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Thread: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quote Posted by Rocky_Shorz (here)
    Finally, with only a day to spare...
    I would guess they first had to build a "road" over some of the washed out area, just to enable the concrete pumper, the cement mixer trucks, and the rock hauling trucks, to get to the place that needed the rebuilding the most.

    If they can ride out tomorrow's rain storm using just the main spillway, that might buy them another week of time to continue rebuilding the area below the auxilliary (ne emergency) spillway.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    I used Twitter, first hitting Trump, but then realized the solution, so searchedtwitter, going through hundreds of posts before finding the conduit.

    If you knew the answer to save Gothem city was bat poop, wouldn't you contact the police commissioner?

    Cops can drive right up to the site and speak with the boss, so I tried it,. They are not only laying the cement, but you can see the wall is already being coated with polyurea...

    White house spokesman says they are on it...

    I'm still friggen pissed because the oil bastards he is helping destroyed my life for asking for a grant to start producing perpetual motion automobiles. I didn't realize a vehicle that doesn't burn gas was illegal in America. I'm sorry I'm so far advanced of you oil morons that what We are capable of is illegal, but if Trump comes after California, I will give the answers to everyone to shut down your blood sucking friends.

    Edited to add Basil Hayden's is great whiskey... 😉
    Last edited by Rocky_Shorz; 15th February 2017 at 17:36.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quote Posted by Rocky_Shorz (here)
    Edited to add Basil Hayden's is great whiskey... 😉
    It's the best in my book. It's made by Jim Beam.
    Last edited by Paul; 15th February 2017 at 19:10. Reason: fix quoting

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quick Showers are hitting at 2pm, over 60 degrees so snow melting will be the main worry before the 3 day storm starting at 7 tonight.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    From Jim stone:

    ABSOLUTELY AMAZING OROVILLE REPAIR EFFORT

    What you will see in This Video that is noteworthy

    1. They got the large scale mining trucks (these are way beyond what is allowed on the road) and used them to rapidly bring in large rocks from a mine somewhere, and with them built an entirely new road across 50 plus foot deep erosion trenches.

    2. With that road in place, they managed to get cement trucks back onto the ground at the emergency spillway, and they are pouring concrete as fast as they can.

    3. A secondary helicopter effort to bring in rocks to areas that the trucks still cannot get to.

    Do I think it will work? Not if the spillway is put to heavy use in the next couple days. But the effort is actually a real effort. I never would have thought they would ever get a road back in, but they did it, and that alone is a major achievement. It was the only way they would ever have a chance.

    How effective they are with this will all depend upon how much concrete they can manage to lay down, and if they can get it into the key places

    They cannot drain the dam enough. As of this evening, they have only dropped it 15 feet. They can't hit the target, which means they had better hope the weather man is wrong.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quake swarm starting100 yards from spillway?


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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    California Dams are all pretty amazing...


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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Current prediction is 11+ inches of rain over the next 10 days. Hope they are wrong. Fingers crossed.

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/02/...d-orovilledam/

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    The pressure of the 100,000 feet of water per second pounding on the spillway hole is putting pressure on the plates causing local quakes...



    Need to finish the overflow project to start a patch on the spillway, why only 1 cement squirter? only one ever made? get 10, move faster...

    13 feet over capacity...

    edited to remove video, Bill and I watched the same one and he goes into specifics of what to expect from these storms rolling in. It's not just the storms, but mountain temperatures in the 70's coming next week to melt off the snow pack.
    Last edited by Rocky_Shorz; 16th February 2017 at 19:17.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    .
    This update, a little over an hour old, is from David DuByne at Adapt 2030. It shows quite a lot of (rather worrying) rainfall and dam-level math, from various sources, and the projections all pretty much agree.


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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quote The pressure of the 100,000 feet of water per second pounding on the spillway hole is putting pressure on the plates causing local quakes...
    That cannot be accurate? What say you Hervé?

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Seems I remember reading of some dams in China that caused mini quakes simply because of the weight of the water. We all know how politics work, I feel bad for all the people threatened by this possible collapse.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quote Posted by Ewan (here)
    Quote The pressure of the 100,000 feet of water per second pounding on the spillway hole is putting pressure on the plates causing local quakes...
    That cannot be accurate? What say you Hervé?
    ... that Rocky has a propensity for exaggeration which compounds with mismatched units of measures... never mind the unknown value attributed to the variable "plate"...

