Ralph Ring and Otis Carr
Ralph Ring and Otis T. Carr
Las Vegas, August 2006
Ring is a brilliant innovative technician who as a young man
in the late 1950s and early 1960s worked closely with Otis
T. Carr. With the aid of his small team, Carr, who was himself
a protegé of the great inventor Nikola Tesla, built
a number of flying disks, which worked.... prior to their experimentation
being forcibly terminated by government agents.
In a dramatic experiment, Ring co-piloted a 45 foot disk a distance of ten miles,
arriving at their destination instantaneously. Ring, now aged 71, tells his story
–the first time it has been reported.
must always work with Mother Nature. Force is never necessary.
The laws of the physical universe are really very simple."
Ring, interviewed by Kerry Cassidy, August 2006
are assuming that ET crafts are made with our technology...
Many years ago, we made that same mistake and it took us
several years to correct the mistake and start fresh from
the drawing board. Their technology is nothing similar to
ours... We started from scratch and learned their principles
of dynamics, physics, etc... The ET craft was manufactured
using ET technology. This craft was built many years before
we developed flight. They used a different physics principle
that we still don't fully understand... I've worked on this
project for 12 years and I sometimes call myself dumb because
I try to compare the craft with our technology. Doing that
is dumb, as all who have worked on the craft over the years
have come to understand."
Alamos National Laboratories physicist, quoted in Exempt
from Disclosure, by Robert Collins
pilots... knew they were going very fast, but it was so fast
that they saw things stand still in time... At first our
pilots could not interface with the craft. The Alien Life
Form corrected the problem with three fingers on the globe
panel. Then the wave formed and the craft began to cooperate
and generate lift..."
Jesus Angleton (CIA), quoted in Exempt from
Disclosure, by Robert Collins
vehicle was simply an extension of their own bodies because
it was tied into their neurological systems…"
Philip J. Corso, The Day After Roswell
flying machine will have neither wings nor propellers. You
might see it on the ground and you would never guess that
it was a flying machine. Yet it will be able to move at will
through the air in any direction with perfect safety."
Tesla, interviewed in The New York Herald Tribune,
material recently discovered by Ralph Ring:
here to download a complete unpublished book by Otis T. Carr, written
in 1952, entitled DIMENSIONS OF MYSTERY. The typewritten manuscript
is an 83 page PDF (23 Mb).
Nine 1958 Long John Nebel radio shows featuring Otis T. Carr and/or
his work. The quality is poor, but the content is of historical
interest. Long John Nebel had a wide audience, covered all aspects
of the unusual and paranormal, and was the Art Bell of his day. (To
users right-click and then select Save As; Mac users option-click.)
here for Margaret Storm on her new book Return of the Dove,
featuring Otis Carr, date unknown (Part 1)
-- Click here for
Margaret Storm on her new book Return of the Dove, featuring Otis
Carr, date unknown (Part 2)
here for Otis Carr, 19 April 1958 (Part 1)
-- Click here for Otis
Carr, 19 April 1958 (Part 2)
here for Margaret Storm and Otis Carr, 11 July 1958 (Part
-- Click here for
Margaret Storm and Otis Carr, 11 July 1958 (Part 2)
-- Click here for
Otis Carr, 15 November 1958 (Part 1)
-- Click here for
Otis Carr, 15 November 1958 (Part 2)
here for Otis Carr, 15 November 1958 (Part 3)
Camelot is privileged to have been introduced to Ralph Ring, a gifted
intuitive technician who in the late 1950s and early 1960s worked closely
with Otis T. Carr, a protegé of the great inventor Nikola Tesla.
Prior to meeting Carr, Ralph had helped the famous French oceanographer
Jacques Cousteau develop the aqualung, and had then spent a period working
with a government-funded research organization called Advanced Kinetics.
Bill Ryan talked with Ralph for over twelve hours on their first
meeting, in March 2006. He was genial, charismatic, gentle, compelling,
and sprightly for his 71 years. The story he told was captivating.
Ralph Ring in 1984
essence, the account is as follows. Carr and a small group of engineers
and technicians, one of whom was Ralph, built a flying disk, powered by
in conjunction with a number of small, ingenious capacitor-like devices
called "Utrons". A number of prototypes were built, ranging in
size from experimental models a few feet across to a passenger-carrying
craft which was fully 45 feet in diameter. The smaller disks flew successfully
– one even disappeared completely and was permanently lost –
and Ralph himself testifies to having co-piloted, with two others, the large
craft a distance of some ten miles, traversing this distance instantaneously.
Carr was seriously intent on taking his craft to the moon. However, two
weeks after Ralph's dramatic experience, their laboratory was forcibly shut
down by government agents and all files and documentation were confiscated.
The group was forced to disband, and the project was never completed. Dismayed
and frustrated, Ralph later bought some land in Arizona where he built a
futuristic disk-shaped home which he said was astonishingly energy-efficient
and, he later realized, decades ahead of its time.
metal turned to Jell-o. You could push your finger right into it. It
ceased to be solid. It turned into another form of matter, which was
as if it was not entirely here in this reality."
work has been recorded in several places, but the details are relatively
scant. One highly respected physicist, researching alternative energy systems
with the backing of a substantial organization, told Bill Ryan that he "had
never investigated Otis Carr because his claims just seemed too outlandish."
But few researchers are aware that one of the team of Carr's engineers is
still alive. Project Camelot is proud to tell Ralph Ring's story, and will
be releasing a video interview with him within the next few weeks.
When recalling the heady events of the late 1950s working day and night
with Carr, Ring again and again stressed that the key was working with nature.
"Resonance", he would emphasize repeatedly. "You
have to work with nature, not against her." He described how
when the model disks were powered up and reached a particular rotational
speed, "...the metal turned to Jell-o. You could push your finger right
into it. It ceased to be solid. It turned into another form of matter, which
was as if it was not entirely here in this reality. That's the only way
I can attempt to describe it. It was uncanny, one of the weirdest sensations
I've ever felt."
was it like working with Carr? "He was an unquestioned genius. Tesla
had recognized his quality immediately and had taught him everything he
knew. He was inspired, and – like Tesla – seemed to know exactly
what to do to get something to work. He was a private man and was also very
metaphysical in his thinking. I think the fact that he was not formally
trained in physics helped him. He was not constrained by any preconceived
ideas. As crazy as it sounds now, he was determined to fly to the moon and
really believed it could be done. I believed it. We all did."
was completely astonished when we realized that we had returned with
samples of rocks and plants from our destination. It was
a dramatic success. It was more like a kind of teleportation."
the craft fly? "Fly is not the right word. It traversed distance. It
seemed to take no time. I was with two other engineers when we piloted the
45' craft about ten miles. I thought it hadn't moved – I thought it
had failed. I was completely astonished when we realized that we had returned
with samples of rocks and plants from our destination. It was a dramatic
success. It was more like a kind of teleportation.
more, time was distorted somehow. We felt we were in the craft about fifteen
or twenty minutes. We were told afterwards that we'd been carefully timed
as having been in the craft no longer than three or four minutes. I still
have no complete idea how it worked. We just built it exactly according
to Carr's instructions. Everything had to be perfect... it all had to be
just so, or it he said it would not work: a kind of symbiotic state between
man and machine.
