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Thread: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

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    Default Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    I am seeking to understand “Gardening” thus the need to address unanswered questions and observation. In doing so I think I may have come into something that most gardeners ignore or have missed. I search the internet and went to forums to find collaboration and gain more knowledge in regards to what I wanted to do. And that’s also the reason I am bringing it up here.
    Observations:
    -When I was a teenage I went with a friend who does a slash and burn type of gardening, where I saw this long patch of sweet potato one portion had leaves that are small and pitted, a clear indication of unhealthy plants the other, smaller portion is the opposite and they are lying side by side. My friend explains that the healthy plants are on the newly opened portion of the garden. Meaning it’s the first planting after they slash the virgin forest. It also indicates that the soil gets diminishing nutrients as they do the gardening and after some years on the same spot the soil gets so depleted that they abandon the garden and open (slash) a new patch in the forest.
    Question:
    Why is it that the forest despite being there for thousands of years never depletes the soil?
    Readings:
    “Abstract. Soil organisms play principal roles in several ecosystem functions, i.e. promoting plant productivity, enhancing water relations, regulating nutrient mineralisation, permitting decomposition, and acting as an environmental buffer. Agricultural soils would more closely resemble soils of natural ecosystems if management practices would reduce or eliminate cultivation, heavy machinery, and general biocides; incorporate perennial crops and organic material; and synchronise nutrient release and water availability with plant demand. In order to achieve these goals, research must be completed to develop methods for successful application of organic materials and associated micro-organisms, synchronisation of management practices with crop and soil biota phenology, and improve our knowledge of the mechanisms linking species to ecosystem processes.”
    http://www.uvm.edu/~dneher/Publicati...stysystems.pdf
    “the mycorrhizal mutualistic association provides the fungus with relatively constant and direct access to carbohydrates, such as glucose and sucrose.[5] The carbohydrates are translocated from their source (usually leaves) to root tissue and on to the plant's fungal partners. In return, the plant gains the benefits of the mycelium's higher absorptive capacity for water and mineral nutrients, partly because of the large surface area of fungal hyphae, which are much longer and finer than plant root hairs, and partly because some such fungi can mobilize soil minerals unavailable to the plants' roots. The effect is thus to improve the plant's mineral absorption capabilities.”
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mycorrhiza
    “Microorganisms are the primary decomposers of raw organic matter. Decomposers consume organic matter, water, and air to recycle raw organic matter into humus, which is rich in readily available plant nutrients.
    Other specialized microorganisms such as nitrogen-fixing bacteria have symbiotic relationships with plants that allow plants to extract this essential
    nutrient. Such "nitrogen-fixing" plants are a major source of soil nitrogen and are essential for soil development over time. Mycorrhizae are fungal complexes that form mutalistic relationships with plant roots. The fungus grows into a plant's root, where the plant provides the fungus with sugar and, in return, the fungus provides the plant root with water and access to nutrients in the soil through its intricate web of hyphae spread throughout the soil matrix. Without microbes, a soil is essentially dead and can be limited in supporting plant growth.
    http://articles.extension.org/pages/...oil-components

    conclusion:
    When man decide to do the gardening the first thing he does is to destroy the soil ecosystem that is suppose to help the plants grow. By removing all the plants in the chosen area.
    Proposed solution: Bit Gardening:
    This is only based on what I have learned so far. I seek suggestion and more info. As theory and practice are two entirely different things.
    The entire concept revolves on 2 main things 1). Least possible disturbance of soil ecosystem. And 2) Quick regeneration of the disturb ecosystem.
    Say we clear a 10 x 10 sq meter for gardening and another 1x1 bit in the middle of a pristine landscape which one do you think will have its natural soil ecosystem back soon?
    Have anyone notice that generally the plants on the edge of the garden are healthier? I did. When we consider that the reestablishment of soil ecosystem will begin from the edge coming from the undisturbed part of the landscape then we see the reason.

