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Old 06-19-2009, 10:05 AM   #26
Orion11
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dantheman62 View Post
Oops looks like the North Pole maybe.........................

Currently, Colaprete's team is searching for the best impact sites inside various shadowed craters. "The first and most important criterion is that we think the impact area will be productive from an ejecta standpoint," Colaprete explains. "If we don't get ejecta into sunlight, it wouldn't matter if we hit an iceberg because we would never know it." For example, if the impact site is close to a high crater wall, the ejecta would have to travel far to get out of the wall's shadow and reach the sunlight above. And if the impactor hits a steep slope in the bottom of a shadowed crater, much of the ejecta would blast out sideways instead of upward toward the sunlight. So a good site would be relatively flat-bottomed — less than about 15° of slope — with a fluffy regolith free of large boulders or rubble that would blunt the blow.
Colaprete says that, so far, one of the best sites appear to be in a 17 km-across unnamed crater just west of Peary crater (88.6° N, 33.0° E), near the Moon’s north pole. "We've gone through essentially every possible launch date and picked a crater for each date".
Choosing impact sites must also take another factor into account: visibility from Earth. Hundreds of amateur and professional astronomers will join the LCROSS robotic orbiter in watching the crash.
The explosion itself will probably be hidden by the walls of the target crater. Instead, what astronomers will look for is the impact plume. An expanding cone of ejecta will rise more than 6 kilometers above the lunar surface and spread outward for about 40 km in every direction. Glistening in the sunlight, the debris is expected to shine like a 6th to 8th magnitude star—invisible to the human eye but an easy target for backyard telescopes.
Colaprete's team will time the impact so that it happens while the Moon is high in the sky at night in Hawaii. There, LCROSS scientists will observe the ejecta plume with the powerful Infrared Telescope Facility. But astronomers on the west coast of the U.S. and in Japan could be able to see the impact as well, depending on the precise impact time. "It really is going to turn into an international event," Colaprete says. "Everyone's going to be training their eyes on the impact to observe it."
Stay tuned to Science@NASA to find out how amateur astronomers can collaborate with LCROSS scientists to help make this historic search for water on the Moon a smashing success.

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2...aug_lcross.htm

ahhhhh, niice find bro, thanks!



much as i dislike 'harming' Selene,
if their gonna do it..
i hope its gonna be sweet to see!! lol

Last edited by Orion11; 06-19-2009 at 10:07 AM.
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Old 06-19-2009, 11:38 AM   #27
Steve_A
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Hi Dantheman62,

You just answered a quetion in my mind about the discrepancies of the date I said the moon bombing project would be launched and when it was actually launched. NASA had to wait in line.

Also your findings bring in to question the validity of the NASA mission if allies have already done the very same thing, even if their end game was different. Just as the Cosmonauts use the International Space Station, could NASA have used the other crash landings to find out if ice particles exist or not. After all, the US is strapped for cash at the moment and the money spent could be used for other more urgent things (like paying off my credit card! )

It could well be that NASA is sending the object to the moon to show the others that it is capable of 'bombing' long range also, a sort of space wars if you like and for the public eye it is merely looking for ice particles.

Could it be that there are some sort of precious material on the moon and everybody is racing to find out if it really exists to claim the moon as sovereign territory? The US is wanting to place a permanent base on the moon by 2200. Why? Other space stations can be used as 'stepping stones' to go further afield, like to Mars for example.

Your post asks more questions than why is NASA the last in line, the question needs to be asked as why is everybody doing it?

Best regards,

Steve






Quote:
Originally Posted by Dantheman62 View Post
I think somewhere on the South Pole, but my question is why are we the last ones to map the surface and crash something into it?????


China's First Moon Probe Crashes to Lunar Surface

By By Tariq Malik
Senior Editor
posted: 02 March 2009
01:38 pm ET

China’s first moon probe Chang’e 1 intentionally crashed into the lunar surface on Sunday after more than year of science observations, according to state media reports.

The Chang’e 1 orbiter fired its engines to leave lunar orbit Sunday afternoon and ultimately slammed into the moon’s southern region at 4:13 p.m. Beijing Time (0813 GMT), China’s state-run Xinhua News Agency reported.

Launched in October 2007, the 5,180-pound (2,350-kg) satellite Chang’e 1 spacecraft orbited the moon for 16 months. During its flight, the spacecraft used eight onboard instruments to map the lunar surface, study its composition and depth, as well as analyze the space environment around the moon.

Chinese space officials said they planned to launch a follow-up mission — Chang’e 2 — by 2011. Chang’e 1’s intentional crash was slated to be a dry run for a potential moon landing, they said Sunday.

Chang’e 1 was a named after a Chinese goddess who, in a popular fairy tale, lives on the moon. The mission cost a reported 1.4 billion yuan (about $180 million), according to past Chinese media reports.

Officials with the China National Space Agency have said Chang’e 1 was the first wave in a three-phase plan to explore the moon with orbiters, landers and rovers.

http://www.space.com/aol/090302-chin...ge1-crash.html





Indian Lunar Probe Crashes On Moon Surface

By Jesus Diaz, 9:00 AM on Mon Nov 17 2008, 10,847 views


The Moon Impact Probe (MIP), one of the 11 payloads of Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft, successfully hit the lunar surface today at 20:31 hrs (8:31 pm) IST. This is the first Indian built object to reach the surface of the moon. The point of MIP’s impact was near the Moon’s South Polar Region. It may be recalled that the modern Indian space programme was initiated in 1962 when Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru was the Prime Minister of India.
Weighing 34 kg at the time of its launch onboard Chandrayaan-1, the box shaped MIP carried three instruments – a video imaging system, a radar altimeter and a mass spectrometer. The video imaging system was intended to take the pictures of the moon’s surface as MIP approached it. The radar altimeter was included to measure the rate of descent of the probe to the lunar surface. Such instruments are necessary for future lunar soft landing missions. And, the mass spectrometer was for studying the extremely thin lunar atmosphere.

MIP’s 25 minute journey to the lunar surface began with its separation from Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft at 20:06 hrs (8:06 pm) IST. This was followed by a series of automatic operations that began with the firing of its spin up rockets after achieving a safe distance of separation from Chandrayaan-1. Later, the probe slowed down with the firing of its retro rocket and started its rapid descent towards the moon’s surface. Information from the its instruments was radioed to Chandrayaan-1 by MIP. The spacecraft recorded this in its onboard memory for later readout. Finally, the probe had a hard landing on the lunar surface that terminated its functioning.

The Moon Impact Probe hit the moon last November 14 at 20:31 IST near the Moon's South Polar Region.

http://gizmodo.com/5090428/indian-lu...n-moon-surface





Japan's first lunar probe ends mission

By SHINO YUASA, AP
posted: 7 DAYS 4 HOURS AGO


TOKYO -Japan's first lunar probe made a controlled crash landing on the moon Thursday, successfully completing a 19-month mission to study the Earth's nearest neighbor, Japan's space agency said.
The remotely controlled satellite, named after the folklore princess Kaguya, had been orbiting the moon to map its surface and study its mineral distribution and gravity levels. It was dropped onto the surface of the moon at 3:25 am. (1825 GMT), the Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency, or JAXA, said in a statement.
"The mission was a success. Thanks to Kaguya, we will have a very detailed map of the lunar surface," said JAXA spokesman Shinichi Sobue. The Japanese space agency will analyze data sent by Kaguya and plans to publish the results online in November.
The 55 billion yen ($560 million) lunar mission launched in September 2007 is the largest in scope and ambition since the U.S. Apollo program of the 1960s and 70s, Sobue said.
"With data from Kaguya, we hope to shed light on the evolution of the moon," Sobue said.
During the Kaguya project, Japan launched two other orbiters to relay data. One landed on the moon in February, while the other has been measuring gravity around the moon and is still in orbit. Japan launched a moon probe in 1990, but that was a flyby mission.

http://news.aol.com/article/japans-f...n/522877?cid=7





Swedish probe crashes on moon

Published: 3 Sep 06 12:27 CET
Online: http://www.thelocal.se/4769/20060903/


The Swedish-developed space probe SMART-1 crashed on the moon at 7.42am on Sunday - exactly as planned.

Astronomers around the world had urged to try to observe the spectacular conclusion to the probe, which was developed by the Swedish Space Corporation in Solna at the request of the European Space Agency.

The probe has been orbiting the moon since November 2004.

At 7.42 on Sunday morning Swedish time the probe collided with the moon's surface, the news agency AFP confirmed. The impact was calculated to have created a crater between three and ten metres in diameter.

Several of the world's biggest telescopes were trained on the moon on Sunday morning in the hope of observing the impact, either as a weak flash of light or a very big dust cloud.

The Swedish research satellite Odin was also expected to be in a position to capture the collision with its radio receivers.

The probe approached the moon at a very shallow angle and at a speed of around 2 kilometres per second. It was initially planned to take place on August 17th, but it was postponed until Sunday so that it would be visible from Earth.

The probe's objective was primarily to test solar energy technology for powering such devices, and the mission was said to have been a success. The probe also carried out a number of scietific studies with the help of newly-developed miniature instruments.

http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=4769
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Old 06-19-2009, 04:01 PM   #28
iainl140285
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

The second mission, the Lunar Crater Observation and Sensing Satellite (LCROSS), aims to answer whether there is water on the Moon - either in the form of ice or hydrated minerals. It consists of two elements: a shepherding spacecraft and a Centaur upper stage rocket.

After being guided to a permanently shadowed crater at the Moon's south pole by its shepherding spacecraft, the Centaur rocket separates.


LCROSS will crash a rocket into the lunar surface
Hitting the Moon at more than 9,000 km/h (5,600 mph), the 2,200kg Centaur will kick up a huge plume of debris which could rise to 50km (30 miles).

It is expected to excavate some 350 metric tonnes of lunar material.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8107197.stm
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Old 06-20-2009, 08:19 AM   #29
viking
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Update...

Alfred Lambremont Webre
The planned October 9, 2009 bombing of the moon by a NASA orbiter that will bomb the moon with a 2-ton kinetic weapon to create a 5 mile wide deep crater as an alleged water-seeking and lunar colonization experiment, is contrary to space law prohibiting environmental modification of celestial bodies. The NASA moon bombing, a component of the LCROSS mission, may also trigger conflict with known extraterrestrial civilizations on the moon as reported on the moon in witnessed statements by U.S. astronauts Buzz Aldrin and Neil Armstrong, and in witnessed statements to NSA (National Security Agency) photos and documents regarding an extraterrestrial base on the dark side of the moon.

If the true intent of the LCROSS mission moon bombing is a hostile act by NASA against known extraterrestrial civilizations and settlements on the moon, then NASA and by extension the U.S. government are guilty of aggressive war which is the most serious of war crimes under the U.N. Charter and the Geneva Conventions, to which the U.S. is subject. The U.N. Outer Space Treaty, which the U.S. has ratified, requires that “ The moon and other celestial bodies shall be used by all States Parties to the Treaty exclusively for peaceful purposes. The establishment of military bases, installations and fortifications, the testing of any type of weapons and the conduct of military manoeuvres on celestial bodies shall be forbidden.” 98 nations have ratified and 125 nations have signed the U.N. Outer Space Treaty.
end of quote

viking
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Old 06-20-2009, 08:21 AM   #30
burgundia
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

As if it was not enough that they mess up the earth...
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Old 06-20-2009, 08:30 AM   #31
Steve_A
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Hi iain140285,

Personally I think NASA is looking for a lot more than water on the Moon. There are minerals that we don't have here on Earth which could be deemed as 'precious' and I think that big corporations are seeing how these things can be exploited, not to mention the huge amount of cheese!

Best regards,

Steve





Quote:
Originally Posted by iainl140285 View Post
The second mission, the Lunar Crater Observation and Sensing Satellite (LCROSS), aims to answer whether there is water on the Moon - either in the form of ice or hydrated minerals. It consists of two elements: a shepherding spacecraft and a Centaur upper stage rocket.

After being guided to a permanently shadowed crater at the Moon's south pole by its shepherding spacecraft, the Centaur rocket separates.


LCROSS will crash a rocket into the lunar surface
Hitting the Moon at more than 9,000 km/h (5,600 mph), the 2,200kg Centaur will kick up a huge plume of debris which could rise to 50km (30 miles).

It is expected to excavate some 350 metric tonnes of lunar material.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8107197.stm
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Old 06-20-2009, 09:25 AM   #32
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

So if I have the maths right the kinetic energy is therefore 6.87 x 10^9 J

Gonna make a big bang!

A..
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Old 06-23-2009, 01:26 AM   #33
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Quote:
Originally Posted by viking View Post
Update...

Alfred Lambremont Webre
The planned October 9, 2009 bombing of the moon by a NASA orbiter that will bomb the moon with a 2-ton kinetic weapon to create a 5 mile wide deep crater as an alleged water-seeking and lunar colonization experiment, is contrary to space law prohibiting environmental modification of celestial bodies. The NASA moon bombing, a component of the LCROSS mission, may also trigger conflict with known extraterrestrial civilizations on the moon as reported on the moon in witnessed statements by U.S. astronauts Buzz Aldrin and Neil Armstrong, and in witnessed statements to NSA (National Security Agency) photos and documents regarding an extraterrestrial base on the dark side of the moon.