    A relatively fast variation in the water column height inducing bedrock readjustments is far more likely, IMO.
    Last edited by Hervé; 16th February 2017 at 18:41.
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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quote Posted by Foxie Loxie (here)
    Seems I remember reading of some dams in China that caused mini quakes simply because of the weight of the water.
    I'm struggling with this concept purely on logic. Just a few hundred metres north of the outpouring is a weight of water that must be thousands of times more, sitting there placidly on the bedrock. An outpouring, even at velocity can only be a fraction of that. If the dam literally burst, that would be a mass weight shift suddenly. Still not sure the possible resultant movement of bedrock could properly be referred to as a quake.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quote Posted by Ewan (here)
    Quote The pressure of the 100,000 feet of water per second pounding on the spillway hole is putting pressure on the plates causing local quakes...
    That cannot be accurate? What say you Hervé?
    2 other dams including Hoover are having small quakes too in the area.

    weight of water levels never seen before on aging infrastructure...

    hoping on no more Surprises, we have another dam only 16 feet from overflow too expected to reach capacity from this storm, melt off.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    Quote Posted by Ewan (here)
    Quote The pressure of the 100,000 feet of water per second pounding on the spillway hole is putting pressure on the plates causing local quakes...
    That cannot be accurate? What say you Hervé?
    ... that Rocky has a propensity for exaggeration which compounds with mismatched units of measures... never mind the unknown value attributed to the variable "plate"...

    A relatively fast variation in the water column height inducing bedrock readjustments is far more likely, IMO.
    2 quakes so far at Oroville, but Dutchsinse mentioned it last night, he is pretty much my expert on earth movements and why I mentioned it.

    it's the alarms going off everywhere, 1:11 11:11 $1.11 $11.11 all in the same day...

    I don't want Oroville to turn to Horrorville

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    "It's not just Oroville: Record rain is straining California's whole flood control network"



    "The frantic effort over the last few days to lower water levels at Oroville Dam after the structure’s two spillways became damaged is part of a larger drama playing out as California rapidly shifts from extreme drought to intense deluges.

    Large swaths of the region are on track to experience their wettest winter on record, with many areas having already surpassed their average precipitation for an entire year.

    And all that water is putting new strains on the network of dams, rivers, levees and other waterways that are essential to preventing massive flooding during wet years like this one.

    The biggest danger zone lies in the Central Valley at the base of the Sierra Nevada, whose tall peaks can wring the skies of huge amounts of rain and snow. The area is essentially one giant floodplain that would be easily transformed into an inland sea without man-made flood control. At 400 miles long and 40 miles wide, it has only a tiny bottleneck from which to drain — a one-mile opening at the Carquinez Strait at San Pablo Bay — before water heads into the San Francisco Bay.

    “You got this big bathtub — water doesn’t flow out of it very quickly,” said Jeffrey Mount, senior fellow at the Public Policy Institute of California and former director of the UC Davis Center for Watershed Sciences.

    As the site of the nation’s tallest dam and the main storage for the State Water Project that sends water to the Southland, Lake Oroville has commanded national attention as the crippled spillways forced the evacuations of more than 100,000 downstream. But smaller water systems are also under intense pressure.

    Sixteen reservoirs, ranging from small to the biggest in the state, were above 90% full as of Wednesday morning.

    Among them is the Don Pedro Reservoir, the sixth-largest in California and located near Yosemite National Park. As of Wednesday afternoon, it stood at an elevation of 827.4 feet, just shy of its 830-foot capacity, the Turlock Irrigation District said in a statement. The district continued to make releases to the Tuolumne River, which flows through Stanislaus County and into urban centers such as Modesto.

    Forecasters predict about 4.7 inches of precipitation could fall in the watershed over the next six days. Although the irrigation district said it does not anticipate an overflow, it advised residents of Stanislaus and Merced counties to register for emergency notifications.

    In the Sacramento Valley, Shasta Dam, the spigot for California’s largest water storage lake, and Keswick Dam both released large volumes of water for multiple days into the Sacramento River.

    George Skelton: Dam officials should've listened to those warnings about Oroville. Now we're stuck paying the price

    The National Weather Service’s California Nevada River Forecast Center warns that the San Joaquin River at Vernalis in San Joaquin County will surge into the “danger stage” this weekend, the first time this winter that the center has made such a warning. That could put the town of Lathrop, south of Stockton, at risk.

    Earlier this week, evacuation orders were issued for Tyler Island, a small farming tract in the Sacramento-San Joaquin River Delta, after a compromised levee posed a risk of flooding.

