Should you pay for spiritual services?

[music]

In the realms of spiritual and higher bodily awareness, where these stray outside the remit of the ‘norm’, there is an undercurrent of thought whereby people seeking help and knowledge feel that those who hold it should give it freely if they are so spiritual. In an ideal world, this would indeed be the case. The problem is that those who seek and are most vocal in their opposition about payment for services often have spent their lives living the normal life of work, mortgage, investment and security, and so are generally comfortably placed. Those who have spent a lifetime seeking knowledge from between the cracks of mainstream society have invested themselves in that realm, and so many are not home owners, they hold no shares or investments, they have no retirement funds, and live fundamentally hand to mouth, relying on the universe to provide for them, such is their faith in the doing and the seeking of all that is good. Food for thought, that is all.

[Daozen]

If prices are reasonable, it's OK. If prices are inflated, it's not. Who can decide what a fair price is? Hard to say...

[music]

Posted by Daozen (here)
If prices are reasonable, it's OK. If prices are inflated, it's not. Who can decide what a fair price is? Hard to say...

If the price is fair to the buyer, they will buy. We all set a value on the things we seek. Perhaps a story will help?

Many years ago I ran a reflexology practice in the UK. I had no price, I merely asked people to pay what they could comfortably afford. That could be zero or infinite. I also took barter. What I found was that those who were honest in the appraisal of their means (whether they paid me 0 or 100 pounds) achieved better and more rapid health outcomes than those who gave less than they could comfortably afford. In placing no value upon my services, they were unconsciously devaluing their selves, and their own health. Food for thought there too :D

[Matthew]

Payment is fair so why not. But spiritual knowledge and personal awakening can be dizzying, coupled with disillusionment of material things.. so there is opportunity for abuse.

[ElfeMya]

There is always opportunity for abuse, it is not restricted to the spiritual services, is it ? More the manifestation of people's choices...
I love your point of view, Music !
fruity hugs everyone !

[Violet]

I've seen local prices range anywhere between 50 and 90 EUR per hour. Also take into account that you may not get all things done in just one hour.

If VAT-registered then of course prices must be set, as this is a costly status to maintain. If it's a hobby, you can choose, free or not, or intermittently. The difference here is that when you charge a fee you have much more liberty to be reasonable in your pricing, as compared to VAT-actives.

[PurpleLama]

The enlightened teacher may give the lie to his preaching of detachment to material things by charging a hefty fee for his advice, whereas if a root doctor presented his services for free then something would certainly be amiss.

[ulli]

Efforts to set a standard here would be doomed to fail.
There are as many possibilities here as there are levels of consciousness.
From "Here is my price- take it or leave it!" to "Everything is negociable".

Plus, most people who have devoted their lives to share their spiritual knowledge often do so freely, in many different ways.
But if someone wants to pin them down to a one-on-one session, requiring 100% attention, requiring that they drop everything else they might be doing, and give their time exclusively, and do all that for free, then they might even be in need a few shocks to shake them out of their selfishness.
Plus I doubt if they would even benefit from such a session.

The only good I can see coming from such a scenario is that the spiritual teacher gets the lesson of standing their ground.

[Deega]

Posted by music (here)
In the realms of spiritual and higher bodily awareness, where these stray outside the remit of the ‘norm’, there is an undercurrent of thought whereby people seeking help and knowledge feel that those who hold it should give it freely if they are so spiritual. In an ideal world, this would indeed be the case. The problem is that those who seek and are most vocal in their opposition about payment for services often have spent their lives living the normal life of work, mortgage, investment and security, and so are generally comfortably placed. Those who have spent a lifetime seeking knowledge from between the cracks of mainstream society have invested themselves in that realm, and so many are not home owners, they hold no shares or investments, they have no retirement funds, and live fundamentally hand to mouth, relying on the universe to provide for them, such is their faith in the doing and the seeking of all that is good. Food for thought, that is all.

Hmm!, we live in a society where everyone was programmed such that we have to work for our existence.

Now people who work to get knowledge, learning, experience in the spiritual world, getting some kind of degree (proficient in spiritual field), and become notable respected caregiver should be paid for services they tend unto people, only my opinion.

