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Thread: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

  1. Link to Post #141
    Avalon Member mosquito's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

    My analysis includes two primary observations:

    .........
    This post deserves to be reproduced on all "alternative" media sites and to be printed in all the mainstream newspapers. It should also be printed on A5 paper and dropped onto the population of the entire planet.

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  3. Link to Post #142
    Scotland Moderator Billy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Selkie (here)


    ** Or "we each create our own reality."
    Quote Posted by Billy (here)

    My thoughts here on Selkie's comment is. What exactly is the definition of "the real world" if it can ever be defined at all ? If what is said is true, that we are creators of our own reality.
    Sorry for my long post in my way for saying something simple. Yes I believe we each create our own reality. I also believe that the controllers only have power because the majority of humanity unknownly allows it to be so. Just as an individual can only take away ones power if we allow it. If we believe our power is being denied and out of reach, then the will to reclaim it does not exist. If we take responsibility and realise we have allowed it to be so. We can then take it back and reclaim it.
    When you express from a fearful heart in the now moment, You create a fearful future.
    When you express from a loving heart in the now moment, You create a loving future.

    Have no fear, Be aware and live your lives journey from a compassionate caring nurturing heart to manifest a compassionate caring nurturing future. Billyji


    Peace

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    United States Avalon Member earthadvocate's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Thank you Bill for posting this conversation which comes at a good time for me, I am so confabulated, hopeless, unable to get a grip on what is really going on in the world and why, I have found my own way to make a difference, I decided to enlist for the Peace Corp, so in a few month I'll probably be somewhere in Africa or God knows were. It would be wonderful to help were you are truly needed

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Hello Bill,

    I understand your frustration with the current state of affairs. But I have come to a conclusion that we are not going to change things by going on streets to protest.
    Recently in Brazil we have been on street on a mass protest and nothing has changed here. And we have witnessed the right wing party term of office and the left wing party term of office and they look like the same thing. Nothing changes.

    So I agree with the opinion of Ron Mauer Sr that stated that self reliance is the answer. You don't need to go on the street to be bitten by the police or the army. If you use what is left of your money after tax to buy things to make you less dependent of the system. This will disempower the Elites. You suddenly don't need them anymore. So in this sense, I believe that your idea when you created this forum to share information about permaculture, community based existence is the solution of the problem.
    We don't need a hero to get ourselves out of this system, we need to take responsibility in our hands to change our own reality.


    I recently read an article saying that navigation within mobile app has surpassed the navigation on the world wide web in US. So you will get less and less attention to alternative media on the ordinary web.

    I would suggest for us to organize a meeting up of people from this Forum to get to know ourselves personally.

    I have read before here and I have the same problem that we don't have friends or family of ours interested in these subjects that is discussed here. We have only ourselves here that share this common interests.

    Kind Regrads,

    Paula

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  9. Link to Post #145
    United States Avalon Member Dennis Leahy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by prc (here)
    ... I have come to a conclusion that we are not going to change things by going on streets to protest.
    Recently in Brazil we have been on street on a mass protest and nothing has changed here. And we have witnessed the right wing party term of office and the left wing party term of office and they look like the same thing. Nothing changes.
    I agree. We now know something that does not work. (In some countries, it might work for people to protest in the streets, but mostly, people protesting in the streets are either ignored or - using agents provocateur to create chaos and phony "cause" for violent police action - subjected to being beaten, killed, disappeared, or incarcerated. (The US is now like this.)

    Quote Posted by prc (here)
    ...So I agree with the opinion of Ron Mauer Sr that stated that self reliance is the answer. You don't need to go on the street to be bitten by the police or the army. If you use what is left of your money after tax to buy things to make you less dependent of the system. This will disempower the Elites. You suddenly don't need them anymore.

    ...

    Paula
    I believe "self-reliance" is (or represents) half the answer. It is critical. But, it won't stop the Global Rulers tendrils and support around the corrupt governments. They won't just fall apart. In the case of externally malevolent governments (like the US), citizens just ignoring the corporatist-militarist-bankster government means that these governments have carte blanche to wreak havoc on the world, any and all humans they target, and all non-human lifeforms in the crossfire.

    The self-reliance part is service-to-self, but is us working on the survival and maintenance aspects that are critical to our lives.

    Service-to-others alone would neglect our own true needs, but we can't wait until we are personally comfortable before ALSO participating, as a group (humanity, nation, village, etc.) in the service-to-others required to stop the malevolent psychopaths. If we don't do it, the trajectory and dispersal pattern of the malevolence may change, but the intensity will only grow.

