Another vicarious adventure, and another Avalon Cairn (for the Wawa Grande, this time)

[Rawhide68]

I´d just want to comment with, It IS a fascinating story ! , and I love the photos!!
Maybe someday could be a book or film ?

[Jean-Marie]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by Valerie Villars (here)
Bill, wouldn't a hiking person bring along a lighter or something which they could build a fire with, in order to alert a search party to their presence? I am NOT a hiker and no little about those kinds of survival skills.

Well, that particular area is way above the treeline (though there are hardy grasses and shrubs), and in bad weather a fire is a tough proposition. But in theory, yes, a lighter only weighs an ounce and has to be worth carrying. A whistle works better for attracting attention, though. (And never goes out!)

For anyone who's interested (and who might care about my well-being!), I personally always carry

• A weatherproof survival bag that reflects 90% of body heat
• A fleece sleeping bag liner
• Spare wool socks
• Warm gloves + waterproof overmittens
• A stormproof mountain jacket
• Two insulating foam sleeping mats
• Two hats (my leather hat + a warm beanie)
• Fleece salopettes and jacket that are warm when wet
• I also always take a knife, cord, plastic bags, elastic strapping (for knees/ankles), safety pins, iodine, suncream, bandaids, toilet roll, compass, whistle, emergency energy drink, headlamp, phone, water bottle, spare food, ID card, blood group card, and camera.
• And a dog.
• No maps. There aren't any. (But I always leave my route details on the Avalon server each time, and never vary from the plan.)

All that (apart from the dog!) weighs a featherweight 13 lbs, including the backpack and a liter of water but excluding the salopettes which I wear whether it's hot or cold. I always aim to travel fast and light, but I'm confident I'd be just fine if I was stuck somewhere up high for a couple of days and nights.

When I visited Bill in Ecuador we went camping at a spot at a much lower altitude than the Cajas Mountains. If I remember right the area we camped at was at 11,500 feet. During the day, I collected pieces of kindling/brush. There are no trees at that altitude, just small brush. We had a small fire that night. Everything at night becomes wet and damp, soaked by morning. So if you know you will have to start a fire you need to start much earlier collecting/preparing before night sets in.

[Valerie Villars]

As a safety, now knowing, isn't there something light weight one could carry that would alert a search team, both day and night, of one's whereabouts? I thought Bill's use of a whistle was ingenious, but perhaps something longer lasting where one wouldn't have to blow a whistle every few minutes for all of daylight hours so one could be found.

The presumption being, of course, that searchers generally don't search at night. Flares would do the job in the darkness.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Valerie Villars (here)
As a safety, now knowing, isn't there something light weight one could carry that would alert a search team, both day and night, of one's whereabouts? I thought Bill's use of a whistle was ingenious, but perhaps something longer lasting where one wouldn't have to blow a whistle every few minutes for all of daylight hours so one could be found.

The presumption being, of course, that searchers generally don't search at night. Flares would do the job in the darkness.

Yes, there are now Personal Locator Beacons that work worldwide and communicate via satellite.

The principle is like a kind of reverse GPS. Instead of you using a satellite to figure out where you are, the satellite can use it to figure out where you are — and then tell others who are searching.

They cost from around $300 to well over $1000. Dave Paulides, having researched a couple of thousand cases of bewilderingly vanished people in National Parks, states that there's not a single person who's ever gone missing who had both a gun and a locator beacon.

A whistle really does work, though. The idea, like with the beacon or a ship sending out a mayday, is that you DO NOT USE IT EVER unless there's a genuine emergency. Any mountaineer hearing a whistle knows there's someone in serious trouble, and it can be heard several miles away.

They weigh less than an ounce, they're indestructible with no moving parts, and cost about $1. If Wilson Serrano had had a whistle and was alive and conscious, he'd have been found.

I did blow my whistle once. (Just once, in several decades of carrying it.) This below is quite some story, and many readers might not be aware of it.

• A day in the mountains: a tale of forgiveness

[Joe from the Carolinas]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
Well, that particular area is way above the treeline (though there are hardy grasses and shrubs), and in bad weather a fire is a tough proposition. But in theory, yes, a lighter only weighs an ounce and has to be worth carrying. A whistle works better for attracting attention, though. (And never goes out!)

