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Thread: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

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    Default How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    I don't think the members and visitors can actually answer this (solve this issue below), honestly I don't. I really don't. I don't think the members can sort it out, the lure, the justification, the temptation, and come up with the real solution. I don't see how humanity is wired for philanthropy really, when survival issues always are an issue for a body.



    So I post this as one example. I will point out to the group something which was just recently was just presented to me.. a way to have real "free energy" zero power cost for house-holds, over this last week.

    It was presented to me by the 'inventor' that it will:

    Quote Destroy completely the Cabal, the money lenders, crash the slavery system in its face, and destroy monarchies, Kings, the skumbuckets who lend to others at slavery rates.
    (I had interestingly enough, discovered a "free energy" solution in 1999 and then was derailed by the USAF a special interest agent sent to me to get me not willing to present to the world a simple reproducible free energy battery back then).

    Let's start with a cabbie who finds in his cab many thousands of pounds sterling and then gets like zero reward for having found the "owner" of such and turning such back to him.

    The thoughts of the members seriously is important... Do we really want to completely destroy the powers that be financially, to rip them more new "assholes" than they ever conceived possible?

    IF so WHY do we want to do that, WHY DO WE want to bring down the monarchs, the kings, the world banking system, the FED, on and on.. EVERY FREE MAN can have complete FREE ENERGY and thereby collapse the monopoly slavery mindset on the planet? Destroy once and for all the monarchy, the financial tyranny, completely and prevent them from ever trying it again.

    Do you think this should be released? OPEN SOURCE? Free for anyone to build, but NOT FOR IN ANY WAY WHAT SO EVER for exploitation and or PROFIT ? TO forever destroy the concept of PROFIT motivation (achieving MORE than balance, or fair share?)

    TELL me your thoughts please. Shall I build this model and release it? Shall we tell the current "inventor", yes do it? Or should I run like hell, let the 'system' stay as-is..

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.2700307

    Quote Boston cabbie is disappointed at $100 reward he received for returning $187,000 left behind in his taxi

    Honesty doesn’t hack it.

    A Boston taxi cab driver is disappointed he only received a $100 reward after returning $187,000 cash lost in his car.

    “I thought maybe he would give $500 or $1,000, maybe one of those bundles,” Raymond (Buzzy) MacCausland, the lucky cabbie who found the fortune told the Daily News.

    MacCausland was driving a homeless man who had inherited his riches after living in a shelter for six months, the 72-year-old cabbie remembered.

    After dropping him off at a hotel, MacCausland later noticed he left the bag filled with bills behind. He looked in the bag to find the man’s name — and stumbled across stacks of $50 and $100 bills.

    “I’ve never seen money like that before. It was quite a sight when they dumped it on the table,” he told the News.

    When he saw the piles of money in the bag, Buzzy said three thoughts ran through his head.

    First, if he should be worried that the man was dangerous and after for him the money.

    Second, if he should just take the treasure and go home.

    Raymond “Buzzy” MacCausland, a cab driver in Boston, returned $178,000 he found in the back of his car. He got $100 for his honesty.

    Raymond “Buzzy” MacCausland, a cab driver in Boston, returned $178,000 he found in the back of his car.

    He got $100 for his honesty. (INDEPENDENT TAXI OPERATOR’S ASSOCIATION)

    He decided on his third idea: to bring the bag of cash to the police station.

    “That’s the way I am. I don’t steal anything; I’ve never been a crook,” MacCausland said. “It would have been nice to see a lot of money like that though — probably changes lives.”

    After the money was returned to its rightful owner, the man gave MacCausland $100 as a reward for his honesty — half a penny on the dollar.

    The honest cabbie then gave the man another ride back to the hotel, where he was staying.

    Dropping him off again, MacCausland admitted he was hoping the man would forget to take his money a second time.

    “I don’t know if that’ll happen again in my lifetime,” he said.

    About 30 years ago, MacCausland had a similar situation, finding a briefcase with about $10,000 inside at the airport. That man who lost it didn’t give him any reward.

    "This hackney driver exhibited exemplary behavior and his honest deed should be recognized," Police Commissioner William Evans said in a statement.

    Raymond "Buzzy" MacCausland said he briefly considered taking the money, but decided to go the honest way.

