A friend's daughter has been abducted.

[angelfire]

A friend of mine has just posted on facebook that his nine day old daughter has this evening been taken away by social services.
This man is a trained minister of Jim Humble's Genesis church and has been the subject of both newspaper and BBC reports regarding the "harm" he is doing by selling and promoting MMS, all of which were, of course, full of lies and disinformation. This is obviously the authorities' unthinkable and cruellest effort to silence him.
I know him to be a good man and I can only imagine the pain and suffering he and his partner are experiencing right now.
Does anyone, particularly from the UK, have any suggestions as to how he should proceed to right this terrible wrong and have his daughter returned to her home?

[penn]

How sad. Unreal how good people get stopped at every turn.

[enfoldedblue]

Here in Australia a father recently had his daughter taken away by police and put into care ... because his car was messy and even though he told the otherwise the police believed they were living in the car. This man took to social mefia and started a gofundme campaign to raise the money needed for legal fees to get his daughter back. Maybe your friend could pursue a similar path? link

[angelfire]

Thanks, enfoldedblue. I'm not sure this would work because of his involvement with mms. A lot of people have been convinced that it's dangerous and may not be sympathetic to his cause. It's a really difficult and tragic situation to be in.

[iamnoone]

Posted by angelfire (here)
A friend of mine has just posted on facebook that his nine day old daughter has this evening been taken away by social services.
This man is a trained minister of Jim Humble's Genesis church and has been the subject of both newspaper and BBC reports regarding the "harm" he is doing by selling and promoting MMS, all of which were, of course, full of lies and disinformation. This is obviously the authorities' unthinkable and cruellest effort to silence him.
I know him to be a good man and I can only imagine the pain and suffering he and his partner are experiencing right now.
Does anyone, particularly from the UK, have any suggestions as to how he should proceed to right this terrible wrong and have his daughter returned to her home?

I am so sorry to hear that Angelfire. It must be devastating for all involved. I have worked in child protective services here in Australia but my boss was from England and he reported that our laws and processes were fairly similar so I can give you a brief outline, but someone over there will need to furnish the details.

Child protective services IS corrupt but i haven't seen it used in this way before. Normally it just unfairly targets the young and the poor and works to their own inhouse agendas. Sometimes there's a focus on DV or drug use or mental health and there will be a spate of removals on not much evidence but this tends to a reactive decision after community outcry rather than anything nefarious.

Having said that though, I left child protective services because I didn't agree with some of their policies and also because I clashed with the bitter attitude of most of the staff. I then joined the a community organisation who worked with families at risk, and was quite troubled by what I encountered. I worked with a woman who's children had been removed due to DV where her partner was the perpetrator. She left him but her children were still taken away and placed in the care of his mother at her home where he lived! Her children were NEVER returned to her. When this young woman got married and fell pregnant 3 years later, they kept her under constant watch and threatened to take her baby when it was born if she refused to work with them. I worked with another woman who had her baby removed after she placed her baby in a pram with his bottle and answered the door to let workers into her house. They told her she was not feeding him appropriately and refused to listen to her protestations. When I spoke to the worker about this she confirmed the story but added that they had checked on her when she was 8 months pregnant and the mother hadn't bought a cot yet. They considered this to be neglect. The mother said she couldn't afford to buy a cot until her family payment came in. The judge agreed to allow the investigation but insisted the baby be placed locally so that the mother could continue bonding with him and feeding him. The office placed the baby out of town. The mother went to pieces and subsequently had all of her children removed. I later found out that child protective services had an actual 'baby snatching' policy in place at the time following the death of babies whose parents were under investigation. The CPS decided to remove ALL at risk infants causing untold heartache to grieving parents who were caught up in their policy.

