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Thread: Do ETs exist?

  1. Link to Post #61
    Aaland Avalon Member Agape's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Quote Posted by mojo (here)
    Quote all the hallmarks of going nowhere fast
    And likely that no statement was going to change the original op opinion. The question was only a premise to start an antagonistic thread and never truly wanted to be answered. But Avalon still responds with their best intentions. It wasnt the first response to oppose a thread either on this subject. Showing the earmarks of a good disinfo agent...

    edit: actually there is another possibility one that we humans do when faced with a stressful situation, like post traumatic stress... perhaps trying to justify something that happened.

    Open minded skepticism is fine with me as long as those people have enough intelligence to reflect subjectivity of their own opinion, stop before the 'debunking line' and simply, do not presume that people 'with experiences' are waiting for someone to explain it to them.
    Truly, for those who have had 'experiences' , it's their choice and responsibility to educate themselves , do the mind exploration on their own - no one in the whole world is going to do that for you - and then decide .

    I find easier sometimes to speak to open minded skeptics - as long as they are thinking creatures wishing to learn - and not just programmed thinking machines

    than talking to 'learned believers' who presume that by some mysterious means that excludes any solid data they've just arrived at the greatest super-theory of everything and can't see or admit where their theoretical holes are .
    Every science oriented individual knows where are his/her 'holes' and 'weaknesses' and presents them together with the other 'evidence' so that in result he/she can get rid of those holes in your theory.

    What the conspiracy and experiencer movement have been seen doing for years now is covering logical discrepancies , straight contradictions and errors in personal testimonies so in result,
    no scientist want to have anything to do with such level of reporting .

    For top notch physicist , say Michio Kaku , ET life or interstellar problem truly are the slightest theoretical problem to get over with ,
    but where you present them with many fantastic tales at the same time , to someone accustomed to follow rules of logic, they'll find the mistake and miscalculation you even do not notice and is clear to them that the story does not fit .

    How ? Not by charms, not by gender, nationality, intuition or beauty . Simply, following logic and questioning the witness .


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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Hmmm…I’ve seem to have missed out on some interesting things. But I’m most intrigued with the many statements giving about this supposed “Abundance of evidence”.

    I’ve read, listen to, scanned over, tons of testimonies/videos/and pictures… but I’ve found none of them to have anything displaying actual aliens from other planets/star systems.

    Can those that have access to all of this “undeniable” proof please share (link) it with me? I’m beyond curious, extremely intrigued to learn what exactly it is giving people these beliefs.

    I’ve worn many hats while working in the entertainment industry. Producer, assistant Director, Script writer, Animator, Editor, Promoter, etc… I’ve mentioned this several times because I’m in contact with many celebrities that are willing to use their positions to help expose these “So called” phenomenon’s.

    Many times I’ve stated how my colleagues and I are aware of media manipulation (first hand) and wish to use our positons to expose truths and lies. Some of you may have notice over the last few years that there is a rise in movies that feature some of the ideologies discuss in this forum. Now think about that for a moment…
    What I’m witnessing is a cipher of programming. Tel-lie-vision is an information resource tool…mainly to gain attention to a particular subject or to condition an idea into popularity.

    We can all help each other by exercising in transparency. When information deemed “highly important” is spread…there should be “attachments” of verifiability. Without such data/facts…how can important information get handled in a responsible manner?

    What makes all the Alien Hype losses its credibility… is not the skeptic…but the lack of substance that supports the claim. Also, whenever this subject gets to a point of heated discourse…it’s often turned into a show of immaturity from those that can’t clarified their own beliefs, resulting to elitism and exclusion banter. I’m still surprised that whenever I’ve asked people for their proof… I’m always re-directed to someone else testimony/video. Remind me on how this is YOUR proof?

    If there was actual proof of aliens…these sought of topics wouldn’t exist. Those holding beliefs only have faith and tales of intrigue form others, they have nothing else to show.…they are just used to the ideas because of years of conditioning, and it doesn’t help that most elders are comfortably stuck in their ways and would rather push a “uncertainty” instead of further investigating the obvious flaws. These same people past on these unconfirmed ideologies to the young and expect them to respect, obey without question. It’s no wonder to me why the youth rebel. Most of the elders consistently show their inconsistencies, their lack of responsibility, lack of commitments and guidance to the actual truth…. They are mostly found in a position of comfort forever waiting for their beliefs to reveal themselves. A sad sight to say the least.

    We need a world where every “Shouted” truth is readily experienced. Telling someone there is an alien is not like telling someone there’s a loaf of bread in the store. I can easily go to that store to verify the loaf of bread’s past, present, and future existence.

    I also find it baffling that people are so eager to believe in alien contact/abductions instead of the more logical ideas that these instances could very well be the work of secret government operations. This thought seems to always go unnoticed, ignored…look down upon, but why? Hmmm…

    What really makes this all seem like a setup is the fact that it makes all of its believers sit by idle watching the skies… instead of reaching for it. They will sit, and sit and sit… only moving to fight any rationale thoughts threatening their heavily ingrained beliefs. Yet still failing to offer anything that matters…and failing to alleviate the tension growing around the topic.