    MacCausland said even if he knew he wasn’t going to get any kind of reward, he still would have returned the large sum of cash.

    “I think it was the right thing to do. A lot of people said, ‘You should have kept it,’ but I couldn’t do that,” he explained.

    Larry Meister, the president of Independent Taxi Operator’s Association, and a longtime friend of MacCausland, said that’s just the kind of person he was.

    He said the cabbie, who has been working as a taxi driver for about 50 years in Boston, was a “very honest, good guy” the company could be proud of.

    “Believe me, he could use the money, he’s not a very rich man,” Meister said.

    The money’s owner told the Boston Globe he wasn’t worried “for a minute” when he realized he lost his backpack.

    From the ride with MacCausland, he knew the driver was honest and would return it, the man told the newspaper, on the condition of anonymity.
    Last edited by Bob; 7th July 2016 at 18:47.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    So, tell me, do you have the chutzpah to spell it out, focus on keeping the $$$$ for ourselves (I am referring to the Cabbie's 'problem', of having the cash left in his vehicle), the Cabal's prime question (can they forever hold humanity at ransom for their own gratification), or for once are folks ready to FINALLY stop the cabal and that mindset? Do you have the vision?

    It comes down to what a group is really all about.. Destroy the MF'ers? Once and for all?

    Connect those dots would ya?

    IS energy manipulation for the few ideal globally ? Have's and have nots? What about one who takes pride in being able to financially manipulate another to accept a "loan" and pay them "profit", another form of "energy manipulation". Do you find them noble that they can do that?
    Last edited by Bob; 6th July 2016 at 06:28.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    The "broker" who contacted me wanted to have an exclusive for himself, exploiting the so called "inventor" who miraculously "appeared" a day after I had discussed this with our private IRC chat group.. I had said maybe it's time to bring back the infinite "vortex battery" and get it to the people..

    Strange that this "mossad" thought he would be able to influence me, trying to cut some "deal" to develop the tech and then thereby restrict it to "the people". I just received an email from him that "negotiations for some reason have turned sour.." how odd? Wonder what feed he may be receiving from TPTB?

    So what about it, release the instructions to such designs (that appear to look like it would cost a few hundred $$$ in materials) have infinite energy de-coupling oneself from the "grid" from the energy cartel? from Mossad, the Saudi's the rest of the blood suckers?

    Show me your logic.

    (note reference "mossad" - not the Israeli "agency", but this term: "Mossad meaning is to catch or take something from.." )
    Last edited by Bob; 7th July 2016 at 16:39.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    I am discussing this on PA as it is the right thing to do. I strongly feel, that We have the ethics here, with the members to look at this objectively. Potential new members the hundreds reviewing this thread.. you can contact PA and request a membership if you so desire to be able to participate.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Do you use gasoline, diesel, who do you pay? Do you use the internet, who do you pay, do you use electricity off the grid, who do you pay? (the wind or solar cells) .. What happens when 'they" raise the rates? for shipment, the raw products to generate the energy?

    Do you buy food at the grocery? What happens when 'they' raise the cost of fuel for the vehicles transporting the food?

    Do farmers have to pay ever increasing costs for the transport of the produce they grow which ends up in Market? Does the fuel cost increase/manipulation lead to hardships? All across the board?

    What about getting medicine, health? Do you understand that such is tied into Energy rates worldwide? Controlled by the few? and cutting dearly into the meager incomes of the groups?
    Last edited by Bob; 6th July 2016 at 05:50.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Whatever you do you do for yourself. If you are the kind of person who wants to help others by giving them access to free energy, you will do it because you want to do it, so it will be for yourself. I personally see nothing wrong with making a reasonable amount of money by selling a design for a free energy device, if it actually works.

    I'm sure many inventors have sold the rights to amazing inventions because they wanted a lot of money or maybe because they didn't want to have a fatal "accident". Free energy would not only possibly destroy the cabal but it could put millions of people out of work. It could create a lot of chaos in the worlds economies that might be a net negative for more people than it helps in the short term. A transition to free energy seems desirable and may ultimately be the best thing for the planet and people, but there are bound to be some unforeseen consequences.

