The COLLINS ELITE: Nick Redfern, Ray Boeche, and interdimensional, demonic 'aliens' - that the deep insiders may know all about

[Bill Ryan]

This complicated and extraordinary story takes us all down a different track, suggesting that

• The 'ET' phenomenon, or much of it, might truly be demonic and highly deceptive.
• At least one group of deep gov't insiders has known all about this since the 1950s.
• The nature of the problem may be spiritual, and not physical at all.

Here's an Oct 2010 Coast to Coast interview with George Knapp. It's an excellent introduction:

• http://projectavalon.net/Coast_to_Co...tober_2010.mp3

UFO researcher Nick Redfern joined George Knapp to talk about a secret group within the U.S. government known as the Collins Elite, who believe our purported alien visitors are actually deceptive demonic entities.

Redfern first learned of the group’s existence through Ray Boeche, an Anglican priest, and former director of Nebraska’s MUFON. Boeche said back in 1991 he met with two men from the Defense Dept. who told him about a secret project to contact NHE’s (non-human entities).

They showed him photographs of people who allegedly died during experiments while contacting the NHEs, and contended that the beings they communicated with were simply masquerading as ETs.

Eventually, Redfern interviewed a man in his 80s named Richard Duke, who claimed to be a member of the Collins Elite up until 1960, and recalled many specific details about the group. The group took its inspiration from occultist Aleister Crowley’s ritual in which he reportedly made contact with an interdimensional entity named Lam.

Later, in the 1940s, rocket scientist Jack Parsons engaged in similar experiments trying to invoke a being, and subsequent UFO sightings may have been enabled through his opening of a portal, the group believed.

According to Duke, the Collins Elite also suspected that various contactees in the 1950s, such as George Hunt Williamson, who used a Oujia board for ET communications, were experiencing demonic deceptions.

In the 1960s, the Collins Elite examined a number of NDE reports, such as one in which deceased humans moved through a hellish landscape as a UFO-type craft hovered overhead, extracting their souls with a ball of light, Redfern detailed. “They eventually came to the conclusion…that the human soul possesses some sort of energy, which these entities can use as sustenance…In other words, they’re harvesting human souls,” he said, adding that the group believed that a strong religious viewpoint, such as Christian fundamentalism could keep the demonic entities at bay.

Linda Howe (with John Burroughs) talked with Nick Redfern and Ray Boeche about the Collins Elite just a couple of weeks ago, on 12 June 2017. This would be the follow-up interview to listen to:

• http://kgraradioarchives.com/Shows/p...%20Redfern.mp3

And there's a great deal more, but I'll leave it at that right now. (Search for 'Collins Elite', and you'll find a lot.)

Recommended, and all my Spidey Senses tells me that there's something very important to this story.

[Chester]

Forgive me that I must make this post this way but.... I have an interesting story directly related to "this." (The Collins Elite and Nick Redfern). I must get back to Dallas to do so and hope that I am able to share my post sometime this coming weekend.

[Justplain]

The point that many researchers make is that many of ufo's are not inter-stellar, but are inter-dimensional, which would tie in to the 'demonic' nature associated with many of them. I know that my own ufo sighting was initiated by a blood curdling series of screams in the woods, very creepy. It wouldnt surprise me if those aliens were demonic. Always a good thing to remember when dealing with the ufo, or paranormal, phenomena, that it can be very negative in nature.

That being said, i personally believe that there are positive aliens, both inter-stellar and inter-dimensional, its just being very cautious when confirming their true nature.

[Kano]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
the group believed that a strong religious viewpoint, such as Christian fundamentalism could keep the demonic entities at bay.

I believe this is an accurate statement and wanted to call attention to it specifically. I am by no means thumping a Bible by bringing light to this although I do identify as a Christian.

Through my research into the topic of demons masquerading as aliens or ET, I do believe there is a large faction of these demons, or as the Nag Hamadi calls them, Archons, in league with humans in power positions. These same humans are none the wiser. But what I found very interesting, and a common thread in my research, was that in fact using the name of Jesus Christ, wielding a crucifix, and blessing oneself with holy water (to name a few), would in fact keep these demonic entities at bay and most every time they would go away. Anyway, I thought it was interesting and recognize there are many ways one can protect himself/herself spiritually.

