They want to separate us from our power. They want to separate us from who we are.

    Genocide.

    Genocide is just an intellectual way of saying murder because we live in a so-called "civilized," industrialized world. And because this world is allegedly civilized and allegedly has laws, they can't go out and call an act of murder, murder any more. They call it genocide to throw another illusion in our eyes. And they have limited our ability to see the necessity for our survival because they want us to believe that genocide just means physical extinction.

    We must consider the spiritual genocide that they commit against us: the spiritual genocide that white people have been victimized for thousands of years, the spiritual genocide that told them not to respect the earth—the spiritual genocide that told them not to respect the life that is the earth—but to pay all their tribute through the churches to god and heaven, that heaven would take care of them in the afterlife. They tried to take and suppress our natural identity, our natural spiritual connection to the earth.

    We must move to the time when we truly understand our connection to real power because these people who deal with illusions and imitations, these men who have attempted to "improve upon" nature, they want to keep us confused. They want to keep us confused with sexism and agism, racism and class. They want to keep us in confusion so that we will continue to believe in one lie after another as they program them into our minds and into our society. We Are Power
    For the record...the focus on denial that the poster children were not participants within abusive and hateful regimes is the distraction today.

    "The man who has moved away from nature? His heart becomes hard"

    The earth IMO is not at risk but we are at risk. The industrial machine world regimes use the same strategies to coerce people to excuse and even to participate in this human SUICIDE.



    John Trudell
    The Realms
    In energy of the realms



    the energy of emotion put into

    the energy of fear put into

    the energy of believe put into

    the energy of distort put into

    the energy of hope put into

    the energy of reaction put into

    the energy of energy put into

    the energy of illusion put into

    the illusion of change put into

    the illusion of familiar put into

    the illusion of revolution put into

    the illusion of progress put into

    the energy of dying put into

    the energy of death put into

    the energy of de-energizing



    of parallels

    parallels of



    the energy of feeling put into

    the energy of clarity put into

    the energy of think put into

    the energy of coherent put into

    the energy of prayer put into

    the energy of action put into

    the energy of energy put into

    the energy of reality put into

    the reality of energy put into

    the reality of creativity put into

    the reality of evolution put into

    the reality of change put into

    the energy of life put into

    the energy of living put into

    the energy of re-energizing



    In the realms of energy
    Last edited by Delight; 25th August 2014 at 19:36.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told




    Holocaust survivors and their descendants accuse Israel of ‘genocide’




    More than 300 Holocaust survivors and their descendants have condemned
    what they described as Israel’s 'genocide of Palestinian people' in an advert
    in the New York Times


    Zachary Davies Boren
    Sunday 24 August 2014



    Dozens of Holocaust survivors, together with hundreds of descendants of
    Holocaust survivors and victims, have accused Israel of “genocide” for the
    deaths of more than 2,000 Palestinians in Gaza since the conflict erupted in July.

    In an open letter released by the International Jewish Anti-Zionist Network
    and published as an advert in The New York Times, the group calls for a
    full economic, cultural and academic boycott of Israel over its “wholesale
    effort to destroy Gaza”.

    “Genocide begins with the silence of the world,” the statement reads, “We must
    raise our collective voices and use our collective power to bring about an end to
    all forms of racism, including the ongoing genocide of Palestinian people.”

    The statement also condemns the United States for its financial and diplomatic
    support of Israel.

    The signatories express alarm at “the extreme, racist dehumanization of Palestinians
    in Israeli society, which has reached a fever pitch.”

    This condemnation was designed as a response to a widely-published advertisement
    from Nobel prize-winning author Elie Wiesel that condemned Hamas for its “use of
    children as human shields”.

    The statement reads: “We are disgusted and outraged by Elie Wiesel’s abuse of our
    history […] to justify the unjustifiable.”

    Of the 327 signatories, 40 survived the Holocaust and the other 287 are descendants
    of Holocaust survivors or victims.