    So why are people getting offended when they know full well that they are not even presenting any real proof? Why do they not see how their hearsay and probabilities are easily exposed to inconsistencies and that alternative thinking/reasoning is better explaining their experience. I'm now coming to the realization that people are just trained to believe and will fight for that belief no matter the logic that is shown to them. A good example of why the world is in a state of confusion, and chaos. We are so easily divided by every little thing... when everything can be so so simple. hmmm...

    Peace
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    Humans created so much wonder through their division, just imagine what they can do through Unity...

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  5. Link to Post #63
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Quote Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
    Hmmm…I’ve seem to have missed out on some interesting things. But I’m most intrigued with the many statements giving about this supposed “Abundance of evidence”.

    I’ve read, listen to, scanned over, tons of testimonies/videos/and pictures… but I’ve found none of them to have anything displaying actual aliens from other planets/star systems.

    Can those that have access to all of this “undeniable” proof please share (link) it with me? I’m beyond curious, extremely intrigued to learn what exactly it is giving people these beliefs.

    I’ve worn many hats while working in the entertainment industry. Producer, assistant Director, Script writer, Animator, Editor, Promoter, etc… I’ve mentioned this several times because I’m in contact with many celebrities that are willing to use their positions to help expose these “So called” phenomenon’s.

    Many times I’ve stated how my colleagues and I are aware of media manipulation (first hand) and wish to use our positons to expose truths and lies. Some of you may have notice over the last few years that there is a rise in movies that feature some of the ideologies discuss in this forum. Now think about that for a moment…
    What I’m witnessing is a cipher of programming. Tel-lie-vision is an information resource tool…mainly to gain attention to a particular subject or to condition an idea into popularity.

    We can all help each other by exercising in transparency. When information deemed “highly important” is spread…there should be “attachments” of verifiability. Without such data/facts…how can important information get handled in a responsible manner?

    What makes all the Alien Hype losses its credibility… is not the skeptic…but the lack of substance that supports the claim. Also, whenever this subject gets to a point of heated discourse…it’s often turned into a show of immaturity from those that can’t clarified their own beliefs, resulting to elitism and exclusion banter. I’m still surprised that whenever I’ve asked people for their proof… I’m always re-directed to someone else testimony/video. Remind me on how this is YOUR proof?

    If there was actual proof of aliens…these sought of topics wouldn’t exist. Those holding beliefs only have faith and tales of intrigue form others, they have nothing else to show.…they are just used to the ideas because of years of conditioning, and it doesn’t help that most elders are comfortably stuck in their ways and would rather push a “uncertainty” instead of further investigating the obvious flaws. These same people past on these unconfirmed ideologies to the young and expect them to respect, obey without question. It’s no wonder to me why the youth rebel. Most of the elders consistently show their inconsistencies, their lack of responsibility, lack of commitments and guidance to the actual truth…. They are mostly found in a position of comfort forever waiting for their beliefs to reveal themselves. A sad sight to say the least.

    We need a world where every “Shouted” truth is readily experienced. Telling someone there is an alien is not like telling someone there’s a loaf of bread in the store. I can easily go to that store to verify the loaf of bread’s past, present, and future existence.

    I also find it baffling that people are so eager to believe in alien contact/abductions instead of the more logical ideas that these instances could very well be the work of secret government operations. This thought seems to always go unnoticed, ignored…look down upon, but why? Hmmm…

    What really makes this all seem like a setup is the fact that it makes all of its believers sit by idle watching the skies… instead of reaching for it. They will sit, and sit and sit… only moving to fight any rationale thoughts threatening their heavily ingrained beliefs. Yet still failing to offer anything that matters…and failing to alleviate the tension growing around the topic.

    So why are people getting offended when they know full well that they are not even presenting any real proof? Why do they not see how their hearsay and probabilities are easily exposed to inconsistencies and that alternative thinking/reasoning is better explaining their experience. I'm now coming to the realization that people are just trained to believe and will fight for that belief no matter the logic that is shown to them. A good example of why the world is in a state of confusion, and chaos. We are so easily divided by every little thing... when everything can be so so simple. hmmm...

    Peace


    I agree with you , blatantly and openly . But - and all i can suggest - bring me a team of curious scientists /researchers who would be actually open to investigate things ,
    including your 'condemned witness' when/after encounter happens .

    A one or two at least who would be genuinely interested in finding such evidence and NOT a priori , programmed debunkers .

    Send them here and we can talk . Don't send shamans , media producers , exorcists and those who resemble who you just quoted , people who think we have an 'abundance of evidence' because it's 'all on the web'.

    Over the years , not even one showed up who would fit into that category and would have the interest and determination to 'uncover such evidence'.

    If you ask why , the reasons are found in your article .. they feel uniformly helpless against the undiscerned mass of 'claimants' of ET contact/abductions and allegations of government conspiracies that together blend to a myth.
    Left to researchers of mythology to investigate ..