    Dennis


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  11. Link to Post #146
    Poland Avalon Member Malgorzata's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Thank you Bill for this post as it is something that has been haunting me... am I doing enough in the world to tell people about what I know? Recently I have been out to lunch with a new friend I just made and the ¨cosmic¨ matters came up. I found myself totally unable to reveal to him the things which I know to be true. I just internally refused to do so.

    Someone above mentioned that we are afraid of confrontation perhaps and dont wish to start debates? In my case this is it, I think. I just dont feel like getting into debates (because most of the times this is how it ends), and having to look for arguments to defend my position. I know what I know and its sufficient to me. I know its probably not how I should be, and I often ask myself what is wrong with me!, but there is something in me that just doesnt want to engage in intelectual exchange of worldwiews. Not anymore. I used to. Now I prefer to spread the frequency through music, for instance (look me up under Dagger Sol in youtube).

    I have been asking myself for a long time WHY I cant speak with outside people about these things. I really dont know. I can barely talk to the inner crowd about it anymore. Sometimes it simply bores me. I prefer to go home and investigate myself. Are we being programmed into this kind of non confrontational attitude through the growing impact of internet behind which we can hide ourself so we are still comfortable? I dont know. I just hope I am stil fulfilling my mission on Earth even though I am not talking to strangers about anything every day, not to mention be active through the movements?!!

    Last edited by Malgorzata; 4th October 2015 at 12:29.

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    I have read this whole thread with interest but am somewhat surprised that the last, genuine, counter-cultural movement has no mention here........ and this was a movement that so frightened the government at that time, the police and military, the enforcers of rigid control structures, they had to re-draft an existing bill and place into law a structure to criminalise those who were a part of this movement.

    This movement, authentically, lasted for six years, although it's shockwaves are still with us and have influenced almost every aspect of this reality we see now. Music, Art, Fashion, Architecture, Advertising, Design, Language, Politics, Drugs............... the list is almost endless. And like the Authentic predecessor's, this movement scared the power structure of the day.

    I was heavily involved with this movement, I was a DJ, an organiser, a participant and whole-hartidly believed that we could change the world....... and for a short time we did. Our movement consisted of an ethos that said we could do anything, all we had to do was do it. At it's core was love, for oneself and those around you, we worked, often for no monetary reward, for the greater group, and let me tell you, that group at some of the events was 40,000 +, and it was this that scared the establishment. I must tell you this, when you see thousands of people, who are really free, and free with their emotion and are free of the social constraints we place upon ourselves, and the feeling of love amongst the thousands, it is the most unbelievable things to try and explain......... I remember one of the country's top policemen saying that he had respect for the organisers as they could mobilise, transport and contain tens of thousands of people right under their noses without their knowledge and established communication and transports systems....... sometimes with only hours of notice, something that neither they, nor the military, could do at that time.

    But in 1994 it all changed. Thanks to then Home Secretary, Michael Howard, we had to deal with this: The Criminal Justice Bill, and especially section v: repetitive beats. This out-lawed any gathering of three or more people listening to music that had at it's core, repetitive beats. Can you imagine that? Having to outlaw a style of music being played in any public, or private, space, with three or more people in attendance...... this is how much it worried the government.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimin...Order_Act_1994


    This Bill was in response to an event that I was at, an epic coming together of like-minded, free, beautiful people....... the most dangerous people to the establishment, and they brought out their best thugs to quell that little gathering.

    I suppose it was my generation's Woodstock.

    Castlemorton 1992




    Background and Organisation

    In May 1992 Avon and Somerset Police tried to end the annual Avon Free Festival, which had been held in the Bristol area around the May Bank Holiday for several years. As a result, thousands of gypsies, new age travellers and ravers en route to the area for the expected festival were shunted into neighbouring counties by Avon and Somerset’s Operation Nomad police manoeuvres. An estimated 20,000-40,000 people gathered on Castlemorton Common to hold a free party that lasted a full week, the biggest of its kind since the Stonehenge Free Festival in the mid-1980s.

    The Rave

    Castlemorton hosted many of the large sound systems of the time such as Bedlam, Circus Warp, Spiral Tribe and the DiY Sound System, and bands such as Back To The Planet, Xenophobia (fronted by Spiral Tribe's MC Skallywag), AOS3 and Poisoned Electrick Head. The Murder Squad - DJ Dread/MC Long Man (RIP)/MC Bad Boy V (AKA TJ Hook-a) They played non-stop dance music. Big name DJs also attended and the immediate high-profile coverage in the national media only served to swell the crowd further, making it an impossible task for the authorities to close the festival down.