For anyone who's interested (and who might care about my well-being!), I personally always carry

• A weatherproof survival bag that reflects 90% of body heat
• A fleece sleeping bag liner
• Spare wool socks
• Warm gloves + waterproof overmittens
• A stormproof mountain jacket
• Two insulating foam sleeping mats
• Two hats (my leather hat + a warm beanie)
• Fleece salopettes and jacket that are warm when wet
• I also always take a knife, cord, plastic bags, elastic strapping (for knees/ankles), safety pins, iodine, suncream, bandaids, toilet roll, compass, whistle, emergency energy drink, headlamp, phone, water bottle, spare food, ID card, blood group card, and camera.
• And a dog.
• No maps. There aren't any. (But I always leave my route details on the Avalon server each time, and never vary from the plan.)

All that (apart from the dog!) weighs a featherweight 13 lbs, including the backpack and a liter of water but excluding the salopettes which I wear whether it's hot or cold. I always aim to travel fast and light, but I'm confident I'd be just fine if I was stuck somewhere up high for a couple of days and nights.

As an outdoors person, I appreciate you listing that out Bill That's a very tested, reliable list. I normally pack a balaclava to keep my face shielded. Lightweight is my favorite way to move on the land. People don't understand why salopettes are preferable over pants until they wear them. And 3 cheers for the whistle!!

While fire is often thought about from a comfort standpoint, I've found that the times when I have really wanted a fire was exactly the wrong time for me to have one (extreme cold, extreme wind).

While I'm huddled and covered, conserving energy and body heat, and making sure my water doesn't freeze... I'm not burning myself out trying to keep a fire going or (worse) trying to boil water.


Anyway, I'm really looking forward to learning more about the Haunted Lake region, that looks like some really unforgiving but extremely fun terrain !

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
My next goal is to see if I can climb the prominent peak overlooking them. My provisional plan is to go there on Monday.

So, here we go. Mara the is super-excited. I'll take some more video of my shoes, and I'll report back late this evening US time.

[Hervé]

Mountaineers Summit Fashion Hats:

... and exchanges on boots' pros and cons... for happy trekking

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
My next goal is to see if I can climb the prominent peak overlooking them. My provisional plan is to go there on Monday.

So, here we go. Mara the is super-excited. I'll take some more video of my shoes, and I'll report back late this evening US time.

Well, WOW. It was very long day, strenuous and spectacular, with a bunch of tricky exposed climbing thrown in for good measure. It was quite something, but also on the edge of extreme for what I should really have been doing on my own.

The route I took to get there was NOT the optimum one at all: in fact, it was probably the most arduous possible option. I'd be sure it wasn't Wilson Serrano's route. But if he went OFF-route (and more on that tomorrow), the kind of terrain I was in would make it really almost impossible for him to be found. I may be able to show that quite well on video. (I have quite a lot to edit!)

The most interesting thing was that I had a most curious and unusual experience as soon as I arrived at the first Haunted Lake, which I'll describe in detail tomorrow also. It was very intriguing... and I'm still processing that. More later.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
The most interesting thing was that I had a most curious and unusual experience as soon as I arrived at the first Haunted Lake, which I'll describe in detail tomorrow also. It was very intriguing... and I'm still processing that. More later.

The anecdote needs a little background context first. If you'll allow me to say this, I'm highly experienced in the mountains, and I also have an exceptional sense of direction. I never get lost, disoriented, or mixed up, even in bad weather. I cut my apprenticeship in Scotland in winter, and that may say something. I'm a formally qualified mountaineering instructor, and I've often taken responsibility for groups as a guide, sometimes on extended expeditions. I know what I'm doing up there, I really do. I wouldn't have lived this long otherwise!

Here's what happened. I have the entire thing documented on video.

Everything was just fine till I descended from a high ridge down to the first main Haunted Lake. And, uncharacteristically, I immediately got confused which way to go to return home.

This never never never happens to me. It was like a blanket of confusion descended on me, even though I was in good shape and the visibility was perfect. I noticed what was happening, and recorded it all in real time on video, talking to the camera, working to figure it out.

The video will show it (I have quite some editing to do), but basically I was being tempted off in quite the wrong direction. And even though I'd looked down on my return route a couple hours earlier from a high vantage point, I'd somehow forgotten that, or that had been at least partially blanked out.

I had to get out my compass, for the second time in three years (the first time was just for a few moments to check I was going in the right direction in some fog, and indeed I was) — and as every hiker knows, you trust that. (And I did.)

At the same time as this was happening, Mara got spooked. I captured all that on video, as well. She was on high alert (I know her well), and she was trying to see something up on the hillside that seemed to be invisible. It was like she sensed something was there, but couldn't figure out what it was, or where it was.