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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Excellent thread btw. Threads like these cause us to rethink our assumptions and beliefs. John Keel and Jacques Vallee have demonstrated with their respective body of research that the ET hypothesis is most likely interdimensional. Now I'm inclined to agree especially in light of the fact that as John Keel has shown, the "phenomena" changes itself to our expectations. 100 years ago ET paraded around in blimps and did things that to us today seem ridiculous but nonetheless made an impression on the people that interacted with them.

    During the Sci/Fi revolution of 40-60's ET appeared as UFO's. (Does anyone else find it hard to believe that a "vehicle" of advance tech could be brought down by radar)

    There is no denying others personal experience, or the multitude of data that shows contact and abductions are occurring. I'm wondering if it's possible that the whole ET is a smokesreen for something else. According to Robert Duncan and others that discuss the idea that we've had the technology for remote EEG heterodyning of cloning brainwaves at a distance since the 50's or 60's(can't remember exactly)thus making it possible(if true) to make any one think anything. Here's the catch though, ET has been appearing for an extremely long time, but the key seems to be how their appearance is tailored to our expectations, as John Keel pointed out.

    So, what do we have here?

    ET/Aliens from space visiting and abducting and experimenting and passing on knowledge, or Interdimensional beings masquerading as ET to keep us always looking "out there". Or TPTB with advanced tech making us think that ET is doing everything, and if so where did they get the tech in the first place?

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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    excellent post from boardingguy. you sum up the issue well. It is definitely perplexing. I tend to the smokescreen
    theory, but recognize its limitations as well. It simply doesn't cover everything. For example,
    older phenomena (unless there is a human group that has had very advanced technology for
    a very long time).

    What R. Duncan talks about is real. This I know from very direct personal
    experience. It is "realer" than people who haven't experienced it will understand (not their
    fault). What I mean is, it would be very difficult if not impossible to imagine what some things are really like,
    from the inside. I couldn't have done it....

    To some, EEG heterodyning etc. is just theory. To others, it is just fact (though I suppose one could still
    debate about exactly who is doing it and the exact nature of the technologies). One can still make those arguments.
    The other stuff, aliens and so on, is interesting to me but still, for me, just rumors and anecdotes. I have no direct
    knowledge.

    Mind influencing technology, including brain to brain / supercomputer to brain communication technology, is much more
    powerful and potentially deceiving than people realize. The uninitiated just have no idea. I do not say this from a pompous
    perspective. Not at all. Some things just have to be experienced for you to really and truly know.

    Anyway, it's important not to be a cult of alien believers. In my opinion the OP made several good points and it is good
    to have a skeptical but open minded approach to things.
    Last edited by David Ansible; 17th May 2016 at 04:01.

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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Your entering the debate reply Bill was very well put, thanks for it and I totally agree.

    One thing related to this Op I just thought about and hadn't done so before relates to our own Secrete technology (Maybe breakaway) is that:

    The beings and entities we see here maybe secrete to their own worlds and species! They might not be the norm on their planets and the general populations of such planets might be in the dark just like us o.0

    They are out-there, they are here, they and us are all here and real as real can be in this conundrum of life.
    I'm a simple easy going guy that is very upset/sad with the worlds hidden controllers!
    We need LEADERS who bat from the HEART!
    Rise up above them Dark evil doers, not within anger but with LOVE

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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Maybe we're categorizing ETs into a box, and the way we're defining them is affecting our ability to approach the question of whether or not they exist.

    So let's take one step back and think about what consciousness is.

    How many people would agree that there is more than one "dimension" to this universe? Meaning, there's more to reality than just this physical aspect. And probably when we die, if you believe that your spirit or consciousness continues in some other non-physical form, then it's probably in one of those other dimensions at that point.

    There's a lot of good material available--some of it mentioned in Bill's "library" post, and some of it elsewhere--that delves into the subject of consciousness. Stuff like the "Seth material" does a good job of giving the impression that it's possible we exist consciously in all of the various dimensions at the same time. And that our earthly life here is an aspect of our non-physical vitality choosing to participate in a physical experience here on Earth, via the "human" envelope.

    If any of this sounds like it could be somewhat true, and the more I learn the more I'm leaning this way, then what really is an ET?

    Maybe if we stop thinking of them as another product of biological evolution on some other planet millions of light years away that became sentient half a million years ago, and tried thinking of ETs as other non-physical energetic personalities who chose to participate in a physical experience in some other species, we could expand the discussion into more interesting territory.

    With that in mind as a new definition of ETs then, I would ask, are you any different that any other ET?

    Even better: How do you know your non-physical vitality/soul/higher self hasn't chosen to check out one of those other species in a previous life already?

    Does the spirit of a dolphin live on after it dies? If you think that's possible, then maybe they fall into the same category now. How do you know you yourself haven't tried out what it's like to be a dolphin already?

    I guess to go there you first have to be open to the possibility that your soul existed before you were conceived in your mother's womb. And for a lot of the deniers, I think that's the biggest hurdle to get over before any of this ET stuff can awaken your sense of wonder.

