What is the opposite of sociopathy?

[Dennis Leahy]

I always thought the words "sociopath" and "psychopath" had different meanings, but when you look up the definitions, most definitions equate the two.

In my mind, a "psychopath" is a sociopath-in-action. Like hillary clinton getting Gadaffi murdered with a knife up his anus, and then cackling in glee about it.

You don't have to see the word "sociopathy" and its opposite as a dichotomy; you can see it as a spectrum between "sociopathy" and [_____________] <-- whatever word or phrase you see as the opposite. But you have to state the opposite to form the other end of the spectrum.

If you agree that the Earth is controlled by* sociopaths/psychopaths, and that they are, well, let's just say, "really bad guys", not to be emulated, then you might just want to aim at being the opposite of a sociopath, right? So, you need to be able to define for yourself what the other end of the spectrum is from sociopathy. *(let's stay at the human level, and not go to reptilians or archons)

This isn't a Milgram Experiment, I promise. No one will be harmed. It could be a powerful thought experiment - whether you offer an answer here in text or not. I've thought about this and have answered it for myself, and would appreciate hearing your answer (and for those who don't answer, I'm happy to have presented it to you for you private thought experiment.)

So, what is the opposite of sociopathy?

[Innocent Warrior]

I’m gonna go with empath.

[Luke Holiday]

Hello - Thank you for this thought provoking thread :)

quick reply: I believe the opposite of a socio/psychopath could accurately be defined as a person who is firmly committed to living her life in service to others...

[Mike]

I would say the opposite of a sociopath is anyone with a conscience.

[Constance]

Perhaps it is a being who is consciously aware of what it really means to do no harm and who actively/consciously lives this way.

[Mike]

I would like to amend my answer a little, because I think even sociopaths can have a conscience.

I think all humans have a conscience, but in a sociopath it's been buried and reduced to a whisper...but could still be heeded if desired.

I think the opposite of a sociopath is someone who has learned, with practice, how to listen to their conscience and have the discipline and strength of character to act in accordance with it.

[norman]

My mind's eye sees a suckling baby being held and cared for.

[Bubu]

If a sociopath enjoys hurting others then the opposite would be the one who dont enjoy hurting others but rather enjoy helping others. We can invent a word for that the important thang is the essence.

[christian]

Sociopathy, or psychopathy, is a disease. The opposite therefore is health.

It's like asking, "What is the opposite of cancer?"

[Sunny-side-up]

A LOVER of life and good will.
A person you trust and love to have around you.

Some one like Bill perhaps :sun:

[Innocent Warrior]

Looks to me that all the posts combined offer an accurate and comprehensive answer. What do you think it is, Dennis?

[Jad]

I think a psychopath/sociopath is identified with nothing but his/her ego and is not aware that everything and everyone are connected. The opposite is someone who truly understands that we are all different expressions of the same oneness and that when you lie or hurt "someone else" you are in fact lying to yourself.

[PurpleLama]

If one considers a sociopath/psychopath to be one who is devoid of emotion, then the opposite would be one who had incontrollable or unfettered emotion, and would likewise be considered deficient in the opposite way.

I like Christian's statement, that the opposite would be health.

[Jayke]

Michael Tsarion has done some good work on the difference between the Sage vs The Psychopath (https://unslaved.com/episode-51-sage-vs-psychopath/). (Although membership to their unslaved podcast is required to view it, unfortunately).

Even Tsarion seems to lump psychopath and sociopath into one catch-all category though, without much distinction between the two.

Clare Graves character levels (https://spiraldynamics.org/shop/clare-w-graves-levels-human-existence/) highlights the core difference between them.

Level 3 on the Graves system is defined as “Express Self To Hell With Others” i.e. the psychopath, these people tend to be more intimidating because they have no qualms about making a scene and having a bust up. Purely motivated by their own survival and self interest. They’d murder, steal, harass and torment without any care as to how they’re perceived by others. Usually found among low level thugs and street dealers, their psychopathic behaviour is expressed overtly, so they’re more likely to end up in prison. The Will-to-Power is expressed in a crude and threatening way.

Level 5 is “Express Self Calculatedly, For Personal Benefit at Expense of Others” i.e. the sociopath, cares more about how their image is perceived by the rest of society, so most of their psychopathic behaviour is done covertly, behind a facade of charm and charisma. Still purely motivated by their own self interest, and completely lacking empathy—the ability to have feelings about other people’s feelings. These are the snakes with 2 faces. The face they present to the world as a successful and motivated businessman/politician, and a face behind closed doors that seethes with rage and envy, that’ll do anything to claw its way to the top of the pecking order. The Will-to-Power is expressed discreetly, so that their manipulative behaviour isn’t recognised by society at large.

Sociopaths have more self awareness than psychopaths because they’re able to recognise how they’re perceived by others, whereas the psychopath simply doesn’t care how others see them.

Rather than opposites, it’s more about degrees of self-awareness, where the Will-to-Wisdom replaces self interest and the Sage develops an understanding of how their actions can impact and benefit society as a whole.

[Zanshin]

Entymologically speaking I think I'd have to agree with Rachel - empath.

As to the difference between the two, my take -

*a sociopath is born devoid of empathy - incapable of feeling in any 'socially accepted' way.

*a psychopath has developed this condition through experiencing severe trauma and stress.

For what it's worth - when I raised this topic a while back with my sister (sporting her freshly minted
psychology doctorate) - she agreed this was as useful a distinction as any.

