Price's law

[Flash]

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Content of the video:

The average person has never done anything creative in their life. on any dimension.

Why?

Price's law says that the square root of the number of people in a domain do 50% of the work.

10 employees: 3 of them do half the work (50% of the work)
100 employees: 10 of them do half the work
10,000 employees: 100 of them do half the work.

As a company grows, incompetence grows exponentially while competence grows linearly.

Furthermore, a company does not know who the best 100 are usually, and have no way to measure creativity, since it is always new, being creative.

When a company goes down and fires people, the first to go are the competent ones, the 100 (they do have opportunities elsewhere). Then second lay off are the second batch of more competent, and the company remains with those who do not produce much. (I personally have seen it at Bell Canada)

This would be why the fortune 500 companies do not hold more than 30 years on average before plummeting down. They had very few chances to be created, then very few chances to succeed, then very few chances to remain.

Price's law applies everywhere: those who have money in their savings account comply with that law, most people do not. Those who score better at hockey or at basketball (again out of ten, only 3 are productive) is distributed the same way, number or records produced, number of compositions written (in classical, only 5 composers occupy 50% of the market place (Mozart, Bach, Bethoven, Brahms, Tchaikovsky) and also 5% of their music occupy 50% of what is played, even size of cities follows the same distribution.

the 1% applies in every single realm where there is a difference in creative productivity.

Therefore it happens with money as well. Same with itirated trading games. 1% end up with all the money (like in Monopoly) and 1% of the 1% end up with much more, etc.

It is not at the level of structural inequalities, but built in at deeper levels.

And, we do not know how to take the money of the 1% and move it to the bottom, without having instantly a new 1% at the top (that maybe different people). You have 10% chance to be at the top 1% for at least one year of your life and a 40% chance of being at the top 10% for one year of your life (Canada and US, it is more difficult in Europe). There is turn over at the top, but all the time, only a fraction of people have all the money

Creative people, those who do the 50% of the work, are not easy to integrate in companies (I would say in any societal group), because they are filtered out at the entrance level (they do not obey as they are supposed to and there is no tool to evaluate them).





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmUdcWk6Vfw

First, I bet Avalon is in the 1% of forums for creative productivity.

Second, given that law, how do we circumvent it? how do we find ways to either get people become more creative producers, or to become supporters of the creative one? In any given path of life.

Third, how do we insure survival of the specie for one (the same law may apply over millions of years here), and how do we ensure survival of societies (the same law applies here too).

And any other questions and solutions that may arise.

I find that law absolutely fascinating. It seems to me that we are doomed from the start, due to our lack of creative productivity for one, and supporting structures as well.
(right now, we seem to have structures supporting narcissism and psychopathy, who are in the 1% as well, same law applies here too).

[Ernie Nemeth]

I have always called this the 80/20 law, as most others do.

Excellent topic, very timely.

Why the 80/20 rule applies universally is an intetesting philosophical question. That it holds true is not a debate since before my time.

[thepainterdoug]

I have always been creative, be it fixing cars, building pianos, making art and now composing music. I have never really worked for anyone, and if so, only as an independent contractor . Im not sure I would know how, or would be of value working with others. I live and work alone.

[ripple]

First, I bet Avalon is in the 1% of forums for creative productivity.
Second, given that law, how do we circumvent it? how do we find ways to either get people become more creative producers, or to become supporters of the creative one? In any given path of life.
Third, how do we insure survival of the specie for one (the same law may apply over millions of years here), and how do we ensure survival of societies (the same law applies here too).
And any other questions and solutions that may arise.
I find that law absolutely fascinating. It seems to me that we are doomed from the start, due to our lack of creative productivity for one, and supporting structures as well.
(right now, we seem to have structures supporting narcissism and psychopathy, who are in the 1% as well, same law applies here too).



Am also a great JP admirer and I do not doubt the basic description , be it labelled the Price Law or 80/20 Equation . But as you say , we need to find and use a mechanism or route which will improve on the perceived current limits of the present and typical model .

Hesitantly ,I believe it is easy to see how that can be done conceptually ( just define the opening position and required conclusion ) , but , of course , realisation is another matter .

I find a possible rationale for a realisation by thinking along these lines :-
When electrons spin around a nucleus , you have a fixed and defined model . And that given specific arrangement defines a particular element .

Equally ,the same applies to people . They spin relative to each other and therefore resultant energy relative relationships are set up , and on a far more complex basis , relative to perhaps many others .

And thus hierarchies are born and show themselves in terms that we see within a four dimension reality .Yet while the overall structure is fixed , perhaps you can change the relative positions of the energy waves or pockets within it , but without losing or changing the identity of the whole .

As you can never change the fundamental --- a hierarchy --- all you can do is change the positions of some of the bits within the full 'structure ' by combining the bits in different ways .

So if you can never re- shape the hierarchy , you do have the possibility of changing some of the quantum characteristics. These can be expressed in a quality which you might choose to label as Good - Bad , and/or , Right - Wrong

Thus the concept of the Philosopher - King(s) is reborn as the only way to change the hierarchy . Not its size or complexity . Just its overall flavour , spin and direction .

I probably have expressed matters poorly . But in precis form -- we must think in more complex ways than current and redefine what we think we mean by success and those it applies to . Perhaps we need A I and Quantum computers to help.


\

[Franny]

Interesting. I was quite creative in jobs I had but it was unwelcome. I was told to stop being creative, stop thinking, it wasn't my concern, do only as you're told; it's for those on top. I needed the income so I stopped being creative and stopped thinking. I became bored and discouraged. I saw it repeated with others in these workplaces. Now I work for myself.