And she has excellent eyesight... she can spot a llama or deer half a mile away, and will always go haring after it immediately. But she didn't move: she just kept on looking around, all tense and alert.

And she was frightened... her teeth were chattering. She does this when she gets anxious (like when the local farmers in the valley where I live are setting off fireworks). And she even whined a couple of times. I scanned the hillside myself, but couldn't make out a thing.

In the end, of course, all was well. I trusted my compass, and when I was about 200 yards/meters from the lake, and about 100 feet above it, my confusion lifted like the sun coming out, and everything felt 100% clear again. And Mara was once again frolicking around as if there was nothing ever wrong.

Whatever it was, was very strong. For anyone with less experience, or who didn't have a compass, or if the weather was bad, they could have been really messed up. My guess is that this may have been what happened to poor Wilson Serrano. If I was there in the dark, and wasn't totally sure where I was, there's NO WAY I'd have moved an inch till morning.

My guess is that he didn't have a compass, and didn't have any overnight equipment worth the name... he was just too confident, simply because of all his experience, and was tempted off into a fatal wrong direction in the dark. It's like a modern Aesop's Fable. Confidence is a wonderful asset, but over-confidence can be a killer.

I have a LOT of video. Some of it is really quite good quality, I have to say. I think I'll just stitch it all together as best I can, but (warning!) it's over an hour long. If anyone's remotely interested, they can fast forward through it, or jump around, and I'll timestamp the various different interesting segments.

98% of the time, I never even encountered an animal trail, let alone a human one: it was really wild and remote. And, you'll be able to see from the video quite how impossible it would ever be to find anyone up there who had wandered off any safe route.

Sierra just asked me if I'd ever plan to be going back there. The answer is no.

[DNA]

Dang Bill I was reading your post #189 the same way Joaquin Phoenix was watching the news in the closet from SIGNS.

With Mara seeing or sensing a presence I wonder if this wasn't being done to you on purpose.

I've read that some UFO's will pull energy out of the earth's magnetosphere in certain spots and this will affect a compass and people's sense of direction, but your compass was fine.

I wonder if Mara was sensing your areas WaWa Grande, if so they may have been zapping you.

Sasquatch seem to have two methods they can affect consciousness, one is through infrasound, and the other is through something called zapping.

It doesn't sound like you got infrasound from what I've read they need to be pretty close to use that, but zapping is something they can do at some distance.

I'm just spit balling here, you should read up on some stories of folks who claim to have been zapped by Sasquatch like Scott Carpenter.

I'm glad you're alright Bill. You and Mara both.

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtUUXJhoMUc

[Ron Mauer Sr]

I feel it was manipulative interference. Intentional or not for specifically you, I feel not so. Something wants to keep people away.


Always trust your instruments, all pilots know this.

[Mike]

I know I'm always blabbing about John Keel, but he covered so much that there's bound to be some overlap with other people's paranormal experiences..

Reading Bill's post I was immediately reminded of one of Keel's experiences in the TNT area in Point Pleasant while searching for the Mothman.

There were areas, or zones, maybe 20 feet wide, that elicited great fear and disorientation out of Keel. For example, he'd be walking along and suddenly he would feel tremendous fear and anxiety and confusion. If he had the courage to keep going, about 20 or so feet later he'd sort of pop back in to normalcy...the fear would vanish just as quickly as it had arrived. Sometimes he'd do a little experiment - he'd turn around and walk thru the area again to see if the fear returned. Sure enough, it did.

It was kind of like a psychic fence, designed to cause all kinds of discomfort and confusion to anyone who happened to walk thru it. It made me wonder if the same type of impersonal force was at work in the Haunted Lake area.

[Nasu]

Thank you Bill, I trust your and Mara's good judgement.

In a similar vein, I too have some experience climbing past the clouds, I used to have my MLTB for both summer and winter so can attest to all that you say. Fear is a strange one, in my experience, when we lose it, we lose our sense of real danger and bad things often happen or follow. I started rock climbing and mountaineering to get over my fear of heights, but found out the hard way that we must keep some small level of fear in order to stay alive. Fear makes you double check your kit, fear makes you think twice, fear keeps us alive up there.

That being said, it is interesting how the locals have named this valley. Again, in my experience, when a place is named after scary or spooky or other worldly things, there is a reason. Glad your back safe. Perhaps it's time to find a local climbing buddy??....x... N

[Magnus]

Bill, thanks for sharing your delightful adventures with us, it's both very interesting and beautiful, I'm grateful.

