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Thread: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

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    Avalon Member Jake's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    I've always appreciated Tellingers work, and the Adams Calendar information.. This stuff with Webre and Tellinger is certainly not what I expected. I dont know what to think.. I will not judge this yet, as it seems like a lot of behind the scenes drama. I would love to get to the heart of the matter, but not while fists are still flying...

    It is breaking my heart that the Credo vid may be viewed as an attack on Tellinger. That would never be our intention. I absolutely love Credo Mutwa from my soul. We shared a dream once.. I have watched the vids with David and Bill and Credo 5 or 6 times!! Several times through, and I would put it up there with the best historical journalism on the planet.. There is much more than a wealth of knowledge and history, in his telling of African history. It is like a breath of fresh air, and I challenge everyone to watch them again.. Credo is no racist.. He has taken beatings,, literally,, for his stance AGAINST racism,,, ie, Sharing sacred history with 'whites' is NOT preferred with many parts of the old culture in Africa...

    As far as portals and stargates,, I will defer,, I have absolutely no idea.. It is not too much of a stretch for me to imagine that these structures were built exactly the way Credo describes,, they were simply built on top of more ancient sites...

    Please please do not speculate too much on the intentions of Credo.. He has more than proved his quality... imho...

    Love to all
    Jake
    Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. Yoda....

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    UK Avalon Member Sunny-side-up's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    That cat certainly has it's fun among them pigeons ha
    I'm a simple easy going guy that is very upset/sad with the worlds hidden controllers!
    We need LEADERS who bat from the HEART!
    Rise up above them Dark evil doers, not within anger but with LOVE

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Quote Originally posted by seeingterra: "This rather makes me wonder what Michael is working on right now that warrants this type of attack"
    My thoughts as well, all this raises the interest to look a lot deeper in Michael Tellinger's UBUNTU social structure and philosophy, there seems to be something worthwhile happening there.

    From this page -

    http://www.michaeltellinger.com/ubuntu-cont.php

    "A Blueprint For a New Social Stucture – What do we do when the global economy collapses? What do we do when the banks close down? We have to consider a brand new social structure – something that we have never tried as the human race. The UBUNTU Liberation Movement and Political party are active in South Africa and are supported by thousands of people around the world. Michael Tellinger is involved in several legal cases against the unlawful activity of the banks in South Africa – the UBUNTU Party is the platform to take this information to the people of the world."



    This appeal by Credo Mutwa was the first interview that I felt compelled to translate into Hebrew



    Two great men


    Blessings ~

    Limor
    Last edited by Limor Wolf; 27th January 2015 at 20:22.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    I would say that it is up to Michael Tellenger to make his peace with Credo, It would be great if this could be done before Credo passes over. Just maybe this thread will open up that door of peaceful opportunity for Michael Tellenger to do the right thing. I am not saying that Michael Tellenger has done any wrong doing. but he does have the choice to set the record straight and heal the situation. Credo being 94yrs old, I would say the ball is in Michael Tellengers court.

    Make peace not war.
    When you express from a fearful heart in the now moment, You create a fearful future.
    When you express from a loving heart in the now moment, You create a loving future.

    Have no fear, Be aware and live your lives journey from a compassionate caring nurturing heart to manifest a compassionate caring nurturing future. Billyji


    Peace

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    Default Bill Ryan's Email#3 Re Credo Mutwa and Adam's Castle

    I watched Credo Mutwa's video concerning his historical knowledge of what the round circles at Adam's Castle were and was surprised to find out that WOMEN were the ones used to mine GOLD for the Anunnaki. The purpose of this comment is to point out a possible explanation of one of the circle shapes at Adam's Castle. The thousands of flying "things" caught on camera from the Space Station and elsewhere in the sky of the Moon, appear to be biological. They have a hole in the middle, two fin-like projections at the rear along with a space between them which looks to me like a birth canal or excretion point. This UFO
    is just the shape of the picture criticized in the book which was criticized by Credo Mutwa. He said the GOLD was offloaded at these circles by elephants. We also hear from Apollo Astronauts that there is a mountain of Gold on the Moon, which is a relatively short hop from Earth by these Biological/Mechanical Craft. Also, Mr. Tellinger writes that Enki and Innana, the original genetic experimenters are burried 16 feet deep at Adam's Castle. Dig them up. Someone should finance Credo Mutwa's version of this early history. It cannot be more wrong than what we already have, and one might compliment and rectify the other. He is old and it is now or never!

