Did you know police can just take your stuff if they suspect it’s involved in a crime? They can!

[jerry]

This is a serious growing trend, and a must see report by Last Week Tonight with John Oliver's ironic twist of humor that aint no joke

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=3kEpZWGgJks

[jerry]

Your stuff, If its involved can most certainly be taken . An example from the video describes a family losing their house because of their son was nabbed with a $40 piece of heroin. From the local news reports and papers these horror stories are hidden from most, when they should be headlined on national news to expose the corrupt criminal police state system, and the flaws in the laws.

[ZooLife]

I have heard some about this subject but this blows my mind. I suspect the show has only scratches the surface on this.

This honestly has the look of third world corruption.

The only question left is....how low will law enforcement go in the US in the coming years.

[ceetee9]

I have not yet viewed the video, but this all started with the enactment of the RICO (Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations) Act signed into law by President Nixon in 1970. The law, we were told, was designed to provide extended penalties for racketeers (e.g., the Mafia and the like), but its reach has been greatly expanded since then and many cases of abuse of the law over the years have occurred where people have lost homes, cars, boats, planes, etc with little or no involvement in the crime in which they were accused of being a participant. Some were able to reclaim what was stolen from them by the government, but it cost them dearly financially, psychologically and emotionally.

I said when this law was enacted that it would go much further than the carrot they dangled to get the public to accept it. Is anyone really shocked that that has occurred?

[Jake]

My dad popped off to a fish and wildlife authority while showing his legal papers for his boat and truck.. They said that they had 'probable cause' to think that he was going to let my daughters ride on the bumper of the truck when they weren't looking... ???? They seized his boat,, they actually handcuffed him (fish and wildlife?) cops were not called until my dad called them later, after we were escorted off of 'Government Property'. (We were at a park...) Police told my dad that he was SOL.... Gave him this to chew on,, from the Prosecutors Manuel for Fish and Wildlife Violations:


A. Civil Forfeiture

Boats, airplanes, vehicles, motorized implements, conveyances, gear, appliances or other articles may be subject to civil forfeiture regardless of whether they have been seized as evidence. WDFW enforcement officers may seize these items without warrant if they have probable cause to believe the items were held with intent to violate, or were used in violation of RCW Title 77 or the Department’s rules. RCW 77.15.070. A conviction is not required for this type of civil forfeiture.

The Legislature intended civil forfeiture to be a remedial civil sanction. Civil forfeiture does not constitute “punishment” for purposes of the double jeopardy clause of either the Washington or U.S. Constitutions . Thus, double jeopardy does not preclude criminal prosecution for the same offense that triggered the civil forfeiture.




You bet yer arss they have NO problem taking your property... Dad just let them keep it.. They sold it at auction for half of what it was worth, and kept the money... NO CRIME NOT EVEN CHARGES....


This is not the America that he grew up in....
Jake.

[jerry]

They didn't even do this sh!t in Germany until after the fact , we will all be homeless in a state of disillusion . Most wont even listen ,I cant count the folks that consider me nuts because of my so called radical views . I've learned to keep my mouth shut, unless another brings up the topic, while I work on my spirituality to deal with this reality.

[sigma6]

Anything registered in the public has a split title... the registrar is the legal title holder in the public, and you are the equitable title holder in the private, this and many other factors underlie the legal dynamic of what is going on... If you just try to operate as the "citizen, under automatic presumption of jurisdiction in the public, and allow the government to act as your trustee under these presumptions... your toast...

"A second significant development in the evolution of uses and trusts was the adaptation of the concept of equitable (beneficial) interest for much more elaborate purposes. Originally the use or trust related only to land. All that was required to create an enforceable right for the beneficiary in equity was that the land be conveyed unto and to the use of the trustee in fee simple, in trust for the cestui que trust [beneficiary]..."

"...When one considers the simplicity of this method of splitting legal title from beneficial enjoyment of property, it is not surprising that the cestui que trust, or beneficiary, came to be thought of as the real owner—or, as sometimes stated in modern terminology, the “beneficial owner”—of the property..."

- Beneficial Ownership & The Income Tax Act - Catharine Brown Canadian Tax Journal (2003) Vol 51, No1

[gripreaper]

It's not your stuff. Where did we get the notion that we hold allodial title to anything, including ourselves? This is what we need to get through our thick sculls.

