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Thread: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Most Americans know something is wrong but don't have the knowledge, the resources or the time to figure out that we've been hijacked by a faceless cabal of global oligarchs who literally want most of us dead...

    In fairness, this is a hard reality to face when you've grown up on a steady diet of Mickey Mouse... and stories about the glory days of Washington, Lincoln, and FDR.

    The truth is we face an assault on all sides. Our dollar is being devalued. Our minds are being harassed and controlled; our bodies are being poisoned, fattened and sterilized.

    Our media is the most wretched outside of state TV in China. Our education system is abhorrent. 90% of us don't know the difference between socialism and democracy, much less democracy and a republic.

    We're being fluoridated and dosed with heavy metals and toxins and fed genetically altered frankenfood.

    We pay $2000 to go to the dentist for a root canal (after insurance).

    It costs 75K to get an undergraduate degree. A huge proportion of Americans have to borrow money each month just to pay the interest on credit debt (which was itself accrued to pay for living expenses)...and our real wages haven't gone up since the 70's.

    We have vast unemployment, and underemployment, just like Europe, except with virtually no safety net. Those who have good paying jobs are taxed at asinine levels, which is odd because we don't really receive anything in return for this money as our infrastructure is caving in all around us.

    And we don't get vacations, or reasonable amounts of sick time, or reasonable family leave when we have children. And any health concern greater than tonsillitis will very often result in personal bankruptcy.

    Our government is abysmally corrupt... like third world banana republic corrupt. We have the biggest inequity in wealth of any country in the world.

    We've been targeted. We've been taken out. We're mob-hit victims bleeding in the street.

    We don't have much time to consider how it got this way because we're trying to stay alive.

    So cut us, and yourself, some slack.
    Last edited by Curt; 10th June 2014 at 14:41.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Excellent OP and thread Guy, Howard Beale would approve. I have limited time ATM but will edit this later when possible.

    Quote Posted by Hawkwind (here)
    If karma is an operative principle in the universe, then we all get what we deserve. If part of that principle is compassion, then you might want to apply some in your posts.
    That's a big 'If' you're swinging around there; have you seen this thread?

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...641#post842641

    Quote Posted by GoldenWaters (here)
    I dont trust gold or silver currency as well, even though its good to barter with I think my fruit orchard has a higher value because you cant eat coins or gold and silver bars but you can with fruits
    Kudos to you sir, but gold and silver don't go grow mold as fast as fruit, and tend to be cheaper than most organic orchards. An equal ratio of organic dry goods to metal is all that some can manage, and is far more feasible to most individuals still trapped in the belly of the beast.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Good morning, all!

    Hello Guyfox! Mod hat on, brother... I can see that you cannot discourse without insulting and/or attacking people.

    Whatever truth you may be spewing is lost to your filthy attitude and insisting on atacks and insults.

    Folks,, Guyfox needs our help to understand that Avalon is not a place where we disrespect one another.

    Guyfox... Do you see how that works??? Your approach to the truth is repulsive and puts everyone off...

    I know that you have the ability to craft your words in a way that inspires intelligent debate. Please, adopt a more mature attitude towards people, or find another group of people to insult!!

    Jake.
    Wow. Filthy attitude? Repulsive? I am simply shocked at your attitude, "brother."
    Too many people have their heads in the sand. We Americans sit and do practically nothing while our government destroys the world and murders innocent people every single day and produces and sells more illegal drugs than any other country or organization in the world. All in our name!! I'm sorry but it really pisses me off to know MY representatives are literally all over the world slaughtering people for our country's materialistic pursuits. What if it was YOUR wedding party that got drone bombed, your family that was MURDERED in cold blood, your legitimately elected government overthrown, just so the American people could continue their materialistic pursuits and not have to face the truth of what was going on in the world.
    Sorry but sometimes hard truth is in order and, sometimes, the truth hurts. Good. I want it to hurt. Pain is a valuable teacher. Again, our country is murdering people and the planet and I am glad some folks from other countries are strong enough to say so. We need to hear it!

