The UK Brexit vote to leave the EU

[greybeard]

Posted by scanner (here)
The damage, all of these politicians have done and are still doing, is irreversible. People, I talk to, say what's the point of voting, they ignored us and more importantly, our vote. It's going to be very interesting at the next general election and the turn out numbers.

I agree scanner--I think people were mislead by Boris Johnston prior to the vote --unreal expectation of life after Brexit--however for whatever reason the vote was to leave.
I value your input on this scanner.
Chris

[greybeard]

As a law professor, I can see Boris Johnson hasn't committed a crime – he's done something far worse than that
The Independent Thom Brooks,The Independent Tue, 24 Sep 14:53 BST

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/lawyer-see...135322634.html


Three years ago, Boris Johnson argued Britain should vote Leave, taking back control and “freeing” the UK from the European Court of Justice to make the British Supreme Court its top judicial body. Today, that same Supreme Court has given Johnson the most devastating verdict issued in a generation, and it’s left his premiership in tatters.

Johnson's government prorogued parliament for five weeks. They argued that the extended suspension was simply needed to put together a new legislative agenda for a Queen's Speech next month, and that this was a political decision beyond review of the courts, meaning that any such intervention would be an act of judicial interference.

In its landmark decision, the Supreme Court has found the government wrong on all points. Its damning, unanimous verdict is that "it is impossible for us to conclude on the evidence … that there was any reason – let alone a good reason – to advise Her Majesty to prorogue parliament for five weeks". Lady Hale, president of the Supreme Court, declared that Johnson's actions were "unlawful, void and of no effect".

The legal implications are clear: when Black Rod came to the House of Commons to suspend it, the order was a mere "blank piece of paper" as its words had no lawful effect. Parliament was not technically suspended, and should now be reconvened immediately in a manner to be determined by the speakers of each house.

The repercussions of this verdict are profound, and given the unanimous verdict, they will run deep. The prime minister has been declared to have made an unlawful request to the Queen to silence parliament in order to pursue a policy agenda that parliament was trying to block. This is not simply undemocratic in that it gags Britain’s elected representatives; it's also unconstitutional.

Amongst lawyers and legal commentators, it was widely expected the government would lose. The executive simply cannot avoid unwelcome scrutiny by parliament, to which it is accountable, by suspending it in order to get its way by other means. The UK may have an "unwritten" constitution insofar as its central rules and conventions are not set out in one document as they are in the US, but its rules and conventions are no less real and form the basis for the rule of law.

So what now? There is a clear convention to be followed by senior government officials when found to have breached the law: to resign immediately. Johnson may not have committed a criminal offence, but in committing an offence against our constitution and the rule of law, he has arguably done something even worse – not only damaging the office of the prime minister, but dragging the Queen into his Brexit mess.
http://players.brightcove.net/624246...=5837728067001
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Johnson's time is now up. He has made a serious error of legal judgement, and he must face the consequences. Clinging onto his office will not improve his position, whether in parliament or in trying to represent the country abroad as he tries to secure a new Brexit deal.

Whether one supports Leave or Remain is irrelevant; the rule of law was always going to prevail. In spite of the of the prime minister’s constitutional vandalism, it has done so triumphantly. Johnson must now pay the price and become the UK's shortest serving occupant of 10 Downing Street. And the sooner, the better.

Thom Brooks is Professor of Law and Government at Durham University.

[greybeard]

Boris Johnson's sister says his language was 'tasteless'

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=jutYLDL08TQ

[rgray222]

It seems to me that if England does not leave the EU they will be one step away from anarchy. If people "feel" that their votes do not matter it would make the validity and effectiveness of the government almost nonexistent.

I saw this today and it seemed to put things into perspective.

[greybeard]

Thanks for your post rgray222
You reminded me that the vote to leave won but a substantial number voted to remain.
When Brexit is done with people will revert to normal priorities--providing for self and family.
So all will be well--there will be winners and losers no matter which way it goes.
Thats life but it does seem that in many areas of life violence is seen as a way of settling things.
Be it verbal or knife crimes--there seems increased polarity--the good verses evil.
Respect out the window.
Nothing goes on for ever Brexit will come to an end.
Chris

[greybeard]

In Scotland it would seem that the people and their MPs are in agreement--dont leave.
National identity seems a prime mover in England and in Scotland but with different results.
Scotland is more reliaiant on European free trade perhaps and has done quite well out of being "part" of Europe.
Anyway the whole finance situation is quite complex and it boils down to what is the best financial deal for the majority of the people, whatever that may be.
Chris

[greybeard]

Posted by rgray222 (here)
It seems to me that if England does not leave the EU they will be one step away from anarchy. If people "feel" that their votes do not matter it would make the validity and effectiveness of the government almost nonexistent.