    We will only know what the consequences are if it happens. If your intentions are good and you want to do it.....do it. I think it would bring about some amazing changes in the world and even if there is some short term pain it might be a good thing in the end. If nothing else, it would be exciting and fun to see what happens!
    Alpha Mike Foxtrot

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Quote Posted by Bob (here)
    [Strange that this "mossad" thought he would be able to influence me, trying to cut some "deal" to develop the tech and then thereby restrict it to "the people". I just received an email from him that "negotiations for some reason have turned sour.." how odd? Wonder what feed he may be receiving from TPTB?
    I'll venture a guess that if released, and they are what you claim, they will shut it down. Didn't Tesla try?

    Money and power has been corrupting since the beginning of time.

    I don't see that the "cabal" can ever be stopped with material endeavours or logical concepts.
    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 7th July 2016 at 12:29. Reason: fixed quote formatting
    “a complete understanding of reality lies beyond the capabilities of rational thought."
    ― Gary Zukav

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    not so much money , it's the withholding of " things" we require to live , money is just the convenient tool they have inserted in the middle

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    When I talked with the "current" inventor, there was a discussion about releasing "to" the archives within the world's data-repositories with the instructions, including how to make the materials, assemble and utilize. I had a long discussion about can it be made into a WMD (Weapon of Mass Destruction) and I don't see any way that can happen.. Such as it is assumed that many "free energy developers" have been shut down, sold out by the Cabal. And by the Militaries around the world, to not release a new form of atomic weapon.

    Take for instance a "free energy" device which is based on the concept of "nuclear isomer" formation. A device such as that, in a package the size of a wedding ring if it released all of its energy at once, would be like a 20 kiloton nuclear detonation.. I verified that this particular "inventor's" design would not be capable of releasing all the energy at once.

    The various groups including the "dis-informers/mitigations teams, took the "nuclear isomer" research and spun it into la-la land, claiming that Hafnium as the atomic element which was "isomerized". The actual element "group" is Samarium, not Hafnium, combined with Cobalt and Yttrium isomer oxides. And yes it is triggered to "switch state" when soft-xRays are applied.

    I didn't see any weapons potential from it. I did see as others have pointed out, it would rapidly interfere with the energy cartel's "oil dependence" and scarcity manipulation. My feeling is they would be like Snowden, release the technology/instructions to all the databases all at once.

    I looked at the cost to make, seemed to be about 1000$ in materials at most for a continual 20 kilowatt output, perpetually (based on existing product cost of materials in very small quantities).

    I looked at the resistance of the components, and they appeared to be close to room-temperature superconductors. Very low resistance and high efficiency. I didn't see any way to create a shortage of the materials needed to manufacture such, as there would be no manipulation possible of "making the materials scarce" to control it.

    Is information to be taken away from the masses?

    Here's another question set: Are the people therefore not having "energy jobs" willing to have a method of not needing to have fuel for their vehicles (if they run on electricity), if their homes are converted to run on electricity? Is industry that relies on petroleum products (rail, freight, trucking) willing to switch to zero pollution, and have zero running cost, (comparable to the fuels they use now) where lubrication products would be the only "petroleum" used (but not burned) ?

    No doubt zero petroleum and zero emission would be the end result.

    I ask to see what public opinion is, what the group opinion is.

    I think the Snowden-like data release is fully set to trigger. When I asked "at what cost", do you want $$ for this, they said no. This is about stopping the tyranny of energy shortage.

    I thought that comment interesting.

    (running a house for instance doesn't need 20,000 watts of continual power.. Many people use solar or wind and survive quite nicely at 2000 watts of continual power, some even 1/10 of that even.. 20,000 watts for a home is substantial. Such power for 3rd world countries could very well level the playing field economically)

    and PS-2

    (materials cost - there is no shortage of the raw materials, there are currently insufficient needs to cut the cost of the raw materials. Typically cost to produce goes down when quantity goes up, i.e. mass production.. Certainly Tesla wanted "free energy" but his distribution system was horrendously massive, requiring "investors" (the Morgan group).. What I was shown by this particular "inventor" doesn't need 'investors' nor massive broadcast systems. It doesn't burn water and doesn't consume resources. That raised an eye-brow. There IS-NO money to make off this, the inventor wanted it to "REMOVE" energy scarcity, and financial tyranny created through energy scarcity and the divvying up of "resources" by the have's preventing the have-nots from access.. creating energy slaves.)
    Last edited by Bob; 7th July 2016 at 19:27. Reason: typos

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    My guess is, if the "technology" is surfacing, the "group" is desiring it, that it is time. That it is time to move past energy scarcity and into energy abundance. Other threads talk about the mind control "waves" that the cabal use through various nefarious broadcast systems (i.e. lan's cell towers, etc.) but they all require energy, and that energy comes from fuels, such as petroleum or coal, and somewhat old nuclear power stations.