    To Goldenwaters: You're right. It's not JUST Americans but Americans are leading the way in all the evil categories, while also trying to always claim the moral high ground and say our crap doesn't stink. Even though you are obviously not one of the people who we are calling out, and we could use a hell of a lot more of people like you, as much as it sucks, you do live in the US and your elected reps ARE in fact the greatest offender of the elite...and they are doing it in YOUR name, with your permission. Mine, too. I am just as guilty. I don't raise nearly as much stink as I should. I am an enabler. But I think, as ugly as the truth is, we have to get it out. Again, think of this from the point of view of someone who is being directly effected by our tyranny and our idiotic consumerism. You think they want us to play nice and not offend each other while we argue about who's responsible or who's words are too offensive? NO!
    Fear is simply a consequence of a lack of information.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Not just Americans- Mea culpa mea culpa mea maxima culpa. I try to do better - Individual volition is very important- we none of us can see what is in the heart of the individual, each country is made up of individuals some with more power / influence than others, so- we may not judge the individual by the whole.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Quote Posted by mpennery (here)
    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Good morning, all!

    Hello Guyfox! Mod hat on, brother... I can see that you cannot discourse without insulting and/or attacking people.

    Whatever truth you may be spewing is lost to your filthy attitude and insisting on atacks and insults.

    Folks,, Guyfox needs our help to understand that Avalon is not a place where we disrespect one another.

    Guyfox... Do you see how that works??? Your approach to the truth is repulsive and puts everyone off...

    I know that you have the ability to craft your words in a way that inspires intelligent debate. Please, adopt a more mature attitude towards people, or find another group of people to insult!!

    Jake.
    Wow. Filthy attitude? Repulsive? I am simply shocked at your attitude, "brother."
    Too many people have their heads in the sand. We Americans sit and do practically nothing while our government destroys the world and murders innocent people every single day and produces and sells more illegal drugs than any other country or organization in the world. All in our name!! I'm sorry but it really pisses me off to know MY representatives are literally all over the world slaughtering people for our country's materialistic pursuits. What if it was YOUR wedding party that got drone bombed, your family that was MURDERED in cold blood, your legitimately elected government overthrown, just so the American people could continue their materialistic pursuits and not have to face the truth of what was going on in the world.
    Sorry but sometimes hard truth is in order and, sometimes, the truth hurts. Good. I want it to hurt. Pain is a valuable teacher. Again, our country is murdering people and the planet and I am glad some folks from other countries are strong enough to say so. We need to hear it!

    To Goldenwaters: You're right. It's not JUST Americans but Americans are leading the way in all the evil categories, while also trying to always claim the moral high ground and say our crap doesn't stink. Even though you are obviously not one of the people who we are calling out, and we could use a hell of a lot more of people like you, as much as it sucks, you do live in the US and your elected reps ARE in fact the greatest offender of the elite...and they are doing it in YOUR name, with your permission. Mine, too. I am just as guilty. I don't raise nearly as much stink as I should. I am an enabler. But I think, as ugly as the truth is, we have to get it out. Again, think of this from the point of view of someone who is being directly effected by our tyranny and our idiotic consumerism. You think they want us to play nice and not offend each other while we argue about who's responsible or who's words are too offensive? NO!
    Thank you for a well thought out and responsible reply! The subject matter is open for debate, as always. What is NOT open for debate are the forum guidelines, which clearly requests that we do not insult and/or attack others.

    I do not plan to distract any more from this discussion. GuyFox,, I know you can do it, ... Just TRY and not insult people.

    Sorry for the interruption.
    Jake.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Good morning, all!

    Hello Guyfox! Mod hat on, brother... I can see that you cannot discourse without insulting and/or attacking people.

