The Out-of-Body-Experience. A Place Where Science and Spirituality Meet.

[Jake]

Posted by Rachel (here)
Hi Jake, I have a question relating to what you wrote here -

A loose definition of OBE is any experience that you have that is beyond the restraints of the physical body... You don't have to be outside your body like a ghost,, there are different flavors to this overall experience.

I was wondering if you could expand on the different flavours you mention here please?

I have been out of my body but only once in the way that people generally define OBEs to be (I was four yrs old). I almost had another one more recently, I began vibrating and was floating out through my shoulders but then I slid back in before I could get completely out. Anyway, the reason I'm asking is because I have a lot of various types of experiences and I did experience some of them as being out of my body but now I'm wondering if some of those OBE experiences were more like psychic experiences. Here's an example of the type that I'm referring to (an excerpt from an experience I shared on another thread) -

I reached out to a young man who had just died a couple of days previously. I was convinced he'd been murdered, so I told him what I thought, I told him I was sorry that had happened to him and then I asked him to let me know if there was anything I could help him with.

I then laid down and closed my eyes to focus on receiving any messages from him. After a few moments I was suddenly standing outside on the road in front of my house, looking up at the night sky (this was during the day). I noticed two stars which were much brighter than the rest and then my attention was drawn to the star on the left, which pulsed brighter for a second (I understood this to be showing me him entering here from the other side). The next instant I was back laying on my bed and I watched the spirit of the man I had addressed walk through the bedroom door. He then instantly put me to sleep (with consent from my HS, so I have no problem with spirits taking such liberties) and we spoke in private in a small wooden room. We hadn't been speaking for long when he had to leave. I pestered him to stay longer but he insisted he had to go right then, he then left and I woke up.

Is there some sort of rule of thumb that you have that distinguishes between psychic and OBE experiences? I'm thinking of the difference between the above example and RVing. When I'm RVing I experience being where my body is, while seeing (or attempting to) the target, whereas in experiences like the above example I experience it as being out of my body. Would you agree it comes down to our personal sense of it?

Hi Rachel.. There are many layers to this onion.. The level of consciousness that we carry in our everyday waking lives is merely one of them.. My definition of an OBE is that it is an Energy Body Experience... which makes the OBE a more tactile, more dense experience than say,, RV...

Our minds/consciousness reach out in different ways in order to glean what it is we are observing... For example,,, when there is something cooking,, our sense of smell gathers the info without us ever inducing any process.. We might LOOK at what's cooking.. again, an automatic process that we don't have to think about,, quite natural..

If we sort of relate that to how we have come to view our experiences with consciousness, it makes more sence...

Let me explain... 😊 The dreaming mind is in there doing it's job,, dreaming.. It thinks that IT is the one at the center of its journey, and that IT is the one living a life.. It carries on in a non-physical world, vaguely aware of a higher self,, and quite insist that it's world is solid and physical... (just like we do in our 'physical' world... lol...)

So both experiences are simply FLAVORS of our TRUE existence...

When one is Remote Viewing, one will still be aware of their physical body... When in an OBE, as soon as you think about your physical body,, it triggers a 'return'.. it's not so difficult, really... There are a vast number of ways to expand/house consciousness so as to explore our worlds.. This is not the primary reality.. this physical world is only one way we are experiencing living...

If we start by assuming that THIS is the primary reality, then trying to have an OBE will be,, well,, limiting... it is the same with RV and psychic experiences...

All worlds are soft, subtle,, energetic/mental constructs... including this one.. (there are no particles in dreams, though you can't tell that to the dreamer..)

Somewhere in the vastness,, we are large conscious minds observing and experiencing... As much as we believe we are physical, will be as much as we will be confused about these non-physical (OBE/RV) ways in which we glean information...

The mental travelers and psychics are traversing those mental planes and can become part of the scene or just be an observer... That is their gift and it is wonderful... Many of us who are having OBEs, are having Energy Body Phenomenon,, that is our gift, and it is wonderful... Mental, spiritual, physical, astral,,, etc,,, these are all different ways we are experiencing our worlds... but we are experiencing them at a higher level,, we just don't fully realize it yet... We are the dreamer who is living the dream,,, we think it is real, though vaguely aware that it ISN'T.. from a higher level, we may not know a difference between RV, OBE, Psychic...

If I take a big Sniff.. I will simply smell what I smell.. That is how I perceive smells.. However, if I am my Nose,, there may be an entire plethora of ways that I experience different smells, highlights, aromas, etc..