It won't add much value, but I'd like to mention an event of mine, maybe similar to yours.

In 2008, in dense urban environment, in a foreign country, in the middle of a small side street, returning to my hotel, I experienced a distressful overwhelming sense of strong disorientation, it came over me in a flash, I couldn't find my hotel even though I knew it was within thirty meters reach. Eventually I found my way, shocked and upset about what had just happened. Back in my hotel room, I struggled to understand what was wrong with me, an hour later I hardly couldn't believe that it had actually happened.

Never before, and not since.

On a second thought, it's surprising this state of mind haven't been weaponized, but then again, maybe it have.

[James Newell]

A very exciting briefing about your trip Bill. Looking forward to the video. Sounds like a misdirection emanation coming from the lake.

[avid]

Something in the rocks causing magnetic disturbances, which could confuse orienteering species like birds and bees to get lost? An electromagnetic glitch? Glad you’re not going back anyway. Phew!

[Dennis Leahy]

I was thinking of some sort of gas emanating from the lake or nearby. Could a layer of air in the area, high in CO2, cause confusion?

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
I have a LOT of video. Some of it is really quite good quality, I have to say. I think I'll just stitch it all together as best I can, but (warning!) it's over an hour long. If anyone's remotely interested, they can fast forward through it, or jump around, and I'll timestamp the various different interesting segments.

Here it is. Enjoy.

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ol5ALBqDD8

The YouTube text:

~~~

Our trip in October 2018 to climb Cerro Negro (or something!), and our visit to the Haunted Lakes... where Mara (my dog) and I both got spooked. :) A very long and very interesting day. There's a running, real-time commentary throughout.

~~~

Because it's so ridiculously long, here are the timestamps of the various component mini-events, so anyone who's interested can just go to any small part they want to. There is a real-time commentary from start to finish, though — some of which may be quite entertaining — so you're not just watching silent images go by.

