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Thread: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

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    Avalon Member Jake's Avatar
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    Default The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    (Oh boy, here goes.)


    Greetings, Avalon. I am excited (and a bit nervous) to bring this information to the table, as it is a culmination of many lifetimes of work, including my own. I am a natural Astral Projector. The OBE has been a part of my life for as long as I can remember. The OBE is a natural, untapped potential for all of us. Whereas the ObE does not bring direct enlightenment and/or spiritual 'attainment',, it WILL break down belief barriers when experienced directly, and it will open us up to other levels of awareness and possibilities. (Your spiritual journey does not require the OBE,, nor does the OBE require your spiritual journey.) It is an actual and practical part of the human experience. Having OBEs is as natural to the human body as breathing or closing your eyes. (Though closing your eyes and breathing properly can be used as powerful tools to open up your experience to what is beyond the physical body senses.) I intend to offer 'nuts and bolts', as this is a real phenomenon. This exploration will be particularly helpful to those who are looking for a more practical and pragmatic approach to the out of body experience. Communion with higher self is inevitable. Let's get you out of your body, and then you can decide for yourself how it applies to your personal awakening. In my opinion, that is the best way to bridge the gap between scientific and spiritual approaches to the Out of Body Experience. Personal experience will become required, either way.


    For this discussion, Higher Self is invited, but not required.


    In 2010, I wrote 'The Book of Jacob'. It is a book about my experiences and interpretations of the OBE, and my strange life. (Feel free to PM me with your email address, and I will send you a copy. Or download from the link above) Since then, I have worked with many other advanced projectors, and have catalogued quite a bit of useful information. I have made the OBE my lives work. If there is a school of thought that is considering the ObE, then I want to be a part of it...

    In this thread, I plan to compare and contrast the research of many different Projectors, and their work, in an attempt to find commonalities in their methodologies. Most of the research in this thread will be coming from very Western points of view. I will display a more left-brained, analytical approach. (Though left-brain/right-brain synchronization will be tolerated too... lol)

    I invite any and all input.

    I will be bringing together the works of Muldoon, Carrington, Charles Tart, Robert Monroe, Robert Bruce, Bob Peterson, William Buhlman, Tom Campbell, among others. I will point out differences and similarities between the perspective modalities. I will also be highlighting advances in modern science, where technology is being forwarded by bravely delving into OBE research.

    I will compare and contrast OBEs/NDE/Remote Viewing, etc.

    I will highlight and expose the truth regarding folks in history who have used the ObE to advance scientific knowledge. We will talk about the future of Sentient Technology, and the implications of said technology. (Astral Projecting ET's and their 'Tech'.)

    We will explore, scientifically,, that the OBE is not just a trick of the eye, or a trick of the mind, and that 'thought' does not originate in the brain,, i.e.,,, you can't put an elephant in a matchbox!!

    We will be exploring the Energy Body Complex and how to properly engage the energy body, and the relevance of the energy body to the OBE. Many cultures (every culture) have their own definition (and roots thereof) of subtle-body energy, and energy body phenomenon. I will attempt to highlight commonalities.

    Ultimately, I will be taking all of this information, and drafting a 'how to have an OBE' methodology based on the best information that we can find, and highlight in this discussion. Then (if folks are up to it) we are going to use this new 'how to guide', right here at Avalon, to begin some new experiments regarding getting folks up, and out of their bodies. It is my intention to offer 'nuts and bolts' rather than 'woo woo'. (Ha! thank you TargeT for the cool word..) Once you have had a couple of fully conscious OBEs, then you can see for yourself how the Higher Self fits it. That will be my core approach in this discussion. (Communion with Higher Self is Inevitable.)

    (And if you want to, carefully get into it) We can explore the possibility that Jesus and Buddha and Muhammad were skilled Astral Projectors who did not have the language/words to teach what they knew, so their teachings were obscured, and wrapped in a Religious context, and still are to this very day.

    Everyone is invited to participate. This discussion is ALL INCLUSIVE. Nobody will be asked to leave, nor will a more limited experience be excluded. As we explore different aspects of this phenomenon, feel free to post your OBEs. Objective Exploration from a Subjective point of view is what this thread will attempt to offer... Everyone is invited... I intend to pour out my heart and soul, in the spirit of discovery.