"The Utron was the key to it all. Carr said it accumulated energy because
of its shape, and focused it, and also responded to our conscious intentions.
When we operated the machine, we didn't work any controls. We went into
a kind of meditative state and all three of us focused our intentions on
the effect we wanted to achieve. It sounds ridiculous, I know. But that's
what we did, and that's what worked. Carr had tapped into some principle
which is not understood, in which consciousness melds with engineering to
create an effect. You can't write that into equations. I have no idea how
he knew it would work. But it did.
are two secrets to making the alien saucers work. One is their advanced
engineering, and the other is their mental ability."
lost count of the number of people who have refused to believe what happened.
I no longer talk about it. It's no fun being laughed at and ridiculed. But
I've described it exactly as it occurred. One day someone will build the
disk just as we did and they'll have the same experience. All his blueprints
still exist. Nowadays, it would all be done with digital and solid state
circuitry - no moving parts would be necessary.
heard that the aliens use the same principle to operate their craft. Their
physics seems to work in harness with their consciousness. The craft amplifies
the power of their minds. Their craft won't operate without the pilots.
I've heard that's why we can't operate their craft – or, at any rate,
we can't operate them the way they do. We're just not adept enough mentally
and spiritually. So there are two secrets to making the saucers work. One
is the advanced engineering, and the other is the mental and spiritual ability.
We may have duplicated some of the first, but we may be a long way from
the second yet."
Ralph Ring with Bill Ryan
Ryan left Ralph having promised to get the information into the hands of
someone who could understand and then duplicate the dramatic experiments
conducted by Carr and his team. Ralph and Bill Ryan had agreed to work together
to see the project through to its reality. Shortly afterwards, Ralph went
into hospital for a routine knee replacement operation. He accidentally
received the wrong treatment, and nearly died three times. At the time of
writing (July 2006) he has just recently emerged, very frail, from intensive
care - but is determined to tell his story. Prior to that he had enjoyed
perfect health for 71 years.
This is exactly what Project Camelot is for.
about Otis Carr currently in the public domain:
to Otis Carr, "Any vehicle accelerated to an axis rotation relative
to its attractive inertial mass, immediately becomes activated by free-space-energy
and acts as an independent force... We have shown that a charged body,
accelerated to an axis rotation relative to this attractive inertial mass,
indicates polarity in a given direction.
"The dip-needle points, say, up toward the top of the body. But mount
this while rotating body, with its spindle, on another platform and rotate
this platform on a spindle, then if the counter-rotation is greater than
the inertial forward rotation of the body, a dip-needle on the second
platform will point down while the first dip-needle points up, indicating
complete relativity of polarity. When the exact counter-rotation matches
the forward rotation the body loses its polarity entirely and immediately
becomes activated by free-energy (tensor stresses in space) and acts as
an independent force... The above-described assembly of counter-rotating
charged masses becomes weightless and will escape the immediate attraction
of gravitational forces."
Carr's engine had only two moving parts – like two spinning tops
on top of one another, each spinning in a different direction. Carr stated
that "when counter-rotation matches forward rotation, a body loses
its polarity... and creates a kind of independent force. This causes the
counter-rotating mass to escape the full effect of gravitational influence."
results, pertaining to the apparent antigravitic properties of rotating
objects, have been shown by a variety of researchers – most notably,
the eminent British engineer Professor
Eric Laithwaite, who demonstrated an apparent loss of weight in a
sealed system containing an arrangement of spinning gyroscopes and called
upon the scientific community to research the phenomenon. Intriguingly,
the "Jell-o" description of the altered state of solid metal,
attained under specific and unusual conditions, has also been reported
by the researcher John
Hutchison, and is part of
the lore of The
to Carr, his vehicle was actually finished in 1947, but at the time he
was unable to generate any interest in it. Carr stated that the core of
his space ship would be a huge battery which would spin at the velocity
of the external craft and which would be recharged by its own motion.
Carr went on to declare that such a battery, built to any size, could
be designed to power the largest electric generating plant, operate an
automobile, heat a house or power any conceivable machine or device.
April 15, 1959 a launch event was held in Oklahoma City with hundreds
of people invited, having been told that a prototype disk would rise 400
to 600 feet off the ground from a gravel pit. After several hours delay,
an announcement was made that the launch was being postponed due to a
badly engineered bearing. However, it subsequently emerged that Carr had
been admitted into hospital for eight days with a lung hemorrhage, in
addition to which, in a preliminary pre-flight test, the accumulator had
developed a leak which had sprayed mercury over the inside mechanism.
Carr's claims began to attract the attention of the US Government in the
late 1950s. Major Wayne Aho, a former Army Combat Intelligence Officer
during World War II, announced that he would take the craft to the moon
on December 7, 1959, that the trip would take 5 hours, and that he would
remain in orbit for 7 days before returning. The 45 diameter craft he
was to use weighed 30 tons and "was powered by the Utron engine".
On June 2, 1960, Carr told an audience of 300 people that it was a "treacherous
misstatement of fact to say or infer that we [OTC Enterprises] are coming
to California to raise money in stock sales." The U.S. Securities
and Exchange Commission had placed an injunction against Carr, ordering
him to cease selling unregistered stock. Negative publicity began to appear
in various publications, and there were hints of impropriety, though never
with any proof. The press began to turn against him.
In January, 1961 the Attorney General of New York, Louis J. Lefkowitz,
stated that Carr had swindled $50,000, and later that year True Magazine
labeled him a hoaxer. By then, his laboratory had been raided and destroyed,
and the group of engineers had been ordered to disband and cease contact
with one another. It is not known what became either of Carr himself or
the craft... but they never flew again. Carr is reported to have suffered
from ill-health, a broken man. He passed away in Gardnerville, Nevada,
The design of the OTC
click on each image to view it in high resolution.
John" Nebel (WOR Radio, NY) with Otis Carr and Norman Colton (29 October,
LJ ("Long John" Nebel): According to the schedule here the delivered
price payable in full on delivery, with no prior commitments required,
and including all poolings, and other overhead is 20 million dollars.