    Referring to the drawing.
    The brown line is the foot path. Since we don’t want to clear the landscape its better to put a brown ribbon to identify the foot path. Always step on the brown ribbon. This will prevent compaction of the plant area. The garden beds is of 3 feet wide maybe more depending on the length of the arm so the garden bits is like 1.5 foot by 1.5 foot. and the foot path can be 1.5 foot wide depending on the size of the shoes. I have divided the beds into 4 groups of bits scattered along the beds. The idea is to clear and plant in small patches so that the surrounding undisturbed ecosystem can quickly re-colonize the disturbed patch. Say plant all the red patches first and then go back and plant the green and so on. If the garden is big enough by the time I go back the disturb bit ecosystem is already established.
    The next planting can be done before harvest particularly if you must pull the whole plant. So the soil is always planted. If not then live the old plant and trim it as the new plant grows. soil ecosystem will be disturbed if plant roots are pulled so if possible live it in the soil. Never clear plants unless the bit is going to be planted immediately.


    Some questions:
    - what is the best way to control weeds in this set up.
    -What do I put in the disturb soil to encourage regeneration of ecosystem? Some say crush stone, others say “natural guard”? maybe ocean fertilizer? some sugars perhaps dissolve in water?
    -If its your garden what plants should you place adjacent to each one? Or would you rather have same plants on each bed?
    On what weather is the good time to start planting? Rainy or sunny? Full moon or no moon?
    Most importantly: your suggestions.

    Thanks Julian

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    Last edited by Bubu; 13th September 2017 at 06:29.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Here is another article from Natural news that supports the theory.
    "Plants routinely face a challenge absorbing enough of certain key elements, such as phosphorus, nitrogen, potassium and iron. Fungi don’t face this obstacle; they produce specialized acids and enzymes that break the bonds that bind those nutrients to soil and organic compounds. Although we call this process “decay” and attach a morbid aura to the word, it’s a lively enterprise. Gardeners recognize this decomposition from their compost piles. It’s no surprise that a plant with hundreds, if not thousands, of miles of hyphae working on the plant’s behalf to mine key nutrients and freight them back to the roots is able to grow faster, stay healthier, and ultimately yield more than it would without the fungi’s partnership."

    "At least 90 percent of all plant families are known to partner with mycorrhizal fungi. These associations can be between a single fungus species and a single plant species, but most plants associate with many species of fungi, and vice versa. Mycorrhizae are by no means considered the exception any longer. They rule. Mycorrhizae, not plant roots, are the principal structures for most nutrient uptake in the plant kingdom."

    "How can a gardener take advantage of this symbiotic relationship that plants and fungi have been developing for 400 million years? Microbiologist David Douds of the USDA’s Agricultural Research Service has been studying that question for 35 years. His studies show that fungal inoculants can increase the yields of many vegetable and field crops, including leeks, peppers, potatoes, strawberries, sweet potatoes and tomatoes (see Slideshow).

    Inoculants can give transplants a strong start, but the main key to raising good crops lies in maintaining healthy communities of native mycorrhizal fungi in the ground itself. Douds cautions against heavy or frequent tilling and the use of chemical fertilizers (especially phosphorus) and soil-applied fungicides. These activities break apart, weaken or otherwise suppress beneficial microbes, including fungal mycelia. You can keep your soil in prime condition by minimizing disturbances apart from occasional light tilling, weeding and mulching"

    "An equally important step is to ensure that mycorrhizal fungi survive through winter and early spring. The kinds of mycorrhizal fungi that support many garden crops aren’t capable of living and reproducing independently of their plant partners. In a carefully weeded and fully harvested garden, mycorrhizal fungi numbers can decline for lack of live roots to colonize. Douds advises avoiding empty beds by keeping plants, whether food crops or cover crops growing at all times. "

    more here
    https://www.motherearthnews.com/orga...i-zm0z14aszkin
    Last edited by Bubu; 13th September 2017 at 05:58.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    When I see your diagram I am reminded of the meso-american milpa system. 'The milpa cycle calls for 2 years of cultivation and eight years of letting the area lie fallow.'

    I'm quite sure the soils of the world can recover from their depleted and poisoned conditions if we abandon the petro-chemical model and get back to basics, thereby increasing both yields and nutrition. Restoring diversity to the plant selections also would increase general plant healths and not leave humans vulnerable to mass food shortages when particular strains succumb to pest or other attack.