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    If I could Jaunt/teleport myself and people at-will (Not just a few random, but much appreciated instances) with their consent.
    Well I would take all Avalonians (Mr Credo Mutwa,Mr Michael Tellinger and Alfred Lambremont Webre included) and all like minded people/beings to a place of beauty, sit around a glowing camp-fire under a star strung warm sky.

    Well what great company and what love, peace and health we could all make, being face to face!

    Thank you Billy
    Quote Make peace not war.
    If I ever win the Loto, this will happen
    (But by conventional travel means I'm sorry to say hehe)
    I'm a simple easy going guy that is very upset/sad with the worlds hidden controllers!
    We need LEADERS who bat from the HEART!
    Rise up above them Dark evil doers, not within anger but with LOVE

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    I don't know Michael Tellinger, and I'm not 'against' him. I have no reason to be. But I am most certainly FOR Credo Mutwa.

    I took the decision to publish this video (which had been on ice for over four years) — not so much an interview, as catching Credo with the book in his hand: it was all quite unplanned, as you can see — independently from Alfred Webre's recent interview, which totally took me by surprise. The mods team here will vouch that I had decided to publish it in the latest newsletter before Webre's piece was released.
    I just want to put it on the record to back up Bill's assertion here that he did indeed mention the existence of this Credo video that he was at the time hesitant to reveal to the public. It was over three month ago and is dated October 16, 2014:

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    ...

    I made a number of short videos, which were well received. A couple of them were pretty wonderful. I do have some raw footage which I have not released... one such is a 48 minute piece, entirely impromptu, of Credo reviewing Michael Tellinger's book Slave Species of God, getting more and more irritated every minute, and tearing it (and Tellinger) apart.

    It's highly entertaining, and contains really good information (Credo KNOWS Africa!). The only reason I've not released it is that essentially, Tellinger is mercilessly trashed — in a most amusing and articulate way. But I have to say, I am very tempted to release it.

    ...
    "Rather than love, than fame, than money, give me truth."
    ~Henry David Thoreau

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    All efforts to discredit Credo Mutwah are doomed from the start. For those who have known him, as well as those who have watched his videos multiple times, it is so apparent that he is nothing but honest, nothing but humble in his role as wisdom keeper. It is possible to get the sense of a person from their video expressions, body language, tone, depth of knowledge and there are many hours available for those who are interested in the deep history of Africa that is corroborated by other accounts, most interestingly, those of Malidoma Some, who wrote about the extra-dimensional nature of initiation and coming-of-age ceremonies in some countries of Africa.

    The multidimensional nature of reality as accessed by African healers, priests and priestesses, the tradition of trance possession, seems to call forth images of channeling in the New Age. Kerry mentioned, in an offhand manner, the Ancestors specifically as being suspect.