Additional identical units are on the same schedule for 4 million dollars
each. That's a lot of money! My name is Long John and we call this "the
I imagine you wonder what I'm talking about for 20 million dollars. Well,
I've had a few sponsors and we've sold a few things, but I don't have
O.T.C. Enterprises Inc. of Baltimore, Maryland as sponsor but they do
have something to sell. Mainly, a circular foil spacecraft that is available
for 20 million dollars. We have talked about flying saucers on the program
many times. But tonight it appears to me we have two very solid citizens
who represent O.T.C. Enterprises and according to all of the brochures,
all of the booklets, everything we have in front of us and believe me
we have a stack of things in front of us, including miniature working
models, and with all of this material. I'm led to believe these men and
believe that there is something to flying saucers.
Oklahoma County attorney William Berry (left),
Otis T. Carr (center), and Hubert Gibson, Carr's attorney (right)
the men that I'm referring to are Otis. T. Carr, President and Norman
Evans Colton, Director of Sales Engineering. These gentlemen are associated
with O.T.C. Enterprises, and we'll be talking with them tonight about
the possibility of making a craft that can go to Venus, that can go to
the Moon, that can go to Mars, that costs 20 million dollars. And after
we have the first one the rest of them won't cost too much, about 4 million
dollars each. We have with us this morning Ben I. and Mel Saloney. They
will be doing a lot of talking with a lot of people and I hope that you
might call some of your friends and neighbors and tell them that if they
are interested in flying saucers, this is one night that they should be
Mr. Carr, some time ago one of our listeners sent me a brochure that was
published by O.T.C. Enterprises. It's a very beautiful brochure; it's
certainly a very inspiring one, and when I read this offer about a spacecraft
that would be made available for 20 million dollars, I nearly flipped
and I mentioned it on the air, and evidently somebody contacted your Director
of Sales Engineering, Mr. Colton and he contacted us and that's why you're
here this morning.
Before we talk about the particular space craft that you intend to manufacture,
I would like to ask you a couple of questions. One; Do you believe in
the possibility of flying saucers coming to this planet, the planet Earth,
from other planets?
OTC (Otis T. Carr): We believe that there are unidentified electrified
objects in the air. We have seen three on three separate occasions.
LJ: Do you say you've seen three, Mr. Carr? Did you see them in the air?
Were they hovering above a particular location?
OTC: In the air, they were going at great velocity and they were definitely
electrified because we have been working on the same principle for many
years and we recognize what we saw.
LJ: Well when you say electrified, what other type, if we may use the
word saucers this morning because many of our listeners understand that,
what other type of saucers could there be other than electrified, could
there be gas driven or something, Sir?
OTC: There could be if we followed principles now known within our atmosphere.
There are many manners in which a circular craft could be used, such as
the helo principal and jets on the area close to the foil, the leading
edge. But in the incidents of the three different ones which we saw in
1951 and 1952 they were definitely electrical and they were very close
to what we had already designed.
LJ: Did you say the 'Helo' system?
OTC: That's right. Well any system of circular rotation that can use a
motive power such as jet propulsion would make an airborne craft.
LJ: In what way is your invention different from the unidentified flying
objects which you have seen?
OTC: We do not know, naturally not having been able to examine the objects
we saw due to the great velocity, we can't say with certainty that they
are similar to ours, but the principle we feel is the same. Our design
utilizes gravity, electromagnetism, and electromotive force and a relative
field to get its functional operation.
LJ: I haven't understood a single word of your last sentence. Without
getting at all technical could you sort of make it a little bit easier?
OTC: We use this statement that we use an electrified sender. It's a central
power core. Now this is what we call an 'accumulator.' In a vernacular
sense, it is a factory. It is a storage cell, an accumulation of storage
cells which provide an electromotive force in the same manner that any
known battery produces an electromotive force.
Wayne Aho (left), and Otis T. Carr (second from left).
The two men on the right are unknown.
LJ: Is that what you are holding in your hand there?
OTC: That's right.
LJ: Can you describe it?
OTC: This is a dimensional object. It was designed with the dimensions
of space itself. We say it is truly the geometric form of space, because
it is completely round and completely square. Now in this surface they
are all round but when we show it this way the surfaces are square. It
has been proven in scientific laboratories that the very smallest unit
of mass matter ever photographed in the electron microscope are square
in shape. This has only been found out in the last couple of months. We
have known it for years and have applied this principle into an electrified
system, which is the power core of our space vehicle. Now what makes this
different and unique and novel from a battery is the fact that this is
a piece of moving machinery that rotates. Our average storage battery
is an inanimate object set in an inertial spot and then the electromotive
force is conducted by wires from this battery to animate some object.
LJ: Let me interrupt a moment, I'll try to describe it further. Well,
it looks like two ice cream cones put together at the wide ends, but the
angle is a lot wider than that of the ice cream cones. There are a series
of ridges that look like gears would fit in. Is that correct?
OTC: No, those are in a sense 'turbines principles'. They are 'reactive
channels'. And where there is atmosphere a flow of air there aids rotation.
LJ: Well then, is this one of the components of the drive, this is the
OTC: This is the central power core.
LJ: This generates electricity?
OTC: This is right. This is a storage cell for electrical energy. In operation
it generates electricity at the same time it puts out electromotive force.
This is the central power system for our space craft.
LJ: I can tell this, that it opened up and it appears to be hollowed out
on the inside, much, I would say....well it's circular, the inside, when
the two parts are put one on top of the other and they fit into place,
the cavity inside is circular.
OTC: It is a sphere, yes. And each unit is a hemisphere. We call the center
of this, this large dimension the equator and of course it contracts and
expands to a point on each side. It's the union of two conical sections,
that is what it is. Two right angle sections, and we say it is the dimensions
of space and we have shown how this comes about.
LJ: This is Tuesday morning October 29th, 1957....Here is a paragraph
that you sent copies of your brochure outlining your system of propulsion
that you have developed to President Eisenhower and the Cabinet and the
Atomic Energy Commission. Have you received an answer from them?
OTC: There was recognition of receiving the material.
LJ: Beyond that did they give any value judgment on what you had to contribute?
OTC: No, we have not received any value judgment.
LJ: Don't you think that is a little odd?
OTC: Yes, I do.
LJ: Is there any way that you can explain it?
OTC: I have my own ideas about this. Of course no way to substantiate
such ideas. To give my own personal opinion, we have a truly safe vehicle
which is not expendable, it does not burn up its energy in a few seconds,
it carries the energy with it, it can leave the earth's atmosphere and
return man, it also can be used within the atmosphere. It can make a trip
as easily as other aerial transportation systems from here to Baltimore
or from here to the moon. Now it is inexpensive, it certainly doesn't
cost as much as the systems of the expanding rocket. The fueling is much
less expensive and whether or not our offer is entering into an economic
picture that is not feasible at this time, we don't know. This is one
of our opinions.
Ben: Mr. Carr. I've been glancing at the literature that you provided
us with. I've been going over it and there is a mathematical formula that
crops up here that intrigues me, minus zero divided by plus zero equals
zero. The first time I ever saw a minus zero is in a mathematical equation
in the work of Einstein. I wonder if you can tell me more about it and
how you stumbled upon this idea.