[Ernie Nemeth]

The opposite of sociopathy, the social disease? I would guess gregariousness.

[xion]

Sociopaths are made by society, surroundings. Those people you can find in everyday life. Mostly in places of power but not exclusive.
while psychopaths are born that way.

My uncle was a psychiatrist so we had a little chat about this topic few years ago.

[Praxis]

The opposite of sociopathy is altruism.

Sociopathy is entirely for oneself. Or another way of putting it is Sociopathy is self interest to the extreme to exclusion of society.

A good example from GoT: Little finger would burn down the world if he could be king of the ashes. This is a sociopathy.

So it is a spectrum and sociopathy or self interest on one extreme with altruism and selflessness on the other.

[petra]

Sociopaths are made by society, surroundings. Those people you can find in everyday life. Mostly in places of power but not exclusive.
while psychopaths are born that way.

My uncle was a psychiatrist so we had a little chat about this topic few years ago.

Thank you for making this distinction.

I believe psychopaths are born that way. Not saying these people start out awful, they're just so predisposed that the chances of awfullness are very very high...

Sociopaths I can relate to quite a bit, and I do think society molds much of it. I might even be turning into a sociopath myself, and although it's not an ideal situation, it could be worse. My emotions are becoming muted, but my conscience is definitely more than just a whisper.

[Pam]

I’m gonna go with empath.

The interesting thing about being an empath is that it is a form of maladaption on the other end of the spectrum from sociopaths and narcissists. I have empathetic qualities and always thought I was just born that way, that it was a gift, or many times a curse. Although I'm sure there will be much disagreement about this, I feel that most empathetic people learn at an early age that the best way for them to gain attention is to be the listener, the fixer, the mediator, to be attuned to the feelings of others before ourselves. The need to do this will crop up from parents that are emotionally disconnected or they may well have a parent(s) that is a narcissist or sociopath. This can cause the empath and sociopaths or narcissists to have an attraction to each other. The empath offers attention, is a good listener and compassionate for a narcissist or sociopath to suck up like a sponge. The empath will see potential, or feel they can help or change a S or N.

So being a empath may be the opposite of sociopathy but it is as unbalanced as a sociopath, although it is not nearly as destructive and can in fact have attributes. At the end of the day, I think it is much harder to be an empath than a sociopath or a narcissist.

[Deux Corbeaux]

One can compare it with the question: “What is the opposite of theft”.

A sociopath (or narcissist) is someone who lives on another person’s energy - emotion, attention. They are unable to generate life energy by themselves, so they steal it from others, without any empathy. It’s also called energy vampirism.

Now what is the opposite of thief? - A person that doesn’t steal.

That brings up the question “what is stealing”? Is it just taking material things without permission?

One can say “I don’t steal, so I’m not a thief”.

- Now how about stealing time from someone when coming late on an appointment?
- Or stealing phrases or ideas, and I don’t mean plagiarism, but just the ones you picked up during daily conversations, using them as being your own later.
- How about stealing a conversation, when interrupting a person.

Contemplate on that and then say you never steal.

Now, occasionally coming late on an appointment will not make you a thief.
And asking for some attention from time to time will not make you a sociopath.

So what is the opposite of theft? Honesty?

And what is the opposite of sociopathy? Honesty?

I think it’s a combination of honesty and empathy, as I agree with Rachel as well.


Entymologically speaking I think I'd have to agree with Rachel - empath.

As to the difference between the two, my take -

*a sociopath is born devoid of empathy - incapable of feeling in any 'socially accepted' way.

*a psychopath has developed this condition through experiencing severe trauma and stress.

For what it's worth - when I raised this topic a while back with my sister (sporting her freshly minted
psychology doctorate) - she agreed this was as useful a distinction as any.

Zanshin, I think it’s the other way round;

* a psychopath is born devoid of empathy - incapable of feeling in any 'socially accepted' way.

* a sociopath has developed this condition through experiencing severe trauma and stress.

[xion]

Thank you for making this distinction.

I believe psychopaths are born that way. Not saying these people start out awful, they're just so predisposed that the chances of awfullness are very very high...

Sociopaths I can relate to quite a bit, and I do think society molds much of it. I might even be turning into a sociopath myself, and although it's not an ideal situation, it could be worse. My emotions are becoming muted, but my conscience is definitely more than just a whisper.

So far as we know, psychopaths are born that way, they have distinct brain wiring.
I remember seeing comparisons of brain scans between psychopaths (convicts for life) and normal people and there were distinct differences in brains.
I won't go in depths as I'm not a psychiatrist. Someone with PHD could explain this in more detail.

On the subject of sociopathic tendencies/behavior, from my observations, could be brought up in anyone if someone is pushed (verbally or physically) constantly for a period of time until a snap happens.
We can correlate this with school shootings where bulling is thriving. Combine bulling with home problems and you get a potential sociopath that goes on killing spree or commits a suicide.
There are many examples but I brought this one up as its a common thing these days.

On the up side in your case, when anyone is conscious of his/her behavior, is on the right path to change it as you recognize the problem from the start.
From there, look what was the trigger.

Well, that's how I deal with my problems and troubles.

Edit:

here are some interesting videos regarding the subject
6dv8zJiggBs

VDVaiwzU8yc

7wncaF5Rdvc

[edina]

I wonder if people interested in this topic would find these two articles helpful

1. Neuroimaging study links brain activity in the prefrontal cortex to certain psychopathic traits (https://www.psypost.org/2018/11/neuroimaging-study-links-brain-activity-in-the-prefrontal-cortex-to-certain-psychopathic-traits-52645)

https://d2ck0sxsjau14o.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/prefrontal-cortex.jpg

The article below was very sobering to me. The difficulty in treating psychopathy is heart-breaking. I remember when I finished reading it, just sitting still and saying a prayer for the parents of these children. It's a hard problem to solve.