    Quote I would also urge people not to assume that indigenous people who have contact with various on and off planet races (sometimes called 'alien' which is actually incorrect since many are related to us through DNA) are not necessarily positive. Sometimes, as many of you already know, these ET races are what we call service-to-self. Just because an indigenous race claims to have knowledge and deep understanding, keep in mind that individuals as well as whole clans or tribes can easily be as mislead as any modern day human. Therefore, an unreasonable sense of awe and honoring of the so-called 'ancestors' can be misplaced and detrimental to understanding the true nature of what contribution (negative or positive) to the planet and humanity, actually is.
    This entire paragraph is so disturbing on so many levels I have no idea where to begin to break it down. The 'so-called' 'Ancestors'? Kerry has minimized the traditions of thousands of years of African knowledge and experience with 4 sentences. The assumptions underlying this paragraph boggle my mind, I am sorry to say.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    My take on what Kerry was referring to was the ET "ancestors" who appartently left such an indelible mark on Africa, in other words, the Annunaki, although how much they are actually ancestors is debatable.
    According to Sitchen and others, of course, they tinkered with Earth humans' genetics, spliced in some of their own, etc.etc. so the term is applicable by some definitions of the term, at least.
    But we are told by the same researchers and others. such as Simon Parkes, that the inheritance the Annunaki left to humankind has not been all good, to say the least, and that they have gone out of their way to deceive.
    Also that they were not the creators of humankind by any means,and that other ET civilizations have taken part in our genetic makeup.
    Africa is not the only continent with thousands of years of knowledge and experience, but I would say that none of us really have a clear and complete picture as yet as to what roles the various ET civilizations have played on our planet over the eons.
    We are really only beginning to put the pieces together, and we still have a long way to go.

    As for the debate between Tellinger and Credo, it would certainly be helpful is there is some proof of Tellinger's claims that he has given substantial royalties to Credo.
    I would think that would probably go a long way toward clearing the air if there is proof that Credo has at least benefited monetarily from his association with Tellinger.
    And if not, then where did those royalty monies go?
    Last edited by onawah; 28th January 2015 at 00:50.
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Thanks for giving me the chance to rant, Onawah. Nothing personal. But I'm not pulling any punches. This issue is too dire, too historical and too continuous for me to let it pass without speaking fully on it.

    Quote Posted by onawah (here)
    My take on what Kerry was referring to was the ET "ancestors", in other words, the Annunaki, although how much they are actually ancestors is debatable.
    This is not the case here at all and if it is, Kerry should have made that clear and been precise in her language. In the traditions of southern and western africa, to use as an example the religion of IFA, the worship of the Orishas includes an Ancestor Veneration aspect. The Revered Ancestors in this system, which stems directly from Egypt's Mystery systems as do the languages of that part of Africa, are those antecedent biological progenitors of a family and a tribe, upstanding and honored individuals whose deeds and lives were held to very high standards of behavior within a long-standing tradition of in-depth spiritual immersion not just by priests and priestesses or even the elite, but also of the every day people, who had to undergo initiation ceremonies which proved to each and every member of society that there was indeed another world, that this world lay just outside everyday human vision and that this world affects the world of our daily lives, that we are observed and that we are subject to good and evil, coming from realms outside of this one.

    This is the danger of mixing the New Age with long standing histories and traditions. And, perhaps, Credo's ISSUE with Tellinger's interpretations. He was applying new interpretations to geographies, anthropogenic remnants outside of the culture of the people who have lived in this region of the world longest.

    Some would call this cultural appropriation. Yes, Tellinger is South African and it is his right and yes, I hope that he is able to work this out with Credo but if Credo calls racism I am not going to dismiss his claim so easily. He knows exactly, through loooooong life experience, what he is talking about.

    So many people are so quick to defend cultural appropriation but when a wisdom keeper of a tradition is adamant about certain aspects of information and is then belittled and ignored and potentially cheated out of money, there is a deeper issue here and an even more relevant issue for us out here observing from the outside is this seemingly automatic need on the part of some to defend the indefensible.

    To call Credo old and senile, to seek to make his words and actions and feelings and statements in regards to what he sees as mistaken understandings and interpretations as something that is less valid or valuable than the book he is excoriating is the utmost in disrespect and paternalism, whether it is a woman or a man who says it. What, because it is written on paper or in digital ink it is therefore inviolable? His conclusions or statements, taken out of the culture of those most familiar with it, are correct because they correspond to some New Age understanding of the Anunnaki or Chitauli, or whatever extraterrestrial race may be brought to bear?

