Zacharia sitchin is not legitimate

Its been interesting watching this conversation go as it has. Its been awhile since i read Sitchin's material and and i plan to reaquaint myself. There alot more info out there regarding Nibiru and the Anunnaki and I hope to add more to this topic.

[motov]

delighted to see that im not alone about sitchin, as i thought i was for years...

[Brinty]

Originally Posted by Heretic

I have no idea if he is right or wrong so I am not selling anything

Yet I do realize I am an armchair researcher with no ties to any black world or privy to insider info, and when someone with clout and a background to know such things comes out and informs me of something I had once discounted...

I will not accept it because they told me so

but

I also will not discount it because someone else told me so

think for yourself

in any case, a wise person in this site mentioned on another thread:

what may be garbage or disinfo for you could be a catalyst for an awakening for another

none of you have proof either way

are you here to learn information or just to blindly judge it?

I'm with you all the way Heretic.

I'm reminded of how Adamski was rubbished back in the 50s and 60s but now, some of what he wrote about his experience is being confirmed. The same goes for Immanuel Velikovsky around that same period of time. Once again, many of his outrageous claims have been proven.

So, exercise caution in what you accept as truth, but don't reject anything out of hand just because it doesn't fit on your page. It may just turn out that you need to get a bigger book.

[Doom]

Originally Posted by Heretic

what may be garbage or disinfo for you could be a catalyst for an awakening for another

disinfo is not going to wake anybody up. of course things that some people might percieve as disinfo , compared to what others percieve as dis-info will be different. but that doesn't make dis-info truth. We have to work together to determine what really is dis-info, and help others to see that - so that people who "wake up" don't fall for all the psyops set up to misdirect them.

Originally Posted by Heretic

none of you have proof either way

actually there is, that is the point - there is proof that sitchin's info is false, from the very fine details to the entire broad general ideas and beliefs proposed by such theories. The proof is in his own work - it doesn't add up. It can only add up when fantasy and falsified information is added. As well, there are many declassified cia documents showing how the new age was set up and would be used(including such far out techniques as making the public believe aliens rule the world), as well it would be benificial to study all other history involving the new age culture creation, such as blavastky's writing, crowley's, etc.

Originally Posted by Heretic

are you here to learn information or just to blindly judge it?

I believe I have responded to comments like this a few times already in this thread - No one is blindly judging, I am advocating looking into all sides of the story rather than just sitchin's. I have researched sitchin thoroughly for many years. The problem is people aren't learning about the new age, and conspiracy culture creation - and because of it they are buying into lies, that are only backed up by other lies. It's a major psyops to keep us from the real truth.

Originally Posted by Heretic

let your knowledge evolve and don't shut out new info to only preserve the old. where would you be now if you had been constantly rejecting new info?

No one is rejecting new info, in this case with sitchin, it has not been rejected, but researched and studied and then objected on as being false. This is not mainstream debunking like popular mechanics i'm talking about either, this is truth research that has exposed how this culture has been set up to mislead us and how sitchin is a part of it.

Originally Posted by Heretic

IMHO it would not be prudent to discount something outright based on assumption and conjecture, especially someone else's work from a website, who could be just as corrupt as you suspect Sitchin to be

If you are refering to the cuttingthroughthematrix.com website and Alan Watt, you are correct, no one should listen to anyone without researching the information for themselves. but all this is all researched and referenced in major publications, declassified CIA documents, etc. It stands on it's own without a medium to tell you about it, I have simply found Alan's website to be the most direct, uncensored source - acting as a short cut to start people out - to introduce them to books and these areas of study that people aren't doing for themselves - so what people actually need to do is research the books, blavatsky's, crowley's, declassified CIA documents about New Age culture creation, etc. for themselves. And I am just trying to get people to do the same thing as Alan is trying to get people to do, research things for themselves, eliminate the medium and see what the information really says.



I'm just asking that people learn more about the techniques used to control us, before thinking they have found solutions in some of these "theories" such as sitchin's. Because the more you learn how they control us, the better you are able to not buy into any of these scams. once aware, we have to get a better understanding of what we are aware of, before we can fix anything.