It is supposed to be difficult to remove a child, even more difficult to remove a baby, from it's parents. Unless the allegations are life threatening or relate to child sexual abuse, a short time period of usually 3 months is granted to the CPS to investigate. The children can be removed at this time. This investigation period can usually be extended several times, again, usually for periods of 3 months. This can usually be done for up to a year (though this could differ slightly in the UK). During this time of 'investigation', the children will be placed into care. Family members and friends should be considered first options and is preferable. You must ask your friend to seek this option. It is far easier to have a child returned from someone you know than state based care. There will be assessments with psychologists, they can be so arbitrary at times to be laughable. If you're emoting, you are crazy or scaring the children, if you're not emoting, you're a psychopath. Your friend and his partner must balance their grief with the need to reassure their child. Given that the child is so young, this will be easier, just lots of cuddles, a few quiet tears will be expected.

Your friend must remove EVERYTHING from social media and he must comply with everything he and his partner are asked to do. Fighting them will not get his child back. They want him to fight. It confirms that he is unstable and is not taking responsibility for his actions. He needs to remain as calm as possible and understand that this could be a slow process. FInd a good lawyer and if they haven't done anything wrong that will come out. The other thing I would recommend is seeing their local members of parliament and any other well known community members who could advocate on their behalf or write letters of support.

There is nothing I can say to make this any easier. I am sorry.

[amor]

This was done to a man in the U.S. named Daniel Smith who is fighting a legal battle in court against the government. He is representing himself as he has made himself an expert on every aspect of the dirty tricks used, legally and otherwise. A relative-in-law of the same name left a wife and two tiny children, one a baby, because he went through the chemotherapy route and died rather than try the MMS I told them about. He should look up the case of Daniel Smith under MMS on the internet and contact him for advice. MMS is a combination of simple chemicals which reconstitute those which are the immune system. If our immunity is strong we do not need Big Pharma. Those bastards will roast in hell.

[amor]

I read some time ago that these agencies had a quota system whereby they were paid a large sum of money for every quota fulfilled by way of the number of children they snatched. Also remembered is an experience Alex Jones spoke about at a time he was a carpet cleaner. He went to the home of a foster person who was a man, a couch potato enjoying his beer, and witnessed three or four young boys in scanty, soiled clothing huddled in fear in a separate room. These children had parents who were undoubtedly in a state of grief, not being allowed to know whether their children were alive or dead or where they were while they were being neglected and warehoused with a man I would not leave my cat with. Also, it was reported that when Child Protective Services wanted to disappear a child as far as the judge was concerned, they merely changed the name on its file and it had effectively disappeared. Alex tells another story about these children abducted by the state ending up a sex slaves to judges and police, etc., who are shot after the act to preserve silence. This happened in his state.

[enfoldedblue]

Posted by angelfire (here)
Thanks, enfoldedblue. I'm not sure this would work because of his involvement with mms. A lot of people have been convinced that it's dangerous and may not be sympathetic to his cause. It's a really difficult and tragic situation to be in.

But is he feeding it to his daughter? Because if he is not then it seems irrelevant. I mean a lot of people sell and promote things that are known to be unhealthy (think cigarettes, alcohol, junk food etc), but they don't have their children removed.

Wishing your friend and his family all the best.

[Jules]

A man had a daughter that was beautiful. Some will do anything to obtain her to obtain her for reasons we don't understand. Let us be aware that the world is not everything we think it is. Let's believe in the love of God not the love of the little g god. Let us understand why we should care about all this.

[angelfire]

Thanks everyone and I am passing your advice on to my friend, iamnoone. Praying that this nightmare will soon end.

[genevieve]

I am no expert on legal stuff, but I've been studying. Here's what I might do if I were the father:

I would claim the child as my property in an Affidavit of Truth, and include any paperwork associated with the birth (Birth Certificate, hospital records, etc.).
I'd get this notarized. I'd keep good copies with original ink signatures. Then I'd have the Affidavit RECORDED at the County Recorder's office (or the British equivalent, if I were in the UK).

I would also write a Legal Notice and Demand in which I repeated what I said in the Affidavit, and then demand that my property be returned to me whole. I might include a fee schedule in the Notice, such as 100 pounds a minute. I'd get this notarized and again keep good copies with original ink signatures. I'd send one original to the head of the agency that took my property and another to the office of the agent who took it.

Also, if I were in the UK, before I did any of the above, I'd contact the website Get Out of Debt Free, which was created and is run by a group of savvy, generous people. Yes, they specialize in debt mitigation, but they might be able to help me find someone to help with my specific situation.