    People buy fuel, the manipulators get cash in their coffers, and they do what they do to ensure more people become more dependent on the 'energy system'. Nobody buying 'energy any more' means what? People may end up "borrowing" from the shrewd "investor" who found a way to find "profit" (at the expense of someone), and then lend money to those needing "energy" for some other commodity.. so that those needing to "go on" who may not be so shrewd, nor so manipulative to "make a profit" at the expense of others, (or the environment) end up falling once again into the 'system'..

    I ask these questions so that we as a group can start to fathom consequences of "real free energy", or energy abundance, and no longer "energy scarcity".. A brave new world or more tyranny?

    A new tyranny and a new way to harm humanity?

    My feeling is when the questions are answered the next level solution to get to the next evolutionary step happens.

    In other threads, there is a discussion of having "gold/silver" to buy what, exchange for other commodities? Some form of "trade"? Energy comes down to one of the biggest manipulative "commodities", those who have it and those who will charge others outrageous pricing in order to "make a profit", some arbitrary based on getting "something for nothing", profit drive claiming that it is "right" to manipulate "energy" to be "smarter" or more devious or better scheming than others, to make the "buck" to get the "interest" on the buck at some perceived "value".

    Stopping the energy commodity manipulation to be able to "charge" for energy would turn some tables? Would the greed profit motive manipulators change? I doubt it.
    Last edited by Bob; 6th July 2016 at 06:36.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Free energy to plant a crop to feed thousands. Free energy to transport the crop across the nations. Free energy to run the water pumps to bring up deep water where there is no fresh water. Free energy to "get to the salt-mines" to work for the slavers who will find another way to get one to succumb to "credit" traps for instance. To borrow at "rates" dependent on fluctuating "arbitrariness" set by the whim of cabals..

    What happens when the free energy allows for "freedom of movement" to happen?

    Where new inventors will take that extra new energy bonus and start to develop, "free medicine", healing technologies, and god forbid to the "keepers" transport by the every-day man anywhere in the world they desire, and maybe even OFF the world? If energy is the "cost" keeping mankind tethered, removing that tether then means what?

    Those are questions to ponder, stay with the "profit" "I will lend you 10,000$ today if you pay me 10,100$ a year from now" mentality of scarcity manipulation of the haves verses the have-nots or change? what do you want? change or the money lender's mindset? the scarcity of energy manipulators mindset?

    Is it really that "inventors" are suppressed by Cabal? Or is it the "money system" itself which is perpetuating scarcity manipulation? Cutting "energy" out of the equation, what is left that prevents evolution? Getting past shortage mindsets and someone can "trade to you" a way if you pay them something greater than what you need? Even barter then can be suspect if profit is the drive.
    Last edited by Bob; 6th July 2016 at 06:42.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Not sure I understand this thread. What are you asking? Surely you are not seriously asking Avalon members if they approve of a FREE Energy device being delivered into their hands?

    Why the run around? why aren't you delivering the plans? What is this little "what if" thingie you are doing.

    Go talk to Wade for the proper answers...

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Quote Posted by Ernie Nemeth (here)
    Not sure I understand this thread.
    Bob's being very circumspect... as well he might be. Baby steps, etc. I think that might be quite smart in a situation like this.


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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    To simplify the topic of morality - it's a conflict between two systems of law:
    __ Law of the Jungle
    vrs
    __ Law of Love.
    In the latter, one survives by harmless actions; in the former, one survives by harmful actions. Generally, civilizations support the latter and oppose the former - but not always.
    . . .

    [Skeptical flag on]
    As to the claim of "free energy" I am skeptical. Furthermore, if it ever was perfected, it would destroy the planet.
    Reason : friction.
    Utilizing "unlimited" power to "do work" inevitably involves friction. Even flying through the air causes friction between the air and vehicle.