    Recent today reports refer to the destruction of an high rise office building in the
    southern town of Rafah, and the bombing of an apartment building in Gaza City
    amid attempts from the Egyptian government to establish a durable ceasefire.

    More than 2,100 Palestinians, including 500 children have been killed in the conflict,
    according to Palestinian health officials and UN figures. Israel has lost 64 soldiers
    and four civilians.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...e-9687994.html

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Thanks Delight.....



    Excellent video of a sad storey of centuries of continuous abuse of the indigenous
    North American peoples, the same happened all over the world in the 'Age of
    Empire' Australia,Asia,South America and Africa , it happened in Europe as well
    slightly earlier. But it is still happening to groups all over the world as I type.

    There are some threads about the native American genocide/holocaust which I
    could not find with a quick search. There is one started by White feather about
    native musical culture.

    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...n-Music-Thread


    ================================================== ==
    ================================================== ==

    This article is on Davids site today and is appropriate to your vid and this thread...








    American Terror Lives On

    D.Icke.com






    American Terror Lives On

    Sunday, 24 August 2014 13:01
    By Margaret Kimberley, Black Agenda Report | Op-Ed

    Can America ever overcome its terrible history of conquest, genocide and
    enslavement? Those horrors are deeply embedded in the American psyche and
    legal system, and allow for repeated aggressions at home and abroad. This
    columnist was reminded of the roots of this never ending terror during a recent trip
    to Alabama.

    Every region of the United States shares in the history of displacement and murder
    of indigenous peoples. Alabama differs from New England only in that Indians there
    were brutally attacked and forcibly removed 200 years after the interlopers called
    pilgrims committed their crimes. In the early 1800s white settlers from the
    Carolinas and Georgia happily suffered from what was called “Alabama fever.” They
    knew that the lands recently wrested from the Creek, Choctaw and Cherokee would
    be theirs for the taking.

    Alabama was called the Cotton State with good reason. It owes its very existence
    to the global demand for cotton, the theft of Indian land and the domestic trade in
    enslaved people. At the start of the Civil War nearly half of the population was
    comprised of enslaved people. The wealth generated by king cotton made
    Montgomery one of the largest slave trading cities in the South, as rivers and rails
    were used to bring the product and the people who produced it to pens and auction
    blocks on Market Street, later re-named Dexter Avenue.

    The damage done didn’t stay in South and it wasn’t frozen in time. The legacy can
    only be left behind if white Americans commit themselves to deep introspection and
    a pledge to leave supremacy behind. That is a tall order for a country which claims
    to be exceptionally virtuous yet also makes every effort to maintain the racial
    status quo.

    The slave patrols that prevented escape and freedom are still present in the 21st
    century. The extra judicial killings of Eric Garner in New York City, Michael Brown in
    Ferguson, Missouri, and John Crawford in Beavercreek, Ohio, are but three of the
    most recent. The brutal beating of Marlene Pinnock by a California highway patrol
    officer wreaked of this awful legacy, when a white policeman had complete
    confidence that he could punch a black woman in the face at least ten times and rip
    off her clothes in broad daylight while hundreds of potential witnesses drove by. If
    that isn’t a legacy of the slave system, nothing else is.

    The open carry of firearms and stand your ground legislation are but the latest
    symptoms of an old illness. The disease is called white supremacy and there has
    never been a serious desire by the controlling race to be free of it. It is frankly
    ridiculousness to ask why black people are victimized by extra judicial killings, high
    rates of incarceration and anything else which keeps them at the bottom of the
    social, political and economic totem pole.

    In the absence of any desire to leave the past behind, police brutality is inevitable.
    The history of black people in America is like a horror movie with many sequels.
    Enslavement ended only to be replaced by a convict labor system and lynch law
    terrorism. The brief American spring of the civil rights mass movement was quickly
    followed by mass incarceration which is fed by the extreme police surveillance of
    black communities. Eric Garner broke up a fight on a New York City street and
    ended up dead in a police choke hold. John Crawford was holding a toy gun in a
    Walmart when he was shot down. Michael Brown was stopped by a police officer in
    Ferguson, Missouri, because he walked in the street instead of on the sidewalk.
    Their deaths should go under the category “things that happen only to black
    people.”

