An Open Letter to Joseph P. Farrell on the Topological Metaphor: questions and thoughts

[Curt]

Here's the guts of a letter (an email, who am I kidding) that I'm going to send to the man, the myth, the legend, Dr. Farrell.

I'm sure he will be amused by the idiocy of it all, and will, if he does respond, tell me to settle down, take my meds and stop bothering people.

And that's fine. In fact, I could use a drink and a couple of aspirin after composing the beast that is the following letter/email.

Anyway, with that preamble out of the way, please do enjoy. Or suffer through it, whichever the case may be.

Oh, and if you have anything to add on any of the material covered, ideas raised, or questions asked, please feel free to contribute here.

This silly little letter can just be a starting off point for discussion here on the forum.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I listened to your conversation with Jay Dyer on the topological metaphor. In this discussion you mentioned its relationship to Plato’s notion of the tripartite soul, which consists of Mind, Spirit and Appetite.

In Plato’s ideal Republic 'Mind' governs. It is the ruling principle. In a manner of speaking it is the father god of the trinity. Through it, 'Appetite', with the cooperation of 'Spirit', is brought to heel; the appetitive urges are sublimated in service of the greater good.

This occurs on a micro level, within the individual, as well as on a macro level, within the body politic of the healthy state.

Mind, in a certain reading of Plato, seems to come closest to the perfected or ‘undifferentiated’ state of being; it is closest to 'God,' or is closest, at least, to what we might call the 'form of all forms'— or the androgyne.

Further, Mind, or its representative class within Plato’s Republic (the philosopher kings) are assigned the mineral designation of gold, which may itself be an alchemical metaphor for the perfected state of the human soul.

But, more interestingly, you mentioned another trinity, as well, within the context of your discussion on the topological metaphor. It consisted of the following elements: Mineral, Vegetal and Animal.

In The Secret History of the World by Jonathan Black, Black explains that these (Mineral, Vegetal, Animal) are the three basic stages of ‘creation’ as understood by ancient occult philosophies— and perhaps by their modern inheritors, as he claims.

As Black describes it, first, there was the Mineral phase of creation, then Vegetal, and finally the Animal stage. He references a great deal of artwork and provides thorough ‘evidence’ to support the idea that esoteric thinkers and artists down through the ages have intentionally depicted this three-staged process of creation/evolution, albeit, in his view, in deliberately coded form.

Generally speaking, Mr. Black portrays this unfolding process as a long ‘descent’ or ‘fall’ into matter— as a process whereby all of creation attains a kind of terminal density which ultimately separates or alienates it (the creation) from its source— that source being Mind.

Like Plato, Black suggests the esoteric traditions held a ‘mind before matter’ model of the universe’—that mind precipitates matter, that the universe is composed by and of Mind. In your discussion, you seem to have said much the same thing.

Am I correct in assuming that these three phases (Mineral, Vegetal, and Animal) correspond to Plato’s ‘trinity’? Can it be said that Mineral corresponds with Mind, Vegetal with Spirit, and Animal with Appetite?

And am I correct in assuming that this ‘trinity’ corresponds (in some essential way, too) with Freud’s superego, ego and id, respectively?

After all, in Freud’s system, the id must be brought to heel through the intervention of the superego, via the ego, in order for a person to be moral and good; sublimation is essentially the basis of human civilization as far as Freud is concerned; this is almost exactly as Plato imagines a just society would function.

It seems that Freud’s notions of sublimation, the tripartite psyche (soul), and his fundamental premise that ‘ mind’ determines how people conduct their lives, (and how they create or recreate the world they live in) are well in line with Platonic thinking— at least, very broadly speaking.

Leaving that aside...I’ve noticed that in classical architecture, there seems to be yet another trinity— specifically, the three basic types of Greek columns, Doric, Ionic and Corinthian. Might these represent the tripartite nature of the soul, as well as the topological metaphor?

Here’s why I ask: it strikes me that Doric is just an inverse step pyramid at the top, (Mineral); Corinthian is an elaborate flower (Vegetal); and that Ionic is a ram’s horn (Animal). And interestingly, the three pillars of freemasonry are depicted as Doric, Ionic and Corinthian.

