David Wilcock:

Interview transcript - Part 2

This page is a reformatted version of the original Project Camelot publication.


The Road to Ascension: David Wilcock - Part 2
A video interview with David Wilcock

Los Angeles, May/June 2007

Shot, edited and directed by Kerry Lynn Cassidy

(continued from Part 1)
(continued in
Part 3 and Part 4)



Start of interview

In the history of the Law of One series, the Law of One was channeled by three people: Don Elkins, Carla Rueckert and Jim McCarty. Twenty years of research and channeling went into this before they did it.

Don Elkins was originally part of the Elkins Mantel flying school, a different Elkins than him, he was just a student there. Mantel is the famous crash in which the guy tried to follow a UFO in his airplane, and got into the field coming off of it, and it shot all these holes through the ship.

So it was like a gravity field around the airplane crash, and you had to kind of lean, when you went near it, and you couldn't stand up straight, kind of like the Santa Cruz mystery spot, which I visited, or the Oregon Vortex. Well, the body was in a horrific state, and there were pores shot through the plane everywhere.

So this is part of what got our government guys thinking that the UFOs could be hostile in their intent. But you've got to remember, now, we've grown up in a society, ever since the late 40's, early 50's, in which we have mutually assured destruction, nuclear missiles aimed at each other.

There is no way... I mean, what does winning a nuclear war mean? How do you win a nuclear war? The 'War Games' movie did a really great job at making us clear about that.

Now, at lot of these witnesses at the Disclosure Project are saying they saw these UFOs hovering over nuclear missile silos and they would power down the whole silo, and the missiles were not launch capable. In fact, there were other cases where they were doing a missile test, and it's flying through the air, and this orb would appear and start shooting beams at it and it would clunk down, and it would be completely radioactively inert, and there was no radioactivity left. It could not even detonate if you wanted it to.

This is just the beginning of where we start to understand that there has been a lot of negative propaganda in films, telling you that extra-terrestrials are evil. There is a battle going on between good guys and bad guys because there are a lot of different ETs out there, there are a lot of civilizations visiting the earth.

Darwinian evolution is not a viable model. The Law of One series teaches us that the galactic creator they call 'the Logos' created a body that it then writes into the energy around us. So what that means is the human body shows up on every planet in the galaxy where life can form; it is a natural evolution. Some might get there by insects, some might get there by lizards, some might get there by mammals, like we do; some might get there by cetaceans Some might get there even by vegetation, apparently.

This very crazy idea that trees could detach and walk around, I realize would probably be ridiculous to most people. But if you start getting into the idea that life is a field, it explains a lot of very strange things.

For example, research has been consistency done on a fruit fly known as Drosophila, in which they altered the DNA so that the eyes don't form; it's a mutant without eyes. No matter what they have done ever, to mess with the Drosophilus DNA, after five generations the eyes come back.

There is another plant that has been used in laboratory studies for 25 years, they mess with the plant and no matter what they do to mess with the DNA to make it alter and mutate, 25% of the time those plants fix their DNA. That means this whole idea of terminator seeds and genetically modified crops will never really happen, because nature can re-write itself, and fix the errors in the DNA.

But it goes a lot more than that when you have Dan Burisch, ( whom you guys have interviewed) he's talking about his Lotus project in which you have a crystal of silicone basically like quartz, and you just put it in distilled water purified and run the whole thing in an autoclave, there is no way that there would be contamination in it. Hit it with a little bolt of electricity, and things start growing in the water! Well, this has been done since the last century, in the 19th century.

Sir William Crookes is one of the guys who did this. He took a volcanic rock, electrified it, put some drops of water on it, and these little mites grew out of this murk, and they grew legs and detached and started walking around.

There are other researchers, mostly from the Reich camp; Wilhelm Reich with the orgone stuff... Wright was demonstrating this over and over again in the laboratory. Now his research isn't criticized, he calls them bions - corpuscles of energy that form living things. But it's since been done under extremely powerful laboratory conditions.

Furthermore, Dr. Francis Crick, who was one of the co-discoverers of the DNA molecule, showed that the dust in the galaxy, when you take a line of sight from where we are to the center of the galaxy, 99.9% of that dust in the galaxy has all the spectrographic signatures, all the lightwaves that you expect to see from living bacteria.

So panspermia, the idea that life was seeded on the earth, it's more than that. Life is the field, the energy that is around us, that underlies matter. Not electromagnetic energy, there's a deeper energy called torsion fields.

That is the energy of consciousness; it is the energy that allows me to be psychic so I can think what somebody else is thinking after his thoughts come into my mind; it is the energy of source, it is the energy of time. Time is actually not an invariant. Time is locally variable, and that's one of the really fascinating things you start learning.

Now, as I told you guys, I've met with a variety of Black Ops scientists, and one of the things that they keep saying again and again is that time can be altered by electromagnetic means, a very strong electromagnetic coil, and this gets back into the Philadelphia Experiment. So I guess this is the time where you guys wanted me to get into the Daniel story.

Kerry: Certainly, Daniel's an interesting place to start. You did say that Daniel has... in some ways you got in touch with us because you said that our Henry Deacon, a lot of what he has come up with has been verified by your relationship with Daniel. Maybe I'm not putting it in the right words.

