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Thread: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

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    Ireland Avalon Member Mulder's Avatar
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    Default Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    I have had a TERRIBLE year trying to move. I found the bureaucracy plain sadistic(the staff seemed to enjoy sending me on wild goose chases & stalling until my visa expired), the expense crippling and trying to legally live in another country impossible. I was shocked at how many rules there are, and how many opportunities there are to "kick me out." Although, I never tried suspect ways like a "sham marriage" because I don't feel I'd be sucessful.

    I am truely at a loss because unless a country just decides to let in "aware" people, we will virtually have no opportunity to move unless you are a highly sought after professional.

    I've read other threads - including the "top 5 countries for Americans to escape to" - http://www.activistpost.com/2010/10/...-americas.html
    However, these 5 countries won't let "anybody" in - so how can aware people live there - especially if they have some kind of past (like a criminal record, or an illness, etc).

    I'm truely at a loss because in theory, it seems like a good idea to leave America, but in practice the rules and conditions will bankrupt the average person.

    My own research has shown the easiest & cheapest country is Dominica. Its VERY cheap and easy to get legal residence, and even a passport within 3 years*. The easiest EU country to get redidence is the Czezh Repuplic* (by starting a company and applying for a long term visa). The easiest South American country seems to be Paraguay* - where getting residence is simple once you arrive. (*As long as you have no criminal record, or illness, etc).

    Please share your own research and experinces as I simply feel I have to stay where I am, as going to a new country & being refused is too difficult to face again.
    “There is no coming to consciousness without pain. People will do anything, no matter how absurd, in order to avoid facing their own soul. One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious.” -- Carl Jung

    "To see the farm is to leave the farm."

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    Australia Avalon Member Anchor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Where have you been refused and on what grounds were you refused?
    Every majestic oak tree was once a nut who stood his ground.

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    Avalon Member lunaflare's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Hi Mulder...an expensive jaunt to Nowhere-land, it seems

    I live in a country where it is very difficult to emigrate- Australia- many forms to fill, hoops to jump and boxes to tick
    oh, and plenty of moolah. I hear this from the Brits who arrive on mass seeking residency here.
    Also, you need super hero skills that most Australians do not have...

    Sorry I cannot offer any advice. I am just responding to your post as there were no replies (yet!).
    Maybe it is a "sign" that you should stay in the land of stars and stripes
    America surely needs more conscious people not less

    And I believe that after the crash and burn, the Phoenix will rise in America

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    Avalon Member norman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    I'm going to just hope my house is high enough above sea level and stay put. I'm not very young or fit these days and I feel that I must put getting straight with my creator at the top of my list of things to do. I fear drowning in a big tidal wave but I don't fear leaving this life.

    I don't understand how some people and websites can be so sure they know what's going to happen and how everything will turn out after. I've just been looking at a map/diagram that claims to know where the poles and the equator will be after the 'event'. That's far too sure for me to find it credible. I do tend to side with the idea that it's a 'natural' event that's going happen, not just a world grab by the human crooks. One clue is in the fact that they don't seem to care how much of the truth gets talked about in the open now. From their point of view it's a done deal, they've pulled out of the economic activity and are ready to run for cover anytime soon.

    I don't think I'd want an invite to be with them even if they offered.

    As for relocation, I think it's quite important to be familiar with the environment. If I'd known about all this 30 years ago I might have cooked up a plan and moved somewhere but right now I think it's better to have local knowledge than to be a foreigner in a new land. I've looked up the hight above sea level of my home and it's 260 meters. I just hope thats enough, and if not, I hope I don't know much about it when it comes.
    “one should indeed be silent, but not about anything” - Otto Neurath

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    New Zealand Avalon Member witchy1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Hi Mulder, have you tried NZ. I know they are looking to increase population - coz we all moved to Oz - rofl. Once a NZ citizen you can cross the gap to Oz without any drama due to cross country agreement. (if thats where you want to be) NZ is perfectly fine as well but expensive but it gets fri**en cold. People are great, as they are here.
    W

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    Avalon Member Isthatso's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Witchy1 .......shooosh - we're full.

    Hi Mulder....in good conscience I'm not sure I can recommend NZ. Even with it's lovely climate and reasonably priced housing (as opposed to somewhere like...oh, I dunno, Sydney). It's just we're simply bursting at the seams with nearly 4.4 million. That's a whopping 3.9 million more than TPTB intend for the entire world population.