WE were pledged to the state at birth, by our parents signing and registering a birth certificate, and we confirmed this ownership by the state through registering a social security card, a drivers license, voter registration, and all manner of contracts of adhesion. We receive benefits and privileges by being registered statutory citizens, and are therefore subject to all the statutes, rules and regulations which the state wishes to impose on us.

We are slaves. We use Federal Reserve Notes for exchange, which do not belong to us, but belong to the international banksters. We place these promissory notes in accounts at their banks using social security numbers, which are commingled in the general fund, and leveraged and risked for the profits of the state, funding the corporatocracy, funding covert mercenary imperialism, and raping and pillaging all around the globe for the self aggrandizing hedonism of a few.

WE give ALL our energy to support this corrupt system. We have acquiesced and are complicit in this support, and most will vehemently defend this system against their own family and friends, chastising those who would speak against it.

This virtual prison operates without bars, and is virtually self regulating, and permeates the very consciousness and cells of almost all humans on the planet, so don't get too worked up about it.

Until we ADMIT we are the glue that holds this system together, we will not change it.

[Frederick Jackson]

Was aware several years ago of I think Louisiana State Troopers taking cars during stops. Widespread practice regarding drugs. I believe is all unconstitutional "search and seizure". And indeed this must become a national issue and stopped immediately. That Fish and Wildlife Service story is hair raising. The story of taking that parents house for a 40 dollar drug bust of the child even more so. The FWS is bad enough with their inane slaughter of wildlife. Now we add their acting like third world corrupt cops?

More is being posted on PA having to do with the growing abuse of authority by police and I have read enough in the newspaper in recent years to believe this is true, that this is a real growing problem. I wonder how much it is being driven by the general collapse of civility in our society and by problems dealing with such a heterogeneous population.

[Octavusprime]

Bump!

John Oliver tackles some real important issues even if he uses comedy to do it. He is right up there with Russel Brand and Jon Stewart. There is a long list of great comedians that speak the truth with a smile, even when the truth hurts. Bill Hicks, George Carlin, Joe Rogan just to name a few.

Why is it that often those who see the corrupt and vileness of the world also have the strength to laugh about it? I guess that's all you can do to some degree, enough to drive a person mad if they think about it too deeply.

[Fellow Aspirant]

I'm really glad that John Oliver has taken this up. Here's a copy of my post on this from last September, about the "on-road" version of this outrage. It will take a long time for this system of theft to be taken down. It's HUGE.

American Travel Warning - For Those Visiting America

FYI: I have now added a link at the end of this post to a similar expose, which was just posted on the Slate site. It concerns the atrocities being committed in Philadephia courts.

Here's my first post:

Yet another warning to travellers and tourists about dangers lurking abroad - this time, though, it's issued to Canadians driving in the United States. It applies to anyone driving a car in the U.S. though.

I knew that this was happening, but I had no idea it was being conducted in such an organized, widespread and aggressive way. So police forces at every level are sending their officers to privately run courses so they can learn the proper techniques for conducting a 'shakedown'? Are you kidding me?

Seems impossible, but it's a real and growing problem. What the hell is going on with our southern cousins?

Copied below is the whole piece, as published by the CBC News yesterday. It was written by their senior Washington correspondent, Neil Macdonald.

Here's the link to the online page ...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/america...oney-1.2760736

And here's the article in its entirety:

American shakedown: Police won't charge you, but they'll grab your money

U.S. police are operating a co-ordinated scheme to seize as much of the public’s cash as they can

On its official website, the Canadian government informs its citizens that “there is no limit to the amount of money that you may legally take into or out of the United States.” Nonetheless, it adds, banking in the U.S. can be difficult for non-residents, so Canadians shouldn’t carry large amounts of cash.

That last bit is excellent advice, but for an entirely different reason than the one Ottawa cites.

There’s a shakedown going on in the U.S., and the perps are in uniform.

Across America, law enforcement officers — from federal agents to state troopers right down to sheriffs in one-street backwaters — are operating a vast, co-ordinated scheme to grab as much of the public’s cash as they can; “hand over fist,” to use the words of one police trainer.