Caveat: I still don't know for sure which mountain is Cerro Negro. (No maps.) I may have identified it towards the end of the day, but the first, large pyramidal peak that we climbed is certainly worthy of the name.



~~~

0:00:00 — Intro, views of Cerro Negro, speculating whether it’s climbable

0:01:57 — Higher on the long whaleback ridge, first glimpse of one of the lakes, more telephoto views of Cerro Negro

0:03:51 — My shoes, my knee bandages, and what it’s like walking on this terrain

0:05:05 — Close-up shots of tiny alpine flowers

0:05:56 — A hummingbird

0:07:14 — Closer to Cerro Negro, now at 14,200 ft, 9.15 am, view of more lakes, why I'm wearing gloves (very high UV)

0:09:53 — Starting the climb (broken rocks and steep, loose talus/scree)

0:14:19 — Picking the easiest way up through the steep, broken rock, looking back down the ridge where I came from, and looking up towards the summit, wondering how easy it might be to get down the other side, wondering whether there’ll be water anywhere

0:16:53 — My feet, climbing the steep loose rocks

0:19:25 — At the summit, Mara doesn’t know the way down, and neither do I, distant view of another Haunted Lake (and other lakes in a different direction that aren’t haunted), wondering what happened to Wilson Serrano, spectacular views

0:23:04 — Down from a tricky dangerous descent, views back towards the rock wall that I downclimbed (“What am I doing here all on my own?”), still thinking about water, clear views of two large Haunted Lakes 1,500 ft below, (“This has evolved into quite an adventure, more than I thought it would be”), time is 10.30 am

0:28:53 — Selfie clip of walking along the high rocky ridge

0:29:50 — Scat of a mountain fox (very high, 14,400 ft), clear detailed view of the return route (which when I get down to the lake at 0:41:54, I unaccountably completely FORGET about)

0:32:10 — Another alpine flower, thinking about water, throat is now very dry

0:34:16 — A whole bunch of alpine flowers, a really beautiful little ‘garden’

0:36:29 — Mara finds some muddy water at last, small deer prints nearby, another large, imposing mountain now visible in the distance, and maybe that’s really Cerro Negro

0:38:38 — Following up a dried-up stream, Mara finds a tiny bit more water

0:40:20 — Mara is now swimming in the highest of the Haunted Lakes, very happy to have found real water (and so am I), time is nearly 12 noon

0:41:54 — Now at a larger Haunted Lake, I am CONFUSED (having unaccountably completely forgotten my excellent clear view of the return route at 0:29:50)

0:45:41 — I get my compass out, speculate about whether Wilson Serrano got confused also, and have some home-made chocolate

0:50:20 — Mara, in alert mode, is very clearly spooked by something invisible

0:52:50 — So tempting to head off in quite the wrong direction

0:55:00 — Now 200 yards from and 100 ft above the lake, and my confusion has now suddenly lifted (“like fog”), Mara is back to normal

0:57:20 — View up the slope, checking direction with my compass again

0:59:03 — 3/4 of the way up, it’s taking longer than I’d thought, getting a little tired now

1:01:24 — The steep and loose last few feet, in real time, to where I can see what’s actually on the other side, and whether I'm correct or not (and I find that I am), part of the sole is peeling off my old shoes, quite a lot of heavy breathing (that was hard work)

1:06:07 — Down at a lake on the home straight, views back up to where I came down, filling my water bottle again and adding iodine drops, Mara and I are both tired now

1:08:15 — More scat, quite large for a fox, but probably a little too small for a puma

1:08:45 — Beautiful emerald colors in the lake, more views of where we came down

1:09:28 — Over 9 hours later, finally back at Pandora (my old 1986 Isuzu Trooper), and all is well.

[DNA]

That was thoroughly enjoyable, I'm convinced Bill would make a top notch nature narrator.

I swear to God I was waiting for the moment when Bill would introduce the mountain lion in it's native habitat.
I've got to admit, at 29 minutes in I was horrified, my sense of propriety and instincts for laziness were appalled.

It was here that Bill was filmed walking down the mountain a good distance and all I could think of in my head was, "oh my God, Bill you're going to have to climb back up there and get that camera, for the love of God Bill stop walking!".


In regards to the first lake you hiked to where the weird stuff started with yourself and Mara it was absolutely evident that Mara was indeed looking for something and was also in distress. She appeared to be looking in a specific area, but her head was bouncing back 180 degrees as well, almost as if you were surrounded by something. If it was indeed the WaWa Grande it would appear to me that they had you surrounded.



Did you feel as if something was watching you? I know you mentioned feeling off kilter with your sense of direction but did you feel as if something was observing you? I might also add that you held up fairly well for that predicament, you didn't seem like you were freaking out or nothing.

I've got to be honest, if that was me I would be talking into the camera like it was the "blair witch project" and telling my wife and kids I loved them and not to come visit daddy's resting place because the boogey man lives there.

Which by the way, I was watching some Sasquatch videos on the Bigfoot Outlaw Radio youtube channel and they were saying that folks back in the 1800's and pioneer days used to refer to the Bigfoot as Boogers, and they used to tell their kids that if you weren't good that the boogers would come and get you, and that this turned into the Boogie Man.

I don't know why I'm mentioning that. Oh well.


Loved that video Bill, big hugs to you and Mara.

You are the man, I would never do what you did. No way. I'm out of shape, I have a horrible sense of direction, I'm far too addicted to human companionship and I'm afraid of getting eaten by a Sasquatch that goes by any name including WaWa Grande. But I'm glad you don't share any of these fears and make some absolutely entertaining adventure videos. Loved it.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by DNA (here)
That was thoroughly enjoyable, I'm convinced Bill would make a top notch nature narrator.
Loved it.

Well, thank you! I enjoyed putting it together. (And enjoyed the hike, too.)

Posted by DNA (here)
...it was absolutely evident that Mara was indeed looking for something and was also in distress. She appeared to be looking in a specific area, but her head was bouncing back 180 degrees as well, almost as if you were surrounded by something.
Did you feel as if something was watching you? I know you mentioned feeling off kilter with your sense of direction but did you feel as if something was observing you? I might also add that you held up fairly well for that predicament, you didn't seem like you were freaking out or nothing.

I started to definitely feel something might be watching, when I saw Mara clearly getting alarmed. A couple of days ago, I wondered about infrasound — of some kind. (As some may know, there's speculation that Bigfoot/Sasquatch may deploy infrasound.) And as Mara was looking around everywhere, as you noted, that sound (if it was a sound) might have had a 'coming-from-everywhere' quality about it.

I understand that infrasound is meant to make people (and animals) intimidated, but with myself it might just have been a confusion factor. (Both Wilson Serrano and myself were unlikely to get intimidated by anything in the mountains, I dare to say. But we might well have gotten our logic somehow scrambled.)