    Whatever truth you may be spewing is lost to your filthy attitude and insisting on atacks and insults.

    Folks,, Guyfox needs our help to understand that Avalon is not a place where we disrespect one another.

    Guyfox... Do you see how that works??? Your approach to the truth is repulsive and puts everyone off...

    I know that you have the ability to craft your words in a way that inspires intelligent debate. Please, adopt a more mature attitude towards people, or find another group of people to insult!!

    Jake.
    Well, what you have just said to me, Mr Jake, is far worse IMHO
    than anything I have said.

    So GOODBYE to you,
    And Good day to all...

    I have run sizable forums, and I think your remarks are truly bad form !!!

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    GuyFox- Please note, I am in no way disagreeing with the idea that at least some Americans deserve the trouble headed their way. From my perspective though, Ghandi and Christ also got what they deserved. If karma is an operative principle in the universe (and I’m as sure as I can be that it is) then one cannot get anything else. My point is, if I stand in judgement of another’s actions and have no compassion for the suffering they incur (even though deserved) then my actions also create negative karma.

    The sentiment you expressed in the OP doesn’t come across as “tough love”. It comes across as frustration and anger. There’s a big difference.

    Quote Posted by GuyFox (here)
    "Most Americans are: Ill-informed, under-educated, and complacent."
    Yes, but so are most of the other 7 billion people on the planet, as far as I can tell. The few who aren’t seem determined to keep things that way.

    Quote Posted by GuyFox (here)
    The Pathway to Third World status paved with soft-hearted Political Correctness. Think about it... clearly.
    Hmm, the fact that I use a mandala as an avatar and often come from an Eastern Philosophical perspective seems to get interpreted as me being a New Age, Love and Light Pacifist. Well, to some extent, perhaps- but I’ve always subscribed to the Kwai Chang Caine school of pacifism, ie- non-aggression as opposed to non-violence.
    I have no idea to what extent my ideas are considered politically correct, and could care less. If I feel I have something useful to contribute to a discussion I do so. I say what I mean and I mean what I say. Some people like it, some don’t. Either way, it’s not my problem.
    As far as America becoming a Third World country, for the most part it already is. It became so, in part, through the pursuit of material wealth and in part as a consequence of the pillaging of other countries to attain that wealth. So again, yes America and most Americans deserve the economic troubles headed their way. The solution, it seems to me, is as Strat suggested- to lead by example.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    the judges and juries above need to put themselves in others shoes, gain some perspective, other then then the ONE they have and find a little compassion towards there brother man. None to bless and all to blame... including the ones above that condemn the ignorant and unknowing...

    Your self-righteous attitudes will come to bite you in the ass sooner or later
    OBADIAH 1:21
    The Good things in life

    "...where ever you go, there you are..."

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Quote Do you think it is constructive to have that sort of "puffed up" self-image any longer?
    You talk about "this vampire", so probably you agree, it is time to drive a stake through the heart of that dangerous beast.
    It is and always was "constructive" (in the loosest sense of the word) to the psychopaths that created it, and buried the truth with little nationalistic "twists"

    I studied up to about a Howard Beale sized outrage before I realize I was in feeding the beast, probably more than the "other side". I feel "driving a stake through the heart" may not be the right approach, I think starving the beast is our only hope.

    First step is to break down the "sides" and divisions that are created by emotional charges (including political correctness, which is pretty lame IMO...there we go making sure everything is super polite, so the forum police don't get their panties in a bunch)

    If you are offended, by any side or angle or language, what does that say about your emotional attachment to the issue? Do you need to be an "adult" scolding the "children" for bad manners? Isn't that the "American way"?

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    GuyFox had already edited his first post to change that post's title from:
    (Some) Americans deserve the Sh/t being poured on them
    to:
    Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?
    I applied his change to the overall thread title.
    My quite dormant website: pauljackson.us

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Quote Posted by GuyFox (here)
    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Good morning, all!