Roadside seizure

It usually starts on the road somewhere. An officer pulls you over for some minor infraction — changing lanes without proper signalling, following the car ahead too closely, straddling lanes. The offence is irrelevant.

Then the police officer wants to chat, asking questions about where you’re going, or where you came from, and why. He’ll peer into your car, then perhaps ask permission to search it, citing the need for vigilance against terrorist weaponry or drugs.

What he’s really looking for, though, is money.

'Authorities claim it’s legal, but some prosecutors and judges have called it what it is: abuse. In any case, it’s a nasty American reality.'

And if you were foolish (or intimidated) enough to have consented to the search, and you’re carrying any significant amount of cash, you are now likely to lose it.

The officer will probably produce a waiver, saying that if you just sign over the money then the whole matter will just disappear, and you’ll be able to go on your way.

Refuse to sign it, and he may take the cash anyway, proclaiming it the probable proceeds of drugs or some other crime.

Either way, you almost certainly won’t be charged with anything; the objective is to take your money, not burden the system.

You’ll have the right to seek its return in court, but of course that will mean big lawyer’s fees, and legally documenting exactly where the money came from. You will need to prove you are not a drug dealer or a terrorist.

It might take a year or two. And several trips back to the jurisdiction where you were pulled over. Sorry.

In places like Tijuana, police don’t make any pretense about this sort of thing. Here in the U.S., though, it’s dressed up in terms like “interdiction and forfeiture,” or “the equitable sharing program.”

Authorities claim it’s legal, but some prosecutors and judges have called it what it is: abuse.

In any case, it’s a nasty American reality.

Powers and justifications

Seizing suspected drug money has been legal here for decades, but after 9/11 police acquired a whole new set of powers and justifications. And they set about using them for profit.

'The Washington Post this week reported that in the past 13 years, there have been 61,998 cash seizures on roadways and elsewhere without use of search warrants. The total haul: $2.5 billion.'

The Washington Post this week reported that in the past 13 years, there have been 61,998 cash seizures on roadways and elsewhere without use of search warrants.

The total haul: $2.5 billion, divided pretty much equally between the U.S. government and state and local authorities (hence the Kafkaesque “equitable sharing” euphemism).

Half of the seizures, according to the Post, were below $8,800. Only a sixth of those who had money taken from them pursued its return.

Some, no doubt, were indeed drug dealers or money launderers and just walked away from the money. Others just couldn’t spare the expense and time of going to court.

Of those who did, though, nearly half got their money back, a statistic that fairly screams about the legitimacy of the seizures.

So does another fact: In many cases, authorities offer half the money back – money they’d claimed was proceeds of crime. And when they do issue a cheque, they almost always insist their victim sign a legal release promising never to sue.

It would also appear police like to target minorities, who tend to be cooperative and less likely to hire a lawyer.

Civil rights advocates have documented all sorts of outright legal theft:

The (minority) businessman from Georgia who was relieved of $75,000 he’d raised from relatives to buy a restaurant in Louisiana.
The (minority) church leaders who were carrying nearly $30,000 from their Baltimore parishioners to carry out church activities in North Carolina and El Salvador.
The young college grad with no criminal record on his way to a job interview out West who was relieved of $2,500 lent to him by his dad for the trip.

News outlets here have reported many such abuses over the years. But the Washington Post’s latest investigation exposes money-grabbing as big business.

It involves a nationwide network of enforcement agencies (except in the few states that have banned it) that operates with the help of a vast private intelligence service called “Black Asphalt” (police forces pay an enrolment fee of $19.95). The network uses consultants and trainers who either charge fees or operate on contingency, keeping a percentage of cash seized by their police pupils.

Police forces use the money to finance their departmental budgets, sometimes spending it on luxury vehicles, first-class tickets to conferences, and lavish quarters. They regard the money as rightfully theirs. One prosecutor used seized cash to defend herself against a lawsuit brought by people whose cash she seized.

It’s just human nature, really.

Give police the legal ability to take someone’s money, and to claim it’s in the national interest, and then tell them they can keep a nice chunk of it, and what other result could there be?

Travel advice

So, for any law-abiding Canadian thinking about an American road trip, here’s some non-official advice:

Avoid long chats if you’re pulled over. Answer questions politely and concisely, then persistently ask if you are free to go.