    While Americans ponder whether or not Germans feel guilt because of Adolf Hitler’s
    atrocities they ought to ask the same of themselves. How do white people in the
    21st century benefit from the crimes of the past and what will they do as
    individuals to give up the entitlements they have long held? There are too few
    people willing to contemplate these questions. Instead they see the protest unfold
    in Ferguson, Missouri, and conclude that it has nothing to do with them. All the
    while they support stop and frisk and any other avenue which allows for the literal
    and very physical control of black people.

    Wearing hoodies for Trayvon Martin or shouting, “Hands up, don’t shoot,” in
    memory of Michael Brown may galvanize popular anger but they aren’t substitutes
    for revolutionary change. That is the only way to undo centuries of injustice.
    Anything else is piecemeal and doomed to fail. The continuing protest in Ferguson,
    Missouri, shows that thousands of people are prepared to do something radically
    different. The question is whether they will again be disappointed or whether they
    will be joined by others in a much larger struggle.
    This piece was reprinted by Truthout with permission or license. It may not be
    reproduced in any form without permission or license from the source.


    http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/ite...error-lives-on
    Last edited by Cidersomerset; 25th August 2014 at 09:40.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    i just got done watching another stark horror reminder of this period of time ...

    Hitler's GI Death Camp
    About the Nazi Concentration Camp of Stalag 9B at Berga


    A documentary 'Hitler's GI Death Camp' on this hell hole place is available on Netflix

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Quote i just got done watching another stark horror reminder of this period of time ...

    Hitler's GI Death Camp
    About the Nazi Concentration Camp of Stalag 9B at Berga

    A documentary 'Hitler's GI Death Camp' on this hell hole place is available on Netflix



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    Question Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    will share this here ...



    Radio 3Fourteen

    Carolyn Yeager - WWII Revisionist History
    September 3, 2014


    Quote Carolyn Yeager is a writer and researcher specializing in World War II and "holocaust" revisionism. She’s the author of a 48-page booklet titled Auschwitz: The Underground Guided Tour, What the Tour Guides Don’t Tell You at Auschwitz-Birkenau. She hosts a radio program and writes numerous articles, which are available on her website. We’ll hear Carolyn’s journey to holocaust revisionism. Having German heritage herself, she’ll speak about her awakening into the truth surrounding WWII. We’ll talk about the atrocities committed by the allies during WWII and claims made surrounding the holocaust, verses what holocaust revisionists claim. We’ll talk about why holocaust revisionism is important and necessary. She’ll also speak about holocaust survivor stories verses war propaganda. We’ll talk about why America harbored such hatred for Germany. Carolyn discusses literature in Nazi Germany, eugenics and the Nazi economic model. Later, she comments on claims made by alt researchers about Hitler. Many are not interested in the truth on this subject. In challenging the holocaust story, we are forced to contend with the entire postwar order, which was created by the allies. The holocaust is their moral cornerstone still used today to justify nefarious behavior. Questioning the victor’s version of the war has landed some in jail. At the end, she discusses infighting among White folk and she questions if unification is possible. We’ll also speak about the predictability of the misinformed that pull the Nazi card on Europeans seeking to preserve their heritage.
    Listen here

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Hello Giovonni

    I don't have time to listen to a 1hr 22min interview at the moment - I'm off to work - but I'm familiar with the work of Caroline Yeager, having read her pamphlet The Underground Guided Tour: What the Tour Guides Don’t Tell You at Auschwitz-Birkenau

    (here's a link to it http://archive.org/stream/CarolynYea...dTour_djvu.txt)

    And the reason the guides don't tell you this stuff is quite simply because it's not true
    This pamphlet was exactly what you'd expect from a person who was the Texas state leader of neo-Nazi ANSWP (American National Socialist Workers party) which has connections with the National Socialist Movement - the main neo-Nazi group in the US. She is much adored by the white supremacist and WW2 revisionist community.

