Let's Investigate the Truth on Chakras

[Catsquotl]

Chacra's The training wheels of men.
I was first introduced to chacra's when I was about 18 years old.
Someone lend me their copy of Anodea Judith's Wheels of Life.
Having head some exposure already to Hatha Yoga and advaita vedanta books I read through the book and started doing some of the exercises regularly.
This was back around 1990, The new age ideas were just emerging and being popularized chacra's seemed to become the standard in those circle's Everywhere there were books, talks, workshops about chacra's. Every book about healing (hands of light by Barabara anna brennan) for instance.

Many of my first self-help groups I signed up for back then utilized some form of chacra meditation in their curriculum to ground, to clear, to heal, you name it.
It wasn't until oh say 2003-2004 The chacra's became alive through my studies of Ascension via the writings of Ascendpress and a few years later a group who were known as raising maldek. During those years I adopted a regime of 30 to 50 minutes of visualizations and meditation exercises to clear my chacra's from implants and impurities, Puff them up and speed their spinning rotation in order to heighten their vibrational quality. Infuse them with pastel colours of synthesis etc etc etc.

Then about 2 years ago I read George Kavassilas book Our universal Journey in which he pointed to a very different idea about the chacra's.
Namely that they were themselves a manipulation tool inserted by the gods. Somehow this idea of chacra's not being a natural part of our human make up resonated with me. The weeks after that i became pre-occupied with the whole chacra idea. I didn't even finish reading Georges book.

What I did do was instead of clearing and grounding and working with my chacra's i just observed them for a while.
I scoured the internet for stories and experiences of people who supposedly had removed their chacra system. And one day listening to how Laura Lee Mystica had removed hers on a podcast i turned my attention to my chacra and within a few minutes had unscrewed them from my system and let them dissolve into dust.

Feeling pretty good for the first few days. I noticed how my energy system felt more centred and whole. I even felt more connected to my surroundings and nature.
Sharing my story on a few forums back then I was well shocked to be honest about the feedback i had gotten. People seemed to go into full cognitive dissonance and told me for the most part I was the stupidest being on the planet for doing such a thing. So I investigated further. Asked those that could RV or otherwise get a reading from my chacra's to take a look and see for themselves.

The gist of reaction stated that instead of removing them I had succeeded in closing them completely. Making the compressed like tiny balls on a stick in the middle of my being and that I would die soon.
After a few days I received a message that someone who felt i was foolish to attempt such a thing had send her goddess/guide to investigate. That entity had seen me on the brink of a heart attack and took it upon herself to reinstate my chacra's.

All that had left me very confused and I decided to let the matter rest for a while.

Last week I was triggered by a thread on PA to take another look.(about 18 months after my initial removal and reinstatement of them. And felt I still resonated with the idea the chacra's are not a natural part of our make up even though we seem to be born with them in place.

In looking at the history of chacra I found no mention of the 7 system chacra's we are familiar with in the west until 1927. Before that there are mentions of chacra as far back as the 8th century, but those usualy consists of only 3 major centers. It wasn't until somewhere in the 1600's that a hierarchy of chacra was written about in several different structures.

This got me thinking.
What if around the 15/1600's AD some archonic plan was set in motion to overlay our energy system with 7 energy centers that would allow for easy manipulation of us humans. The chacra would be ideal to easily distort a little and have us believe we have to work with the concepts they represent. That way each human could be targeted in a variety of ways according to their energetic make up and level of awareness. If not manipulated they could be made to think they could gain enlightenment/ascension through working with them. Recieving small increases of awareness and "powers" if they worked with them long enough.

Now I realize many people have spend years working with their chacra's and built careers around them so its difficult to let go of pre-concieved idea's about them.
However on a forum full of truth-seekers I'd like to invite everybody to chip in and share your thoughts and idea's on the matter so we can hopefully find some truth about them.

It is not my intention to make this a flame war, so I urge everyone to think before posting and keep in mind this is about sharing and lifting possible veils. Not for putting down ideas that are differnt from yours..