    I think it is appropriate to begin with a brief History of the OBE....

    (Oh boy, here goes)

    [More to follow:]
    Jake.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    United States Avalon Member Zaya's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Jake: I am so happy you are doing this. I have actually found myself reacting to your posts about your OBE's quite a bit and wishing you would do this. I so look forward to it!

    I read a few books on the subject, and felt like I was about to get there, but then I purposefully stopped my progress out of fear and frustration. I have been thinking lately that I would love to start up again and start with a fresh source of information. Thank you for offering to us all of your knowledge. I can't wait to see what you have to say! Cheers!
    "The only wisdom is in knowing that you know nothing." -Socrates

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    United States Avalon Member Sebastion's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    I, too, have been a natural projector since birth here on this planet. I have spent my entire life consciously observing and experiencing. My primary interest was in the "high" spiritual and I have learned well by that direct experience over many years. I look forward to what you have learned and are ready to impart with enthusiasm. Thank you for starting this thread as perhaps a lot of the "woo woo" can be laid to rest as we get down to the brass tacks, as it were!

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    Avalon Member Jake's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Quote Posted by Zaya (here)
    Jake: I am so happy you are doing this. I have actually found myself reacting to your posts about your OBE's quite a bit and wishing you would do this. I so look forward to it!

    I read a few books on the subject, and felt like I was about to get there, but then I purposefully stopped my progress out of fear and frustration. I have been thinking lately that I would love to start up again and start with a fresh source of information. Thank you for offering to us all of your knowledge. I can't wait to see what you have to say! Cheers!
    Thank you, Zaya, for your support, and words of encouragement. This will be a journey for ME as well. I have a lot to offer, but I have never considered myself a Teacher, only a learner. So this will be a challenge for me. Also, My ObEs have been (mostly) Spontaneous OBEs,,, or,,, SOBE. I have not yet been able to master the induction/triggering of an OBE from scratch. In this sense,, we will both be learning together.. I am drafting my next post like a madman!! Thank you for your encouragement. It means a lot.

    Jake.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Germany Avalon Member Reinhard's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Way to go, Jake!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Reinhard
    The very moment the caterpillar thought the world would end, it turned into a butterfly.
    Laotse

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    France Avalon Member Rollo's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Very good start Jake! I guess you will write about lucid dreaming as well in this thread as people are mixing the two.

    Is your High Self has a name?
    "Love is a portal to God"
    Rollo

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    Avalon Member Jake's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Quote Posted by Rollo (here)
    Very good start Jake! I guess you will write about lucid dreaming as well in this thread as people are mixing the two.
    Yes, absolutely. One cannot hope to tackle the various aspects of ObE without understanding the dream-scape, and the Dreaming mind. Lucid dreaming is a part of this.. Many OBEs are 'remembered' via the dream-states. Yes, we will get into this in quite some depth... I am glad you brought it up, as I didn't mention it in my OP. Good call.


    Jake.

    Quote Posted by Rollo (here)
    Is your High Self has a name?
    My name is Jake. I am my direct self. (though, there is more) The higher self enigma will become a part of this too. I'll not be giving a name to higher self. That is for folks to decide on their own. Yes, there is a prize at the end...

    Jake.
    Last edited by Jake; 16th September 2014 at 16:53.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Hi Jake
    Thanks for starting this thread, I find this topic fascinating. Ever since I was a child, from the age of about 7 or 8 I have had involuntary Out of Body Experiences. When they first started I was somewhat alarmed but not frightened. Over the years I learned to enjoy the experience but never knew how they were triggered. They simply happened. For some reason I never spoke about this to family or friends. I had never heard anyone speak about it so I began to think that the experience was unique to myself.

    They would always start just minutes after getting into bed (definitely not asleep), I would feel my body get exceptionally heavy. The weight of my body seemed to be so great that I was sure that the mattress was almost hitting the floor. It was not like there was a weight on me, it was more like I was the weight. While this was happening I considered the sensation odd, alarming, humorous and just plain bizarre. After a minute or two the weight would release, comparable to relaxing the tension in an overstretched rubber band. As soon as this happened I would be out and up and free to go where ever I wanted.