Is this bit of freemasonic iconography a coded reference to the tripartite soul/trinity, and to the topological metaphor you describe?

You also mentioned dialectics. Plato suggests a gradual ‘dialectical’ process whereby the rule of philosopher kings in the Republic gives way to the rule of Timocrats, then Oligarchs, then Mob Rule, and finally to Tyranny. This gradual process of corruption occurs both within individuals, and on a societal level—one being an analogue of the other.

Can this process be read, as the writer I referred to above, Jonathan Black, might read it, as a gradual process of decline--as a process of separation from (mind/mineral creation) which reaches a terminal point whereby Mind, through its descent into ever courser material form, achieves such density that creation is totally disconnected from its sustaining source?

Is this why Plato stresses the primacy of the 'form', the ideal, of which all material things, he suggests, are just fleeting, imperfect examples?

This all reminds me of Yeats’s, ‘The Second Coming’ where the ‘widening gyres’ signal a time when the ‘centre doesn’t hold’ and ‘things fall apart’, where mind fails to hold back the tide of appetite— where apocalyptic revelation is ushered forth in a time of war and destruction.

...As a background to why I’m thinking along the lines of trinities, esoteric architecture and mineral/mind metaphors, and perhaps... even where they converge... I recently travelled to Newgrange and saw the megalithic structure there. This is an ancient site pre-dating Christianity by thousands of years. Trinity symbolism is found throughout. Spirals—in groups of threes— are everywhere.

The inner chamber is a cross, which is illuminated by the sun on the Winter Solstice, no less. The rest of the year the chamber is in total darkness. The entire structure was constructed out of mineral rich rock, and is currently lined with quartz crystals around the outer perimeter. These crystals have been added by archaeologists who believe this was the original design and intent of the builders.

The builders’ choice of mineral rich and (as experts suggest) even crystalline materials to construct this site would be especially fitting, if, as you’ve said, the structure of the universe is essentially crystalline in nature.

Is this monument an example of an attempt on the part of ancient people to experience the mineral/mind stage of creation? Was it an attempt to journey back to the mind of creation- to get a glimpse of it at the beginning—like a kind of megalithic Hadron Collider?

Was Newgrange intended, too, as an almost cosmic womb, an analogical portal that provided ancient people an experience of undifferentiated existence, of unity, and timelessness?

Did these ancient people gain an experience of overcoming death, as they witnessed, inside that dark chamber each year on the Winter Solstice, the sun rising on the cross?

....But, to bring all of this questioning and speculation forward to our present sci-fi times... are the transhumanists and those modern occultists/scientists, whom you mentioned, fundamentally trying to achieve something similar today?

Except, with the crucial twist that they’re not trying to conquer death by analogy, or to experience timelessness through metaphor or poetry, but that they are instead trying to accomplish it literally, and in prose?

Is their decidedly literal attempt to live forever the consequence of a complete ‘descent into matter’—as Black might suggest—a descent so complete, perhaps, that the ‘signal’ from Mind (to pick up on your frequency analogy) can simply no longer be received?

...Another of Plato’s metaphors comes to mind, and that’s Atlantis, where hubris and high technology combine with a lack of wisdom and sink a civilization at the height of its powers.

Do the ‘live-forever-crowd’ just not know that they don’t know? Do they mistake being able to trace the lineaments of a ‘thing’ for having real knowledge of its true substance and 'form'?

[Curt]

Oh, and here's the interview with Dr. Farrell and Jay Dyer that I've referenced in the post for those who'd like to have a listen.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=8Y18k5mZtYQ

[Mike]

Well... did he write back?

[Mike]

enough info in that OP for several threads. concise, intelligent, thoughtful. and very well written.

i thought i had an opinion or 2, something i wanted to share, but i was suddenly struck with this fear that my comments would be really really dumb. so i'm going to sit back and let somebody else make that mistake. and then, when someone offers something insightful and intelligent, i'm going to jump in and adopt it as my own and pretend they simply beat me to the punch ("i was just going to say that!").

Curt i'm going to be honest: i have no idea what youre talking about...