Don’t leave litter on the vehicle floor, especially energy drink cans.

Don’t use air or breath fresheners; they could be interpreted as an attempt to mask the smell of drugs.

Don’t be too talkative. Don’t be too quiet. Try not to wear expensive designer clothes. Don’t have tinted windows.

And for heaven’s sake, don’t consent to a search if you are carrying a big roll of legitimate cash.

As the Canadian government notes, there is no law against carrying it here or any legal limit on how much you can carry. But if you’re on an American roadway with a full wallet, in the eyes of thousands of cash-hungry cops you’re a rolling ATM.

ADDITIONAL INFO:

Synchronicity being what it is, I was not too surprised to come across this piece in Slate Magazine just now, and I had to post it as well. It's a close-up look at the despicable UNjust behaviour of the courts of Philadephia, of all places, where they're carrying out a blatant, in-your-face version of what goes on in the streets. Holy sh*t, this is bad!!!

I'll just post the link. At least in this situation, a group of Libertarians are actually fighting back on behalf of the victims of the "judicial system":

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...ght_civil.html

[sigma6]

Posted by gripreaper (here)
It's not your stuff. Where did we get the notion that we hold allodial title to anything, including ourselves? This is what we need to get through our thick sculls.

WE were pledged to the state at birth, by our parents signing and registering a birth certificate, and we confirmed this ownership by the state through registering a social security card, a drivers license, voter registration, and all manner of contracts of adhesion. We receive benefits and privileges by being registered statutory citizens, and are therefore subject to all the statutes, rules and regulations which the state wishes to impose on us.

We are slaves. We use Federal Reserve Notes for exchange, which do not belong to us, but belong to the international banksters. We place these promissory notes in accounts at their banks using social security numbers, which are commingled in the general fund, and leveraged and risked for the profits of the state, funding the corporatocracy, fundimg covert mercenary imperialism, and raping and pillaging all around the globe for the self aggrandizing hedonism of a few.

WE give ALL our energy to support this corrupt system. We have acquiesced and are complicit in this support, and most will vehemently defend this system against their own family and friends, chastising those who would speak against it.

This virtual prison operates without bars, and is virtually self regulating, and permeates the very consciousness and cells of almost all humans on the planet, so don't get too worked up about it.

Until we ADMIT we are the glue that holds this system together, we will not change it.

You are not pledged to the state, some actuarial value of your lifetime of labour, the source of all wealth is supposed to be pledged to the State. And that is not necessarily a bad thing. If one understood how to take advantage of it. The Birth Certificate in and of itself could NEVER be used to identify you in a court of law, except by YOUR OWN ACTIONs. The government NEVER refers to the BC as "identification". The Deputy Registrar General (who's signature is on the BCs in Ontario) clearly stated that they DO NOT even RECOMMEND you use it to create identification! The issue isn't whether we are PERSONS or not, we can't be, the issue is how do you choose to establish your relationship to the NAME.

There are options. As all our UK members will attest to, it states on their BC's "This extract is evidence of an event recorded in a register of births. It is not evidence of the identity of the person presenting it" How many different ways can they bang it into our heads!? This is why they laugh at us, thinks us fools, and ignorant... (regardless that it is snobbery...)

It's not about "being" the PERSON so much, as that is a "turn of phrase" just as the word "identification" is... it's not what people think it means as far as the courts go (which is why they are occult or maybe more accurately "esoteric". The issue is about the nature of your relationship to the legal registered organization, sole corporation you hold the certificate to.

Are you taking on the surety? Or are you taking advantage of the trust option? Of course no one understands trust, or barely the concept of equity, and therefore the denial and repression kicks in... The thought of learning something that will take longer than a few months is just not worth it for some people...

Signing a social insurance card using an "unqualified signature" is another matter. That CREATES the PRESUMPTION of "IDENTIFICATION"... However you could have understood, and thus undertook to sign it on behalf of the NAME... and maintained YOURSELF in the private... That is another way to do it...

That is the principle of the matter. How it is done in actual application is up to contention (still!...) If you think that is your signature. Then you don't understand the principle, and you are taking on the surety. If you sign on behalf of a corporation, whose signature is it? If you understand that is NOT your signature you are starting to see the big picture.

SLAVERY also has a connotation of VOLUNTARY SERVITUDE... a Roman system of paying off a debt by working for another, what we call today being an "employee" The SLAVERY that you got from TV is illegal today, and misinterpreted and misleading... The system of "SLAVERY" today is VOLUNTARY (at least from their interpretation) You chose to sign certain documents voluntarily, you choose to be recognized as a citizen, taxpayer, person, etc, voluntarily... your actions clearly state that you choose to be a "slave" (and thus fall under the jurisdiction of the State) voluntarily...

Not understanding any of this IS THE PROBLEM...

And we have property rights, (again this is not what people think it means...) if you are suspected of having stolen property, that is another matter... the cops and courts are mixing it up... just to confuse people... things are getting dirty and nasty... there should be an onus for people who want to learn more about their property rights... AND how to protect them... and yes I know... easier said then done. But do we have a choice here?

[ceetee9]

I finally got around to watching the OP video. Very funny, but also very sad that we've allowed our government to get to this point.

If only we could find some lawyers with balls who aren't on the take and are tired of the corruption and destruction of this country. Maybe we could use the PTB's own RICO and Civil Asset forfeiture laws against them to confiscate all their money and possessions. I know. It's a fantasy, but it's a good one...

[Peace of Mind]

I wonder if any other animal/creature/species on this planet allow themselves to be born into such conditions. Could we be the only life form here that's trained to uphold and be governed by corrupt organized slave systems? There is so much amazing and intelligent life on this planet, I just can't say for sure if humans will ever reach that same potential.

Peace

[ceetee9]

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
... There is so much amazing and intelligent life on this planet, I just can't say for sure if humans will ever reach that same potential.

Peace

LOL! I wouldn't hold my breath Peace of Mind.

[Jake]

I've been looking for an article that I read over a decade ago regarding a fish processing boat that was seized off of the coast of Wa State... The only reason that I read it is because I was applying for a job on a boat... They told us about an employee on another one of their processing rigs was caught with a SINGLE MARIJUANA CIGARETTE,,, and the boat was seized and was NEVER RETURNED... The folks giving the jobs for their last boat told us all that we would be out for weeks/months at a time. But since they had a boat seized by the Federal Government (Millions of dollars worth of equipment) that it was more probable than not that NONE OF US WOULD GET PAID FOR ANY OF OUR WORK. EVER... We were just supposed to take the chance....

Yay government. Yay freedom. Yay war on drugs... What an awesome equation that we have to work within....

Jake.

[Michael Moewes]

Welcome to the coutry of unlimited possibilities. but only if you're on the right side of the lawsystem.
sorry but I'm so glad to live in Europe.

Posted by jerry (here)
This is a serious growing trend, and a must see report by Last Week Tonight with John Oliver's ironic twist of humor that aint no joke

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=3kEpZWGgJks

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Yeah people are searching the universe for intellligent human life. I for myself am still looking for it on this planet.

Posted by ceetee9 (here)

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
... There is so much amazing and intelligent life on this planet, I just can't say for sure if humans will ever reach that same potential.

Peace

LOL! I wouldn't hold my breath Peace of Mind.

[Pam]

My goofy nephew just got his car confiscated along with all of his earthly possessions (his addiction has led to him living in his car) as he was stupid enough to deal a small amount of drugs from the vehicle. So, Yep, it really does happen...

[jerry]

A Mexican shake down is far less intrusive and costly than these north of the boarder mafia federalists shakedowns, only in AmeriKa. I wish I had an out but like the majority im stuck . and even those who do have a little bit saved ,to take and start over elsewhere, another country .YOU CANT! The rules are set to enslave all working class individuals and the assets of ones life's work. Boggles the mind how we got here in so little time.

[jerry]

The facts you guys have shared brings to mind a very educational video that I want to share. I recommend every one to watch, and watch again, take notes, and then notes from your notes. Its a bit tough to follow as it is a dry tutorial , but its for ones own preservation , If you want to protect yourself from any unlawful stops. Done properly procedures covered here may actually help stop the seizure of your property . Uncovers loopholes and revealing contradictory pitfalls of the codes and laws of both Federal and State. Education is key and this video is priceless in turning the tables on the criminal justice system. @ about the 1:10:00 an eye opening explanation begins on speeding tickets

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=V9kVCQ0y5Ec

Posted by sigma6 (here)

Posted by gripreaper (here)
It's not your stuff. Where did we get the notion that we hold allodial title to anything, including ourselves? This is what we need to get through our thick sculls.