    Once I graduated from college and started working I never really thought about it too much. Over the years it would happen less and less. About 5 years ago I started thinking about it and wondered if I could reproduce or somehow trigger the event. I laid down in bed and actually smiled at the thought of weighing a ton, I smiled at the thought of the mattress indenting from the weight of my body. To my amazement it happened almost instantaneously. Once again, I was up and out and on a journey. If I relax and get the clutter our of my mind I then seem to have the ability to do this at will.

    I have never really researched or studied this phenomena but I have read many articles about it over the years. The vast majority of the info I have read deals with two factors.
    • Are Out Of Body Experiences Real
    • How to achieve a Out Of Body Experience
    My question (if your up for one) is what purpose do they serve. I have never really given this much thought, I have always considered an OBE to be self entertainment (for lack of a better description). Is there something that you can actually achieve while on this journey? I would love to hear your thoughts.
    Richard
    Last edited by rgray222; 17th September 2014 at 02:33.

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    Scotland Avalon Member aranuk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Hi Rollo, As a matter of interest: my username Aranuk was given to me by a friend of mine who was told by her Higher Self to tell me that my Higher Self had a name and that name was Aranuk. I thought at the time that that was a wee bit unusual. I had never ever heard that a Higher Self indeed had a name. Then I thought to myself; well if I have had hundreds if not thousands of lives with all different names, feminine and masculine, I wonder what I am called in the realm between incarnations. Surely I am not referred to as Charlie, Jenifer, Maureen, Richard etc. and all the other names I have had. It now became clear that a name which all souls would know me by would indeed be the case. So I now accept that my Higher Self is called Aranuk.
    Good Luck and all the best with this thread Jake

    Stan
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    On a lighter note. I hope Jake will permit a wee bit of fun here and there. I was thinking after I posted above that if we human souls have been given our Higher Self names by Higher spiritual entities or whether we have any say in the matter of naming ourselves. Perhaps as we are named by our parents without our permission the same thing happens "up there". It is said that "as above so below" so maybe we do get named there also. Who knows? As far as a balancing of the inequalities of life in the meat suit goes, why couldn't we have a choice in naming ourselves. Whether we name ourselves or we are named by higher spiritual beings it would be logical to assume that the older souls would have the choice of the shorter one syllabled names like Al or Jo or Ed and the next group not quite as old with two syllabled names like Andy, Maggie, Mary and so on. The newer souls would likely have really long names like Krishnamurtiparahamanandayogimeshti or something. This is becoming rediculous I must stop.


    Stan
    If you don't follow your spirit without hesitation, you end up following your hesitation without spirit.

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    "We will explore, scientifically, that the OBE is not just a trick of the eye, or a trick of the mind, and that 'thought' does not originate in the brain,, i.e.,,, you can't put an elephant in a matchbox!!"

    Dear Jake,
    Great timing and thank you for taking this subject on. Recently I feel exiled by a teacher of mine (he hears my thoughts and I some of his) for having a negative thought (never voiced) that seemingly came from some foreign place. Maybe he is preparing me for cosmonauting- but the separation I feel is heart rendering.

    Ready and listening in Oregon!
    Last edited by annacherie; 16th September 2014 at 18:39.

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    Avalon Member Jake's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    A Brief History of OBE.

    Please bear with me, as I would like to explain a bit where I am coming from.

    So, what is an OBE? In my own words.

    From The Book of Jacob

    The Out of Body Experience is a natural, human, energy-body awareness event where one finds oneself exteriorized, and operating completely free and independent from their physical body. Free to fly around and observe the real world from a completely different perspective. Our physical human body systems have a highly complex energy-body counterpart. Part of that system of energy includes the mechanism whereby we exteriorize an actual energy-body state that can house (expand) our consciousness, and allow us to exist independent of our human-body-awareness state. The OBE state can be induced consciously through meditation and energy work, or, if you are like me, it will occur spontaneously no matter what. This is a completely natural process and is a genuine untapped human potential for all of us. The OBE and awareness of astral states has been a part of the human experience since the very beginning. Countless events in human history have unfolded as a result of information that came from ‘seers’ ‘prophets’ ‘mystics’ or ‘interpreters or dreams’. Events that have laid the groundwork for religions, governments, profound historic undertakings and, dare I say, future historic episodes, are caught up in how humans interoperate the information gleamed from the LD and OBE states. In a strange twist of fate, these same ‘mystics’ and ‘seers’ have always been seen as heretics by the rest of the world, and (dare I say) still are.