Based on your logic, you should at least research more into what I'm saying, considering you have already researched sitchin's side of the story, and most likely already know from being bombarded the mainstream's side of the story (imho the mainstream pushes sitchin's side of the story as well as the mainstream debunker's side of the story - they play off each other). Remember, there's always more than 2 sides to the story, and the answer is never black and white, but usually grey.

Even if I was wrong, and that me asking people to look into how Sitchin is illegitimate might be dis-info itself - is it not at least as worthy of being looked into as Sitchin's? The truth is tough to swallow, and most of us WANT to believe in these fantastic stories put out there that aren't true at all(like Sitchin's) - we've been trained to do so by fiction, by predictive programming.

[Doom]

Originally Posted by Brinty

I'm reminded of how Adamski was rubbished back in the 50s and 60s but now, some of what he wrote about his experience is being confirmed. The same goes for Immanuel Velikovsky around that same period of time. Once again, many of his outrageous claims have been proven.

So, exercise caution in what you accept as truth, but don't reject anything out of hand just because it doesn't fit on your page. It may just turn out that you need to get a bigger book.

Exactly. The truth is very outrageous - but that doesn't make anything that is outrageous, truth. My fear is that people haven't read the "bigger book" into culture creation, and the new age. Because I feel that if people do, they would be more equipted to identify dis-information. For example, I think I mentioned this earlier, the new age coined the term "open mind", and it doesn't actually mean to be open to information that doesn't fit your world view - it means that they want your mind open to programming. So open that you'll accept anything as reality. Anything they want us to believe. The new age culture was set up to bring in a new religion, and it was set up to first be accepted by those who don't go along with the majority. It is designed to destroy the mind of those who question their percieved reality. And it works, because most who buy into the new age, don't even know they are new agers.
As Adam Weishaupt said:
"Oh, foolish man, what can you not be made to believe?"


You see they have a very old system, and this is the age/time where they are bringing that system down and bringing a new one in. And because of this they are the ones who are first to put out dis-info that shows some truth(how the old system was a con-to gain followers), and then mixes it with fiction and new age beliefs, so that when others come out with the real truth afterwards, it is discredited and associated with the ficitonal conspiracy culture that they created that helps lead us down the path to their new system.

first they introduce the cultures by setting up their foundations with massive funding using music, movies, books, etc., and once those are established, and people fall into them, the people become conditioned to accept the new system. And so you got all these confused truth seekers buying into one or more of these some of these top down created conspiracy sub-cultures, thinking they are opposing the establishment, when infact, the culture is just perpetuating the new world order into it's final stages.

[Heretic]

Originally Posted by Doom

disinfo is not going to wake anybody up. of course things that some people might percieve as disinfo , compared to what others percieve as dis-info will be different. but that doesn't make dis-info truth. We have to work together to determine what really is dis-info, and help others to see that - so that people who "wake up" don't fall for all the psyops set up to misdirect them.

Dis-info does wake people up, otherwise how do you account for all the people here who have different backgrounds based on different info/dis-info.

I am a walking example of how dis-info can wake you up as I was heavily into the new age blavastky, Godfre Ray-king 30 years ago, it woke me up and by the nature of my new ability to discern I found that my source was flawed which allowed me to move on to other stuff and here I am.

Todays truths are tomorrows lies - the very nature of mental evolution and even life itself. It is the mistakes we make that build our truths. Are you saying that mistakes are worthless and fruitless?

actually there is, that is the point - there is proof that sitchin's info is false, from the very fine details to the entire broad general ideas and beliefs proposed by such theories.

Sounds like belief to me. Is there real proof that Sitchen's work is false? Where is this proof and while your at it define proof for me because I am missing something here as I always thought that proof was based on imperial evidence. We have NONE on both sides of the argument here. If we had the slightest bit of proof for any of the conspiracy theories we entertain, then they would not be conspiracy at all.

No one is blindly judging, I am advocating looking into all sides of the story rather than just sitchin's.

just as I am, yet I keep an open mind and accept the fact that I could be totally wrong. Pardon if I am mistaken but may I quote you from your first post on this thread?