With Love
Eelco

[gripreaper]

Interesting concept. All that I might add to this discussion at this current time, is that I'm pretty sure we are made of energy in the form of light. If we postulate that source is the pure undifferentiated white light, and that moving further into density we refract into the various frequencies of this light spectrum (think prism, the rainbow bridge), then why would explaining these varied frequencies as chakras be improper? Who cares how we arrange them or what we call them. How we transmit energy into the void of all that is, and how we receive energetic pulses from the void are all that matters to me.

Whether there are only three pulses or seven may be up for further inquiry, I suppose. The terrestrial frequency, the heart in the center, and the celestial frequency, could be. Why does the rainbow have seven colors?

[Catsquotl]

Thanks gripreaper,

For the purposes of debate I will ventilate my view as someone who feels the chacra are a false/imposed overlay.

From that perspective i'd say that 7 frequencies or 7 colors of a rainbow are parts of a whole. there was a unified white light which was broken appart into 7 sepperate frequencies. at that point the whole is no longer capable to express itself as a unified whole without an external intervention.

say you draw the 7 colors on a circular chart. You could only see white if yoi spin that chart very fast. however if the charts slow down again. it wouldn't be whole again.

of course one could say that these 7 frequencies are the building blocks of the whole. However I sense that we are so much more.
and the emphasis we put on the parts would be a distraction instead of a tool to become.

does that make sense?

With Love
Eelco

[betoobig]

This keeps my so intrigated... never felt nothing wrong with chacras, but it could make sense. Marielalero talks about "energetic blueprints" that have been put on us and that we should overpass in order to evolve. Not sure she was talking about chacras...
Thanks for sharing Casquoti and please keep on the issue.
Love

[gardener2]

Hello Catsouotl I agree totally with you, I am in early sixties and have had many spiritual experiences since early childhood just when I was building up the confidence to share these experiences, somebody really didn't want to know, so I wont elaborate but I do know from these experiences that you are right, please don't take my word for it, but I do value what you have to say and thank you for posting.

[naste.de.lumina]

The light is duality, particle and wave at the same time.

[Finefeather]

It is quite clear to me that those who have not actually witnessed chakras themselves would be easily fooled and convinced of anyone's ignorant ramblings, beliefs and claims about chakras.

The amount of fiction we can find on the internet and in books claiming all kinds of things in the realms of higher frequencies or dimensions or worlds is amazing.

So it would be quite naive of me to think I could convince anyone who has not had first hand objective experience of chakras what they actually are and actually do...but I am an optimist...so I will at least attempt a simple...inadequate as it will be...explanation.

I have done some out of body research on this idea to find where it came from, because it intrigued me, and it turned out to be quite interesting.

The idea of chakra removal stems from the false notion that chakras impede our consciousness growth and hense we need to remove them.

There are people who believe that chakras are implants from some really bad Ets flying around somewhere with nothing better to do than fitting chakras to us humans to prevent us from seeing the light.

Just recently I heard a good one...chakras are gateways for evil little gremlins, and not to mention demons and some wizards, who can take over our whole body and destroy our soul...and that will be the end of us.

So having come to these findings people, who have no idea of what they are actually doing, said...”right...let's sort this mess out and get rid of the chakras once and for all and foil these bad aliens and ETs and other baddies...and get on with our enlightenment”.

They then convinced all the ignorant that this was the whole truth and nothing but the truth and now there are a whole load of people who think they are walking around without a chakra in sight

So one day someone might be walking casually along this nice path in the forest on a beautiful day, checking out all the beautiful birds and things and suddenly in the corner of his/her eye will discover this huge heap of old used discarded chakras just lying there

So what are chakras really then?

First...Chakras are NOT training wheels...they are vortexes in ALL the different auric envelopes or bodies in which we, as true Selfs or monads, reside whilst incarnated.

If you are capable...and you can train yourself...you can see the first level ones, in the etheric body quite easily...the rest are more or less out of reach because of their high frequency rate and I have only been able to get a glimpse of these whilst out of body...and even then it depends on our level of consciousness reached.