2. When Your Child Is a Psychopath
The condition has long been considered untreatable. Experts can spot it in a child as young as 3 or 4. But a new clinical approach offers hope. (https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/06/when-your-child-is-a-psychopath/524502/)

Psychopaths have always been with us. Indeed, certain psychopathic traits have survived because they’re useful in small doses: the cool dispassion of a surgeon, the tunnel vision of an Olympic athlete, the ambitious narcissism of many a politician. But when these attributes exist in the wrong combination or in extreme forms, they can produce a dangerously antisocial individual, or even a cold-blooded killer. Only in the past quarter century have researchers zeroed in on the early signs that indicate a child could be the next Ted Bundy.

Researchers shy away from calling children psychopaths; the term carries too much stigma, and too much determinism. They prefer to describe children like Samantha as having “callous and unemotional traits,” shorthand for a cluster of characteristics and behaviors, including a lack of empathy, remorse, or guilt; shallow emotions; aggression and even cruelty; and a seeming indifference to punishment. Callous and unemotional children have no trouble hurting others to get what they want. If they do seem caring or empathetic, they’re probably trying to manipulate you.

Researchers believe that nearly 1 percent of children exhibit these traits, about as many as have autism or bipolar disorder. Until recently, the condition was seldom mentioned. Only in 2013 did the American Psychiatric Association include callous and unemotional traits in its diagnostic manual, DSM-5. The condition can go unnoticed because many children with these traits—who can be charming and smart enough to mimic social cues—are able to mask them.

More than 50 studies have found that kids with callous and unemotional traits are more likely than other kids (three times more likely, in one study) to become criminals or display aggressive, psychopathic traits later in life. And while adult psychopaths constitute only a tiny fraction of the general population, studies suggest that they commit half of all violent crimes. Ignore the problem, says Adrian Raine, a psychologist at the University of Pennsylvania, “and it could be argued we have blood on our hands.”

Researchers believe that two paths can lead to psychopathy: one dominated by nature, the other by nurture. For some children, their environment—growing up in poverty, living with abusive parents, fending for themselves in dangerous neighborhoods—can turn them violent and coldhearted. These kids aren’t born callous and unemotional; many experts suggest that if they’re given a reprieve from their environment, they can be pulled back from psychopathy’s edge.

In his book, Change Your Brain, Change Your Life, Dr Daniel Amen (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwijhoOPsNfgAhXJj4MKHWp9BXoQFjAAegQICBAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2FChange-Your-Brain-Life-Obsessiveness-ebook%2Fdp%2FB000S1LEO2&usg=AOvVaw0BTyMCUA5womQ8MNZL7Q2W) offers several cases where he was able to help people who had become violent, due to brain trauma.

Looking at the brain scans of the various conditions of the brain is very enlightening.

(I have a pdf of that book, but haven't figured out how to share it on the forum. I think the file is too big to upload?)

[yelik]

HUMANitarian

[edina]

And another article that delves into the differences between the two, sociopathy and psychopathy.

How to Tell a Sociopath from a Psychopath by Psychology Today (https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/wicked-deeds/201401/how-tell-sociopath-psychopath)


The cause of psychopathy is different than the cause of sociopathy (1). It is believed that psychopathy is the largely the result of “nature” (genetics) while sociopathy is more likely the result of “nurture” (environment). Psychopathy is related to a physiological defect that results in the underdevelopment of the part of the brain responsible for impulse control and emotions. Sociopathy, on the other hand, is more likely the product of childhood trauma and physical/emotional abuse. Because sociopathy appears to be learned rather than innate, sociopaths are capable of empathy in certain limited circumstances but not in others, and with a few individuals but not others.

[Dennis Leahy]

Looks to me that all the posts combined offer an accurate and comprehensive answer. What do you think it is, Dennis?

Yeah, I really appreciate that our combined answer covers a variety of aspects.

My answer is love (the verb.) The opposite of sociopathy is love.

I inadvertently confused the issue a bit by mentioning sociopaths (individuals with sociopathy) as well as sociopathy (a condition, with its behaviors.) To me, the opposite of a sociopath (individual) would be a non-sociopath (individual), which could range from a 'normal' amount of empathy/compassion in an individual, to someone highly empathic/compassionate. Sorry to those that were sort of misdirected toward defining the opposite of a sociopath (which I think is harder to define than the "opposite of sociopathy.")

A sociopath all alone isn't affecting other individuals, so when I think of sociopathy I think of an active energy exchange/behavior between the sociopath and other individuals. Sociopathy needs a target. I see love as a directed force, born of compassion (the missing ingredient of a sociopath.) The Greeks and some other civilizations/cultures were wise to have a handful of definitions/categories for love (eros, philia, agape), and so slightly clearer would be for me to define the "love" I'm referring to as love directed outward toward other individuals, falling into philia and agape. Love needs a "target" too.

I like that norman hit on the nurturing aspect of the love, so love is not just a feeling, it's an action (as sociopathy is the action/behaviors of the sociopath that affect others.) I think empathy/compassion is the feeling that spawns love. Without empathy/compassion, love won't occur.

Thanks, Avalon collectively, and all who have posted (or will post) their thoughts on this.