As we all know, the spiritual trained person has to live, incur expenses living, incur expenses with profession, it's only natural to be paid for services.

When the services are questionable, then, one don't have to seek them!

[Kryztian]

One pays for the service, the ritual, the formalities, the space, the use of the accoutrements. All those things cost money to the person rendering the service and help them maintain their existence.

The spiritual part is absolutely free of charge. Money gets you through the front door, but the spiritual part is given to you if you are open to it. It is a gift, not from the person conducting the event, but from the mysterious source behind it.

[Ahnung-quay]

If going to a Native American for spiritual services or ceremony, if that person is really walking the Red Road, all that they will expect is a tobacco offering. By all means, donate money, food, gas, etc. This is a free will offering and the amount is decided by the donor.

[Agape]

It's a problem I once started to sort ( 23 years ago ) and never sorted it yet . In old Indian or Buddhist traditions where most teachers were monks after all,
the rule once was never to accept money.
Not even to touch money or gold or anything too 'precious' in the eyes of the world. So my teachers taught me .
It's barely possible nowadays even for monks 'not to touch money' unless your monastery and people take care of you and then you'd have to be prevented from travelling abroad too because of all the documents ( and money ) it entails.

Back here and when I started to teach I tried to maintain everything free , open, low cost and donation based .
There were times we had to pay for place rentals and times the place was shared and sponsored and most of private sessions were run in my or peoples homes .

Then I had to do something for money which turned to be either being hired by someone to lecture , translating scriptures and doing astrology readings for those who were so oriented but out of that realm,
I'd not know for what to charge . I was too young to feel tired and loved people. And staying with mum I did not have to worry about living so I did not care.

I refused advertising myself too , thinking it's un-spiritual , looking back nowadays looks indeed like we had good times and fun

The older I'm I understand that if I ever meant to live within the secular society I'd have to find fitting 'cover job' and way around this .


[ looks to the cloudy sky and grins sheepishly ]

[Sean]

Lightworkers have to pay rent too. I don't see the issue with charging a reasonable fee for services rendered, just like physicians do(although their charges tend to be UN-reasonable). INTENT is the key. nothing unholy or unspiritual about money, unless you're ripping people off.

[Zampano]

From the spiritual view...a teacher/guru/enlightened beeing can always point to the "One" thing in a myriad of ways. In Satsang, NonDuality Talks, Guided Meditation, whatever.
I mean, basically, there is not a lot of training needed for that-just to find the right exercise and follow it to the end. Everytime.
If you are looking for the right exercise or if you feel that you are stuck somewhere-go see a teacher.
Like a schoolboy who failed at math-he will see a coach or a tutor and pay for it. So for me, it seems legit to pay a reasonable price.

When it comes to Psychic Healing/Astrology/Reiki, there should be at least a fixed price, because they undergo some training, seminars, courses, etc
Which costs money. Also a quiet room, equipement when needed, taxes, time, and so on.

But everything should be negotionable-depending on the individuals circumstances. I do it with barter. I bring fresh fruits, vegetables, eggs, cooked meal or whatever is in my garden. Some of them really really apreciate it. That would be the optimum from my point of view.

Unfortunately we live in a society, where everything is measured with money and it also has the "more money, more in return" effect/thinking.
Do not forget: "What costs nothing is worth nothing" is the state of mind :-(

[TrumanCash]

Posted by Ahnung-quay (here)
If going to a Native American for spiritual services or ceremony, if that person is really walking the Red Road, all that they will expect is a tobacco offering....

Actually, this depends upon the particular tribe/nation. For example, the Niimiipuu (aka Nez Perce) condemn any tribal member who sells herbs for medicine or spiritual purposes--even people with no tribal affiliation. In one case of which I am personally aware they tried to kick a man out of the tribe for selling herbs.

However, traditionally, the Mide'wiwin (spiritual healers) of the Anishinabe actually required payment from students/initiates. Experienced spiritual healing practitioners charged for their services.