OTC: The equation is brought about by the shape of our Utron electrical
accumulator, this is the name given to our central power system. In our
operation of working models and in checking out experiments, we had to
find the formula that fit the reason for the action and reaction we were
getting. So in exploring nature and studying the great inspirational work
of Dr. Einstein on relativity, we came upon this formula of linear correlation.
And when we study linear correlation in geometric form, we have to have
a starting point and this is the point. And from there it expands through
the cross and through the circle. And the mathematics, the only way we
can express it, is in the symbolism of zero X (or 0x) and this formula
brings us to that. We claim that this is the true unified field theory
in physical practice.
Ben: The thing I wonder about....is how you were led to the concept of
a minus 0.
OTC: In a further study of Dr. Einstein's great inspirational work and
we corresponded with him and we had the great good fortune of being advised
by him at one time, we learned that all measurements of time and space
had to be considered in relationship to the observer and therefore there
never was a fixed equation, due to the observer being an attempt, as I
understand it, the observer himself being somewhat the minus factor and
therefore you can't have any fixed quantity of any number. Now in physical
form, this is something else again. We worked for a considerable time
with and had many conferences with the great Nikola Tesla and his evaluation
of the sine wave and electrical principles and the true value of alternating
current and hydro-electric systems were developed by the great genius
of this man. Further inspirations came to us and finally from this knowledge
and continuing to seek we found this formula.
Ben: Did you find this formula, Mr. Carr?
OTC: I found it with the assistance of Mr. Colton in the evaluation. Mr.
Colton researches very heavily in all the work that I do and we collaborate
very closely. Also Mr. Shea collaborates with me in research.
LJ: Mr. Carr, when was O.T.C. incorporated?
LJ: And how long prior to the year 1955 were you associated with Mr. Shea
and Mr. Colton?
OTC: Not before that, they have come with me since then.
LJ: Were you interested in this before 1955?
OTC: We started, I use the editorial 'we', this development in 1937. Our
investigations began in 1937. We were actively making models in 1938.
In 1942 we had come up with the basic principles.
LJ: In other words, 18 years prior to this year you had in your mind that
possibly some type of craft could be developed that you could go into
space with? Is that right?
OTC: This is true.
LJ: Do you hope with this craft, if you are able to manufacture it, that
you can go to other planets with it?
OTC: Escaping from the immediate gravity pull of the earth plus the heavy
atmosphere of the earth enables us, just as our satellites are doing now,
to join a universal free energy system. They have a velocity now of 18,000
miles per hour, more or less, without any expenditure of energy whatsoever.
Now any energy attached to this would immediately throw them into a higher
velocity orbit which would expand them further into space...This is extremely
easy to do. We feel that our craft will gradually escape and possibly
escape the atmosphere of the earth and then we can handle velocities almost
unimaginable in reaching other gravity systems and the moon should not
be more than five hours away.
LJ: Five hours away from Baltimore, Maryland.
OTC: That's right.
LJ: How many people can you have in this craft?
OTC: The one we have on the design board which is 45 feet in diameter,
the cabin would accommodate three to be comfortable.
LJ: And with type of equipment will you have on board of this craft?
OTC: On this craft, insofar as the individuals are concerned, can travel
the same as in a pressurized airliner. We don't have the problem of a
LJ: What about high velocity?
OTC: We don't have a problem of thermal barriers because the electro-magnetic
system sets up a protective shield in our craft which enables us to overcome
this barrier without any discomfort to the occupants inside the craft.
And we can very slowly rise, and once we are outside the atmosphere, we
can accelerate to tremendous velocities up to the speed of light itself.
LJ: I am greatly interested though in the method of landing this craft
if you were able to get to the moon. Let's forget the moon a minute, if
you get the craft up from this planet from the airport to Baltimore, how
would it land sir?
OTC: Back in Baltimore?
OTC: Very simply, we can fly at a very slow velocity of 100/ft. per minute
or less and we can sit down as gently as a feather because part of the
operation of our craft has joined universal systems. This is a relative
velocity of the attractive inertial mass, it becomes weightless as regards
this inertial attraction. Individually, it is not weightless, it has the
same weight as before, but when it reaches the relative location it becomes
an independent system just as a planet is an independent system.
LJ: Is there any gravitational pull at this point sir?
OTC: None whatsoever.
LJ: What happens to the occupants of the space craft?
OTC: They are perfectly comfortable.
LJ: I mean are their heads on the ceiling?
OTC: Not at all. They will have the same feeling of pressure or weight
that they have right now because we will maintain as near as possible
the atmospheric pressure of the earth at sea level inside the craft.
LJ: This is rather technical for me, Mr. Carr, so please accept my apologies
for being rather stupid and ignorant in my line of questioning. I am under
the impression that the only reason I'm able to sit in this chair, is
because of gravitational pull.
OTC: We have this at around 14 pounds per square inch within our atmosphere.
We have been able to be sealed off away from such a condition and thus
artificially with atmospheric pressure the pressure in the cabin is maintained.
We have it very well in submarines. The same may be used in our craft.
LJ: In other words, under sea, where a submarine may be, there is no gravitational
pull, is that what you're saying?
OTC: There is a gravitational pull at all times but we're speaking about
the atmosphere of the particular occupants inside a sealed unit.
LJ: Is that necessary to keep occupants in the position they desire.
OTC: Absolutely, because in a vacuum they are at the mercy of any velocity.
LJ: What would happen, sir, if there was some kind of instrument that
you could turn on and eliminate the gravitation pull that was in this
OTC: You would in a sense become very buoyant and this is not in itself
a novelty but it certainly does not have any disastrous effects on humanity.
LJ: Would I remain in this position?
OTC: You could, but any movement could move you out of it.
LJ: Would objects, the mike, remain in position?
OTC: Until they were brought into any other movement. Any movement would
make them buoyant themselves.
LJ: I have a lead pencil, if I hold it in the air and release my fingers,
it would fall because of gravitational pull.
OTC: This is true.
LJ: If we had this other condition which you so aptly described a moment
ago, if I released my fingers would the pencil remain in midair?
OTC: This is true, it would stay there.
LJ: I believe what you are saying is that you'd be creating an artificial
gravitational field within the body of the space craft and yet there would
not be any gravity on the outside?
OTC: Exactly correct.
LJ: And this is done by the battery which I attempted to describe, spinning
around and producing its own gravitational influence?
OTC: Yes, this is the beginning of an answer to your question: we have
capacitor plates and electro-magnets as a part of this system. Now this
is counter-rotating, the electro-magnets rotate in one direction and the
accumulator, the batteries rotate in another. The capacitor plates rotate
in conjunction with the battery so that we have a clockwise and counter
clockwise rotation. Now the third system is the cabin that maintains the
crew. This does not rotate, it is fixed due to the fact the two bodies
are rotating clockwise and counter clockwise. Therefore the system causes
the craft to escape from the gravity pull. The craft itself due to this
system still has internal gravity because it still has the same weight
that it had in the beginning.