    Before the dawning of Science, the OBE was always seen in the abstract, and has always been considered to be the business of Religions, or Spiritual Masters. Historically, the OBE has always been put up on a 'divine' shelf that can only be experienced through a divine ordination, or religious/spiritual ritual. There have been some very exotic induction ceremonies including, psychedelics, bloodletting, trauma, drums/music, etc... These approaches are still in use today, however they have been proven to be quite unnecessary.

    Once Science came along, and was embraced by the masses, another level of confusion was heaped on the pile, as human thought was now (and still is, unfortunately) believed to exist only within the neural pathways of the brain. Science and scientific thinking became a dogma unto its own. Science set out to discount the existence of anything non-physical in nature. Any exploration into the nature of consciousness and/or the mechanisms that bond our instincts to beliefs in God or Enlightenment, were thereby FORBIDDEN. Thus, the new dogma of Science was born. And the exploration into the implications of the ObE were put back on the shelf, and considered completely irrelevant.

    Today, we stand on the precipice of a barrier that is about to collapse, and fade into History. We have decided to take many different concepts that have been considered OFF LIMITS by religion and science, and re-evaluate them, as they are the mechanisms of the soul that have been ignored by history. We have the duty, and responsibility to push through.

    The OBE is NOT Gods territory. It is OUR territory. The OBE is not a by-product of thought, NO,,, quite the other way around. I cannot see a more direct pathway for the planet to become full of spiritually independent and sovereign beings, than to break down the belief system barriers that have been erected by History, Religion, and Science. The OBE will give you that. And you don't have to depend on Religion, or Science or Government, or Money!!!! You can put your fate in your own hands again.

    The ObE, telepathy, visions, prophecy, meditation,,,, all of these types of natural human experiences have the same core principle. And that is: Controlled thought, controlled breathing, and controlled trance induction. Again, these concepts have always had a religious 'wrapper', and science has always turned a blind eye. (Though, things are a changin')

    I am very sensitive to the thought that the ObE is still being put up on a divine shelf. I am also very sensitive to Gurus, who will try and turn this back into a religion. I am no Guru. And the OBE is not divine. Though it will break down barriers.
    If we were all to have an ObE tonight, and wake up tomorrow with the full memory intact,,, the world will change tomorrow morning,, FOREVER.... This is very potent stuff...

    I do not want to turn my back on Science OR spirituality,, therefore I propose that we keep them BOTH in mind, as we move forward. This IS where science and spirituality meet, in the minds of folks that can embrace change.

    The truth is that common folks, just like you and me have been having ObEs all throughout history, in all walks of life, and still are. The difference has always been our interpretations of them. There is no question about the powerful ways in which OBEs affect our lives. What we need to do is take the OBE off of the list of things that are unattainable, and put it back on the list of daily tasks. Throughout History, folks have not been given the tools to do this. However, things have changed,, and we owe it to ourselves to re-discover this 'missing basic' in the human experience, as it is RIGHT THERE,, within our grasp.

    I could go on and on about the History of the ObE. But I want to get to it!!
    Jake.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Avalon Member Jake's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Quote Posted by rgray222 (here)
    Hi Jake
    Thanks for starting this thread, I find this topic fascinating. Ever since I was a child, from the age of about 7 or 8 I have had involuntary Out of Body Experiences. When they first started I was somewhat alarmed but not frightened. Over the years I learned to enjoy the experience but never knew how they were triggered. They simply happened. For some reason I never spoke about this to family or friends. I had never heard anyone speak about it so I began to think that the experience was unique to myself.

    They would always start just minutes after getting into bed(definitely not asleep), I would feel my body get exceptionally heavy. The weight of my body seemed to be so great that I was sure that the mattress was almost hitting the floor. It was not like there was a weight on me, It was more like I was the weight. While this was happening I considered the sensation odd, alarming, humorous and just plain bizarre. After a minute or two the weight would release, comparable to relaxing the tension in an overstretched rubber band. As soon as this happened I would be out and up and free to go where ever I wanted.