    Like everything else these days it would seem to work best from the bottom up as its pointless petitioning or hectoring any govt body for change.

    Polyculture Macroscope : Milpa

    Quote “A milpa is a field, usually but not always recently cleared, in which farmers plant a dozen crops at once including maize, avocados, multiple varieties of squash and bean, melon, tomatoes, chilis, sweet potato, jícama, amaranth, and mucana…. Milpa crops are nutritionally and environmentally complementary. Maize lacks the amino acids lysine and tryptophan, which the body needs to make proteins and niacin;…. Beans have both lysine and tryptophan…. Squashes, for their part, provide an array of vitamins; avocados, fats. The milpa, in the estimation of H. Garrison Wilkes, a maize researcher at the University of Massachusetts in Boston, “is one of the most successful human inventions ever created.”
    I can thoroughly recommend Charles C. Mann's 1491 : New Revelations of the Americas Before Colombus even though there are only 5 or 6 pages specifically discussing milpa agriculture there are many other interesting snippets about agriculture in general. The word agriculture in the index has 13 sub-headings covering many pages. Besides all that it is simply a fascinating read from start to finish.

    You can read the books introductory pages here

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Destroying forests to gain some new high-quality soil for gardening is WRONG on many levels and in many ways. As mentioned, forest soil never depletes. That's because of the soil structure, microorganisms, mushrooms, different kind of plants living in the same space and benefiting from each other (unless when we're talking about weeds - those hurt every other plant by taking away its nutrients - but you can cut the weeds and use that plant material as a ground cover, keeping the soil humid and ensuring the best conditions for microorganisms in the top soil to thrive and process the organic matter). You'll always see leaves lying on the ground in forests (ground cover), which slowly turn into humus. Keeping the soil moist is also a requirement for the fungi to grow and form mycorrhizae.

    "Humus significantly influences the bulk density of soil and contributes to moisture and nutrient retention. Soil formation begins with the weathering of humus." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humus
    Humus is very very important. You need to make sure humus stays on the top of the soil. If there is no humus, you can help the soil by adding some compost on top of it, and cover it with some fresh plant matter - grass, leaves. This is also a way to control weed growth - just cover the ground with leaves where you don't want any weeds to grow, and if they do, make sure you get rid of them before they get a chance to make the seeds.
    All the organic matter that you cannot put directly on top of the soil, like leftovers, coffee grounds and everything else, you can put into a compost. It will attract beneficial worms and microorganisms (can also attract other animals). After a year or so, you should get top-quality soil on the bottom of the compost which you can sprinkle around, or even better yet, add it below the ground cover. It will contain a lot of macro and micro nutrients (macro: phosphorus, potassium, nitrogen, micro: iron, manganese, zinc, selenium, magnesium, ...).

    The question of what to put in depleted soil is a more complex one. It depends on type of soil and what nutrients are lacking in the soil right now. Anyway, compost is a great addition, always. Soil needs organic matter and LIFE, like worms, fungi and microorganisms. If the soil is of high quality and contains all of these "ingredients", you don't have to worry too much about restoring the ecosystem, just make sure the soil stays moist with humus and ground cover on the top and don't forget to add organic matter to the soil frequently. The system will restore itself. Soil quality is what you should worry about in my opinion. If there's any ways to restore it much faster, I don't know.

    "Crushed stone" could mean the volcanic ash, for example, rich in micro nutrients, definitely a great addition to any soil. You should also check the soil's pH value - it should not be too alkaline or too acidic, values around pH 7 (neutral) are usually optimal.

    Some plants benefit from other plants like I've mentioned. So it is beneficial to plant them together. Check out this chart:
    http://www.vegetablegardeninglife.co...ng-charts.html

    Also, check out "permaculture" if you haven't heard about it yet. There's some threads about it on this forum, haven't gone through all of them ...
    But one of the most important persons in this field is Sepp Holzer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GMXqgQIU9c
    Learn from nature, that's the key!!

    When to plant? Depends! Plants with fruits above ground should be planted when the moon is "rising" or waxing. Plants wiuth fruits below ground like potatoes should be planted when moon is waning. I usually plant one day before rain comes (but the seeds need sun as well, so don't plant if you know there will be 2 weeks of rain).