If the true intent of the LCROSS mission moon bombing is a hostile act by NASA against known extraterrestrial civilizations and settlements on the moon, then NASA and by extension the U.S. government are guilty of aggressive war which is the most serious of war crimes under the U.N. Charter and the Geneva Conventions, to which the U.S. is subject. The U.N. Outer Space Treaty, which the U.S. has ratified, requires that “ The moon and other celestial bodies shall be used by all States Parties to the Treaty exclusively for peaceful purposes. The establishment of military bases, installations and fortifications, the testing of any type of weapons and the conduct of military manoeuvres on celestial bodies shall be forbidden.” 98 nations have ratified and 125 nations have signed the U.N. Outer Space Treaty.
end of quote

viking

http://www.examiner.com/x-2912-Seatt...-civilizations


NASA moon bombing violates space law & may cause conflict with lunar ET/UFO civilizations.






U.S. astronauts, NASA employees, Soviet scientists, NSA confirm the extraterrestrial presence on the moon

There are confirmed reports of an extraterrestrial presence on the moon, both from U.S. astronauts who have visited the moon, from NASA employees, from Soviet scientists and observers of the NASA moon visits, and from witnessed NSA (National Security Agency) reports on a moon based on the far side of the moon.

One report states that, “In a 2006 television documentary, ‘Apollo 11: The Untold Story,’ Buzz Aldrin admitted for the first time publicly that the astronauts saw UFOs on their trip to the Moon, but they were not allowed to discuss this information on the live audio feed to NASA. He stated that he felt it would have caused a ‘panic.’”






http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6QNz...layer_embedded

Last edited by micjer; 06-23-2009 at 01:28 AM.
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Old 06-23-2009, 01:44 AM   #34
oldpaganfreak
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

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Originally Posted by burgundia View Post
As if it was not enough that they mess up the earth...
my sentiments exactly. slamming large metal objects into the moon. serious littering. stupid, eh? i mean, WTF??
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Old 06-23-2009, 02:05 AM   #35
Dantheman62
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Maybe they're trying to break through that hard crust.

The Meteorite Craters Are All Too Shallow

Scientists tell us that the craters on the surface of the moon were
caused by the impact of meteors or comets. There are also meteorite craters
on earth. According to scientific calculations, if a meteorite of several
miles in diameter hits the earth or the moon at a speed of 30,000 miles per
second, which is equivalent to one million tons of dynamite, the depth of
the crater it creates should be four to five times that of its diameter.
The meteorite craters on earth prove this to be correct. Yet the craters on
the moon are strangely shallow. For example, Gagrin Crater, the deepest
one, is only four miles deep, although its diameter is 186 miles. With a
diameter of 186 miles, the depth of the crater should be at least 700 miles,
instead of 4 miles, which is just 12% of the diameter. This is another
scientific impossibility.
Why is it so? Astronomers are unable to come up with a perfect
explanation and they don't seem to want to either. They know that a perfect
explanation would overturn established theories. The only explanation is
that the moon's crust is composed of a very hard substance four miles
beneath the surface. The meteorites have failed to penetrate this hard
layer. Then, what is the very hard substance?
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Old 07-17-2009, 01:50 PM   #36
iainl140285
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

India Moon probe 'malfunctions'

India's first mission to the Moon has experienced a technical problem, India's space research officials say.

A sensor of the unmanned Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft has "malfunctioned" and steps have been taken to ensure it is able to continue its work, they say.

But the possibility remains that the mission may have to be cut short.

Chandrayaan-1 was launched last October and is regarded as a major step for India as it seeks to keep pace with other space-faring nations in Asia.

Scientists belonging to the Indian Space Research Organisation (Isro) said that the "vital star sensor" of the spacecraft had "malfunctioned".

"The mission is safe, but its lifespan may be affected," Isro spokesman S Satish told the BBC.

For the moment the spacecraft has been placed on a higher orbit, but officials say this could affect the quality of the photographs being sent back.

The unmanned Chandrayaan-1 spacecraft was launched into space from southern Andhra Pradesh state.


CHANDRAYAAN 1

1 - Chandrayaan Energetic Neutral Analyzer (CENA)
2 - Moon Impact Probe (MIP)
3 - Radiation Dose Monitor (RADOM)
4 - Terrain Mapping Camera (TMC)
5 - Moon Mineralogy Mapper (M3)
6 - Chandrayaan 1 X-ray Spectrometer (C1XS)
7 - Solar Panel


India sets its sights on the Moon
In Pictures: India Moon mission
The spacecraft is on a two-year mission of exploration.

The robotic probe will orbit the Moon, compiling a 3-D atlas of the lunar surface and mapping the distribution of elements and minerals.

"We have already got useful information from the pictures beamed," said an Isro official.