    So, um, is the Out of Africa theory now out the window too? Genetic histories of the world's people? Don't we ALL go back to Africa, then? Despite more recent genetic manipulations? Weren't ALL of our ancestors the slaves of the gods? Not just black Africans?

    Tellinger as a white S. African must be given the benefit of the doubt? I just listened to that 10 minute blurb of Tellinger "defending" himself and, once again, as with a recent individual who has been called out - and who I have known for years is not who people thought he was until Webre called him out also - Tellinger did 'not want to talk about it', did 'not want to go into detail', did not address the underlying issues or Credo even, at least not in any in-depth and direct manner. I'm sure Credo is not concerned, but I wanna know about the money trail too.

    This does not end until WE decide it ends. Until WE as a collective people decide to HONOR the truth of ALL people in the world and not to minimize those truth givers when they TELL THE TRUTH.
    Last edited by Mark/Rahkyt; 28th January 2015 at 01:09. Reason: grammar and spelling

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Quote Posted by Rahkyt (here)
    All efforts to discredit Credo Mutwah are doomed from the start. For those who have known him, as well as those who have watched his videos multiple times, it is so apparent that he is nothing but honest, nothing but humble in his role as wisdom keeper. It is possible to get the sense of a person from their video expressions, body language, tone, depth of knowledge and there are many hours available for those who are interested in the deep history of Africa that is corroborated by other accounts, most interestingly, those of Malidoma Some, who wrote about the extra-dimensional nature of initiation and coming-of-age ceremonies in some countries of Africa.

    The multidimensional nature of reality as accessed by African healers, priests and priestesses, the tradition of trance possession, seems to call forth images of channeling in the New Age. Kerry mentioned, in an offhand manner, the Ancestors specifically as being suspect.

    Quote I would also urge people not to assume that indigenous people who have contact with various on and off planet races (sometimes called 'alien' which is actually incorrect since many are related to us through DNA) are not necessarily positive. Sometimes, as many of you already know, these ET races are what we call service-to-self. Just because an indigenous race claims to have knowledge and deep understanding, keep in mind that individuals as well as whole clans or tribes can easily be as mislead as any modern day human. Therefore, an unreasonable sense of awe and honoring of the so-called 'ancestors' can be misplaced and detrimental to understanding the true nature of what contribution (negative or positive) to the planet and humanity, actually is.
    This entire paragraph is so disturbing on so many levels I have no idea where to begin to break it down. The 'so-called' 'Ancestors'? Kerry has minimized the traditions of thousands of years of African knowledge and experience with 4 sentences. The assumptions underlying this paragraph boggle my mind, I am sorry to say.


    i think youre really reaching here, Rahykt. i think Kerry makes a good point. i fail to see anything even remotely disturbing about that paragraph youve quoted. she's simply saying we shouldn't be careless with our reverence.

    when the ancients were exposed to ET's, history suggests they regarded them as Gods - wise, infallible and omniscient...even though they were likely as fragile and nuanced and fallible and uniquely complex as humans. some of them gave away their power and worshipped the ET's; therefore, their interpretations must be viewed through that lens. some of their interpretations are compromised. and some of the knowledge passed on from the ET's was anchored in sophism...or were just plain lies. the ancients then passed their stories down from generation to generation - not just the wisdom and lasting insight, but also the nonsense.