I can imagine that my soul comes from a more Energetic world.. Therefore my sojourns are an energetic experience ie,, OBE... I can imagine that you (soul/essense) may come from a more mental plane.. Therefore your sojourns will be more mental, ie RV...

I have absolutely no idea if I touched on your question.. lol... I try and get folks up and out of their bodies as soon as possible so they can judge it for themselves...

it may very well be that the OBE is the 'thrill-ride' version of sojourning... RV/Psychic may be the peaceful path to the same place...

Merrily merrily merrily merrily...
Jake

[Jake]

Posted by Ron Mauer Sr (here)
OK Jake, here is your target.
Let me know if you find the stargate in the pictures or find it when you are out and about. If you find it please let me know where it is.

This will be fun.. I have no idea what you are talking about... I guess I will see it when I get there... Just make sure you leave a light on for me... (permission to explore..)

Cheers,
Jake

[Ron Mauer Sr]

Jake, Carol Clarke told me there was a stargate (portal) on the property. If she is correct, it might be fun to locate it.

[Jake]

Posted by Ron Mauer Sr (here)
Jake, Carol Clarke told me there was a stargate (portal) on the property. If she is correct, it might be fun to locate it.

Fair enough.. I'm clearing my dance sheet... lol. I am clearing my goal list, and I'm gonna give it my attention... I'm going for a Real Time Projection. My goal is to find you. My secondary goal is to find your target,, with only the intent to locate it... If I have a good clear night,,, I Will try and pull you out.. Generally, my Real Time Projections are very short,, minute to minute and a half...

On a side note,, I think I have figured out where I was in the last OBE that I described... The good sign is that I was clearly asking where you were in the Astral,,, I will find you.. I'm used to 'flying blind',, so to speak... lol...

Be forewarned,, if you don't get up,, I'm tickling the **** out of your feet...

Jake..

[Ron Mauer Sr]

Posted by Jake (here)

Posted by Ron Mauer Sr (here)
Jake, Carol Clarke told me there was a stargate (portal) on the property. If she is correct, it might be fun to locate it.

Fair enough.. I'm clearing my dance sheet... lol. I am clearing my goal list, and I'm gonna give it my attention... I'm going for a Real Time Projection. My goal is to find you. My secondary goal is to find your target,, with only the intent to locate it... If I have a good clear night,,, I Will try and pull you out.. Generally, my Real Time Projections are very short,, minute to minute and a half...

On a side note,, I think I have figured out where I was in the last OBE that I described... The good sign is that I was clearly asking where you were in the Astral,,, I will find you.. I'm used to 'flying blind',, so to speak... lol...

Be forewarned,, if you don't get up,, I'm tickling the **** out of your feet...

Jake..

While sleeping, I've had someone pull my toes while I was the only physical human in the house. Must have been someone with a sense of humor.

The playing card is on the wood stove, face up.

And similar to the "Motel 6" commercial, "We'll leave the light on for 'ya".

[Jake]

Early morning projection. About 3:30am.. I woke to go to the bathroom and lay back down, I tickled the eye trigger and felt a robust twinge of energy.. Before I went further, I clearly held in my mind my new goals. I began to visualize myself in an elevator,, (good trick,, try it after a brief sleep,, it is a method to lower yourself into deeper states...) After a bit,, I got to a floor where I immediately felt very strong energy.. no vibrations, just a strong steady stream.. I got up and out easily.. it was dark so I allowed my vision to adjust.. I was definitely in my house. I made my way slowly down the hallway.. my vision kept getting dark, I would have to pause for it to adjust.. I tried saying 'clarity now!' But my voice seemed to be choked off,, I could not utter words... I remember Thinking about how to get to Ron... I remember thinking, 'I'd better keep it short..' I phased back into the physical and got up and jotted down some notes and dozed back off to sleep...

Both the loss of vision and the the loss of a voice has always meant (for me) lack of energy...

It only gets better from here.. I'll begin an Energy work regiment immediately.. I've been slackin...

Cheers...
Jake

[samildamach]

Posted by Jake (here)

Posted by Rachel (here)
Hi Jake, I have a question relating to what you wrote here -

A loose definition of OBE is any experience that you have that is beyond the restraints of the physical body... You don't have to be outside your body like a ghost,, there are different flavors to this overall experience.

I was wondering if you could expand on the different flavours you mention here please?