LJ: What charges this battery?
OTC: This starts out electrochemically the same as other batteries, but
we do have a regenerating system that is very unique. We are able here,
the first time to our knowledge, to use atmospheric electricity as a recharging
system. This is done as a part of operational principal of the craft.
LJ: You say you use atmospheric electricity. What happens when you use
the atmospheric and there isn't any atmosphere?
OTC: We have electrochemical systems to provide us with all the energy
that we need and have a regenerating system in the manner of a regenerative
coil that recharges this battery, in the same manner that the storage
battery in the automobile is recharged now, by a generator.
LJ: What you have done is made the first perpetual motion machine.
OTC: There is nothing perpetual about our machine. The energies which
cause it to operate are perpetual. You cannot destroy matter, you cannot
destroy energy. Molecular flow is perpetual and has been proven in the
laboratory. It has been proven that electricity itself is immortal. When
we take away resistance we can set up a spark of electricity and it will
continue to operate, therefore we have perpetual energy. No machine that
we can conceive of made by man would be perpetual, but it is free energy.
It's self energizing and as long as all parts function and do not wear
out this is truly a self energizing machine.
Ben: About this formula, were you using conventional algebraic methods?
OTC: No, we weren't, partially conventional, but we were joining actual
space forms. We arrived at satisfactory equations for ourselves which
can be demonstrated.
Ben: Are the physical laws upon which your invention works, are they expressible
in mathematical terms?
OTC: Possibly, but I wouldn't say that I'm qualified. We're satisfied
with this formula.
Ben: Well, it's like saying plus 4 divided by minus 4 equals 4.
OTC: Sometimes these solutions are not always what they appear. As we
know, in synergy, we know one plus one equals three.
Ben: One plus one equals three? How?
OTC: Because two conditions always produce a third.
Ben: The third condition is 2 isn't it?
OTC: Not necessarily...
Ben: Could you go over these conditions?
OTC: If one condition operates one way and another operates another way,
and when they join you have another condition and their sum is 3.
Ben: Well that's a little bit over my head, I've been looking at this
prototype you have here and I noticed a wooden frame or scaffolding, you
have a larger model of.....that you have in it a turbine and around it
is a wooden ring and it seems to be filled with electromagnets.
OTC: That's right, this is a wood model of the operational model. What
we have here is the cones - our Utron electric accumulator - that is the
power system. This system activates the electromagnets and in turn activates...
Ben: Does the system - the thing inside - activate the electro-magnets
on the outside?
OTC: This is true. We do this by contacting this lead wire from the positive
and negative poles of these batteries to the electro-magnets and then
we have circuit breakers from these electro-magnets and we have counter-rotation.
These electro-magnets will rotate counter clockwise while the internal
area is rotating clockwise.
Ben: Are the spools of wire on the model itself, are they magnetized also?
OTC: The coils of wire inside the ring are regenerative coils, they are
electro-motive force coils and they assist the regenerating of the battery.
Because they are loops of wire brought through a magnetic field which
sets up an electro-motive force. These others are capacitor plates and
these are also activated by the central power core; but these plates,
which can accept a very high charge in neutral conductance also through
the process of ionization utilize atmospheric electricity.
Ben: I mean if you turn that thing... I don't see how you can get a square.
OTC: Dimensionally it is, it is square in these dimensions and when this
rotation starts and builds up to a certain velocity, this form is very
important because we have the total equation of action and reaction. Now
this is done by a system of coil winding wherein we start at a point,
expand to an equator, continue our winding down to a point. With this
physical expansion and contraction, is an electromagnetic field. Where
gravity enters the picture in the form of this relative rotation. When
the relative rotation reaches the inertial effective mass, it's a matter
of dimension. So that if the earth as we say is 8,000 miles in diameter,
we know its fixed rotation is 1 in 24 hrs. If we were 1 mile in diameter
its rotation would be 8,000 in 24 hrs. And by the same system, our 45
foot craft would have a rotation of 580 rpms a minute and when it reaches
this rotation it is totally independent of its inertial attractive mass,
in an electro-magnetic field.
Ben: 580 rpms a minute, that's not very fast is it?
OTC: Well, if you say a merry-go-round going 580 rpms a minute that would
be quite fast.
Ben: If your models get up to 580 rpms a minute, will they take off?
OTC: This model was spun at 40,000 rpms a minute and when it did it set
a pressure pattern of 1,000 tons, the horsepower reading was a little
over 700. Six engineers checked this out. Now the relative rotation of
this model would be about 68,000 rpms a minute and when it reaches this
rotation, it would immediately take off.
LJ: Sam Vanderburt is the photographer who took pictures here this morning.
They will appear in edition of Argosy Magazine dated April, 1958.
LJ: A question from a telegram - Would the time factor be involved with
OTC: In our solar system, the time factor would be involved, yes. We evaluate
time on the velocity of light and in certain systems, if we exceed the
velocity of light, unquestionably the time would slow up.
Ben: Your craft can exceed the velocity of light?
OTC: We don't say this, I say in other systems.
Ben: I thought nothing could do this, I thought it was a constant factor,
one of Einstein's factors.
OTC: Possibly in our system, but not necessarily true in other systems.
Ben: Anything approaching the speed of light becomes pure energy.
OTC: Pure energy, but in other systems it could change.
Ben: What other systems?
OTC: Other solar systems, we are completely controlled by our system and
here the velocity of light is our yardstick and our pattern and our craft
is designed around this...
Ben: You just don't upset one of the basic principles of the universe.
Mel Salomey: Doesn't Einstein say any measurement is relative?
Ben: Except this one, it's the first axiom.
Mel: What is an axiom?
Ben: Self-evident truth.
Mel: Thank you. Wasn't Einstein theorizing, wasn't he assuming?
OTC: However we have to get back to what has been accomplished. We have
invented an electrified system which makes it possible for a propulsion
system which put into operation can carry human beings, with a fuel system
which is not expendable and take them into space and bring them back and
return in this craft. If I had the tools now, and those tools are available
in large plants. If those tools were available to me we could have this
craft on the moon in six months from this date.
Q: Mr. Carr, on this sheet I have in front of me, the sheet headed, Performance
Characteristics and Delivery Terms for the OTC-X1 circular foil space
craft. I noticed the paragraph headed 'physical components.' Safety under
normal conditions would be anticipated in flight. It would be within 1,000
miles away from earth. Now maybe I am not reading this correctly. Sir,
but as I read this you are saying that at the present time you feel that
the OTC-X1 craft could go a distance of 1,000 miles away from earth and
yet a few minutes ago you told us you could go to the moon in 5 hours.
OTC: That is true, the same craft, after all this is a contract form and
we have not been to the moon. We are going to enjoy looking at the earth
1,000 miles out and I think that would be satisfactory if we make a safe
Q: From a thousand miles?
OTC: 1,000 miles was picked as an arbitrary figure for demonstration purposes
only. Before we delivered the craft we would take the crew a distance
of 1,000 miles.
Q: Before you delivered to the purchaser?
OTC: That's right.
Q: Then let me ask you Mr. Colton, how long would it take you to go 1,000
miles and return provided you don't hover around 1,000 miles away from
Colton: It could be done in a matter of minutes, probably because of the
takeoff and landing practicalities, it could be done comfortably in the
space of one hour.
Colton: So as to avoid awkward velocities and any discomforts.
Q: In other words the possibility of going to the moon in five hours is
a dream at the moment, right?
Colton: No, I wouldn't say it's a dream...
Q: Well, if it takes you an hour to go 1,000 miles away from earth it
should take you a little longer than 5 to go to the moon unless you've
got an indirect route that will save a little time.
Colton: If you think of it in terms of a passenger train leaving a station
and arriving at another station or an aircraft traveling between cities.
This proportion and the amount of time it takes for takeoff and landing,
the distance of approximately 50 miles in a heavy atmosphere would be
traveled very slowly. Once out of that atmosphere as Mr. Carr said almost
any type of speed is possible up to and approaching the speed of light.
You couldn't approach any such speed because you could reach 1,000 miles
in the wink of an eye. That's why I say the figures are rounded off and
arbitrarily selected for discussion and preparing the contract proposal.
Q: Mr. Colton, 20 million dollars sounds like a lot of money if you purchased
an amount of jellybeans but it doesn't sound like a lot of money to me
if you could produce the craft you propose. Do you have any idea in your
mind why some big aeronautical concerns, Lockheed, etc.; I don't know
all of them, why it is that they haven't taken advantage of this opportunity
to invest. It's quite possible it wouldn't cost them 20 million dollars
because they already have so much equipment available to them.
Colton: Up to the present time we haven't approached them directly with
Q: You were incorporated in 1955 and I imagine you have made an effort
to get some money to promote your product.
Colton: An offer we made was that the OTC-X1 craft will be parked in any
specified area in the Continental US and go one or more times outside
the earth's atmosphere and land within a distance of the Pentagon building
in Washington or any other location best suited for public observation.
Q: What are these coils? To describe this the best I can, imagine if you
will a circle about 16-18 inches in diameter. Two circles that form a
sort of a...in other words 1 circle fits over another circle and from
the top of the circle and coming down from off the circle are two cones,
in other words one is up like a round pyramid, the other an inverted round
pyramid. There are a number of what appears to be copper wound coils around
the edge of it. If you looked at it head on it would look like an old
fashioned airplane engine more or less. And then there's sort of a framework
on top and underneath there's sort of braces. That's the general idea,
I noticed this, these cones placed mouth to mouth with some coils, the
coils on the edge of this thing, it revolved within this structure. A
tough thing to describe.
Q: What is this over here, Mr. Colton?
Colton: This is a paper mockup to show the counter rotation principle
and its outside circular section that Roy is describing looking at the
other mockup. It contains the electrified horseshoe magnets. This would
rotate in one direction counter clockwise while the center section with
the electron accumulator would, which he described as 2 inverted cones
mouth to mouth, would rotate clockwise in the other direction.
Q: Would these coils in the outer rim...?
Colton: Rotate counter clockwise, correct.
Q: What is the material in the actual space craft?
Colton: A number of materials would be used.
Q: Was the outer shell possibly aluminum, sir?
Colton: Possibly aluminum, possibly fiberglass. Certainly not any material
or materials or products not known to use or easily available.
Q: When you say 580 rpms do you mean the outer rim is rotating in 1 direction
580 rpms and the inner rotating in the other direction at the same speed,
giving a total rotation, one relative to the other of 1160 rpms?
Colton: Exactly, although I don't know if 1160 has any bearing on it or
Q: Well, it would be twice the rotation in reference to the earth.
Colton: We're not giving it for a certain rotation for the sake of rotation
but for the sake of relativity to the attractive mass. The earth at 8,000
miles diameter rotating once in 24 hours is relatively equal to a 45 foot
craft rotating at 580 and 580 would calculate to be the approximate rotational
speed of an automobile tire on a car moving at about 25-30 miles per hour.
LJ: I'll try to describe a description as seen from the outside. I was
attempting to describe the inside of the mechanism which is very difficult
but I think I could describe it this way if I may. Imagine taking a couple
of loud speaker cones and putting them mouth to mouth. Now that seems
to be the body of the craft as you would see it in flight or well let's
say landing. Now around it is an independent ring...so that the mouth
to mouth speaker cones revolve inside the ring and on its axis.
Q: It looks like a flying saucer. It sort of reminds me of a gyroscope...
LJ: Have you described the basic principle of the thing?
Colton: Yes, Mr. Carr described the basic principle and the relationship
of electricity and electro-magnetism.
LJ: Could a small craft be made to take off?
OTC: We plan to build a prototype model as a demonstration device. Now
I would like to state certain models have been built by me and tested.
Each one has been airborne. One was lost entirely in space. We had a control
system and this one didn't function. This has already been done.
LJ: Years ago a man sold me two pieces of balsa wood, two cross pieces,
and a rubber band. It would take off and go up very nicely and gently
descend to the ground. It was not surprising to me that a thing like this
is quite feasible. As a matter of fact he had a fantastic flying platform.
He said it would one day be a way of flying instead of a prop in the front.
OK now, how does it differ from this particular flying saucer? That's
what it really is, in principle, in motivation. The flying platforms I
believe are a combination of a propeller and a jet. Thus directing motion
downwards. This does not have anything to do with this system?
Q: None whatsoever. As we calculated, the speed of the circumference was
1263 miles per hour. It gets kind of warm at that, doesn't it?
OTC: No, it won't because it has its own protection field which is its
electro-magnetic actuation. We described it as a self contained unit the
same as an orange. It contains its juice within its skin and maintains
its own circulatory system, like mammals and animals, etc. This ionization
of the capacitor plates sets up a glow brilliantly with a very soft luminescent
LJ: What color?
OTC: It would be in the nature of the blue green or very similar to the
electric arc you see in welding. This is the field we are testing, you
do not have a heat barrier in forward velocity at all. This electro-magnetic
field is being tested out now in conventional aircraft and proved very
efficient. We have known that there is something a long time in our particular
operation. We found out by actual physical tests.
LJ: Have you patented this?
OTC: We have patent applications in preparation and on file.
LJ: I personally am very reluctant to try to argue with you about this
device because it looks like a very definite look into the future. Do
you think that there are flying saucers from other planets?