I saw this today and it seemed to put things into perspective.

Looking once again at the figures
There is just over a million more voted to leave---its not a landslide victory for leave.
The media is all about the people voted leave end of story--fair enough leave won.
However the rest of the figures dont make sense in proportion to the actual numbers voted remain--vs --leave
The % for leave in the votes cast is far far lower than the rest of the statistic which does have a massive % for leave apart from the no of MPs for remain.
Statistics statistics.
Chris

[greybeard]

Boris Johnson knows exactly what he's doing. The angrier Britain is, the better for him – and Trump showed him how
The Independent Sean O'Grady,The Independent

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/boris-john...090808770.html



No one listening to Brendan Cox’s interview on BBC Radio 4's Today programme this morning could fail to be touched by what he was saying about the way Jo Cox’s name and memory has been used and abused in the House of Commons. The contemptuous manner in which Boris Johnson dismissed others MPs’ distress and fears of death threats as “humbug” was unusually offensive, even by his standards.

It was ludicrous for him to make out that the best way to honour Jo Cox’s memory would be to “get Brexit done", breathtaking in its audacity, and the emotional responses to that remark were visceral. After all, Jo Cox was assassinated while campaigning for Remain during the 2016 referendum – and event which, for a time, stopped the clock.

Her widower has appealed for some calm, and for everyone to recall Jo's abiding testament: “We are far more united, and have far more in common with each other, than things that divide us”. He regrets that the Brexit debate has descended into a “bear pit of polarisation”.

Brendan is right about that, but the political polarisation he refers to – and the exploitation of it – is quite deliberate, and has not yet peaked. Johnson will see to that.

The polarisation of the debate is intensified by the prime minister all the better to mobilise his own “base” of support: increasingly embittered and frustrated Leavers. He wants them to turn out and vote for him on some dank evening in November. He wants to get them angry.

Thus, he actively wants to be seen battling with parliament – and especially opposition MPs – in the name of “the people”; that is, Leavers. The optics, as they say, suits him fine.

Johnson is battling, or rather wishing to appear to be battling, valiantly against a vast “Remain Establishment” conspiracy, a “zombie parliament”, terrorist-sympathising Labour leaders, the mainstream media including what he’s termed the “Brexit Bashing Corporation”, and, now, the judiciary. If he thought he could get any traction with it, no doubt he’d chuck the Queen under the bus as well.

“Dog whistle” politics are nothing new for the man who used to write about “picanninies" with "watermelon smiles” and Muslim women wearing “letter box” veils. He knows what he is doing, and what he has been doing for some time now is following the ruthless advice of Dominic Cummings and Lynton Crosby. Their trade is division and their currency hate. When a turbaned Labour MP, Tanmanjeet Singh Dhesi, savaged the PM in the Commons for his racism, a lot of Johnson’s supporters would take Johnson’s side. Liberals have to realise that.

So when Brendan Cox, and well-meaning figures such as Amber Rudd and Stephen Kinnock, start talking about reaching out, building consensus and reaching compromise they have Johnson’s electoral tactics plain wrong.


Boris Johnson says the best way to honour Jo Cox is to get Brexit done

On Brexit – as John Curtice as pointed out, and the current atmosphere also speaks for itself – there is no middle ground to appeal to in the traditional Left-Centre-Right spectrum of conventional politics. The bell curve has been replaced by twin peaks; the votes are found in the extremes (and that is one reason why Labour's Brexit compromises fail to get much support).

This is a polarised culture war. The only way to win a war like that is to make the other side as angry as your own side in a sort of perverse process of political symbiosis. You need to start fires, and watch them spread.

Seeing Johnson wind up the Remainers and insult these venerable justices and flail the “surrender act”, the “collaborators”, “traitors” and Brussels is just what he needs to recruit these voters – many of them Labour, ex-Labour, ex-Ukip or Brexit party sympathisers – into the Conservative camp. The politics of division thrives on discord and division. It abhors harmony and enjoys the insult.