David: No. What do I do when I have been given access by extreme, wonderful synchronicity to connect with somebody who is in the Black Ops, black operations, meaning off the government radar of official, congressional inquiry into how the funding is being allocated.

I get this guy. He tells me stuff that nobody else has ever said in any public forum. I go to this website called Project Camelot, and you guys have the same data! I just about lost it! I said: Maybe it's true.

I mean, I knew it was true because when you spend enough time with somebody, which I did, with this guy Daniel, you know when somebody is telling the truth. If somebody is going to try to attack me and say well, you know, he was telling a big story, it's like, I'm sorry: I interrogated this guy so many different ways. I have all the science that builds up to the things that he said, all be in place.

I'm now out here in Hollywood. I'm working on a film called Convergence, the Movie. I've gotten into the whole system of Hollywood, and I've put together a series of data, which we are going to make into a movie called 'Convergence', as I said.

This really is where my interest is, more than in trying to say, "I'm Edgar Cayce". The book came out years ago. I haven't really done that much to promote it. I don't talk about it on the radio. I've gave you guys the story. But what I'm really fascinated with is the science of consciousness, and so we're doing a whole film about this.

So I have all the science now to get from the mainstream model, to these very exotic things that are in the Black Ops community.

The Law of One series, which started with channeling in the 50's and went all the way forward from there, is sort of like the base that everything has come from and everything that I find keeps tying back into this, including the Dan Burisch testimony, including many other testimonies; some of the things that Deacon said - everything was in this book from 1981, so that tells me there is some truth in there, plus the fact that I have personal experience with this source and it made two house calls to that woman where the light came in her window and then to my brother in his bedroom.

So getting back to this Daniel situation, I had the opportunity to meet this guy. I had flown to New York. I'd gotten off the plane. I was going to visit my mother. It was winter time and we didn't have transportation to get me down. It was like there was a storm. There was ice all over the roads, so I had to stay in a hotel that night. I needed to eat something so I got in the taxi and I went to the Denny's; and it just so happened before I left that this book had gotten my attention again, The Montauk Project.

Now I read this book in the 90's before I ever found the Law of one, and I thought it was completely horse pucky, I just had no interest in it. But I just said let me bring it along as reading material, so I had it with me.

I'm in this Denny's late at night and this guy walks past and he kind of looks like a Harley guy, like a biker, you know in his leather jacket kind of thing and he says, " what you think about that Montauk Project?" I said: "Oh, it's ridiculous. This is a joke. I'm just reading this for entertainment". He said: "Could I talk to you about something?" "Okay".

So he sits down and he says, I worked at Montauk. I literally laughed in his face. I said, "You've got to be kidding me."

To make along story short, he gives me this enormous download. I'm scribbling stuff on the back of a napkin and the back of the place thing that they give you at Denny's and we made a contact and I've had numerous opportunities to connect with him since that time.

I can't get into a lot of detail. He does not want to come forward; he is terrified of publicity. He has been willing to do some audio work so he can get his testimony recorded on audio, but I'm going to have to garble his voice.

So, here's the deal. Now, first of all, let's not forget. If even one UFO sighting is real, meaning not swamp gas, then we're not alone and there are UFOs. As soon as you accept that, you have to also accept the fact that they can materialize and de-materialize. So they are winking in and out of our reality somehow. Well, how would they do that?

Apparently, the answer is in the seat. You have a seat in the UFO and it plugs into your mind and you think, "I want to go to a particular place." You visualize where that place is. This vortex opens up in front of your ship. Your ship flies through the vortex. The vortex closes behind you and you end up going where you need to go.

So what happens if a disc crashes, and our government guys pops a seat out of the UFO and start tinkering with it? And then what happens if they get health problems?

A particular group of extra terrestrials from Sirius, apparently, and the ETs are telling them, "design this coil and build it this way and built a big octahedron, like two Egyptian pyramids top to bottom, and that's your main antenna."

So, to make a long story short, it took a number of years, but there was a series of progressive steps that led to the ability to bring this chair on line, so that it was fully functional in its intended purpose. The chair had, this is all stuff... now Daniel got hired in at this job. He was an Air Force captain, and he was given a sentry position at this place, kind of like a guard; but he also had a variety of tasks that were to be performed. He did not know what was going on.

So what happened in the early days was, he was in the cafeteria, eating his lunch or whatever, and you'd see over in the corner of the room that it would start to burble like a mirage, and you would see something that shouldn't be there. Like you might see through the wall into the other room, or you might see a field with green grass or something, and sometimes it would be up near the ceiling and sometimes it would be in the floor.

So it turns out that everybody talked to the janitor. The janitor had somehow gained everybody's confidence, so they started having these meetings with the janitor. The janitor started telling them what was going on.

Now gradually over time, he apparently was indoctrinated and got fully knowledgeable about what was going on. This was an abandoned military base at the far out point of Long Island called Montauk.

He did say that the first book in the Montauk Project series was authentic, and that pretty much everything in the book is true. He then went on to say that every book since then has been increasingly distorted and not truthful.