...no indictment on you. youre the best writer on the forum, far as i'm concerned.

i'm just a little slow these days. i do have some vague ideas floating around in my head regarding some of the things youve written, but i'd be much more comfortable sharing after the conversation has evolved a little and im certain my ideas are at least remotely relevant. i kind of wish this was a conversation we were having over a fire pit after a few beers. i have this uncanny way of squinting my eyes and furrowing my brow that makes even the stupidest of questions seem sincere and poignant (' "appetite" eh? what does craving a burger have to do with a holy triumvirate again?")

so, i hope someone says something competent here soon. ive only contributed my nonsense because youve obviously put alot of time and effort into this epic post, and someone had to bloody say something at some point. i'm just sorry it had to be me.

[RunningDeer]

Posted by Mike (here)
Well... did he write back?

...that I'm going to send to the man...

Not yet.

I had a hunch you'd pop up, Mike. Curt and Mike back on the same day. I'd swear you two have similar biorhythms.

As for what you wrote, most of the thoughts you expressed, I was thinking, too. Curt, I soooooooo wanted to come up with something. I even was at the ready to post that video to get the ball rolling.

Glad you're both around.

[Curt]

Thanks Mike, and Paula.

I just shot off the email a few minutes ago. I'm sure Dr. Farrell has got much better things to do than responding to unsolicited letters from crackpots like me, but I figured I'd shoot the moon. I sent it to the media inquiries email address on his website, which may not be the best way to contact him.

Just thought I'd give it a try.

In the meantime, here's another really interesting interview with Dr. Farrell from Radio Far Side on the topic.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=TWu4c9Pbj_E

[Debra]

Posted by Curt (here)

The inner chamber is a cross, which is illuminated by the sun on the winter solstice, no less. The rest of the year the chamber is in total darkness. The entire structure was constructed out of mineral rich rock, and is currently lined with quartz crystals around the outer perimeter. These crystals have been added by archaeologists who believe this was the original design and intent of the builders.

The builders’ choice of mineral rich and (as experts suggests) even crystalline materials to construct this site would be especially fitting, if as you’ve said, the structure of the universe is essentially crystalline in nature.

Is this monument an example of an attempt on the part of ancient people to experience the mineral/mind stage of creation? Was it an attempt to journey back to the mind of creation- to get a glimpse of it at the beginning—like a kind of megalithic Hadron Collider?

Was Newgrange intended, too, as an almost cosmic womb, an analogical portal that provided ancient people an experience

I am taken by this, Curt. I saw this and I think I am seeing what you are seeing.

These are the questions .. That I think are being asked, the heart of the matter. And. I think you have the answer ..

Love your dedication to going deep, my friend. I am awake to this and won't let it rest either. Thanks for the opening. I am going to dip my toe in. Might need some help but I am game

Zeb x

[Carmody]

That matter, or atoms, or particles, and so on, exist only in differential. Ie as comparison between two or more. Across the minimum two, as comparison or differential. Yet, reason or observation, would take a third, ie one to observe the two in differential. This also pertains to the first solid of the elements... lithium, which is fundamentally trinary in organization. That reason, or reaction, in this case, arises from the total of the three. That self awareness (externalization and internalization), in fundamental, in this temporal differential realm, arises in the minimum of three.

This takes you directly to quantum paradox, Heisenberg, Schrodinger, and much more.

Thought, or reason/reaction/observation, in this realm, exists only in reflection. Ie, this realm, this reality, gives rise to ego and body, ego and flesh.

Whereas the singular, the individual component can communicate with the next atom or particle, but outside of the ego or realm reference. Spooky action at a distance, and the rest, of the whole quantum non-local aspects. The singular is therefore the whole but the next coupled stage is temporally and locationally chained... due to it's fundamental being a differential/comparative. Ie, that the Newtonian reality window is what it is, nothing more.

That spirit or the singular, informs of the whole and beyond.... but the ego/body informs of the local...it is chained/tied/anchored to the reflective-reactive reasoning of the temporal-elemental basis. The two components are separate, but fundamentally coupled. The singular is coupled to the whole, and all, but the differential system is outside of the awareness of such things...even though it is fundamentally coupled.