    Seriously though, from your post it appears you have already checked us out - however, I'm interested to know your answer to John's question - on what grounds were you refused?

    I hope you find peace, wherever you find yourself.
    "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."
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    New Zealand Avalon Member witchy1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Isthatso, you better have room left for me when I come back in a couple of weeks

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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    If you want out then why not try Asia ? I have lived in the Philippines now for 6 years and have never had problems of any kind, the cost of living is very cheap and the people are fantastic and most speak good English. Pick from over 7000 islands i'm sure you will find one that suits your needs.

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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    The difficulties of emigrating sure makes one respect and admire those who have done so in the past, doesn't it! I am thinking of those who left Europe and sailed to North America to escape religious persecution, all the Irish who emigrated to the US to escape famine, the many who left Europe during WWII to escape war and persecution, and the millions of other human beings all over the world who have been displaced throughout history by war, famine, disease, or political/religious persecution. It is extremely hard to start one's life all over again in a place where you have no family or friends to help, where the language and customs are different, and where people might be hostile towards you. It takes great courage for people to take such drastic steps into the unknown, and is very telling about how horrible their life circumstances were/are for them to contemplate let alone take such steps. I deeply admire people with such courage. Of course for them, it was clearly a matter of survival. It would be interesting to map these human waves over history - and the reasons why people took such extraordinary steps to protect themselves, their families and their futures.

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    Avalon Member lunaflare's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Yes, it would be interesting to "map these human waves", Ankenhaten (am sure this is chronicled "somewhere" in our infinitely vast cellular memory) .
    And I agree, it does take great courage. Any kind of change...stepping out and into the unknown.

    Hmmmm will we be emigrating to various planets/star systems in the not too distant.....?
    And will we be legal aliens?

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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Well one thing is for sure lunaflare, we will surely be carefully frisked before we board the rocket! :-)

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    United States Avalon Member Generous's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    I Have dual citizenship and a green card, i can basicly live anywhere. My situation give me the liberty to pick up and go whenever and wherever i want, for me and my family.
    The question is, where do we go? Where is it safe? what impending disaster are we looking at? I think those questions top my list and would like to have them answered before choosing where to hunker down.
    Just my though.

    k

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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Hi Mulder,

    I really don't see where you are finding problems. I left the UK when I was 22 years old and have lived in mainland Europe for around ten years and moved to Brazil almost fifteen years ago and across here the Federal Police were nothing less than extremely kind and helpful.

    If I were you before taking the plunge, get a tourist visa (if you need one) and take some time out to see if you like the place where you are wanting to go to. If you do like the place you can extend your tourist visa another three months and at the same time put in an aplication for a permanent residency visa - but you must need a good reason for staying - being 'aware' isn't enough, unless you consider your life in danger in your home country, but that would mean a refugee type visa.

    I think your main problem is that you need to act. Dont put problems in your way, solve them as you go along.

    Best regards,

    Steve

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    Ireland Avalon Member Mulder's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Quote Posted by John (here)
    Where have you been refused and on what grounds were you refused?
    Hi, it was a ex-communist country in Europe - I'm still upset, so I don't want to name it. The grounds I was refused were the immigration staff kept stalling me and finding problems with my paper work. The staff kept doing this until my 3 month visa ran out, when I HAD to leave and would never have been accepted as I would have been an "illegal immigrant." The staff were "sabotaging" my application and even though I corrected all errors they found, they'd always find something else. Trust me, this was a very cruel and horrible experience I won't repeat soon.
    “There is no coming to consciousness without pain. People will do anything, no matter how absurd, in order to avoid facing their own soul. One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious.” -- Carl Jung

    "To see the farm is to leave the farm."

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    Australia Avalon Member Anchor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    Well - That sucks.

    It may be useful to get professional advice when completing these forms. You need someone who has been through the process many times.

    Remember this is not a reflection on you and your ability - it is an artefact of a broken bureaucracy - a twisted game that has to be played.

    What is important is that you were not refused. Your application failed - this is a different thing. If you were refused it would be more serious.

    Dont give up! Dont feel judged! You can make this work the way you want it to - its the "law"

    John..
    Every majestic oak tree was once a nut who stood his ground.

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    Netherlands Avalon Member Paranormal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Emigrating to another country is EXTREMELY Difficult - should I stay where I am?

    It sounds like you were "used" by the immigration agents & "played" for their entertainment. I hope things work out better for you in the future!

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