Interview transcript - Part 2
This page is a reformatted version of the original Project Camelot publication.
Bob Dean: An Officer and a Gentleman
A video interview with Retired
Command Sergeant Major Robert Dean
Phoenix, Arizona, May 2007
Shot, edited and directed by Kerry Cassidy and Bill Ryan
Start of interview
The sheer anger that I felt over what the government was doing to people to keep the lid on this - it violated every concept of my whole idea of life and honor and democracy and fairness and decency. And then I began to realize that the government we think we've got is not the government we have.
And I said this publicly to people in conferences. I said, "You people out there blithely think you live in a democratic republic... well, you don't." And then what's all come out over the years - the shadow government - we don't know who they are. We have no idea. We have an inkling of who they might be.
But these guys are unelected. They are not... they are not responsible, they don't have any responsibility to congress, to the people, to the country... to anything. And they're running the damn program. And that drives me up the wall! I could almost kill... my sense of anger is so deep over that... that these self-appointed so-called experts that are running this program and keeping this... the greatest story in human history from people. The people have a right to know.
And let me tell you why I say that. I shared this with Bill: I have always believed that if this were to come out - totally - as big as it is, as dynamite as it is, that it would bring about an expansion of consciousness in people. That we would stop thinking of ourselves as Muslim, Christian, Jew, whatever... we would think of ourselves as human beings from one little, tiny planet on the edge of a middle-class, mid-sized galaxy. And that knowledge in itself would bring us together as a species and as a race. And I thought, "That is our survival." If we can bring ourselves together and think of ourselves as 'one race, one people,' this knowledge that we're not alone and we've never been alone I think would do that. (sighs)
Kerry Cassidy: So...
Bob Dean: But the story is so big, honey. Let me tell you something else. Over the years I've learned... what I learned in 1967 was nothing compared to what I've learned since. Over the years, digging in, talking to people... talking to people in high positions... people who would - you know - sit at a conference and say, "Hey, let's sit down and talk. Let me tell you what I just learned... " I've almost come to the conclusion that the story is so damned big that the government may be right: that the mass of people can't deal with it.
How do you tell people that this species, this race that we're all a part of... is a hybrid race? That we were genetically created by an extraterrestrial intelligence... how do you tell them that? Ha... carefully! You look around and you tell them carefully, depending on where you are. Now if you're in Baghdad, talking to some Sunnis or Shia, you don't even bring the damned subject up. How do you tell them that every major religion on the planet has been initiated and orchestrated by extraterrestrial intelligence? How do you tell Christian fundamentalists that that lovely man from Galilee two thousand years ago was a part of that program? You don't tell them that, unless you've checked the exits and know how the hell you can run and get out of the house!
KC: OK, well...
BD: You don't bring these subjects up. How do you tell them, for example, that this contact and these abductions is... the genetic program is still underway?! That these people that are pulled out of their bedrooms and their automobiles at night, and are examined and samples taken and all... and it is shocking to them... and it is frightening to them... and it's harrowing to them. When they finally have to confront it, and maybe through hypnotic regression, they have to deal with it... how do you tell them that that's part of the ongoing genetic development program?
KC: But how do you not tell them, when they're in the millions, you know? When there's so many of them out there, right now, that are just as aware as you are... and as I am, and Bill... you know, and Marcia, I mean...
We are not in the minority as much as we think we are. And that's the interesting problem, is that the government and what they've planned to do all those years back when they were running the country (which they're not any more)... you know, wasn't the best decision they made back then. And now, it's the worst thing to keep the secret going. And you obviously believe that it's still important to wake people up.
BD: I still believe that there are...
KC: Because you're here today.
BD: ...great masses of people out there who can deal with it. You didn't fall to the floor sobbing when I just told you that this is a fact. This is not just my idea... these are facts that I have verification for.
BD: You see, I know that... I've talked to people on the inside. I've had people come and share with me, who are on the inside.
KC: I bet... I bet.
BD: ... And say, "Let me tell you... " I've had military officers share with me, "I had men working for me," he said. Over in... outside of Las Vegas, "that when they were confronted with this, I had grown men with combat experience who broke down and cried like babies." He says, "They can't deal with it. I've had to send these men off to another assignment somewhere." They couldn't deal with it. They came face-to-face with an alien and broke down and cried like babies. Now... you say you can deal with this, right?
