Straight Pride gets attacked during "pride month"

[TargeT]

If you believe in something: go for it.




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What is your reaction to this.... where are we?

[KiwiElf]

Welcome back big guy! You were missed! (... and believe me, WE are sticking up for what we believe!) ;)

[TargeT]

all of existence is what it is... it doesn't need to be stuck up for ;)

Thank you for the sentiment however, glad to see you as well.

[DNA]

Straight pride is kind of like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.
Also, it's good to see you back.

[Mike]

look, are we really going to pretend not to know why a gay pride parade is reasonable and a straight pride parade really isn't?:)

1) gays are a minority, historically discriminated against and ridiculed, demeaned, shat upon, judged relentlessly, and treated with disdain.

2) aaaand straight people haven't been(not because of their sexuality anyway)

gays have this pride parade to: remind themselves and the world how it all started, where it is now, and hopefully where it will go in the future. they're a tiny group, peering at a massive audience through a lens of justified fear and distrust....so maybe we can forgive them if they wanna have a little reassuring pow-wow once a year??

straights have a pride parade to: troll gays.

i mean, have the straight pride parade. i don't give a sh!t. go for it. i'm no SJW, i'm a jordan peterson acolyte for christ sake.

but for the love of God, stop pretending like you don't know why it's a little silly.

TargeT, good to have ya back:handshake: I disagree with you here, but what's new?;)

[Orobo]

Straight pride is kind of like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.


What is that reason, do you think? I am very curious about your angle.

I have been working with a lot of gay men and women in my profession ( body modification in Amsterdam...ahem..) and never got confronted with the sour tone launched at straight people nowadays. They thought I was straight...
After my move to another country, later, I had a lesbian colleage I worked with extensively around 2007-2009. Big sculptural/architectural art projects ( another profession of mine).
There was this drip of "patriarchy this and that..." that I did not get at all. That came a bit later, when it was in your face more and more while going through some rabbit holes.
She was not a happy camper at that time and found a kind of way to funnel her confused hate through this.

This, I read, was an important tactic from the start it seems; engaging sour lesbians to fan a new movement within feminism to hurt the existing society.

I have recently, after quite some years, started talking to her again. I will ask her about this...

[Orobo]

look, are we really going to pretend not to know why a gay pride parade is reasonable and a straight pride parade really isn't?:)

1) gays are a minority, historically discriminated against and ridiculed, demeaned, shat upon, judged relentlessly, and treated with disdain.

2) aaaand straight people haven't been(not because of their sexuality anyway)

gays have this pride parade to: remind themselves and the world how it all started, where it is now, and hopefully where it will go in the future. they're a tiny group, peering at a massive audience through a lens of justified fear and distrust....so maybe we can forgive them if they wanna have a little reassuring pow-wow once a year??

straights have a pride parade to: troll gays.

i mean, have the straight pride parade. i don't give a sh!t. go for it. i'm no SJW, i'm a jordan peterson acolyte for christ sake.

but for the love of God, stop pretending like you don't know why it's a little silly.


I do not know where to start....since this issue is one of the lines going straight ( haha..) to the heart of the matter. That heart being evil forces getting our world unglued with acidic strategies. There is, nothing silly or trolly about it. This is as serious as it gets.
There is a reason there is a parade for gays, there is a reason why straight people are targeted.

And, after having been on the receiving end; a mod circumventing the cursewordrobotthingy.... :happythumbsup:

[Wind]

straights have a pride parade to: troll gays.

i mean, have the straight pride parade. i don't give a sh!t. go for it. i'm no SJW, i'm a jordan peterson acolyte for christ sake.

but for the love of God, stop pretending like you don't know why it's a little silly.

Amen to that. The straight parade seems like a "butthurt parade" to me, no pun intended.

[Mike]

straights have a pride parade to: troll gays.

i mean, have the straight pride parade. i don't give a sh!t. go for it. i'm no SJW, i'm a jordan peterson acolyte for christ sake.

but for the love of God, stop pretending like you don't know why it's a little silly.

Amen to that. The straight parade seems like a "butthurt parade" to me, no pun intended.


:bigsmile::bigsmile::bigsmile:

[conk]

There is a stark distinction between not discriminating and placing the gay contingent on a golden pedestal. They certainly deserve to be treated with respect and acceptance, but do not deserve any special considerations. Their voice cannot stifle normal discourse and quieten the voice of freedom. Straight people must not be made to feel guilty or shameful for simply being straight.

But we all know there is an underlying agenda that isn't addressed in polite company and the media is awfully quiet on it. The whole gay/lesbian/bi/trans/non-specific refusal to identify agenda has been co-opted by those seeking to obliterate family and community standards. Break up the strength of a nation and control is much easier.

[Mark]

What is your reaction to this.... where are we?

We are at a very strange place in human history and also in American history. They say truth is stranger than fiction and it is becoming increasingly clear that it is so. I get this, as I get all responses to identity politics. Hit back with more identity politics. I see it as a zero-sum game that masks as such but really isn't, since one side of it is ingrained and embedded, but has chosen to use the strategies of what it perceives as its opposition.

Perfectly logical.

If it works, use it.

It degrades the entire debate and renders the discussion meaningless as it is no longer concerned with finding an answer to an inherent problem, but, instead, is seeking only to neutralize and minimalize the issue that divided and pit populations against each other in the second place. The only outcome possible is a lessening of real understanding and the capacity to move forward productively. There is the further embedding within a perspective and lifestyle and attempts to reach out and find a way forward productively becomes more difficult.

This is where we are.

It is, apparently, where we absolutely need to be. My question is, where do we go from here?

[Mike]

There is a stark distinction between not discriminating and placing the gay contingent on a golden pedestal. They certainly deserve to be treated with respect and acceptance, but do not deserve any special considerations. Their voice cannot stifle normal discourse and quieten the voice of freedom. Straight people must not be made to feel guilty or shameful for simply being straight.

But we all know there is an underlying agenda that isn't addressed in polite company and the media is awfully quiet on it. The whole gay/lesbian/bi/trans/non-specific refusal to identify agenda has been co-opted by those seeking to obliterate family and community standards. Break up the strength of a nation and control is much easier.



Perhaps there is an agenda, but an important thing to remember is this: the average gay person is not suggesting anyone feel guilt or shame for being straight

Suggesting they do is an intellectually shallow thing to say, respectfully.

[DeDukshyn]

... like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.
...

There's also this new thing where you aren't allowed to say "Merry Christmas" anymore. I get told this all the time by overly fearful white people. So I ask them "why not?". And they respond "Because you'll offend the Muslims, of course!". I ask in curiosity, "who told you this?".
"Well, everyone just knows this!"
"Who's everyone, and how do they know?"
"You mean you don't know about this!?"
"No, I don't, lets go find some Muslims and test this out."
"No! You can't do that!?" - they would respond with terror in their eyes ...

I say "Merry Christmas!" to every brown person I see (I live in Calgary, Lots of non-whites, and non-Christians here). Not one is offended. Some return a hearty smile and "Merry Christmas!" back, others, just smile and say "thank you!". Not one gets offended in any form or fashion.

"Should we try this on Jews? Maybe it'll work on Jews?"

In reality, the only people I ever met that would get offended from receiving a "merry Christmas" were white atheists, not Muslims, not Jews, not Sikhs (Sikhs love Christmas and respect Christ BTW), etc. Yet I was told constantly by all my friends of a certain political bias, that this was a real thing, and they knew it 'as a fact!!' ... but it was a lie created out of nothing more than fear itself.


It really is amazing how a bunch of like minded white people can create an entire divide and conquer strategy on their own just because they are full of fear. That fear and the results of thinking within that fear and the words and decisions that spawn from it, are what is quite often creating the "chaos" that they also are reporting ... a fear that manifests, a self realizing "prophecy" ... but its all just an evil born out of a sick perception that is not reflected in reality.

I also knew this black lady, who always was complaining about how she's constantly a victim of racism. We were in the store buying some stuff, and the clerk was a bit of an ass - but equally to me as to her - just some guy having a bad day I guess.

"Did you see the way he treated me! Just because I'm black!"

I didn't point out to her that the guy was treating everyone very equally crappy, but it was obvious that at least in part, her perception of "racism" (in this example) was created by A) her expectation of it even if it didn't exist and B) Her inability to observe anything outside of herself and her own mind.


It is these types of things that are going to destroy our freedoms. And guess who's going to make damn sure its going to happen? The same people who bitch about not being "allowed" to say Merry Christmas in Canada. Not the "Left" not the "Capitilists", "not the PTB"

It'll be brought on by these type of people that have strong political and other biases, creating discord out of their fear everywhere it doesn't exist.

[Praxis]

There is a stark distinction between not discriminating and placing the gay contingent on a golden pedestal. They certainly deserve to be treated with respect and acceptance, but do not deserve any special considerations. Their voice cannot stifle normal discourse and quieten the voice of freedom. Straight people must not be made to feel guilty or shameful for simply being straight.

But we all know there is an underlying agenda that isn't addressed in polite company and the media is awfully quiet on it. The whole gay/lesbian/bi/trans/non-specific refusal to identify agenda has been co-opted by those seeking to obliterate family and community standards. Break up the strength of a nation and control is much easier.



Perhaps there is an agenda, but an important thing to remember is this: the average gay person is not suggesting anyone feel guilt or shame for being straight

Suggesting they do is an intellectually shallow thing to say, respectfully.

What is happening here is getting to be a victim. People see the power of being a victim. So they want that. I have never met a gay person who has done this to me because I am straight. Im sure it has happened but not to me.

But if they get to frame the discourse as straight people are the victim here, then their aggressive actions will look like defense instead of offense.

[conk]

There is a stark distinction between not discriminating and placing the gay contingent on a golden pedestal. They certainly deserve to be treated with respect and acceptance, but do not deserve any special considerations. Their voice cannot stifle normal discourse and quieten the voice of freedom. Straight people must not be made to feel guilty or shameful for simply being straight.

But we all know there is an underlying agenda that isn't addressed in polite company and the media is awfully quiet on it. The whole gay/lesbian/bi/trans/non-specific refusal to identify agenda has been co-opted by those seeking to obliterate family and community standards. Break up the strength of a nation and control is much easier.



Perhaps there is an agenda, but an important thing to remember is this: the average gay person is not suggesting anyone feel guilt or shame for being straight

Suggesting they do is an intellectually shallow thing to say, respectfully.I did not mean to intimate as much. The purveyors of discord, not the individuals, are guilty of it.

I am a huge proponent of human rights. Know there is no distinction made for gays or other minorities. Always treat anyone as an equal, as a occupant of this place in space with me until they demonstrate otherwise.

[DeDukshyn]

There is a stark distinction between not discriminating and placing the gay contingent on a golden pedestal. They certainly deserve to be treated with respect and acceptance, but do not deserve any special considerations. Their voice cannot stifle normal discourse and quieten the voice of freedom. Straight people must not be made to feel guilty or shameful for simply being straight.

But we all know there is an underlying agenda that isn't addressed in polite company and the media is awfully quiet on it. The whole gay/lesbian/bi/trans/non-specific refusal to identify agenda has been co-opted by those seeking to obliterate family and community standards. Break up the strength of a nation and control is much easier.



Perhaps there is an agenda, but an important thing to remember is this: the average gay person is not suggesting anyone feel guilt or shame for being straight

Suggesting they do is an intellectually shallow thing to say, respectfully.I did not mean to intimate as much. The purveyors of discord, not the individuals, are guilty of it.

Who are the purveyors of discord in this example? And are not the spreaders of the perceptions of the discord the ones doing all the actually heavy lifting?

[conk]

There is a stark distinction between not discriminating and placing the gay contingent on a golden pedestal. They certainly deserve to be treated with respect and acceptance, but do not deserve any special considerations. Their voice cannot stifle normal discourse and quieten the voice of freedom. Straight people must not be made to feel guilty or shameful for simply being straight.