Absolutely, Sitchin is not legitimate.

smells of judgment to me. and since you have no qualified expertise in the field that Sitchen is accomplished in I would also call that "blind", or just a repeat of someone else's judgment, which is probably also blind and motivated to debunk.

I have researched sitchin thoroughly for many years. The problem is people aren't learning about the new age, and conspiracy culture creation

As have I and I fully admit I have no proof one way or the other. Bob Dean's interview didn't sell me. But an insider is telling me to research Planet X even further, yet I will not be looking to Sitchen for that, I already know his story. I will looking elsewhere. Probably in the astronomical circles, because that is where the proof will show itself first IMHO.

Furthermore I am really interested in your findings on the connection with Sitchen and the new age movement. Could you post some of it or PM some of that info to me? An article or anything as this really interests me. Thanks.

It's a major psyops to keep us from the real truth.

an entirely subjective statement an is in no way convincing to me that Sitchen is the boogy man (yet could be). Hell, I even suspect that those who are doing the psyops are also under a greater psyop. isn't that how compartmentalization works? You could be right, but my gut tells me you really dont know this as fact.

No one is rejecting new info, in this case with sitchin, it has not been rejected, but researched and studied and then objected on as being false. This is not mainstream debunking like popular mechanics i'm talking about either, this is truth research that has exposed how this culture has been set up to mislead us and how sitchin is a part of it.

It could very well be. But isn't it a foolish gamble when you decide something isn't true without direct knowledge of it?

but all this is all researched and referenced in major publications, declassified CIA documents, etc.

Now THIS would substantiate as proof. Can you post them or a link please, as I have never been exposed to them and would love to see what the CIA has to say about Sitchen?

I'm just asking that people learn more about the techniques used to control us, before thinking they have found solutions in some of these "theories" such as sitchin's.

This is great advice. I recognize I could be under the influence right now concerning this information, do you?.

Based on your logic, you should at least research more into what I'm saying,

believe me I am and will be doing so for a while. Have you ever read the terra papers or The Gods of Eden? They mesh well with sitchen's work yet Nibiru is an anomaly I have found only in Sitchen's work and I considered most of the history he presents as pretty good evidence (not proof). Yet there are still some things I have difficulty relating too. And I feel he tends to try to over prove himself by latching onto any new technology that relates to his work while he tries to convince us it is proof.

Even if I was wrong, and that me asking people to look into how Sitchin is illegitimate might be dis-info itself

Dis-info is something that has been getting thrown around alot. Yet from where I am sitting, no one has the whole story and there is a good chance that the info that the best of the whistle-blowers and disclosers have could have been dis-info that THEY were fed. Combine this with the predisposition of the belief system they are attached to, as well as other information they simply cannot tell us, and you will find that we are not getting the whole story from anyone.

Bob Dean even says he lies to Kerry and Bill and this is no doubt due to the fact that he can only reveal so much. This is also true with other insiders. Perhaps even Zacharia Sitchen did this in his books. Point is, we simply do not know.

my take anyway

[Doom]

Originally Posted by Heretic

Dis-info does wake people up, otherwise how do you account for all the people here who have different backgrounds based on different info/dis-info.

I am a walking example of how dis-info can wake you up as I was heavily into the new age blavastky, Godfre Ray-king 30 years ago, it woke me up and by the nature of my new ability to discern I found that my source was flawed which allowed me to move on to other stuff and here I am.

Todays truths are tomorrows lies - the very nature of mental evolution and even life itself. It is the mistakes we make that build our truths. Are you saying that mistakes are worthless and fruitless?


Sounds like belief to me. Is there real proof that Sitchen's work is false? Where is this proof and while your at it define proof for me because I am missing something here as I always thought that proof was based on imperial evidence. We have NONE on both sides of the argument here. If we had the slightest bit of proof for any of the conspiracy theories we entertain, then they would not be conspiracy at all.

just as I am, yet I keep an open mind and accept the fact that I could be totally wrong. Pardon if I am mistaken but may I quote you from your first post on this thread?

smells of judgment to me. and since you have no qualified expertise in the field that Sitchen is accomplished in I would also call that "blind", or just a repeat of someone else's judgment, which is probably also blind and motivated to debunk.