    Pull up some books from the Avalon Library and see if they can help you get over that hurdle.

    Much love to all on this thread.
    Last edited by Joe Akulis; 17th May 2016 at 16:29.

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  14. Link to Post #68
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Quote Posted by indigopete (here)
    It’s in that context - not that of ‘belief system’ - that I’ve come to the conclusion that some of assumptions associated with the UFO agenda are bogus and in fact serve to deny people an indigenous understanding of their own existence...
    I don't blame you at all for having doubts. However, if I had never had a UFO/ET experience, I think I would still believe in the phenomenon to some extent. It's such an implausible stretch, based on the literally thousands of case histories, to not believe in their existence. But experiencing the reality for yourself really is the clincher.

    Quote Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
    Can those that have access to all of this “undeniable” proof please share (link) it with me? I'm beyond curious, extremely intrigued to learn what exactly it is giving people these beliefs...
    I have experienced extra-terrestrial phenomenon with my own eyes. Physical, tangible, right-in-front-of-me REAL. Beings that are not of this world. The inside and outside of crafts that are not of this world. It really IS real.

    It's also incredible, mind-blowing, and life-changing - I would almost say life-shattering to some extent, because when this first unravelled for me in the 80's and 90's it totally shattered my psyche. The human psyche is a pretty flimsy machine. It's not naturally wired to easily cope and absorb the reality of...another reality. That's the only way I can put it!

    It can literally shatter the foundation of your life, and everything in it. It took me years to understand what was happening. And it took me years to come to terms with it. Of course I still haven't got it all figured out. But the experiences NEVER leave you. Memories crop up literally every single day: of SEEING and experiencing these extraordinary things - can you imagine the contrast and dichotomy of this reality against the backdrop of my daily (mundane) life? I can only say once more, it is REAL, and it's incredible to KNOW that it's real, but it's as equally frustrating to know you cannot share this reality, except in (empty) words.

    It's like I'm saying I climbed Everest - an incredible feat, yet unfortunately I have no photographs to prove I did it, no evidence for having done so. But I know you're saying to yourself that Everest is still ten times or a thousand times more likely to have happened to me than seeing, touching, and interacting with alien beings, right? You are right. But whatever the case you either believe it happened to me, or you don't.

    I understood where you're coming from, and I understand your doubts. I WISH I could give you proof, I wish I could give you the memory and knowledge of my own experience - or that of MANY others. I wish you could SEE what I've seen. This would be your undeniable proof. I wish I could do that, but I can't. All I've got are words. You either believe them, or you do not.
    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
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  16. Link to Post #69
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    All one has to do , is look at you his-tory . Paintings with ETV's on them , not UFO's . We were either very intelligent to build places like , Gobekli Tepe . Strange animals on the side of pillars of stone , not known today . Said to be 12000 years old . The Pyramids , engineers say they could not build them today , with all the technology they have at their disposal and many more structures like them . Cave paintings ,depicting astronauts and some very similar to greys . And , we're actually told from a very early age we are the image of our creator, whom itself is an alien (imo). Whatever you believe , there is no denying we ether lost our ability to make these structures or , someone else built them , I plum for the latter .

    There are many early accounts , like Ezekiel's wheel . Probably one of the very early abductions , eye witness account .

    Now as I looked at the living beings, behold, there was one wheel on the earth beside the living beings, for each of the four of them. 16The appearance of the wheels and their workmanship was like sparkling beryl, and all four of them had the same form, their appearance and workmanship being as if one wheel were within another. 17Whenever they moved, they moved in any of their four directions without turning as they moved .

    This is just a very small snapshot , of a huge phenomena and yes ET's and EDB's exist .
    Last edited by scanner; 17th May 2016 at 17:42.
    Am I one of many or am I many of one ? interesting .

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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    .
    This short, recent video, of Richard Dolan discussing the 'ETH' (Extraterrestrial Hypothesis) is — as can be expected — of the very highest quality. I'm tempted to make a joke and say, well, we should just close this thread, and all watch the video instead.

    It's short of 17 minutes long, but presents, intelligently and lucidly, every possible angle on everything that's been discussed in this thread. Highly recommended. There's not a single word (or concept) in there that I'd disagree with.


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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Richard Dolan really is a fine speaker. Exhibit 'B' then, could be his excellent speech at the Citizens Hearing on Disclosure. Anyone still doubting the reality of ETs or UFOs could do no better than spend an afternoon listening to these testimonies.

    "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace."
    ~ Jimi Hendrix

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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

    It's short of 17 minutes long, but presents, intelligently and lucidly, every possible angle on everything that's been discussed in this thread. Highly recommended. There's not a single word (or concept) in there that I'd disagree with.
    But Bill, no matter how advanced Rich Dolan sounds to you and yours , do you expect ANSWERS where you believe that he or you have '' every possible angle on everything'' ?
    It is informative, good summary for people who are new to the ''ET Hypothesis'' and conjures with the 'objectivity strand' people need to be vaccinated with ,
    to survive the rest of 'ET Exposure' ,
    forgive my complicated wording ..

    but it's also slightly discouraging if you believe that such understanding represents the 'peak of knowledge' and no one else knows better .