He knew Al Bielek. He knew Preston Nichols. He knew Duncan Cameron. He knew Stuart Swerdlow, all these guys were there.

Duncan ran the chair the best, Duncan was the guy that could run the chair. He had some experience working with the chair. He said that they originally tried to build one reverse engineered and that didn't work. They eventually had to go back to the original design, use the actual real chair, not one that had been rebuilt. There was something about these Helmholtz coils that had to be altered.

So, basically what happens is, you are in the chair. There are 22, I think he said 22, wavelengths that the chair creates that are like your mind waves, your brain waves, and from these 22 wave lengths, all other waves come from your mind.

So when you sit in the chair, they would have you go into what they call the quiet point, and this is a point where your mind is perfectly still.

Now normally if you go in the chair if your mind isn't quiet, the waves are going to be fluctuating all the time. If you go quiet, then the waves will sort of stop and go to a fixed point, like this. (gesticulates) Well, out of the 22, if you have a wave that looks like this, the idea is to get it to go flat. They would zero out the chair, 22 knobs, 22 waves and flatten out all the graphs. Duncan Cameron, apparently, was the only person who could get everything perfectly zeroed out, perfectly stable.

There was an extremely, extremely, enormous power supply that was required to run this chair. It was a non-standard frequency. It was not alternating current, 120 hertz; it was some weird decimal point number of hertz that they had to run through the chair.

But what would happen is that consciousness would create matter.

They found that you could think about an object, like let's say you thought about a particular wooden chair and you visualize the chair, the chair would start forming in the room. First maybe very shimmery and sort of like you couldn't even see it and it would harden up. Depending on how much thought energy you would put into it, it would stay solid for a period of time and then it would dissipate and sort of disappear back into the background.

Then they started to find out that if you thought about a particular place that there would be an opening that would appear and you would go to that place. You could send somebody through it and then they could walk around in there for awhile and other people could see them. It was like they were there and then you would have to have the person in the chair physically pull them out with conscious intent to get them back out.

Now they did do a lot of experimentation. They sent innocent people through, and they were killed. Some of these were street tramps; some of these were homeless kids.

Apparently, Swerdlow was responsible for recruiting a lot of the kids.

I believe it's possible people can change; Daniel doesn't. He talked about Al Bielek He said Bielek was a big story teller, always had some funny thing going on.

Daniel claims he, himself, never went through the vortex.

At some point they realized that they had gone to a place that was not the present, that they had traveled through time. They got very excited about this.

Now this is where it gets really strange. It just gets stranger and stranger.

Supposedly, we have a body that they call the transient body, and then we have a physical body. The transient body is what new-agers would call the astral body. At the point that you're first conceived, it's called your zero time reference (ZTR), that moment is where you have contact with this place called zero time.

Now the physics model goes like this. If you can imagine space/time like a sheet, everything above the sheet is the world that we inhabit, the reality that we inhabit. Everything below the sheet is this three dimensional reality that's kind of like where anti-matter is.

It's like the astral plane, a mirror image of where we are now. As you accelerate though space you start curving space ,and eventually it curves around in on itself like a donut and that's a torus, it's called a torus. If you keep on going, the torus unrolls.

Now because of what I've told you with this sheet thing, you got time in here, space in here. (Time below the sheet, space above) Time is three-dimensional down there, Space is three dimensional up here. As the sheet curls in you get time on the inside of the donut, but then as you keep going, the donut unrolls in the other direction and the time that was down here unrolls and becomes your space.

So you're now in a three-dimensional world, you can walk around in, you can inhabit, but it's out of phase with our reality and people in this reality wouldn't see you, you'd disappear.

So this is apparently what was done inadvertently with the Philadelphia Experiment. The Philadelphia Experiment started with tests that were done on very, very high intensity welding, arc welding of navel vessels, and they had these enormous pieces of steel that they are welding together. They blast it with electrical energy at a very high frequency and they started to notice the tools would disappear after this. They couldn't find them.

They finally filmed it and they found that when they blasted this arc welding thing, that there would be this big black hole that would appear in the room, and they discovered that, in fact, it was de-materializing objects and that they wouldn't come back.

So this is what led them to do increasing amounts of research, discovering that electrical energy is one way that you can pop this hole between space/time and time/space, and get through to this realm down here.

Well, they tried to send a ship of sailors through. and unfortunately there was an inconsistency in the hull. The ship's hull was kind of used as an antenna to allow this energy to form around the ship properly. They put coils on the ship and there were coils off shore. The ship, apparently, got caught up in this energy flow. It manifested up in Philadelphia, hence the Philadelphia Experiment, (it was originally the Norfolk Naval Shipyard) and then it popped back to the shipyard.

Some of the sailors were actually imbedded in the hull. Some of them burst into flames, some of them would appear and disappear because they were here, but if you get energetically tuned to this, then you can flip-flop between the two halves of the torus, so to speak, and the matter in their bodies would do that.

So, in the 1920's, Tesla built something that would stabilize your ZTR. It's called a Zero Time Reference, and let me explain what that means.