I have been out of my body but only once in the way that people generally define OBEs to be (I was four yrs old). I almost had another one more recently, I began vibrating and was floating out through my shoulders but then I slid back in before I could get completely out. Anyway, the reason I'm asking is because I have a lot of various types of experiences and I did experience some of them as being out of my body but now I'm wondering if some of those OBE experiences were more like psychic experiences. Here's an example of the type that I'm referring to (an excerpt from an experience I shared on another thread) -

I reached out to a young man who had just died a couple of days previously. I was convinced he'd been murdered, so I told him what I thought, I told him I was sorry that had happened to him and then I asked him to let me know if there was anything I could help him with.

I then laid down and closed my eyes to focus on receiving any messages from him. After a few moments I was suddenly standing outside on the road in front of my house, looking up at the night sky (this was during the day). I noticed two stars which were much brighter than the rest and then my attention was drawn to the star on the left, which pulsed brighter for a second (I understood this to be showing me him entering here from the other side). The next instant I was back laying on my bed and I watched the spirit of the man I had addressed walk through the bedroom door. He then instantly put me to sleep (with consent from my HS, so I have no problem with spirits taking such liberties) and we spoke in private in a small wooden room. We hadn't been speaking for long when he had to leave. I pestered him to stay longer but he insisted he had to go right then, he then left and I woke up.

Is there some sort of rule of thumb that you have that distinguishes between psychic and OBE experiences? I'm thinking of the difference between the above example and RVing. When I'm RVing I experience being where my body is, while seeing (or attempting to) the target, whereas in experiences like the above example I experience it as being out of my body. Would you agree it comes down to our personal sense of it?

Hi Rachel.. There are many layers to this onion.. The level of consciousness that we carry in our everyday waking lives is merely one of them.. My definition of an OBE is that it is an Energy Body Experience... which makes the OBE a more tactile, more dense experience than say,, RV...

Our minds/consciousness reach out in different ways in order to glean what it is we are observing... For example,,, when there is something cooking,, our sense of smell gathers the info without us ever inducing any process.. We might LOOK at what's cooking.. again, an automatic process that we don't have to think about,, quite natural..

If we sort of relate that to how we have come to view our experiences with consciousness, it makes more sence...

Let me explain... 😊 The dreaming mind is in there doing it's job,, dreaming.. It thinks that IT is the one at the center of its journey, and that IT is the one living a life.. It carries on in a non-physical world, vaguely aware of a higher self,, and quite insist that it's world is solid and physical... (just like we do in our 'physical' world... lol...)

So both experiences are simply FLAVORS of our TRUE existence...

When one is Remote Viewing, one will still be aware of their physical body... When in an OBE, as soon as you think about your physical body,, it triggers a 'return'.. it's not so difficult, really... There are a vast number of ways to expand/house consciousness so as to explore our worlds.. This is not the primary reality.. this physical world is only one way we are experiencing living...

If we start by assuming that THIS is the primary reality, then trying to have an OBE will be,, well,, limiting... it is the same with RV and psychic experiences...

All worlds are soft, subtle,, energetic/mental constructs... including this one.. (there are no particles in dreams, though you can't tell that to the dreamer..)

Somewhere in the vastness,, we are large conscious minds observing and experiencing... As much as we believe we are physical, will be as much as we will be confused about these non-physical (OBE/RV) ways in which we glean information...

The mental travelers and psychics are traversing those mental planes and can become part of the scene or just be an observer... That is their gift and it is wonderful... Many of us who are having OBEs, are having Energy Body Phenomenon,, that is our gift, and it is wonderful... Mental, spiritual, physical, astral,,, etc,,, these are all different ways we are experiencing our worlds... but we are experiencing them at a higher level,, we just don't fully realize it yet... We are the dreamer who is living the dream,,, we think it is real, though vaguely aware that it ISN'T.. from a higher level, we may not know a difference between RV, OBE, Psychic...

If I take a big Sniff.. I will simply smell what I smell.. That is how I perceive smells.. However, if I am my Nose,, there may be an entire plethora of ways that I experience different smells, highlights, aromas, etc..

I can imagine that my soul comes from a more Energetic world.. Therefore my sojourns are an energetic experience ie,, OBE... I can imagine that you (soul/essense) may come from a more mental plane.. Therefore your sojourns will be more mental, ie RV...

I have absolutely no idea if I touched on your question.. lol... I try and get folks up and out of their bodies as soon as possible so they can judge it for themselves...

it may very well be that the OBE is the 'thrill-ride' version of sojourning... RV/Psychic may be the peaceful path to the same place...