    Unleashing unlimited power among 7+ billion beings will do more to "overheat" the planet than any "greenhouse gas."
    {I would be favorably impressed with a discovery of zero friction machinery, which would eliminate waste heat.}

    . . . .
    Money Madness addressed here:
    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...-Money-Madness
    Last edited by ozmirage; 7th July 2016 at 14:57.
    The secret of life is that there is no secret of life.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    OFF WORLD INSTRUCTION MANUAL - lesson 1 page 1

    Fred the Alien was looking down on the poor people of Easter island. They were scratching a wretched existence with a primitive form of farming leading to vitamin deficiency and premature death. Fred has a miracle topical salve for their infections(let's call it gentian violet). He wants to give this technology to the people and help their lives improve and their civilisation flourish.
    Question: should Fred provide this, given that he can do it in a way that will not reveal his own presence?
    Hint: Take out your timeline viewer and note down the possible results.
    Answer: I viewed the most likely timeline, it involved a health revolution and dramatic leap in child survival. The population mushroomed, and for the first time in the Island's history WAR and CANNIBALISM occurred. The never ending need for wood for construction and fuel resulted in the Island being totally denuded of trees. Too late, the people realised that their Farming & economy relied on the trees, and the civilisation died out completely. I was horrified and decided not to provide any information or technology to the civilisation as it seems well intentioned acts can lead to awful results.
    Teachers Comment: Good..., 5/10...but please refer to lesson 2.
    Lesson 2: UNIVERSAL LAW: if the technology is birthing in the collective consciousness, and this may just mean imagining what it could do...not how to create it...you have permission to apply to the high council for a Karma Free Certificate and authority to release the tech.(as you know these requests go all the way up the line.)
    Teacher: You will be issued with your collective consciousness slide rule next term.

    God bless
    Last edited by Baby Steps; 7th July 2016 at 13:10.
    we have subcontracted the business of healing people to Companies who profit from sickness.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Quote Posted by ozmirage (here)
    To simplify the topic of morality - it's a conflict between two systems of law:
    __ Law of the Jungle
    vrs
    __ Law of Love.
    In the latter, one survives by harmless actions; in the former, one survives by harmful actions. Generally, civilizations support the latter and oppose the former - but not always.
    . . .
    [Skeptical flag on]

    As to the claim of "free energy" I am skeptical. Furthermore, if it ever was perfected, it would destroy the planet.

    Reason : friction.
    Utilizing "unlimited" power to "do work" inevitably involves friction. Even flying through the air causes friction between the air and vehicle.

    Unleashing unlimited power among 7+ billion beings will do more to "overheat" the planet than any "greenhouse gas."


    Money Madness addressed here:
    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...-Money-Madness
    I added the emphasis in red.

    I've asked many questions starting with the OP - the first being SHOULD the CABBIE take the money and run. Had that money NOT been there in his cab, he would not have been presented with the "potential windfall" (who here can't use almost 200,000$ in cash dropped in their laps?).

    So I have dropped in my lap, a potential "wind-fall". And I ask will this destroy humanity? (It was dropped in my lap in 1999 also, and recently this was revisited once again, this time by a "broker" who wants to manipulate it's distribution to "the select few".)

    The philosophic questions through-out the thread are important.. For example:

    Quote IS energy manipulation for the few ideal globally ? Have's and have nots? What about one who takes pride in being able to financially manipulate another to accept a "loan" and pay them "profit", another form of "energy manipulation". Do you find them noble that they can do that?
    Putting more POWER into a mindset who would "take the money and run", or find a way to ransom to get more $$ (let's say ransoming NOT releasing it if $$$ is paid to the "broker" to prevent it from going to certain groups, or prevent it from ever appearing)..

    The technology to accomplish the design is simple and elegant. The concept first dropped into my lap in 1999, and was tested briefly (about a minute) on the lowest possible power setting. On powering it up using the smallest scale (in Ohio), it apparently tripped a series of intermittent blackouts in the Mid-West of the US. Transmission lines failed, substation power transformers shorted out. Very similar to reports of what happens when certain UFO's enter an area (reminds me of the large east coast blackout of 1965, see this link: http://www.presidentialufo.com/old_s...c_blackout.htm). Right after this I was contacted by a representative (a LT. Colonel) of the USAF and "asked" if I would assist in doing research (classified) on one of their military bases which housed nuclear devices. Nothing spectacular, just could I locate underground toxic spills infiltrating the water table near the base, and possibly have a way to "find" un-exploded ordinance from the many years of live bombing tests. The experimentation on the "battery" stopped while being engrossed in "solving" that issue for them. At the point of doing the "bench test", I had to go outside briefly, came back and found this "agent" plugging in a USB drive into the computer which had the data on the "battery". That computer became totally unusable with apparently a bios "root-kit" installed on it (that was 1999). It was tossed.