    this isnt anything you dont know, of course. which makes your reaction here even more baffling. i think Kerry was warning us not to regard our ancestors as our ancestors did the ET's. thats not to suggest we should disregard or disrespect them either. it simply means we should balance our reverence with our discernment.
    Last edited by Mike; 28th January 2015 at 01:55.
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Only Kerry can clarify what she meant, so I think it would be wise not to jump to conclusions about that.
    Whatever Tellinger's personal failings may be, and I think all human beings have them, I will say it again: I am deeply grateful that he discovered the traces of the ancient settlements and mines, because our future is very much dependent on humankind's understanding the truth about the fact that we are not alone and that we have never been alone.
    Actual physical proof right in plain sight, that can be verified and dated by science, right here on the planet--not in outer space somewhere, available only to the few for examination, signifies to me a rare and unique opportunity for that truth to come out.
    The truth of our past is valuable for its own sake as well, but if both truths are trumped because of squabbles between individuals and camps who should basically be on the same side continue to bring every inch of progress that we can make towards the truth about our origins to a halt, well then, we all know who is cheering and counting coup, don't we?
    The biggest victory we can score is to come together and bury our differences, before it's too late.
    I'm not a big fan of Dr. Deagle, but maybe it's no coincidence that the 10 minute excerpt of his message in the link that Bill last posted on the Avalon newsletter thread at: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post927178
    which is:
    http://projectavalon.net/Dr_Bill_Dea...10_extract.mp3
    ...where he talks about how we have to make it on this planet as a people or not at all, may well be true, and if it is, then we really need to make that our first priority.
    Last edited by onawah; 28th January 2015 at 04:35.
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Kudos to Avalonians for handling this issue in a civilized manor. This is about two persons held in esteem to different degrees by different members of the Avalon Community and the potential for animosity is high and everything has remained remarkably civil. It certainly helped that Bill Ryan started the ball rolling here with a very civil minded tone.

    There are really two separate sets of charges against Michael Tellinger and we need to keep them in mind and keep them separate:

    1) Charges of intellectual theft or intellectual sloppiness in Tellinger's work. This is a big area and discussed in a rather general way by Credo Mutwa. I don't think I could make a judgement about this without reading Tellinger's book and then hearing rather in depth critical analysis of them.

    2) Charges of financial theft or impropriety or just poor ethics when it comes to sharing the proceeds earned by a collaborative effort. This is laid our quite specifically by Mel Ve in her e-mails to Alfred Webre. Also Credo and his wife confirm those charges in the video below.

    While I have not come to any final conclusions, the recent interview of Tellinger by Vinny Eastwood http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2gdf_fMcgQ (posted earlier by seehas), is helping me to make up mind. Firstly, Eastwood doesn't sound very prepared or knowledgeable about the charges, and doesn't get into any detail with Tellinger or ask him the hard questions. Tellinger could have discussed what happened between him and Mel Ve from his perspective, and could have address her very specific charges, but he chose not to. Instead he uses character assassination: "Alfred Webre has gone beserk" and "Mel Ve is just a gossip monger." and then goes on to play the victim card and claims that they are just attacking his Ubuntu movement, although no explanation as to why one would do that.

    Then Tellinger first highly praises Credo Mutwa, but then ends his interview telling us that Credo is "not as clean as you think" but refuses to tell us why. If you are going to denounce someone as a criminal, you aren't doing the that person any favors by not telling them what the crime is.

    Tellinger also makes is seem as if Credo is suffering from senility and has been high pressured by his interviewers to put down Tellinger. I don't know if this is the interview Tellinger is speaking of, but here he is with Alfred Webre with Credo Mutwa, who has certainly aged since his interview with Bill Ryan and David Icke visited him in 2010, but still has his eloquence and wit, and without and pressure from Alfred, he and his sister-wife state that Tellinger never fulfilled his end of the deal, to pay them 50% of the profits from their 2008 contract.

    If Micheal Tellinger wants to put the charges against him to bed, he just needs to produce some cancelled checks or bank statements or other proof of payment to Credo Mutwa, and similar financial or contractual records pertaining to his dealings with Mel Ve. If, instead, he continues to make generalized smears of those who accuse him and play the victim card, then he does deserve to fade into obscurity.


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    Avalon Member Tangri's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Quote Posted by Kryztian (here)
    Kudos to Avalonians for handling this issue in a civilized manor. This is about two persons held in esteem to different degrees by different members of the Avalon Community and the potential for animosity is high and everything has remained remarkably civil. It certainly helped that Bill Ryan started the ball rolling here with a very civil minded tone.