But we all know there is an underlying agenda that isn't addressed in polite company and the media is awfully quiet on it. The whole gay/lesbian/bi/trans/non-specific refusal to identify agenda has been co-opted by those seeking to obliterate family and community standards. Break up the strength of a nation and control is much easier.



Perhaps there is an agenda, but an important thing to remember is this: the average gay person is not suggesting anyone feel guilt or shame for being straight

Suggesting they do is an intellectually shallow thing to say, respectfully.I did not mean to intimate as much. The purveyors of discord, not the individuals, are guilty of it.

Who are the purveyors of discord in this example? Are not the spreaders of the perceptions of the discord the ones doing all the actually heavy lifting for them? That's likely a rhetorical question, as the answer is evident, but I'll say yes, you are correct. They sometimes, maybe often, do so out of ignorance. They do not realize they are part of something more sinister. We're all used and engineered to some extent.

[Orobo]

... like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.
...

There's also this new thing where you aren't allowed to say "Merry Christmas" anymore. I get told this all the time by overly fearful white people. So I ask them "why not?". And they respond "Because you'll offend the Muslims, of course!". I ask in curiosity, "who told you this?".
"Well, everyone just knows this!"
"Who's everyone, and how do they know?"
"You mean you don't know about this!?"
"No, I don't, lets go find some Muslims and test this out."
"No! You can't do that!?" - they would respond with terror in their eyes ...

I say "Merry Christmas!" to every brown person I see (I live in Calgary, Lots of non-whites, and non-Christians here). Not one is offended. Some return a hearty smile and "Merry Christmas!" back, others, just smile and say "thank you!". Not one gets offended in any form or fashion.

"Should we try this on Jews? Maybe it'll work on Jews?"

In reality, the only people I ever met that would get offended from receiving a "merry Christmas" were white atheists, not Muslims, not Jews, not Sikhs (Sikhs love Christmas and respect Christ BTW), etc. Yet I was told constantly by all my friends of a certain political bias, that this was a real thing, and they knew it 'as a fact!!' ... but it was a lie created out of nothing more than fear itself.


It really is amazing how a bunch of like minded white people can create an entire divide and conquer strategy on their own just because they are full of fear. That fear and the results of thinking within that fear and the words and decisions that spawn from it, are what is quite often creating the "chaos" that they also are reporting ... a fear that manifests, a self realizing "prophecy" ... but its all just an evil born out of a sick perception that is not reflected in reality.

I also knew this black lady, who always was complaining about how she's constantly a victim of racism. We were in the store buying some stuff, and the clerk was a bit of an ass - but equally to me as to her - just some guy having a bad day I guess.

"Did you see the way he treated me! Just because I'm black!"

I didn't point out to her that the guy was treating everyone very equally crappy, but it was obvious that at least in part, her perception of "racism" was created by A) her expectation of it even if it didn't exist and B) Her inability to observe anything outside of herself and her own mind.


It is these types of things that are going to destroy our freedoms. And guess who's going to make damn sure its going to happen? The same people who bitch about not being "allowed" to say Merry Christmas in Canada. Not the "Left" not the "Capitilists", "not the PTB"

It'll be brought on by these type of people that have strong political and other biases, creating discord out of their fear everywhere it doesn't exist.

There are real world changes on street level. School in Holland are not placing Christmas trees anymore due to vandalism by students.
Villages are having Christmas displays with animals ruined and lambs got killed.
At the same time are big chain-stores, who are deep rooted in the dutch people quit using "Happy Easter" and "Merry Christmas" in their folders and advertisements. It is " Happy springtime" and " winterfeast" now.
High level police folk are publicly visiting muslim iftar feasts profiling themselves in the media. They never have bothered profiling themselves at christian, jewish or other festivities.

The same happens with the gay canal pride in Amsterdam. Public servants and other figures showing off in the media wearing pink and rainbows.

It is long beyond the "only in the heads" of people here in Europe. And it is a strange sight indeed: "hurray gays!" and "hurray muslims!" from the same mouths while local culture is being erased.

Combine this with the systematically hiding of crimes by minorities, and giving excuses for lower sentencing than the native europeans get and one can see there is a push for a deep conflict.

I understood there was a similar push by using the black community in the US against the society as it was, until the perpetrators were seen and dropped for a big part quietly the manipulations and moved on to the gay community and blew it up to the big LGBTQ+++ circus as it is now.
Even using using gay-rights rhetoric as a base for destructive foreign policy.

I am very much in line with you that it is a lot about self-policing.
Get it in their heads and they will do the work themselves.
Genius, using the typical inherent empathy of a people as a weapon against them. This, I think, is effective since it combines so well with the social structures of the human species.

For that to happen a few key things have been placed front and center in the media. These thoughts are not generated by themselves.

Who controls the media?

[Justplain]

I will tell you why the lbgt issue has gotten beyond just ensuring that mistreated people are treated better, its the way the lgbt message is being delivered. The message is emphatically applied to children, and this is insidious from my vantage. For instance, in the schools in my province every flagpole has first the Canadian flag and then the lgbt rainbow flag flying right below it for the month of June. No other flag is ever allowed to fly on the same flagstaff as the Canadian flag. This is symbolic, and designed to make being lbgt seem to be something special, a promotion to susceptible children IMHO.

Another example of how the lgbt agenda is peddled to children is this asinine gender identity theory, that gender is 'a social construct'. In some jurisdictions, including the world health org, there are over 100 genders a person can be. This terminology is not based on scientific biological fact, there are only two sexes, and its really turned gender into a fashion statement. This popycock was sourced by the Kinsian Institute (now part of the u of Indiana) funded by Rockefeller grants in the 1940s. You may say this subject is trivial, however, gender identity propaganda was trotted out to minor-aged children in Ontario over the past few years and I heard one mother complain that her daughter was not having any issues with heterosexual sexuality until her class became exposed to this nonsense in school, and then her class started to display children saying they were this gender or that, etc, which encouraged more sexual experimentation and permiscuousness, etc. Sexual experimentation leads to a divorce between associating sex with love and marriage, and also gives rise to sexually transmitted diseases, etc.

Other examples of 'over-the-top' exhibitionism of lgbt-ism include bands of totally naked gay men tromping along in gay parades. This is offensive to most and if anyone did this at a regular parade they'd be arrested. Another is 'dragqueen storytime for children' at public libraries, which tries to make cross-dressing a 'fun' activity for susceptible children. Sorry, leave children out of this one too.

So there is a legitimate reason to push back against the 'promotion' of the lgbt agenda. If this issue was kept to being a private issue between consenting adults, I would not have a problem with it, but not public promotion. And if the public promotion of lgbt-ism continues expect more pushback because, to me, this isn't about civil rights anymore, it's about lifestyle choices and if one side can promote itself then so can the other.

[Orobo]

Yep, right on.

Were you now justsplaining to me? ;)

Your post was more about how, not why, by the way.
The same here. Sex on the canal pride in Amsterdam is not about throwing off the yoke anymore. My gay friends agree, but the extreme drug use in the gay community, and the deep nihilistic depressed state of many, lead to strange tableaux, I tell ya.

My oldest daughter is now on course with all kinds of psychologists to see whether she will be a he, down the line. Kind of ****ed up, excuzes mes mots.
She is a she, but it is considered inconsiderate to tell her that, even as her father. But since she is 18 now...

She got exposed to LGBT stuff via all kinds of popular you tubers and the road to recognition and status is very short as a trans-this or that. An insecure teenager eats that like cake of course. We'll see what happens, I take it in quite a relaxed manner so far even though my perspective on the general state of the society at large is broad and deep. Rapid onset gender dysphoria anyone?

Soon the new state school planning is being revealed soon. I am very curious, and my wife too. She is a teacher, but very aware and doing her part. Loved by her pupils. Especially the difficult ones. The sexual curriculum, if I can call it like that is what I am most interested in... is it our turn now?

love, O.

[DeDukshyn]

There is a stark distinction between not discriminating and placing the gay contingent on a golden pedestal. They certainly deserve to be treated with respect and acceptance, but do not deserve any special considerations. Their voice cannot stifle normal discourse and quieten the voice of freedom. Straight people must not be made to feel guilty or shameful for simply being straight.

But we all know there is an underlying agenda that isn't addressed in polite company and the media is awfully quiet on it. The whole gay/lesbian/bi/trans/non-specific refusal to identify agenda has been co-opted by those seeking to obliterate family and community standards. Break up the strength of a nation and control is much easier.



Perhaps there is an agenda, but an important thing to remember is this: the average gay person is not suggesting anyone feel guilt or shame for being straight

Suggesting they do is an intellectually shallow thing to say, respectfully.I did not mean to intimate as much. The purveyors of discord, not the individuals, are guilty of it.

Who are the purveyors of discord in this example? Are not the spreaders of the perceptions of the discord the ones doing all the actually heavy lifting for them? That's likely a rhetorical question, as the answer is evident, but I'll say yes, you are correct. They sometimes, maybe often, do so out of ignorance. They do not realize they are part of something more sinister. We're all used and engineered to some extent.

"They"? ... or "We"?

[DeDukshyn]

... like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.
...

There's also this new thing where you aren't allowed to say "Merry Christmas" anymore. I get told this all the time by overly fearful white people. So I ask them "why not?". And they respond "Because you'll offend the Muslims, of course!". I ask in curiosity, "who told you this?".
"Well, everyone just knows this!"
"Who's everyone, and how do they know?"
"You mean you don't know about this!?"
"No, I don't, lets go find some Muslims and test this out."
"No! You can't do that!?" - they would respond with terror in their eyes ...

I say "Merry Christmas!" to every brown person I see (I live in Calgary, Lots of non-whites, and non-Christians here). Not one is offended. Some return a hearty smile and "Merry Christmas!" back, others, just smile and say "thank you!". Not one gets offended in any form or fashion.

"Should we try this on Jews? Maybe it'll work on Jews?"

In reality, the only people I ever met that would get offended from receiving a "merry Christmas" were white atheists, not Muslims, not Jews, not Sikhs (Sikhs love Christmas and respect Christ BTW), etc. Yet I was told constantly by all my friends of a certain political bias, that this was a real thing, and they knew it 'as a fact!!' ... but it was a lie created out of nothing more than fear itself.


It really is amazing how a bunch of like minded white people can create an entire divide and conquer strategy on their own just because they are full of fear. That fear and the results of thinking within that fear and the words and decisions that spawn from it, are what is quite often creating the "chaos" that they also are reporting ... a fear that manifests, a self realizing "prophecy" ... but its all just an evil born out of a sick perception that is not reflected in reality.

I also knew this black lady, who always was complaining about how she's constantly a victim of racism. We were in the store buying some stuff, and the clerk was a bit of an ass - but equally to me as to her - just some guy having a bad day I guess.

"Did you see the way he treated me! Just because I'm black!"

I didn't point out to her that the guy was treating everyone very equally crappy, but it was obvious that at least in part, her perception of "racism" was created by A) her expectation of it even if it didn't exist and B) Her inability to observe anything outside of herself and her own mind.


It is these types of things that are going to destroy our freedoms. And guess who's going to make damn sure its going to happen? The same people who bitch about not being "allowed" to say Merry Christmas in Canada. Not the "Left" not the "Capitilists", "not the PTB"

It'll be brought on by these type of people that have strong political and other biases, creating discord out of their fear everywhere it doesn't exist.

...

... from the same mouths while local culture is being erased.


I don't want to discount what you say, but there's still much of this that is a RESULT of what people think "in their heads" - this was my point.