    I'd love to come to Philippines and help you personally :D

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    I like to compliment my plantings in order to sustain the soil. I plant the "Three Sisters" of corn, squash and beans together as the plants feed each other, therefore take less from the soil. Also rotating crops help.

    I also feed the soil in the fall with a beer, sugar and compost mixture to foster organism growth over the winter. It works well on a microcosm level.
    When in doubt, do the next right thing.
    My blog: http://grayseconomy.com

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    I'm into organic soil rejuvenation past 10 years. I've worked with sand and dust and clay soils that have barely any nutrients after 100 years of tobacco and cotton farming where they sprayed chemicals for the pests. I use a silt, sand, pebble, rock, and paper filter on the natural draining of run off into my garden. Little rows that fill with water and hydrate the roots.
    I have a natural mixture of compost that transforms these rotten little growth soils into healthy black good smelling nutriented soil in one or two seasons and you can grow while you treat the soil. I recommend covering your greens from the butterflies after pollination season has passed in spring or they will lay eggs in the softest parts of the plants. I call this "arch growing." Bamboo thin poles shoved into the ground and arched to the other side of the plant row, then covered with plastic and a few rocks to hold the plastic down while protecting the plants from pests. On rainy days, just flip the plastic over and put the rocks on it for after the soaking rain. I'd give you my soil rejuvenation recipe, but I'm about to launch next year on some family property. I'll be bagging it up for a reasonable price to repair the farms damaged by MonsterSatan round-up/run-down chemicals.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Well since you are sharing your recipe, I'll share mine here for the members that can keep their mouth closed and not spoil my business projection. Banana peels, used coffee grounds and any and all veggie scraps, added to mulch, sand or clay or dusty soil.
    Turn in fall after stocking from the harvest/prep/scraps. January run a few wooden poles in the pile to loosen and aerate. In March when the suns coming in, turn it with a shovel and pitchfork for the sun to do it's deterioration naturally. By planting time, take a wheel barrel full on a 50ft square plot and till it, then plant. I even get the different colored red and white mushrooms from the health of it.
    Good planting the fruits of this labor has earned me many praises going organic. Just a few days ago, my Son who's been a vegetarian for years picked up one of the smaller tomatoes on the way to the laundry room. He came back chewing saying: "Mom, Mom this is a great tomatoe. This is a real tomatoe taste and juicy. My string beans are sweet right off the vines. Sun flowers grow to giant heights and multiple heads.(plate sized heads of seeds.)

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Exactly. Well put in those scientific terms. I just knew it was right by "white fuzzy moist roots on the trans plant to the garden from my green house. I keep some compost inside for seedlings.
    I pulled some string beans for freezer prep and found a few overripe with beans inside. I stripped them, and put them in a "open plastic bag." Well 36 hours went by before I got back to them and there they were at least a dozen already rooting and waiting for soil. I put them on the back porch in the compost/rejuvenated soil and voila, bean plants with leaves in 2 more days. Amazing.
    Last edited by Lifebringer; 13th September 2017 at 12:27.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Sometimes seeds from my crop end up with the veggie scraps stay dorment until the sun warms them in January -March pre-spring sun warms the compost. (mulch holds heat and so do the decomposing process. Energy at the bottom:-) brings life energy to the top. I've loved the bean, tomatoe and melon yields. I've shared with neighbors jualapenos, tomatoes, cucumbers, beans and I've save Avacado pits and have a dozen trees. Looks like my orchards when I start the youth camp, will be pretty good for yields with Citrus, Orange, Grapefruit, Lime, Lemon , apple trees as well as a good knowledge of soils to teach these children how to survive the future while repairing and rebuilding without stress or hunger. Generator or solar elect to keep the freezer on and foods fresh frozen and good for the body. NWO is breaking the body down, WE have to incorporate top rate affordable foods to build our bodies and rid ourselves of the chemical imbalance diseases.
    Ever wonder why we only recieve 2% of the daily allowance/corporate industry recommended allowance? Should we pay them 2% of the price for the junk they push?
    Hee, hee, we pay 100% dollars for 2% of what we need in our bodies?
    Does that make sen$e to Gen X,Y,or Z?
    NOPE!!!
    Much smarter than that we want quality affordable and we're gonna do it if we have to barter with local businesses in exchange for food.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Wow thanks a lot to everyone. Didnt expect to get far more jewels of knowledge here than that of gardening forums. Well gardening forums is suppose to be full of gardener members. But then just remember most of them just follow with the norms.