    It was odd, I had asked that "agent" what if we applied this concept to a small, micro-nuke, couldn't we have infinite power that way, with a small atomic trigger driving the reaction? What happened thereafter I just don't know. The thoughts of doing a power system were GONE. No desire what-so-ever to continue working on such. I can only guess something was done to cause me to look elsewhere.

    At one point, headed home from the workshop where the bench test was done for the USAF representatives a few weeks earlier, I saw this model in pure black and totally silent, pointing it's front cannon right at my workshop. I momentarily debated what was the best solution to deal with this type of harassment. It was about 500 feet away, "hiding" below tree-level, hovering totally silently. That afternoon when I got back to my workshop, all the computers were crashed. EMP?

    Pointing such "guns" at a civilian certainly is a no-no. Was their message, "life can really be too short?" I wonder if China applied the power concept to their tactical battle-field nukes what the "balance of terror" would be like?


    That is a little bit of the "dance" since 1999.
    Last edited by Bob; 7th July 2016 at 16:21.

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    United States Avalon Member Chanlo23's Avatar
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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Even assuming the inventor Bob met (after being asked to vet him and his tech) really HAS designed something capable of producing free energy AND that said inventor does not want $$ for it, I personally think it is a fantasy for that inventor to believe that such would destroy TPTB or there is no way to make money from it (or some aspect of its production and implementation, or that the energy produced from it would actually BE free in terms of what it will cost to have it accessible to all).

    The inventor may say he does not want $$ for his invention, but he does not have the funds to mass produce the device, which is why he sought out the broker to find someone to pay for that. The broker may not want $$, but he DOES want control of who gets it first, when and how AND he wants to be a full partner in future 'humanitarian' inventions -- providing he can find someone invested enough in the current system to have the funds to produce the devices and/or the conversion services to make them usable and who doesn't actually want a ROI.

    Those in direst need of free energy do not have the money to buy the supplies needed (e.g. $1000) nor do they have the skillset needed to build this device -- even if they had detailed plans for it. Further, they do not have the ability to convert their current homes, vehicle, etc. to a form that could utilize it. That means they would have to PAY someone to do all those things for them - providing they can convince Mr. Broker who wants to rule the world that they should be allowed to do so. What can a poor farmer offer some wannabe fat cat dreaming of world domination in order to get his name on the approved list of folks who will be allowed to have it?

    I believe that whilst free energy could possibly resolve many issues for anyone capable of building such a machine on their own and converting all their living/vehicular/working devices to be able to utilize such - I also believe that widespread use would simply create a new systemic mechanism for control. It might not be built on fuel or oil, but it would be built around granting access to the technology to those incapable of building it themselves either because they don't have the cost of raw materials or the skill set to build it/implement it. Rather than destroy TPTB, it might simply offer them another opportunity to control in a different way with different products, while creating pathways for new PTB to rise (such as Mr. Broker). Whole new industries could rise in marketing conversion devices designed to fail after 4-5 years, installation services, conversion services, building services, etc.

    Recall that gasoline once cost $.05-$.07 per gallon. Gas stations used to offer ALL brands so shoppers could choose the cheapest one. TPTB built 'system' to exploit that resource and raised the price to its current market value, while altering the way it was sold to maximize profits for all. The same would happen to the 'free energy' in my opinion. It seems to me that this broker wants to hold the invention for ransom so HE can collect bribes and/or be paid off to not implement it by the current PTB in exchange for a place at their table.

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    United States Avalon Member ozmirage's Avatar
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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Quote Posted by Bob (here)
    Quote Posted by ozmirage (here)
    To simplify the topic of morality - it's a conflict between two systems of law:
    __ Law of the Jungle
    vrs
    __ Law of Love.
    In the latter, one survives by harmless actions; in the former, one survives by harmful actions. Generally, civilizations support the latter and oppose the former - but not always.
    . . .
    [Skeptical flag on]

    As to the claim of "free energy" I am skeptical. Furthermore, if it ever was perfected, it would destroy the planet.