In my example, it was the local culture erasing their own culture. They made a choice to not say "Merry Christmas" anymore. Maybe someone started that rumour, or maybe they started it themselves, but it was the local people, the local culture, the ones feeling like they were being "attacked" that decided that they weren't allowed to say Merry Christmas anymore. They chose that. Not the Muslims, not the "social engineering" squad, not the "Lefties" not the "PTB" ... THEY chose that for themselves. Sure, public schools are still trying to purge religion, and find that balance as their demographic changes, but that doesn't stop ANYONE from saying "Merry Christmas" to anyone. That's a personal choice. This is how it starts ...

Also consider that thinking like this gets into the heads of CEOs and people who make advertising decision, all which is entirely driven by money. As Earth's demographics become more mixed, the target demographic for business also does the same. It is just a result of this, but it is that initial disease that first, is "only in the heads" - as you put it, and it is from this location that the damage begins to occur, NOT actually from any external source. As I said, its like a self actualizing prophecy, and the PTB sit back and watch and laugh at us destroy ourselves.

This is how the world gets destroyed. Who you blame is irrelevant in this light.

[Orobo]

Well yes, you are right. For a large part.

I think the social codes are very strong, so signaling, conforming, statusbuilding etc maybe win from a larger perspective about ones culture and its values, and what is needed to survive.
Because these values and their meaning are phased out, in the media, in schools.

"Internationalization" is inevitable, as agent Smith said it right. But exactly where do you want it to go?

It is a development that works itself forward with the internet at its core, after TV did a great part already. But who decides the programming?

Also, we are pretty myopic. If one is a long trem thinker, or doer, it goes under the radar for most of the time. Maybe apart from some flare-ups, when you hold your position, and your breath, and wait till the commotion has subsided. Then one can continue, while feeding the next slight of hand. Plain simple magician stuff. Keep em dumb enough, not seeing the whole picture. And keep that up just two generations, and you're scot free.

But it has to be fed, led. There comes in the hidden hand. Where originates the first publication of a term, or an action, a change? Someone does it, and it has to be sustained. Not too slow, not too fast.
And then there have to be politicians, to throw the change in the lap of society. On the right moment, when enough of a base has been formed. Some have read about whatever it is this time, some not. The media and the discourse strategies wil iron out wrinkles that will pop up. And then a new ruse will be launched, just in time to go further. I see it as all managed.
The international character of the changes are a giveaway. My family is well spread out in Europe, so we see it. Feel it.

Some ceo's will get it "in their heads" and some are in on the plan and decide to, together with those other ceo's in the know to change the advertisements. So it is more than one nudge and the sitting back watching us destroy ourselves. There is work being done, constantly. And thus it does matter if there is someone to blame. That is why there is this forum. We love the minutiae.

My view is that people must be pushed to conflict. It is not readily there, it is a last resort. Think about false flags fx, narratives spun out. all that.

Someone is pushing and someone is paying.

Like you say it is the people themselves. At one point, though, the machinations of "the evil ones" will break the links to your past, your awareness about yourself, your value in your society, óf your society and the values it holds and needs to live well.

At thát point, is it still the peoples own fault?

love, O.

[Kryztian]

Yes, Strait people need to celebrate. For millenia, people have lived in narrow channels between two bodies of water, from the Straits of Magellan and the Straits of Hormuz to the Dardanelles and the Singapore Straits, and have endured ... oh .. wait a minute ... perhaps you didn’t mean “Strait” people but ... “Straight” people? As in heterosexuals? Okay then! Well then a quick piece of Queer Eye to the StraiGHt guy advice: if you belong to a certain affinity group, you might want to learn how to spell the name of the group properly.;)

So, at a gay pride parade you have:

Dykes on Bikes (usually leading the parade)
Drag queens on roller skates
Gay choirs (i.e. the ones that can actually sing in tune a capella)
Disco go-go boys on floats and backs of trucks
Colorful balloons, flags, leather, feather boas as well as some of the Americana you see at a small town 4th of July parade with a rainbow twist.
Village People impersonators blaring out music from floats that cause all sorts of passersby who don’t even know what the parade is about to spontaneously start dancing the moves to “Y-M-C-A”


Granted, most of these people go home and live the same mundane lives as everyone else, but they do know how to throw a spectacular parade!

So since parades are often there to promote come concept of dignity and equality, I have to ask you, Straight Pride people, what kind of parade will you create that is equally captivating and successful at the GLBT parade. You do want want the town to block off the main street for you for several hours and you are going to do a lot to build up the down town community and get people to the restaurants and spend money there right???? What could that possibly be? I would love to see Straight Pride people thrown parades year after year in cities all over the world that were as popular and successful.

[DeDukshyn]

...
But it has to be fed, led. ...

I want to engage your post a bit more, but I'm at work ... it was a good post.

But just on this snippet ... consider that, in my original example, the "can't say merry Christmas!" group is both the producer of loosh and the consumer of it - no one appeared to be "leading it" or even "starting it" -- it took on a life of its own - it became its own meme.

I'll be the first to denounce the media as controlled, but much of it is still controlled by money. They write inflammatory headlines and articles, re-print anything that their competitors / affiliates are printing without vetting ... while there is some manual control from the top, I won't argue there, don't lose sight that money is primary the target - sensationalist headlines and articles create loosh, and we are both the creators and consumers of that loosh. WE are.

Humanity is completely blind. It has come much more heavily to me, the realization of this. We don't understand how we all are the conduits of all the "evil" and "chaos" we see around us. Without us, evil ceases to exist. Not "them" ... US.

We are not recognizing the true energy flows, we think we are and we are lashing out at what we think we see but we are blinded by our own perceptions.

[neutronstar]

Straight pride is kind of like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.
Also, it's good to see you back.

Yes they are. The problem is the radical left is the only side you hear and they are the minority.

[Orobo]

Straight pride is kind of like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.
Also, it's good to see you back.

Yes they are. The problem is the radical left is the only side you hear and they are the minority.

Very accurate, and, with sufficient control over politics and media, the noise this little group generates is enough to shift laws in the direction they wish for. Even if there is no mandate to actually do what they do, it keeps everyone confused enough to keep the lean on. I call that The Lean. That long term push hanging there for ages and ages.
One group being able to hold on to their history is enough it seems. The one with the longest memory wins.

And I feel I know very little about where I come from. I really wish for this "inner knowing" stuff to be true. Otherwise I am a lost soul like any other squabbling over the crumbs.

O.

[Strat]

don't lose sight that money is primary the target - sensationalist headlines and articles create loosh, and we are both the creators and consumers of that loosh.

100%.

Not too long ago there was a drive by during a football game, not far from the stadium. Initially they reported it as a 'drive by', 4 people were shot. Then they went back and changed it to 'mass shooting in jacksonville.' 4 people is a massive amount of people?

'Drive by' in the ghettos of jacksonville is not news you click on, that happens constantly here. If you hear of a 'mass shooting' though then you drop everything and find out what happened.

[DeDukshyn]

Straight pride is kind of like stating it is okay to be white.
For some reason these neither are culturally acceptable at the moment.
Also, it's good to see you back.

Yes they are. The problem is the radical left is the only side you hear and they are the minority.

Very accurate, and, with sufficient control over politics and media, the noise this little group generates is enough to shift laws in the direction they wish for.

O.

If only the more "aware" people like us could just learn to ignore it instead of spreading it ... If this is a social engineering thingy ... we certainly are reacting to it exactly as they want us to - to spread it, and with it spread the emotional reaction. They don't care if the emotional reaction is in support of or against. It serves their purpose equally either way.

The only way ahead is to stop giving it energy, and try to encourage others to do the same.

[Orobo]

Yeah Dedukshyn, that is the weirdest.

Whatever I do, any which way, I will be unknowingly supporting someone's plan that will not benefit the good.
The thing I return to is truth. Let that be the lead, always. That is the best I can do, I reckon.

One pretty awake dude I know says he spreads his knowledge according to the morphic field-principle. Sounds neat, but not doing anything could be a trap also?..."trust the plan" right Quabblers?

Not giving "it" energy means one has to know what "it" is and your neighbour too, preferably. Which means reading and talking?

I deal with the barrage of info by doing stuff, good stuff, important stuff around the farm, while going through 1000s of hours of mp3s. Hence the ear avatar. Shutting up and listening. See my amount of posts since January 2011?
Can't be bothered, have **** to do.

That balance leaves little to no emotional baggage to be bothered by. I can't even listen while sitting still. The flow of work through my hands is the key for me.

O.

[DeDukshyn]

 
 
It was a bit rhetorical, meant as general statement to everyone to hopefully provoke some thought ... I didn't mean it to be directed at you, but maybe at some other people.


Yeah Dedukshyn, that is the weirdest.
...
Not giving "it" energy means one has to know what "it" is and your neighbour too, preferably. Which means reading and talking?

I disagree a bit. You (or "someone") needn't need to know what "it" is; what is required is to learn the ability to ignore emotional reactions and see only only the known facts as they lay in front of you. One needs to stop "believing" in "things" and start believing in themselves, and being honest with them self and living up to the standards they hold everyone else to.

Edit: I re-read what you wrote, and I think you may have meant "Giving 'it' energy means ..." -- if so, yes, you are 100% correct.



I deal with the barrage of info by doing stuff, good stuff, important stuff around the farm, while going through 1000s of hours of mp3s. Hence the ear avatar. Shutting up and listening. See my amount of posts since January 2011?
Can't be bothered, have **** to do.

That balance leaves little to no emotional baggage to be bothered by. I can't even listen while sitting still. The flow of work through my hands is the key for me.

Then you are already one step ahead of most. ;)

[HaveBlue]

The Tavistock institute, Committee of 300 etc... doesn't care what the public is fighting and distracted about. Just as long as they are fighting amongst themselves and not focusing their attention on where they ought to. THEM.

[Orobo]

 
 
It was a bit rhetorical, meant as general statement to everyone to hopefully provoke some thought ... I didn't mean it to be directed at you, but maybe at some other people.


Yeah Dedukshyn, that is the weirdest.
...
Not giving "it" energy means one has to know what "it" is and your neighbour too, preferably. Which means reading and talking?

I disagree a bit. You (or "someone") needn't need to know what "it" is; what is required is to learn the ability to ignore emotional reactions and see only only the known facts as they lay in front of you. One needs to stop "believing" in "things" and start believing in themselves, and being honest with them self and living up to the standards they hold everyone else to.

Edit: I re-read what you wrote, and I think you may have meant "Giving 'it' energy means ..." -- if so, yes, you are 100% correct.



I deal with the barrage of info by doing stuff, good stuff, important stuff around the farm, while going through 1000s of hours of mp3s. Hence the ear avatar. Shutting up and listening. See my amount of posts since January 2011?
Can't be bothered, have **** to do.

That balance leaves little to no emotional baggage to be bothered by. I can't even listen while sitting still. The flow of work through my hands is the key for me.

Then you are already one step ahead of most. ;)

Your re-reading made you get it right.
Preferably we wouldn't need to know what "it" ( the evil deeds ) is, but since we have been cut off from our roots it is a little harder. We have to read up, collect ourselves, and build up the awareness and hammer it into a solid guide for generations to come. There is a root why many lack the self love and harmony within, I think.
This is one of the most positive angle I can think of. But we have to survive first.

The hypocrisy of the church about sexuality, the topic of this thread, was the vector that made me drop that power structure at age 12. I went on from there.
Now there is a new "religion" again tampering with our base, our sexuality, and worse even....our genetics. Our genetic heritage, and our future. On all levels. Quite heavy, but I acknowledge the genius of it all.

A "silly" straight-parade could be the thing making some of the power visible. And it is. That is already a bit of a pay-off. I would state that it feels silly to some since the original gay pride parade feels silly. But one is not allowed to vent that.
The mirroring into straight-land makes this underlying silliness visible.
And some go into the trap of projecting these negative sentiments towards the reactionary straight pride, showing, unbeknownst to them, their feelings about the original "real" pride parade. That is what I saw inside me at least.