Best wishes to you and your friends.

Peace Love Joy & Harmony,
genevieve

[BIG CAT]

Hi all, I was a foster carer and once looked after an 18 month girl who had been removed from her mother, although she was unable and sometimes unwilling to care for her child or turn up for contact the father was fighting the local authority for custody and met all the requests of the local authority and in my opinion was a fantastic dad. but social workers set the bar so high that he had no chance of winning custody. sadly the child was put up for adoption and was adopted by a couple who I know love her and will do what's best for her. but I cant understand why he was deemed unfit, I think they said it was he's lack of experience (well that's all first time parents) my heart broke for this father but he was doomed from the start because of social workers who in my opinion wield a massive amount of power and sometimes get it wrong! anyway, its my experience that once a child is taken away it can be years before they are returned. all I can suggest is that your friend does everything they ask and jumps through all the hoops they hold up and thanks them for their support (they like nothing more than hearing how good they are) tell him not to loose his temper and to be calm at all times. I came out of fostering because of a disagreement with a social worker whose advise I thought was counter productive, after I put in writing my concerns she started making comments and observations about my own child and my parenting skills even though I was an approved and experienced foster carer. I could see what she was doing and knew that she was letting me know what trouble she could cause, so I got out. not all social workers are bad some are good but I found very few have fostered themselves. I wish your friend the best of luck. BIG CAT

[angelfire]

Thanks, Genevieve - I will pass on the information.

[Kari Lynn]

Posted by BIG CAT (here)
Hi all, I was a foster carer and once looked after an 18 month girl who had been removed from her mother, although she was unable and sometimes unwilling to care for her child or turn up for contact the father was fighting the local authority for custody and met all the requests of the local authority and in my opinion was a fantastic dad. but social workers set the bar so high that he had no chance of winning custody. sadly the child was put up for adoption and was adopted by a couple who I know love her and will do what's best for her. but I cant understand why he was deemed unfit, I think they said it was he's lack of experience (well that's all first time parents) my heart broke for this father but he was doomed from the start because of social workers who in my opinion wield a massive amount of power and sometimes get it wrong! anyway, its my experience that once a child is taken away it can be years before they are returned. all I can suggest is that your friend does everything they ask and jumps through all the hoops they hold up and thanks them for their support (they like nothing more than hearing how good they are) tell him not to loose his temper and to be calm at all times. I came out of fostering because of a disagreement with a social worker whose advise I thought was counter productive, after I put in writing my concerns she started making comments and observations about my own child and my parenting skills even though I was an approved and experienced foster carer. I could see what she was doing and knew that she was letting me know what trouble she could cause, so I got out. not all social workers are bad some are good but I found very few have fostered themselves. I wish your friend the best of luck. BIG CAT

I too have been in the foster care with my parents. My mom and dad being licensed foster parents. My father since died, and my mother continues to keep her license, but hasn't taken in kids in years. (She's 73)
In this time I have seen so much corruption. She would die of fear if she knew I was writing this. She's had her phone tapped, and lives in fear of what they could do to me and her grandchildren.
I've seen other foster parents, fight to get parental rights terminated so they could adopt the kids in their care. Not out of love for these children, but for a long term income.
I've also seen this same foster parent push a young girl down the stairs. I was outside of her split level home and heard the girl scream, and her body hit the garage door which had been turned into bedrooms for the 12 girls she had. I called my mom from the car, and told her what happened and asked if I should call the police, but my mom was terrified of what the woman would do in retaliation, as she would know I had called her in. So I let it go. Horrified of what this woman does to the girls in her care. This 12 yr old girl, had been my mom's former foster girl. She was a blessing to have. Quiet and helpful in the house, always smiling. In this other woman's house, she was accused of being a thief, and was cowering and afraid. I never saw her smile there.