[Kryztian]

These are my definitions:


An empath is someone who can connect to other people's feeling and may seeks to help them alleviate their pain and suffering or at least wishes them well.


A psychopath has no regard for other's people feelings and is indifferent to how their actions will impact others. They are frequently talented at affecting fake empathy and use this to take advantage of others.


A sociopath frequently violates the rights of others, has more awareness of the feelings of others and often enjoys causing pain and suffering.


A narcissist seeks out empaths and needs to be the recipient of their attention. This makes them ideal victims of psychopaths.

Interestingly, the DSM-5, the current Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, published by the APA (American Psychiatry Association) lists neither Sociopaths or Psychopaths as a personality disorder. It does list "Anti Social Personality Disorder" which has some commonalities with sociopathy, but also with narcissism. Perhaps one reason for this omission is that there are so many psychopaths who are a powerful force within the APA (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?104365-Birds-of-a-Feather-CIA-APA).

[Constance]

Looks to me that all the posts combined offer an accurate and comprehensive answer. What do you think it is, Dennis?

Yeah, I really appreciate that our combined answer covers a variety of aspects.

My answer is love (the verb.) The opposite of sociopathy is love.

I inadvertently confused the issue a bit by mentioning sociopaths (individuals with sociopathy) as well as sociopathy (a condition, with its behaviors.) To me, the opposite of a sociopath (individual) would be a non-sociopath (individual), which could range from a 'normal' amount of empathy/compassion in an individual, to someone highly empathic/compassionate. Sorry to those that were sort of misdirected toward defining the opposite of a sociopath (which I think is harder to define than the "opposite of sociopathy.")

A sociopath all alone isn't affecting other individuals, so when I think of sociopathy I think of an active energy exchange/behavior between the sociopath and other individuals. Sociopathy needs a target. I see love as a directed force, born of compassion (the missing ingredient of a sociopath.) The Greeks and some other civilizations/cultures were wise to have a handful of definitions/categories for love (eros, philia, agape), and so slightly clearer would be for me to define the "love" I'm referring to as love directed outward toward other individuals, falling into philia and agape. Love needs a "target" too.

I like that norman hit on the nurturing aspect of the love, so love is not just a feeling, it's an action (as sociopathy is the action/behaviors of the sociopath that affect others.) I think empathy/compassion is the feeling that spawns love. Without empathy/compassion, love won't occur.

Thanks, Avalon collectively, and all who have posted (or will post) their thoughts on this.

Spectacular thoughts there Dennis. :star:

What you said there Dennis about love being the opposite of sociopathy, it was actually going to be my initial response.
And then another question came to me. What would be the conscious thought required within all of this love to be the opposite of sociopathy? And what came to me was my previous response and I think I need to reword it slightly here, to do no harm to any being.

I really like what you said there Rachel about all the posts offering an equally accurate and comprehensive answer. It is really a synergistic wholistic state of wellbeing that defines what the opposite of sociopathy is.:heart:

[Innocent Warrior]

I’m gonna go with empath.

The interesting thing about being an empath is that it is a form of maladaption on the other end of the spectrum from sociopaths and narcissists. I have empathetic qualities and always thought I was just born that way, that it was a gift, or many times a curse. Although I'm sure there will be much disagreement about this, I feel that most empathetic people learn at an early age that the best way for them to gain attention is to be the listener, the fixer, the mediator, to be attuned to the feelings of others before ourselves. The need to do this will crop up from parents that are emotionally disconnected or they may well have a parent(s) that is a narcissist or sociopath. This can cause the empath and sociopaths or narcissists to have an attraction to each other. The empath offers attention, is a good listener and compassionate for a narcissist or sociopath to suck up like a sponge. The empath will see potential, or feel they can help or change a S or N.

So being a empath may be the opposite of sociopathy but it is as unbalanced as a sociopath, although it is not nearly as destructive and can in fact have attributes. At the end of the day, I think it is much harder to be an empath than a sociopath or a narcissist.

Interesting view but it doesn’t fit for me. I was the opposite to attention seeking, I actively and successfully sought to avoid attention well into my twenties by being alone or hiding (hiding didn’t garner any attention because nobody missed me). I did hope to help my parents though, I thought I could fix them with money when I grew up, but while I was a child my focus was on surviving and minimising the impact they had on my life, the last thing I wanted was their attention.

I’d replace empath with PTSD for your point, strangely enough, a response to trauma that’s the opposite to becoming a sociopath. With PTSD you become hyper defensive and hyper sensitive to survive, and yeah, I reckon being a sociopath would be easier than PTSD, although far more undesirable, PTSD being the lesser of two evils, so to speak.

[Zanshin]

"Zanshin, I think it’s the other way round;

* a psychopath is born devoid of empathy - incapable of feeling in any 'socially accepted' way.

* a sociopath has developed this condition through experiencing severe trauma and stress."

Deux Corbeaux, you are correct - I got it arse about.

Apologies all - the hazards of posting too late at night.

[norman]

Looks to me that all the posts combined offer an accurate and comprehensive answer. What do you think it is, Dennis?

Yeah, I really appreciate that our combined answer covers a variety of aspects.

My answer is love (the verb.) The opposite of sociopathy is love. . . . . . .



I agree so much with that statement that I'm a little shocked when I 'look up' and see who I'm agreeing with :)

As I read through the various replies in this thread I was thinking to myself about the difference between a true opposite and an intellectual counter point.

[Flash]

Looks to me that all the posts combined offer an accurate and comprehensive answer. What do you think it is, Dennis?