    Hello Guyfox! Mod hat on, brother... I can see that you cannot discourse without insulting and/or attacking people.

    Whatever truth you may be spewing is lost to your filthy attitude and insisting on atacks and insults.

    Folks,, Guyfox needs our help to understand that Avalon is not a place where we disrespect one another.

    Guyfox... Do you see how that works??? Your approach to the truth is repulsive and puts everyone off...

    I know that you have the ability to craft your words in a way that inspires intelligent debate. Please, adopt a more mature attitude towards people, or find another group of people to insult!!

    Jake.
    Well, what you have just said to me, Mr Jake, is far worse IMHO
    than anything I have said.

    So GOODBYE to you,
    And Good day to all...

    I have run sizable forums, and I think your remarks are truly bad form !!!
    I'd pretty much have to agree with Guy on that one Jake. Some action from a mod was probably called for, but jeez! No need to bring out the taser when a tap on the shoulder would do.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Quote Posted by Hawkwind (here)
    I'd pretty much have to agree with Guy on that one Jake. Some action from a mod was probably called for, but jeez! No need to bring out the taser when a tap on the shoulder would do.
    I tend to agree .

    On the other hand, Jake's comment did have the useful effect of causing GuyFox to choose to step away from posting for perhaps a week. The gentle shoulder taps from other members above did not accomplish that. A self imposed vacation is quite a bit less work for me than a mod-imposed vacation (which involve quite a bit of backroom mod discussion in most cases), so I am grateful for small blessings.
    My quite dormant website: pauljackson.us

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    If Americans deserve anything, it is to be awakened to the chains which enslave them. In all honesty, I don't know which emotion I display often when it comes to this issue - anger at Americans who refuse to believe this is being done and everything is peachy in this once great land, or sorrow for those who don't want to have the knowledge that their reality is about to come crashing down. What we do deserve here in America is truth, we deserve liberty, peace and prosperity, we deserve to have the freedom of choice to make decisions in our own lives without being heavily scrutinized or for fear of retaliatory actions from the government.

    Last month I was able to obtain my Associates of Applied Sciences in Computer Information Systems - the first in my immediate family with a degree from college. I am proud of this as well as is the rest of my family. I will now be attending an actual university this fall and will be double majoring in Computer Science and Journalism with minors in Economics and Political Science - and as the days progress and this false reality unfolds itself, I'm beginning to think that I won't be able to earn a Bachelor's and later a Master's in both of these fields.

    We here at Avalon need to start a genuine grassroots movement, I thought about calling it "The Awakening". There are several venues here locally where I could set up shop and start preaching the facts and handing out information on the truth of reality - but I'd like to see something all over the United States and more so all over the world. We need to do this my fellow Avalonians. Create an 8.5 x 11 pamphlet and just start handing them out in mass. My only issue is I don't know what information is critical of being put on here, so if you have suggestions on what dire information should be put on here, as well as any graphic artists who would like to put their skills to use, send me a PM and let's get this started.

    Wes

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Quote Posted by LivioRazlo (here)
    ...We here at Avalon need to start a genuine grassroots movement, I thought about calling it "The Awakening". There are several venues here locally where I could set up shop and start preaching the facts and handing out information on the truth of reality - but I'd like to see something all over the United States and more so all over the world. We need to do this my fellow Avalonians. Create an 8.5 x 11 pamphlet and just start handing them out in mass. My only issue is I don't know what information is critical of being put on here, so if you have suggestions on what dire information should be put on here, as well as any graphic artists who would like to put their skills to use, send me a PM and let's get this started.

    Wes
    I personally have made at least seven attempts at getting something like this started. The first four during my college days (about 30 years ago), two shortly after the 9/11/2001 attacks, and one shortly after joining here at Avalon. They all crashed and burned without ever really getting off the ground. My conclusion is that the people who want to wake up will and those who are either too afraid to look at reality or too complacent with life in the Matrix won't. My job is to remain as awake and aware as I can be and to help people who want to be helped. You can offer people the choice of taking the red pill, but you simply can't force it down anyone's throat. In fact, given the depth of despair that can result from awakening to what's really going on in the world, even offering to lift the veil of illusion is a choice that shouldn't be made lightly.