    A great deal of media interest surrounded the festival. Simon Reynolds wrote that "during the next five days of its existence, Castlemorton will inspire questions in Parliament, make the front page of every newspaper in England and incite nationwide panic about the whereabouts of the next destination on the crusty itinerary."

    Aftermath

    Concerns about the festival and the way in which it was policed inspired the legislation which developed into the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994. This wide-ranging Act effectively made illegal such outdoor parties that played music, which was defined in section 63(1)(b) to include "sounds wholly or predominantly characterised by the emission of a succession of repetitive beats."

    Whilst some have argued that Castlemorton, with its attendant publicity, led directly to the Criminal Justice Act and was the "final nail in the coffin of the unlicensed event", others have seen the Act as a draconian piece of legislation which was "explicitly aimed at suppressing the activities of certain strands of alternative culture".


    This movement was Dance Music. Raves. Like all Authentic movements it was a coming together of music, drugs and fashion, in response to the socio-economic climate of the time. It was ours. It was about providing massive parties for masses of people. "lets just do it" was our rallying call. It was a very free movement. There was no centralised control structure, just bands of like-minded souls throughout the country, and beyond, who wanted to have a good time, and it was very effective. The authorities couldn't control it...... there was no head to control.

    After the advent of the Criminal Justice Bill, the 'scene' was brought indoors....... where it could be controlled. The advent of the Superclub. This was the end of the movement as it was known. Organisers now had to deal with local authority (local government) and the music was seized upon by the major record labels. The drugs became completely different, as did the effects on a whole generation.

    From '88 to '94 was a truly magical time............. we felt as if we could do anything.

    Sadly, there has been no authentic youth movement since then. It has become corporate, controlled, turned and used against it's participants. My children do not know the feeling of belonging to a movement that is truly theirs, and in my eyes that is a sad thing.

    The Second Summer of Love






    Regards.
    Last edited by Citizen No2; 4th October 2015 at 13:19.

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    What about a vision quest!

    Old Snake

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Malgorzata (here)

    Are we being programmed into this kind of non confrontational attitude through the growing impact of internet behind which we can hide ourself so we are still comfortable?
    Thank you for this post!

    Yes, in answer to this very important question, I think we are.

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Now, it's much less clear who or what the 'leadership' is. And most often, we meet only virtually.
    Ah - that might be unfortunate. One of the (few) things I have gotten out of going to conferences was to meet and be in the presence of those original creators, who made a real difference, an original contribution driven through to realization, of a substantial nature. That is very empowering ... one gets a real sense that one can, when one spots an opportunity to apply one's particular talents where perhaps no one else yet even sees an opportunity, make substantial contributions and changes.

    Virtual meetings, especially if only in text which is less compelling for many, might not yield such results, so often and so well.
    I do not totally agree ,"only in text" etc. One thing that goes hand in hand is the knowledge of how to express yourself and how to convey an Idea.

    We are dumbed down , and should in some instances relearn our language.
    One typical thing is abreviations used, looks inteligent , but is language-lazines , and it takes away part of what is being devulged, one is forced to use an other part of the brain and than you have to resume reading,
    haveing solved that .

    Old Snake

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Very good analysis. Oppose this Jade Helm 15 global program.

    Quote Red Alert! U.S. Cities Join New World Order To Form a Global Police Force Targeting Homegrown Extremism! Patriots Here Comes Trouble!

    By Lisa Haven on October 2, 2015

    On September 29th, the Department of Justice lined up with several U.S. cities to link globally to form a global police initiative they are calling, The Strong Cities Network. The initiative is being presented as a “global terror busting network that combats homegrown extremism.” Attorney General Loretta E. Lynch announced its formation during the United Nations General Assembly this past Tuesday. Cities who are participating include: New York City, Atlanta, Denver, Minneapolis, Paris, London, Montreal, Beirut, Oslo and thirteen others.

    This is an outright handing over of our rights to a global unit! Please don’t’ miss this crucial report that harbors critical details about what awaits the world…

    “…through the Strong Cities Network that we have unveiled today, we are making the first systematic effort in history to bring together cities around the world to share experiences, to pool resources and to forge partnerships in order to build local cohesion and resilience on a global scale. Today we tell every city, every town and every community that has lost the flower of its youth to a sea of hatred – you are not alone. We stand together and we stand with you.

    “By connecting municipal leaders, facilitating information-sharing and providing training and other assistance where appropriate, the Strong Cities Network will help to fashion a global response to a global issue, without losing sight of its inherently local roots….It will provide a platform for discussing community policing and prevention strategies that safeguard the individual rights of citizens.