Because that is what I think it is; fluffed up silliness into holy canon ( if I said that right, sorry it is my 3rd language). With all respect for my gay friends and colleagues. And I can say that to them too, without being bludgeoned.

It is like the Canadian trans-people writing to Dr Jordan Peterson. They see they are being used. So I reckon the end of thát manipulation is in sight too, like the one of the black community in the US.

In Europe our kids are being tied up in front of the globalist wagon to fight against their elders. New level.

So it is a race now. Is society waking up in time before the power grid ( 5G ?) is in place?

I wonder how much reading it takes for the natural bull**** detector in us all being able to run independently and see in real-time the manipulations.

O.

[DeDukshyn]

 
 
It was a bit rhetorical, meant as general statement to everyone to hopefully provoke some thought ... I didn't mean it to be directed at you, but maybe at some other people.


Yeah Dedukshyn, that is the weirdest.
...
Not giving "it" energy means one has to know what "it" is and your neighbour too, preferably. Which means reading and talking?

I disagree a bit. You (or "someone") needn't need to know what "it" is; what is required is to learn the ability to ignore emotional reactions and see only only the known facts as they lay in front of you. One needs to stop "believing" in "things" and start believing in themselves, and being honest with them self and living up to the standards they hold everyone else to.

Edit: I re-read what you wrote, and I think you may have meant "Giving 'it' energy means ..." -- if so, yes, you are 100% correct.



I deal with the barrage of info by doing stuff, good stuff, important stuff around the farm, while going through 1000s of hours of mp3s. Hence the ear avatar. Shutting up and listening. See my amount of posts since January 2011?
Can't be bothered, have **** to do.

That balance leaves little to no emotional baggage to be bothered by. I can't even listen while sitting still. The flow of work through my hands is the key for me.

Then you are already one step ahead of most. ;)

Your re-reading made you get it right.
Preferably we wouldn't need to know what "it" ( the evil deeds ) is, but since we have been cut off from our roots it is a little harder. We have to read up, collect ourselves, and build up the awareness and hammer it into a solid guide for generations to come. There is a root why many lack the self love and harmony within, I think.
This is one of the most positive angle I can think of. But we have to survive first.

The hypocrisy of the church about sexuality, the topic of this thread, was the vector that made me drop that power structure at age 12. I went on from there.
Now there is a new "religion" again tampering with our base, our sexuality, and worse even....our genetics. Our genetic heritage, and our future. On all levels. Quite heavy, but I acknowledge the genius of it all.

A "silly" straight-parade could be the thing making some of the power visible. And it is. That is already a bit of a pay-off. I would state that it feels silly to some since the original gay pride parade feels silly. But one is not allowed to vent that.

Like you can't say "Merry Christmas"? :) Here let me do it for you ... "I-think-Pride-parades-are-silly" -- I qualified that with "I think" ... and now no one can argue with me and I've said what I believe. (note: rhetorical for thought provocation, I actually don't have an opinion on them)



...
Because that is what I think it is; fluffed up silliness into holy canon ( if I said that right, sorry it is my 3rd language). ... -- you said that well.




I wonder how much reading it takes for the natural bull**** detector in us all being able to run independently and see in real-time the manipulations.

O.

Reading isn't the requirement (and can be a detriment at times, depends on what you are reading), and for most of the "manipulations" (some are, some are just seen as such -- "can't say Merry Christmas anymore!" is an example still), the only requirement is simply not giving it any energy at all. It feeds off negative energy as much as it does off of supportive energy.

Hah! I re-read that again, and you may have meant "reading" differently than I interpreted it. :) If so, my apologies.

[Praxis]

This thread is funny.

There was never a time when straight people were murdered for having relations with a person. Tell me when a straight person was dragged behind a car until they died because they were straight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0hbnrxxh5A
You really should listen to that song, and specifically at 2:01 there is a news broadcast from the day with a person that would fit right in here in this thread.

"Im not excusing their actions, But it seems to be partially his fault and the partially the guys who did it. so you know, may be its 50-50"

https://www.aclu.org/blog/lgbt-rights/lgbt-nondiscrimination-protections/matthew-shepard-was-brutally-murdered-laramie



There are specifically laws targeting gay people's sexual practices while not being the case for straight people(although straight people can be put in prison for sodomy in some places still).

No one says it is not okay to be white or straight. Only people with the fourteen words in their mind think that other people think that is the case.

And if some people do think it is not okay to be white or straight THEN: **** THOSE PEOPLE. Yeah it is probably gonna shock some of you: I think all humans are okay to exist and im not a self hating white straight man.


The thing that we should be nailing down is: It is okay to be any kind of human.

Now stop trying to claim the victim mantle and create helter skelter and focus on the actual issues: Did you know Guantanamo Bay is still open and taking more business? This doesnt bother nearly as many of you as it should especially when in this thread we are having a pity party for ourselves.

And if you think Gitmo should be open and think there is a war on straight people by some secret gay agenda . . . .

[Orobo]

This thread is funny.

There was never a time when straight people were murdered for having relations with a person. Tell me when a straight person was dragged behind a car until they died because they were straight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0hbnrxxh5A
You really should listen to that song, and specifically at 2:01 there is a news broadcast from the day with a person that would fit right in here in this thread.

"Im not excusing their actions, But it seems to be partially his fault and the partially the guys who did it. so you know, may be its 50-50"

https://www.aclu.org/blog/lgbt-rights/lgbt-nondiscrimination-protections/matthew-shepard-was-brutally-murdered-laramie



There are specifically laws targeting gay people's sexual practices while not being the case for straight people(although straight people can be put in prison for sodomy in some places still).

No one says it is not okay to be white or straight. Only people with the fourteen words in their mind think that other people think that is the case.

And if some people do think it is not okay to be white or straight THEN: **** THOSE PEOPLE. Yeah it is probably gonna shock some of you: I think all humans are okay to exist and im not a self hating white straight man.


The thing that we should be nailing down is: It is okay to be any kind of human.

Now stop trying to claim the victim mantle and create helter skelter and focus on the actual issues: Did you know Guantanamo Bay is still open and taking more business? This doesnt bother nearly as many of you as it should especially when in this thread we are having a pity party for ourselves.

And if you think Gitmo should be open and think there is a war on straight people by some secret gay agenda . . . .

:facepalm: Like I said; got no time for thís. Sorry Prax, up your game. **** to do.

Ta-ra, O.

[DeDukshyn]

This thread is funny.

There was never a time when straight people were murdered for having relations with a person. Tell me when a straight person was dragged behind a car until they died because they were straight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0hbnrxxh5A
You really should listen to that song, and specifically at 2:01 there is a news broadcast from the day with a person that would fit right in here in this thread.

"Im not excusing their actions, But it seems to be partially his fault and the partially the guys who did it. so you know, may be its 50-50"

https://www.aclu.org/blog/lgbt-rights/lgbt-nondiscrimination-protections/matthew-shepard-was-brutally-murdered-laramie



There are specifically laws targeting gay people's sexual practices while not being the case for straight people(although straight people can be put in prison for sodomy in some places still).

No one says it is not okay to be white or straight. Only people with the fourteen words in their mind think that other people think that is the case.

And if some people do think it is not okay to be white or straight THEN: **** THOSE PEOPLE. Yeah it is probably gonna shock some of you: I think all humans are okay to exist and im not a self hating white straight man.


The thing that we should be nailing down is: It is okay to be any kind of human.

Now stop trying to claim the victim mantle and create helter skelter and focus on the actual issues: Did you know Guantanamo Bay is still open and taking more business? This doesnt bother nearly as many of you as it should especially when in this thread we are having a pity party for ourselves.

And if you think Gitmo should be open and think there is a war on straight people by some secret gay agenda . . . .

:facepalm: Like I said; got no time for thís. Sorry Prax, up your game. **** to do.

Ta-ra, O.

I think Praxis was more referring to the OP and sentiment of that message itself ... much of this thread including part of our conversation is not even on that topic. I might be wrong though, but that's how I interpreted that post.

But good call on not getting emotionally engaged. :thumb:

[heretogrow]

What would a straight pride parade look like?

People marching in and out of Divorce Court LOL!

Sorry but that is the image that popped in my head when I read that question.

[Bluegreen]

I don't necessarily have a problem with strangers waggling their sexuality in my face, gay or straight, but there's a place for it and it ain't the streets.

[enfoldedblue]

To me this is about people feeling small, feeling less-than. Our egos are fragile, most if not all are wounded. Wounded ego is terrified of feeling small, and so looks for ways to feel superior to compensate and hide from this uncomfortable feeling. I think everyone grapples with this to some degree. For those who belong to the group who is dominant in society, who have big wounds to their ego it can be can be confusing because even though they have the privileges of the dominant group...they secretly feel small and inadequate. When they see a group that they have always felt better than celebrated and given increased status in society they feel threatened and triggered...and so feel the need to take back some power so they don't feel even smaller. To me that is what this parade is really about.

[Anchor]

The various factions of the elite are loosing control, but they still seek to serve up division in anyway they can.

Stoking up division around "identity" is a potent focus for hate, but I don't see it working on the long term here.

We are all one, yet we are different. We know that we need to love others and ourselves and seek out that perfection that inspires each other-self as well as ourselves - regardless of the way we refract that purity in our expression on Earth.

It is what many are doing and it is why, eventually, these tactics of spreading hate will fail.

That said, I found the idea of a straight pride movement quite amusing, because to me, it is clearly not part of the plan. It is a backlash - and that backlash is now being fought. Not only that but it seems that, it has causes some pretty hateful things to have been said - which kind of highlights the dangers of this identitarian way of thinking.

[DeDukshyn]

I don't necessarily have a problem with strangers waggling their sexuality in my face, gay or straight, but there's a place for it and it ain't the streets.

I think I just got this now ... :)

I'm gettin' old ... :(

[T Smith]

I get this, as I get all responses to identity politics. Hit back with more identity politics...It degrades the entire debate and renders the discussion meaningless as it is no longer concerned with finding an answer to an inherent problem, but, instead, is seeking only to neutralize and minimalize the issue that divided and pit populations against each other in the second place. The only outcome possible is a lessening of real understanding and the capacity to move forward productively.

I get where you're coming from and recognize this as a valid observation; however, I would submit your conclusion is presumptuous. It presumes motive embedded in the dogma of identity politics itself--which is completely logical and reasonable, but only if this is the paradigm on which one perceives the world. It should come as no surprise that those who criticize identity politics may well perceive the world itself through a different lens.

Let's do a thought experiment outside the particular paradigm that divides individuals into groups and casts and colors and creeds and assumes all individual motives are thus based on the interests inherent to one's particular group. Let's assume for sake argument that identity politics plays no role in how or why one thinks and believes as he or she does. I would ask you, under these set of givens, do those who throw identity politics back into the fray really do so to employ a defensive shield of sorts to neutralize and minimalize the issue? Is that really true, you think?

It may be true, and I'm sure it is for some who bandy the argument. However, I challenge you to meditate on this just a little further. Could your conclusion of what's going on here be a biased interpretation based on your personal experience of marginalization, or at the very least, based on a paradigm of identity politics itself?

How about this an an alternative explanation. How about those who are courageous enough to launch any kind of push back against identity politics (the general cultural consensus casts aspersions of the social injustice apologist upon those who dare criticize identity politics) not only recognize the problem but actually do want to find the answer to an inherent problem. If the problem is structural in nature and has to do with a sort of trance people are in that undergirds beliefs and behaviors and unconscious modes of being, the answer, then, is to raise awareness and break this trance without pushing people further into their matrix of unconsciousness. What would you say to the hypothesis that asserts the methods and tactics to raise awareness via the dogma of identity politics not only exacerbates the problem itself, but also lessens a real understanding of the problem and stagnates the capacity to move forward productively? Would it be such a stretch to entertain this as the underlying motive of those who criticize identity politics?