    In this she claims that Auchwitz was a happy place of “reform, re-education and rehabilitation” where people only died of natural causes, and everyone lived happily in luxurious conditions with flower beds and tree lined boulevards, flushing toilets, a caring health care system, and a "flourishing cultural life".

    All this despite the fact that, in his autobiography, the Auschwitz commandant Rudolf Hoess, described how Himmler "gave me the order to prepare installations at Auschwitz where mass exterminations could take place,” and then detailed the entire process, including gassings that he himself witnessed.

    All that despite the accounts of thousands of victims, perpetrators, camp liberators and Nazi officials - including Auschwitz’s most infamous commandant - were these all lies and propaganda?

    That said, could you please summarise for us what you consider to be her most salient points in this interview? I'd be interested to know whether she's still beating the same hate-filled, neo Nazi drum
    Last edited by loungelizard; 6th September 2014 at 10:25.

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    Question Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Dude ...

    Note i just shared the interview ... Though i don't appreciate your insinuating sarcastic tone towards me because i did ... Perhaps it is best we let it go at that.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Quote Posted by giovonni (here)
    Dude ...

    Note i just shared the interview ... Though i don't appreciate your insinuating sarcastic tone towards me because i did ... Perhaps it is best we let it go at that.
    Giovonni - I'm sorry you interpreted my post as being sarcastic towards you. It wasn't intended that way at all: I'm aware that my tone can be a little…abrasive sometimes but it's certainly not meant to be personal. I apologise if it came across like that. You have every right to share whatever you choose on your thread: I'm only interested in commenting on the facts of the situation.

    I'm interested in what Carolyn has to say these days, but I also think it's important to know something of her background. That's all.
    Last edited by loungelizard; 6th September 2014 at 13:46.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    If this post ends looking inappropriate, please have mods remove:

    I am not a historian or expert but I read and have read reams of information. Reading develops the ability to see patterns when you begin looking at common themes.

    Looking at current collective trends and looking at RedIce as an example of the zeitgeist, the recent emphasis is on the threat of the stranger to destabilize the "civilized". It is being played by politics and by religion AND MORE by sheer superstitions based on race and sex.

    Where are the trustworthy panels who can confront the twisted up mythologies???? The internet can make lies much larger and more believable. We accuse mainstream but we are seeing similar shills for a stinky CAUSE On PLACES LIKE Redice IMO. No one seems to be asking deep questions and in an hour how can they?? I desire a source to stand as clear referee.

    In the collective, something has been looking more and more reactionary. In the not main stream media emphasis, one is seeing what looks to me like increasing backlash against people couched in terms that looks like spiritualISM, racISM, classISM, religionISM and misogyny (I think I know what feminism is and it is not what is being purported by haters).

    Even in this exchanged disagreement between Gio and Loungelizard, something is generating a HOT flash. Gio senses directed "sarcasm" (which was NOT what I read but what GIo felt). WHY??? How is it that sides are being drawn up in our midst? To justify the wrong a group has done by the wrong the other group has done does not make either wrong right and will we be stuck between non arguments?

    I agree that present Israel should not be funded. If all this is to try to disentangle the idea of reparations...that is one thing. I do not believe this "forgiveness" is the purpose of what "Holocaust revision" and revisionists in general is about.

    This recursive divisionist strategy is FEUDAL and it is FUTILE.
    "feu·dal·ism
    noun \ˈfyü-də-ˌli-zəm\: a social system that existed in Europe during the Middle Ages in which people worked and fought for nobles who gave them protection and the use of land in return".

    In my reading, the "jewish people" were made to be the buffer zone working FOR the "kings" and always the hatred was directed at the middle man as the taxman. The trap that people are given making them to "work" for the ever FEUDAL system is what is hurting humans and the latest is seeing how hate is directed at police who are the new middle man. This is just one example.