    To water experts, it’s a pattern that plays out in years of heavy rains. Lakes pushed to capacity have placed tremendous strain on levees, some of which were built long ago and were weakly constructed. Perceived as fail-safes, experts say levees were meant to reduce the frequency of floods, not stop them altogether.

    “They’re really the No. 1 defense against floods, and they’re not very good at it,” Mount said. “Levees are kind of unreliable partners in flood management.”

    Hoping to avoid the situation faced by Lake Oroville, officials are planning large releases of water from reservoirs. But that could further strain the hundreds of miles of levees that line the Central Valley’s vast river networks, built to protect homes, businesses and farms from floods. The series of storms that slammed the area in December 1996 and lasted for a week caused numerous levees to collapse. Widespread flooding that inundated 300 square miles led to extensive damage and evacuations of 120,000 people, as well as nine deaths.

    While the state’s reservoirs are built to release water slowly, officials are forced to quicken the pace of releases when they are at capacity. Water from brimming reservoirs is guided into nearby rivers. If those rivers are full, water can seep over and under levees, or through hidden cracks, leading to erosion.

    More expected storms this season and a massive snowpack likely to run off into the summer has officials grappling with their options.

    “After several years of drought, now we’ve got too much all at once,” said Jeremy Hill, a civil engineer who is part of the Department of Water Resources flood operations team.

    Hill said the threat of floods would be a lasting concern until the end of spring.

    Levees were not designed to be stressed for extended periods of time and they require constant supervision, said Joseph Countryman, a member of the Central Valley Flood Protection Board and former head of reservoir operations for the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers for Northern California, Nevada, Utah and Colorado. Even without major rainstorms, the magnitude of the volume of water flowing through the system will still create “tremendous seepage” in the levees, potentially weakening them. And significant flows are to be expected through June, he said.

    “The longer the water is on levees, the more potential they have to become saturated and develop problems they have never before exhibited,” he said.

    State water officials said despite the record rainfall, they remain confident the flood control systems will hold up.

    “There’s a lot of water moving around and everything’s full and everybody’s going to have plenty of water,” said Bill Croyle, the acting director of the Department of Water Resources who was at incident command headquarters for the Oroville Dam. “I don’t think it’s testing the system.”

    Even as rain began to fall Wednesday, Croyle said the storms forecast over the next few days will not be enough to test the integrity of the Oroville Dam or its two damaged spillways. He said the public “won’t see a blip in the reservoir” levels, now dropping about 8 inches an hour.

    Officials at the dam said their biggest worry wasn’t the weather but the damage done to the dam’s already compromised main spillway during days of sustained pounding from heavy releases of water. When the emergency spillway began to fail Sunday, officials sent massive amounts of water down the main spillway — despite the damage — in a desperate effort to reduce the water level in the reservoir.

    “It’s holding up really well,” Croyle said of the main spillway. But he added continued mass water releases could be causing hidden damage to the rocky subsurface adjacent to the concrete chute. LA Times

    CNN Entertainment has an Oroville video out, they even put very fake news into it...

    they have a quote from the head of California's emergency department telling people if they get an emergency text to their cell phones saying to evacuate, just ignore it...

    Click for current capacity levels of California Dams
    Last edited by Rocky_Shorz; 16th February 2017 at 21:33.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Dutchsinse comments from yesterday

    At 8 minutes in he starts to talk about California--big increase of earthquake swarms in California over the last few days.
    He talks about the impact of the water from the dam causing small quakes far beneath the surface.
    Last edited by onawah; 16th February 2017 at 22:06.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    Hey Avalon, look at this real time image, see the huge break in the storm passing over Orville?



    You all did that, I'm proud of you...


    Oh, and CNN, a good reporter would have known he hasn't slept for a week so would have clarified...

    "excuse me sir, but did you mean ignore last Sundays evacuation message now that everyone has been given an all clear for now?"
    Last edited by Rocky_Shorz; 16th February 2017 at 22:31.

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    Default Re: Oroville Dam... (California, Spring 2017 - current)

    California's Oroville Dam update: Spillway releases curbed, even as 'atmospheric river' looms

    Ryan Lillis
    Sacramento Bee Thu, 16 Feb 2017 20:51 UTC



    Oroville Dam Spillway

    The water level at Lake Oroville continues to drop as state officials press on with the effort to drain the reservoir in light of a forecast calling for rain through Monday. Despite forecasts showing another "atmospheric river" poised to strike the region early next week, engineers began dialing back the water releases from Oroville Dam's main spillway Thursday in an effort to eventually restart the dam's shuttered hydroelectric plant. When operational, the plant could release additional water from Lake Oroville.