[Hervé]

I recall reading a while back about a young'un meeting with "red diablos" in his dreams who were telling him they were about to invade earth, etc., and asking an old shaman about it... and the shaman's answer: "Oh, they always say that..."

Here is a variation on that theme from here (<---):

I first read about Reptilian Intelligence in ‘The Way of The Shaman’ by Michael Harner way back in the early 90s. In the opening chapter, he recounts an ayahuasca experience in which he travels to the edge of the Universe and meets some winged reptilian creatures who offer him power and control of the whole world. On recounting this to his shaman teacher, the old man chuckles and replies ‘Oh, they always say that. Take no notice of them.’

This, of course, ties in with the conclusion many a researcher came to envisage:

Posted by Hervé (here)

When did disclosure morph into an 'expand my consciousness' movement?

I am not sure as to the "when," but it may be because many a researcher, like Jacques Vallée, came to the conclusion that many of the reported UFO phenomena were indistinguishable from psychic phenomena?

Or is it because these two fields have been amalgamated to confuse everyone?

Because, if a "Third Man in a Room" can be made to "disappear," or a stage hypnotist subject can gain weight on a diet of "imaginary" food... or when half of a group of people can see a UFO where the other half cannot see nothing... the battle is of the mind and its control and the two fields become confused.

As in: a real nuts and bolts aircraft can be made to be "not seen" - or barely there - by influencing the witnesses minds, so can "imaginary" fleets of crafts be made "Oh, so real" by influencing the non-witnesses' minds... the former for cover ups, the latter for misdirections and muddying the researches...

See?

Is one to conclude "They have said that..." for 1000s and 1000s of years?

[Bob]

I had a discussion in person (physically face to face) in the early 1980's with a researcher who was highly respected, noteworthy and quite sincere, having had first hand contact with J. Allen Hynek. Dr. Josef Allen Hynek was an American astronomer, professor, and ufologist. He is perhaps best remembered for his UFO research.

This researcher was told by Hynek about the "dark side", or the demonic side, contrary to Greer's 'love and light candy' approach to ET's. Hynek relayed that the "phenomenon" was 3 fold - spiritual (demonic or angelic-like), physical ET's, and "unexplained". The 4th category was human development of captured crafts, or earth-developed. Hynek didn't clarify if inner-earth or moon-based or other planet solar system based was the case.

There was a brief discussion about "soul harvesting" in the spheroid craft.. Consider a human with a body is a formidable opponent. A soul captured and stored in ROM (read only memory), is a valuable tradeable commodity. Consider some of the "demonic" ET's to be soul harvesters 'profiting' for trade of "souls with unique experiences"..

I found the discussion interesting. It certainly won't stop me from heading back to the Roswell area (see my other posts about that in Disclosure), specifically around Dexter to see what I can 'dig' up . Thanks for the thread Bill.

[7alon]

There is something important about this subject. I think it is closely related to the topic of some ETs worshipping these negative entities. There are different types of these beings.. such as skinwalkers, who project images of themselves in human form as well as other things. They can make you see bad stuff.

[CurEus]

I tend to view things along the lines with everyone who has posted so far in this thread. There are a variety of entities and forms of contact from many types of places. It seems disheartening that we really have very little control over ourselves or any of these creatures. I expert there are some lovely, friendly and inspiring types....but it seems the negative far outweigh the positive encounters.

LA MArxulli believes ALL aliens are demons. Greer thinks they are all Mary Poppins........*sighs*

The olde religions and new are quite clear about the dangers of some entities. We seem to be hardwired to terror when some specific types appear. Especially reptilians for some reason.
ANYTHING that requires blood sacrifice, pledging your soul, hurting others or other rather "obvious" warning signs seems intuitively negative to me. These creatures must have loved the Aztec empire....total bloodbath of ritual sacrifice daily. Which is akin to our ongoing "Wars"

Negative Aliens/demons probably know it will be a bloody bloody day if we ever manage to develop enough to defend ourselves. We are also hardwired for extreme aggression and retribution...the "good" creatures probably hope we can tell the good from the bad before we go on an intergalactic fear based pogrom of total annihilation.