KC: Okay, but... these are people that have all... have bought into a certain mindset that a lot of people on the outside - and I mean the civilians - never bought into anyway. I mean it just depends who you're talking to, but you and I know that we're in a world that is... is changing faster than anyone could even think.
BD: You're in a world that isn't at all what you think it is.
KC: Exactly. So...
BD: As I have said, many times: you are living at the moment inside of, part of, one of the galaxy's finest, ripest, zoological gardens. And if you think I just told you you live in a zoo... you do live in a zoo! Now, I don't know how this deals with your sense of ego and your self-respect, and who you think of yourself... you are. But you are an animal, living in a zoo.
Now, how does a mass of people, confronted with this reality, going to deal with this? You're unusually enlightened and bright on this subject, because I think you have informed yourself.
KC: Of course.
BD: You purposefully made... tried to learn what it was all about.
KC: That's right.
BD: So, you've taken little bits and pieces of this and have absorbed them and digested them, and chewed them and masticated them, little bits and pieces at a time. So you have a pretty good smart there about what's really happening. And you're still walking around, like a normal human being!
BD: But you're an exception. You know, you're... I saw an audience filled with people like you when I spoke the last time at my last presentation. And I was speaking to the... I was, what do they call it... singing to the choir?
BD: Yeah. You're part of the choir.
KC: Alright. But, who is it that's coming to you? I mean, what about Majestic? You are familiar with the Majestic-12?
BD: Oh, yes. Yes, yes.
KC: Well, how...
BD: They don't call themselves that anymore... but they exist.
KC: I understand. What do they call themselves? What is their new name? Do you know it?
BD: Oh, yeah well used to be... PI-40 was the last term I heard.
KC: PI-40... alright. Well, that's fine, so there's forty...
BD: I don't know what the hell that means... there's probably forty members of it now.
KC: And have they approached you?
BD: I've met several of them, yeah.
KC: Because they know you're very well informed...
BD: Well let... can we get back to the subject here, we were talking about just briefly earlier... why the hell have I gotten away with what I'm doing. I've got a big mouth, I've come out bluntly and honestly and I've... shared my anger.
But I think... and I've said this publicly... after I began speaking all over the world and all over this country, about subjects as sensitive as the ones we've just been talking about... I concluded there was someone, somewhere who wanted me to do this.
BD: ... or I could not have gotten away with it.
BD: And I don't know who that someone is... I may have met him or her... They may have been among those who have come up to me at conferences and shook my hand and said, "Damn good job. Keep it up," you know, something like that.
KC: Okay, so... what Dan Burisch says is that part of Majestic wants disclosure, and part of Majestic does not.
BD: Well but... Twenty years ago they were split down the middle.
BD: We know this...
KC: Right. So where do you think... where do you think it's at today?... Do you think that...
BD: Robert Wood... do you know who Bob Wood is?
BD: Okay, you know his son Ryan?
BD: Alright. Bob Wood said this to me at a conference in Long Beach a long time ago... he said, "I know two members of Majestic." He said, "They said they're split down the middle and it's a ferocious damned fight." He said, "It's vicious." He says, "One half says 'Yes, bring it out' and the other half says not only 'No' but 'Hell no, and not ever' " And that group is still calling the shots.
BD: You see, we've got a shadow government thing here... this is a little bit of interest to me, as an American, and it should be of interest to you...
BD: Do you know how much money a trillion dollars is?
KC: No concept, but I hear you.
BD: It's a lot.
BD: Okay... In this country, for three years... '98, '99, and 2000... each year there was 2.7 trillion dollars missing from the Pentagon accounts that they could not figure out where the money went. They knew they had it, and then it was gone. Now that's 2.7 trillion a year for three years. Now... you think these guys aren't funded well?!
BD: Oh, hell, they're funded better than the United States Army, for Christ's sake. The United States Army doesn't get that kind of... you know, we get money in the billions, but not in the trillions. And not 2.7 trillion a year for three years...
KC: Right. Are you referring to Catherine Fitts, her research?
BD: Well, I haven't met the lady... I have a great deal of respect for her...
BD: I have a very close, dear friend, who... I will tell you this and I will deny I ever said it.
BD: There's a member of PI-40 who runs a think tank in Washington, D.C... (pauses)... No? (looks off-screen to Marcia)... well, it's a source, she might want to talk to him. He's a man I trust, a man I admire and respect, and he is on the inside. And he told Catherine one time, he says, "You want meet an alien? I can arrange it... " And she got... and she evidently scurried off. And so, he was never forced to deliver on his promise. But if you ever are in Washington, and you get a chance, say hello to John for me, will you?