Merrily merrily merrily merrily...
Jake

Thank you Jake
Your description of rv and obe travellers makes so much sence and has given me a different way of looking at things.I've found it very easy to travel while meditating knowing it's not an obe.you have reminded to appreciate the gift I've been given

[Constance]

[Rich]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=DYizDDYSUtg

A nice introduction into the OOB experience with Luis Minero who is a chemist and takes a bit more of a logical and scientific approach in explaining it. He says that anyone can learn it.

[Pieman]

Hi Jake,
I want to congratulate you and this superb thread. The methodical structured approach and the content with the detailed descriptions makes this easy to follow and understand. I am a new Avalon member but have been a “lurking” guest to the forum for a few years. I have been interested in trying to Astral project for a long time now and have read the other interesting Avalon threads on this subject including; Sirdipswitch’s, Trainee Human & Another bob, all of which provide great information.
Whilst these have helped alleviate fears and concern your advice on energy work and the detailed explanation of the Munroe trigger method started the vibrations for me basically straight away which really surprised me.
Just a quick question if I may and please bear with me if you would I’ve only read about one third of this thread and you may have addressed this further on but could you please explain why it is necessary to remove any jewellery prior to attempting energy work and OBE?
So....many thanks for your help and I’ll keep you posted on any further progress.
Best wishes;
Andrew

[Jake]

(Jake opens the creeky door to the seemingly abandon room. Seeing the cobwebs and dust and neglect,, Jake tells himself,,

"I've got some work to do...")

2bCont.

Jake

[Jake]

Posted by Rich (here)

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=DYizDDYSUtg

A nice introduction into the OOB experience with Luis Minero who is a chemist and takes a bit more of a logical and scientific approach in explaining it. He says that anyone can learn it.

Luis is spot on. I have yet to do a deep dive into his Organization, but he's the real deal. Check out this interview with Luis. In this one, he goes into different aspects of our energy bodies and the mechanics there of... He alludes to energy body work and stimulation of the energy body as a tool for OBE. He goes into what the 'vibrational state', how to induce it, and what it means for human potential.. it's packed full of the goods. (The host kinda creeps me out... Lol... )

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=DYizDDYSUtg

Jake

[Jake]

So I've been busy... (MwooohoooMwaaaahahaaaa)

I've been away for awhile, but nature has brought me back. Meaning, something has happened, and I am spontaneously popping out of my body almost every time I wake up. I'm not even trying. In fact I haven't bothered trying in a couple of years. For the last couple of months, I've been doing energy work. Simply moving energy throughout my body. Just back and forth from my head to my feet, never worrying about OBE. I don't go for the VIBRATIONS. Just moving a volleyball sized ball of energy from head to toe, and back.

(The How-too PDF is coming)

There are lots of other energy moving techniques, but the central channel bounce stimulates all the major centers, and that is good enough for me...

So without trying, I am setting the stage for OBE by just doing the energy work. I do it, then just go to sleep. At some point, in the night I wake up with heightened energy body sensations and vibrations. Now, I can move out of my body freely.

In a nutshell, that's the formula. I'm getting my new computer next week. I haven't had on in almost 4 years. I'll put the finishing touches on the pdf... It should be fun.

Ron, I tickled hour foot. Did you feel it? You seemed to...

Cheers, Jake...

[Ron Mauer Sr]

Jake, moving the ball of energy through your body is similar to an exercise taught by the Rosicrucian Order many year ago. I am looking forward to reading your pdf.

I do not remember getting my feet tickled while sleeping recently, although years ago something has pulled my toes. Dreamtime is usually very busy for me.

Keep trying if you want to play. It would be interesting if you can identify the playing card I will put on top of my computer. Do not be gentle with my feet :-) next time.

[Ron Mauer Sr]

Jake, have you ever used an OBE to have a dialog with your inner being?

[Jake]

Posted by Ron Mauer Sr (here)
Jake, have you ever used an OBE to have a dialog with your inner being?

Indeed. I have a handful of different experiences with what I would consider higher self. I tend to experience astral entities that seem to be ME. I have met an old Kung Fu master. He teaches me about energy work and chi. He teaches me about creating and sustaining energy balls or streams of energy. Of course it is a high representative of myself. (He's very clever and playful,,, like Pai Mei from kill bill,, but nicer...)

Whenever u get 'tangled up' in the astral (can't move or fly) there's very often a playful light orb that gets my attention so we play tag, or hide and seek... It takes my attention away from the snag, and u can move freely again. These are only examples, really. There are many more that are quite ALIEN in nature. Pun intended.