(And much more, of course. Just throwing some stuff in here)

[Debra]

So father son and Holy Ghost, the triage for our era, is this belief born out of lithium? Alkali .. Alkaline ? Lithium carbonate. Mood stabilising .. Keeping us together? Just riffing here. Carmody, I respectfully ask you to add more here as I know you have thought a great deal more on this than I have.

[Carmody]

"Objection!"

"Leading the witness, your Honour."

"Objection sustained."

It's not borne out of lithium, per se, but that the first solid has, in some ways, the highest captive stable energies of the solids..relatively speaking... which is why it's compounds are used in batteries. It is merely part of the evidential trail of the as 'above -so below' aspects of the temporal-differential matrix. It is of evidential importance, as linkage and being as points on a descriptive chart...but not to be confused as fundamental.

[Debra]

I am going to sit in crystal for a while and see if it is sustainable.

[Carmody]

Another analogy is that Newtonian temporal differential reality is series connected, whereas the spiritual reality is singular in nature from the one viewpoint... it is parallel connected.

Which gives rise to the opacity in Newtonian temporal differential reality, and the transparency in the spiritual and quantum reference.

This does not mean that the "bi-directional energetic egress" from and to each individual quantum functioning parallel connection/particle is identical, not at all. It means there is connection.

Which is partly connected to the idea of how in astral projection that people or beings can become stuck in dense materials or that one avoids water, due to it's severe mutable disorganization and high mass. Not that this is specifically pertinent to the discussion at hand (ie, just a random factoid), but that the evidence is in everything, all the little bits and the whole of the data set(s).

This bring up the point that there is not just one single layer of existence in connective quantum realms, but that the Newtonian/relativistic/differential/temporal realm is distinctly low in such quantum connective energies and associated evidence.

Which tends to give rise to the complexity and difficulty of trying to illustrate such 'other' aspects to full connected reality..... in a matrix the defies the ability to describe the rest.

The seemingly large discrepancy, this makes it seem very black and white to the Newtonian/temporal anchored ego-body system.

That 'spooky action at a distance' quantum stuff is totally different and as a lumped whole thing. Not true.

When in fact, there are layered and connected universes in existence via that channel.

Why would the distance between a proton/neutron and the so-called electron be so huge? Why would an electron be calculably.....dimensionless? That it is specified to have no size? That it is a reference, but not a reality? WTF? so, in essence, we define electrons as a reality thing but we don't actually give it 'anything'.... that it isn't actually here....as we define 'here'.

Yet electrons are fundamental... and as layered orbital systems around all proton/neutron systems, and as complete systems, we call them 'atoms'. (as a pairing of things we empirically decided on, in the mists of scientific time)

Those so called orbits of electrons are actually vectors and resonant vibrations. They are geometrical unidirectional energetic patterns, from our temporal-reality matrix ego-body viewpoint. One might even say that your entire ego-flesh-temporal reality... is the vectored vibration patterns on the skin of a bubble.

[Mike]

i was surprised to find out that the mormons have a triumvirate as well. it appears, at least superficially, identical to the Christians (father,son,holy ghost), but the difference is that they regard the 3 entities as totally separate personages. in fact, for them, God is a man of flesh n bones who lives on the planet Kolob. it's true. he started as a mere mortal and evolved over time into.....er...nevermind.

it got me to thinking: do the scientologists have a triumvirate too? turns out they don't...

but i s'pose pretty much anyone can co-opt any form of symbolism they choose and give it any meaning they please. why am i saying this? i don't know...

moving on:
i think Plato had too much time on his hands. if he were alive today, he'd likely be some coffee house intellectual. too much philosophy will swell the mind and atrophy the soul. it's a rich man's game. he came from a rich, aristocratic family. it's easy to spit platitudes at people from a position of wealth. show me the philosopher who toiled all day in some sh!tty back breaking job..and still had the energy and wherewithal to commit lofty thoughts to paper, and i'll show you a truly honorable man. Celine said "to philosophize is only another way of being afraid and leads hardly anywhere but to cowardly make believe." he also said "the poetry of heroism appeals irresistibly to those who have never been to war.." Plato had never been to war ..metaphorically or otherwise. his life was too cozy. listening too closely to him is like taking nutritional advice from a fat doctor.