    Are we just bound to repeat the same reverberating texts one can read from the annals of historic time? I feel so sad because people have been hurt and right now somewhere, a little child is learning from an older "child" that what makes us TOO DIFFERENT to ever get along has to do with the enemy created to support feudal mind set.

    IMO IMO IMO alert.
    If we look at every context, hate divides and is the with-holding of the energy we generate that is starving us. The FEUDAL LORDS play our sympathies and we keep the FUTILE going generation after generation. I see the wedge of fearful defensive identities projected onto racial sexual and and cultural screens. Used AGAIN and AGAIN to create interpersonal blame and suspicion we create.

    So, if I could talk to Henrik Palmgren directly, I would request that he ask CHALLENGING questions to those who appear on his show based on their reputations and see what they say when confronted strongly.
    Last edited by Delight; 6th September 2014 at 15:42.

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    i'm still wondering if either of you (or both) have even listened to the interview yet ...

    Maggie with all due respect, who are you to tell me when and how i should take an offense.

    Note Henrik did not conduct the interview, Lana did ... And she is a friend of mind, and i respect her work.

    Blessings Gio

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    Default Re: Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story Never Told

    Quote Posted by giovonni (here)
    i'm still wondering if either of you (or both) have even listened to the interview yet ...

    Maggie with all due respect, who are you to tell me when and how i should take an offense.

    Note Henrik did not conduct the interview, Lana did ... And she is a friend of mind, and i respect her work.

    Blessings Gio
    Sorry to make it seem I was suggesting anything except I saw what looked like a hot flash and I see the hot flashes like summer lightening all over the discussion boards of current events. Did you know I have only ever met you face to face of people on PA. I don't know you are a freind but you are valued deeply as a person. Friends IMo are people to have dinner and talk, forums mean IMO sharing info.

    No, I did not listen as I know of Carolyn Yeager and I do not understand the line of thought she holds on being a human on the new earth that I seek.

    I am female and I am considered white. Both these categories hold considerations for her I do not value:

    Quote Another concern today’s women have is their freedom to make personal choices and set their own direction in life. Women want the same freedom that they believe men have enjoyed throughout most of history. But there are consequences to this type of equality of men and women.

    The modern right to work means the burden of supporting oneself. Control over one’s own body may mean the “right” of abortion, but it also means the right of either party to dissolve a marriage because they are unhappy, and the resulting constant legal battles to demand payment from the economically stronger partner, as well as misery for the children who are often shuttled between homes.

    In contrast to this, National Socialism encourages a more traditional role for women, allowing them to remain at home as wives and mothers. In no way, however, do women have less legal rights than men. Both men and women have duties and responsibilities; the difference is they have those that are appropriate for their gender.

    Speaking at the opening of a women’s exhibition in Berlin in 1933, Dr. Joseph Goebbels assured the women it would be “crazy” to think of driving them from public life, professions, work and bread winning, but there were two areas that must remain for men alone: politics and the military.

    National Socialism is not blind, and recognizes that women are creative, intelligent, capable contributors to the common good, and individual talents should be recognized and utilized, especially of those who cannot bear children or who are past child-bearing age.

    For women concerned with the quality of personal relationship, Goebbels got to the heart of the matter when he said: “Looking back over the past years of Germany’s decline, we come to the frightening, nearly terrifying, conclusion that the less German men were willing to act as men in public life, the more women succumbed to the temptation to fill the role of the man. The feminization of men always leads to the masculinization of women.”

    When we look around at our society today, with growing numbers of ever bolder gays and lesbians, we see this unnatural lifestyle Goebbels describes modeled for our schoolchildren as normal and natural. We see our women serving in the military and police and fire departments; we see our men becoming nurses and child-care workers. Rather than resist this trend, too many of us try to accommodate it.Women and National Socialism
    Last edited by Delight; 6th September 2014 at 17:08.

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