Brendan Cox wishes us to believe that Johnson is not “evil”, which is admittedly not exactly lavish praise, but then again Johnson is not exactly St Francis of Assisi either. The short word for it is “populism”.

Welcome, in other words, to the new politics. Remind you of anyone?

Obviously Johnson, more or less self-consciously, seeks to be the British Trump, or, as Trump once put it himself, “Britain Trump”. Both men like to have the last word, enjoy upsetting their moments, insult anyone and any institution that gets in the way, double down when they are criticised or attacked, and never, ever apologise or show contrition. They never display “weakness” – or, I should clarify, what they regard as weakness.

[Matthew]

Posted by Letty (here)
Hi John,

I understand why you would see Brexit as "ill-informed parochialism."

But England will do just fine without the EU.

Historically it's the financial centre of the world and every country stores its gold in the City of London.

Many people think that Wall Street holds the purse - this is not the case, it's The City of London.

The US has the might, England has the purse.

The British Empire never died.

It's a bumpy ride and it will certainly get more sinuous, but the English will quickly land on their feet.

They always do.

Cheers,

Letty

This is a nice calm respite from the fear that comes from the media

Another calm voice: Mahyar Tousi

MP's abusing their seats has not gone unnoticed. The remain side are so desperate they failed to be inconspicuous about their motivations, which was always to stop Brexit

Majority of British People Back Boris as Remain Parliament Block Democracy

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=pJcCp2RUBy0

[Matthew]

While I'm at it, here's some more of Carl Benjamin's crusade to get the truth out

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=mW9TuyIXs0g

17.4 million

[greybeard]

Keep posting please YoYoYo
Different perspectives are necessary.
Regards Chris

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by greybeard (here)
Keep posting please YoYoYo
Different perspectives are necessary.
Regards Chris

Well, they're vital. The British media (and general mainstream) perspectives can't be trusted. They're deeply in bed with, and supporting, the EU agenda. That's just so obvious.

So I for one would really welcome alternative views. If I want to know what the BBC says, I'd just go to bbc.com. We can all do that ourselves! It's the other informed commentary I really value.

[Gemma13]

https://www.spiked-online.com/2019/0...of-the-people/

IN DEFENCE OF THE PEOPLE

ARTICLE EXTRACTS: When I began to study democracy over a dozen years ago, few of the so-called cultural elite were in a rush to argue against it as a form of government. After all, practising democracy was what made them the ‘goodies’. Yes, they may have made a lot of mistakes, they may have lied once or twice, but when the other options were dictatorship and Communism, all they had to say was the magic word ‘democracy’ and the grumbling over these indiscretions would quickly subside.

Not only did the elite at this time not question the value of democracy — they actively promoted it as the self-evident, one, true path. It was seen as the end of history. The very word possessed such talismanic power that you could even get away with attacking whole countries and killing all kinds of people just so the ones who survived could have democracy.

Then these gatekeepers of good manners lost a referendum (Brexit) and an election (Trump) and decided that democracy was totally passé. The volte-face they performed was rather breathtaking in its coordination, like a little shoal of well-disciplined fish avoiding troubled waters with mindless accuracy.

[…]

Britain’s Leave vote may be the result of a jumble of factors, but it wasn’t just some irrational, ill-informed bad-hair day. Commentators should really have been tipped off by the fact that more than 3.8million voters (12.6 per cent of those who cast a ballot) supported UKIP in the 2015 national election, and over five million (30 per cent) supported the Brexit Party in the 2019 European election. That is a pretty resilient vote spanning four years, and holding up in the face of a persistent media barrage focusing on the negatives of Brexit.

But while elites have been strong on the negatives of what they don’t like, they haven’t spent much time on why their preferred option – in this case remaining in the EU – is so great. Instead, like their American counterparts so frequently do, they insist on offering a relatively bad package that doesn’t fully take account of underlying preferences.

People aren’t opting out, because they are ignorant of the consequences of their actions, but rather because ‘elites’ have decided they don’t need to make a compelling case for why their ideas are good ones, as one would need to do in a democracy. They believe their ideas simply are good and people who don’t agree with them need to be cancelled.