As have I and I fully admit I have no proof one way or the other. Bob Dean's interview didn't sell me. But an insider is telling me to research Planet X even further, yet I will not be looking to Sitchen for that, I already know his story. I will looking elsewhere. Probably in the astronomical circles, because that is where the proof will show itself first IMHO.

Furthermore I am really interested in your findings on the connection with Sitchen and the new age movement. Could you post some of it or PM some of that info to me? An article or anything as this really interests me. Thanks.

an entirely subjective statement an is in no way convincing to me that Sitchen is the boogy man (yet could be). Hell, I even suspect that those who are doing the psyops are also under a greater psyop. isn't that how compartmentalization works? You could be right, but my gut tells me you really dont know this as fact.

It could very well be. But isn't it a foolish gamble when you decide something isn't true without direct knowledge of it?


Now THIS would substantiate as proof. Can you post them or a link please, as I have never been exposed to them and would love to see what the CIA has to say about Sitchen?


This is great advice. I recognize I could be under the influence right now concerning this information, do you?.

believe me I am and will be doing so for a while. Have you ever read the terra papers or The Gods of Eden? They mesh well with sitchen's work yet Nibiru is an anomaly I have found only in Sitchen's work and I considered most of the history he presents as pretty good evidence (not proof). Yet there are still some things I have difficulty relating too. And I feel he tends to try to over prove himself by latching onto any new technology that relates to his work while he tries to convince us it is proof.


Dis-info is something that has been getting thrown around alot. Yet from where I am sitting, no one has the whole story and there is a good chance that the info that the best of the whistle-blowers and disclosers have could have been dis-info that THEY were fed. Combine this with the predisposition of the belief system they are attached to, as well as other information they simply cannot tell us, and you will find that we are not getting the whole story from anyone.

Bob Dean even says he lies to Kerry and Bill and this is no doubt due to the fact that he can only reveal so much. This is also true with other insiders. Perhaps even Zacharia Sitchen did this in his books. Point is, we simply do not know.

my take anyway

dis-info won't wake anyone up, sorry I cannot agree that it can wake someone up.
Well...the only way it can wake someone up, is if it makes someone aware there's something going on, and then they look into it for themselves. Ie. If Sitchin makes you aware there's something crazy going on, but then you look into it and relize there is some crazy going on but that Sitchin's info was set up to mislead anyone who dared question their reality. Then Dis-info can wake one up. But most likely it will just lead them on a journey chasing your imagination around in circles. And it is hard to break out of because so much has been pushed out by the establishment that people think is waking them up, when it is actually disabling the victims minds.

That's my point, stop getting the info from "whistle-blowers" and "disclosers" who are fed the dis-info or have been set up to put out the dis-info. go to the sources yourself, the documentation from the establishment, and you will see 95% of these people are mislead or liars. The real big players really running the world don't write about aliens, or reptilians, etc. because there aren't any. (aren't any here involved in anything anyway - i don't doubt there is life elsewhere in the universe). Just take a look how much establishment mainstream media support there is for aliens/reptilians/ancient astronauts. It's everywhere, much of this is documented in links I have previously provided. Like I said before as well, they put out the mainstream debunkers, and the mainstream conspiracies, and play them off each other to advance their agenda.

I have posted a list of over 100 books in this thread:
http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/s...ad.php?p=11144
Many by the elite. Please check them out if you haven't.

I also should say that the declassified cia douments I'm refering to (sorry i don't have direct links - For at least one, if you can find it, CIA has declassified information about a booklet/magazine the CIA put out in the 50s called "The New Age". ) don't specifically refer to Sitchin, they refer to the setting up of the new age culture - they refer to things like creating the belief in people's minds that aliens were here in the past and created us. Almost all supporting evidence of this theory is false, and a part of the same major psyops. They want people believing this, because then the people who do have already been defeated - They disable the mind of the victim.