Let's just simplify this and get it over with:

Identity politics makes things worse.

Agree or disagree and that being said, I assert adamantly that I do not fall into the camp of one who is apologizing for the problem. I am certainly not seeking to neutralize it. And I will say in all sincerity it has nothing to do with serving the interests of the group or cast or class or color or creed or sexual orientation with whom I associate.

Can't we find another path to address the problem and to raise awareness? Is there no other way?

[DeDukshyn]

I get this, as I get all responses to identity politics. Hit back with more identity politics...It degrades the entire debate and renders the discussion meaningless as it is no longer concerned with finding an answer to an inherent problem, but, instead, is seeking only to neutralize and minimalize the issue that divided and pit populations against each other in the second place. The only outcome possible is a lessening of real understanding and the capacity to move forward productively.

I get where you're coming from and recognize this as a valid observation; however, I would submit your conclusion is presumptuous. It presumes motive embedded in the dogma of identity politics itself--which is completely logical and reasonable, but only if this is the paradigm on which one perceives the world. It should come as no surprise that those who criticize identity politics may well perceive the world itself through a different lens.

Let's do a thought experiment outside the particular paradigm that divides individuals into groups and casts and colors and creeds and assumes all individual motives are thus based on the interests inherent to one's particular group. Let's assume for sake argument that identity politics plays no role in how or why one thinks and believes as he or she does. I would ask you, under these set of givens, do those who throw identity politics back into the fray really do so to employ a defensive shield of sorts to neutralize and minimalize the issue? Is that really true, you think?

It may be true, and I'm sure it is for some who bandy the argument. However, I challenge you to meditate on this just a little further. Could your conclusion of what's going on here be a biased interpretation based on your personal experience of marginalization, or at the very least, based on a paradigm of identity politics itself?

How about this an an alternative explanation. How about those who are courageous enough to launch any kind of push back against identity politics (the general cultural consensus casts aspersions of the social injustice apologist upon those who dare criticize identity politics) not only recognize the problem but actually do want to find the answer to an inherent problem. If the problem is structural in nature and has to do with a sort of trance people are in that undergirds beliefs and behaviors and unconscious modes of being, the answer, then, is to raise awareness and break this trance without pushing people further into their matrix of unconsciousness. What would you say to the hypothesis that asserts the methods and tactics to raise awareness via the dogma of identity politics not only exacerbates the problem itself, but also lessens a real understanding of the problem and stagnates the capacity to move forward productively? Would it be such a stretch to entertain this as the underlying motive of those who criticize identity politics?

Let's just simplify this and get it over with:

Identity politics makes things worse.

Agree or disagree and that being said, I assert adamantly that I do not fall into the camp of one who is apologizing for the problem. I am certainly not seeking to neutralize it. And I will say in all sincerity it has nothing to do with serving the interests of the group or cast or class or color or creed or sexual orientation with whom I associate.

Can't we find another path to address the problem and to raise awareness? Is there no other way?

Your post, as a response and argument to Rhakyt's post, makes no sense. You argue, say you don't quite agree, then go on to argue the exact same thing he was stating ... he just said it first and more succinctly? I guess that could be seen as flattery maybe ... not sure what is going on here ... :)

[T Smith]

I get this, as I get all responses to identity politics. Hit back with more identity politics...It degrades the entire debate and renders the discussion meaningless as it is no longer concerned with finding an answer to an inherent problem, but, instead, is seeking only to neutralize and minimalize the issue that divided and pit populations against each other in the second place. The only outcome possible is a lessening of real understanding and the capacity to move forward productively.

I get where you're coming from and recognize this as a valid observation; however, I would submit your conclusion is presumptuous. It presumes motive embedded in the dogma of identity politics itself--which is completely logical and reasonable, but only if this is the paradigm on which one perceives the world. It should come as no surprise that those who criticize identity politics may well perceive the world itself through a different lens.

Let's do a thought experiment outside the particular paradigm that divides individuals into groups and casts and colors and creeds and assumes all individual motives are thus based on the interests inherent to one's particular group. Let's assume for sake argument that identity politics plays no role in how or why one thinks and believes as he or she does. I would ask you, under these set of givens, do those who throw identity politics back into the fray really do so to employ a defensive shield of sorts to neutralize and minimalize the issue? Is that really true, you think?

It may be true, and I'm sure it is for some who bandy the argument. However, I challenge you to meditate on this just a little further. Could your conclusion of what's going on here be a biased interpretation based on your personal experience of marginalization, or at the very least, based on a paradigm of identity politics itself?

How about this an an alternative explanation. How about those who are courageous enough to launch any kind of push back against identity politics (the general cultural consensus casts aspersions of the social injustice apologist upon those who dare criticize identity politics) not only recognize the problem but actually do want to find the answer to an inherent problem. If the problem is structural in nature and has to do with a sort of trance people are in that undergirds beliefs and behaviors and unconscious modes of being, the answer, then, is to raise awareness and break this trance without pushing people further into their matrix of unconsciousness. What would you say to the hypothesis that asserts the methods and tactics to raise awareness via the dogma of identity politics not only exacerbates the problem itself, but also lessens a real understanding of the problem and stagnates the capacity to move forward productively? Would it be such a stretch to entertain this as the underlying motive of those who criticize identity politics?

Let's just simplify this and get it over with:

Identity politics makes things worse.

Agree or disagree and that being said, I assert adamantly that I do not fall into the camp of one who is apologizing for the problem. I am certainly not seeking to neutralize it. And I will say in all sincerity it has nothing to do with serving the interests of the group or cast or class or color or creed or sexual orientation with whom I associate.

Can't we find another path to address the problem and to raise awareness? Is there no other way?

Your post, as a response and argument to Rhakyt's post, makes no sense. You argue, say you don't quite agree, then go on to argue the exact same thing he was stating ... he just said it first and more succinctly? I guess that could be seen as flattery maybe ... not sure what is going on here ... :)

Well for sure it probably shouldn't be in this thread (while related to the OP, a side discussion about identity politics could possibly derail the thread)... And perhaps I read his post wrong, but I inferred the gist to mean the push back against identity politics as a legitimate means to ameliorate marginalization in society merely renders the entire debate meaningless and instead exposes an ulterior motive to derail the intent undergirding identity politics... Am I reading this wrong? If so, I will modify my post accordingly with apologies to Rhakyt and all those who suffered through my thoughts :). But if not, this is the part I specifically disagree with. When he says "...no longer concerned with finding an answer to an inherent problem, but, instead, is seeking only (emphasis mine)to neutralize and minimalize the issue..." implies to me that those who criticize identity politics have an ulterior motive....

Carry on.

T Smith

[DeDukshyn]

I get this, as I get all responses to identity politics. Hit back with more identity politics...It degrades the entire debate and renders the discussion meaningless as it is no longer concerned with finding an answer to an inherent problem, but, instead, is seeking only to neutralize and minimalize the issue that divided and pit populations against each other in the second place. The only outcome possible is a lessening of real understanding and the capacity to move forward productively.

I get where you're coming from and recognize this as a valid observation; however, I would submit your conclusion is presumptuous. It presumes motive embedded in the dogma of identity politics itself--which is completely logical and reasonable, but only if this is the paradigm on which one perceives the world. It should come as no surprise that those who criticize identity politics may well perceive the world itself through a different lens.

Let's do a thought experiment outside the particular paradigm that divides individuals into groups and casts and colors and creeds and assumes all individual motives are thus based on the interests inherent to one's particular group. Let's assume for sake argument that identity politics plays no role in how or why one thinks and believes as he or she does. I would ask you, under these set of givens, do those who throw identity politics back into the fray really do so to employ a defensive shield of sorts to neutralize and minimalize the issue? Is that really true, you think?

It may be true, and I'm sure it is for some who bandy the argument. However, I challenge you to meditate on this just a little further. Could your conclusion of what's going on here be a biased interpretation based on your personal experience of marginalization, or at the very least, based on a paradigm of identity politics itself?

How about this an an alternative explanation. How about those who are courageous enough to launch any kind of push back against identity politics (the general cultural consensus casts aspersions of the social injustice apologist upon those who dare criticize identity politics) not only recognize the problem but actually do want to find the answer to an inherent problem. If the problem is structural in nature and has to do with a sort of trance people are in that undergirds beliefs and behaviors and unconscious modes of being, the answer, then, is to raise awareness and break this trance without pushing people further into their matrix of unconsciousness. What would you say to the hypothesis that asserts the methods and tactics to raise awareness via the dogma of identity politics not only exacerbates the problem itself, but also lessens a real understanding of the problem and stagnates the capacity to move forward productively? Would it be such a stretch to entertain this as the underlying motive of those who criticize identity politics?

Let's just simplify this and get it over with:

Identity politics makes things worse.

Agree or disagree and that being said, I assert adamantly that I do not fall into the camp of one who is apologizing for the problem. I am certainly not seeking to neutralize it. And I will say in all sincerity it has nothing to do with serving the interests of the group or cast or class or color or creed or sexual orientation with whom I associate.

Can't we find another path to address the problem and to raise awareness? Is there no other way?

Your post, as a response and argument to Rhakyt's post, makes no sense. You argue, say you don't quite agree, then go on to argue the exact same thing he was stating ... he just said it first and more succinctly? I guess that could be seen as flattery maybe ... not sure what is going on here ... :)

Well for sure it probably shouldn't be in this thread (while related to the OP, a side discussion about identity politics could possibly derail the thread)... And perhaps I read his post wrong, but I inferred the gist to mean the push back against identity politics as a legitimate means to ameliorate marginalization in society merely renders the entire debate meaningless and instead exposes an ulterior motive to derail the intent undergirding identity politics... Am I reading this wrong? If so, I will modify my post accordingly with apologies to Rhakyt and all those who suffered through my thoughts :). But if not, this is the part I specifically disagree with. When he says "...no longer concerned with finding an answer to an inherent problem, but, instead, is seeking only (emphasis mine)to neutralize and minimalize the issue..." implies to me that those who criticize identity politics have an ulterior motive....

Carry on.

T Smith

I just think you missed his main emphasis which was this:
Hit back with more identity politics...It degrades the entire debate and renders the discussion meaningless ... That doesn't sound like he was claiming legitimacy.

He was claiming that some see it as legit, it was their motivation, and thus that was why it occurred (the "reasoning" in peoples minds that led to this) . He was not saying it was a legit thing to do.

[Orobo]

Lads (...),

I think it is inevitable that identity politics (IP) is discussed on this thread. It is part of it.

Maybe some think IP is a real way to open up peoples perception to the manipulations, since it is so ridiculously obvious once you see it. So maybe there can be sincere motivations behind using IP in discussions.
Truth is truth.

But, yeah If you mean throwing back IP in the same , or escalating, fashion, it becomes a fight. You engage in the game you did not make.
Using the rules of the IP game to dismantle it is fair I think.

I think though that the diversity+proximity =conflict is very real and done on purpose. Of course. That is very real in us humans.

The tribal forces in us are pretty strong. Especially when the differences are so flabbergastingly large as with migrants for example, as opposed to, for example, the Irish Troubles, which already seemed irreconcilable.

This here goes way beyond any hope of a peaceful solution, it feels right now.
The infighting within our own group is so difficult already, like with this manufactured LGBT++ unrest. Pretty sure that is for a reason too.
Silly humans. Easily toyed with, within a certain timeframe. That frame is possibly, if we are not too slow to catch up, coming to an end now.