    “…the Obama Administration is deeply committed to ensuring that the Strong Cities Network is as strong, vibrant and resilient as the cities it unites…

    “When the representatives of the Strong Cities Network join together for their first Annual Summit in Paris in Spring 2016, they will be making a strong and clear statement to their citizens and to the world: we stand united against violence, united against fear and united in the pursuit of a better and brighter future.” Attorney General Loretta E. Lynch
    http://lisahavennews.net/2015/10/02/...comes-trouble/

    http://<iframe src="https://www.yout...560"></iframe>

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Malgorzata (here)
    Thank you Bill for this post as it is something that has been haunting me... am I doing enough in the world to tell people about what I know? Recently I have been out to lunch with a new friend I just made and the ¨cosmic¨ matters came up. I found myself totally unable to reveal to him the things which I know to be true. I just internally refused to do so.

    Someone above mentioned that we are afraid of confrontation perhaps and dont wish to start debates? In my case this is it, I think. I just dont feel like getting into debates (because most of the times this is how it ends), and having to look for arguments to defend my position. I know what I know and its sufficient to me. I know its probably not how I should be, and I often ask myself what is wrong with me!, but there is something in me that just doesnt want to engage in intelectual exchange of worldwiews. Not anymore. I used to.
    I know exactly what you mean. While spending time with a friend the other day - with whom I've had a number of good, but limited, 'alternative' debates with - the media and television came up in casual conversation. It was his opinion that the Free Press was such a wonderful thing, and how when tuning into the BBC every night he was getting the truth, the free, unbiased, and methodically reported truth. So I tested the water with him on how he was grossly overestimating the integrity and veracity of said media outlets, that they were completely the opposite of true, independent and unbiased. Suffice it to say, I got a strange look from him.

    I'm starting to avoid talking about these things with friends, family and colleagues more and more now - even when I feel I might have something to say to open up their minds. A kind of apathy has set in. The rabbit hole goes deep. They have no idea how deep, not a clue. I don’t think they know there even is a rabbit hole. So where does one even begin to start??

    **

    Another point on the theme of this topic:
    I don't think we should at all overlook the part TV has had to play in programming the social and political mindset of people, shaping the way they think (and don't think). I think it has also played a significant role in the decline of counterculture - at least in the eyes of Mr. and Mrs. Middle-class Tax Payer. The nightly news would often regularly marginalize, even demonize any kind of counterculture movement. If you defied the establishment in any way, you were branded some sort of pariah, or weirdo - one of the 'unwashed' masses who were just too lazy to get a job like 'normal people'. My parents were appalled by hippes. When punk rock came along, they were moritifed! Opinions formed from real-life experience? No. from what they saw on TV.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Malgorzata (here)
    Thank you Bill for this post as it is something that has been haunting me... am I doing enough in the world to tell people about what I know? Recently I have been out to lunch with a new friend I just made and the ¨cosmic¨ matters came up. I found myself totally unable to reveal to him the things which I know to be true. I just internally refused to do so.

    Someone above mentioned that we are afraid of confrontation perhaps and dont wish to start debates? In my case this is it, I think. I just dont feel like getting into debates (because most of the times this is how it ends), and having to look for arguments to defend my position. I know what I know and its sufficient to me. I know its probably not how I should be, and I often ask myself what is wrong with me!, but there is something in me that just doesnt want to engage in intelectual exchange of worldwiews. Not anymore. I used to. Now I prefer to spread the frequency through music, for instance (look me up under Dagger Sol in youtube).

    I have been asking myself for a long time WHY I cant speak with outside people about these things. I really dont know. I can barely talk to the inner crowd about it anymore. Sometimes it simply bores me. I prefer to go home and investigate myself. Are we being programmed into this kind of non confrontational attitude through the growing impact of internet behind which we can hide ourself so we are still comfortable? I dont know. I just hope I am stil fulfilling my mission on Earth even though I am not talking to strangers about anything every day, not to mention be active through the movements?!!

    I've asked myself the same questions and some of the conclusions I have come to are:

    Whilst people do need to be aware of what is going on so that they know what they are up against, the rabbit hole goes on forever.
    It truly is a bottomless pit.

    Some people simply don't have the neurological pathways to even know that there is a rabbit hole. A combination of fluoride, chemtrails, GMO and processed food, birth trauma, PTSD, TV, lack of sunlight, lack of nature, living in an artificial environment, being in survival mode, schools etc keep people at a point where they lack the spiritual/natural intelligence to understand what is really going on, even when it is right in front of them.