We'd do it too! We'd d obliterate everything that scared us. Doesn't take much t whip us up into a frenzy.

[Noelle]

While listening to the Knapp interview, the "astral wind" popped into my mind. Maybe some Avalonians have experienced it while dreaming/lucid dreaming or while having an out of body or near death experience. The best way to describe it is it's like a tornado or, better yet, a powerful vacuum cleaner that sucks the energy body from behind, pulling it out from whatever it was experiencing and into who knows where. It does sound something like a gust of wind.

I have experienced it three or four times while lucid dreaming or out of body. It's frequently talked about in astral travel circles, including possible "beneficial" reasons for it. Robert Bruce talks about it in his "Astral Dynamics." Many who have experienced it do not perceive it as something terrible, but some do. Every time that I have experienced it, I felt dread and always thought, "Here I go again." There was no stopping it.

Could it be that the astral wind is related to soul harvesting? Could it be feeding off our souls while we are still alive or embodied?

[Chuck]

Coming face to face with a potential reality of us being 'farmed creatures' is disconcerting at the best of times ... ahem. Nevertheless, thanks for the reminder to consider/contemplate it as a potential so as to formulate plans/hope for escape, if true.

Indeed what would you say to a steer (who by his own nature is already diminished ) about the beef industry? Would you rather him live the rest of his life in ignorant bliss? or inform him? Tough call. There is a saying "the truth will set you free". Maybe so but it can also turn one into a brooding recluse...

However, I am somewhat heartened to know that there are those in the DoD who have also considered us as 'farmed creatures' as a reality... Sobering however that they, with all their vast resources, haven't figured out escape either. No wonder that they're not known for their parties.

Perhaps that's just it. There is no escape. Rather we are here in this matrix, light bubble, simulation as it were, as a training ground for our soul. And Satan, the Lord of Light is our prison warden.

Makes one wonder about the nature of light... and the nature of matter and antimatter ... of forward time and backward time... of sleep and awake ... and of souls caught in the charades.

[6Denno]

I agree, there's something very important about this story. It kind of resonates with how the internet was made, the military is always investing trillions in experiments and projects, just as long as they think it will be effective as a weapon. They may be onto something greater than they think. I'm thinking, if its possible to make contact with demonic entities, then it must also be possible to be in contact with angelic entities, or phosters.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Bob (here)
This researcher was told by Hynek about the "dark side", or the demonic side, contrary to Greer's 'love and light candy' approach to ET's. Hynek relayed that the "phenomenon" was 3 fold - spiritual (demonic or angelic-like), physical ET's, and "unexplained". The 4th category was human development of captured crafts, or earth-developed.

Yes, that's a good brief summary. I'd personally agree with that. ETs are not all 'demonic', I'd be sure. But there may well be an unsavory and spiritually dangerous aspect to the whole phenomenon, yes.

[Bruno]

While I personally agree with the spiritual/inter-dimensional/demonic aspect of the ET phenomenon discussed in this thread, I disagree with the idea that invoking Jesus has any power in such situations. In my personal experience praying or calling on Jesus has had mixed results and is likely as helpful as calling on the spirit of "Thor" or "Wonder Woman". I feel they find our religious ideas amusing at best.

[Callista]

I cant understand why a theologian has not heard of the Archons. The Nag Hammadi texts explain the Archons quite specifically, together with their effect on humanity.

[LadyKitt]

Posted by Callista (here)
I cant understand why a theologian has not heard of the Archons. The Nag Hammadi texts explain the Archons quite specifically, together with their effect on humanity.

Hi Callista,

Michael S. Heiser, a renowned biblical scholar, has addressed many topics in the paranormal/ufo/metaphysical realms. I've not read any of his books, but I have listened to several of his lectures, which offer an interesting 'crossover' view, if I may characterize it so for lack of a better term.

Kitt

[Callista]

Thank you Kitt (great to have you on Avalon!) - I will take a look at his work

[Noelle]

Posted by Bruno (here)
While I personally agree with the spiritual/inter-dimensional/demonic aspect of the ET phenomenon discussed in this thread, I disagree with the idea that invoking Jesus has any power in such situations. In my personal experience praying or calling on Jesus has had mixed results and is likely as helpful as calling on the spirit of "Thor" or "Wonder Woman". I feel they find our religious ideas amusing at best.

As I remember, at the end of the audio, he says it may have nothing to do with Jesus coming to the rescue; rather, it's our own mind/conscious exerting power while invoking the word "Jesus."

[Bill Ryan]

There's a huge repository of very interesting linked information, here:

• https://reddit.com/r/worldpolitics/c...evenda/ddc4c3a

1. (a) Don Ecker interviews author Nick Redfern about "FINAL EVENTS and the Secret Government Group on Demonic UFOs and the Afterlife" on Dark Matters Radio, 20 September 2010: https://web.archive.org/web/20120502...0/dmr-38-m.mp3
   Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20110822...wlist/dmr2.htm (2010, Monday, Week 38)
   "FINAL EVENTS: UFOs, Demons and the Government": http://eventsfinal.blogspot.com
   (b) "Demons and the Defense Department" by Nick Redfern, published on 4 June 2015: http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2015/0...se-department/
   (c) "Demons, Djinn and UFOs" by Nick Redfern, published on 11 April 2014: http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2014/04/demons-djinn-and-ufos
2. On the 3 October 2010 episode of The Paracast show Gene Steinberg (host) and Christopher O'Brien (co-host) interview author Nick Redfern about "FINAL EVENTS and the Secret Government Group on Demonic UFOs and the Afterlife": http://www.theparacast.com/podcast/now-playing-october-3-2010-—-co-host-christopher-obrien-with-nicholas-redfern/
   MP3: http://www.theparacast.com/podcasts/paracast_101003.mp3
3. On the 1 December 2016 episode ("Peter Levenda: Sekret Machines") of UFO modPod Jason McClellan interviews Peter Levenda: http://rogueplanet.tv/peter-levenda-...machines/33493 or http://www.stitcher.com/podcast/rogu...hines-48409433
   Audio file: http://traffic.libsyn.com/ufomodpod/UmP_15.mp3
   UFO modPod: http://rogueplanet.tv/ufomodpod-a-ufo-podcast or http://www.stitcher.com/podcast/rogue-planet/ufo-modpod
4. (a) Doctor Future (Dr. Future), host of the Future Quake radio program, interviews Raymond W. Boeche -- "A Prominent Investigator And Pastor's Evidence of Direct Government Involvement in the Occult" -- on 31 May 2010, 1 June 2010, 2 June 2010, and 4 June 2010: http://www.futurequake.com/Audio/FQShow211.mp3
   Source: "31 May - 4 June 10" at http://www.futurequake.com/FQ_PastShows.htm
   Show description: http://www.futurequake.com/PressRele...Y-4JUNE10.docx
   "UFOs Caught in a Web of Deception" by Raymond W. Boeche, "This paper was originally presented at the Gulf Breeze UFO Conference, Gulf Breeze Florida, February 12, 1994" in the United States of America (USA): https://www.academia.edu/11583866/UF...b_of_Deception or https://web.archive.org/web/20120626...ke.com/MIB.pdf
   Raymond W. Boeche: http://independent.academia.edu/RayBoeche
   (b) Doctor Future (Dr. Future), host of the Future Quake radio program, interviews Linda Moulton Howe -- "The Message and Motives Behind Entities Observed To Be In Contact With This World" -- on 15 June 2009, 16 June 2009, 17 June 2009, 18 June 2009, and 19 June 2009: http://www.futurequake.com/Audio/FQShow161.mp3
   Source: "15 - 19 June 09" at http://www.futurequake.com/FQ_PastShows.htm
   Show description: http://www.futurequake.com/PressRele...5-19JUNE09.doc
   (c) Phenomenon Radio hosted by John Burroughs and Linda Moulton Howe, 8 June 2017, an interview with Raymond W. Boeche and Nick Redfern: http://kgraradioarchives.com/Shows/p...%20Redfern.mp3
   Source: http://kgraradioarchives.com/shows/p...adio/?loc=2017 via http://kgraradioarchives.com/shows/phenomenon-radio
   See also: http://www.phenomenonradio.com/earthfiles via http://www.phenomenonradio.com
5. "The Death Of Physical Mediumship As We Know It?" by Sue Farrow, published in Psychic News - January 2015, Issue No. 4123: http://www.psychicnews.org.uk/articl...-as-we-know-it