here's the funny thing: Celine was a philosopher. and a noted anti semite....but thats for another thread.

why am i being so hard on Plato? again, i have no idea...

more sporadic and probably nonsensical thoughts:
i think mind and appetite should be lumped together. mind, at its best is the ultimate creator. at its worst it is the ultimate indulger in appetites. all governed by spirit, i think. seems obvious to me. why Plato couldnt figure this out while some servant was wiping his ass i can't fathom (note: i have no idea what i'm talking about)


plowing ahead now:
don't get me going on Freud. yup he was on to something alright...his mother! he spent his whole career justifying his incestuous thoughts by making it seem normal (it's not). he couldnt sublimate. he couldnt follow his own advice (note: still don't know what i'm talking about)

lastly:
ive no doubt the triumvirate is a sacred concept. by now it seems obvious that god or whoever speaks in numbers and shapes. the same ones keep popping up over n over again, and they are no doubt interrelated: same idea, different words..all trying to express the same thing. but i'm not sure that thing can be intellectualized; i'm not sure mind dominates. with concepts like these one will always hit an intellectual wall. after that, progress can only be determined by a "leap of faith"

I'm no expert, but thats my hypotneus (for an explanation on that last statement, see post#34 in "things that make you laugh or go awww" thread.

[Curt]

Just a quick update.

Dr. Farrell got the email. He responded within a few short hours of my sending it, and told me, very politely, that he's quite busy, but that he'll try to have a look. He said that he wouldn't likely have time to respond, which is obviously totally understandable.

However, he did mention that he sometimes covers this topic in vidchat sessions on his website.

So, for any Avalonians who are also members of Dr. Farrell's site, keep your eyes peeled for new discussions on this topic.

And, if you think of it, please drop a line in this thread with any new developments you're able to share.

Many thanks, and rock on.

[RunningDeer]

Posted by Curt (here)
And, if you think of it, please drop a line in this thread with any new developments you're able to share.

Congratulations, Curt!

FYI: There are seven ways to stay current with Dr. Joseph P. Farrell. Scroll to the bottom of GizaDeathStar.com website for options such as Tweets, Facebook, email and YouTube.

If you're new to YouTube, look for the subscribe button on the top right of the YouTube channel. That way it’ll come up in your newsfeed. If you don’t have a YouTube account, the latest video is also on the front page of his website.

[RunningDeer]

Posted by Carmody (here)
Why would the distance between a proton/neutron and the so-called electron be so huge? Why would an electron be calculably.....dimensionless? That it is specified to have no size? That it is a reference, but not a reality? WTF? so, in essence, we define electrons as a reality thing but we don't actually give it 'anything'.... that it isn't actually here....as we define 'here'.

Link adjustment: "The Void Between Protons and Electrons Makes Us All Phantoms”

Posted by Mike (here)
I'm no expert, but thats my hypotneus (for an explanation on that last statement, see post#34 in "things that make you laugh or go awww" thread.

Post #34:

"A friend of mine had just gone thru a painful breakup, and a few of us were talking him thru it. My friend Adam opened up and told some very personal stories, what he'd learned from painful experiences, his thoughts and opinions on romantic relationships etc.

It was unlike him to be so talkative. We were all pretty surprised and impressed. He was really on a roll and he knew it. So he kept going...and concluded his speech by humbly saying "...i'm no expert, but thats my hypotneus.."

What???

Someone, I can't recall who, said "what do you mean "hypotneus"? You mean "hypothesis" right?"

Adam wasnt going down without a fight. I think he would have defended his word choice to the death. Someone even grabbed a dictionary at one point to prove his error, but he was hearing none of it. That was his "hypotneus" and he was sticking with it. Maybe you had to be there, but we were all laughing so hard we were crying.

Of course now its a running joke. In fact, if one of us gets even the least bit philosophical, its almost a rule that they then must say "....i'm no expert, but thats my hypotneus..."

[Carmody]

We can have the noise, which this talk and all other talks are...but eventually we must turn to the messy task at hand, which is the clearing of the self.

The thing the noise helps the ego avoid. The ego's eventual sublimation to the higher self. Since the ego, the high level reflective inner voice... is it's peak --it is the body's mechanism with a reflection system for the voice dialogue that comes into being-- for the purpose of integrating with the Newtonian reality matrix.