    Reason : friction.
    Utilizing "unlimited" power to "do work" inevitably involves friction. Even flying through the air causes friction between the air and vehicle.

    Unleashing unlimited power among 7+ billion beings will do more to "overheat" the planet than any "greenhouse gas."


    Money Madness addressed here:
    http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...-Money-Madness
    I added the emphasis in red.

    I've asked many questions starting with the OP - the first being SHOULD the CABBIE take the money and run. Had that money NOT been there in his cab, he would not have been presented with the "potential windfall" (who here can't use almost 200,000$ in cash dropped in their laps?).

    So I have dropped in my lap, a potential "wind-fall". And I ask will this destroy humanity?
    Since I don't evaluate actions with respect to money madness anymore, I wouldn't seek to keep $200,000 worthless IOUs that are slave chits on 320 million people. That's just me. Can't say what other people might do. "White men go crazy over yellow metal!"

    As to the covert rulers of the planet, I would not doubt that the alliance of collectivists and usurers would seek to prevent the sheeple from getting loose from the pasture, or worse, stop being grateful for being allowed to regrow their skin after being skinned alive.

    I personally think their strategy is flawed, and that eliminating predation and parasitism would be a step in the right direction. Based on human population growth potential, we'll have to begin colonizing outer space within 40 to 80 years, preferably by massive autonomous self sufficient orbiting vivariums.

    As a cornucopian*, I advocate a hopeful future, where humanity can geometrically expand without fighting over resources, power or volume. Based on preliminary surveys of system resources, there's probably enough to support humanity for another 4000 - 6000 years. By then, we will undoubtedly need to migrate to other star systems, and repeat the process.

    >>>|||||<<<
    *(A cornucopian is a futurist who believes that continued progress and provision of material items for mankind can be met by similarly continued advances in technology. Fundamentally they believe that there is enough matter and energy on the Earth to provide for the ever-rising population of the world. Looking further into the future they posit that the abundance of matter and energy in space would appear to give humanity almost unlimited room for growth.)
    The secret of life is that there is no secret of life.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Thanks Bill for the explanation. We've been through this on other threads years ago so it hit me hard. Dropped it because of lack of interest. Now here we go again. Poor Wade, babbling on for hundreds of pages and no one gets it, or if they do no one cares, or if they do no one can get a handle on what to do, how to proceed. It is very frustrating.

    What I personally took away from previous discussions is that the average person is not ready emotionally or intellectually. Most of that ill-preparedness is because of the world we are forced to live in where are natural proclivities are constantly under attack. Until that changes, I don't think FE will help. FE would just allow some to lord it over most. Until people understand that we are in a war and we must vanquish the enemy, we will live as the conquered race that we are. Slaves don't get a say in their lives, neither do we.

    If we were truly ready, we could change this world overnight, literally. But we as a collective are not yet ready. We still believe in democracy and capitalism for heavens sake. It is not a population problem or a money problem or even a technological problem - it is lack of heart and as Wade says a lack of true integrity.

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    Default Re: How Money and the lure of it Corrupts us

    Interesting observations by the members, but I still don't see the prime questions being answered, I see some trying, and some skirting around happening. I've seen the other commodity items's manufactures assassinated.. i.e. ways to 'produce gold through low temperature transmutation'; gold for instance is another form of "manipulative energy". I've seen discussions on "dark matter" (potentially anti-gravity, and possibly matter self organization from energy, basic particle creation) be sabotaged also, derailed, the prime researchers harassed.

    @bluestflame stated it well in her post above
    Quote not so much money , it's the withholding of " things" we require to live , money is just the convenient tool they have inserted in the middle
    Commodities, yes, that is what 'money' allows for the obtaining. Have the money obtain the commodity.

    There are others though who "want" and expect others to "just give it to them, NOW !"

    Nobody is just going to "give one that candy" without asking some questions first. And getting the answers which point out how one will utilized that "candy".