    I've observed how my energies contract whenever we talk about something that limits our being and how they expand whenever I talk about how we can empower ourselves as sovereign beings.

    If I can maintain a state of expansion in my being, if I can maintain that flow, I find that I grow.
    It is very fulfilling and nurturing to share in how we can return to our natural state of being, how we can share in the infinite possibilities of our infinite potential and continue to learn about how we can inspire others to reach their highest potential.

    I would infinitely prefer to talk about how we are going to do what we need to do to bring peace to earth and then talk about how we maintain that peace. Happy to chat any time about that!

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    Netherlands Avalon Member Catsquotl's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    I've been pondering this over the last few days. I so want to say yes, but truth be told.
    There's several points of view that one can take looking at the countercultures and in the end it's as much a personal preference as it is a subjective answer.
    If by doing a better job you mean exposing the lies of government with strong, valid arguments then yes. These days it's easy to make a point and prove it with documentation, reports and what not's. Even though I do meat the occasional jerk that is regurgitating the voices of the opportunist, racist politician as truth. Most people I do meet have a bit more than half a brain and do think, read and form a somewhat informed opinion. That fact alone is enough for me to consort with and feel part of the sheeple

    If however like me one would clasify doing better in terms of tolerance and overall attention to ones fellow human being I fear we are falling gravely behind the counterculture as i imagine the 60's and 70's must have been. Being born in 1972 I know I was to young to be in the midst of it. But as a young punk living in squats and spending a few night sleeping in a tent when the occupy movement rose a few years ago what literally shocked me was the self absorption and lack of genuine contact between people. especially the last few (18 or so) years where everyone seems to live behind some form of screen, even without television, screens everywhere..(myself included) I feel we are doing a really poor job at sharing the human qualities that matter compared to the 60's

    That's my 2 cents thrown in..

    With Love
    ---
    Please leave some of your light everywhere you go.

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    Avalon Member Peacerebel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Great thread! Mad respect for you Bill!

    Where is my young imaginative mind on this?

    I like the word consciousness, my own perspective of the word has changed. I like the idea of calling all of this..this god, this universe , this hologram or atoms or quantum physics or simply energy.
    But wait! there are so much more words to describe this that them and these things or is it only in one dimension? Are there other ones? Bubbles and comets and moon landing rockets, mothers fathers children and made in china toys, war famine rape and murder it's just a shot away and brought to you by these sponsors, Oh my! your child has ADD so you learn from your Full-HD that there's a guy with a PHD who will describe you some ProHappiness-Pills. Nobody wants this stupid poem to continue and is hoping that this ignorant child will just STOP

    What I mean is that I can change my theme of ideas from left to right and all over the place, doesn't matter positive or negative. What I do think matters is that when we are thinking about collective things, things that have affected or will affect all of us someway or another. We have to start from places and areas that connect us all, or rather feel and know how something as simple as walking an old lady across the street safely has connected roots to the place that feels good and loving rather than the other one.. Everyone has their own unique way and life, and my own desire and path is the search for freedom. I do think things intellectually and logically but I am also feeling the idea emotionally, and that many times gives the certainty of something to be right or left. I have so many different views it's impossible for me to explain it. Maybe I'm just too naive and young to be taken seriously. Sociopath, narci
    ssistic a-hole.

    Somewhere in the midst of my 10 hour David Icke marathon I started to lose a filter of some kind that was probably one of my egos ways of keeping all the things "I am" in order..
    Now three years later I'm quite sure that one does not need a specific list after the sentence: I AM , I've been dazed and confused for so long that maybe I'm M I A(missing in action)
    It's a strange feeling to love and care about everything because it is like being totally neutral except you are looking to the "Lighter side" -of things, just a quick turn of the head and there I am looking to the "Darker side", still neutral though.. funny how that works.. Symbiosis or Psychosis.

    Anyway, the collective things that connect us at least in a way that they can be accepted in this dimension, this planet. Things that everyone can understand, awake or not. Is free energy, free nutrition: pure water, natural, organic food and vitamin sources like chia-seeds or chlorella, and free shelter. These are things that I believe are simply a basic things that everyone has a right to on this planet.
    I can understand the kind of strategy of molding the earth with a 2000 year patience, it
    s just unbelievable how powerful something like that is. Totalitarian tip toe alright.
    It doesn't put much weight on standing in protests on some concrete parking lot you're rebelling against.