[…]

I could say that what elites really need to do is get people on board with their programme, but most people never will be on board with it, for the good reason that it isn’t in most people’s interests.

Changing your electricity company every 12 to 18 months to avoid being shafted is a right pain in the neck that no one gets around to – not in most people’s interests. Corporate forum-shopping for low wages isn’t in most people’s interests. Gutting health services – not in most people’s interests. Sky-high property prices that set off a real-life game of Monopoly – not in most people’s interests.

There’s a big, unbridgeable disconnect between the average person’s interests and elite interests. And in a direct democracy that would be settled quite quickly, in the interests of the average person.

It’s not because the average person is too stupid and can’t identify his or her own best interests that elites are so down on direct democracy – it’s because we are too smart.



https://www.spiked-online.com/2019/0...ish-democracy/

TODAY WAS A VERY DARK DAY FOR BRITISH DEMOCRACY

ARTICLE EXTRACTS:

Don’t believe for one minute the self-aggrandising claims of the Remainer establishment and its noisy cheerleaders in the media. Tonight’s vote by MPs to seize control of the parliamentary agenda in order to prevent a No Deal Brexit is not, as they claim, a wonderful assertion of parliamentary sovereignty against a dictatorial executive led by Boris Johnson.

No, it is an assertion of the political elite’s arrogant authority over the people. If MPs have seized power from anyone this evening, it is from us, the public, the millions who voted to leave the EU. This is not parliament vs the executive – this is parliament vs the people, and it opens up one of the greatest, most troublesome constitutional crises of modern times.

[...]

Probably their most perverse and insulting claim is that they are standing up for parliamentary sovereignty. This is the opposite of the truth. They are ravaging parliamentary sovereignty. These are the people who over the past 40 years have green-lighted the outsourcing of huge swathes of parliament’s authority to Brussels, and whose very efforts to destroy Brexit run counter to parliament’s own handing of that decision to us, the people, and its insistence that it would respect the decision that we made.

[...]

The elite’s claim to be defending democracy is a brazen lie. It is crushing democracy. It is revolting against the people and the decision we made in 2016. How grotesque for Jeremy Corbyn to say this evening that parliament has struck a blow for the idea that ‘sovereignty rests’ in the people. It has done no such thing. In fact it has elevated the political authority of an out-of-touch and increasingly hysterical elite over the largest democratic decision ever made by the British people.

[greybeard]

Psychic Predictions for UK General Election and Brexit 2019
6 Sep 2019

Craig Hamilton-Parker
53.4K subscribers
General Election Predictions by the psychic medium Craig Hamilton-Parker and the Brexit Crisis. More on our predictions page: https://psychics.co.uk/blog/predictions/

Psychic Medium Craig Hamilton-Parker makes his psychic predictions about the British General Election. Craig has had a lot of success with his predictions and has been hailed by the media as ‘The New Nostradamus’. In this video, he uses his Nostradamus inspired psychic skills to make prophecies about Boris Johnson, The upcoming General Election, and Brexit.

A General Election has still not been called but the seer predicts that it will happen very soon. The result will have a major effect on the outcome of Brexit. Keep watching this channel as new videos are planned and coming soon. These will include Psychic Predictions for 2020, American Psychic Predictions, Psychic Predictions for the UK and many more clairvoyant insights. In this video, you are given a taster of upcoming events.

Craig and his wife Jane used to work on the Channel 4 program ‘The Big Breakfast’ where they were the resident psychics. Every week they would predict ‘next week’s news today.’ They would predict the coming week’s news headlines. Now you can enjoy these intriguing predictions online.

If you have any predictions that you would like to hear, please leave a message in the comments below. Craig will be making more videos in the coming weeks so please leave your requests. The more specific the better. Topics can include anything you would like. Craig makes psychic predictions for the UK but also makes World Psychic Predictions as well as Predictions for the USA.

What will happen with Brexit? Who will win the next General Election? Will Boris Johnson deliver Brexit? Will there be a General Election? Come and get the answers here. And remember, you heard it here first!!