Here is space/time, here is time/space, and in the middle is zero time. You're not in space, you're not in time. When you go there apparently it looks kind of gray.

In zero time we all have a point at which we were conceived, where the transient body or the spiritual body, and the physical body join. As we get older there is like a widening cone between the physical and the metaphysical self. That forms your biological age.

If you mess with the ZTR, it's like you push the top over, but the bottom is still where it is, this gap creates great static which in some cases causes you to burst into flames and other cases causes you to go comatose. Sometimes your sense of time gets really screwed up.

For example, with some of these guys you'd have to rub their skin for days at a time, the exposed flesh, they would just be... paused, because in their time only a few seconds have gone by in what amounts to years of time for us, or maybe weeks of time. So by rubbing them, you could eventually get them to slow down and rejoin their time reference with where we are.

Now one of the things Daniel told me was that some people were able to psychically reconstruct the ship from memory. They remembered that they were on a ship. They remembered where the ship was, where the floor was, where the walls were. They were the ones who came out okay.

So that was part of the research. Now since that time, the Philadelphia Experiment was not dropped, it has since been parlayed into technologies, including jump-gate technology, as I have heard it has been called, in which they now can warp you from one place to another.

There is apparently, as you guys disclosed with Deacon, a stable jump gate between Earth and Mars... an inhabited base on Mars, I heard that too. Daniel also came across the fact that Mars had been inhabited in ancient history, and that there were artifacts all over the place. He also said he saw a photograph of astronauts waving next to a pyramid, in basic NASA spacesuits.

So it's not easy when people realize that you have been lied to, and that there is a lot you don't know, but that it's the reality of what's happened.

So they got a chair from the UFO and they started using these same principles, and took it further.

Now, one guy was actually crazy enough to go back in time, and he killed his father, because he wanted to see what would happen, I guess. You know, there are some nasty guys working in Black Ops and it was also a suicide move, you would think.

Well, he felt great. I mean, he went and he killed his father, which apparently resolved a lot of anger issues for him, and he came back, "I'm fine, everything's fine." The next day, or a couple of days later, he stepped out in traffic, got hit by a car and was instantly killed.

So from that they came to the conclusion that time is like a living fabric that repairs the tears that are made; repairs the rips that are made as much as it can.

The most interesting thing that Daniel ever told me was, of course, well, first of all before we get to that, your ZTR determines your absolute biological age. So apparently, if you travel into the future and your ZTR says that you were born in 1956, let's say, You travel into the future ten years, fifteen years down the road, in a matter of a couple of hours, your body becomes ten or fifteen years older. When you travel back in time, you revert back to the age you were when you left, in a relatively short period of time.

Now, this is very anomalous, and suggests a very multi-dimensional component to the biological aging. So they had to find a way to shift the ZTR in order to send somebody through, and Daniel believes they had, but he did not have access to that information.

They were taking wavelengths of the psychic's mind, analyzing them and trying to figure out a way to mechanically generate them, so that they wouldn't need the psychic. They were using a variety of psychics, but Duncan Cameron happened to be the one who had the most success.

So they sent people through time, there was a twenty-year wave that came out which apparently was a natural harmonic of the Earth in its rotation, and you could plot on the wave very precisely what time somebody was in by how far the wave went. If the wave went to here and then stopped, they could calculate, ok, that's 1996, January 15th, or whatever.

The wave keeps going, and this is what really drove these guys crazy; is that there was a certain point, (they were sending people into the future) there was a certain point on that twenty-year wave as they're traveling along through a time tunnel, at which all the waves, a hundred-some plus waves from the chair, and that was just the number that they had analyzed, there were hundreds more that they weren't even looking at; the
amount of cables coming out of the chair was in this two inch by three inch box coming out, a huge amount of data.

All the graphs would go flat-line, for about five or six seconds and then come back on line; but during that time, you couldn't see anything. The graphs were gone.

Well, then they asked the people, what happened to you during this time; and they said, "It 's the most fantastic thing I've ever experienced in my whole life! It was like, I'm one with the galaxy! I could be a star, I could be a planet. I could zoom in on the planet. I had access to all knowledge there ever was to know! I could be a sub-atomic particle. I could be an atom, a molecule. I could fly anywhere, do anything, know anything, be anything! It seems like there is no time, it just goes on eternally. Absolute ecstasy! It was the most wonderful thing I have ever experienced in my whole life, and I do not want to leave."

When you first hit it, it's like hitting a really intense bump. Like slamming into something, so they call it the 'bump', or the discontinuity. The experience of going out of the reality you know, they call it 'the full out', that you would have this full out experience.

So then, all of the graphs went silent, which drove these guys crazy, because they wanted to be able to re-play that part and analyze the waves, but they couldn't. So then they're looking at the time line and they look at this 20 year wave, and they find out exactly how far it went, right up until poof, everything goes flat. It was December 21, 2012. So here we get into your whole 2012 thing.

Well, the Law of One tells us what is going to happen in 2012. The channeled material was talking about it before. So when Daniel starts telling me this, I am aware that this is not a guy who is lying, because there were too many things that I asked him. I cross-examined him, and met him on multiple occasions. Then when you guys came out with your Henry Deacon testimony, it really was fascinating.