KC: I will do that.
BD: Okay, I...
KC: That story is on Catherine's website...
BD: Oh, is it?!
KC: She said she always regretted to this day...
BD: ... that she never took him up on it? (laughs)
KC: ... that she never took him up on it.
BD: Alright. Well, John is one who not only knows aliens, but he's probably got a couple on his board.
KC: I believe that.
BD: That's how involved we all are with at least one group.
BD: Now, everybody says, "Which group is which?" You know. "Are they the Lizards, or are they the Reptiles," or are they 'this' or are they 'that'... it doesn't matter... we're dealing with some groups out there that... are a million years ahead of us in evolution, technology, and development.
There are intelligent races out there that are a billion years ahead of us. We found stars out there, that probably have planets, that are three times as old as our star... meaning that probably the planets and the intelligent life on those planets around those stars maybe three times older... we've been maybe, what... 11 billion? Well, that's nothing.
The universe, the last they figured, was 14 billion. And then they had an astronomer... I love this... they had an astronomer one day who said, "We can't figure this out... we found stars that are older than the universe."
BD: ... and I thought, "Nitwit. Do you think, perhaps, that you ought to go back to the drawing board? That maybe you missed something in Astronomy 101?" Anyhow, I diverge here.
KC: Well actually...
BD: What I'm trying to tell you is that we are immersed in a universe that is conscious... teeming with conscious intelligence. And there are planets out there like grains of sand, filled with intelligent life. And there are cultures, civilizations, societies... that are a million years ahead of us.
Now... I used... I like this because it's an exercise I like to throw out to kids. I put together a curriculum one time for grade school kids, on this subject. They'd have burned me at the stake, the school board would have, if I'd ever tried to get this thing accepted.
But... when you stop to think about these realities... that this species, in all of its primitive savageness (savagery), with all of its limited heartbreaking ignorant, stupid... way of going to try an go about life... that there are cultures and civilizations and societies out there... that if not perfect, have reached a level so far beyond what we have here. And that I know this and I sense this and I feel this in my gut.
And that's why I pick up the paper and I read the latest garbage... and the killings and... it's no wonder that I have not become... a recluse. I cannot live in that world anymore, and the reason I think I gave you earlier is that my old world view... my paradigm... collapsed around my knees twenty years ago.
BD: Now, if it's turned me into a cynical recluse, what would it do to the masses of people out there... that are going about their tiddly-ass little business... their little lives... going bowling... going to NASCAR races... drinking their beer... chomping their chips... and thinking that this is, "this is a good life." ... when you and I know that's not so.
KC: Right. Well, actually, you've shown me a remarkable amount of consciousness, of love, of... you know, you have a vibrant spirit that's very amazing... you're very eloquent... for you this has not been all bad. This information has enlightened you, and made you who you are today.
BD: Yeah, it certainly has. What I am today is a total product of not only 78 years on this planet, but I've always liked to say that you know... I've lived a... couple of hundred lifetimes, because I'm totally convinced of the reality of reincarnation...
KC: Good for you.
BD: I just made my mind up that I ain't coming back here again.
BD: The point I'm getting at is, I have a love-hate relationship with the human race... I really do.
KC: Sure... understandable.
BD: I have a love-hate relationship with this species... and if I would be able to grab this species by the collar and slap the living shit out of them, I would do so. But what I'm doing here with you and your little camera, is to some degree, doing just that. If my words have any meaning or any value, to not only to you guys, but to anyone in the future who sees this, it is that I love this race... (sighs)...
I've been a part of it, for 78 years, this time. I've seen pure hell. I've been through two wars, I'm on my third marriage... I raised two kids, lost one to suicide...
I've seen things in this life, that have affected me... affected me a lot. But you see, I know... and don't tell me, and don't ask me to explain exactly how I know and how much I know...
Because, I have never shared this before, but I have been contacted. (deep breath) It's very difficult to talk about. I've been abducted. I don't look upon it as an abduction... I look upon it as an invitation, and... I've been aboard some of those ships several times. I've had even friends come up to me and say, "Oh my God... "
A friend up in Sedona... a doctor... a dentist, he said, "I was abducted," and he says, "When I 'came to' up there, I look around and I see you standing over in the corner talking to some of these guys!" And I said, "Well, I'm not surprised." Because I've been aboard the ships several times.