[elirien]

The three thousand year old space module was 25 year old plaster!

It became evident that The alleged three thousand year old Space Module that was hosted by the Archaeological Museum of Istanbul was in actuality made from plaster 25 years ago.

The space module which was found “matchless” by museum curators, found as a three thousand year old space module of the Urartu Kingdom many headlines to news in the western press. But conclusions of the Ministry of Arts and Culture Memorial and Museums department chemical and petro-graphical analyses proved that those theories didn’t agree with historical reality.

There is various and contradicting information concerning how the artifact came to the museum. One of the theories is that an antique merchant brought it to the museum. The space module, which has five engines is 23 centimeters long and 9,5 centimeters high. The General Director of the Museum Ph. D. Alpay Pasinli said that, the artifact could not be from three thousand years, but rather from 25 years the most. Pasinli, who said that we should remember that the western press convinced their public that the space module was three thousand years old, added that they have confirmed that this artifact was made out of plaster and marble dust through the results from analyses.

The space module, which became one of the most popular artifacts of the Istanbul Archeological Museum and was sought after by western scientists and media, was written about in tens of Articles in Europe and became news in many newspapers and television news casts. The space module which was sought after by German and English archeologists in the beginning of the 1990’s was for a long time secured in the preservation unit of the museum. The first who succeeded in photographing the space module was the English Magazine “Fortean Times”. The Magazine, which showed a picture of the sculpture and head lined “Is it an ancient space module?” in their October 1993 issue was followed by the German magazine “Magazin 2000”. After this event the competing firm of Magazin 2000, G.A.R.L. sent their editor to Istanbul and he shared his findings with the public. But almost all of the research and what was presented to the public was written in this manner: “It is confirmed that the space ship that is now in the Istanbul Archeological Museum was found in a archeological dig made in 1975 in the old city of Tuspa that is also known as Toprakkale. It is in the northeast of the Van lake where the Urartu Kingdom spread between 830-612 BC.” After these allegations were made it was written that it was in the Istanbul Archeological Museum but not on public display.

Zecharia Sitchin, linguistic and Bible scholar and writer of the book “The 12th Planet”, made the greatest research on the controversial “Space Module”. Sitchin, who came in the beginning of the 90’s to Turkey came in the forefront of the people that claimed that the Space Module was three thousand years old. Sitchin made these remarks after the sculpture left the preservation unit of the museum and was presented to him on a velvet tray: “The object, was made out of a porous material that could probably be a stone made out of volcanic ash. The bends and amazing amount of detail disproves that it was made from raw labor. Was it really a plaster caste that came out of a plastic toy as claimed by the museums official explanations? It doesn’t seem that way.

There are various and contradicting information concerning how and from where the “Space Module” was brought to the Istanbul Archeological Museum. The most popular idea is that an antique trader brought the sculpture and after realizing that it was fake he didn’t pursue it. The Space module which is 23 centimeters long, 9,5 centimeters high and 8 centimeters wide has five engines. There is also a pilot figure on the small sculpture that has bent his knees reaching its chest. The clothing of the pilot resembles the space suits that astronauts wear.

Zaman

source: http://arsiv.zaman.com.tr/2003/04/30/kultur/h6.htm (in turkish though, I translated it).

[Doom]

Cool. Yea, I've read many similar reports about the Crystal Skull not being the true artifact it is made out to be either. I can't say for sure with what you posted and the crystal skull, but I can say for sure that many, many, of these evidences for all this type of stuff has been forged/made up/etc..

Originally Posted by Shakesbeer

Comet NEAT 2000/V1[/URL]) that was twice the size of Jupiter, which should have at least pulled Mercury into the sun based on conventional celestrial mechanics, but didn't.

It was Comet 17P/Holmes that was twice the size of Jupiter and not NEAT... Holmes eventually grew as large as the sun before it receded...

It did not mess with any orbits as it was the ejection of gases that made it that large, not the actual mass...