    In gist , in case of interacting with the real 'ET strain' ( trying to minimise ) your best assumptions and hypothesis likely DO fall than otherwise and who are you to say no one here carries the information within them .

    Do you only expect QUESTIONS that you or Rich could answer - because that's keeping the community and public opinion safe, and in check .
    And no more 'advanced answers' .. or , even a clarity , but ..

    please think of 'future generations' .

    In the 'bad Hollywood movies' not to speak about good ones, ET intelligence/visitors usually get the chance to make friends with humans .
    In so called 'quality science fiction' movies of the 50s, 60s, 70s ... and so forth , ET intelligence can seldom make a good sense of humans as they are - and vice versa ( vis Solaris , AC Clark 2001 Space Odyssey or the Europa Report ) .
    Solaris IS a quality movie but I can't say I'd like it , from deep within .

    I liked ET or the Close Encounters much better . Because there's a happyend, true but also , they make sense .. to both worlds .






    Do you allow any ET to your 'experience' is one good question . Because all these people you take refuge in and their judgements are still, very human.


    And me thinks it's futile , from my ET perspective , trying to talk to humans who really think they know everything , especially everything about ETs.
    Last edited by Agape; 18th May 2016 at 12:34.

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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Quote Posted by Star Mariner (here)

    It's like I'm saying I climbed Everest - an incredible feat, yet unfortunately I have no photographs to prove I did it, no evidence for having done so. But I know you're saying to yourself that Everest is still ten times or a thousand times more likely to have happened to me than seeing, touching, and interacting with alien beings, right? You are right. But whatever the case you either believe it happened to me, or you don't.

    I understood where you're coming from, and I understand your doubts. I WISH I could give you proof, I wish I could give you the memory and knowledge of my own experience - or that of MANY others. I wish you could SEE what I've seen. This would be your undeniable proof. I wish I could do that, but I can't. All I've got are words. You either believe them, or you do not.

    Thanks for the heart talk Star Mariner , sums the 'human experience' pretty well for me too , completely true .

    Most humans are likely to believe about anything else being the 'real explanation' than the one option of thousands ( or millions ) of 'meeting the ET'.
    It's strange ..about humans and observable fact that many long-term earthlings are inherently xenophobic and when pushed to think 'out of the box' ,
    philosophically, spiritually or scientifically .. more than few find themselves empty of imagination and fearing dissolution of their personal integrity ,
    as if the cosmic intelligence and its structure began and ended with them .

    The 'ET awareness' in humans hardly started century or two ago .. it's been here much much earlier and essentially, since the beginning of human race ,
    so were periodical encounters .

    Or is it the need-for-immediate-proof , the g'me , give me or I forsake you that is preventing us from sharing .

    There's something that travels faster than light in Space , not talking of 'vacuum' and that is - information. Information is immaterial in nature the way the 'spin of particle' is to its 'mass' .
    With technologies advanced enough all we could be receiving is 'intelligence imprint' of civilisation faraway in Space that docks to the most sensitive apparatus of our biological intelligence instead the radios, telescopes and TVs.
    In my experience though , we've been 'located' from much closer here .. and what happens next ..
    is ET ( not ) waiting for the correct answer ?

    The original, never thought of answer that PROVES there's a race of advanced biological entities somewhere in our direction and not a race of primitives or even drones ..?



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    Avalon Member Peace of Mind's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Re: Do ETs exist?

    hmm...

    I’m not entirely sure if I made my point clear enough. So I’ll attempt to make this as blunt as respectfully possible. I see the whole alien subject as a clever distraction for several reasons.

    1. Almost every person with a testimony/ video/ picture/ documentation has always claimed their evidence to be real, but when challenged…their supposed facts turn into personal experiences. Yet, these same people expect others without ‘Said” experiences to indulge in discussions on that very subject. However, as soon as the topic shows signs of logical alternative thinking (for these claims) … the conversation starts showing signs of sensitivity issues instead of sensitive issues getting exposed. That’s always a red flag in my book, and this will always compel me to dig further, ask the tougher questions.

    2. The subject about aliens has shown/provided us absolutely nothing…other than being one of the world’s biggest distraction. WHY?? An why is there so much attention given to this mysterious, imaginary, undisclosed, never seen before beings…when the existence of humanity lies in peril? When these points are repeatedly ignored…suspicion can only set in due to these unresolved irresponsible presentations. Due diligence; Respect earns Respect!

    3. The blatant/total disregard of the idea that actual humans within our governments are behind all of these alien abductions and encounters. We had great technology in pass civilizations because we are unlimited thinkers (within and outside of the box). Many of the "alien believers" just don’t want to consider the logical ideas of being victims to ourselves…even though there’s plenty of evidence in the past and present showing our propensity to manipulate each others mindset/lives for personal gains. So if there is nothing to truly gain and nothing of urgency within the alien hype…why is this such a distraction at the times when our focus is most needed? Hmmm…..