In that sense it is useless pouncing on the breadcrumb trail of conflicts that is laid out in front of us. Waste of energy, waste of time. Cut ahead to the levels behind. But already there is a huge wall. Made out of illicit laws, a pumped up and propogandised public against any who dares to go beyond and touch anything really aiding or abetting the plight of the (white) population, and therefore, further down the line, all of humanity. Why else is there such a hate-on on Europeans? It seems they see us as the last bump in the road to full spectrum dominance.

Dehumanize the ones with the most resources, rob them to pay for the bombs to ruin other weaker groups. Then stampede the weakened first group with those from group two who are by now pretty pissed off. Something like that.

This dehumanisation, with the softening up of the cohesion in our society is well underway. Using IP back, in the fighting fashion, is almost a given for people waking up late in the game, or those with not enough brain power to put it all in perspective.

O.

[Hervé]

...

It might be a good thing to check where it all came from: [Address] 'The Origins of Political Correctness' | Bill Lind - February 2000 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?107442-Address-The-Origins-of-Political-Correctness-Bill-Lind-February-2000)

[Pam]

...

It might be a good thing to check where it all came from: [Address] 'The Origins of Political Correctness' | Bill Lind - February 2000 (http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?107442-Address-The-Origins-of-Political-Correctness-Bill-Lind-February-2000)

I encourage everyone to read this article. It is well worth the time.

[Orobo]

The focus seems to be western culture, capitalist and christian.
What I am more, or also, interested in is in what way the critical theory (CT) or/and cultural marxism (CM) are also breaking down our human nature. Things that lie underneath western culture. It is then, I think, that the destructiveness and actual danger of these destructive forces can be judged.

I had great trouble with the catholic environment I grew up in and broke with it at age 12. The repressive nature was stifling and the hypocrisy of the believers indigestible, even for a young lad like me. So I have sympathy for the lust to break it down.
I have lived that anti religious life for many many years, until I found out there are certain principles in life that need to be upheld for a family and a society to survive. I was not taught those principles. Like the function of sex after marriage.
It seems that the CM and CT go too far. That is when the anti western becomes suspect. Is it anti- gentile? That is a question that I see being asked more and more.
The overreaction to just posing this question makes it even more suspect, as there are more related questions that get with the same hammer. So there is another repression laid on top of us, istead of the christian one. Not good, at all.

O.

[Carmody]

Western society, re north America, required maybe 3-4-5 more IQ points of emergent grouped knowledge and knowing, overall, as a group, to be able to see past the manipulations of the elite..well enough that the manipulations would be obvious enough to note clearly enough--- that they could be countered.

The importation of the immigrants in an unchecked manner is to fuzz up or discombobulate the masses and to bring the overall societal and cultural IQ down, so that it cannot rise into being free of elite parasitism.

I don't know of a single soul that thinks that unchecked immigration and importation of so many people is even remotely a good idea. But it is still happening, and totally against the given rules, laws, discourse, and sanity....that resides in all these countries.

Parasites require a host to be free and to grow. Almost to live at all, requires this host body. So, the threat of human freedom is a life threat to elite parasitism.

so they will go as far as they have to, including to the edge of total death for the host. Ie, any price, any price at all. Any cost to the host, is permissible, as the threat to the parasite is almost the same, ie, total.

It is the problem, reaction, solution game, writ large across all of it. Forced immigration, forced integration, forced problems, forced losses, forced solutions, forced controls.

The alternative media has made all of this --- quite obvious to all. Which is a huge threat. The totalitarian tip-toe.... is always lurking...

This parasitical group, is still fighting to give rise to the North American union, this attempt at a 4th Reich.... This time, with Canada under control and involved, with all those resources, and oceans on two sides. Jim Marrs' book, 'Rise of the Fourth Reich' (pdf widely available, chock full of many hundreds of facts that are fully documented), is a good primer for part of the story.

Ie, the money problems are all fake and can disappear in a second with the stroke of a pen, and so on.

You are being gamed.

What does this have to do with the subject at hand? Well, same manipulators ---it's part of their manipulation package.

You are a pile of kittens, they they break out the laser pointers, you attack the laser spots on each other. Simple enough.

[Orobo]

Carmody,

Ok post, but could you go more into specifics?

Do you mean parasites as in 'Ryan Dawson-parasites' or more like inter-dimensional parasites? Or both, they could well be interconnected. Or even, just a group of non-descript descent, hiding behind The One Proxy. I am not sure as of now.

It is just so, now, that many threads lead to "semitic" hands and going there is not allowed. Making it more compelling to look at. And because of that it could be a well placed smokescreen.

The fast pace of the destructive strategies put to work synchronously all over the world (smart everything, 5G, migration, wars) gives the idea there is a hurry.
This hurry might be in pace with the breakdown of the barrier to the JQ ( jewish question) I see, and that the rabbit hole does not go further after all. To link it back to a previous post, I consider that group to be the one with the strongest memory of themselves and their culture, combined with actual power and influence. Something that is ruined with all other groups, but especially christians at the moment.
But even thát could be a hijack of that group. So I can not blame anyone, even tough They say it in their own words. I do not trust it.

You see, I look at it without holding back, but also without a political/ethnic underpinning from my side. I do not care what is the truth, as long as it is the truth, and I can act accordingly.
So I am not hung up on one thing or one perpetrator. I tend to zoom out a bit, while tugging several threads and asking questions.
Questions that would annoy myself to no end before. I still feel this annoyance in me, but the trail leads here for me now. I consider those inner feelings as part of an indoctrination, next to the default empathy.

The 4th reich idea is not at all impossible, even if one is talking about actions of the semitic or the self-proclaimed semitic group ( Khazar theory) . The links between zionists, banks, national socialists, israel, freemasonry, thén, are well clear.
Just like the links between forced migration, freemasonry, israel, capitalists, banks, and foreign policy in our time.

What happens here in Europe could also be put under that 4th reich umbrella, with what happens with Germany in the EU. National socialist, socialist or communist....it is all collectivist power grabbing for an elite. The freemasonry signs are all over it.

But there is a difference between collectivists ruining individualist culture for power over other ethnic groups and resources, and parasitical entities manipulating humans against themselves to take over the planet, hiding behind brutal, but human, faces.
There is probably several more ideas that could be put in this list.

What I see is that western man is in the way for domination over all. There is no culture with this creativity, intelligence coupled with a high level of empathy. There is no other that recognised other races as fellow humans worthy of a life, with dangerously low levels of inn-group preference and wishes individual rights for all.
But yeah, I am probably missing something...

O.

[DeDukshyn]

Western society, re north America, required maybe 3-4-5 more IQ points of emergent grouped knowledge and knowing, overall, as a group, to be able to see past the manipulations of the elite..well enough that the manipulations would be obvious enough to note clearly enough--- that they could be countered.

The importation of the immigrants in an unchecked manner is to fuzz up or discombobulate the masses and to bring the overall societal and cultural IQ down, so that it cannot rise into being free of elite parasitism.

I don't know of a single soul that thinks that unchecked immigration and importation of so many people is even remotely a good idea. But it is still happening, and totally against the given rules, laws, discourse, and sanity....that resides in all these countries.

Parasites require a host to be free and to grow. Almost to live at all, requires this host body. So, the threat of human freedom is a life threat to elite parasitism.

so they will go as far as they have to, including to the edge of total death for the host. Ie, any price, any price at all. Any cost to the host, is permissible, as the threat to the parasite is almost the same, ie, total.

It is the problem, reaction, solution game, writ large across all of it. Forced immigration, forced integration, forced problems, forced losses, forced solutions, forced controls.

The alternative media has made all of this --- quite obvious to all. Which is a huge threat. The totalitarian tip-toe.... is always lurking...

This parasitical group, is still fighting to give rise to the North American union, this attempt at a 4th Reich.... This time, with Canada under control and involved, with all those resources, and oceans on two sides. Jim Marrs' book, 'Rise of the Fourth Reich' (pdf widely available, chock full of many hundreds of facts that are fully documented), is a good primer for part of the story.

Ie, the money problems are all fake and can disappear in a second with the stroke of a pen, and so on.

You are being gamed.

What does this have to do with the subject at hand? Well, same manipulators ---it's part of their manipulation package.

You are a pile of kittens, they they break out the laser pointers, you attack the laser spots on each other. Simple enough.

Well an easy way to not be manipulated is to not succumb to politically biased judgements, and stop acting like a loser. If one does those two thing, everything will be fine. And I'm not talking about "Well now I am a "rightie" and the bad guys are "lefties" so now I am winning!" -- yeah your winning like Charlie Sheen, and falling straight into it.

Removing the political bias (whichever way you think you "lean") from every thought and every word goes a long way in not being a used tool of the Elites.

[Orobo]

Well an easy way to not be manipulated is to not succumb to politically biased judgements, and stop acting like a loser. If one does those two thing, everything will be fine. And I'm not talking about "Well now I am a "rightie" and the bad guys are "lefties" so now I am winning!" -- yeah your winning like Charlie Sheen, and falling straight into it.

Removing the political bias (whichever way you think you "lean") from every thought and every word goes a long way in not being a used tool of the Elites.[/QUOTE]

"You can ignore reality, but you can not ignore the consequences of reality" is what I heard when reading your post.

Love, O.

[DeDukshyn]

Well an easy way to not be manipulated is to not succumb to politically biased judgements, and stop acting like a loser. If one does those two thing, everything will be fine. And I'm not talking about "Well now I am a "rightie" and the bad guys are "lefties" so now I am winning!" -- yeah your winning like Charlie Sheen, and falling straight into it.

Removing the political bias (whichever way you think you "lean") from every thought and every word goes a long way in not being a used tool of the Elites.

"You can ignore reality, but you can not ignore the consequences of reality" is what I heard when reading your post.

Love, O.

Consider that each of our views together creates reality, If we are busy constantlyreacting then with those reactions we are creating what those who want us to react, wants us to create. The responsibility is each of ours. This is the message have been trying get across - in fact its the only message anyone needs to know, from there we can begin to change things.

[Orobo]

I have a friend who wholly believes this what you write here. I myself have many, many experiences of co-creation or manifestation. It just goes on and on. So no doubt there.

There is also this bell ringing in my head...not acting is losing. This is why you write here too, isn't it?

O.

[DeDukshyn]

I have a friend who wholly believes this what you write here. I myself have many, many experiences of co-creation or manifestation. It just goes on and on. So no doubt there.

There is also this bell ringing in my head...not acting is losing. This is why you write here too, isn't it?

O.

Its not about something we don't already understand. We each view reality in our own way, how we perceive and judge that reality (whether accurate or not) defines how we think, how we act and react, how we make decisions. Those decisions then have consequences that change the "reality", then we perceive and judge it again and the feedback loop starts over ... this IS reality and how it is created - by each us trapped in the process of perceiving / judging, and having the results of that feed back into reality.

Its logic.

[Orobo]

[/QUOTE]

Its not about something we don't already understand.

Its logic.[/QUOTE]

You and I, maybe. Since there is some others too who have a different view. The billions in religion are held tight in a system that does normally not allow for this reality you describe. It has been squashed for many generations, and maybe even bred out of them. At least the propensity to have an open view is killed again and again. That breeds a typical kind of animal, like our dogs. Some are smart and bred for that, some are bred for ferociousness etc.

I just hopped out of some christian tradition that sucked up the smartest in society and rendered them ineffective to breed for smarts, and managed to open up a lot, for myself end maybe around me. This is not usual, but it looks like it is slowly augmenting. Is it just underneath the surface inside of us all and just needs a little freedom?
This freedom we have in the west is stomped on right now. Really fast and hard.
Is this pocket of freedom a side effect of the de-religionisation of the manipulators? Is a side question that comes up. Also, is there a group that bred specifically for intelligence? Is that a group that is taking action to hinder our development and even our status quo?