    While I have not come to any final conclusions, the recent interview of Tellinger by Vinny Eastwood http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2gdf_fMcgQ (posted earlier by seehas), is helping me to make up mind. Firstly, Eastwood doesn't sound very prepared or knowledgeable about the charges, and doesn't get into any detail with Tellinger or ask him the hard questions. Tellinger could have discussed what happened between him and Mel Ve from his perspective, and could have address her very specific charges, but he chose not to. Instead he uses character assassination: "Alfred Webre has gone beserk" and "Mel Ve is just a gossip monger." and then goes on to play the victim card and claims that they are just attacking his Ubuntu movement, although no explanation as to why one would do that.

    Then Tellinger first highly praises Credo Mutwa, but then ends his interview telling us that Credo is "not as clean as you think" but refuses to tell us why. If you are going to denounce someone as a criminal, you aren't doing the that person any favors by not telling them what the crime is.

    Tellinger also makes is seem as if Credo is suffering from senility and has been high pressured by his interviewers to put down Tellinger. I don't know if this is the interview Tellinger is speaking of, but here he is with Alfred Webre with Credo Mutwa, who has certainly aged since his interview with Bill Ryan and David Icke visited him in 2010, but still has his eloquence and wit, and without and pressure from Alfred, he and his sister-wife state that Tellinger never fulfilled his end of the deal, to pay them 50% of the profits from their 2008 contract.

    If Micheal Tellinger wants to put the charges against him to bed, he just needs to produce some cancelled checks or bank statements or other proof of payment to Credo Mutwa, and similar financial or contractual records pertaining to his dealings with Mel Ve. If, instead, he continues to make generalized smears of those who accuse him and play the victim card, then he does deserve to fade into obscurity.
    Good catch ,

    I also did it, but reserved it for sake of peace.

    Credo is "not as clean as you think at 9.09 and 9.50

    Tellinger also makes is seem as if Credo is suffering from senility and has been high pressured by his interviewers to put down Tellinger.


    These unfortunate words are burning the bridges with no turning back. It makes imposible an arranging chat between involved characters.
    Maybe he was upset the involved third parties and try to blackmail them with "sceletons in Credo's closet", but he did not need to use such wording towards Credo. This interview is a failure on Tellinger's behalf.
    Now ball is definitelly on Tellinger's yard. He fired the first shot with casualties.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2gdf_fMcgQ

    I wanted to add this

    Last edited by Tangri; 28th January 2015 at 10:09.
    Love and Hope

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Keep an eye on Credo's rendition of the star peoples' descent to Earth. Credo deciphered a drawing of the place where star people descended to Earth and described a ritual union of heaven and Earth on the back of the bull as recently as 1941! The Celestial Pillar where the father of the seven Pleiades, the Titan Atlas, held up the heavens makes a clear connection with the bull. “Taurus” is the Latin word for “bull,” and the Pleiades are in the Taurus Constellation. (Hesiod, Astronomy Fragment 1 (trans. Evelyn-White) (Greek epic C8th or C7th B.C.) : "The stormy Pleiades . . . lovely Teygeta, and dark-faced Elektra, and Alkyone, and bright Asterope, and Kelaino, and Maia, and Merope, whom glorious Atlas begot.") http://www.theoi.com/Titan/TitanAtlas.html

    Southern Africa is the “right” place for a guardian of the South. All the continents emerged from the Antarctic south of Africa when Pangaea supercontinent formed 270 million years ago, before it began breaking apart 200 million years ago from its southern birthplace, the area the bull guards.

    The heavens literally join the Earth most closely at the South Atlantic Anomaly with radiation anomalies where science continues to make new discoveries. The South Atlantic Anomaly (SAA) is the high energy zone where the Van Allen Belt is closest to the Earth extends over Africa and South America. (See The Bermuda Triangle of Space.) The South Atlantic Anomaly (SAA) and the magnetic dip equator of the Earth are both situated over southern Africa. And the megalithic calendar circle is directly on the magnetic dip equator at 30 East longitude south of the Great Pyramid on 31 East longitude.