OTC: These are electrified unidentified flying objects. We have seen these
as mentioned earlier on this program and we were interested inasmuch as
we were already building models and tested them out by the time we had
these observations. Now, it is not up to me to conjecture whether or not
they are from other planets, but the evidence is so because we certainly
would not have to spend 355 million dollars to build a rocket if we had
such a system, which we propose to make possible. We have the system ourselves.
If the system is in operation already, something is very wrong to put
this money expense on an expendable rocket. 55 million dollars is no cost
at all to test out a rocket that only gets a few feet off the ground.
Q: Well, what do you think about the principle of rockets under certain
conditions? Would you suppose you could put rockets toward the edges of
the cones and have the ring spin by rocket propulsion?
OTC: We don't need it. We have a tremendous spin here. An electric motor
operates the same way. You set up an electromotive force inside a magnetic
field and you get rotation. So what we actually have here is an improved
electrical motor which in itself is a circular device, and we say we make
energy out of the air, from another dimension.
To clear your analogy up also, we would like to demonstrate the fact that
this earth itself is literally a space craft demonstrating what we're
talking about; it's rotating and orbiting at a certain constant speed
with a magnetic field and it is in itself a spacecraft.
Q: Mr. Colton, we assume the moon has a gravitational field. How does
it make a gravitational field and yet it does not rotate on its axis.
Colton: It does not rotate on its axis?
Q: No, the moon does not rotate on its axis.
Ben: Sure it does, 1 rotation for 1 revolution.
Q: How long does it take?
Ben: 28 days.
Q: And the earth takes one day.
OTC: And that's how engineers and scientists have evaluated the velocity
of the craft we call the earth by the orbit of it. Upon the pattern already
set up, by the amount of time it takes the moon to rotate once around
the earth from the center of the earth's core: 28 days. The distance being
245,000 miles. It is easy to calculate.
Q: These cones seem to revolve over intricately wound copper coils. Do
you supply any motor power to this?
OTC: All energy comes from these two cones [Utron]. This in vernacular
is a battery. The big novelty is that we have put a battery in motion.
We have designed it within the accepted knowledge of total dimensions
of space-matter and we have activated it electrochemically [electrolyte
in the hollow center] and used the force through chemical activation to
activate the entire craft, after which we have motion as the feature of
Ben: Mr. Osgood's telegram brought up a very important and perhaps crucial
point, mainly, James Clerk Maxwell demonstrated that light is an electromagnetic
radiation, also verified by Hertz who laid the foundation for modern radio.
Now the speed of electromagnetic radiation such as radio waves also travels
186,000 miles per second. In other words, light and all forms of electromagnetic
radiation travel at the speed of 186,000 miles per second. Now if it were
possible for your craft to travel faster than the speed of light, it could,
therefore, travel faster than the speed of electromagnetic radiation.
So once it exceeded 186,000 miles per second, you wouldn't be gaining
all this energy from this electromagnetic radiation you're generating
and wouldn't you fall rapidly down?
OTC: There is a continuous falling in space which in itself can bring
velocity and can bring you to another system. We mentioned conjecturally
that in other systems, there could be different velocities. We're not
applying them to our craft. We don't identify them wit our craft. Relatively,
we could not go faster than the speed of light unless we were in a system
that permitted it. In our solar system, which we have mentioned now three
times, it is designed on known principles. We conjectured about other
systems. If we go beyond the speed of light in other systems the conditions
within that system would make it possible for us to have power.
Roy: Let's assume, Mr. Carr, this vehicle is at rest. What is it that
originally overcomes the inertia of this rotor and starts the rotor moving?
OTC: The electromagnetic force stored in the energy of the Utron electric-accumulator,
which in vernacular is a battery.
Roy: Now the Utron electric accumulator is these cones that are inverted
to each other with bases together. I know of zinc batteries, nickel-cadmium,
lead-acid cells. Could you use those?
OTC: We could use any of the kinds you mentioned; what we have here is
tremendous power size in comparison to other batteries; therefore, it's
very easy to put 1,000 2-volt cells inside this one unit as you see it.
It has functioned very well. In our 45-foot craft we plant to have 12,000-volt
batteries which will extend an electromotive force which will energize
the electromagnets and the capacitor plates. The generative coils will
put back into the batteries in this system the same amount of volts going
out until there is a breakdown of electro-chemicals or wear-out of equipment.
But it could last as long as average storage batteries in automobiles.
Roy: In order to start the motor off originally, is it necessary to cause
a flow of electricity through one set of the coils?
OTC: That's true.
Roy: Is there any magnetic force in the other set of coils at this point?
OTC: They individually operate by circuit breakers and the first motion
begins to start a repetition. The same we have in a motor that has the
opposite of a commutator, which is an accumulation of contact points where
each coil is energized as the current flows through this coil. Then this
starts the motion, the repetition of this motion brings the whole motor
into phase in the same sense our accumulator and magnets become speeded
up and the circuits are made and broken as they rotate.
Roy: Where the inner rotor rotates in one direction and the outer in the
other direction. and if the cabin is located on top of the rotating mechanism,
what keeps it from rotating in one direction or the other?
OTC: We have this cabin as the center of the craft and the battery below
the cabin and the electromagnets are the total outside of the circular
foil. The shaft of the accumulator goes through the cabin and there is
a bearing. Now, just as this stays stationary when this is rotated, so
will the cabin because there are two rotating forces. You have the clockwise
rotation of the accumulator, the capacitor plates, the generative coils,
you have a counter-rotation of the entire circular area of the craft,
the larger diameter which houses the electromagnets; therefore, when you
have rotation in both directions, the cabin itself is like a bearing and
extension of the shaft. We've built models and proved this is correct.
Roy: OTC X-I was accomplished?
OTC: Six crafts were airborne, one escaped; we used circuit breakers of
various types and fuses burned through the switch and we lost one craft.
Roy: What was the size?
OTC: The largest and the one lost was 6 feet in diameter.
Roy: You also talk of the Caroto Gravity Motor and you mention it requires
no fixed location in which to function, and you also say a lot of other
wonderful things about the possibility for this motor. Is it something
else than the spacecraft?
OTC: They are two separate packages. The spacecraft utilizes the electrical
accumulator and the gravity motor uses the energy of the inertial attractive
forces. We have learned how to take this energy and key it to a working
shaft and get work power which we call free energy because it is. We don't
make any part of it. Now in the rather vulgar vernacular sense this would
have been classified as perpetual motion. It is nothing of the sort. It's
free energy. Now we have learned that all masses that are smaller than
the masses to which they are attracted exert energy. Even this ashtray;
if it takes a pound of energy to lift it, then it is exerting a pound
of energy. We have a true gravity motor. Its functional operation is to
produce power continuously without any dissipation of the energy which
causes it to operate, and we have built models of this and they operate
and function and we are in the patent procedure with this.