KC: Do you have conscious recall of this?
BD: Oh, yes. Yeah, no hypnotic regression needed. When that... when that happens to you, it makes such an imprint on you, that you don't need to be hypnotically regressed to remember. I mean, it's there. It's like a scar - it's there. No no, I've been aboard several times, and I suspect much of the information I've got about the depth... the depth of the societies and the civilizations and the cultures... that exist out there, that makes me know how glorious some of them are...
And then I look around this mud-heap that we're living in here, and I think, knowing what it could be... and what it's not... and hopefully, what it might be. (emotional)...
I've touched a nerved here... I've touched a nerve, in that I have shared some things with you that I have seldom shared with anybody except the lovely lady I live with.
I don't think I've ever publicly, in an interview or anywhere, ever shared the fact that I have been aboard their ships. Because if I'd ever done that it would have opened a Pandora's Box that I was not prepared to deal with. Now she has a different story... she talks to them and meets with them all the time. That's another story.
No, I've shared with you this afternoon a couple of little things.
KC: Well, we're honored.
BD: Why I feel so strongly that this truth... that we're not alone, we've never been alone, that we're intimately involved in this inter-relationship. We are family with them. And yes, we are 'in a zoo' and they are... in a degree, to an extent... our 'zookeepers.' Now you don't share that with everybody out there.
Old Jerry Falwell, wherever he may be right now, God bless his soul... No, he's not there, Marcia, there is no such place as that... she's pointing down.
BD: No, Hell doesn't exist. Hell is of our own making.
KC: Yeah. I believe that.
BD: But, there are people out there that I've... I spoke in Dallas one time. That's what they call the Bible Belt. It's right in the middle of 'Bible Belt,' in Texas, you know. And I laid some pretty hairy things out there in front of 800 people one afternoon. And I looked at people's faces and I saw their eyebrows rise and their mouths drop, and... little old ladies going (gestures with mouth open and hands on face)... you know. And after it was all over with, down comes the aisle, here comes this rotund, round little Baptist, fundamentalist minister... with his Bible under his arm and he's heading for me. And I thought, "Oh, God, we're going to be rolling on the floor here in a minutes, because I've shared some pretty blunt things to that group over there in the'Bible Belt. "
Well... got the shock of my life. This little Baptist minister comes up... makes... leaps up onto the stage. It must have been 250 pounds of... you know... comes up on to the stage, throws his arms around me, and as I said, we're going to roll on the floor here, and he's going to beat me half to death with his Bible...
He hugs me, kisses me, and says, "Oh, Brother Dean, you've said it the way it needs to be said." And I was in a total state of shock. But that's only happened once.
KC: (Laughs) That's amazing.
BD: It... it was an interesting experience for me.
KC: That's great.
BD: But it encouraged me to continue to be outspoken and blunt. And as I've done... as I've said, in my last presentation in San Jose, I laid it out pretty bluntly, pretty close to what I shared with you this afternoon, only not entirely.
And I don't speak publicly anymore. I've been invited may times... I've turned down invitations. I turned down a trip abroad... another conference up in Laughlin...
But this is probably my last interview. And I've given you a lot of... garbage here. I've given you a lot of material. If, within that mass of stuff I've shared, if you can find one or two items that are worth keeping, that's fine. But as I said, I have a love-hate relationship with the human species, and I just know what we could be and what we're not.
I learned years ago... before I retired in '76... the government knew, not only everything the SHAPE study had in '64... the government knew all of that and more, years and years before. They just were not sharing it with anybody.
BD: We were... we were confronting and dealing with intelligences from other planets, other star systems, other galaxies... and some of the contacts we've had have been intelligence from other dimensions.
And, I'm all fascinated by the work Michio Kaku, this brilliant scientist in New York, who is a physicist who is involved in string theory...
BD: And I think their latest conclusion is... that they concluded there are at least 11 different dimensions. And I've always said that death... when we die... the soul, which I believe is an immortal living creature in itself, simply goes over to the next dimension, which we look upon as death. Well, it isn't death; it's just a higher form of life.
And I've been making my plans recently to... to make the transition. Marcia says, "Don't get up alone to go tonight." I haven't bugged her quite enough yet.
KC: (Laughs) Well, I hope you stay with us for quite a while longer, because you're a wonderful, enlightened being to be around...