    Once I graduated from college and started working I never really thought about it too much. Over those years it would happen less and less. About 5 years ago I started thinking about it and wondered if I could reproduce or somehow trigger the event. I laid down in bed and actually smiled at the thought of weighing a ton, I smiled at the thought of the mattress indenting from the weight of my body. To my amazement it happened almost instantaneously. Once again, I was up and out and on a journey. If I relax and get the clutter our of my mind I then seem to have the ability to do this at will.

    I have never really research or studied this phenomena but I have read many articles about it over the years. The vast majority of the info I have read deals with two factors.
    • Are Out Of Body Experiences Real
    • How to achieve and Out Of Body Experience
    My question (if your up for one) is what purpose do they serve. I have never really given this much thought, I have always considered an OBE to be self entertainment (for lack of a better description). Is there something that you can actually achieve while on this journey? I would love to hear your thoughts.
    Richard
    rgray222 Wow! Thank you for that.. Most (not all, of course) folks journey with the OBE started out as spontaneous experiences. I posit that most 'natural' projectors do not have any advanced knowledge,, but simply have a natural tendency to drop into 'trance'. (Trance being any of the different levels on the slippery slope between waking and sleeping.) Interestingly enough, I have found that most people will have OBEs in the course of 'waking up' (coming back up from trance) though others will have them whilst 'dropping down into' trance. We will explore some of the differences/similarities between Hypnogogic (dropping to sleep) and Hypnopompic (coming out of sleep) projections. Most aren't aware that there IS a difference.

    Quote Posted by rgray222 (here)
    My question (if your up for one) is what purpose do they serve. I have never really given this much thought, I have always considered an OBE to be self entertainment (for lack of a better description). Is there something that you can actually achieve while on this journey? I would love to hear your thoughts.
    Richard
    Good question. Perhaps the purposes will be unique to each of us. With that said, the purpose of the ObE is to break down belief system barriers by way of direct experience. When we do that, we empower ourselves with knowledge rather than surrender to faith. The point being that we re-enforce our goal of becoming free/sovereign beings. When I get out of my body, the filters fade away and I can think with an amazing clarity of thought. The astral airs are electric and alive. My spirit explodes right through the roof of the night... I spend most of my time playing and exploring and experiencing the joy of being free and unbound. Perhaps not the most noble of things to do,,, but I can't help it. Coming back is a bit of a buzzkill. Though I have learned this:

    1) I am more than my human body.
    2) Death of the body is NOT the end.
    3) I am part of something greater than myself.
    4) I exist, and I always have. And I always will.

    I walk with the full waking knowledge that I am much more than my physical human body, and that I will never die. Dispelling the myths about death,,, that is as good a purpose as I can think of!!

    Quote This is becoming rediculous I must stop.


    Stan
    Ha! You can come by anytime and help us to experience JOY!!! Never stop.


    Jake.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Hi Jake, thanks for starting this thread.

    I hope to get OBE’s going to have clear two way communication with HS. Once that is available, with the wisdom and knowledge of HS, it would be wonderful to reconnect with life forms and places I have loved, visit for as long as I please, and do so on my command. And support freedom, well being and joy for all who want it.


    Ron

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Quote Posted by Ron Mauer Sr (here)
    Hi Jake, thanks for starting this thread.

    I hope to get OBE’s going to have clear two way communication with HS. Once that is available, with the wisdom and knowledge of HS, it would be wonderful to reconnect with life forms and places I have loved, visit for as long as I please, and do so on my command. And support freedom, well being and joy for all who want it.

    Ron
    In a nutshell, Ron,, That is the intended goal for this exploration.. I just want to get people up and out of their bodies. The rest is up to you! Getting out of body is not the journey,, it is only the beginning...

    Jake.
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Hello Jake just wanted to know if you experienced some really good things also some very dark things? in or out of the body? and if you (whilst out of the body stay on this planet or have you been able to go to other planets or dimensions} I do have some things to share that can be unnerving so a I would appreciate a little feedback on the question's I have asked you, hope that I am not out of line saying that, if so I apologise in advance.