[Ernie Nemeth]

This last year alone.

Unsolicited creativity:
At work: awning over workbench, new top for bench, lights for bench, proper trouble light (made from scratch), speaker box to enhance sound , adjustable wire rack, plug testing console, new circuits from panel for more work bench plugs, filing system, screw organizer, cable splicing jig, tool tote on wheels (from scratch), standardized evaluation system for equipment, others.

At home: mobile work shop, 200+ pages of book (half a book), 100+ pages other writings, paint all walls ceiling, designed and built living room swing chair, reappolstered kitchen chairs, designed and built vacuum accessory holder, in depth study of current interests, development of ideas snd concepts for this years plans.

[Flash]

I have always called this the 80/20 law, as most others do.

Excellent topic, very timely.

Why the 80/20 rule applies universally is an intetesting philosophical question. That it holds true is not a debate since before my time.

The Price's law (there is always a 1% who gets most of the wealth, even if the persons do turn over) is more striking to me than the Pareto law of 80/20 (20% of people do 80% of the productivity). Price's law explains in fact how to calculate all kinds of successes, how to calculate how many people in a given group will reach the pinnacle.

It also says that very few people in a given group are truly productive. It explains the 1% in top of the world quite well.

Peterson also says that the !% may be in that group only for a year or two. But 1% of 1% remain there for a longer time.

How come this is happening. How could we make the average folks more productive and creative? What would happen if the top was not 1% of the population but many many more? What would happen if wealth was distributed equally?

I read years ago about an Island in the Pacific who had natural resources that paid for all the living expenses of all the citizen of the island. The results were that people got demotivated, depressed and fat. They stop working altogether and creating. Does misery makes people become creative?

¤=[Post Update]=¤


I have always been creative, be it fixing cars, building pianos, making art and now composing music. I have never really worked for anyone, and if so, only as an independent contractor . Im not sure I would know how, or would be of value working with others. I live and work alone.

Yes, I do think that many many productive people and creators work often alone, and for themselves. I do think that large groups of workers do kill creativity. The social constraints become too much to be able to remain creative.

But I have no proofs of that.

[Flash]

First, I bet Avalon is in the 1% of forums for creative productivity.
Second, given that law, how do we circumvent it? how do we find ways to either get people become more creative producers, or to become supporters of the creative one? In any given path of life.
Third, how do we insure survival of the specie for one (the same law may apply over millions of years here), and how do we ensure survival of societies (the same law applies here too).
And any other questions and solutions that may arise.
I find that law absolutely fascinating. It seems to me that we are doomed from the start, due to our lack of creative productivity for one, and supporting structures as well.
(right now, we seem to have structures supporting narcissism and psychopathy, who are in the 1% as well, same law applies here too).



Am also a great JP admirer and I do not doubt the basic description , be it labelled the Price Law or 80/20 Equation . But as you say , we need to find and use a mechanism or route which will improve on the perceived current limits of the present and typical model .

Hesitantly ,I believe it is easy to see how that can be done conceptually ( just define the opening position and required conclusion ) , but , of course , realisation is another matter .

I find a possible rationale for a realisation by thinking along these lines :-
When electrons spin around a nucleus , you have a fixed and defined model . And that given specific arrangement defines a particular element .

Equally ,the same applies to people . They spin relative to each other and therefore resultant energy relative relationships are set up , and on a far more complex basis , relative to perhaps many others .

And thus hierarchies are born and show themselves in terms that we see within a four dimension reality .Yet while the overall structure is fixed , perhaps you can change the relative positions of the energy waves or pockets within it , but without losing or changing the identity of the whole .

As you can never change the fundamental --- a hierarchy --- all you can do is change the positions of some of the bits within the full 'structure ' by combining the bits in different ways .

So if you can never re- shape the hierarchy , you do have the possibility of changing some of the quantum characteristics. These can be expressed in a quality which you might choose to label as Good - Bad , and/or , Right - Wrong

Thus the concept of the Philosopher - King(s) is reborn as the only way to change the hierarchy . Not its size or complexity . Just its overall flavour , spin and direction .

I probably have expressed matters poorly . But in precis form -- we must think in more complex ways than current and redefine what we think we mean by success and those it applies to . Perhaps we need A I and Quantum computers to help.


\

Good, and what about abolishing hierarchy. What about stretching the common happenings much further, and creating a new way to doing / thinking? entirely new? So that everyone can enhance its own creative abilities and productive states.

What about changing the way people spin relative to each other? and how?

¤=[Post Update]=¤


Interesting. I was quite creative in jobs I had but it was unwelcome. I was told to stop being creative, stop thinking, it wasn't my concern, do only as you're told; it's for those on top. I needed the income so I stopped being creative and stopped thinking. I became bored and discouraged. I saw it repeated with others in these workplaces. Now I work for myself.

Yes I have been told once to serve coffee!!! Another time, I was told I did not have the huge company's profile (I did thank my boss for his comment lol). I also saw opportunities that made a lot of money from my employers, but was never thanked nor recognized for it (a few man took the glory).

As Peterson said, companies do not have the skills nor the equipment and know-how to evaluate people creating things that do not exist yet.

¤=[Post Update]=¤


This last year alone.

At home: mobile work shop, 200+ pages of book (half a book), 100+ pages other writings, paint all walls ceiling, designed and built living room swing chair, reappolstered kitchen chairs, designed and built vacuum accessory holder, in depth study of current interests, development of ideas snd concepts for this years plans.

I NEED YOU IN MY HOUSE!!!! lollllllllll