Okay, I have one last question, and then I'll let... if Bill has a question he can go ahead.
2012... have you been told, either by your military contacts, people in the deep black secret government, and/or by your alien contacts anything about that period of time?
BD: It isn't the end of anything. It's the beginning. My conclusion is, and I haven't been given, "blah, blah, blah," you know, "this is what's going to happen"...
I've concluded that it involves probably major contact. I mean major. If you think the Phoenix Lights, which I'm sure you're familiar with...
BD: You're familiar with the Hudson Valley Incident some years back?
BD: ... Which makes the Phoenix Lights look like nothing... as I said, small potatoes. I think that these exposures, these fly-overs, are going to probably gently continue to increase... and I think in 2012, somehow... I anticipate, and I hope to hang around maybe that long... if I can get my arthritis to settle down.
I think, major contact. I think we're going to have it whether we like it... whether we're ready for it or not. I think that by that time we will be so close to destroying ourselves with a thermonuclear exchange, that they're going to step into the zoo and... put the orang-utans over here... and the baboons over here... and the chimps over here... and they're going to say, "Now look: these are some facts, guys. Time to wake up, time to grow up." This is what Robert Heinlein called 'Graduation Day'.
KC: Has it occurred to you... I'm not sure if you've heard Dan Burisch's testimony, or seen his interview... we did an interview with him, in which he talks about the fact that, from what he's been told, some of the aliens that have come to visit were time-traveling humans from the future. Has this entered into any of your contact experiences, or knowledge that you've come across?
BD: No, it's always... it's been a... well, how do I say this? It's been a given to me that time travel is a reality. Now, I don't know if I've been told that, but I seem to instinctively accept it and understand it.
Time, as we understand it, and this dimensional thing, and the time and space, is so... so primitive and so fundamental, you know...
Time is infinite, space is infinite, and time and space is connected so deeply involved together... that time travel is just accepted... it's a given.
Now, this primitive little society here... still likes to play with the idea, you know, make movies and all that, and tell stories and... wonder, and... to me, the fact that some of these dimensional people... that in itself is form of time travel.
When you come here from another dimension... that is so totally different in many respects than what we have here... you're literally coming from another time. Now, whether it's our time, and another time and place... you see, we are so limited in our concept, physically... in terms of physics and all, that we really can't even discuss it.
We are entering the end of the Great Year. Now... our astronomers tell us that we're moving... this little tiny solar system, and all of its little, pathetic little planets... even beautiful Jupiter... we're all moving in a form in the galaxy... we're on the edge and we're shifting... and we're reaching a point where we're going to be aligned somehow... with the center of the galaxy. Now, don't ask me to explain how that works, but I do know... I do believe that we are completing a Great Year. This age of Pisces is closing.
And I always felt that the beautiful young man from Galilee was part of that because he ushered it in... and, eh, I've often wondered if he might now drop back in to usher it out.
And I'm not talking religion to you, I'm talking spirituality. Because that young... that spirit, that soul, that great soul that incarnated in Galilee back then... is alive and well, and I've told some of my fundamentalist friends, who think I'm cracked.
BD: ... That I... knew him well and he was one of my closest friends, and I'm looking forward to seeing him again. And they... you know, that's almost heresy to them, you know.
But I told them, I says, "Don't be troubled. You're going to see him again. The same young man who walked the fields in Galilee two thousand years ago is probably going to come back again, and you better damned well get ready."
KC: Robert Dean, we've been incredibly grateful to have you here today. And you are really a legend in your own time... among UFOlogists, and I wouldn't be surprised if you are a bit notorious as far as the 'secret government', Majestic, and what did you call them?... the PI-40?
KC: PI-40... Alright.
BD: Well, who knows... what goes for the name, you know?
KC: Sure. Absolutely. Is there anything else that you want to tell us, or add?
BD: Yeah. I appreciate the opportunity to have shared a few things with you, and I apologize for some of the emotions. I feel very strongly about all we've been talking about.
In closing, I would like to say one thing. I have a love-hate relationship with the human species... I have a great belief in the future of mankind. (clears throat)
We're not a mistake. We're not an accident. None of this is an accident.
...That the human species... the human race... in spite of all of its orneriness... is a beautiful race...
(Deep inhale)... And it has a future. And that I have a deep, deep belief that in time... we're going to go out there... and take our rightful place... where we began... our home in the stars.