Yeah, I really appreciate that our combined answer covers a variety of aspects.

My answer is love (the verb.) The opposite of sociopathy is love. . . . . . .



I agree so much with that statement that I'm a little shocked when I 'look up' and see who I'm agreeing with :)

As I read through the various replies in this thread I was thinking to myself about the difference between a true opposite and an intellectual counter point.

I not see the opposite of sociopathy as being love at all.

Sociopathy is the ABSENCE OF LOVE, not the opposite of love. The opposite of love is hatred, but, I am not even sure there is an opposite to love except for destruction.

But I am absolutely sure there is the absence of love. It is cold, extremely painful to feel for human beings.
We are made of love, even those hating are made of love. Encountering beings who have no love, who are the absence of love, is extremely painful. We have a few directing this world.

sociopathy is the absence of love. Psychopathy is the absence of love too, plus neurosis.

[Joe from the Carolinas]

If the question is tweaked a little to, what is the pathological opposite to sociopathy, I would think unhealthy dependency.

[Dennis Leahy]

If the question is tweaked a little to, what is the pathological opposite to sociopathy, I would think unhealthy dependency.

Yeah, I was just thinking in terms of sociopathy as the pinnacle of unhealthy (and, because it requires a target, dangerous) behavior, and so what should we aim for to take our energy the opposite direction. I don't think someone has to be a DSM-IV antisocial personality disorder "sociopath" to inflict sociopathic damage on others.

"If you agree that the Earth is controlled by sociopaths/psychopaths, and that they are, well, let's just say, "really bad guys", not to be emulated, then you might just want to aim at being the opposite of a sociopath, right? So, you need to be able to define for yourself what the other end of the spectrum is from sociopathy."

[norman]

I think the intellect itself, as we are currently trained to know it and use it, has a pathological leaning.

[Tintin]

Well, the term sociopathy is actually logically or literally oxymoronic, at least in the accepted terminology. Etymologically, it kind of means "sharing of feelings". To be sociopathic may mean that you are sharing a feeling about something. At least being aware of how your feelings may impact on others around you.

The opposite of sociopathy is potentially NOT sharing feelings; being unaware of how your feelings and how you express them impact on the social dynamic - your milileu - maybe being somewhat un-empathic, or, un-feeling. Or even un-sociopathic.

So, maybe, being sociopathic is something to aspire to; to be opposed to that may be something to avoid aspiring to.

[Flash]

If the question is tweaked a little to, what is the pathological opposite to sociopathy, I would think unhealthy dependency.

yes, it is

Dennis, one of the problem for understanding sociopathy is precisely that we give it normal human feelings: hatred vs love, feelings all human have at one point.

We fail to understand that basic human emotional parameters are our greatest hindrance to understand it.

Sociopathy, and mostly psychopathy, means NO EMOTIONS. One of the feelings they have is thrill, the adrenaline feeling, but those are feeling, body based mostly, not emotions. And forget about anything higher than emotions.

Why would very very big dependency (emotional dependency is almost always unhealthy imo) be the opposite of sociopathy. Because big dependency means lots of emotions. Sociopathy means none.

It is the absence of love that is sociopathic. Believe me, I met a few in my life. And the absence of love is much more painful than hatred. The later is still a human being albeit in pain.

[AlyssaRoselyn]

I agree with empath. Sociopaths understand the emotions of others but don't actually feel the emotions. Where as empaths can barely ignore the emotions and experience of others

[Dennis Leahy]

...

Dennis, one of the problem for understanding sociopathy ...

Well, then, my question was poorly stated. I figured the prompting of mentioning hillary clinton's heinous behavior, (antisocial personality disorder/sociopathic) as one end of a spectrum would be enough to examine the other end of the spectrum (the healthy behavior we would all want to aim toward.) I wouldn't have thought of emotional dependency as the opposite of clinton's behavior, for example.

I was looking for heart-centered responses, and got a lot of those. Some other responses seem more head-centered (intellectual) than what I was going for, but I think the head-centered responses added to the collage. :~)

[TomKat]

I always thought the words "sociopath" and "psychopath" had different meanings, but when you look up the definitions, most definitions equate the two. In my mind, a "psychopath" is a sociopath-in-action. Like hillary clinton getting Gadaffi murdered with a knife up his anus, and then cackling in glee about it.


I heard a psychologist say that a sociopath is thought to be the result of environment, whereas a psychopath is thought to be genetic.

[Flash]

...

Dennis, one of the problem for understanding sociopathy ...

Well, then, my question was poorly stated. I figured the prompting of mentioning hillary clinton's heinous behavior, (antisocial personality disorder/sociopathic) as one end of a spectrum would be enough to examine the other end of the spectrum (the healthy behavior we would all want to aim toward.) I wouldn't have thought of emotional dependency as the opposite of clinton's behavior, for example.

I was looking for heart-centered responses, and got a lot of those. Some other responses seem more head-centered (intellectual) than what I was going for, but I think the head-centered responses added to the collage. :~)

lol how can you have a heart centered response when talking of sociopathy?? we have to consider something that has no heart to start with.

Heart centered? this is the problem... it puts you in the wrong track when about sociopath. I feel some disconnect here. Dennis, it seems obvious to me that you have little experience with true sociopath. Am I wrong?

By the way, Clinton has no heart. She is a true sociopath in my views.

Are sociopath environment created while psychopath genetic? I would say it is on a sliding spectrum. What I observed us that psychopaths have other mental illnesses, such as neurosis, psychosis, etc while sociopaths do not. But I am pretty sure both have some genetic components.