    Is the idea of that "candy", for instance "low temperature transmutation of elements into other elements, such as "gold", or "holo-replication of proteins/carbohydrates" not requiring animals or plants, but from ENERGY directly, or "energy to transform aberrant weather systems", or "energy" to be able to produce and synthesize biological molecules, or "energy" to be reconfigured into "water itself"? Connect some dots. Infinite energy (at no cost to continue to produce) means potential to create whatever. TO HAVE that ability is to have the ability to assemble, or disassemble. That scares those who would "take the candy and run" (the opportunist thinking they can get a quick profit by stealing (or deceiving a producer of a "value").. It reminds me of a pack of jackals who have found a carcass and are having their "feast" off the body of something that lost the "struggle".

    When "energy" production no longer "costs", it can be utilized, reconfigured into "commodities".

    That's the basic basic. Reconfiguring into other forms.

    Folks just think "energy" as in gasoline, or diesel, or heat the home/industry. Or using coal, oxidize the coal so it creates heat to boil water to create steam to drive turbines and eventually the light bulb turns on at the flip of a switch - totally mindless of what it took to have that step happen, for the "consumer".

    A creator though looks at responsible action.

    A creator looks at consequences of action.

    A creator that cares about community, global outcome, and the progeny of civilization may just ask a few questions, about "consumer mentality", or "wanting the candy now" and maybe say, "the saltmines really are the best use of consumer mentality". Or the creator may say, those who believe in "take" without balance will go like other viri or bacteria, until they take so much their own pollutions kill themselves off.. fully laissez faire.

    @NancyV made a great observation, honoring those who take the risk, and ask the questions

    Quote Whatever you do you do for yourself. If you are the kind of person who wants to help others by giving them access to free energy, you will do it because you want to do it, so it will be for yourself.
    So a person who looks at a group, asks stewardship questions potentially then may be one who could have dropped in their lap, a way to help the group.

    Who brought fire? I think of Prometheus now and then, wondering why the 'god's' would punish one who brings down fire (energy) to 'civilization'.

    Quote Greek: Προμηθεύς [promɛːtʰeús], meaning "forethought")[1] is a Titan in Greek mythology, best known as the deity in Greek mythology who was the creator of mankind and its greatest benefactor, who stole fire from Mount Olympus and gave it to mankind.

    Ancient myths and legends relate at least four versions of the narratives describing Prometheus, his exploits with Zeus, and his eternal punishment as also inflicted by Zeus.

    There is a single somewhat comprehensive version of the birth of Prometheus and several variant versions of his subjection to eternal suffering at the will of Zeus. The most significant narratives of his origin appear in the Theogony of Hesiod which relates Prometheus as being the son of the Titan Iapetus by Clymene, one of the Oceanids.

    Hesiod then presents Prometheus as subsequently being a lowly challenger to Zeus's omnipotence. In the trick at Mecone, Prometheus tricks Zeus into eternally claiming the inedible parts of cows and bulls for the sacrificial ceremonies of the gods, while conceding the nourishing parts to humans for the eternal benefit of humankind.

    The two remaining central episodes regarding Prometheus as written by Hesiod include his theft of fire from Olympus for the benefit of humanity against the will of Zeus, and the eternal punishment which Prometheus would endure for these acts as inflicted upon him by the judgment of Zeus.
    I suppose this strikes me also - looking at Pandora, not as in the "Avatar" (or is it ) -

    Quote The poet Hesiod describes the "bringing of Fire to Mankind"

    Had Prometheus not provoked Zeus's wrath (44–47), "you would easily do work enough in a day to supply you for a full year even without working; soon would you put away your rudder over the smoke, and the fields worked by ox and sturdy mule would run to waste."

    Hesiod also expands upon the Theogony's story of the first woman, now explicitly called Pandora ("all gifts").

    After Prometheus' theft of fire, Zeus sent Pandora in retaliation.

    Despite Prometheus' warning, Epimetheus accepted this "gift" from the gods.

    Pandora carried a jar with her, from which were released (91–92) "evils, harsh pain and troublesome diseases which give men death".

    Pandora shut the lid of the jar too late to contain all the evil plights that escaped, but foresight remained in the jar, depriving humanity from hope.
    Energy can be related to understanding, and eventually wisdom. How it is used, how it is obtained, how it is shared (education/parable and allegory) hopefully can reach those who have a bit more insight than demanding that their light be subsidized as their "right" to another's efforts.
    Last edited by Bob; 8th July 2016 at 15:32.

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