I am taking into consideration that the few we have might not be enough for a change in reality and act accordingly. You too. We write. Therefore.

it might not be logic for those others. Have you got some data or at least something to support a view that allows for your attitude?

Love, O.

[DeDukshyn]

Its not about something we don't already understand.

Its logic.

You and I, maybe. Since there is some others too who have a different view. The billions in religion are held tight in a system that does normally not allow for this reality you describe. It has been squashed for many generations, and maybe even bred out of them. At least the propensity to have an open view is killed again and again. That breeds a typical kind of animal, like our dogs. Some are smart and bred for that, some are bred for ferociousness etc.

I just hopped out of some christian tradition that sucked up the smartest in society and rendered them ineffective to breed for smarts, and managed to open up a lot, for myself end maybe around me. This is not usual, but it looks like it is slowly augmenting. Is it just underneath the surface inside of us all and just needs a little freedom?
This freedom we have in the west is stomped on right now. Really fast and hard.
Is this pocket of freedom a side effect of the de-religionisation of the manipulators? Is a side question that comes up. Also, is there a group that bred specifically for intelligence? Is that a group that is taking action to hinder our development and even our status quo?

I am taking into consideration that the few we have might not be enough for a change in reality and act accordingly. You too. We write. Therefore.

it might not be logic for those others. Have you got some data or at least something to support a view that allows for your attitude?

Love, O.

You are right - it is only "logic" when someone spells it out, but then, you almost can't undo that understanding once it is attained. I agree most people are unaware of how simple their part in "reality" is and how ultimatley responsible they must be with their beliefs, perceptions and the process of sharing these things.

My whole entire point is that this should be goal, arguing about politics or over-emphasizing whatever we "hate", will all be addressed, at least in part, if people are aware of how their own thoughts and actions lead often to the exact results that they don't want ... I think it behooves everyone who wants to make this world a better place to start trying to get across this understanding of how our reactions and anger fueled thoughts, words, and decisions / actions REALLY affects the reality around us.

But its not complicated to understand, its explainable to most in a single paragraph, others might need a bit more experience in life to see it as true, but for those, the theory still actually makes sense.

For me, my goal is to be consistent and persistent with this understanding in my every thought and word; others might take notice in this and their attention can be a conduit for gaining a new understanding.

It'll take effort, but if each of us with this awareness maintain consistency and persistence, hopefully changes will be seen within my lifetime, from there I hope to have properly instilled these values in my children.

[Justplain]

The identity politics is so obviously a premeditated agenda. The shift to 'move' the goalposts for traditional family values started way back with apparently worthwhile causes, like the suffragettes, which in and of itself was fine, and western society showed strength in being to accommodate this change. However, the push went further, to other worthwhile causes such as racial rights and religious freedoms and even sexual orientation rights, all of which were/are needed.

Then, the push for 'freedom' has gone further, and gotten into grey areas of questionable merit such as abortion rights, euthanasia, uncontrolled immigration, etc. So, my guess is the 'freedom' movement was orchestrated with a disruptive end in mind, and the 'elite' human power brokers intended that, as exposed by Aaron Russo who claimed that Nick Rockefeller indicated that women's Lib and planned parenthood we both funded by the Rockefeller Foundation for the purpose of disrupting the nuclear family.

Another funding project of the Rockefellers was the Kinsey Institute (now part of the U of Indiana) that formulated today's gender identity theory during the 1940's (fake science btw) which is being peddled by the World Health Org. This is the policy of division that hit everywhere sort of unexpectedly in the last few years, since no one was protesting in the streets for lgbt rights, or that the definition of gender was an issue, but now this movement hit the socio-political scene with hate speech laws, children's aid protocols for sex changes, lgbt flags flying at primary schools, drag queen storytimes at libraries, nude gay parades, etc.

Combine this lgbt roll-out with the Islamic refugee influx caused by prefab-proxy wars in the middle East, and impoverished economic refugees from Central and South america, and you have a psuedo 'perfect storm' against Western culture.

Humane members of Western culture want to be empathetic, and be fair, however there is a point where one has to set a limit on generosity and tolerance. One limit is when LGBT-ism is being promoted to children in schools, especially without a counter viewpoint being permitted. Another limit is when so many migrants flood your community that they are using up the available social housing, and funding, so that domestically born poor don't get enough.

To me this agenda to disrupt western society is identifiably propogated by the rich elite. The social norm changing attack was funded by the Rockefellers. The mass migration problem is obviously supported by George Soros. So, although supported by other unseen forces, we can identify the visible human faces of this disruption.

So, identity politics aside, communities have been stretched to their limits by these converging tides, and rightfully must push back for their own survival. And by the looks of the pushback, which to me is mostly very civilized in manner, then we are not doing too badly in this affair. The pushback will likely need to be more vocal, and it rightly should be. And if the pushback stays civilized, which I believe it will, then counteracting this agenda may actually succeed. In fact, this pushback is getting some extremely aggressive reaction, particularly from lgbt quarters, so we'll have to see how that pans out.

[T Smith]

One limit is when LGBT-ism is being promoted to children in schools, especially without a counter viewpoint being permitted.

You mean LGBTQUWIOPXZERYASDFKJHMNVCism, right? (Oh, damn. I ran out of letters).

Well at least if we're going to run with identity politics we may have some limitation to only 26 special groups :)

To be clear, and all joking aside, every single individual regardless of identity affiliation should be afforded the same inalienable rights and freedoms and opportunities as any other individual. Individualism, by definition, encompasses diversity. So I support breaking this down to individual rights -- as in capital "I", I-ism, if you will, where the individual supersedes the State, and any individual can celebrate her or his or their or hirs or zirs or zies individual uniqueness accordingly.

How about this. Let's have an Individual's Parade, where all celebrate their individuality together. Imagine that. Gays, Straights, and peoples of all creeds and colors waiving their flag in unity.

In the United States we already have a constitution in place that legally allows for and celebrates this concept among We the People.

Of course our constitution is merely a document in theory. It grants and protects the rights and liberties of all on paper, but it is blatantly violated and has admittedly been co-opted by the State and the powerful.

I say we have the framework already in place. Let's renovate the blueprint, update the foundation and bones, if necessary, and put that "theory" into practice.

[DeDukshyn]

One limit is when LGBT-ism is being promoted to children in schools, especially without a counter viewpoint being permitted.

You mean LGBTQUWIOPXZERYASDFKJHMNVCism, right? (Oh, damn. I ran out of letters).

Well at least if we're going to run with identity politics we may have some limitation to only 26 special groups :)

To be clear, and all joking aside, every single individual regardless of identity affiliation should be afforded the same inalienable rights and freedoms and opportunities as any other individual. Individualism, by definition, encompasses diversity. So I support breaking this down to individual rights -- as in capital "I", I-ism, if you will, where the individual supersedes the State, and any individual can celebrate her or his or their or hirs or zirs or zies individual uniqueness accordingly.

How about this. Let's have an Individual's Parade, where all celebrate their individuality together. Imagine that. Gays, Straights, and peoples of all creeds and colors waiving their flag in unity.

In the United States we already have a constitution in place that legally allows for and celebrates this concept among We the People.

Of course our constitution is merely a document in theory. It grants and protects the rights and liberties of all on paper, but it is blatantly violated and has admittedly been co-opted by the State and the powerful.

I say we have the framework already in place. Let's renovate the blueprint, update the foundation and bones, if necessary, and put that "theory" into practice.

I think its clear what has happened is that some people have mistaken their desire for being treated "normal" with being treated "special" -- think about it, if they just wanted to be accepted as normal, would we need 26 different "special" labels and categories? Isn't that doing the opposite of what they actually want? And here's another example of the very people who feel like they are being "attacked" (like the "can't say merry Christmas!" bunch), creating a situation which is not what they really wanted.

If we keep making these groups all distinct and separate islands (that they seem to want, but is actually a result of confusing acceptance with being treated "special"), then eventually there will be LGBTQRSTUV washrooms, sections of restaurants, special place at the back of the bus "gays only" -- they will "special" themselves straight into segregation from society, when I am pretty sure the "real" motivation that started this movement was for acceptance, but that is morphing into something else completely.

All that said, its 2019, and it seems insane to me that these people are still in a lot of ways NOT accepted as "normal" -- and with this emphasis on "specialness", which is diametrically opposed to "normal" it seems it'll stilll be a while before this finds equilibrium.

The danger is us non gays lashing out at this perceived "specialness" and making the situation inflamed. Eventually that feeling of "specialness" will wear off, like it does with any new "thing" :)

[T Smith]

The danger is us non gays lashing out at this perceived "specialness" and making the situation inflamed. Eventually that feeling of "specialness" will wear off, like it does with any new "thing" :)

Agreed, fully. It's a hard discussion to have. My instinct is to lash out (may even be the wrong choice of words -- how about "critically question?") the machinations of "specialness" without unintentionally implying a hidden, pretextual, or clever condemnation of it, which, at least speaking for myself, is never the case. So it's not hard to understand how this line of discourse may be perceived as inflammable and divisive, which is my main criticism of Identity Politics to begin with!

Who's on first?

[DeDukshyn]

The danger is us non gays lashing out at this perceived "specialness" and making the situation inflamed. Eventually that feeling of "specialness" will wear off, like it does with any new "thing" :)

Agreed, fully. It's a hard discussion to have. My instinct is to lash out (may even be the wrong choice of words -- how about "critically question?") the machinations of "specialness" without unintentionally implying a hidden, pretextual, or clever condemnation of it, which, at least speaking for myself, is never the case. So it's not hard to understand how this line of discourse may be perceived as inflammable and divisive, which is my main criticism of Identity Politics to begin with!

Who's on first?

Well a lot of the outcome is going to come down to how we all personally choose or choose to not talk about it. Similarly as I explained with Orobo, that how we choose to express on this topic could make the difference between us allowing ourselves to outlaw saying "merry christmas"(metaphor) ... or not. :) ... and that is each of our personal responsibilities.

Its not that hard to get right, but it takes consciousness of self thoughts and self actions, for those who have been programmed to "lash out" (yeah maybe poor choice of words, but the end result seems like that to some), as opposed to remaining politically objective.

The hard part with this strategy is sometimes just simply keeping your mouth shut is ultimately the best thing you can do ... which comes across as "inaction". So as to not seem "inactive", people open their mouths to "contribute", but don't realize they are most often "contributing" to the problem, not the solution.

Doing the "right" thing sometimes can be tricky ... because it sometime goes completely against our programmed responses. But ultimately, being able to have an objective view requires going against those anyway. :)

[DeDukshyn]

..

I think though that the diversity+proximity =conflict is very real and done on purpose. Of course. That is very real in us humans.
.

It's only real if the individual people choose to make it real ... the country I live in has one of the most diverse populations in the world - always has. And what is said about Canadians? People in Canada get along pretty well with each other - no matter what colour your skin, your religion, your language, etc. This diversity is what defines Canada.

You should see the office at my work ... we have Jews, Christians, Mulsims, Sikhs, Hindus, atheists, of all colours: brown, black, white, and from all countries of the world: Filipino, American, Korean, "African", Chinese, India, etc, gay, straight, whatever. And we all know each other well, respect our diversity, and everything is actually extremely harmonious in the office. Everyone loves everyone - there's no issues at all. In fact this would be a fairly common scenario in offices all across Canada.

I think Canadians tend to have a slightly different view because diversity works quite well in Canada -- it always has (with the exception of Quebec getting disgruntled once every 25 years or so ... :))

[Orobo]

See if I can get this to work...

