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Thread: Enlightenment and related matters.

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    Avalon Member truthseekerdan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    There is nothing sacred about the use of words or definitions. We can use or define words how we like for our own purposes, provided we do so in a clear fashion. We know that words are far from complete when trying to relate what we think, especially when we are trying to express something unique, original or formless. The true power of words is not in their literal meaning but in the qualities or intentions that they conceal from our view. We use words because even in their shallowness, they can be a turning point to cause a person to look deeper within their being.

    If a belief were true, it would be true even if no one believed it. Beliefs are agreements about reality, which in turn form the structure and parameters that envelop the world we choose to live in. The world we choose to live in is self-created and protects us from the essential uncertainties and paradoxes of existence. When we are fully aware of the present, we have access to all that is real.

    Much Love
    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Hopefully, this is taken as on topic.

    ACIM lesson 132: excerpt.

    I who remain as God created me would loose the world from all I thought it was. For I am real because the world is not, and I would know my own reality.
    (this is what I meant by re-integrating reality)

    Peace

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Just wanted to share this quote with you all.

    "A person does not have to be behind bars to be a prisoner.
    People can be prisoners of their own concepts and ideas.
    They can be slaves to their own selves." ~ Maharaji

    Much Love
    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Seek and ye will find.
    The 18 years unaccounted for in the life of Jesus.
    No wonder the powers that be wanted him crucified.
    He taught the same truth as Krishna including reincarnation, meditation and the truth is within you.

    Chris


    Source: Watch on Vimeo

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    This is a great topic to bring into focus and for that I thank you greybeard. A book I use is A New Earth by Eckhart Tolle. This book goes into great detail about the ego and generating PRESENCE and the more you read this book, the better it gets. I've read it 6 1/2 times and the only reason I'm not reading it now is because I let a friend borrow it.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Thanks JoshuaM
    Quite a few Eckhart Tolle videos in these pages.

    You might like this video too

    Regards

    Chris



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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    I am new here and its my honor to connect with you all at this forum.

    The Ego, in my opinion, is not to be tamed but befriended and comforted. There is an existential 'egoic' personality that develops within us as we are born and continue to grow in a world we dont understand, a world that transmits a constant threat to the spirit subtly through a simulated environment designed to attack our bodies and spirits through systematic strategic experiential infiltration. The Ego, which may have originally just been an element of individuated creative awareness of Self, grew to be a paranoid, insecure and frightened prisoner trapped in the mind, drowning in the sludge of truths and lies, illusions and realities, information and technology, wars and peace negotiations... one could go on and on with the pattern of conflict and separation that is programmed into every concept or idea we perceive, hence seeding the conflict in our own reality. The Ego need not be pandered to but nurtured and kept assured. It is as is... it is We who transcend the Ego.

    I am not trying to validate or object to anyone's theory on this with my thoughts... just answering the question the best i could. Thanks for having me here. Love and smiles to All.

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    Lightbulb Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Once our state of being begins to break free of its illusions through increased knowledge and love, it starts to live in complete separateness and fulfillment knowing reality beyond a mental concept or vague series of images. It begins to experience the presence of something beyond itself that dwells in a place where there is no need to pursue more or be anything other than self (within the physical body). When does this happen? When we face the oneness of our existence and recognize there is no other joy that can exist except the joy of being an active part of the whole. This joy of oneness allows us to truthfully experience the freedom of our own individual existence, and with the highest realization that all that really maters is our love for one another.

    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    I agree with you sir. As a traditional shaman we are taught to tame the ego...and that the origional use of the ego was a survival mechanism in the human psychie. Thus we learned to make fire because we refused to be cold etc. We are also taught that the ego is the part of the spirit that we see as ghosts. This is a very interesting conversation that I teach my initiates about so that we can do our best to remain humble in our service to our people. Thank you for bringing up this timely subject.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    I was raised as a Roman Catholic. I easily understood The Golden Rule as espoused by Jesus of Nazareth, The Christ. But I could never accept Jesus as God. If Jesus was God then his teachings shrink and shrivel and become small. For when Jesus the man says "Love thy neighbour" I can appreciate the great capacity to empathize. But when Jesus as God says "Treat your neighbour as you would have them treat you." I do not understand the concept because I Am Not God. These thoughts ran through my young mind and I renounced the paradoxical teaching altogether by the age of 14.