They are different sizes and have different levels of activity, depending on the stage or level of consciousness each has attained...also known, maybe, as enlightenment.

Because of the extreme energy/consciousness levels from the Causal world...from were we come...we need a series of step down envelopes or bodies to convert or transform this energy to a level which would not burn or destroy the human organism...uncontrolled energy from atomic levels is mean stuff.

So each of these envelopes...starting from the organic body are...Etheric...Emotional/Astral...Mental...Causal...and there are higher but I am not going there now...have these chakras or vortexes in them which link the different envelopes or 'bodies'.

If any one of these would separate or become unlinked...which can happen in some extreme cases...the organism would suffer in some way because it has lost the connection to the Self...the real you...the same as when we finish each life...we need to disconnect from first the physical body...then the etheric envelope/body...then the emotional/astral envelope/body...then the mental envelope/body....Only now at this point are we closest to being our real Self...free of all the envelopes we needed to don to protect us...allow our consciousness through...and thus allow us, as true Selves, to incarnate.

These envelopes serve other purposes as well...like our feelings and our mental capabilities are also determined by them.

So what this means is that consciousness as well as energy is pouring through these envelopes and passes from the higher to the lower through the chakras...and if you never had chakras...which is just not possible because it is how we are made up...we would be like organic zombies with none of our hard earned state of being able to manifest in the brain consciousness.

Chakras need to be activated, refined, and their frequencies stepped up to allow greater consciousness and energy to pass down from higher realms to our waking consciousness...and we do this by becoming more and more refined in our natures and in the lives we live with others...

The quickest way to grow 'spiritually' is to serve others and begin to realise what unity and brotherhood are...and by living our lives giving unconditional love to all we meet and touch.

Knowing technical stuff about life is fine but if it interferes with our relationships with others then we have not found the truth because all truth leads to unity and consciousness growth.

Take care...and...Be love
Ray

[Ikarusion]

Posted by Catsquotl (here)
In looking at the history of chacra I found no mention of the 7 system chacra's we are familiar with in the west until 1927. Before that there are mentions of chacra as far back as the 8th century, but those usualy consists of only 3 major centers. It wasn't until somewhere in the 1600's that a hierarchy of chacra was written about in several different structures.

i dont see this as an issue or come to the same conclusion as you do because of it.
from my former investigation on the matter, it seems that a lot of "ancient knowledge" was lost for thousands of years.
however, if you look at other cultures, like asian ones you should find info on chakras or 7 main chakras before the 16th century.

also, if you read the corpus hermeticum, which was written down apparently between 300-700 ad. and as far as i know should be mostly a collection of things written on much older emerald tablets, in the first chapter there is a conversation between a meditating person and what seems to be higher creature calling himself the shepherd of men.

the shepherd explains how plantes and men were formed and hints/says that the 7 other planets of our system are also part of us. so basically he says each of the main chakras are representative of another planet in our system.

this is one of the reasons why i dont believe our chakras are something "new". i mean our bodies are apparently covered in them anyway.

[Finefeather]

Here is a pdf I would recommend if you have the time to read it...it is probably the best work on chakras on the planet...but don't take my word for each...give it a chance...
http://www.anandgholap.net/Chakras-CWL.pdf

[WhiteFeather]

Great Post Eelco, and if i may.

Deirdre L. Aragon


Bio: A Laguna Pueblo Indian, who spent the early years of her life on the Laguna Pueblo Reservation in New Mexico. Her paternal grandmother and aunt, who were tribal healers, taught Deirdre the wisdom and teachings of her tribe. She was raised in a home where metaphysical principles and holistic healing were accepted and practiced as a way of life. During a near death experience when she was ten years old, Deirdre was given the "mark of the shaman" from the Spirit World. Accepting her abilities, Deirdre has designed several healing techniques based on her personal experiences and knowledge gained through various sources and is an active speaker. She is actively involved with A.R.E. in Northern Virginia and has participated in A.R.E. Search for God Study Groups since she was a child. She has been a student of the Unity Movement for over 15 years. You'll find her website Noble Minds, a companion on the path of enlightenment, online at Noble-minds.com. She is hosting a "Transformational Event" featuring A.R.E. author and lecturer Kathy Callahan, PhD, in Oakton, VA on Saturday, March 31, 2012. Visit her website for upcoming details