    Best regards, Krsanna

    Credo Mutwa with Bill Ryan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPBK...ature=youtu.be

    Map for megalithic calendar (Adam’s Calendar) in South Africa: http://www.allstarroundup.com/domains/13jaguar.html

    Ancient peoples worldwide oriented sacred structures to the cardinal directions – North, South, East and West. Mutwa explained that a bull shaped in stone was the guardian of the South, which corresponds geographically with the southern end of a grand cross reiterated in 2014 crop circles, when the crop designs are centered on the planet’s magnetic equator in Africa. http://www.allstarroundup.com/cc/cccosmicearth.html


    Ningishzida: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ningishzida

    Credo mentioned that in Phoenician this was Ningishzida, who was the god who guarded the southern regions of the world. Credo did not explain why the bull guarded the South, but the connection of ancient Phoenicia and Ningishzida is important. Notably, Ningishzida and his counterparts in Egypt, India, and Mexico were represented with serpents and associated with the “good tree,” the tree of life. Before Jewish and Christian ethos made the serpent crawl on his belly, the serpent was a god of life forces that protected Buddha while he meditated.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Credo's wikipage has an undertone to it, I find. You can read here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vusamazulu_Credo_Mutwa

    Did he find back the lost necklace? Or tips?

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    i think youre really reaching here, Rahykt. i think Kerry makes a good point. i fail to see anything even remotely disturbing about that paragraph youve quoted. she's simply saying we shouldn't be careless with our reverence.
    It is all about context. If she were speaking generally of popular understanding, yes. It is a great point. But we are talking about Credo Mutwah here and so, contextually, her comment was about him and the traditions that he personifies. The underlying implication being, Tellinger can be trusted because the traditions Credo represents may be compromised by the Chitauli. The specific inclusion of the Ancestor Veneration tradition is where I find offense. That is not reptilian-based. No more so than any human ancestor who has some form of reptilian DNA, which, according to the general understanding, should be pretty much all of us to a greater or lesser extent.

    That you see nothing disturbing about the paragraph speaks to your perspective and your knowledge, or lack thereof, of African traditions and spiritual systems. I am quite knowledgeable about these systems, having studied them and participated in them now for decades. There are indeed negative aspects of any system of worship, of extraterrestrial intervention in human affairs, of purposes and intentions at higher dimensional levels and of our ability to understand them in our limited 3D modalities of interpretation. African spiritual systems are renowned for being balanced, for expressing both polarities, as are most indigenous systems, of recognizing negative as well as positive entities, powers, principalities. The same can be said of all Eastern systems and Mesoamerican systems as well.

    Implying that Credo is being influenced by negative beings and traditions, though, is beyond the pale.

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    this isnt anything you dont know, of course. which makes your reaction here even more baffling. i think Kerry was warning us not to regard our ancestors as our ancestors did the ET's. thats not to suggest we should disregard or disrespect them either. it simply means we should balance our reverence with our discernment.
    Your bafflement is probably shared by many people who are also less familiar with the traditions that Credo invokes. I understand. When invoking the Honored Ancestors and impugning their orientation, one is opening a can of worms that has multidimensional ramifications. My response is not just coming from me. My response is coming from my DNA. From my Ancestors. Thousands upon thousands of them, with me, in me, rejecting her characterization of our Being as negative or even potentially so. It is an affront at the very deepest level. Perhaps this short article will help to clarify why the specific use of the term Ancestor is more than just a general term to imply a progenitor, but a word that encompasses much that is good about communal societies that live within the cyclic understanding of life and its holistic and sustainable nature.

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    In this interview, Michael Tellinger's language was definitely aimed at character assassination. The implications of this kind of behavior are important in the whole community and for many reasons.
    This is a revealing interview also.