[Dennis Leahy]

...

Dennis, one of the problem for understanding sociopathy ...

Well, then, my question was poorly stated. I figured the prompting of mentioning hillary clinton's heinous behavior, (antisocial personality disorder/sociopathic) as one end of a spectrum would be enough to examine the other end of the spectrum (the healthy behavior we would all want to aim toward.) I wouldn't have thought of emotional dependency as the opposite of clinton's behavior, for example.

I was looking for heart-centered responses, and got a lot of those. Some other responses seem more head-centered (intellectual) than what I was going for, but I think the head-centered responses added to the collage. :~)

lol how can you have a heart centered response when talking of sociopathy?? we have to consider something that has no heart to start with.

Heart centered? this is the problem... it puts you in the wrong track when about sociopath. I feel some disconnect here. Dennis, it seems obvious to me that you have little experience with true sociopath. Am I wrong?
Considering that I am convinced that the humans that control planet Earth are or mimic the behavior of sociopaths/psychopaths, such as the example I offered of hillary clinton, we ALL have a great deal of experience with sociopaths. They have murdered, tortured, imprisoned, raped, robbed, and impoverished hundreds of millions of other humans in our lifetimes. And, yes, I also have one-on-one experience with sociopaths, as well as sociopathic behavior from individuals that may not exactly fit the DSM IV definition but still exhibited sociopathic behavior. I think there are accepted aspects of society that train people into sociopathic behavior, even if they are not technically antisocial personality disorder. Almost everything that we think of as a dichotomy is really a spectrum, and so there are people who range from expressing love to people expressing sociopathy - a full range where at one end the behavior gets closer and closer to a john bolton, or a hillary clinton, or a john mccain, or a barack obama. What's the behavior at the other end of that spectrum? The good end of that spectrum.

I'm asking about (the opposite of) sociopathy, in general, not the opposite of John Doe the sociopath that I experienced or a technical discussion of DSM IV symptoms. You know that story about the Buddha in front of a group of monks, and the Buddha held up the lotus blossom, and one monk smiled instantly, and the Buddha handed him the flower and named his successor. Like that. Your instant, gut-level response for how you would describe the other end of the spectrum from sociopathy. What's the opposite of sociopathy?

Whatever you say is OK, it's right - this is all opinions.

[AutumnW]

The opposite of psychopathy is borderline personality disorder. Psychopaths are fearless, cold and do 't bond emotionally. Borderlines are fearful (of abandonment primarily) and bond hysterically.

Strangely, both extremes end up treating others really badly, though the interior states of mind are radically different. Of all the disorders Borderlines suffer the most and psychopaths the least.

[Flash]

...

Dennis, one of the problem for understanding sociopathy ...

Well, then, my question was poorly stated. I figured the prompting of mentioning hillary clinton's heinous behavior, (antisocial personality disorder/sociopathic) as one end of a spectrum would be enough to examine the other end of the spectrum (the healthy behavior we would all want to aim toward.) I wouldn't have thought of emotional dependency as the opposite of clinton's behavior, for example.

I was looking for heart-centered responses, and got a lot of those. Some other responses seem more head-centered (intellectual) than what I was going for, but I think the head-centered responses added to the collage. :~)

lol how can you have a heart centered response when talking of sociopathy?? we have to consider something that has no heart to start with.

Heart centered? this is the problem... it puts you in the wrong track when about sociopath. I feel some disconnect here. Dennis, it seems obvious to me that you have little experience with true sociopath. Am I wrong?
Considering that I am convinced that the humans that control planet Earth are or mimic the behavior of sociopaths/psychopaths, such as the example I offered of hillary clinton, we ALL have a great deal of experience with sociopaths. They have murdered, tortured, imprisoned, raped, robbed, and impoverished hundreds of millions of other humans in our lifetimes. And, yes, I also have one-on-one experience with sociopaths, as well as sociopathic behavior from individuals that may not exactly fit the DSM IV definition but still exhibited sociopathic behavior. I think there are accepted aspects of society that train people into sociopathic behavior, even if they are not technically antisocial personality disorder. Almost everything that we think of as a dichotomy is really a spectrum, and so there are people who range from expressing love to people expressing sociopathy - a full range where at one end the behavior gets closer and closer to a john bolton, or a hillary clinton, or a john mccain, or a barack obama. What's the behavior at the other end of that spectrum? The good end of that spectrum.

I'm asking about (the opposite of) sociopathy, in general, not the opposite of John Doe the sociopath that I experienced or a technical discussion of DSM IV symptoms. You know that story about the Buddha in front of a group of monks, and the Buddha held up the lotus blossom, and one monk smiled instantly, and the Buddha handed him the flower and named his successor. Like that. Your instant, gut-level response for how you would describe the other end of the spectrum from sociopathy. What's the opposite of sociopathy?

Whatever you say is OK, it's right - this is all opinions.

well, in that case, what many have said here is it:

on the sick side, the ultra dependent is the other end.

but the true other end is the mentally healthy, hearty person. No less no more. Someone who has a heart. Human emotions being the first step.

Mara the dog is much healthier than any sociopath. She has emotions of joy, happiness, she can suffer through loss of a loved one, and she has an elemental heart, can sacrifice herself for her human friend. Name me any sociopath that can do all that.

The answer is so simple that I still have problems to see the purpose of your question. Anyhow...

If you were talking of highly spiritual people, this would be another topic altogether.