The Edgar Cayce teachings of the chakras, which are similar to the Hindu beliefs. Very few, however, are aware of the chakras as taught in the myths of the Pueblo Indians of the Southwestern United States. The following article gives a brief overview of these chakras according to traditional Pueblo teachings.

Like Edgar Cayce's readings, the Pueblos refer to the chakras as spiritual centers, which directly correlate to physical parts of the body. These centers or points form an axis in the body that is related to the polar axis of the Earth. Each center has its own vibration. These vibrations travel up and down the body's axis similar to the kundalini force of the chakras in the readings. The First People 1 of creation were given these points to remind them of their spiritual connection to both the Creator and the Earth. At the time of the First Creation the poles had not yet shifted to their current positions and the Earth energy flowed in a different direction than it does now. Therefore the energy of these chakras moves from the head down, rather than from the bottom up.

The first of these spiritual centers lies at the top of head. This is where the soul enters the body upon birth and exits upon death. As a person ages, this center hardens and the connection with the Universal Consciousness becomes less recognized. This explains why young children are more apt to see auras and spiritual beings. Their minds are still open to the possibilities Western Culture does not accept as reality.

The next vibratory center corresponds with the brain. The true function of this point was to help you understand the plan of the Creator and thus carry it out. The physical functions of the brain-thoughts and actions are considered to be secondary to that of the Creator's original plan.

Below the brain center lays the throat and place of speech. This center connects humankind to the "breath of life" in all creation. Through vocal prayers and praises humans are able to commune with the Creator from their physical existence on Earth.

Moving downward, the heart center represents the duality of nature and life. A person of true intent is said to be of One Heart, one purpose, and one ideal. If their thoughts and actions are not at one with the Universe they are said to have Two Hearts. Those of Two Hearts were the first to bring physical illness to humankind. The last spiritual center is at the solar plexus. It is the Throne of the Creator from which the spiritual life of the person is directed. It can be thought of as the central center of spiritual thought. Physically this is the center of digestion for the body.

Unlike the First People, who were more attuned to their spiritual connections, humankind today has two additional lower chakras. These are based in the physical realm and were not needed by the First People. As humans evolved through each successive world, we lost touch with the Creator's plan and became more focused on the physical world instead of our spiritual self.

Many prophecies from different cultures, including those of the Hopi Pueblo, say we are moving towards another pole shift. When the Fourth World ends and we move into the Fifth World, it is likely that humankind will see another change in our chakras. This time the change may be back to our less physical side, similar to the First People. In another generation, as we reconnect with our spirituality, human bodies may no longer have a need for the lower physical chakras. This will help humanity on our journey back home to the Creator.

According to Pueblo stories there are five worlds of humankind. The first three were destroyed because humans separated themselves from the Creator. We are currently in the Fourth World.

Link:
http://www.edgarcayce.org/are/blog.a...224&blogid=445

[Realeyes]

So many threads over the years repeating this same old Georgie chestnut; he certainly knows how to grab attention and impact his followers. Isn't it curious that George even admitted he doesn't read books on purpose or look at other people's works of wisdom, nor ancient wisdoms our ancestors discovered and left for future times.............. who needs such when master George is reinventing the wheel. Such a shame he never found the purpose of the spiritual wheel within the wheel.

So yeah, with the Georgie idea of throwing out those pesky electrons, positrons and photons that just might be infested with Archontic influence (shaking in the bones sort of stuff) . We don't need those dimensional energy fields in our auric bands, that unexplored territory means nothing to the 'image', such is no longer fashionable and its important to be fashionable. Well whatever floats your boat as the saying goes, every experience is a learning.