    That said, I'd be more than happy to collaborate with you should you decide to pursue this project. Maybe a new thread on the subject would be in order.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    America isn’t the only place in the world where people are still asleep; the UK is just as bad, if not worse. Most western economies follow similar strategies of encouraging consumer spending because it constitutes around 70% of GDP. GuyFox is right you cannot spend your way out of the huge debt that burdens the west, in particular, the UK. Thanks to the corrupt media the pound is strengthening and there’s very positive market sentiment, however our already horrendous debt is actually getting worse despite what our politicians say. We are broke so is the US and Europe.

    The US is a superpower that cannot afford to keep spending on its military might and fighting and instigating wars around the world. It will not solve or help anybody accept the elites. We all should know that the secret service in the US, UK and Germany are mostly responsible for stirring up unrest around the world so as to grow the military industrial complex; the problem is they've robbed our governments and people of their wealth. If they can crash the markets again then everyone could be in the poor house, which is what they want. The world will be weak and ready for control.

    All superpowers come to an end. The problem is that the west does not want China to become too powerful so everything will be done to stop them, the thing is can / should America hold onto its position.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    [QUOTE=GuyFox;842763]
    Quote Posted by Strat (here)
    I think it is so very true than many Americans have shot themselves in the foot, and in the head by over-consuming gasoline. (IF, indeed, that is the point you are making.)

    The consumption thing got way out of hand over the last 3-4 decades, I think. it left many people in huge homes, surrounded by things they did not need, driving long distances... And deeply in Debt.
    Yes, and had they listened to Carter when he installed the solar panels and Ronnie removed them, we still wouldn't be paying hard earned tax dollars on the lavish parties a Presidency requires for diplomats and visiting leaders/states/members of other countries. Solar panels pay for themselves withing 5-10 years of installing them on your home, and if you intend on keeping it for your life or living in it for that time, when you rent, it adds value to the home, because there is no electric bill and theOIL/Coal/NtGas tentacle is removed from your pocket. Then they have to sell their toxins to some other country while they use the money to buy politicians, and cause wars for more of the same resources. A revolving door of stupidity to think that we can continue to poison water, air and land and still live above the "death bubble." I've seen various visions of what it will look like, if we continue the destruction. It's not pretty and I'll probably put it in one of the 3 books I'm writing.

    WE are much smarter than to poison our children and grandchildren and hand pharma and big oil all our hard earned dollars throughout our lifetime of renting or living in this country. WE should never have substidized the Oil companies to "convert to clean energy in the 70's" but executive order a percentage of progress be made before payment to them. So far they've used the substidies to "buy oil voting politicians in our government in exchange for donations and stock options in the companies. In Virginia, Republican tobacco people paid a democrat by offering him a job at the head of the company, and a vote for his daughter to become a judge. Lot of greasing the luggnuts around here. He resigned and gave power to the same ones who offered him the job. WE needed Medicaid buy in, but now there's no majority in VA. Cheaters never prosper, and we are gonna do our best to put a middle class or someone in that knows "our" daily budgeting for the family and needs and necessities.

    Bottom line is communities should have everything they need within a 5 mile walking distance to keep from spending money. Gas isn't gonna go down, we've peaked in 2007, so..we must convert. WE must finish what we started in the 70's. Greed Over People party want offshore oil drilling, WE the average joe and jane want offshore wave generation, which is much cleaner and safer.

    Lots to fight for, but it's not here we do that. We just talk things out, since "this is our time in this history, and the ptw are not immortal" They are dying off as we speak and won't pass the torch before kicking the bucket. Ergo, we must go around them and not use their nasty energy sources. Fracking and rain=mudslides for miles.