Graig Hamilton- Parker may well have it right.
Well worth a listen
Thought a really different perspective would be helpful.
Chris

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=-V70jt2Nw1M

[sunwings]

The problem with Brexit is NOT Europe it is Britain. It is Britain and its Prime Minister who has lost 7 out of 7 votes, lost a bi-election quicker than any other PM, lost in the supreme courts, lied to the Queen and lost his majority in the house. The referendum took place under a strong Conservative government who rallied to remain. Now the Conservatives in power have savagely forced out anyone who disagrees that No Deal Brexit is a good idea.

This non-political referendum has come political. Jon snow of channel 4 news recently tweeted "In all my 45 years of reporting - I cannot remember a more chaotic, divided, and disturbing period in British politics."

The language of Brexit has also become a hot topic and this clip of Farage suggesting we will take a Knife to all the Civil Service after BREXIT is DONE is very alarming! But look who is there, who is clapping in the audience. This new generation will decide what will eventually happen in Britain, maybe not today but tomorrow!

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=obKhaYKO9K0

[greybeard]

What I have observed is a blindness as to the nature of Boris which is well documented.
Yes media hypes, dramatizes that's what they do.
But looking behind and beyond the hype is some undeniable truth.

Sacking respected conservatives even if you dont agree with them lessening your majority--is insane.
Boris, Sister, Brother, ex employer, ex cabinet members deciding to resign, ex Prime ministers are they all wrong?
Sister implies that he is backed by those who have bet millions on exit without a deal--Philip Hammond more direct.
The very language of Boris, Betrayal etc is very similar to the language used in Northern Ireland during the height of the troubles.
Denying the impartial wisdom of the supreme court.
Boris claims anti-democratic a wrong decision.
Affairs.
The list goes on.
We are all human but none of the above is setting a good example to my mind.
All im saying is be careful what you wish for-----
This is an investigative forum and its true that the remain camp has an agenda--by the same token surely the exit without a deal camp has too.
My only concern is the well being of people.
Chris

[greybeard]

One thing I do agree with is that Brexit has gone on far too long.
I suspect that a referendum might be the ultimate answer.
Quite a high percentage actually voted for remain so I have a challenge with "The people voted to leave" thats a blanket statement. More accurate--leave won the vote.

Now one of the remains complaints is that people were misled.

Well people now have a lot more information.
So if a new referendum says leave then the remainers have lost a major part of their argument.
General elections come and go and there is the fail safe of various part members elected thats democracy.
This may be a once in a life time jump so a second referendum just to be sure might be a good idea.

If the referendum is held first then a general election can be held with the question of brexit out of the way and then who ever is elected can get on with normal business.
I dont think electing a government on one issue is a good idea and it would come down to people voting for a leave or stay party.

Chris

[Flyswim]

I thought this article, and youtube video, about how hedge funds made huge profits off the Brexit vote was worth putting in the mix. It details how said financiers made money just before the referendum result was (being) announced & whether Farage/they had inside knowledge (or in Farage's case 'pretended' to conceed defeat).

Article https://www.bloomberg.com/news/featu...beat-the-crash

12 minute video

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ht40yrt3VrY

Make you wonder who is making money out of the current no deal/deal debacle!

[Matthew]

Posted by sunwings (here)
The problem with Brexit is NOT Europe it is Britain. It is Britain and its Prime Minister who has lost 7 out of 7 votes, lost a bi-election quicker than any other PM, lost in the supreme courts, lied to the Queen and lost his majority in the house. The referendum took place under a strong Conservative government who rallied to remain. Now the Conservatives in power have savagely forced out anyone who disagrees that No Deal Brexit is a good idea.

This non-political referendum has come political. Jon snow of channel 4 news recently tweeted "In all my 45 years of reporting - I cannot remember a more chaotic, divided, and disturbing period in British politics."

The language of Brexit has also become a hot topic and this clip of Farage suggesting we will take a Knife to all the Civil Service after BREXIT is DONE is very alarming! But look who is there, who is clapping in the audience. This new generation will decide what will eventually happen in Britain, maybe not today but tomorrow!

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=obKhaYKO9K0

Boris has been right, and we should have had a general election when he called one

This looks a clip from The Brexit party conference. Here's the whole thing from their London stop.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=0UF_PbhG6Lk

[samildamach]

https://www.ukcolumn.org/article/her...-defence-union
Summary
Lord blackheath was shut down for asking questions,on the u.k armed forces a long with mi6 being handed over to Brussels.
Do they get the nukes to?
The eu empire is in sight the stakes are high