    Hi Ewan thanks for the book. This are the kinds that we should preserve and definitely what i am looking for. These are also the kinds that big business wants to hide from us to continue our dependence on them.

    Hi Bluemoon, you pointed out some very important pointers, yes covering the ground is of utmost importance. I'm currently constructing my mulch machine.
    I'd love to have a good tutor around

    Thanks mgray, I will definitely have the 3 sisters on my garden. I presume the soil microorganism will have a nice time overwintering with some beer,

    Hi Lifebringer, thanks for sharing your recipe. By coffee grounds you mean the coffee peel? although I my concept is to use whatever is available in the vicinity and coffee grounds may not. Any substitute recommendation.
    Last edited by Bubu; 13th September 2017 at 16:27.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    I have one more question. does GMO seed revert back to original? Since I am starting I anticipated that it would be difficult for me to get original seeds since most of the farmers here just buy seeds from the agriculture supply. and most of them are classified F1 i just dont trust anything in packaging.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Coffee grounds are what's left over when you make coffee. The brown "powder".
    Gmo seeds will not revert back to the original, try to find some old people, planting food for themselves in their gardens.

    I'm coming to visit you if I get some unexpected money coming my way ... Or when I get some good steady income. I would visit your country already if I could afford it but I'm positive I'll do it sometime in the future

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Quote Posted by BlueMoon (here)
    Coffee grounds are what's left over when you make coffee. The brown "powder".
    Gmo seeds will not revert back to the original, try to find some old people, planting food for themselves in their gardens.

    I'm coming to visit you if I get some unexpected money coming my way ... Or when I get some good steady income. I would visit your country already if I could afford it but I'm positive I'll do it sometime in the future
    I wonder what is it in the coffee grounds that is useful perhaps I can find some substitute lest I will force to drink lots of coffee I wonder if cococoir or cocopeat will work. Yeah that is also what I am planning, to seek for gardeners that has native seeds.
    Looking forward to hosting you

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Coffee grounds have lots of nitrogen. Very important for all plants. You can just ask people to give it to you, for most people it is basically worthless trash. You can even go to bars and restaurants, they have loads of coffee grounds. I'm sure some of them could agree to give it to you (for free).
    Very good addition to your compost as well. Cococoir and cocopeat contain almost 0 nitrogen. They can contain lots of moisture, I think that's their primary use.

    I just need an idea how to monetize my knowledge, then I'm coming to help you with your gardens :D

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Milpa system 2 years gardening and then rest 8 years. Is just about what slash and burn farmers here do. of course it is understandable that if you destroy the soil ecosystem that converts minerals into bio available nutrients for plants, mineral conversion will stop and the reserves will not be replenish. And with the harvesting system technique especially with seasonal crops, its like destroying the reestablishing ecosystem every harvest time. The method I am proposing is to not destroy the whole garden ecosystem at all but rather only small parts so that it can heal quickly. Its like small wounds heal quickly. And it is to be done only when soil is compacted and needs cultivating otherwise there is no need to disturb the ecosystem just plant in between weeds and progressively eradicate the weeds as the plant grows. weeds are host to soil ecosystem as well and we want to preserve it as the new host our veggies takes its place.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Quote Posted by Bubu (here)
    Milpa system 2 years gardening and then rest 8 years. Is just about what slash and burn farmers here do. of course it is understandable that if you destroy the soil ecosystem that converts minerals into bio available nutrients for plants, mineral conversion will stop and the reserves will not be replenish. And with the harvesting system technique especially with seasonal crops, its like destroying the reestablishing ecosystem every harvest time. The method I am proposing is to not destroy the whole garden ecosystem at all but rather only small parts so that it can heal quickly. Its like small wounds heal quickly. And it is to be done only when soil is compacted and needs cultivating otherwise there is no need to disturb the ecosystem just plant in between weeds and progressively eradicate the weeds as the plant grows. weeds are host to soil ecosystem as well and we want to preserve it as the new host our veggies takes its place.
    I rather think that is the 'official' explanation for Milpa. Perhaps one that needs to be taken with a pinch of salt, for if the combination of plants assist each other then the soils cannot be really depleted, esp with a program of composting/feeding. Without going through the whole book to hunt for it I remember one reference to a Milpa area that had been farmed continually for decades.