For almost all of us, we have no problem understanding and seeing the other hand of the spectrum. The problems we have is in accepting the no emotion, no love, the non human amongst us humans.

[edina]

In his book, Change Your Brain, Change Your Life, Dr Daniel Amen (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwijhoOPsNfgAhXJj4MKHWp9BXoQFjAAegQICBAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2FChange-Your-Brain-Life-Obsessiveness-ebook%2Fdp%2FB000S1LEO2&usg=AOvVaw0BTyMCUA5womQ8MNZL7Q2W) offers several cases where he was able to help people who had become violent, due to brain trauma.

Looking at the brain scans of the various conditions of the brain is very enlightening.

(I have a pdf of that book, but haven't figured out how to share it on the forum. I think the file is too big to upload?)

As luck would have it, I just stumbled onto a link to an earlier version of this book in pdf form, for anyone who may be interested in reading it.

http://avalonlibrary.net/ebooks/Daniel%20G.%20Amen%20-%20Change%20Your%20Brain%2C%20Change%20Your%20Life%20-%20The%20Breakthrough%20Program%20for%20Conquering%20Anxiety%20Depression%20Obsessiveness%20Anger%20 and%20Impulsiveness.pdf

Lots of food for thought in this book.

It's in a pdf archive library. (http://www.pdfarchive.info/index.php?)

[AutumnW]

If the question is tweaked a little to, what is the pathological opposite to sociopathy, I would think unhealthy dependency.

yes, it is

Dennis, one of the problem for understanding sociopathy is precisely that we give it normal human feelings: hatred vs love, feelings all human have at one point.

We fail to understand that basic human emotional parameters are our greatest hindrance to understand it.

Sociopathy, and mostly psychopathy, means NO EMOTIONS. One of the feelings they have is thrill, the adrenaline feeling, but those are feeling, body based mostly, not emotions. And forget about anything higher than emotions.

Why would very very big dependency (emotional dependency is almost always unhealthy imo) be the opposite of sociopathy. Because big dependency means lots of emotions. Sociopathy means none.

It is the absence of love that is sociopathic. Believe me, I met a few in my life. And the absence of love is much more painful than hatred. The later is still a human being albeit in pain.

Psychopaths have emotions, just dialled way way down. So to say they have no emotions makes sense as a kind of shorthand.

As far as opposites go, if a lack of intensity of emotion (not buried, not suppressed) is the hallmark of psychopathy. It's opposite would be intense emotion of any kind. The psychopath doesn't hate you when he or she discards you, often without warning of any kind -- they simply feel nothing. That void of apathy, being dumped out of a warm bed right into an arid wasteland, is the worst of Hells.

Is the true opposite of all extreme states of emotion, the void? Is the opposite of love really hatred? Hatred indicates a potential for change to another extreme state. But apathy, not caring? That seems like an end point, the end of the story.

Metaphysically, it may represent a spiritual vanishing point a non-being. When the highest emotion one being can feel for another is withering contempt, they are well on their way.

[Flash]

If the question is tweaked a little to, what is the pathological opposite to sociopathy, I would think unhealthy dependency.

yes, it is

Dennis, one of the problem for understanding sociopathy is precisely that we give it normal human feelings: hatred vs love, feelings all human have at one point.

We fail to understand that basic human emotional parameters are our greatest hindrance to understand it.

Sociopathy, and mostly psychopathy, means NO EMOTIONS. One of the feelings they have is thrill, the adrenaline feeling, but those are feeling, body based mostly, not emotions. And forget about anything higher than emotions.

Why would very very big dependency (emotional dependency is almost always unhealthy imo) be the opposite of sociopathy. Because big dependency means lots of emotions. Sociopathy means none.

It is the absence of love that is sociopathic. Believe me, I met a few in my life. And the absence of love is much more painful than hatred. The later is still a human being albeit in pain.

Psychopaths have emotions, just dialled way way down. So to say they have no emotions makes sense as a kind of shorthand.

As far as opposites go, if a lack of intensity of emotion (not buried, not suppressed) is the hallmark of psychopathy. It's opposite would be intense emotion of any kind. The psychopath doesn't hate you when he or she discards you, often without warning of any kind -- they simply feel nothing. That void of apathy, being dumped out of a warm bed right into an arid wasteland, is the worst of Hells.

Is the true opposite of all extreme states of emotion, the void? Is the opposite of love really hatred? Hatred indicates a potential for change to another extreme state. But apathy, not caring? That seems like an end point, the end of the story.

Metaphysically, it may represent a spiritual vanishing point a non-being. When the highest emotion one being can feel for another is withering contempt, they are well on their way.


where did you get this information about psychopaths having emotions, being able to emote? they learn to imitate emotions this for sure. But having emotions, where did you get that? Seems to me you took it from Mattiuzzi https://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-g-mattiuzzi/do-psychopaths-genuinely-_b_10287312.html

I think he is confounding feelings and emotions and antisocial disorder versus real psychopaths - psychopath can feel, they feel people 24/7 if they want to be able to exploit us. They can detect other's emotions and even imitate those emotions. But at some point, we will find them ackward in their imitation. It may take time to discern, but at some point we finally see something. Theirs are is feeling a relation, not emoting such as joy, love, etc.