    This dichtomy has made it difficult for me to love Jesus, my brother, with the grace that is my right - as I now understand it.

    There was a time when I loved Jesus and could see myself following in his footsteps. But his teachings have been perverted and, it seems, I along with them.

    I wish to love Jesus again, my brother, and to recognize The Christ he represents. He is the road to my salvation only because he has been my role model since I was a child. I need him to be a man, to be my brother, so that I can look into the eyes of the Created and see the Source of its Love.

    Peace

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Quote Posted by Ernie Nemeth (here)
    I wish to love Jesus again, my brother, and to recognize The Christ he represents. He is the road to my salvation only because he has been my role model since I was a child. I need him to be a man, to be my brother, so that I can look into the eyes of the Created and see the Source of its Love.

    Peace
    The strength of skepticism and ignorance on Earth is extraordinary. Priests, officials and media continuously manipulate information, so people are scared and confused and therefore easier to control and exploit. Today teachings of Christ are perverted beyond recognition, far from what they actually represent.

    Fear of God is preached and people continue to torture and kill one another in the name of God and religion. The Universal Law of “Loving one another” seems much too advanced for the great majority of people on Earth. We need to wake up, before time runs out...




    Much Love ~ Dan
    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Quote Posted by Ernie Nemeth (here)
    I was raised as a Roman Catholic. I easily understood The Golden Rule as espoused by Jesus of Nazareth, The Christ. But I could never accept Jesus as God. If Jesus was God then his teachings shrink and shrivel and become small. For when Jesus the man says "Love thy neighbour" I can appreciate the great capacity to empathize. But when Jesus as God says "Treat your neighbour as you would have them treat you." I do not understand the concept because I Am Not God. These thoughts ran through my young mind and I renounced the paradoxical teaching altogether by the age of 14.

    This dichtomy has made it difficult for me to love Jesus, my brother, with the grace that is my right - as I now understand it.

    There was a time when I loved Jesus and could see myself following in his footsteps. But his teachings have been perverted and, it seems, I along with them.

    I wish to love Jesus again, my brother, and to recognize The Christ he represents. He is the road to my salvation only because he has been my role model since I was a child. I need him to be a man, to be my brother, so that I can look into the eyes of the Created and see the Source of its Love.

    Peace
    Ernie have a look in the mirror, focus on your eyes for a moment.
    That which looks through your eyes is the same Divinity that looked through the eyes of Jesus your brother.
    You and the Father are One you just dont fully know that yet!!!!
    You are a great example to us all, thank you for sharing with us.

    Chris
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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Karma.

    If you look at self as a vibration attractor field and that we are in a university for personal spiritual evolution, then when we have evolved sufficiently, raised our vibration enough, then we graduate from the university of Earth to a new school which is suitable and concordant with our raised spiritual vibration, then we do not need to reincarnate here.

    Jesus pointed the way by teaching devotion, humility, love, forgiveness and Thy will be done not mine.

    Thats as best I can explain.

    Not saying I am right but thats my understanding of the moment.

    Chris
    Last edited by greybeard; 8th July 2011 at 22:49.
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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Quote Posted by greybeard (here)

    Jesus pointed the way by teaching devotion, humility, love, forgiveness and Thy will be done not mine.

    Thats as best I can explain.

    Not saying I am right but thats my understanding of the moment.

    Chris
    Dear Chris,

    Jesus did not teach devotion because devotion is a religious (mind) concept. Also humility is a negative word, what Jesus taught was acceptance and love to one another. However, the main teachings of Jesus' were love, compassion, and service to others. Hope this helps.

    Namaste ~ Dan
    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Quote Posted by truthseekerdan (here)
    Quote Posted by greybeard (here)

    Jesus pointed the way by teaching devotion, humility, love, forgiveness and Thy will be done not mine.

    Thats as best I can explain.

    Not saying I am right but thats my understanding of the moment.

    Chris
    Dear Chris,

    Jesus did not teach devotion because devotion is a religious (mind) concept. Also humility is a negative word, what Jesus taught was acceptance and love to one another. However, the main teachings of Jesus' were love, compassion, and service to others. Hope this helps.