My mom also told me about a baby that she had care of for a short while. My mom is an emergency care giver. Meaning she takes children for up to 30 days when they are first taken from their parents in the middle of the night, until another foster home can be found. The infant she had, was taken from a man, 3 years after his children were returned to him. He was accused then of spanking his older child, so they took them. After much hoop jumping, he got them all back. But 3 yrs later, his wife has another baby. They took all the children again, accusing that he hadn't finished a class he was suppose to take. My mom had the baby and two other kids for a month. After reading the report, and case files, she told him to get a lawyer.
The agency then took the baby and moved him to another home. One day the dad went to visit his kids. My mom took the two older kids, to the other foster parents house to meet him there. However, when the dad returned later with the baby, he was accused of putting bruises on the baby a day later. A problem arose when my mom angrily accused the other foster mom of the deed as she had taken the child, changed his cloths, when the father brought the kids back, and there were no bruises on him. It finally came out that the foster mom had put the baby in a walker the next day and he fell down a few steps of the porch. She got nothing out of it though. It never went to court, and she didn't even get so much as a slap on the hand. Infact, she still had custody for another year.

I also have been on the other side of the coin. After my oldest son was shaken at 4 months old by a babysitter. My son was in my mom's custody, so is only reason why I think I got him back so quickly. (3 months) I was also under inspections for the next year. Attending CAPA classes. Which turned out to be an enlightening situation.

Unfortunately, my brother, his wife, and his mother-in-law. Hot lined me again, when my youngest was 9 months. my middle son was almost 2 and my oldest 5 yrs. Because my house was dirty. I admit, I'm a horrible house keeper. Especially when I've got 3 children wrapped around my legs, hips and waist. I asked for help, and get told by my mom, I had them, deal with them. No one would even so much as come over to hold a baby while I cleaned or cooked. Which is all I ever asked her. But, my mom again got custody of them. And, every week for the next 6 months, the case worker would come to my house and say. "Lots of people would love to adopt pretty white baby boys." Finally after 3 or 4 months of this, I asked if she was threatening me? She said just stating a fact, as a way of asking if I wanted to adopt them out. A couple of months later she came to my house for a surprise inspection, after I started a new part time job, (I just arrived at work. I think she waited for me to leave) she called me at work stated that the house was a horrible mess and she'd see me in court. I raced home from a new job that day. (lucky the boss didn't fire me.) to find the house clean as I had left it. She wrote in her report that I had food and dirty dishes on the counter and cloths on the couch and floor. What it was, (and I videoed this with a newspaper for date, and clock for time.) I had a bowl of fresh apples sitting on the counter for the kids to eat as snacks. A single bread plate in the sink. And a basket of cloths sitting on the couch waiting for me to come home, as I had broke my toes, and couldn't walk down the stairs, so I had asked my hubby to get them and set them on the couch for me when I got home. Which he did. I even videoed my swollen, bruised toes as evidence. I was so mad, that the next day, when this woman's supervisor came to my house, I was mad and yelling about what had happened, and showed her the video. I demanded that they can't come to my house without me having a legal witness/lawyer, and video tape as I couldn't trust either of them. I then told her that I KNEW that the reason they lied about this was to continue the supervision over my children because I had started a new job and their supervision of me was at an end that very week. The supervisor admitted this. I told her I would NEVER sign in agreement as long as it was a lie, but if she recanted the accusations, and put the reasoning for the continuation of supervision as to my new job, I would agree, but I wouldn't have anything to do with the former caseworker, she had to get another. She agreed, rewrote the form and I signed for the another 6 months of inspections. However, no one ever did come to my house after that. I'm sure the woman was afraid of our anger and not want to face us. But with all I've learned from both sides of the child protection coin, is that its no more than black market baby trafficking made legal. My mom would be horrified to see me write this. She's always hushing me up. Terrified that someone would find out and come after us. Which they might. But my kids are old enough, that it wouldn't be likely. I wonder sometimes if another foster parent would teach my boys how to clean the house?
I'm tired of feeling like their maid. lol All kidding aside though, I wouldn't want them back in the system. Now I fear what will happen with my grandchildren. They usually attack families for generations.

[BIG CAT]

there was a case of a 17 year old boy who was sexually abused and sadly had become an abuser, a placement could not be found for him so the social worker conveniently omitted the part of his file that related to him being an abuser, a foster carer took the placement and he went on to rape her three young daughters.
All because the social worker was having a hard time finding a placement!