WE were pledged to the state at birth, by our parents signing and registering a birth certificate, and we confirmed this ownership by the state through registering a social security card, a drivers license, voter registration, and all manner of contracts of adhesion. We receive benefits and privileges by being registered statutory citizens, and are therefore subject to all the statutes, rules and regulations which the state wishes to impose on us.

We are slaves. We use Federal Reserve Notes for exchange, which do not belong to us, but belong to the international banksters. We place these promissory notes in accounts at their banks using social security numbers, which are commingled in the general fund, and leveraged and risked for the profits of the state, funding the corporatocracy, fundimg covert mercenary imperialism, and raping and pillaging all around the globe for the self aggrandizing hedonism of a few.

WE give ALL our energy to support this corrupt system. We have acquiesced and are complicit in this support, and most will vehemently defend this system against their own family and friends, chastising those who would speak against it.

This virtual prison operates without bars, and is virtually self regulating, and permeates the very consciousness and cells of almost all humans on the planet, so don't get too worked up about it.

Until we ADMIT we are the glue that holds this system together, we will not change it.

You are not pledged to the state, some actuarial value of your lifetime of labour, the source of all wealth is supposed to be pledged to the State. And that is not necessarily a bad thing. If one understood how to take advantage of it. The Birth Certificate in and of itself could NEVER be used to identify you in a court of law, except by YOUR OWN ACTIONs. The government NEVER refers to the BC as "identification". The Deputy Registrar General (who's signature is on the BCs in Ontario) clearly stated that they DO NOT even RECOMMEND you use it to create identification! The issue isn't whether we are PERSONS or not, we can't be, the issue is how do you choose to establish your relationship to the NAME.

There are options. As all our UK members will attest to, it states on their BC's "This extract is evidence of an event recorded in a register of births. It is not evidence of the identity of the person presenting it" How many different ways can they bang it into our heads!? This is why they laugh at us, thinks us fools, and ignorant... (regardless that it is snobbery...)

It's not about "being" the PERSON so much, as that is a "turn of phrase" just as the word "identification" is... it's not what people think it means as far as the courts go (which is why they are occult or maybe more accurately "esoteric". The issue is about the nature of your relationship to the legal registered organization, sole corporation you hold the certificate to.

Are you taking on the surety? Or are you taking advantage of the trust option? Of course no one understands trust, or barely the concept of equity, and therefore the denial and repression kicks in... The thought of learning something that will take longer than a few months is just not worth it for some people...

Signing a social insurance card using an "unqualified signature" is another matter. That CREATES the PRESUMPTION of "IDENTIFICATION"... However you could have understood, and thus undertook to sign it on behalf of the NAME... and maintained YOURSELF in the private... That is another way to do it...

That is the principle of the matter. How it is done in actual application is up to contention (still!...) If you think that is your signature. Then you don't understand the principle, and you are taking on the surety. If you sign on behalf of a corporation, whose signature is it? If you understand that is NOT your signature you are starting to see the big picture.

SLAVERY also has a connotation of VOLUNTARY SERVITUDE... a Roman system of paying off a debt by working for another, what we call today being an "employee" The SLAVERY that you got from TV is illegal today, and misinterpreted and misleading... The system of "SLAVERY" today is VOLUNTARY (at least from their interpretation) You chose to sign certain documents voluntarily, you choose to be recognized as a citizen, taxpayer, person, etc, voluntarily... your actions clearly state that you choose to be a "slave" (and thus fall under the jurisdiction of the State) voluntarily...

Not understanding any of this IS THE PROBLEM...

And we have property rights, (again this is not what people think it means...) if you are suspected of having stolen property, that is another matter... the cops and courts are mixing it up... just to confuse people... things are getting dirty and nasty... there should be an onus for people who want to learn more about their property rights... AND how to protect them... and yes I know... easier said then done. But do we have a choice here?