[Note: the Anishinabe were the largest nation that the Europeans encountered on the eastern shores of Turtle Island (now called North and South America). They had a government that connected many tribes similar to a national government, written language, religion, etc, before the European invasion. Check out the 7th Fire Prophecy. Detailed info about the Mide'wiwin here. Today the Ojibwe is the largest tribe remaining.]

[BongoBob]

Borrowed from The Wanderling's Site:

In America there is a tendency to make a commodity out of anything, even spirituality. Not only is making salvation a marketable item absurd ("Sorry, you don't qualify for the highest, blissful heaven." - "Why not?" - "You forgot to pay last month's subscription dues for soul discourses"), but it allows for a number of unscrupulous individuals to make huge sums of money off naive seekers.

Although money is necessary to keep movements functioning (the publishing of books, etc.), there is a distinct line between obligatory payments -- even if they are disguised as "love offerings," and unsolicited donations; the latter has justifiable reasons behind it, whereas the former makes religion a business enterprise, with a very lucrative tax shelter.

"Real Masters never charge for their services, nor do they accept payment in any form or any sort of material benefits for their instructions. This is a universal law among Masters, and yet it is an amazing fact that thousands of eager seekers in America and elsewhere, go on paying large sums of money for "spiritual instruction.". Masters are always self-sustaining. They are never supported by their students or by public charity."

---- Julian P. Johnson, The Path of the Masters (1939) ----

"A Wise One like me should not charge for her services....The one who charges is a liar. The wise one is born to cure, not to do business with her knowledge."

---- Maria Sabina, Curandera, Shaman ----

"Real Enlightenment definitely is not on sale at the corner store, it doesn't contain preservatives, and isn't wrapped in plastic. Absolute surrender to God, or the Universe, is the greatest gift, the "pearl of great price," and it will never be cheap. That is why one should question the ersatz gems that pseudo-spiritualists so readily sell in their fancy packages. If one wants the real thing, one must learn about counterfeits; otherwise, one is showing off a rhinestone to God, convinced it is the Hope Diamond."

---- Mariana Caplan, Halfway Up the Mountain (1999) ----

Of course, this all seems to be put in the wayside as has come to be the presiding notion of control, and few strive to find a way to live without it anymore.

This message also tends to sway more towards self-enlightenment than it does metaphysical services such as Reiki, astrology readings, and so on, and may not be entirely related to your query in that regard.

[Ahnung-quay]

Yes, Truman you are correct. I guess I was thinking individual practioner. The Mide society is different. They do even base advancement within their ranks on payment sometimes.
I should also mention that I meant North American natives. S out American shamans seem to charge for services more ofteN charge money.

[Chris Gilbert]

Energy is infinite, but one's time is not. Assuming that you don't live in a mutually supportive tribal structure that has other exchanges in lieu of the financial one, you have every right to charge for your linear, limited TIME, especially if you are doing healing work full time during normal working hours. I do energy work focused on the meridians from TCM combined with tuina massage techniques, and charge the usual rate for a massage. Some day humans will no longer use money (assuming we don't destroy ourselves first) but for now this is how energy exchanges occur in most places.

Ethics do enter into the picture in terms of how much you charge, and other issues. Someone who trained in the same lineage I practice started raising their prices too much and going only for the highest bidder. The result...Heaven removed their healing ability. A general rule of thumb I go by is that your prices should be within the range of other practitioners in a given geographic radius, and should be within range of what people can spend every couple months for health maintenance with their discretionary income if they are willing to forego other indulgences like bars, etc.

[6pounder]

i didnt read all the posts but ill say this. if you have a talent and you are looking for "easy way" to earn your living then you choose to make it as a job and you charge money from people spiritual or not. but if you understand the nature of what spiritual work is and you find it as something that has nothing to do with making living but only as something to fulfill your destiny then you give it to people as part of your mission on earth with no motive to earn anything accept the fulfillment of your destiny. i dont have any special talent that i call spiritual but i do know that i love to fight for the greater good so i do it with out asking for anything back as i feel that it fulfills my destiny. do things out of love not out of need.

[OMG]

No

(Won't let me just say "no" so I needed to write this.)