    Anyway, I liked the line I read in one of the replies. It said: "I think all of you should individually take responsibility for yourselves and get things done yourself."
    That is why I will do something that I believe will echo to the next children after I'm gone. Thinking ways to connect us without taking freedom and privacy.

    Vlad the Impaler and the 10 000 bodies converted to Unknown civilian and 10 000 free energy generators with a card: Have a nice day!

    -Peace & One Love!

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    Brazil Avalon Member Hawkwind's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Bill, not to be frivolous or unnecessarily argumentative, but who exactly is this “we” you refer to in the OP, and who exactly are “we” taking the planet back from? Because if you’re referring to a small group of elites who control the various social institutions of the planet, there simply was no “we” prior to “us” being under “their” control. In fact, if Sitchin or Tsarion are correct then “they” literally created “us”. If that’s the case, then there has never been and never will be a chance to “take back” the planet. It’s more a matter of humanity breaking free from control of the Annunaki and their agents. That isn’t simply a semantic distinction, it’s a very different context altogether.

    It’s virtually impossible to evaluate where we stand in that regard now as opposed to during the 60’s and 70’s. There are just too many unknowns. First and foremost, do these beings actually even exist? If so, have they left the planet? If so, do they plan to return? What are their actual capabilities as compared to ours? Do other beings exist with technological and/or physical abilities far beyond our own? Are the true intentions of these beings collectively more benevolent, malevolent or some combination thereof? How can we know? Do our thoughts and actions individually and/or collectively influence the overall outcome of this interaction?

    My guess to the last question is yes, and if so, that really becomes the crux of the matter. You said in your opening remarks of the interview with Freedom Central (Full interview below, highly recommended for anyone who hasn't seen it yet):

    “We are infinite love, infinite consciousness temporarily experiencing what it's like to be here with our feet on the ground trying to figure it all out and what we're doing is we're playing games. We're just playing games. That doesn't mean there's anything trivial about it, but what else is a spirit or playful being going to do in all of eternity apart from play games? That's a good way to learn.”

    Yes! Perfect! “We” (everyone and everything that exists.) are playing a game. The main objective of which (from my perspective anyway) isn’t to win or lose, but to have fun and learn. Like most games there are players with counter-opposed objectives. The principal opponents in this particular game are the Service toward Self team (hereinafter referred to as the bad guys) and the Service toward All team (henceforth referred to as the good guys). The good guys can never truly defeat the bad guys, any more than the bad guys can ever truly defeat the good guys. If they did, the game itself would end, and then what would we do for the rest of eternity? Also, there aren’t really any good guys or bad guys, there are just different perspectives from which the universe observes itself. What matters then, is that I remain as fully conscious as I can during my incarnation and act as fully in alignment with my own inner truth as I know how.

    What that boils down to for me is to hold a vision of the world as I would like it to be as firmly in my mind as I can and then act toward making that vision a reality. In terms of making the broad societal changes that would be necessary to bring that vision to fruition, I came to exactly the same conclusion that Dennis has. The only way to achieve it is to change the manner in which representatives are elected. I’ve made at least six serious attempts at getting a grassroots movement toward that end off the ground over the last 30 odd years, and failed miserably each time. My conclusion was (and still is) that the time just wasn’t right for such an idea to take hold. The vast majority of people I spoke with were either sufficiently content with the way things were to feel motivated to make radical changes in the way the world is run, or felt so powerless to alter the status quo that they were unwilling to attempt it. That situation has changed and changed dramatically during that time. Many people have come to see that it isn’t only their lifestyle which is at stake, but their existence. That may well provide sufficient motivation to get the proverbial ball rolling.

    The advent of the internet, instant messaging, and social networks has been (and continues to be) a vital part of that transition. So, I don’t personally view my give and take of ideas and opinions on the net as “just wheel-spinning” or of any less value toward making real change than, say, planting trees.

    Last edited by Hawkwind; 6th October 2015 at 15:01.

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    United States Avalon Member WildOrchid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    .
    Dear Friends,

    I want to start a discussion on the counterculture today.

    I've said many times that we've had two chances before in history to take back the planet.
    • The first was 2,000 years ago, and that was taken over and failed.
    • The second was in the '60s and early '70s. That also failed.
    The third is now. We won't get a fourth chance.

    This thread is inspired by my spending yesterday evening watching videos of Joan Baez in the 60s. I could have gone on to watch protest songs, marches and speeches all night. It was a mighty attempt to wake up the world and take back the planet.

    How are we doing now?