    Namaste ~ Dan
    Respectfully Dan
    Jesus on various ocasions said They will be done which is a form of humility also he was against being put on a pedestal.
    He said "You will do greater things than these" my words.

    Humility is not weak it releases the power of God.
    The miracle of recovery in AA comes from the belief in a "Power greater than one self"
    That humility, faith in the power of God works, not theory but fact.

    The ego hates humility.
    It thinks it is the author of ones life and the sole authority.
    It keeps the alcoholic thinking that it can through self will stop one drinking.
    Self will is weak compared to the will of God/ the Holy Spirit which resides in all.
    The meek will inherit the earth,

    There are degrees of devotion and different meanings to the word devotion.
    I am devoted to the search for spiritual truth, my life for the last 35 years has been devoted to, given to, that search.
    That has been the priority.
    "God" is spiritual Truth.

    I agree that the words of Jesus were probably "adjusted" to suit religion.
    Being devoted to a dogma is a big mistake--- I dont see that devotion to the love of God is.
    Yogananda was a classic example of that as portrayed in his book "Divine Romance"

    There are examples of Christian Saints levitating and Eastern sages bi-locating through the power of devotion/love of God.
    Through that power they became "light".

    New age teaching very cleverly demoted God with the concept of co-creator.
    The ego love that though.
    At present we tend to create through ego.
    When we become a clear channel, when we are enlightened, God creates through us, yet we are God

    Thats why the sages say enlightenment can not be spoken of it can only be experienced.
    It is beyond debate. Words are not sufficient to describe that state.

    Eventually on the spiritual path there comes a moment when the door of enlightenment opens and one is faced with the temptation to be all powerful, that temptation is to be resisted and "To Thee oh Lord I surrender my very life"
    That is the death of the false sense the ego. Then only God walks through the final door.
    --- not a religious concept but as described by Dr David Hawkins.
    He faced the temptation and surrendered his life through devotion to God.
    Eckhart Tolle in the "Power of Now" also talks of a moment of dread where he had to surrender-- he heard the unspoken words "resist nothing"

    Every account of the moment of full enlightenment that I have read speaks of this moment of great fear, surrender then unconsciousness, then awakening to a different state which is our true Self.
    With some a bliss state persisted for some time then "normal" life resumed but with a state of ongoing peace and stillness.

    There is also a bliss state which occurs just short of enlightenment which is similar to enlightenment but not the full merging with source not full oneness or Christ Consciousness.

    Chris

    Namaste
    Last edited by greybeard; 9th July 2011 at 10:00.
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  29. Link to Post #1136
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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Dear Chris,

    I understand where you're coming from. As I mentioned in one of my previous posts language and its semantics are a barrier especially when trying to relate what we think. Add to that the English language which is not necessarily a 'rich language'. Hope I did not offend anyone.

    Quote "Jesus on various ocasions said They will be done which is a form of humility also he was against being put on a pedestal."
    Even though Jesus was at a higher level of awareness and understanding than anyone else at that time, including the so called masters, gurus, etc. -- he never saw himself above anybody else (arrogant or prideful), but treated everyone with love and kindness as his equals. This is what it means to do "God's Will"...

    “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone". Here Jesus gives us an example that many will interpret it as 'humility', however, it actually shows he was very much aware that each human being is a living embodiment of God, experiencing a different level of spiritual understanding and awareness.

    Therefore God is All There Is, and at a higher level of perception "good & evil" don't exist because we're all One. IMHO, 'humility' is a tool that TPTB use to keep humanity in a state of authoritative 'fear of God', where it's easily controlled and manipulated. That kind of 'humility' has nothing to do with 'true spirituality'.

    Quote "New age teaching very cleverly demoted God with the concept of co-creator. The ego love that though."
    A dominant ego loves itself, and wants you to believe that you have no potential -- you are not your 'true Self; God'. It likes to limit yourself to a false identity through traditional beliefs, dogmas and mind concepts.

    Quote "Thats why the sages say enlightenment can not be spoken of it can only be experienced. It is beyond debate. Words are not sufficient to describe that state."
    We alone make the decision if we want to achieve enlightenment by 'breaking free of the false identity veil' (ego mind). We all have free will, and the freedom of choice... When does this happen? When we face the oneness of our existence and recognize there is no other joy that can exist except the joy of being an active part of the whole. This joy of oneness allows us to truthfully experience the freedom of our own individual existence, and with the highest realization that all that really maters is our love for one another.