    After pounding the damaged spillway with releases of 100,000 cubic feet per second since Sunday evening, the state Department of Water Resources dialed back the releases to 94,000 by late Thursday morning. DWR's website indicated releases would fall to 80,000 cfs by 3 p.m.

    Even with the curtailed releases, the water level at troubled Lake Oroville continued to decline. The reservoir was falling by about 5 feet every 12 hours and was down to 867.5 feet just before noon, or nearly 34 feet below the top of the dam. Federal flood regulations say the lake should be at no more than 850 feet this time of year.

    Officials had said they would start throttling back the releases to resume pulling debris from the river channel beneath the dam. The debris has backed up the river at a critical point, preventing the state from restarting the dam's hydroelectric power plant. The plant would be capable of releasing up to 13,000 cfs.

    Independent experts told The Sacramento Bee the strategy makes sense. The reservoir should be empty enough to handle the inflow from the "atmospheric river" forecast for Monday, and getting the power plant working again will prove vital to navigating the rest of winter and into spring, when snowmelt from the Sierra will create heavy inflows.

    "They think they've got the reservoir under control," said water policy expert Jeffrey Mount of the Public Policy Institute of California. "They've got the breathing room."

    Joe Countryman, a former U.S. Army Corps of Engineers official, added: "They're thinking down the road. It's very, very important to make that (power plant) functional, no doubt."

    Countryman said the releases down the main spillway still will be considerable. "It's not like they're cutting it back to zero; 80,000 (cfs) is a lot of water."

    Meanwhile, the National Weather Service predicts an "atmospheric river" will strike the area beginning Monday, putting renewed strain on the reservoir.

    The lake level fell by nearly 5 feet in the 12-hour period ending at 10 a.m., dropping to below 868 feet. That was about 33 feet below the top of Oroville Dam even as the first in a series of storms hit the Oroville region late Wednesday.

    The first storm didn't bring significant rains, but the National Weather Service reported that a warm, heavy storm known as an atmospheric river is expected to roll into the Feather River basin Monday and Tuesday.

    "It is looking like the system for next week is trending wetter and warmer," said Michelle Mead of the National Weather Service in Sacramento.

    However, Mead said the rainfall is expected to be only half as heavy as last week's storm, which swamped Lake Oroville with peak inflows of 191,000 cubic feet per second just as Oroville Dam's main spillway suffered a massive crater.

    The giant fracture in the main concrete spillway Feb. 7 temporarily hobbled dam operators' ability to push water out of the reservoir, causing the reservoir to fill and water to flow over the never-before-used emergency spillway. Some 180,000 downstream residents were ordered to evacuate Sunday when state officials feared the emergency spillway was in danger of failing. The crisis eased and evacuations ended Tuesday.

    Despite damage to the main spillway, dam officials have been releasing water at 100,000 cfs nonstop since late Sunday to increase flood-control space. DWR officials say they don't believe the erosion in the spillway has worsened.

    "We want to keep taking water out of that reservoir for flood-control space," said Chris Orrock, state Department of Water Resources spokesman.

    Meanwhile, crews working to reinforce the emergency spillway were able to continue their efforts through the night despite periods of heavy wind and rain.

    Windy conditions and more rain are forecast for Thursday. Helicopters that have been dropping bags of rocks on emergency spillway this week, likely will be grounded Thursday.

    And, if the hillside becomes too slick, ground crews using dump trucks to pour boulders onto the spillway will have to stop their work. The boulders are designed to fortify the eroded hillside at the foot of the emergency spillway's 1,700-foot concrete apron.
    "We want to make it through this weather system and re-evaluate where we are at," Orrock said.
    The National Weather Service is forecasting a half to an inch of rain to fall Thursday in Oroville. Perhaps another half inch could arrive on Friday.

    However, the early storms are relatively cold and snowy, alleviating pressure on the reservoir. That's expected to change. Mead said the 7-day forecast for Oroville calls for a total of 10 inches or so of rain, with much of it coming Monday and Tuesday. Snow levels in the Sierra could be as high as 7,000 feet, she said.

    While not as bad as last week, when snow levels were higher and total rainfall approached 20 inches in the Feather River basin, Mead said the reservoir can expect a significant amount of new water.

    "Enhanced inflows are expected," she said.
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