    Quote Posted by
    The assumed realities of the alternative media are also very worrying. We have to wake up to this... in my strong opinion. Or else we may fail again. This is, for instance, why I
    [LIST=1

    [*]Support the work of Alex Jones and David Icke. They are focused on real-world political realities.[*]Support the work of Rebekah Roth, whose popular books on 9/11 have reached way outside the ghetto, and are waking up regular members of the public. (They really are. She gets letters every day from Mr and Mrs Everyman, who never knew.)[/LIST]But we are (in my opinion) WAY WAY WAY too preoccupied with (and often diverted and distracted by) ethereal concepts like 'Wave X', CERN (I am NOT convinced, at all, that it's anything other than a supercollider), the possible mystical effects of comets and Blood Moons, channeled messages from 'Ascended Masters', unprovable subjective recall and perception, and multidimensional phenomena that may or may not have any reality at all.

    (Coast to Coast AM radio shows these days are usually just about the above, and avoid political reality like a hot potato. Never think that these are anything other than 90% entertainment. Their mission is NOT activism of any kind.)

    And don't let's even start on Blue Avians.

    Joan Baez and Bob Dylan never sung about any of that.

    Do please comment.

    In my view what matters is what each of us does from here on forward. We are facing a society that is on a collision course to self destruction. A society that is sick, drugged, in trance, manipulated or brainwashed into "believing" some fantasy land reality, or whatever the latest lie being spoon fed to them by the corrupt powers that be, or the controlled mass media.

    The trend is that those who are truly aware, awake with sanity and common sense are being ridiculed and made to look like they are "lunatics or criminals". Is is all upside down, instigated by the real lunatics that happen to be in power at the moment. I can see and understand why some people prefer to be spoon fed false realities or live in fantasy lands. They are much easier to face, than the true mess we are in!

    But as the saying goes "god helps those who help themselves". And I prefer to see the cup half full, not empty. I believe there is always something that CAN be done. The only thing that would be completely wrong is DO NOTHING. We all operate in our individual playing fields, be it family, friends, neighbors, work etc..., and within that we can influence others and bring about positive changes. Were all connected on some level, spiritual or physical, and even the tiniest thing counts. Compare it to the power of an ocean, without an infinite amount of droplets it would accomplish nothing. To the degree our intentions and actions align things CAN and WILL improve, first small then on larger scales.

    Here some little things that can help and can be done by everyone ...
    • If you feel all negative and down, if all seems black and hopeless, take a walk or do something that you really enjoy until you laugh and things look brighter and more positive.
    • Don't constantly hang around or argue with negative people and fear mongers. Balance it out with lots of positive, optimistic and cheerful company. If you don't have positive friends, make some.
    • Treat others the way you would like them to treat you.
    • There is always the power of saying "NO", one does not have to agree or go along withe every piece of crap that one is being fed or dictated. Try it sometime, it is very empowering.
    • Support whistle blowers, people that speak out, stick their necks and stand up for us and our rights.
    • Support positive groups and organizations that fight for common sense, freedom and the brighter side of life.
    • Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.
    • Encourage others to do all the above.

    We are only victims to the degree we decide to submit, go along and be effect. One might say "little me, I can't change the world". Wrong! Look at what one single man like Gandhy accomplished! It does not matter on what level you are active, what matters is that you DO SOMETHING.

    Wishing you all a relaxing sleep, sweet dreams, and a successful, sunny tomorrow!
    Last edited by WildOrchid; 7th October 2015 at 17:01.
    Artist - Lover of Life - Seeker of Truth

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    Brazil Avalon Member Hawkwind's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    addendum to my previous post- It suddenly occurred to me that by exchanging ideas and information on the net, I actually am planting trees and nurturing them to grow. They just happen to be a metaphorical variety rather than the literal type.

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    Avalon Member take's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    Quote Posted by Daozen (here)
    1) In 2005-2015 we sucessfuly decentralized the media. Mainstream circulation is now in freefall.

    2) We have now realized the alt media was co-opted too, and are finding our way out of that trap.

    3) 2015-2025, my goal is to decentralize and fragment finance. Can we do to finance what we did to the media? Every human being has a dream: Artist, farmer, musician, water purifier, teacher. But it's hard to get on the crowdfunding ladder. That's why we are coding some microfinance portals. Microcrowdfunding sites that help people crowdfund amounts *lower* than 100USD. There's enough room for everyone in the microcrowdfunding world, so maybe people could visualize and act along those lines.
    THIS.

    And it's already started. Ubers, bitcoins, time-based currency systems (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time-based_currency) and services like Airbnb, not to mention 3D printing and it's possible possibilities, are some of the mechanisms that are fragmenting the traditional financial models. They're fragmenting capitalism, not destroying it, unfortunately. At least not yet.