Before we go any further, I want to make sure I mention my web site. My web site is divinecosmos.com. You can read about more of this testimony, more of all this kind of stuff I'm talking about. There are audio interviews that I have done in our archives. We have a great CD series, which we've put together called, 'The Science of Peace', which goes into a lot of the consciousness science, understanding this stuff.

Now this is what I came to. We have zero time reference when we are born. Time and space become one at the moment of our conception. Daniel doesn't agree with me, but I believe that 2012 is the ZTR of the earth. That it's a new re-birth of the earth's energy body, and it makes a lot of sense. So it is at that moment that we have this implosion and everything kind of comes together.

Now Don Elkins, the guy who was the questioner in the Law of One series, has access to channeling materials that were brought through with the help of this guy W.B. Smith, who you will encounter frequently if you read about ufology.

W.B. Smith worked for Canada in the Defense Ministry, and was the only officially sanctioned program that investigated this global grid. It was called, 'Project Magnet', the idea that there is this energy grid on the earth, criss-crossing lines.

When you hear Dan Burisch's testimony, he talks about natural stargates. Those are points where these lines cross. They form nodes. A node is basically a dimensional crossing point. Now you have two counter rotating geometries on the earth. One that pretty much stays stable and determines the shape of the continents, and then there's another one that we don't see which counter-rotates; and as the two go through each other at certain points the nodes will cross. If those node points cross together and you have a favorable planetary alignment at the same time, you get this surge of energy in which space/time and time/space, there is that crossing point briefly.

The Bermuda Triangle is a natural stargate. If these two grids cross over each other, the nodes connect, the alignment is right, then you can end up flying through this vortex and fly clear into time/space and end up not in our reality anymore.

The reason why all this stuff is important is that 2012 literally represents a vortex activity across the entire earth. That's what I have concluded from the research. Every person on earth, except for maybe some of the people that are on the negative spiritual path, called Service to Self, but almost everybody on earth is going to go through this vortex experience, which is an ecstatic thing; it's not a terrifying or painful event at all. It's similar to how the 'full out' happens. Our whole planet goes into that.

Now, I read about ascension and all these things for a long time and I said, "How could this be possible? How could something like this happen?" There would have to be a massive surge of energy in the solar system that would be demonstrating this.

The work that W.B. Smith was doing in the 50s with people who were contacted by UFOs shows that they had information coming through from channeling, which was very accurate; Smith had a list of 200 specific questions about UFOs, and he only took the people where the channel answered every question the same way. Sometimes the questions were a little different and the channel would say that that's because the person is a Christian and they are biased with their religious beliefs, something like that.

Anyway, all these channels said the same thing and one of the things that they kept saying was the whole solar system is going to get charged up with energy. You're going to see all the planets changing, and you're going to see a transformation occur. Earth changes, cataclysmic changes will seem to be happening, but then there's going to be this big energetic event and the earth will be propelled into a golden age.

There is what's called a three way split when this happens. Some people stay on the positive path. Those are the people who stay with the earth. The earth becomes fourth dimensionally activated.

When you have an out of body experience, which I've done, you fly up into the sky, you go above a certain point, it's kind of like a feeling. For a long time I couldn't get past the feeling. It drove me nuts because I want to go into space and I couldn't get past this feeling.

Well, eventually I was able to do that, punch through. You punch through the ceiling and there's a new earth underneath you; and you fly up again and you punch through another one. There's a new earth again! And there are buildings and there are cars and there are people. These are like the after life planes where people go after they've physically died.

If you go high enough, you go up to the 7th one and it's all like Stonehenge, and there's all these people walking around in robes and headbands, and they are all very friendly to you and they say hello, and they know that you're there but they're really kind of surprised to see you. I've been there a couple of times.

If you go past that then you go out into space, and typically you end up finding yourself on a UFO pretty quickly, 'cause they see you and they find you, and you hang out and talk to the ETs, and most of them are very friendly. I've never really had a negative ET experience myself. I know other people have.

So to make a long story short, there is a plane that is con-centered with the earth as a globe, which would be up in the sky, probably even above the altitude you're flying at when you are in an airplane, and that's going to be where people live who are on the positive pat, as this happens.

Now it does get a little evangelical sounding; Christian prophecy - Jesus mentioned something that they call the rapture. There are lines in the book of Daniel talking about where there are two, and then there shall be one. Two shall be walking in the field and then there shall be one. Two shall be making wine and then there will be one, all this stuff.

But you've got to remember, Christianity is not the only religion that has this prophecy. It runs through Aboriginal prophecy, Hindu prophecy, Buddhist prophecy, Native-American prophecies. The Ragnaroc is the Celtic legend. Pretty much any ancient wisdom teaching you'll find, says something discontinuous, spontaneous and amazing, leading to a golden age, is going to happen on the earth.

I don't think that this pole shift thing will happen until after this happens, and most people will have popped through it before the pole shift ever occurs.

Now again, this is really lunatic fringe stuff; however, I did the research. I looked through countless reams of websites and printed them out. I have a huge bookshelf we could film if we have time, to show you all the research I did. NASA studies, again and again, showing every planet in the solar system, except for Mercury; but the Sun, Venus, Mars, Earth, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, Pluto - all of them are having massive climate changes.

They're getting brighter, they're getting hotter, and the magnetic field is growing larger. In some cases, like Saturn, they are rotating at a different speed.

Kerry: And you did all this research for Richard Hoagland...

David: That's correct.

Kerry: ...and actually are working with Hoagland on this, and he's published some of your research.

David: I had first found out about this from the work of Dr. Alexei Dmitriev, who is a Russian scientist, published in 1997. But he didn't have NASA data, he had Russian data, so I ended up talking to Hoagland about this in 2004, and I had done a little bit more research but not too much.

We were talking on the phone and he said, "David, you've got to do it. You've got to get the whole thing from NASA. If this is true, it's the biggest story we've got."

So I just hit the books, and I just went nuts on the internet, Googling, research, research, research; and what I came out with is a very impressive document which your contact, Henry Deacon, said was everything you needed to know about what's going on in the solar system. It's called Interplanetary Day After Tomorrow. It's a paper I wrote with Richard Hoagland. You can find it on his website, which is enterprisemission.com.

You can also find links to it on my page, and I'm going to be putting up a concise version of all the data in the future, that you can read at divinecosmos.com.

Why is this important? This gets back into the studies from the Russians about DNA, dealing with a particular experiment that was done.

First of all we have Dr. Glen Rein, an American scientist who showed - he took placental DNA from a human placenta, put it in a test-tube and had people trained to create certain emotional states. They'd hold the test tube and they'd feel the greatest anger and rage you can imagine, or they'd feel the love of a mother for her newborn baby, the most pure, unconditional love.

What Dr. Rein found is that when you feel the love the DNA unwinds and when the helix unwinds, the messenger RNA can go in and grab the code, and build life, build healing, build the healing of your body, the healing of cancer, diabetes, whatever. The anger causes the DNA to knot up like a braid of hair, and then you can't get healing at all.

Now this is the kind of data that I went into great detail about in my MP3 series, 'The Science of Peace', which is available on my site, and that's where I went through all this with this man who won nine Grammys in music, and his name is Larry Seyer. We did a whole musical soundtrack for it. It's wonderful! I'm just giving you a little bitty taste of it right now.

But anyway, that proves on a microbiological level that DNA is an antenna for consciousness. It's tuned to the mind and to the soul.

Well, now you have to get into this guy, Dr. Peter Gariaev, who first conducted research called the DNA Phantom Effect. He found if you put DNA in a little room in which it can absorb light, all the light gets stuck in the DNA and spirals through the molecule. It doesn't stay in the room. The DNA is like a light sponge, which is really weird, right?

But then you take the DNA out of the tube and the light keeps on spiraling as if the DNA was still there holding it in place, but there is no DNA. Guess how long it stays like that? How long do you think? 30 days! For 30 days the DNA continues to act, even though it's not there anymore.

This is what we call a latent structure, a latent structuring effect. This is a common feature of what the Russians call torsion fields, which I get into great detail about in the 'Science of Peace' MP3 series on my website divinecosmos.com

Anyway, Gariaev went further than that, he took a frog embryo and a salamander embryo and took a non burning laser, and shines it through the salamander embryo, redirects the light into the frog embryo, all he's doing is beaming light into hermetically sealed containers, and what do you think happens?

Well, you don't really want to go there, but remember what we said about the Drosophilus, the fruit fly? The DNA code of the eye is taken out, and five generations later the eyes pop back on.

You have this plant and you make it mutate; standard laboratory plant, and 25% of the time the mutations heal. What do you think happens if you shine the energy of the salamander embryo into a frog embryo - just the light beam? The frog embryo completely re-tools itself 100% and becomes a salamander, and there is no genetic evidence of it ever having been a frog whatsoever.

Now if we want to get really off into the far fringes of things, you have this secret group which we have heard a lot about called the Illuminati, and they are very into bloodlines, and they say there is magical power in the bloodlines; and that's why there are these 13 families ... they don't inter-marry and that's why if you are in The Illuminati you are born into the Illuminati.

I do believe that they exist. I have spoken to witnesses who are members of it, who got out. But they are all into this magic power of the blood, but what did I just tell you? You can take a salamander embryo and send that energy into a frog, but what if your body is the frog and the salamander energy is like the cosmos, the logos, the galactic creator?

That's what the Great Pyramid was built for. You sit in the tomb, the open coffer in the pyramid. The pyramid is a centralizing, focusing, spiral of energy. It takes this energy and makes it into a spiral.

I don't have the time to describe the physics of how this works, it's in the 'Science of Peace' but you can experience ascension in the pyramid. That's what it was built for. It was built as a chamber of healing.

So the Illuminati are the inheritors of this Atlantean science, which was then distorted, according to the Law of One series, thousands and thousands of years ago; seven, eight, nine thousand years ago, these negative energies got involved and changed the teaching and put it into a more negative direction.

That's where you get into the sacrifices and all these things that the Mayans ended up doing, the secret orders end up doing these things. Sacrifice is one way to open up the shift between space/time and time/space.