Funny how he missed that

Originally Posted by Nebula

When people donot understand something, they will critize and discredit you!. Case and example with ZSitchin. With all information, you have to research and check it for yourself. I believe in what Sitchin is saying. Now i have a question for you!.

Well that is fine... but may I suggest that you ACTUALLY research what Sitcins DOES SAY?


I shall Quote Sitchin....


Nibiru settled into a clockwise orbit (equal to 3,600 orbits of Earth
around the Sun). Nibiru stabilized into a clockwise orbit, equal to
3,600 orbits of Earth around the Sun until 10, 900 B.C.E., when
Nibiru arrived earlier, due to increasing drift from Solaris of
Uranus. Uranus' gravity sped Nibiru's orbit. As a result of this
close encounter between Nibiru and Uranus, one of Nibiru's moons,
Miranda, was captured by and became a moon of Uranus as Nibiru and
Uranus pulled at each other. From 10,000B.C.E. on, Nibiru's
revolution sped to 3.450 Earth years; which makes Nibiru's next
return 2900A.D. rather than 2012 as predicated on the earlier 3600-
year orbit

Sitchin, Z., 2007, The End of Days, pages 315 - 317


Now if Bob Dean believes Sitchin and qoutes Sitchin... why does he say 2017ish when Sitchin says 2900 AD?

As you say RESEARCH... something I do well....

Is there any other researchers prior to Sitchin with the same research, insight and info?

On Nibiru? No...

On Sumerian? Yes...

Mike Hieser says Nibiru means crossing point or gateway...

Perhaps indeed the Sumerians had access to a Stargate...

Now Sitchin based Nibiru on one cylinder seal..

Well I have several that show they had a stargate...

And there is no misinterpretation that it represents a gate...

Ea stands in his watery home the Apsu


Enki walks out of the watery gateway to the land.


Their is a good possibility that the Abyss in Revelations is indeed this same gateway...

Abydos
also known as Abtu or Abdju
Abzu
Sumerian name for the Abyss...
Abyss
Biblical watery gateway...

Abyss = Abzu = Abtu = Abdju = Abydos

From an excavation in Abydos


So there are other possible interpretations

But Sitchin sells books and has now a cult following...

Believe as you wish... but personally I 'favor' the Stargate concept...


And so does Giovanni di Paolo, a painter from 1445,
"Creation of the World & Expulsion from Paradise"

[Doom]

REgarding that painting from the 1500's, Even back then they were into puting out media to control the minds of the public, plays that were mandatory to attent, and lots and lots of art from painting to sculptures, they of course loved to scare the public with lots of gargoles. They have been creating myths of things that come from the skies for many ages. Though I can't say for sure about that particular painting, it's meanings etc., but I would have to suggest that does not have to do with a stargate.

If we read the Sumerian tablets, it’s no different from ancient India or Ra of Egypt where the God inseminates himself and all the rest of it, etc.. He has sex with the spirit of the air. It’s all to do with spirits, you understand, not people. There are no references to "stargates" in my opinion.

the engraving of the 'helicopter' and other 'craft' is acutally a picture that is a composite of two quite ordinary hieroglyphic texts laid over each other. The appearance of the helicopter on the artefact was actually an artefact itself, and was formed from two separate hieroglyphs.

[Heretic]

Originally Posted by doom

dis-info won't wake anyone up, sorry I cannot agree that it can wake someone up.
Well...the only way it can wake someone up, is if it makes someone aware there's something going on, and then they look into it for themselves.

From this I believe we think alike and we just mis-communicated because this is all I meant.


I am about to do some heavy research on all this myself because I have pretty much discounted Nibiru as garbage and Dean's testimony is urging me to look into it further.

didn't Burish discuss a stargate in Iraq? Same one maybe?

hmmm

My stance on all this? - undecided and seeking answers

just another paradigm to add to my collection

HAH!

[Doom]

Originally Posted by Heretic

From this I believe we think alike and we just mis-communicated because this is all I meant.

Agreed, my point is just that, more often than not, dis-info won't get the person to look more into whats behind everything, but will just get them looking deeper into the dis-info. But yes, it does happen that some people start with dis-info, but then with the relization that such deception is out there, will question the dis-info, and eventually actually wake up.

[Heretic]

Originally Posted by Doom

Agreed, my point is just that, more often than not, dis-info won't get the person to look more into whats behind everything, but will just get them looking deeper into the dis-info. But yes, it does happen that some people start with dis-info, but then with the relization that such deception is out there, will question the dis-info, and eventually actually wake up.

agreed

it greatly depends on the person and their thirst for knowledge, and how easily satisfied they are, I am never satisfied and perhaps I just couldn't see beyond that


peace

[Connecting with Sauce]

Is it possible that with time travelling UFO's some of these stone carving's could actually be sent back in time to be disinfo?

Just throwing in a curve ball there to this discussion.

[Heretic]

Originally Posted by Connecting with Sauce

Is it possible that with time travelling UFO's some of these stone carving's could actually be sent back in time to be disinfo?

Just throwing in a curve ball there to this discussion.

I have heard it said that a group did just that.

set our past up to support their benevolent presence so we would see them in the light they wish

I have heard alot of things though, and many of them conflict

interesting times eh?

[Doom]

Originally Posted by Connecting with Sauce

Is it possible that with time travelling UFO's some of these stone carving's could actually be sent back in time to be disinfo?

Just throwing in a curve ball there to this discussion.

I'm going to have to say no, because there are no time travelling UFOs.

If you look back to some of the links I gave, it explains in one particular instance how erich von daniken(author of Chariots of the Gods) paid some mexican children to do some of the "ancient astronaut" stone carvings etc. that he used as evidence.

[Visvasa144]

Please see this video part1 and 2.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1wsLOJ7Tvw

please realize that most or all the information that your using to rebuke his claims or facts are based on others information that most likely is a disinformation smear campaign to steer everyone away from the truth of who we and how we came to be as human beings. i've heard tons of things said about sitchin being illuminati and meeting with the vatican. im not saying 100% everything is true but FOR THE RECORD. Nibiru is a real. The ANNUNAKI do exist.
They created what is now called the cadueces or entwined serpents ans much much more.

you dont have to like sitchin. it doesnt matter. dont sell yourselves short in not believing that the ANNUNAKI exist. who do you think are our archangels? everyone of them are ANNUNAKI. is that a shocker too? what about JESUS? everyone wants proof. mostly everyone is searching outside themselves for the answers when all along all the answers have been inside all of us. its in our consciousness. its all up to yourselves to find it. but looking on a computer and doing "years" of "research" makes you question sitchin? question your own techniques and tools. the truth will always be.

Bob Dean said that he was informed that Nibiru's atmosphere is orange/yellow. thats true.


seeds of devotion and enlightenment,
elias.

[Heretic]

Originally Posted by Doom

I'm going to have to say no, because there are no time travelling UFOs.

have to differ with you there, and I am hoping you can change my mind. if you even believe in "infinity" then you have declared that all things exist, this means 2000 years ago, as well as 2000 years from now exists, right now. Instead of being there, you are here instead.

There is no time, just as when you look outside the window of a car, things seem to move, but it is only you and your perception that move. We are merely moving along an infinite tapestry and our choice determine where on this tapestry we decide to go next. The only "time" that exists is now.

Even though it is hidden from your view, it is also 2000 years ago right now. Just as it is 2000 in the future, right now. Your now just happens to be here instead of there, because you lack the technology to make it otherwise (accept for memory).

check out Wilcock's work on the relationship between space/time and time/space. Not to hard to wrap your mind around the basics. Time...is spatially related.

Originally Posted by Visvasa144

FOR THE RECORD. Nibiru is a real. The ANNUNAKI do exist.

Judging by your "conviction" I assume you have more evidence than has been presented so far. I want to believe too, please help me with some more data found elsewhere beyond Sitchen and Dean if you have it. I really want to know!

Thanks

[Visvasa144]

Judging by your "conviction" I assume you have more evidence than has been presented so far. I want to believe too, please help me with some more data found elsewhere beyond Sitchen and Dean if you have it. I really want to know!

Thanks[/QUOTE]
hello Heretic,
My data isn't on paper though its well documented by, let's say, third parties. if i say, "Shamanism". what do you think of? natives dancing around a fire? eagle feathers? sometimes you have to learn the ancient techniques that are still available to this day. their taught to anyone who is willing to learn. does that sound strange to you? i'm learning every single second, also.

if you check out my blog you'll get an understanding of why i say this.

http://heavenlycatalyst144.blogspot.com

check out Wilcock's work on the relationship between space/time and time/space. Not to hard to wrap your mind around the basics. Time...is spatially related.

"time is spatially related?" i missed that lesson that day. i think i was day dreaming when in class as i usually do. day dreaming is a right brain function. so is creativity. so is the divine feminine energy. have you heard of something called "fluid intelligence?" its when a person can link random things or patterns without having to go though the "order" of "things". kind of like when you get an intuitive feeling about something. so if you can... lets say, jump to get info. then why cant you jump dimensions. everyone does it all the time. they just call it memory. what about day dreaming. big brother calls it "reality engineering".
why do you think we've got millions of gifted kids diagnosed with ADD or ADHD. the gov. is trying to keep these gifted people from accessing parts of their brain that do amazing but normal things.
space and time is only applied in dense realities like 3rd dimension. their really is no such thing as space and time or time space. of course theirs rules when on this earth and in your body but they all go away when its just your consciousness which really isn't just your consciousness, its consciousness.
your the gatekeeper.

flouride, gmo's, etc. all to keep the human being from being. being a vegetarian helps also. dont eat anything that feels pain or fear. yeah plants feel a little pain but its not like an animal being slaughtered
while still alive and screaming and convulsing in pain. the meat that people eat is filled with that pain and fear or energy. if you eat meat then you are giving yourself free reign for the reptilians. they thrive on those emotions. we are love.

if you want to see a graphic documentary about how people get their meat watch this.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...30308142&hl=en

have you heard of the Mekaba? its that picture i have on my profile. its also called the chariot for good reason. you can go places.


seeds of devotion and enlightenment,
visvasa

[Doom]

Originally Posted by Heretic

have to differ with you there, and I am hoping you can change my mind. if you even believe in "infinity" then you have declared that all things exist, this means 2000 years ago, as well as 2000 years from now exists, right now. Instead of being there, you are here instead.

There is no time, just as when you look outside the window of a car, things seem to move, but it is only you and your perception that move. We are merely moving along an infinite tapestry and our choice determine where on this tapestry we decide to go next. The only "time" that exists is now.

Even though it is hidden from your view, it is also 2000 years ago right now. Just as it is 2000 in the future, right now. Your now just happens to be here instead of there, because you lack the technology to make it otherwise (accept for memory).

check out Wilcock's work on the relationship between space/time and time/space. Not to hard to wrap your mind around the basics. Time...is spatially related.

Sorry bud, already have looked into all that stuff. Doesn't change anything. I understand the science. There are no time travelling ufos. You can throw all the quantum science out there, even being able to prove the possibilty of it doesn't change the realtiy that there are no time travelling ufos. Just because something is possible doesn't mean it must be. BTW david wilcock is one of the last people on earth i'd take advice from.

[Heretic]

*shrug*

good times all




peace

[elirien]

Originally Posted by Doom

Sorry bud, already have looked into all that stuff. Doesn't change anything. I understand the science. There are no time travelling ufos. You can throw all the quantum science out there, even being able to prove the possibilty of it doesn't change the realtiy that there are no time travelling ufos. Just because something is possible doesn't mean it must be. BTW david wilcock is one of the last people on earth i'd take advice from.

I can't trust his channelings one bit but the research he gathers sometimes is good and new. I don't know about the UFO bit but why couldn't there be time travel? I know it is off topic but if you have a higher dimension then time travel should be a piece of cake shouldn't it (if you have the means of course)?

On the UFO part I can just say this: It is important what we describe as a UFO.

[David]

Originally Posted by Heretic

are you here to learn information or just to blindly judge it?

Excellent point.