This ego system runs the body edifice---- it fears it's own transformation and delegation to being...or returning to being a second tier system.

The body is designed to fear it's own death so it can be a semi autonomous vehicle. If not it would be a highly illiterate and dysfunctional avatar. Obviously so. Thus, the ego voice refletion, does not want to die and it will fight it's dissolution or it's re-assignment to being second tier, it will fight this to the death, in all ways possible. recall it is thought projection-reflection, and it runs the body. Pure mayhem is the result when you go after it's tendrils of fundamental control.

Silence is the doorway to recovery of control, which the body voice will help you avoid, in any way it can, in each and every second.

Like all things Newtonian and of this matrix... it lives in reflection and thus is given unto the idea and 'thought' that it is the real driver and in charge. The mind is vocal mirror, nothing more. Yet it believes it is real, when it is not.

When we silence the mind, we find the true door of true self and begin the sublimation of the ego control of the body and thus regain our balance in the world. the ego loves the noise. In that, it gets to be alive and retain control. It is entirely emotion/animal based... as that is what it is, the voice of the body, not the self. Just the reflection.

Thus all this, all low level and even high level discussions are, in the end, in the final analysis...as avoidance techniques....they are simply your ego masturbating itself and the body... into remaining in charge.

From another thread, this same morning:

Posted by Carmody (here)
The problem with mainstream science is that it is the latest and greatest form of might makes right, the bulk drives the masses, the C-grade is so full and sure of it's self in it's ignorance whereas the more intelligent are careful to be correctly unsure of themselves.

That mainstream science might make it to a level of 120IQ, but the more rarefied understandings required to be met to understand the questions at hand, exceed that level of intellect, and in some ways, notably so.

Thus the connection is in... intelligence that is raised by the given self.... and cannot be brought down.

“Real learning comes about when the competitive spirit has ceased.”

“Governments want efficient technicians, not human beings, because human beings become dangerous to governments – and to organized religions as well. That is why governments and religious organizations seek to control education.”

Part of the problem of book derived science, with a set past that forces a directed future--there is no capacity for correction. Which is a dogmatic situation that will always lead to fundamental error.

“Tradition becomes our security, and when the mind is secure it is in decay.”

“The constant assertion of belief is an indication of fear.”

“The following of authority is the denial of intelligence. [It] may help us temporarily to cover up our difficulties and problems; but to avoid a problem is only to intensify it, and in the process, self-knowledge and freedom are abandoned.”

Which directly indicates that the problem is fundamental in science. that the errors are DEEP and FUNDAMENTAL in both the science, the thinking and mathematical formulae. The more intractable the problem ----the more fundamental the mistake in the formulation of the question.

“If we can really understand the problem, the answer will come out of it, because the answer is not separate from the problem. ”

“Thought is so cunning, so clever, that it distorts everything for its own convenience.”

Truth cannot be brought down, rather the individual must make the effort to ascend to it. You cannot bring the mountain-top to the valley.

On how to encircle and control humanity:

''I maintain that Truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect. That is my point of view, and I adhere to that absolutely and unconditionally. Truth, being limitless, unconditioned, unapproachable by any path whatsoever, cannot be organized; nor should any organization be formed to lead or to coerce people along any particular path. If you first understand that, then you will see how impossible it is to organize a belief. A belief is purely an individual matter, and you cannot and must not organize it. If you do, it becomes dead, crystallized; it becomes a creed, a sect, a religion, to be imposed on others. This is what everyone throughout the world is attempting to do. Truth is narrowed down and made a plaything for those who are weak, for those who are only momentarily discontented. Truth cannot be brought down, rather the individual must make the effort to ascend to it. You cannot bring the mountain-top to the valley. If you would attain to the mountain-top you must pass through the valley, climb the steeps, unafraid of the dangerous precipices.
…
If an organization be created for this purpose, it becomes a crutch, a weakness, a bondage, and must cripple the individual, and prevent him from growing, from establishing his uniqueness, which lies in the discovery for himself of that absolute, unconditioned Truth.
… The moment you follow someone you cease to follow Truth. I am not concerned whether you pay attention to what I say or not. I want to do a certain thing in the world and I am going to do it with unwavering concentration. I am concerning myself with only one essential thing: to set man free. I desire to free him from all cages, from all fears, and not to found religions, new sects, nor to establish new theories and new philosophies.