In the death process, you pop a hole through the veil temporarily. It's a conscious energy, so in a ritual, people can focus that energy and use it for something, including creating this opening; especially if you are at a natural star gate kind of thing. So there are technological means to do this also.

Now I am not a supporter of animal sacrifice, or any other type of sacrifice, I think it's something you will end up paying for karmically. That's the thing that's really crazy about the secret orders. It's not that I dislike them as people. I have known a lot of people that are in these groups. Its more that they have a fundamental misunderstanding of how consciousness really functions, which is a loving creation that we live in.

Dan Burisch's data talks about a group of entities from Orion; that is mentioned in the Law of One series. The Law of One series says that the Orions are a negative group. Negative, meaning that they have an intention to try to take over, to try to control people through fear.

So these Orions, according to Dan Burisch's testimony, come from the future, travel back in time and they are trying to fix their genetic code. They're trying to fix their DNA. They say this because they were bred from a small number of people who survived the cataclysm on earth.

So, put your thinking cap on! What did we just learn about DNA?

DNA is something that is modified by an outside energy. You can take a salamander embryo, zap it, re-direct into a frog embryo, the frog transforms. So the universe, even if you have a small population, you can still rejuvenate your DNA by consciousness.

That's not what's happening to the J-rods. The J-rods are experiencing what the Law of One referred to as the dissolution of the spirit body. When you're on the negative path, meaning the path where you create fear and you are trying to manipulate and control others, eventually you get to a point where your soul cannot hold its charge. Your soul begins dissolving and it actually affects your DNA.

Now, this (the Law of One Material) is in the 80s. This is 1981. Burisch's testimony comes out in 2000/2001. I saw this and I thought, "Oh my Gosh, this is a direct validation of what's in the Law of One series!"

You have to realize that there are two opposing ... according to Burisch, there's the Illuminati on one side and there are the neo-cons on the other side, Majestic or the 'order of death' as Alex Jones just called it in his documentary, which is now number one on Google video at the moment.

So, you have two groups - the Illuminati believe in a luciferian philosophy.

Imagine if you are this secret society and you've been around for thousands of years and then this group comes along and says they're Christian, and they start torturing and killing all your people, and telling you that your knowledge is evil and that you are a bad person. Your natural instinct is going to be to say, okay, well, whoever they say is the bad guy, must be the good guy. Oh, well, Lucifer was the angel who had the greatest amount of wisdom and light; God's brightest angel who was tossed out of heaven.

Well, wherever he got thrown out from, that's not where we want to be because these Christians are torturing us, persecuting us, killing us. The Christians are suppressing science because they only say the bible's way. They are suppressing your natural instincts. They don't want you to have sex, they don't want you to procreate, except under unique circumstances with a contract, legal contract, marriage.

So the Illuminati got started as a natural rebellion, of these secret orders, to what was already being established. They brought in the Egyptian Gods, Isis and Osiris.

Osiris is represented in Egyptian mythology by the severed phallus, the penis, which is symbolized by the obelisk.

Isis is symbolized by a woman holding the torch, which represents the secret mystery school teachings, and the book which represents the mystery school teachings, and she has these rays coming off of her head.

Torch, book, rays on the head, American sculpture, harbor of New York City - ah, the Statue of Liberty! Obelisk - ah, Washington Monument! Hmm.

So this is the back of the dollar bill, the pyramid, the eye on top. They hide it right out in front of you, and they laugh at you. They laugh at you because you don't understand. I have been with these guys. I have been in the room with them and they laugh at the average person at how stupid they are... in their minds, stupidity. I don't agree with that, but it is nonetheless amazing that they put the information out there, if you want to know it you can know it, so few people believe it and they are smug with their sarcasm and don't believe any of this stuff.

But here's the deal. The 2012 thing is about consciousness evolution. It's about love. It's about choosing to love.

All you have to do to get to be a part of the earth that's coming, is be slightly more focused on loving people and helping them, rather than manipulating and controlling them.

If you have ten things that you do each day, five of them are negative meaning you manipulate, you control people, five of them are positive, meaning of yeah, you can get in front of me in traffic, or let me help you across the street, if it's a perfect mix of 5 to 5, then you are still not going to make it.

But if you are at 51%, meaning that 49% of the things that you do are selfish and manipulative and controlling, as long as you're 51% you're going to go through this vortex, you're going to end up in the Earth in 4th density, as it's called.

How am I supposed to rectify when I get to L.A. seven years after I did these tapes, I had 25 or more tapes that I hadn't transcribed. I was in a bad relationship and I just stopped transcribing. You remember the stacks of tapes on my desk, right?

Seven years later I had a dream that was saying, "you've got to transcribe these tapes now."

I'm in Hollywood. I'm working on a movie. Seven years ago when I did this channeling, I was living in the loft of a barn working in construction. I wasn't even making enough money from my readings to do it full-time. It was 1998 and early 1999.