6. The abduction of a "25-year-old farmer named Adelino Roque" on 20 April 1969 in Itauçu, Goiás, Brasil
   "Another Teleportation And Its Sequel" by Gordon Creighton, published in the September/October 1971 (Volume 17, Number 5) issue of Flying Saucer Review (FSR): https://web.archive.org/web/20120627201054/www.ignaciodarnaude.com/ufologia/FSR 1971 V 17 N 5.pdf
7. The abudction of 24-year-old José Antônio da Silva on 4 May 1969 in Bebedouro, Minas Gerais, Brasil
   (a) "Abduction At Bebedouro" by Húlvio Brant Aleixo, published in the November/December 1973 (Volume 19, Number 6) issue of Flying Saucer Review (FSR): https://web.archive.org/web/20120626182006/www.ignaciodarnaude.com/ufologia/FSR 1973 V 19 N 6.pdf
   "Bebedouro II: The Little Men Return For The Soldier" by Húlvio Brant Aleixo, published in the November 1975 (Volume 21, Number 3 and Number 4) issue of Flying Saucer Review (FSR): https://web.archive.org/web/20120625230137/www.ignaciodarnaude.com/ufologia/FSR 1975 V 21 N 3-4.pdf
   (b) "O Caso de Bebedouro (MG)" by Sociedade Brasileira de Estudos de Discos Voadores (SBEDV), published on 15 June 2016: http://www.fenomenum.com.br/ufo/casu...1960/bebedouro
   English translation via Google Translate: https://translate.google.com/transla...1960/bebedouro
   - http://www.fenomenum.com.br/ufo/down...EDV/B94_98.pdf and http://www.fenomenum.com.br/ufo/down...V_ESP_1975.pdf
   Source: http://www.fenomenum.com.br/ufo/downloads/sbedv
8. The abduction of Onilson Pátero on 22 May 1973 and 26 April 1974 in the State of São Paulo, Brasil
   (a) "Caso Onilson Pátero: Um dos mais importantes casos de abdução da Ufologia Brasileira envolveu o comerciante Onilson Pátero, que em duas ocasiões foi abduzido. Na segunda vez, ele foi deixado a 300 quilômetros do local do sequestro." by Sociedade Brasileira de Estudos de Discos Voadores (SBEDV), published on 15 June 2016: http://www.fenomenum.com.br/ufo/casuistica/1970/patero
   English translation via Google Translate: https://translate.google.com/transla...ca/1970/patero
   - Boletim da Sociedade Brasileira de Estudos de Discos Voadores: http://www.fenomenum.com.br/ufo/downloads/sbedv
   (b) "The Car That Turned Transparent" by Gordon Creighton, published in the November 1975 (Volume 21, Number 3 and Number 4) issue of Flying Saucer Review (FSR): https://web.archive.org/web/20120625230137/www.ignaciodarnaude.com/ufologia/FSR 1975 V 21 N 3-4.pdf
   (c) "Close Encounter In Brazil" by Aerial Phenomena Research Organization (APRO), published in the May/June 1973 (Volume 12, Number 6) issue of The A.P.R.O. Bulletin: http://www.afu.se/Downloads/Magazine...n_May-June.pdf
   "Follow-up" by Aerial Phenomena Research Organization (APRO), published in the July/August 1973 (Volume 22, Number 1) issue of The A.P.R.O. Bulletin: http://www.afu.se/Downloads/Magazine...uly-August.pdf
9. The abduction of Antônio Alves Ferreira on 4 January 1975 in São Luís, Maranhão, Brasil
   "Caso Antônio Alves Ferreira" by Jackson Luiz Camargo, Portal Fenomenum and Centro de Investigação e Pesquisa Exobiológica (CIPEX), published on 15 June 2016: http://www.fenomenum.com.br/ufo/casuistica/1970/aaf
   English translation via Google Translate: https://translate.google.com/transla...stica/1970/aaf
10. (a) "The Men-In-Black Syndrome...1" by Dr. Berthold Eric Schwarz, published in the January 1978 (Volume 23, Number 4, 1977) issue of Flying Saucer Review (FSR): https://web.archive.org/web/20150322...23%20N%204.pdf
    "The Men-In-Black Syndrome...2" by Dr. Berthold Eric Schwarz, published in the February 1978 (Volume 23, Number 5) issue of Flying Saucer Review: https://web.archive.org/web/20150322...23%20N%205.pdf
    "The Men-In-Black Syndrome...3" by Dr. Berthold Eric Schwarz, published in the April 1978, (Volume 23, Number 6) issue of Flying Saucer Review: https://web.archive.org/web/20150322...23%20N%206.pdf
    (b) "The Car That Disappeared" by Derek James and Jenny Randles, published in the October 1977 (Volume 23, Number 3) issue of Flying Saucer Review (FSR): https://web.archive.org/web/20150322...23%20N%203.pdf
    More details in "A Mundane Case" in the chapter (13) titled "Evidence Of Aliens" in the book "The Truth Behind Men In Black: Government Agents--Or Visitors From Beyond" by Jenny Randles: https://books.google.com/books?id=Jd...ots=4Kz4VnE-b_
    (c) Men In Black / Men-In-Black / MIB: #5a and #5b at https://www.reddit.com/r/worldpoliti...evenda/dbs41gv
    Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/worldpoliti...evenda/d9q9006
    Via: #26 at https://www.reddit.com/r/Missing411/...ore_by/cz3we2z

[Spiral]

Posted by LadyM (here)

Posted by Bruno (here)
While I personally agree with the spiritual/inter-dimensional/demonic aspect of the ET phenomenon discussed in this thread, I disagree with the idea that invoking Jesus has any power in such situations. In my personal experience praying or calling on Jesus has had mixed results and is likely as helpful as calling on the spirit of "Thor" or "Wonder Woman". I feel they find our religious ideas amusing at best.

As I remember, at the end of the audio, he says it may have nothing to do with Jesus coming to the rescue; rather, it's our own mind/conscious exerting power while invoking the word "Jesus."

This is the theory that people who have no direct experience like to push, however those who have found it to work are not of that opinion, its not the word or the mind, & in reality its highly unlikely that any opertunity to do so during an abduction would arise anyway.

Just to be clear, calling out "Jesus" will do nothing if the person has not renounced other connections & oaths, and made a clear & powerful connection to Christ in their own heart....in otherwords, if the person "belongs" to Christ, the "aliens" have no "right" to take that person.

There will be some pact, oath or contract made by the adbuctee that allows it to happen, they can of course be tricked into this as the "aliens" love deciet, and you can also be "sold" into a contract by those who claim to rule you.

[Foxie Loxie]

@Callista....The mainline denominations & especially the fundamentalist religions do not recognize the Nag Hammadi texts as authoritative as they consider the Bible.
It kind of explains why the NH texts had to be hidden back then! The controlling faction did not want the "truth" available to all! Having come out of that type of background I can verify that thousands still believe the only true authority is The Bible! Thanks to what I found here on Avalon & the mature ones who helped me along here I was able to ferret out a more complete picture of what has been going on over the centuries My thanks to all who contributed to my growth!