    Aside that, if one can grow all they need from 1 acre and owns 5 or 6 then rotational farming ensures prisitne soils always available. The 'slash and burn' methodology is an ignorant and unsustainable solution imo.

    Check out Sepp Holzer also.



    https://www.amazon.com/Sepp-Holzers-.../dp/160358370X

    http://www.seppholzer.at/cms/index.php?id=5

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    Holzer is definitely a rebel farmer, on the permaculture path where so many of us end up after going broke playing around with buying soil additives.

    Slash and burn is not sustainable but is an occasionally natural event. Certain weeds and fungal species will only grow after a burn. After mt St. Helens popped off, people were picking literally truckloads of morel mushrooms.

    To replenish the soil and grow nutrient dense food, replicate the growth patterns of the forest. Nature is the teacher here. Look at the layers of a forest. Also in permaculture production-based growing "beds" are sculpted intentionally with the contours of the land, so I naturally don't have to do any acrobatics.

    The paddock shift system works wonderfully for animals by the way.

    Check these.




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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    thanks Joe,
    yes food forest should be the ultimate goal since with perennials and fruit tress there is no need to disturb the soil ecosystem every harvest time,, Along with the benefit of less work. The problem comes when we want to grow seasonal plants and that is where bit gardening comes in. An old farmer once told me that "when calamity strikes plant the fastest crop first". I dont see much problem in creating a food forest it just needs time. I have created a mini food forest at the back of our previous place by simply throwing the seeds. well, actually a papaya forest; Haha. with me throwing hundreds of papaya seeds everyday along with other fruit seeds. I may be wrong but I think creating a food forest is as simple as replacing the old forest with food plants progressively. Plant something remove something until the whole place is planted with food plants. Strickly No chemicals it will kill the ecosystem.

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    Default Re: Bit Gardening; a new concept in dirt gardening

    I was able to listen to video only now as my speaker broke the other day. It appears that he is starting from an almost bare land. And is mimicking "ecological succession" in creating a food forest. Any barren land will soon be colonize by a certain type of small grass then herbs then bushes and tress each smaller specie of plant seems to serve as a host to bigger ones.

    "Ecological succession is the process of change in the species structure of an ecological community over time. The time scale can be decades (for example, after a wildfire), or even millions of years after a mass extinction.[1]

    The community begins with relatively few pioneering plants and animals and develops through increasing complexity until it becomes stable or self-perpetuating as a climax community. The ʺengineʺ of succession, the cause of ecosystem change, is the impact of established species upon their own environments. A consequence of living is the sometimes subtle and sometimes overt alteration of one's own environment.[2]

    It is a phenomenon or process by which an ecological community undergoes more or less orderly and predictable changes following a disturbance or the initial colonization of a new habitat. Succession may be initiated either by formation of new, unoccupied habitat, such as from a lava flow or a severe landslide, or by some form of disturbance of a community, such as from a fire, severe windthrow, or logging. Succession that begins in new habitats, uninfluenced by pre-existing communities is called primary succession, whereas succession that follows disruption of a pre-existing community is called secondary succession.

    Succession was among the first theories advanced in ecology. The study of succession remains at the core of ecological science. Ecological succession was first documented in the Indiana Dunes of Northwest Indiana[3] which led to efforts to preserve the Indiana Dunes.[3][4] Exhibits on ecological succession are displayed in the Hour Glass, a museum in Ogden Dunes.[5]"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecological_succession
    Last edited by Bubu; 18th September 2017 at 19:49.

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