Jake

[Jake]

Posted by Ron Mauer Sr (here)
Jake, moving the ball of energy through your body is similar to an exercise taught by the Rosicrucian Order many year ago. I am looking forward to reading your pdf.

I do not remember getting my feet tickled while sleeping recently, although years ago something has pulled my toes. Dreamtime is usually very busy for me.

Keep trying if you want to play. It would be interesting if you can identify the playing card I will put on top of my computer. Do not be gentle with my feet :-) next time.

No, not recently. A couple of years ago. But tickle, not pull... I'm going for a big energetic tickle. The kind that you'd definitely remember...

I'm finding that most energy work techniques are similar. Go figure. I'll need a volunteer group when the pdf is ready. If you are up to it,, we'll go over it together, right here on the thread. I've seen/taken several courses on OBE. We are gonna do it better, and for free!!!

I'll do an open call for volunteers soon. Hopefully sooner than later. It's been a long time coming...

Cheers, Jake

[Ron Mauer Sr]

Sounds like fun. I've had a few successes playing similar games with the Monday night meditation group my former wife and I used to host.
Count me in.

[Ron Mauer Sr]

When traveling using OBE, is the journey restricted to what is considered current time?

Can one move to the past or future by using the OBE?

I would love to have the ability to visit any life form or place I have loved. Come and go on my command.

[Jake]

Posted by Ron Mauer Sr (here)
When traveling using OBE, is the journey restricted to what is considered current time?

Can one move to the past or future by using the OBE?

I would love to have the ability to visit any life form or place I have loved. Come and go on my command.

Indeed, good question. Yes, there is a category that I call 'real time' projections... Those are (obviously) projections that occur in real-time. It's difficult to say REAL-TIME, as time isn't, well,, real. But you know what I mean. I get up and out of my body and explore the real world in real time, observing things as they happen in the physical. Just like a ghost or phantom. Real time projections are very short. 30 second to just a couple of minutes. As our focus on the physical fades, so does our adherence to a timeline. The experience shifts from an OBE to a more Astral experience. Things become abstract, and we shift into another mode of thinking. Our surroundings become quite thought responsive and our mental behavior more pliable. It takes some getting used to. We have a perfectly coherent thought process that exists outside if TIME, it's not really compatible with how we think as earth humans. It's difficult to remember the experience of being too far into the Astral. Heck, it's difficult to remember a real-time projection, sometimes.

One time, about 6 years ago,, I was living with my wife at her recently deceased grandfather's house. We we're helping fix it up to sell. This was in Brewster WA. A very small orchard town. So anyways,, I had a vivid OBE. It was like a real-time projection to me, but when I got up everything was different. I got up and out if my body. I waved my hands in front of my face to clear my vision. When I looked around, the house was gone. The trees were gone. There was no main road, just a dirt road where the paved road was. The houses down the road were not there. The horse ranch across the road was not there. I simply figured that I was in a different place altogether. I flew down the dirt road to see where it went. Maybe get a clue to where I was... Down the road there was a small travel trailer with an old Oldsmobile in front. There were 2 men inside. One if them was smoking pot, and the other was complaining while looking for his keys. I tried to get their attention, to no avail. The fellow smoking, put his pipe down and I saw that it was an antler from a deer or something.

The scene began to fade, and I was being signalled home.

I woke up and wrote it all down. Fast forward about a week.

No bull***t......

We we're going through some boxes in the house. I came across, guess what,,, the small antler pipe. It was the same one. I told my wife about it... Weird, yeah? So later that day, my mother in law came over and saw the pipe. (Long story short) she went into a long winded story about the pipe. It was my wife's Dad's pipe. She told about the dirt road, the small trailer, the old car,, etc... It's a mind feck... She even told us that it was her brother that smoked pot, and my wife's dad hated it. It was my wife's dad and uncle from a much earlier time period that we're in the trailer. If my mother-in-law hadn't come over when she did, I never would have known that I had effectively Time Traveled.

So I experienced it as a normal, real-time projection, but it was not MY time period. It was all quite spontaneous.

I have a handful of what I believe are future lives of mine. Very strong and powerful projections that show me how I die in a future life. I can't verify the future though... Lol...

I try and keep my OBES short, so I can remember them. Once our focus shys away from the real-time OBE event, our memory of the event becomes evasive.

There's a lot going on out there,, (in here,, whatever..)

I WILL ticke your feet, Ron... Lol...

Jake