Imho, paranoia and superstition are well and truly in bloom with so many false prophets directing us. Please Discern, discern, discern and listen deep within yourself - you are and always will be your greatest teacher.

Anyway I will not post again on this thread, I've been here before on previous re-runs of this subject spending/wasting precious time when I could be doing somthing much more meaningful and mindful.

Good luck!

Catsquotl I thought the below might be useful for 'dates' - I did post these to you over a year ago.

Chakras are first mentioned in the Vedas, ancient Hindu texts of knowledge. Early text that provide the location of the chakras include: the Shri Jabala Darshana Upanishad, the Cudamini Upanishad, the Yoga-Shikka Upanishad and the Shandilya Upanishad. Hiroshi Motoyama in "Theories of the Chakras: Bridge to Higher Consciousness" discusses these text and that of 10th Century mystic Guru Goraknath who wrote in the Gorakshashatakam about awakening these energy centers through meditation.

According to Anodea Judith in her book "Wheels of Life", these early Hindu writings come from an even older oral tradition of the Aryan culture. This Aryan culture was believed to have invaded India during the second century B.C.E. bringing with it its culture and beliefs. Without going into depth into this version of the origins of the chakras and the associated Aryan controversy, it is interesting to note that chakras and auras are often associated with rainbows, for obvious reasons. Norse or Teutonic myth's World Tree, Yggdrasil, holds nine worlds and is graphically represented much like early chakra diagrams. These Norse and Germanic myths speak of a "rainbow bridge" that links the worlds of Midgard and Asgard. Heimdal, who is responsible for creating the three races as told in the "Song of Rig", is the guardian of this rainbow bridge and his domain is between the worlds.Freya Aswynn in her book "Northern Mysteries and Magick" discusses this to some extent in her description of the Runes of the Elder Futhark. Similarities between Teutonic Myth and the Chakra System are discussed on the "other systems and chakras" page. To learn more about one of the oldest Hindu hymns or songs, the Rig Veda, click here for "Commentary on the Rig Veda - The Planet's most Ancient Text by Sri Aurobindo". The theory of the Vedas coming from an older Aryan oral tradition is much debated. For further discussion see articles by David Frawley.

Rainbow colors and rainbow myths are present in many cultures. Two of the most noted in western culture are the rainbow that appeared as a sign to Noah after the flood and the Hopi rainbow warrior. In the "other systems and chakras" link, the relationship between the kabbalistic sefirot and the chakra system is discussed. The legend of the rainbow warrior is not discussed on this site, but is discussed in some detail in Rosalyn Bruyere's book, "Wheels of Light". Reverend Bruyere tells the story of the warrior who sought meaning in the rainbow of color that he saw around everything.

http://home.comcast.net/~chakra_system/chakra.html

[guido]

hi all,

i do believe chakra's are not to "play" with.

According to the teachings of kriya yoga, when activating the 7 chakra's in the spine (by working with certain breath excersizes) one will get peace in mind and action.

I have to tell for me this worked, this helped me to get much more peace in life. Activating the chakra's is like magnitising the spine.

Its very subtle.

Kriya technique is a old technique and has a liniage of known teachers.
It was paramahamsa yogananda who already went to America in the 1920 to spread the kriya yoga in the west. It's these masters of yoga who knew and know about the chakra's.

According to their teachings, when the chakra's are fully open, the ida and pingela (seated in the spine) become the shushumna Than one becomes in the higher state of nirvikalpa samadhi.
There are more levels of samadhi. When a human being reached this high level of samadhi there is no breath and no heart beat and no body conscious for a while anymore.
One is One with divinity. The yogis say this is the route to break through the circle of life and death. When all chakras are fully open on the moment of passing away one will leave duality and conquers dead. This they call mahasamadhi.

I have to tell i myself belief this as thruth. Why? because when i became aware of my chakra's and (so to say worked with them) almost everything became lighter in my life or more easy to deal with.

I hope you will find your answers in your search into the chakra's. In my humble opinion chakras are for good use.
Than again might be very possible with using "wrong'" technics to get them more out of balance.

with love Guido

[loveoflife]

New age manipulation for kids here. No mention of closing the chakras down or for the need to protect oneself.

How To Open Your 7 Chakras - As Explained In a Children's Show

http://youtu.be/02FkMr21xOA

[Omni]

Witnessing what feels like a chakra dissolving is not a credible way to know if a chakra is there or not. I have been shown much technology affecting chakras and it would be very easy to create exactly what is described when they "dissolve" as an illusion.

My theory is the demonization of reincarnation and chakras is pure psy op origins... They have turned pure truths into tainted lies. In my view reincarnation is not a "trap", and chakras are not synthetic archontic control systems.

Chakras can indeed be controlled, and used against us at times though. I have been shown such first hand. Just like our mind's can be controlled against us at times... They are open source and have no firewall. I wrote an article on my blog about technological control of chakras that can be found here if anyone is interested:
http://omnisense.blogspot.com/2014/1...f-chakras.html

[Gardener]

Chakras are ancient much older than 1500 years. It seems according to Hindu mythology they came about as a result of the descent into matter as a means to keep the connection with source creator (all that is).

Calling them chakras I am thinking gives them a sort of objectification, some tangible 'thing' for something that is transforming higher/faster energy into energy which is useful to us as bodies of matter. Helps to prevent burnout . Inextricably linked to the kundalini and to the psyche, to the cosmos and to the All, and acting like press-studs to the various bodies as finefeather mentioned,

Forcing the kundalini energy to raise through the 'chakras' through certain practices, before the individual has reached an appropriate or individuated state of consciousness, is certain to have a detrimental effect on the psyche. It happens automatically as an individual works on raising the consciousness through serving others and understanding the psyche, bringing their energy under conscious control.

Its also a massive subject and impossible to do justice to until an individual has personally worked through the accumulated crap stored in the unconscious, otherwise this incredibly powerful energy could easily become misdirected through misunderstanding.

Best to leave well alone until the individual knows wtf they are doing.
C

[boutreality]

I kindly disagree with the notion that Chakras are natural or in anyway beneficial. Show me diagrams of which glands and organs they "control" and I see advance tech capable of resonating at quantum levels within appropriate molecules of cells to manipulate among other things, hormonal secretions; all are associated with at least one gland to my knowledge. The lower three (along the legs) are used specifically to interface with tech.

Another thing, my feet touch the earth and my entire physiological make up is comprised of a lot of sparking/shining sources of minute light (nervous system/mitochondria/ribosomes the latter two largely a chemical burn.) So is everyone's body, and your feet touch the earth, Where does your lowest Chakra of this 7 chakra system end? How far from the Earth's ground is that? Some questions that are in my view, worth consideration.

I too speak from experience, yes genuine experience with real chakras. My further thoughts on them are already posted and I too seek to convert no one. My only line of thinking here is to provide an alternative view to the accepted mode. Yes true to me, and I feel it best that others don't just pick it up as if "here's the truth." If you're not in line for whatever reason disregard it. It changes nothing in my path and I wish everyone pleasant tidings in theirs.

[Jake]

Of course they are real.. I had a complete crown center blowout very recently... its been quite the balancing act... ive also had complete center clearing in mee heart center.. I do energy work daily... I broke my own rule regarding direct center stimulation.. I was mapping out the centers and the cucuits before I had ever heard or read about them.. there is much more to them than a simple energetic component.. I have heard of folks paying big bucks for chakra removal.. I guess money changes everything..

if I pull a muscle in my leg,, I do not assume that my leg is an archontic implant.. if another person has a stronger, physique,, I do not assume archontic manipulation. If I have a leach on my foot,, I do not cut off my foot,,, I remove the leach.. The ancient Egyptians wold not even bother to preseve the brain in their mummification process. They must have read somewhere that brains are useless...

I had to get the energetic events in my life under control, and never really had the luxury of speculation... must be nice...

Ive done quite a bit of research into the subject after someone brought it up about a month ago... Chakra removal is a brand new concept...
10,000 dollar question... I have been able to witness energy centers in cats and dogs and ducks... Differnt makeups, but enegetic systems, nonetheless.. Did the archons put them there to control and manipulate them??

Jake...

[Wind]

I can't "see" chakras, but I know that they're there and natural part of us. I have rarely meditated by doing the chakra meditation and I do feel how my spine gets all energized and it can be quite an intense feeling, but I have never tried to force anything, I only feel the warm tingling energy rising and it usually stops around at my throat chakra, the heart chakra usually feels quite tingly and expands. Sometimes the energy rises to third eye and even to crown chakra and then I may start to get the REM-visions and feeling of electricity... But it's funny, now that I started to talk about I can already feel the energy once again in my spine and in some chakras, I'm not sure if it's the kundalini energy.

True spirituality is about balancing and maintaining equlibrium, not attaining some special powers or enlightenment. Enlightenment will come once the individual has processed all the accumulated stuff, but that might take lifetimes. Until you have arrived to the lifetime when you are ready to embrace that kind of new state of (vibrational) being.

[Catsquotl]

First of I'd like to thank all of you for your time to think and write about the subject.
You have certainly given me much to think about.

Realeyes I am sorry, but i have either forgotten or never read the list of books you refer to. I will certainly investigate. As the fact i could not find written texts about our chacra system from before the 1600's although many said they were there i didn't find them yet.

To clarify I am not talking about the removal of every energy center one can find within their body. Having been scooled in TCM and shiatsu I can vouch for energy manipulation through accupressure or puncture. I am not saying the chacra are not "real" either. They are certainly there and can be utilized in various ways.

As I said before I am not a seer. I do feel though I know certain things or resonate with certain concepts and let synchronisity do the rest. Sure that's about as reliable as guessing the grains of sand in a jar, but when it comes to life I have found it to be the best way to navigate its waters.

Which brings me here. I see people here certain they exist and are part of their natural makeup. Then I see those that are certain they aren't and those that don't know.

So maybe a better question would be how can we be sure of something. Does it matter or is the fact we all look human not a guarantee we share the same energetic makeup.

For now I feel anyway that the concepts of the 7 or 13 chacra system do not symbolize my energetic make-up.
My center is located in my chest area, a little below where the heart chacra supposedly sits. The times I am aware and flow from that center I feel more whole, more human, more me than the times i choose my way to breath (low center) or think (high center), my seeing, or vizualisation is more akin to imagining a story so my 3d eye center does not function as it should be.

Of course i can list all the drawbacks I recieved from chacra work as "failure" to cleanse, grow or evolve propperly. I could also state i should let it come to fruition by itself. Doing that however does not help me live a happy fulfilling life. It messes with my self-esteem and more than once created more discord that it did me any good.

I'm sorry, but am a bit pressed for time right now.
Thanks again.. I'll be back

With Love
Eelco

[heyokah]

During my studying of Raja Yoga, some 25 years ago, we had to study "The Yoga Sutra's of Petanjali", "Hata Yoga Predipika" written by Svāmi Svātmārāma and ****"Science of the Soul" by Swami Yogeshwaranand Saraswati.

Although I learned a lot about the chakra system during this study (as a sort of an extra), the chakras weren't mentioned in any of the tree books, nor was the concept of Kundalini. The nadis (ida, pingala and sushumna) were.

I've always been surprised about that.

****UPDATE

After taking out the book 'Science of the soul' and re-reading it a bit, I saw the chakras were mentioned in there.
This actually was the book we used as students to get deeper into the chakra philosophy.

It is said in the book:

"One can take the description given here entirely literally. Although the experience and interpretation of various practitioners vary, the underlying reality of the chakras is constant, despite the small variants of the formal knowledge.

Because true knowledge of the chakras lies in the experience itself and not in mental formulations and descriptions, the practitioner is encouraged to bring to life this reality by his own meditative vision."