    As you mentioned Chris, enlightenment can not be spoken, it has to be done. Jesus taught us what the "enlightenment state" really is, to love unconditionally, to have compassion and be kind, and to be of service to others without discriminating. When we realize this enlightenment, and come together in Unity of Love Consciousness, then greater things are possible while we enter a new paradigm in a New Earth.

    Much Love to All
    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Well said Dan.
    I dont think any one honestly seeking spiritual truth would be offended by anything you post.
    Language does not do truth justice as you say.
    The closest one can get is as said "Only God is"
    Chris

    Namaste
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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    "Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven."

    In other words God's Will is to be done "As above so below". As we come from Unity (Oneness) to experience this 'illusion' of separation and divisiveness with all its differences and diversities in the physical below. We learn through this amnesia with its limitations to eventually progress and awaken to our true spiritual nature. To know our true nature we need to make 'an effort' to connect to our higher self ('oversoul above') for spiritual guidance, understanding and knowing the truth beyond sensory perception. We then are ready to 'evolve' to something beyond our physical being by knowing that through our finite existence, the infinite expresses itself. This awareness is the impulsive nature of love. Love without conditions is the heart of universal unity in consciousness.

    Much Love
    Last edited by truthseekerdan; 9th July 2011 at 19:58. Reason: words clarification
    Unity Consciousness
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    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    As a human being, you will make mistakes in arriving at truth. Do not allow remorse to become a Prompter. Be joyful that error has disclosed truth. To err is human. Evil is human. But evil is illusion, nothing more. It dissipates in front of good almost magically, and every error in your life is for the purpose of revealing truth to you and not to stultify your divinity in shame and remorse and fear. There will be evil in the world until man completes his progress to a oneness with God (All That Is).

    For there will be error until all truth is known. You will make mistakes. You cannot live and not make mistakes. But this you can do. You can suffer the consequence of each mistake only once and no more. Find a man who has suffered a score of defeats and you will find a great soul. He may know more of truth than the man who has won a half dozen victories. The man with the half dozen victories knows a half dozen truths. While the man with a score of defeats may know twenty truths!

    Much Love and Unity
    Unity Consciousness
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free your mind, and open your heart to LOVE.
    You'll then become enlightened able to just BE.

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  37. Link to Post #1140
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    Default Re: Enlightenment and related matters.

    Dan, Chris greetings and thank-you for a lively and enlightening thread,
    this is for Nameth:
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    ---Quote (Originally by Ernie Nemeth)---
    I wish to love Jesus again, my brother, and to recognize The Christ he represents. He is the road to my salvation only because he has been my role model since I was a child. I need him to be a man, to be my brother, so that I can look into the eyes of the Created and see the Source of its Love.

    Peace
    ---End Quote---
    The strength of skepticism and ignorance on Earth is extraordinary. Priests, officials and media continuously manipulate information, so people are scared and confused and therefore easier to control and exploit. Today teachings of Christ are perverted beyond recognition, far from what they actually represent.

    Fear of God is preached and people continue to torture and kill one another in the name of God and religion. The Universal Law of “Loving one another” seems much too advanced for the great majority of people on Earth. We need to wake up, before time runs out...
    Much Love ~ Dan

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    This is indeed so, religion having being used to suppress the masses. a probable mechanistic is that they use the ego and ego ulterification to affect this. a healthy eog therefore being important, but ego regulation is more important as we would see by greybeards steps that they are controlled in the path to enlightenment {never knew that Greybeard was so aware of the effects of the New Age setting of ego which is pathologic}.
    But few of these religious would have known that they could have effected enlightment of an initiate class by their teachings. i also evolved up from the stockade of catholic educated youths. Nietzsche perhaps cause he shared this same setting writes powerfully [so-that we can understand by our tool sets] to break this mold and set it[/us] up for a new thing.
    Actually it is my latest field of exoteric studies which lead me to beleive that the religious orders never wanted to effect enlightenment of the masses. I believe the Manichaeans had an initial understanding of this i crave to find out....

  38. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to sirac For This Post:

    Ernie Nemeth (10th July 2011), greybeard (10th July 2011), truthseekerdan (10th July 2011)

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