I sit down, and I start transcribing these tapes from seven years ago. They're talking about 2012. They're talking about ascension and they're also talking about my being in L.A, my working on a film - all these things. The names of the people I'm working with, the cat that our editor had, all the personalities. Even to the point where I had these sweet potatoes I bought at the health food store and they went to sprout on my refrigerator, and then I go back to this tape from seven years ago and it's describing sweet potatoes going to sprout on the top of a refrigerator.

Seven years from then is when this happened. We have seven years from now until 2012. I get readings where they're saying what my future is seven years in the future. In the same reading they're saying what's going to happen after 2012. That we're going to have this world that is 100 times more harmonious than what we are living in now. This is a world in which you can levitate yourself. You can manifest instant healing, instant telepathic communication, nobody can keep a secret. It's totally harmonious because there are no secrets. You can fly. It's ascension!

Jesus, in John 14:12 said: "As I do these things, so shall you do greater things, for I go unto my Father".

Now again, I'm not a fundamentalist. I'm not a bible thumper. I know it's not fashionable to be Christian, especially because of the war on terror and how that's all become manipulated into the next crusade.

But, nonetheless, don't you think that maybe Jesus knew what he was talking about? Don't you think that maybe enough people witnessed what he was doing, that this is based on real testimony and is not all a fabrication like some books have said?

Whenever I would read one of these books that would start saying that Jesus was made up and was fictional, I would start getting all these thought forms of evil and I got messages saying, look, you know, he was real. He got blown way out of proportion in terms of people making him into the only Son of God; that was never intended. Jesus would say "I'm the Son of Man."

But what if this rapture thing is real?

Well, you have a whole scenario in the Book of Revelations describing an anti-Christ, which had gotten worldwide power, that was wounded on the side and yet did live, and the mark of the beast on the forehead. The mark of the beast is people shutting down their third eye. It doesn't have anything to do with micro chipping. None of that stuff is going to happen. They might want it to happen, 'they', meaning the Illuminati or those types of people, but it won't happen.

I really don't see, prophetically speaking, a negative future for humanity. I see predominantly a positive future. I have had dreams in which the entire pantheon of Neo-cons in the Bush administration ends up being held accountable for what they have been doing, which involves manipulation and control.

I think we are heading into a very interesting time in the future. I do not see massive, irreversible economic collapse. The vast majority of people on the inside in both groups - the Majestic and the Illuminati - are now well aware of this 2012 thing that's going to happen. They only see it as a cataclysm because when you're working from separation and control, some of the people that are on that path will probably experience pole shift. But you have this three way split.

Kerry: So what happens to the other two branches? Because you were talking about a three way split, and you've talked about the good side...

David: Right. The vast number of people, at this point (although it's changing) are stuck in what the Law of One called the miasma of indifference. What that means is, the average person on this planet has not chosen whether they are service to self or service to others, meaning they have not chosen whether they want to manipulate people or whether they want to love people. That's what it really boils down to.

Now in the secret orders, you have some very cynical people in there. You're born into this thing where you are abused from the time you're born. You have to go to these rituals at night. You're seeing these slicers and dicers, that's what they call them in the lower echelons; but the vast majority of the people in the Illuminati don't like what's happening and would get out if they could. They don't like it, but they're stuck because if you try to escape, they'll kill you.

You have to go to these meetings starting from 1:30 in the morning until about 4:00 in the morning. So you end up going to sleep with your clothes on, two times a week and you are indoctrinated with all the cult teachings, and they tell you that you are going to be this wonderful leader in the new order, and they want to have control over the earth because they inherited this ascension prophecy. They know it's coming. That's why it's on the dollar bill.

'Novus Ordo Seclorum"... New World Order. "Annuit Septis"... He has looked with favor on our beginnings...

The pyramid without the capstone is six sided. Okay, you have the four sides, the bottom and the top. That's six. What happens when you put the cap-stone on? How many sides do you get then? The top is eliminated. You only have five. One, two three, four, and the bottom is five. In pyramid numerology six means imperfection; evil, five means perfection and divinity.

So the cap stone returning to the pyramid represents the New World Order, the new age, which originally was not a bad thing.

So our insiders are now aware of this. People say, "why are they deficit spending, why are they running up the national debt so much, and why are they polluting the atmosphere and cutting down the rain forest and nuclear missiles and dah, dah, dah, dah? How can they be doing this? It's almost like they're not planning for the future. They don't think it's going to matter. Well, that's true. What does it matter if you pollute the earth? What does it matter if there is global warming? So, this is what starts to make sense out of all the madness.

Kerry: ...so that's two...

David: Right. I'm sorry, I didn't answer the question expediently.

Kerry: And so we have a third group? What happens to them?

David: The negative group graduates 4D negative. That's a very small number and that's the people who become the J-rods and the P-52s, P-45s, P-24s. Those are all your negative graduates. They stay with the earth, and experience pole shift. They experience cataclysm; some of them are underground, some of them are on the surface. The ones on the surface are the P-52s that go to Orion. The ones on the ground are the J-rods and P-45s.

Most people on earth pop into time/space, the one down here, and they recreate the earth exactly as it had been except that now, you're in fantasy land. You can levitate if you chose to, or you can see beams of light.


(continued from Part 1)
(continued in
Part 3 and Part 4)



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