Mel: Back to a question a while ago regarding an analogy of the earth
as a spacecraft. Taking another look at the mock up prototype power package
there in front of you. It resembles the solar system itself, and as a
matter of fact one of the statements in the brochure published in 1957,
stated it illustrated the geometry of the universe. It seems that this
device miniaturizes and essentially duplicates the motion of bodies in
the solar system. It must have the ability to miniaturize their energy.
So in a sense, the bodies in the solar system, in all time, have maintained
their constant motion perpetually in those motions and this is why people
characterize this power package as a perpetual motion machine.
OTC: But we do not make any such claim.
Colton: The Utron has many applications, has many forms, many variation.
In one sense you might describe it as an energized armature or in other
words a motor with a self-contained moving battery, also capable of continuously
re-energizing itself. The offer in regards to spacecraft applies to government
and industry alike. We will only make total disclosure demonstration after
we have procured a firm order. In other words, we're not looking for anyone
to evaluate our development. Mr. Carr has come a long way in his research.
He doesn't need any risk money from taxpayers or industries for further
exploration and development. We will disclose to anyone who is a purchaser,
but not to anyone who comes along for curiosity.
Mel: What does the word "Utron" mean?
Colton: "Utron" is a coined word, a word Mr. Carr put together:
the letter "U" and "tron", U meaning the direction
or shape of motion as applied and used and equated in this accumulator
or battery we described -- U is the plane, the geometrical figure that
is the portrait of the wave, you might say. The letter U as described
on paper, the two-dimensional, is a portrait on paper of the wave or the
wave motion with the cut field, with the straight line, the pressure energy
in the Utron accelerator.
OTC: To me there's no such thing as a completed curve; you only go half
way, just like you only go half way into the woods, then you're coming
out. This is the same. A bisection of a total sphere is its exact curve
and one half of it is primarily U-shaped. Because in magnets there are
always two poles and one normal way to show them is in a U-shape, but
if it's in a bar magnet, there are still two poles and the shape is still
the same. We can only put a rope one half way around the tree and it's
coming back the other way, and this is true in all wave motion. Now, if
you extend this into velocity, this is the pattern in the sine wave and
definitely the electromagnetic wave.
Ben: I see... the vortexian of the wave.
OTC: All motion is relative to all other motion, so this serpentine, spiral
Ben: So it's not the form of that motion, the graph and the equation.
I'll accept the fact that it's the form of the Utron motion though.
OTC: Also the form as well in two dimensions is intensified in the geometry
of our accumulator.
Q: Why do you refer to this vehicle as a 4th dimensional vehicle?
OTC: Because the geometry of the accumulator is such as the 4th dimension.
To me the application of space and time, a vibratory field and electricity
as we know it is a vibratory force in motion. This is symbolic of it and
when it is activated it becomes such. Now this may be a little bit difficult
to understand, but nevertheless the very smallest electronic particles
of matter have been shown under the highest type of electron microscope
to be one-dimensional squares. To me this is verification that this is
truly a space dimension because it is the shape of matter. Without matter
you couldn't have space.
Q: I'm holding a thing that looks like two loudspeakers in a simplified
form, placed mouth to mouth, two cones mouth to mouth, like two tops together
so they have a point at each end and actually like a thickened flying
saucer... Now what is it that comes from that: is it a high voltage?
OTC: The voltage is whatever we wish to make it by design.
Q: In other words, then, this is a battery?
OTC: That's right.
Q: The battery then goes through these magnets?
OTC: The battery rotates in this magnetic field. The average armature
today in any electrical system is usually the permeability, iron wound
with copper, then through a magnetic field acts as a motor, or it becomes
a generator, depending upon the lead. The great novelty here in the area
in which an armature is normally used, we have a [power unit, and this
a battery, and this is a moving power unit.
Q: In other words, you might call this a self-contained power supply,
right? How would this generator --- maybe I'm using the wrong word ---
gather additional energy from outside?
OTC: This is due to its circular motion. Electrical forces are motions
where they manifest. Now we have cycles in alternating current; AC gives
you 60 cycles per second; we have discovered in our experiments that there
is a space cycle related to electricity, and if we join the cycle we get
energy from it.
Q: Mr. Colton, will you try to describe to our listeners how they can
draw at home a facsimile of an Utron?
Colton: You can take a pencil and draw four lines to form an open square.
When you have a square, draw a straight line from one point of the square
to an opposite point and you'll have two right angle triangles. Now if
you convert the line you've just drawn into a small lip you'll begin to
see two inverted cones, the base of which form a circular equator. While
you started with a square, you now have two cones. Obviously, the base
of the cone is a circle or completely round as we describe it, and you
have the device which is described as completely round and completely
square, the Utron electric accumulator. The cavity in the center of these
which is a hemisphere when the two cones are put together have a hollow
sphere. This is the cavity which contains the electrolyte which would
be used in some of the applications of the accumulator.
Q: Of what value is the term "completely round and completely square"
apart from its obvious redundancy?
Colton: It is Carr's definition of the geometry or the basic space form
or the basic form of all matter large or small relatively as we describe
it. It is the definition of the terminal motions of universal energies
in what we call space.
Q: In one of your brochures you make mention of a "photon gun"
and you say, "This is primarily a development that works outside
of the earth's atmosphere. We are entering an age of space flight and
the use of solar energy is practically unlimited"... What is a photon
OTC: I am using the word "gun" as a reaction principle instead of
as a weapon. Nevertheless, it is a gun and in fact fires billions of rays
of solar energy at right angles to the reception. By placing them through
a certain chamber, we have been able to get a reaction and whenever there
is a reaction, we can get power, we can get force from it. So we feel
outside the earth's atmosphere new systems of propulsion even beyond our
own of electromagnetism will make themselves apparent.
text of this interview was kindly shared by Mike Hughes of Anaheim,
California, as reprinted in ENERGY UNLIMITED around 1983, and though
very faded in many spots, was typed up by Jerry Decker from KeelyNet.
Decker's intention was for it to be copied at other sites on the net
for the widest possible audience of interested parties. Project Camelot
supports and echoes that intention here.
Notes (Bill Ryan, Project Camelot)
There is no doubt in our minds that Ralph Ring is 100% genuine. Everyone
who has met him and heard his story in person is in full agreement. However,
the events he recounts took place nearly 50 years ago and there are some
engineering details which he has some understandable difficulty in recalling.
It must be emphasized that almost all of the laboratory documentation
pertaining to Carr's experimentation was confiscated by the US Government
Since Ralph's recovery from his serious illness, Project Camelot is proud
to have now introduced him to a group of engineers and researchers who are in detailed communication
with him and are committed to replicating the results of Carr's research.
Project Camelot pledges to post updates on these developments as results
are obtained. A full video interview with Ralph will be posted here soon.
Some of the above diagrams and photographs, from Ralph Ring's private
papers, have not been published before. We thank him for placing them
in the public domain.
here for a transcript of the video.