    4. All the alien hype could be a plan to disguise human divinity/potential. You see this potential drawn on ancient walls, some people today have unexplained natural abililites as certain hieroglyphics suggests...but to an disempowered being...or being seeking to hide such probability...they will say its from another world...A world they have no way of experiencing, but somehow KNOW. hmm...

    If humans believe that there are outer world beings more advance than them…they will lose confidence, gain fear, become idled/distracted, uninspired, confused, etc…

    Also, the alien phenomenon seems to be a great way to further gain control over the masses. This can control the populace mentals, physicality, financials, and emotional states of being. It's the ultimate trap. Yet no one here wants to consider that, they wont even expand on that rational possibility, rather go straight for the cosmos alien entity theme…why? hmmm..

    5. And most of all…people are making tons of money from promoting “truths” that they can’t even provide to their customers. How can you not see how this practice is not being a part of the problem? Especially when you say…
    “it’s my experience”, “there’s plenty of evidence out there” (even when this same evidence is shown to be inconclusive and highly subjective)?

    How can you not see the flaws in stating a "truth" when you’re resulting to defining your truth by directing skeptics to someone else’s definition/testimony of YOUR truth?

    You are not providing anything…you're just spreading someone else’s propaganda.To not see this from a place of healthy perception...well, that can also be seen as disrespectful to those you wish to educate on the “UNKNOWN”.

    If you can’t be creative/ thorough enough in your “offerings” to important matters in our lives… it’s not going to help matters by being at odds with those that have the courage and commitments to peeling back all the layers. If there is nothing to hide…there should be nothing to fear, or get upset about. The truth will always speak for itself…you don’t have to defend it…just present it. It has always been this way.

    That said… I have no problem considering most things…it’s just that my “To Be Considered” bin is starting to overflow and I may need some assistance in handling it properly. So please Help me Help you… so we can Help us…

    Peace
    --
    Humans created so much wonder through their division, just imagine what they can do through Unity...

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  26. Link to Post #75
    United States Avalon Member Gerald Paris's Avatar
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    Exclamation Re: Do ETs exist?

    Quote Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
    hmm...

    I’m not entirely sure if I made my point clear enough. So I’ll attempt to make this as blunt as respectfully possible. I see the whole alien subject as a clever distraction for several reasons.

    1. Almost every person with a testimony/ video/ picture/ documentation has always claimed their evidence to be real, but when challenged…their supposed facts turn into personal experiences. Yet, these same people expect others without ‘Said” experiences to indulge in discussions on that very subject. However, as soon as the topic shows signs of logical alternative thinking (for these claims) … the conversation starts showing signs of sensitivity issues instead of sensitive issues getting exposed. That’s always a red flag in my book, and this will always compel me to dig further, ask the tougher questions.

    2. The subject about aliens has shown/provided us absolutely nothing…other than being one of the world’s biggest distraction. WHY?? An why is there so much attention given to this mysterious, imaginary, undisclosed, never seen before beings…when the existence of humanity lies in peril? When these points are repeatedly ignored…suspicion can only set in due to these unresolved irresponsible presentations. Due diligence; Respect earns Respect!

    3. The blatant/total disregard of the idea that actual humans within our governments are behind all of these alien abductions and encounters. We had great technology in pass civilizations because we are unlimited thinkers (within and outside of the box). Many of the "alien believers" just don’t want to consider the logical ideas of being victims to ourselves…even though there’s plenty of evidence in the past and present showing our propensity to manipulate each others mindset/lives for personal gains. So if there is nothing to truly gain and nothing of urgency within the alien hype…why is this such a distraction at the times when our focus is most needed? Hmmm…..

    4. All the alien hype could be a plan to disguise human divinity/potential. You see this potential drawn on ancient walls, some people today have unexplained natural abililites as certain hieroglyphics suggests...but to an disempowered being...or being seeking to hide such probability...they will say its from another world...A world they have no way of experiencing, but somehow KNOW. hmm...

    If humans believe that there are outer world beings more advance than them…they will lose confidence, gain fear, become idled/distracted, uninspired, confused, etc…

    Also, the alien phenomenon seems to be a great way to further gain control over the masses. This can control the populace mentals, physicality, financials, and emotional states of being. It's the ultimate trap. Yet no one here wants to consider that, they wont even expand on that rational possibility, rather go straight for the cosmos alien entity theme…why? hmmm..

    5. And most of all…people are making tons of money from promoting “truths” that they can’t even provide to their customers. How can you not see how this practice is not being a part of the problem? Especially when you say…
    “it’s my experience”, “there’s plenty of evidence out there” (even when this same evidence is shown to be inconclusive and highly subjective)?

    How can you not see the flaws in stating a "truth" when you’re resulting to defining your truth by directing skeptics to someone else’s definition/testimony of YOUR truth?

    You are not providing anything…you're just spreading someone else’s propaganda.To not see this from a place of healthy perception...well, that can also be seen as disrespectful to those you wish to educate on the “UNKNOWN”.

    If you can’t be creative/ thorough enough in your “offerings” to important matters in our lives… it’s not going to help matters by being at odds with those that have the courage and commitments to peeling back all the layers. If there is nothing to hide…there should be nothing to fear, or get upset about. The truth will always speak for itself…you don’t have to defend it…just present it. It has always been this way.

    That said… I have no problem considering most things…it’s just that my “To Be Considered” bin is starting to overflow and I may need some assistance in handling it properly. So please Help me Help you… so we can Help us…

    Peace
    Amazing. Thank you for adding this to the conversation.

    and to use a quote found in this conversation, in regards to my feeling on your addition


    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    .

    It's short of 17 minutes long, but presents, intelligently and lucidly, every possible angle on everything that's been discussed in this thread. Highly recommended. There's not a single word (or concept) in there that I'd disagree with.
    Last edited by Gerald Paris; 18th May 2016 at 18:03.

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  28. Link to Post #76
    Aaland Avalon Member Agape's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    All you can receive ..or not .. is an information here, whether it's visual, tactile or auditory or combination of all but an information that connects , docks to the particular set of neuroreceptors and your own information patterns ..

    it's upon you to make smart use of all that information , or not ..

    in fact it's what is happening everywhere around us , great boost of technical creativity and flourishing human potential , in all possible directions , upwards and downwards .

    There's an 'evolution' of human potential happening at all times and , 'devolution' as well , in many of our biological aspects we are but receding to oblivion as a race ..

    The 'hype' is about people recalling their origins in Space

    In times long ago it was only the chosen few ..

    now , a mass event is happening but it's probably all the same stuff .


    People do make lots of flowery rhetorics but there are few of them with any real knowledge of more subtle truth .

    At the end of the 'alien hypothesis' may well be a tiny singular ET AI in size of a lady-bird responsible for the rest and we will never find out .

    Or it was all in your grandma The moment she lifted you from cold night pod after hours and you suffered existential shock.
    It may have started right there .

    But how possibly did the other kids make it to ordinary human world devoid of advanced strangers ?


    What's my 'existential fault' for being who I am . That's not a test . I've got my questions answered in encounter lasting hours of human time .


    How does it connect ? This is not 'me' , or 'you' , this is but an 'internet message' . Mirror mirror .


    Peace to you

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  30. Link to Post #77
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Its easy to see a different view on the subject of "Do ET's exist?" Some say yes and others no. Did anyone's mind get changed here? Probably not....At least the mainstream attitude has changed on the subject. It's agreed that a larger percent believe the existence of alien life. For some members like Bill mentioned earlier, are not going to change. Speaking as one having being witness to them it doesn't matter about convincing others. I got to see....

    Accounts throughout history, folklore and drawings have shown something about them.

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    France Avalon Member araucaria's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    .
    This short, recent video, of Richard Dolan discussing the 'ETH' (Extraterrestrial Hypothesis) is — as can be expected — of the very highest quality. I'm tempted to make a joke and say, well, we should just close this thread, and all watch the video instead.

    It's short of 17 minutes long, but presents, intelligently and lucidly, every possible angle on everything that's been discussed in this thread. Highly recommended. There's not a single word (or concept) in there that I'd disagree with.

    This more philosophical than historical talk from Richard Dolan clearly shows how ufology fits in with the broader spectrum of human speculation. ‘ET craft’ may well be real, but at the same time they are merely a placeholder for the more general concept of the unidentified and its role in human endeavour: you might call it uology. My own background in literature turns up the same idea. See this post: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1014637
    This is not just human endeavour in fact, as Dolan mentions dogs and fish too. (See this post: http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1006734 ) Talking of animals, at the age of just two months, my daughter’s new kitten was intrigued at water emerging from a tap/faucet and downright puzzlement on seeing it disappear down the plughole. However, this was only spare time water: the water in its bowl was drunk with no questions asked! The issue is how the two situations relate: once you are adequately fed and watered you can start asking questions about things that previously passed you by. The choice for those that reach that point (many of course do not) is whether to carry on or to turn back. What happens if you do carry on is that you start experiencing quantum leaps, first in the scientific sense of tiny jumps, and maybe at some stage in the ordinary sense of a huge leap into a whole new dimension.

    For example, we know that some fish can fly: they’re called flying fish Mostly they land back in the water; however, when they land on a boat they tend to get eaten, but they may also land on a desert island, where some may get to evolve into amphibians, as the fossil record suggests some of their ancestors did. You evolve from apparent closed system to apparent closed system – fish ponds, dogs in libraries, humans on prison planets, it’s all the same – until the idea emerges that on a grander scale the system is actually open. When that stage is reached, an enquiring mind can explore these various subsystems without being or feeling cramped, and sometimes more importantly, without feeling totally insecure in this bigger, largely unknown environment. It can’t have been easy for the first land-based fishes literally to get a foothold, but it is as natural as an individual being born and leaving the protective closed environment of the womb. The individuals involved didn’t actually evolve at all: while the species was evolving, these individual fish had to hit the ground running, and survive as the fish they were on the dry ground they landed upon. This is the grim reality of the DIY universe: there may be perfect fins out there, and perfect legs, but the task ahead means walking on fins, breathing air directly through gills etc etc: not for the faint-hearted. It makes no sense, but you only have to try it to see that it works.

    Hence the actual fact or not of extraterrestrial beings and the details thereof are totally secondary to their positioning at the interface of our present world with another, where you can fall off the edge into the other via an intermediate vesica piscis-type no man’s land, neither here nor there, where paranormal interference takes place. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vesica_piscis When ufology is placed within this broader perspective, the issue is no longer about ufologists obtaining disclosure for their findings, but in their discovering that... they are not alone: others are discovering other similar tears in the fabric of reality, whether it is someone like myself watching a piece of writing morph into something else materialist or a neurosurgeon dealing with NDErs. Or disabled people pulling off the craziest exploits in relation to their handicap. Or, more generally, huge numbers discovering that the old ways of doing things are fast becoming totally inoperative, and getting on with their lives regardless.

    This is why I suggest the issue is not about sharing the content of ufology per se as about sharing the principle behind ufology: what I am calling uology. The problem with ufology, and for any single field for that matter, is its authoritarian tendency to fill in any gaps as a one-size-fits-all big picture. This is why we can legitimately suspect something is wrong with the disclosure movement for example: a limited hang-out as another form of enslavement. And it is why it will never gain traction with many people, namely those are working precisely in the gaps that are getting filled in. The advantage of uology on the other hand is that it places on a single platform people working in similar ways in totally different fields, people for example who might be the first to laugh at the tinfoil hat brigade and yet be working to assimilate similar huge anomalies in their own fields of research: the sort of stuff that has Buddhist monks talking to scientists etc. Hence the slogan ‘We are not alone’ applies first and foremost internally to the human race, because we are all growing in so many different ways and directions that it seems like the world is being invaded by aliens, when we are more likely just dealing with fellow humans who are by now unrecognizable in the new medium or dimension we are entering. Dogs in the library reading the books

    Edit: For the removal of any doubt, the above is in no way a criticism of Richard Dolan: just the opposite in fact.
    Last edited by araucaria; 19th May 2016 at 07:31.


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  34. Link to Post #79
    Finland Avalon Member Wind's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    I'm quite amazed that a question like this is asked here, of all places! No offense meant. Isn't this mostly an UFO/conspiracy website after all? I know that the so called "normal" humans might have varying opinions about ET's (mostly disbelief and disinterest!), but even many of them do believe that intelligent life surely exists somewhere out there. Way, way more intelligent than us. Can we even be really called intelligent? Perhaps that, but certainly not wise. I think we have not only been visited since the beginning of mankind, but also have been created by some races. Many of the God deities of the past may in fact have been ET's, because they literally seemed godlike compared to humans. Some more benevolent than others, others wished to educate where others wanted to enslave. Such is the case with humans too. Dualistic universe and all that jazz.

    Also I know that we have been visited many times and even quite recently, that's a fact. I have not had any major UFO encounters, but I have seen objects on the sky which possibly could not have been anything manmade. That being said, I do believe that there are also interdimensional travellers and there are spiritual phenomenons. There is much more than meets the eye and especially material scientists have a hard time admitting that, or maybe they just don't care. The body itself is a vessel, sure.

    Then there's also technology beyond human comprehension and they surely have figured out the secrets of the universe eons ago and know how to bend timespace to their will. Our "public" rocket technology seems absolutely pathetic... Although I do applaud companies like SpaceX for their endeavors. Then again I'm sure that many of us here don't really believe the lies that NASA would have stopped the Moon landings after the 70's and that we never went beyond that? Interstellar travel is probably already a reality for humans too. Or something close to it.

    I don't think that our ET brothers and sisters will be announcing themselves anytime soon, considering the state of the collective human mindset. Nor will the governments ever admit the truth, at least not directly. Why? Because then they would also have to admit that they have lied to us for almost 70 years, about the ET phenomenon and the secrets of the universe. If we get our act together in time (which could be a luxury we're running out of...) then we might be allowed to take our rightful place in the galactic community. Much has to change before that and human consciousness needs to reach a new higher level. Currently we're still at the kindergarten level. What kind of a civilized civilization focuses on insane things like wars anyways? Did you hear the news? Humans allowed their fellow beings to starve to death on their planet while they were busy developing arms technology? Although the planet was and has been full of abudance for all. Now, what did Gandhi say about greed again?

    Who knows, maybe in the not too distant future we will be experiencing something like this..?


    That movie blew my mind when I was a kid! That and Star Wars.
    Last edited by Wind; 18th May 2016 at 22:12.
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    Avalon Member lunaflare's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do ETs exist?

    Do ETs exist? Yes.
    This is my informed opinion...

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