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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Quote Posted by Rahkyt (here)
    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    i think youre really reaching here, Rahykt. i think Kerry makes a good point. i fail to see anything even remotely disturbing about that paragraph youve quoted. she's simply saying we shouldn't be careless with our reverence.
    It is all about context. If she were speaking generally of popular understanding, yes. It is a great point. But we are talking about Credo Mutwah here and so, contextually, her comment was about him and the traditions that he personifies. The underlying implication being, Tellinger can be trusted because the traditions Credo represents may be compromised by the Chitauli. The specific inclusion of the Ancestor Veneration tradition is where I find offense. That is not reptilian-based. No more so than any human ancestor who has some form of reptilian DNA, which, according to the general understanding, should be pretty much all of us to a greater or lesser extent.

    That you see nothing disturbing about the paragraph speaks to your perspective and your knowledge, or lack thereof, of African traditions and spiritual systems. I am quite knowledgeable about these systems, having studied them and participated in them now for decades. There are indeed negative aspects of any system of worship, of extraterrestrial intervention in human affairs, of purposes and intentions at higher dimensional levels and of our ability to understand them in our limited 3D modalities of interpretation. African spiritual systems are renowned for being balanced, for expressing both polarities, as are most indigenous systems, of recognizing negative as well as positive entities, powers, principalities. The same can be said of all Eastern systems and Mesoamerican systems as well.

    Implying that Credo is being influenced by negative beings and traditions, though, is beyond the pale.

    Quote Posted by Mike (here)
    this isnt anything you dont know, of course. which makes your reaction here even more baffling. i think Kerry was warning us not to regard our ancestors as our ancestors did the ET's. thats not to suggest we should disregard or disrespect them either. it simply means we should balance our reverence with our discernment.
    Your bafflement is probably shared by many people who are also less familiar with the traditions that Credo invokes. I understand. When invoking the Honored Ancestors and impugning their orientation, one is opening a can of worms that has multidimensional ramifications. My response is not just coming from me. My response is coming from my DNA. From my Ancestors. Thousands upon thousands of them, with me, in me, rejecting her characterization of our Being as negative or even potentially so. It is an affront at the very deepest level. Perhaps this short article will help to clarify why the specific use of the term Ancestor is more than just a general term to imply a progenitor, but a word that encompasses much that is good about communal societies that live within the cyclic understanding of life and its holistic and sustainable nature.
    When we speak about ancestors, it is very tricky subject. Are we talking our the grand of grand fathers or who they did serve?

    I am not familiar with African invaders(ET,/ terra origins). But I know some asian group. I understand western civilization adore it when they met a new concept and they prone to follow any kind of it without thinking that it could be the worst one.
    Shamans job is not easy, they are human and carry human's desire, they are dealing with some power which humans not familiar in their nature, if they traped in the lure of other entity's show off, they are compromising their existent. I believe Credo has a lot skeletons in his closet but it is not important, unless he sold out human kind's interest. Now, I deffinitelly interested in Tellinger's acusation on Credo's cleanliness since he open the pandora's box.
    Last edited by Tangri; 28th January 2015 at 22:45.
    Love and Hope

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    Default Re: Bill Ryan's 2010 interview with Credo Mutwa about Michael Tellinger

    Hi Tangri.

    This series has not been posted in this thread yet, although it is all over PA and the Net.





    In answer to your question in regards to skeletons, Credo does discuss some of the things that he has had to do in order to gain knowledge. He has eaten Grey flesh, and, if memory serves me, human flesh as well. I'm sure there are other things he has done also in his search for knowledge, to become the keeper of traditions that he is. The secret societies in Africa are like societies of that sort elsewhere in the world, and they all often require things of their aspirants that are outside of the range of normative human ability, as proof that the individual is willing to sacrifice substantially in order to gain knowledge.
    Last edited by Mark/Rahkyt; 28th January 2015 at 22:49. Reason: added video

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