all quotes from Krishnamurti

This is why observation and the rise of philosophy (and astrology*) is the true and steady father of all sciences. Science is meaningless if it has the wrong origins and emphasis. Science becomes not truth and seeking... but the yoke of control of self and group (a C-grade group of illiterate animal dogmatics), where one hangs themselves, self secure in the comfortable den of their dogmatic edifice.

(*Astrology is the pattern through time, of how the temporal world is shifted and patterned-including all human life, individuals and whatnot. The greater one's understanding of astrology the more it will show the patterns of the universe, in time... in equivalent perfection as to one's knowledge of astrology. But then again, truth is pathless land, any real and fundamental search will do. As long as we seek out error in our postulates and accept that the new can change our fundamentals. Astrology is mentioned as it was fundamental to the origins of observation and theory and all math... astrology...which became the fundamentals of philosophy and then combined....is the origins of all sciences )

The most important part of all this is that all of science, all of it in total, is based on a lack of truth in the deepest fundamentals. That the very bottom most, the very depths and anchors of all sciences, are not understood. the fundamentals are not defined. They are postulates. they are beliefs. Not even that, they are left blank. There are no facts at the bottom of the physics of all science. The stacked turtles of science are all hanging in empty space.

This is what you find, when you dig into the fundamentals of science (and associated academia).

This means that all of science is a dogmatic system of belief, a dogmatic church from the bottom up. A dogmatic church that is violently enforced by the mid level c-grade intellect/soldiers/fanatics.. which form the middle of it's herd. (an IQ of about 110-120 max, and mostly linear in design, no balance in intellect, very lopsided and myopic--which means it is easily manipulated--from just out of sight)

There is every point in evidence that it is a manipulated and controlled edifice, controlled and enforced by multiple parties and interests which are the true controllers of that particular puppet, the puppet of science...one with a great depth and wide in facets, so that it's control (science's control) is notably invisible to the general public. A general public which is a C-/D grade intellect, for the most part.

Posted by Carmody (here)
Thus, the more inundated the society, the more it is in decay.

Look around you.

The same goes for the noises in the mind and life.

Clarity come from the silence, not the noise. Noise is decay and control, in self and other.

Which is why I said above 'objection, leading the witness'..as.. I must not stand in place for the ego voice, so it can hold control. I must not agree with it's game and aid it in holding ...and thus slip into (or remain comfortably in) decay. (To be the comfortable animal in the herd. safe. But dead, fenced in.)

Ie, that the topological metaphor is fine as an exercise in grounding at various levels for the purposes of ..whatever... but in the end ..it is avoidance technique like all other things... and will have to put aside as you get down the real meat of the matter. The matter where you remove the control/interface of the avatar from the ego system ....so the real intellect can rise.

Ie, recall the higher intellectual self that emerges when people undergo regression hypnotism. (and newton's life between life hypnotism). Something that is far more intelligent and clear.

This is in you, each and every one of you...and this is what the motion toward inner silence is all about.

[Curt]

Here's a recent interview with Dr. Farrell from Forum Borealis on 'the metaphor'.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=sXibJ5An1ZA

[Agape]

You see On the topographical landscape and curve from the square one to the square infinite , speaking of metaphorical simulation of evolution of consciousness ,there are not only thousand blocks and rocks to lift , not only systems to traverse , create and destroy , there is in reality more than 6 billion human options .
Now, we can't remember that many people and their information and all we carry within our understanding , a derivate of our chosen assembly of archetypes, no matter what's the real number.
And yet our ability to expand and include information and increase our memory grows exponentially with time , surpassing the dilemma of one and many .

Soon ... and when we're capable to consider as many human options as once as available our interconnectedness and our judgement too will be more accurate .

The time it takes from establishing our intent to its fulfilment depends on our capacity to calculate those options.

[PurpleLama]

I missed this interview, thanks Curt.