    Imo the best thing any one single person can do, is to be educated (about social, economic and environmental issues in the world) and exercise critical thinking.
    Be creative. Work together. And not to sound too much like the zeitgeist movement, which is pretty grand scale and unrealistic (? I haven't really followed that lately), I'd suggest that people should focus on small things. Small-scale, practical things that are doable and that benefit the individual and the community. Hopefully something outside the capitalist system, like when they came up with time-based currency. Or do something way bigger if you can. Do whatever, just do something.

    Also, if you are not familiar with the concept of basic income, I strongly suggest you take a look at this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_income
    That's something I'm very passionate about atm. Something that would solve so many issues in so many countries.

    Here's some quick suggestions on the top of my head:
    Get educated.
    Support human rights.
    Fight globalization and capitalism.
    Make environmentally sustainable decisions.
    Think globally, act locally.

    Oh and keep in mind that it's all just a ride and that we are all one like the fingers of a hand, there is no death or you as a person or a separate entity, everything is energy, all is one and one is all, we are the universe experiencing itself, and that there is no good or bad or right and wrong.
    But there's suffering, and there needn't be.

    Just some suggestions you may want to consider if you want to, you know, do something.
    Last edited by take; 7th October 2015 at 22:49.
    The root of suffering is desire.
    The uprooting of suffering is desirelessness.

    Awareness.
    Awareness.
    Awareness.

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    Avalon Member Delight's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the counterculture today doing a better job than the counterculture in the 60s and 70s?

    I think the woowoo that I have participated in has brought me far along on my own journey through culture.Maybe the generartions after me will continue pursuing the paranormal as normal.

    Politics is something I passed through: debating, taking sides, wanting a new party to DO something, being disappointed.
    My best friend ever stayed in the Socialist Workers Party. That model had her moving around the country and getting uinion jobs to infiltrate and teach the workers. They had a newspaper they sold and books. My disappointment with the party in ONE way was how the workers IN the party were just pawns to sell socialism divorced from the culture they lived in.

    They considered unions to just be pacifiers but they took union jobs to tell people that message. IMO, at least the unions have been more about living wages, hiring and firing issues, safety and protection for the workers.

    My path led me to woowoo in the form of embracing a world of metaphysical action. My frustrations continued wherever I went in the culture. My curiosity and drive took me superficially through different "magic practices". the groups like OTO were not attractive. The systems like astrology all had their schools. It was so complicated.

    I tried tarot and I could read people with triggers form cards. I passed through as I was not that willing to study deeply any of the systems BUT I took in many a little bit....

    Actually this is a sort of ADD mode and I don't think we necessarily get more in going deep.

    I tried GI Gurdjieff's school lessons and found that woowoo too cultish. I was not drawn in anywahere...

    My job in health care led me to the idea that healing is a woowoo path.
    I could not fit in exactly THERE either as I saw it a bunch of proliferating modalities and people remain prone to sickness.

    I heard about placebo and nocebo as the peron's own beliefs at work. I telecoped that out to apply to society itself as fulfilling it propehecies. Any political model that caters to a belief in I Nocebo a good future will ce it happen.

    This took Me to the woowoo of karma and how we get entangled in beliefs and act out the past. This woowoo took me past that to forgiveness...let's just let it go and start over.

    Woowoo has led me to a culture that is engaged in actively dismantling the wrong headed attachments to all givens. this is counter to culture itself as a valid platform to stand on....

    IMO a slow dismantling is quietly occurring when disappointment rages high. It looks like needing to choose what the placebo is about. IMO the placebo is the craziest gift of the ability to imagine we are well and see it happen. I place my next woowoo phase here...to BE the placebo.

    A culture where we are self innoculated as THE placebo is one I imagine is without any needs of external medicines, external improvement and prescribed change for the sake of getting better.

    I imagine this is nonchalant and yet rather alert. It is open and relaxed and able to take in the cosmic star dust of inspiration.

    From where ever we are now, we take a deep breath of prana and wonder...what would I really enjoy next in my thriving. Yes, Woowoo 100%. I love woowoo

    Woowoo tried to explain the gaps to me and I WANTED to know WHY the world is so crazy? It explained enough for me to give up on explaining and just be the placebo. MAYBE, We have no NEED to change anything because we are able to place every possibility as the outcome where we thrive. Like taking the sugar pill instead of red and blue?
    Last edited by Delight; 8th October 2015 at 03:31.

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