But he said the "quality of the pictures" had been affected because of the malfunction.

Powered by a single solar panel generating about 700 watts, the Isro probe carries five Indian-built instruments and six constructed in other countries, including the US, Britain and Germany.

The mission is expected to cost 3.8bn rupees (£45m; $78m), considerably less than Japanese and Chinese probes sent to the Moon last year.

But the Indian government's space efforts have not been welcomed by all.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/8155120.stm
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Old 11-13-2009, 06:03 PM   #37
Reader
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575012,00.html

NASA apparently found lots of water on the moon, beds of ice
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Old 11-14-2009, 06:27 AM   #38
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reader View Post
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575012,00.html

NASA apparently found lots of water on the moon, beds of ice
Reader - Hmm. And after a little dust plume on impact to analyze that kind of data from particulates? I thought that's how the experiment was supposed to flow. That's interesting. Barack Obama's Nobel Peace Prize announcement also preceded the mission by less than a day. It makes no sense: LCROSS nuke the moon, no dust, mission failure, peace prize, find water anyway.

Now Google's promoting the water. It's a bit mysterious. Oh well.
____________________________________

Nasa's lunar crash landing fails to raise moon dust
The Guardian, Saturday 10 October 2009
Nasa scientists had anticipated that the impact would throw up a six-mile-high cloud of lunar dust and rock which could be scanned for evidence of frozen water. But after the collision at 12.31pm today, no sign of the plume was spotted, even from the second stage, which crashed nearby four minutes later.

The Nuclear Attack on the Moon and Its Aftermatch – Lion!
The $98 million ‘ nuclear bombing raid’ on the moon was supposed to create a six-mile high cloud of dust that would be visible from small telescopes on the Earth.

Last edited by no caste; 11-14-2009 at 08:27 AM.
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Old 11-14-2009, 07:47 AM   #39
Dantheman62
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

There was a little dust plume.


2009 October 10
LCROSS Centaur Impact Flash
Credit: NASA, LCROSS Mission Team Explanation: This mid-infrared image was taken in the last minutes of the LCROSS flight mission to the Moon. The small white spot (enlarged in the insets) seen within the dark shadow of lunar crater walls is the initial flash created by the impact of a spent Centaur upper stage rocket. Traveling at 1.5 miles per second, the Centaur rocket hit the lunar surface yesterday at 11:31 UT, followed a few minutes later by the shepherding LCROSS spacecraft. Earthbound observatories have reported capturing both impacts. But before crashing into the lunar surface itself, the LCROSS spacecraft's instrumentation successfully recorded close-up the details of the rocket stage impact, the resulting crater, and debris cloud. In the coming weeks, data from the challenging mission will be used to search for signs of water in the lunar material blasted from the surface.
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Old 11-14-2009, 07:54 AM   #40
no caste
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dantheman62 View Post
There was a little dust plume.
OK, I changed that to little

Does it make sense though? A little dust plume on the dark side to find beds of water ice at the lunar south pole?
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Old 11-14-2009, 08:08 AM   #41
Dantheman62
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

Makes no sense to me at all! Didn't somebody already confirm ice? If not then that means that all of those countries that have crashed something into the moon, none of them did any tests for ice, but they tested for everything else! Atmosphere, soil composition, mapping the surface, and gravity tests, but not water? LOL

There's plenty of frost on Mars! LOL

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Old 11-14-2009, 08:26 AM   #42
no caste
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dantheman62 View Post
Makes no sense to me at all!
I'm glad it's not only me. It makes me feel better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dantheman62 View Post
There's plenty of frost on Mars! LOL
I still can't figure earth out.

Last edited by no caste; 11-14-2009 at 10:02 AM.
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Old 11-14-2009, 09:16 AM   #43
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

-

Last edited by no caste; 11-14-2009 at 10:43 AM.
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Old 11-19-2009, 09:52 PM   #44
Dantheman62
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Default Re: NASA prepares to bomb the moon...

2009 November 18
Water Discovered in Moon Shadow
Credit: LCROSS, NASA Explanation: Why is there water on the Moon? Last month, the LCROSS mission crashed a large impactor into a permanently shadowed crater near the Moon's South Pole. A plume of dust rose that was visible to the satellite, although hard to discern from Earth. The plume is shown above in visible light. Last week, the results of a preliminary chemical analysis gave a clear indication that the dust plume contained water. Such water is of importance not only for understanding the history of the Moon, but as a possible reservoir for future astronauts trying to live on the Moon for long periods. The source of the lunar water is now a topic of debate. Possible origins include many small meteorites, a comet, or primordial moon soil.
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