    That is the reality of it all and 40 years later beats not doing so at all. When the methane seeps in the air, one big lightening storm and "boom!" goes the air source.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Guy, all we are saying is the post is like bursting in a meeting, insulting the people that won't look out the window, and then saying you guys are wrong. Nobody is wrong about how they feel about what is going on, but until a firm solution is put together, using up energy isn't on the table. Here, we just practice respect for each and "every individual" that is posting as a member. By practicing respect for each other, we don't fall prey to emotional outbursts that leads one not to take you seriously or not want to draw that negativity, into their meditational state or purging of negativity at this time. WE are all aware of what is going on, and have yet to do anything but reveal what we find worldwide, which is why the rest of the world is wondering: "What is wrong with Americans? Why aren't they locking them up for the theft by financial instrument?" I'll tell you why. It's gonna take a few elections to remove the toadies out, and we can't leave a vacuum where no "People Power" is present that still do honor citizens and country. It takes a while to awaken because "we have the very best of distraction in technocolor and 3D. LOL, but we're doing it. And the more we can do it/kick their legs out from under them by not participating or supporting their finances to ruin the world, under cover, the better we don't tip our hand while awakening others. Since the MSM won't put it out there, we do. We twittersize, and facebook and go to sites that are popular in all party lines, and just tell the truth. When we meet here, the anger over it comes, but then the need to unite and make a movement proceeds. Be it telling it on the mountain, or dropping links with their own words in them, like Mitt Romney's 47%. So we can have fun while we do it, or burn energy that is needed when we focus, on emotional turmoil which serves nothing, but karma. We must think from the other spiritual side of the brain. The reptilian one got us here, by burying ourselves in distraction as they picked our Mom and Dad's pocket/program in cuts because their buddies plundered US. WE must find the connected political tentacle on all sides of the isle. Even Rand Paul went global for war, when paid enough and is the reason he's seeking the 2016 nomination. Wolves can't hide their howl for long. Eventually a full/truth Moon will reveal their true nature. Tread carefully and kick the people out of office connected to WARStreet. That much we can do together on "ALL" sides of the isle.

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Visually see the gorilla chained down, marching through OUR courts and facing the Hague, who is also tired of their crap. All these people dying for some enterprise called CORPORATE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. Hmmm.. I say let's take the "capitals" out and then take our country to progress. Those at the top did it, there fore throw the bums out and prosecute them with the lousy breadcrumbs they throw at the 300 million. Boy they better be glad I didn't become a prosecutor, I'd have their lawyers so busy trying to keep them out of jail, you'd think they were Al Capone.

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    Canada On Sabbatical Deega's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Hey GuyFox, pretty courageous to bring this forward, even though it's controversial!

    If the Americain Economy fails and Americains have to bare the brunt of very difficult time coming, who would be responsible for this?, the Americains, or the Representatives of the Americain Military Industries, or the Representatives of the Financial World, or Representatives of the House and the Senat? I think that it's all but the Americains!

    Even though, they voted for their Representatives for Generations, they have a minute responsibilities in being part of the Great Americains Culture. Are their Representatives accountable, they (Rep.) say at the voting booth.

    No!, as we know, now a day this answer shouldn't stand, they should be accountable to the people, not to the Military Complex, not to the Financial World, not to the Corporate America standing for "profit" only!

    So unfortunately, this Great Nation will have to live the cycle he was ment to, however dramatic, difficult, gut-wrenching! But, as we know, if this Great Nation suffer through difficult time, the rest of the World won't be spared, unfortunately!

    Hope for the best for the Americains Family and all the Families of the World!

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    Default Re: Do Americans deserve the Trouble Flowing their way?

    Jake has the best "poker face" . No other mod/admin can appear so harsh, distant and cold while hiding deep inside such a big heart...

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