They feel jealousy, envy, resentment. They do not emote it. Emotions are basic stuff such as love, joy, anger, sadness, fear. A psychopath will feel pleasure (body oriented), will feel stress and be exhilarated by it, will feel thrill, but will not have the accompanying emotions. This study dates from 2013. Again here, they do not distinguish between antisocial personality disorder leading to horrendous crimes, and psychopathy leading to horrendous crimes too. Those with personnality disorder to emote at least two main emotions that the psychopaths do not have (studies from 2018)

Please, read this whole text where the psychopaths brains were scanned. It seems they chose not to emote for others, the default brain position being not to emote nor empathize. So in real everyday life, they do not emote, an automatism, which can be by choice. Our default position is to empathize automatically, to emote automatically. We have to chose not too when doing a surgery or acupuncture for example.

here an extract;
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/nov/25/could-a-brain-scan-diagnose-you-as-a-psychopathSo psychopathic individuals do not simply lack empathy. Instead, it seems as though for most of us, empathy is the default mode. If we see a victim, we share her pain. For the psychopathic criminals of our study, empathy seemed to be a voluntary activity. If they want to, they can empathize, and that explains how they can be so charming, and maybe so manipulative. Once they have seduced you into doing what serves their purpose, the effortful empathy would though probably disappear again. Free of the constraints of empathy, they is then little to stop them from using violence.

Then you have this study done in 2017, which shows that the psychopaths brains are different, lacking some neuronal connectivity. They did not distinguished between antisocial behavior or antisocial personality disorder (those do have emotions, even if often called psychopaths, they are not true psychopaths) and psychopathy as such. But interesting nevertheless.


That region of the brain, the ventromedial prefrontal cortex, is really important for perspective-taking and it's thought to be important for empathy, because it has the general function of simulation. It simulates other people and their mental states, it simulates ourselves in the future.

So the fact that this brain region appears not to work quite as well in psychopaths, and that it has weaker connections with other brain regions — like the ventral striatum in our paper, or the amygdala in other papers — suggest that this knocking-out or disrupting of this key node for simulation might have broad effects on behavior that include decision-making and interpersonal relations.https://www.wbur.org/commonhealth/2017/07/07/psychopaths-brain-scans-neuron

The most interesting article being this one in my views. It explains that antisocial behavior - antisocial personnality disorder (ASPD) - is divided in two groups when brains are scanned. Here are the findings, from 2018. More it is studied, more we see that psychopaths lacks at least two emotions everyone else has:


“The cold-hearted psychopathic group begin offending earlier, engage in a broader range and greater density of offending behaviors, and respond less well to treatment programs in adulthood, compared to the hot-headed group. We now know that this behavioral difference corresponds to very specific structural brain abnormalities which underpin psychopathic behavior, such as profound deficits in empathizing with the distress of others.”

The researchers used magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) to scan the brains of 44 violent offenders diagnosed with ASPD. Crimes committed included murder, rape, attempted murder and grievous bodily harm. Of these, 17 met the diagnosis for psychopathy (ASPD+P) and 27 did not. Those that met the antisocial personality disorder but did not meet the psychopathy criteria (via the Psychopathy Checklist) were referred to as the ASPD-P group by the researchers. They also scanned the brains of 22 healthy non-offenders.

The study found that ASPD+P offenders displayed significantly reduced grey matter volumes in the anterior rostral prefrontal cortex and temporal poles compared to ASPD-P offenders and healthy non-offenders.

These areas are important in understanding other people’s emotions and intentions and are activated when people think about moral behavior, the researchers noted. Damage to these areas is associated with impaired empathizing with other people, a poor response to fear and distress, and a lack of self-conscious emotions such as guilt or embarrassment.

“Identifying and diagnosing this sub-group of violent offenders with brain scans has important implications for treatment,” Blackwood continued.

“Those without the syndrome of psychopathy, and the associated structural brain damage, will benefit from cognitive and behavioral treatments. Optimal treatment for the group of psychopaths is much less clear at this stage.https://psychcentral.com/news/2012/05/11/scans-show-psychopaths-have-brain-abnormalities/38540.html”

For psychopathy, I much prefer to rely on actual research and brain scans correlated with behaviors than our own judgment. I think we cannot comprehend those behaviors, we are not equiped to comprehend what is lacking in someone else's brain.

Now FOR DENNIS :peace:

The opposite of psychopathy or sociopathy would be, on a scientific research based level, a brain that would have many more interconnectivity than the average person in and between the specific regions that are lacking in psychopaths.

[Constance]

In his book, Change Your Brain, Change Your Life, Dr Daniel Amen (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwijhoOPsNfgAhXJj4MKHWp9BXoQFjAAegQICBAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2FChange-Your-Brain-Life-Obsessiveness-ebook%2Fdp%2FB000S1LEO2&usg=AOvVaw0BTyMCUA5womQ8MNZL7Q2W) offers several cases where he was able to help people who had become violent, due to brain trauma.

Looking at the brain scans of the various conditions of the brain is very enlightening.

(I have a pdf of that book, but haven't figured out how to share it on the forum. I think the file is too big to upload?)

As luck would have it, I just stumbled onto a link to an earlier version of this book in pdf form, for anyone who may be interested in reading it.

http://avalonlibrary.net/ebooks/Daniel%20G.%20Amen%20-%20Change%20Your%20Brain%2C%20Change%20Your%20Life%20-%20The%20Breakthrough%20Program%20for%20Conquering%20Anxiety%20Depression%20Obsessiveness%20Anger%20 and%20Impulsiveness.pdf

Lots of food for thought in this book.

It's in a pdf archive library. (http://www.pdfarchive.info/index.php?)

Thanks very much for that Edina, greatly appreciated :highfive: