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What Does It Mean ? What does this all mean for the Ground Crew ?

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Old 11-19-2008, 06:23 PM   #1
joe2288
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Exclamation what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

ive been seeing all this stuff on the news about people not wanting to

bail out the 3 major auto companies im curious if any body has a good idea

of what will happen if we dont bail them out.


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Old 12-09-2008, 07:59 PM   #2
1fixitman
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

The suppliers for the three auto makers can only stay afloat if all three of them(auto builders) survive. If any of the three go under then the suppliers can not stay in business to supply the other two. One will fold, then the suppliers will follow suit then the other two will fold. There are about 3 million people between the suppliers and the Auto builders that will be out of work when or if it unfolds. Something you have to understand about GM is that it is not just the Union that is bringing them down....GM owns GMAC Mortgage and DiTech.com. They are leveraged out too far.
Dwayne
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Old 12-09-2008, 08:12 PM   #3
777 The Great Work
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe2288 View Post
ive been seeing all this stuff on the news about people not wanting to

bail out the 3 major auto companies im curious if any body has a good idea

of what will happen if we dont bail them out.


Its a lie, The Rockefellers own the majority of car manufacturers and oil companies. Its all a lie being used for distraction from the work behind the scenes. As long as they can keep us focus on the surface stuff, we will never sit back to really read between the lines.

They must keep conflict going until their replacement for war is in place
.
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Old 12-09-2008, 08:17 PM   #4
Steve_A
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

Hi joe2288,

The economic plight of the three automakers has been set. Economically they will go under, with or without bailout. it's just a case of sooner rather than later. Firstly they would enter in Chapter 11 and try and sort themselves out. But they will fail in the end. The credit isn't being offered to the consumer to buy the cars and also the confidence has been kicked out of the market.

Politically there are basically two options. They will be nationalized and the government will foot the complete bill, or as it was suggested on Fox News this morning, that the head of the union will be given a seat on the board of directors in exchange for the union to pull some strings and sacrifice some of the workforce and reduce pensions, wages and healthcare (this option stinks to high heaven).

The problem as I understood it is that because of the union wanting the most for its' members, the automakers pay pensions. The problem is that there are four pensioners for every worker now at GM. So GMs' overheads are enormous in relation to, say, Toyota which is a young company and hasn't had anybody retire yet. although this isn't the complete reason for the collapse, of course it could be considered one of the contributions for it.

But I feel that in the middle to long term, great changes will occur in the auto industry market, many will lose their jobs, but there will be opportunities in other areas, in smaller industries related to engineering and such like.

Best regards,

Steve


Quote:
Originally Posted by joe2288 View Post
ive been seeing all this stuff on the news about people not wanting to

bail out the 3 major auto companies im curious if any body has a good idea

of what will happen if we dont bail them out.


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Old 12-09-2008, 08:20 PM   #5
feeler
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe2288 View Post
ive been seeing all this stuff on the news about people not wanting to

bail out the 3 major auto companies im curious if any body has a good idea

of what will happen if we dont bail them out.



The plunge protection team will be ordered to quit (i.e. manipulate). The market will tank. People will see the evaporation of their 401k's. Our govt will come to the rescue. The bailout bill will pass. The plunge protection team will resume their routine (i.e. market manipulation).


-feeler

Last edited by feeler; 12-09-2008 at 08:23 PM.
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Old 12-10-2008, 02:32 AM   #6
Humble Janitor
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

I don't agree with a bailout because I feel that Detroit has failed to listen to the consumers for the past 30 years. They latched onto the SUV trend and when gas prices went up, they continued to market SUVs when people were demanding more fuel-efficent vehicles. They have been doing this forever and their stubborness is what allowed Toyota, Honda and other foreign companies to thrive in this country.

I don't think nationalization is a good idea but I also do not like the idea of the union pulling strings to sacrifice jobs and pensions. I cannot in good conscience blame the UAW for this mess because the CEOs of the Big Three automakers are just as responsible for this mess if not more.

I could care less if Ford went under though. I never liked Henry Ford. He was a nazi sympathizer and known anti-semite.

I would like to see the auto industry opened up to smaller, niche car companies that would have more room to maneuver without the Big Three stifling them and their innovations (or outright buying their innovations and burying them).
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Old 12-10-2008, 02:57 AM   #7
Realview
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

The real point is that the bail outs have nothing to do with helping the companies. It has to do with de-valuating US currency leading to a more through economic collapse leading to rationals for a common new currency leading to rationals to drop borders and consolidate countries leading to an end of rights ie like the Bill of Rights. We're not bailing anyone out we're simply increasing the dependency on the Fed/NWO.
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Old 12-10-2008, 07:55 AM   #8
Dominic
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

GM will be kept for awhile. The consumer side may fall but, GM is a massive defense contractor.

Peace
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Old 12-10-2008, 08:35 AM   #9
KassandraLoves
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

If the auto industry falls, then the motorcycle industry will fall shortly after.

So, to answer your question, "what happens if we dont bail out the auto industry?"....KassandraLoves will LOSE HER JOB.

And im kinda bummed about that, because I really like the Harley family a lot and I enjoy the place where I work. **sighs**

Its ok guys, its ok. I guess ill take one for the team

(But dont say I never did nuthin' for ya....lol)

All kidding aside, I dont agree with bailouts either. Its really sucky what position americans have been put in and im sure they already know the outcome anyway...
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Old 12-11-2008, 02:04 AM   #10
giovonni
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Thumbs up Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by KassandraLoves View Post
If the auto industry falls, then the motorcycle industry will fall shortly after.

So, to answer your question, "what happens if we dont bail out the auto industry?"....KassandraLoves will LOSE HER JOB.

And im kinda bummed about that, because I really like the Harley family a lot and I enjoy the place where I work. **sighs**

Its ok guys, its ok. I guess ill take one for the team

(But dont say I never did nuthin' for ya....lol)

All kidding aside, I dont agree with bailouts either. Its really sucky what position americans have been put in and im sure they already know the outcome anyway...
Hi KL,
I believe your company has a very good chance of surviving, The Harley Family (yours), has weathered bad times before. You have a good product! The Big Three, need to get their act together, become leaner and meaner! Ford, seems to be doing ok, products and credit still good. On the other hand, GM and Chrysler need to combine, and develop a more competitive auto line. I'm sure, you and I agree, we do not want to see any more bleeding from the American worker and taxpayer sector! Love ya! gio
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Old 12-11-2008, 02:26 AM   #11
Squeptikal
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_A View Post
Hi joe2288,

The economic plight of the three automakers has been set. Economically they will go under, with or without bailout. it's just a case of sooner rather than later.

But I feel that in the middle to long term, great changes will occur in the auto industry market, many will lose their jobs, but there will be opportunities in other areas, in smaller industries related to engineering and such like.
I appreciate your post, Steve. You have a strong grasp of the facts and the idea that the automakers are going under is seemingly obvious.

I disagree with the idea of them going under.

1. The American automobile industry is a symbol of America's strength and a foothold for the labor unions. The unions aren't going anywhere, and consequently, the auto industry isn't going to fail. The unions represent a strong control system of a large voting institution and the total loss of the pensioners' funds would be catastrophic to this control system.

2. Since the Fed has found it useful to bail out billionaire bankers to maintain control over the Fed, they are now expected to to the same for labor street by everyone. This expectation is part of the "create your own reality" destiny we all serve. The pensioners won't be ripped off while there is a standing American labor army. Don't forget that these are huge corporations owned by those in power for some time to come.

3. Many police & other government agencies are prohibited from purchasing vehicles made substantially from parts outside the Americas. The American SUV market, while sagging, still represents a level of achievement for many college kids entering the job market. Sure, they buy sporty imports, but don't forget that even they are generally made here in the USA. It is far more cost effective to used dollars to build cars rather than ship them from overseas. Try shipping a car here from anywhere outside the continent. $2,800.00 per car last time I heard.

Regards, Squep.
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Old 12-11-2008, 03:16 AM   #12
BROOK
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

I agree with realview, it is about the economic condition we need to worry about. I work for one of the big three and I think we need to remember the consumer has some blame here. please read this I received the other day and ask your self who is buying these cars, and before you judge.. get the facts straight.


read this letter to the editor from Elikins

http://messages.finance.yahoo.com/St...=19&so=R&frt=2


are we going under...I'm getting prepaired
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Old 12-11-2008, 03:32 AM   #13
Antaletriangle
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

If yer don't bail out an "Auto maker" yer don't bail out yerself...true
Me,i come from a place filled with coal mines,pot banks,steel works and ill educated d*ck faces,male and female-raw ain't it!
Yet true.
Unemployment is ridiculously,ridiculous;"we are USED to it"!??
No sentiments here,STOKE-on-pokey holed trent.
I have suppos-ed friends whom i've known for 25 years who've sold themselves out on their souls during the last two to three weeks!!

I'm very disturbed!!!!
As these people possess greater than average intelligence,(Economics is the degree,by all accounts;(puns fully intended) and one can wear a suit and 'fit thus into the society' crew: They're 'accomplished' regarding the real deal.
Now,this could either sound like naked lunch writer or me-forget it as they say in france!!lool,was Karl marlden a Frenchman??
Two work for Stoke-on-trent council and have sold the f**k out for local people,whilst keeping their arses ""CLEAN""????I attended a funeral of one fellow's father recently-his dad was and is a good chap,an almost indecision from the roll call-he wouldn't understand his son's ways now.
I'll say no more;anyone who feels the need to read knows.
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Old 12-11-2008, 04:09 AM   #14
BROOK
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

here is the complete letter from the Elkins dealer

http://www.pistonheads.com/Gassing/t...20in%20America


Note that American companies including Harley Davidson gave 40 billion plus emergency vehicles to 9/11 relief and the Asian and European manufacturers gave NOTHING.
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Old 12-11-2008, 04:13 AM   #15
BROOK
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Default Re: what happens if we dont bail out auto makers

oops typo that was 40 million in relief money
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