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Quote Posted by Jake (here)
    Quote Posted by rgray222 (here)
    Perhaps the purposes will be unique to each of us. With that said, the purpose of the ObE is to break down belief system barriers by way of direct experience. When we do that, we empower ourselves with knowledge rather than surrender to faith. The point being that we re-enforce our goal of becoming free/sovereign beings. When I get out of my body, the filters fade away and I can think with an amazing clarity of thought. The astral airs are electric and alive. My spirit explodes right through the roof of the night... I spend most of my time playing and exploring and experiencing the joy of being free and unbound. Perhaps not the most noble of things to do,,, but I can't help it. Coming back is a bit of a buzzkill. Though I have learned this:

    1) I am more than my human body.
    2) Death of the body is NOT the end.
    3) I am part of something greater than myself.
    4) I exist, and I always have. And I always will.

    I walk with the full waking knowledge that I am much more than my physical human body, and that I will never die. Dispelling the myths about death,,, that is as good a purpose as I can think of!!

    Ha! You can come by anytime and help us to experience JOY!!! Never stop.


    Jake.
    Yes I agree with you wholeheartedly
    We believe in death because we've been taught we die. Had we been taught that death is a transition than we would think very differently about death. Death is not the terminal event that we think it is............when you add consciousness to life it explains some of the biggest mysteries of science.

    I can only "assume" that teaching mankind that life is terminal serves a necessary purpose. It gives one pause before taking his or her own life. Also being born with no memory serves the same purpose. If people were born with fond memories before life people might be to eager to go back and regain that experience instead of living through a difficult (but necessary) life on earth. Sorry, did not mean to get off track.

    As I mentioned I have never really given OBE much thought, it was something different and fun that just happened. Something to be experienced and enjoyed but on a little reflection maybe there is a specific reason for the event and a valuable lesson that needed to be learned. I will give it some thought and follow the thread with some 'joy'ful anticipation.
    Richard

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Quote Posted by gardener2 (here)
    Hello Jake just wanted to know if you experienced some really good things also some very dark things? in or out of the body? and if you (whilst out of the body stay on this planet or have you been able to go to other planets or dimensions} I do have some things to share that can be unnerving so a I would appreciate a little feedback on the question's I have asked you, hope that I am not out of line saying that, if so I apologise in advance.
    Na, mate. You can ask anything you like, at any time. Or you can chime in with what you know at any time. I don't have all of the pieces of the puzzle.

    I think it is safe to say that we all experience darkness in our physical lives. My friend, I have definitely experienced dark places whilst out of body. Make no mistake. To transcend the physical body is not the same thing as transcending 'duality'. There is still dark and light, in my experience. I've had deep and dark questions in my soul, and to expose them, meant to experience some deep and dark things.. Ask and ye shall receive, but remember to be careful what you ask for. Much of what will be experienced in the astral will be a direct reflection of how you question your life in the physical, and vice versa. (As above/so below)

    I don't want to jump the gun here, as I will have quite a bit to say about it,, but I have been to other planets, been aboard spacecraft, seen the destruction of planets,, I have memories of other worlds, and specifically seeing 'UFOs',,, I've been held paralyzed whilst having all my vital energies bled out of me by very mean little bastards. Again, I may have asked for it. Yes there is darkness. Much of the reason that I feel it important to point out the ACTUAL mechanisms of projection is to dispel much of the 'fear based self questioning' that bleeds over/into the OBE. Also, I intend to propose a new take on 'abduction', with regards this discussion and the implications of 'astral technology', and extra-dimensional realities. We have the keys to the locks of this mystery right in our little hands!!!!

    Much of this is unnerving, no need to apologize.
    Jake.

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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Quote Posted by rgray222 (here)
    We believe in death because we've been taught we die. Had we been taught that death is a transition than we would think very differently about death.
    Absolutely!! That is exactly it, too.. Also, through direct experience out of the body, maybe we can learn to better transition the life/death/incarnation process, so that we are not born with amnesia.. We can change the whole dynamic by open studies into the OBE... IMHO... lol.

    Jake.
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    Default Re: The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

    Thank you Jake, I look forward to joining you in this most audacious quest for self discovery. Thank you.... N

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