Came over this bloke's video and had the giggle.. If you can be bothered the relevant part about the straight pride is 3:48 to 07:00 min, so pretty short.


https://www.bitchute.com/video/XDG2oaaU-C0/

After that he talks about something else, but very interesting too. The big exposé on THE two gay film people working for Lauren Southern, who is hiding now for apparent immoral behaviour and who is not who she says she is. Tommy Robinson, who is not who he says he is ( makes you wonder why these people do this...), and Alex Jones, Gavin McInnes, Ezra Levant...who they all stole from, blackmailed and blabbed on to leftist terror groups.
They were the two making the Borderless film and writing for Lauren Simonsen (Southern) but turned out to be a psychopathic and alcoholic Bonnie and Clide duo.

Entertaining article from Milo:

https://www.dangerous.com/50638/say-farewell-to-the-klepto-queens-of-the-british-far-right/https://www.dangerous.com/50638/say-farewell-to-the-klepto-queens-of-the-british-far-right/

I will react to your writing D, when I have some more time...but it could be in another thread for sure.

Love, O.

[Patient]

..

I think though that the diversity+proximity =conflict is very real and done on purpose. Of course. That is very real in us humans.
.

It's only real if the individual people choose to make it real ... the country I live in has one of the most diverse populations in the world - always has. And what is said about Canadians? People in Canada get along pretty well with each other - no matter what colour your skin, your religion, your language, etc. This diversity is what defines Canada.

You should see the office at my work ... we have Jews, Christians, Mulsims, Sikhs, Hindus, atheists, of all colours: brown, black, white, and from all countries of the world: Filipino, American, Korean, "African", Chinese, India, etc, gay, straight, whatever. And we all know each other well, respect our diversity, and everything is actually extremely harmonious in the office. Everyone loves everyone - there's no issues at all. In fact this would be a fairly common scenario in offices all across Canada.

I think Canadians tend to have a slightly different view because diversity works quite well in Canada -- it always has (with the exception of Quebec getting disgruntled once every 25 years or so ... :))

I would say that what you describe is how things have been in Canada. I would also bet that that is the way it still is in your office. Outside of the office things are changing.

You can not -should not- ignore how children aee being schooled in school. (Including the USA)

We took Christian prayer out of the school system to keep religion out of the school and leave it in the hands of the family, yet Muslim prayer rooms are now in those schools and Christian prayer is not.

Children are urged and supported to explore and choose their sexual preference years before they can even understand what it means.

I think that the "straight pride" escalation was meant to open some people's eyes to what is going on. Perhaps just not the right way to go about it. But considering that it caused people to react the way it did, it is obvious that there is a problem.

[Sandy123]

...
But it has to be fed, led. ...

I want to engage your post a bit more, but I'm at work ... it was a good post.

But just on this snippet ... consider that, in my original example, the "can't say merry Christmas!" group is both the producer of loosh and the consumer of it - no one appeared to be "leading it" or even "starting it" -- it took on a life of its own - it became its own meme.

I'll be the first to denounce the media as controlled, but much of it is still controlled by money. They write inflammatory headlines and articles, re-print anything that their competitors / affiliates are printing without vetting ... while there is some manual control from the top, I won't argue there, don't lose sight that money is primary the target - sensationalist headlines and articles create loosh, and we are both the creators and consumers of that loosh. WE are.

Humanity is completely blind. It has come much more heavily to me, the realization of this. We don't understand how we all are the conduits of all the "evil" and "chaos" we see around us. Without us, evil ceases to exist. Not "them" ... US.

We are not recognizing the true energy flows, we think we are and we are lashing out at what we think we see but we are blinded by our own perceptions.

I think you are closer to the truth of it all - "they" are using us for our energy and our creative energy. They lead, we follow. President Obama declares Bruce/Caitlyn Jenner a hero and the energy flows into the field. It really does open my eyes this very moment to realize the power we humans actually have!!!! We create change! As long as they keep people tied into their programming they have the control. It's pretty darn obvious.

I think the LGB-T is an agenda being implemented for AI because AI can't understand male/female and transhumanism is neither. I wonder what's the reason for this massive push on humanity to do away with our gender? Why are they trying to interfere with human evolution?

[Patient]

I wonder what's the reason for this massive push on humanity to do away with our gender? Why are they trying to interfere with human evolution?

There could be many reasons, but the couple things that come to my mind are;
Having more couples that can not easily procreate would help to slow the population growth.

Melt everyone into the same mesh and control is easier. (There is a flag for everyone to wave together.)

Keep people distracted so that they can continue to do what they want.

Those are a few that come to mind.

With my own children and other families that I am close to, the kids are spending a lot of time questioning whether they are really a boy or a girl rather than just being a kid.

Who would be the first person that a child might blame for who they are?

Answer; their parents. How many more children would end up in the care of social services or just lost in the streets? Easy pickings for those that would exploit them.

[Sandy123]

People are becoming increasingly aware. While getting my teeth cleaned they hygienist blamed it on MSM.
A junior high counselor I just met mentioned the increase in children coming in and being very confused about it all.

It seems that they are in a big rush the past few years - they are pushing hard and heavy, against all of us. We all need to connect with earth and nature and meditate as often as we can and help the awakening along. The more that know the faster it echoes through the field.

[DeDukshyn]

... trim ...
It really does open my eyes this very moment to realize the power we humans actually have!!!! We create change! As long as they keep people tied into their programming they have the control. It's pretty darn obvious.


Thanks for the view Patient,


I noticed that your two sentences above somewhat contradict ... is it our power or not? If it is, then the second statement should read: "As longs as people keep tying themselves (giving them our power) into their programming, they have control."

A person can say "we have the power" - and it would be true, but if one truly believes this, rather than expressing feelings of helplessness (which indicates the belief in the opposite), then we should be expressing change, and expressing the belief in our power. Its easy to say, but when one truly believes it, its their own action that changes ... 100% independent of what "They" do ... the solution is our responsibility, not theirs, and wasting our energies playing the "who's to blame?" game is a waste of energy, due to the fact that change will occur in us despite anything they can do. We have the power, right?

As I mentioned, sometimes expressing that power is to NOT fight and create a war - that "war" is how we lose, we can't win that war because the mindset that it takes to win that war is their "prize" - that diseased mindset - the mind that thinks like theirs - that is what they are trying to "win". Nothing else matters to them as long as we turn on a perceived "enemy" from a perception that they create - if that enemy is seen "them", it still gets the job done in their eyes.

Starting WWIII and major depop agendas depends on us not falling into their trap. Most don't have a clue what that trap actually looks like.

The solution has nothing to do with the "rulers" and "controllers" - they are 100% irrelevant to the solution to this problem (even if they have a hand in creating it) - it has everything to do with us as individuals.

[DeDukshyn]

...
It seems that they are in a big rush the past few years - they are pushing hard and heavy, against all of us..

Big agreement on the meditation and nature advice ... :thumb:

Every kid runs into that identity thing at some point, its just never been something openly discussed before (previously it stayed a parental discussion and the response from parents was often 'your a boy and that's that! No more questions!') Now its an open conversation. (although I think parents should be encouraging their kids to not dwell on the topic, the fact that I hear of some kids being "trans" at age eight or whatever is a bit cringeworthy - just let kids grow up - you shouldn't be sexually or even gender-y considering these sort of things at that age; curious? maybe ...)

Everyone will find out who they are if they are honest with themselves. If their parents didn't teach them that ability, then maybe their life will be harder than others, who knows?

Consider that in general on all the Earth, the pace of any and all "change" is rapidly accelerating outside of anyone's control ... in general, humans do extremely poorly with change and adaptation. Chaos is bound to ensue. Nothing will really change by continuing to play a blame game, but rather it will change if we just keep our actions and words related to what we know are universal Truths.

[Orobo]

..

I think though that the diversity+proximity =conflict is very real and done on purpose. Of course. That is very real in us humans.
.

It's only real if the individual people choose to make it real ... the country I live in has one of the most diverse populations in the world - always has. And what is said about Canadians? People in Canada get along pretty well with each other - no matter what colour your skin, your religion, your language, etc. This diversity is what defines Canada.

You should see the office at my work ... we have Jews, Christians, Mulsims, Sikhs, Hindus, atheists, of all colours: brown, black, white, and from all countries of the world: Filipino, American, Korean, "African", Chinese, India, etc, gay, straight, whatever. And we all know each other well, respect our diversity, and everything is actually extremely harmonious in the office. Everyone loves everyone - there's no issues at all. In fact this would be a fairly common scenario in offices all across Canada.

I think Canadians tend to have a slightly different view because diversity works quite well in Canada -- it always has (with the exception of Quebec getting disgruntled once every 25 years or so ... :))

Patient said it pretty well in post #67, DeDukshyn.

Yes there is responsibilities within ourselves on what to do, or not. One makes in part his/hers reality.
There are unfortunately enough going along to make a serious mess of your direct surroundings, leaving ultimately even the staunchest of SJWs running for their lives because of racial aware foreigners with machetes.
It used to be here like you describe your Canada, until it didn't work anymore.
And the red flags that were driven past were numerous. And ignored.

It comes down to The State being able to grant special acces to programs, money, preferential treatment over the backs of the normal and productive.... then the dancing around the chairs is really starting.
Contrived competition bringing forth resentment and a stronger role for that state. Greed and the fear of missing out on the doled out alms keeps anyone on their feet.
Divide and rule, with your own money. That isn't even real. Pathetic.


O.

[Ti]

One limit is when LGBT-ism is being promoted to children in schools, especially without a counter viewpoint being permitted.
It would be a problem, but I'm pretty sure heterosexuality is still the main course. Isn't there a thing with a condom and banana demo? I don't know, I never went to public school, I only heard about this by proxy. It sounded like most of my embarrassed public school friends were taught how to not get pregnant, to avoid diseases, and how their body parts functioned. It seems unreasonable to me that, just because homosexualty is a bit more acceptable and celebrated these days, public schools would stop doing heterosexual contraceptive demonstrations. Now that's a different agenda. Even if they throw in a mention of how to not transmit diseases through homosexual encounters I'm sure the whole "prevent teens from accidentally making babies and rampantly spreading herpes" is still 90% of the point of those lessons in school. Which would be about statistically correct for how gay the world is, because I've heard about 10% of people are some sort of LGBTQ, and that's pretty accurate based on the slice of people I know too.

Speaking of 90%, 90% of media is straight still. Sure, some shows have sexual diversity, but I'd say most of the contemporary work still showcases and glorifies sexual straight relationships. Lots of questionable heterosexual couples demonstrating things that if I had kids, I wouldn't want them picking up on. Abuse, hypersexualization, often at an unnervingly young age, my skin often crawls a bit at what's sexualized on the screen. My point though, isn't that there's corruption in heterosexual mainstream media. It's that no one has to try to find an excuse to celebrate a heterosexual relationship. The opportunities are endless. If straight people want to throw a giant party in honor of their straightness, cool, but they better rival Mardi Grau and St Patrick's Day and Halloween and Valentine's Day and all of the other cash grab holidays based on shilling you some heterosexual sex and candy.

Now, I'm pretty gay, to be honest. I do think that homosexuality is a subtle and non-violent means of depopulation. I also believe it to be a manifestation of past lives cracking through the veil. I have never met a gay person with an agenda that was anything other than the one straight people have: to meet someone they find sexually attractive and romantically attractive and settle down. I've pondered that it's an evolutionary shift, where in periods where times are not hard and there could be a strain on resources if people continue to have children at an extreme rate, people still desire companionship. Perhaps it doesn't make sense to have children where there's not a need to do it to make sure your species survives, since time raising children is time that could be dedicated to some other form of bettering the world for the children. So without the pressure to procreate or die out, perhaps there's an upswing in people who are compelled to seek alternative companionship to scratch that itch (and crave it by default so as to not feel like they're missing something). This class of people would then be available to dedicate their lives to careers where they can serve as workers, creators, healers and teachers and do the lengthy time consuming tasks parents shouldn't be doing. Parents should be dedicated to their children's upbringing! I think homosexuality allows for the potential for a more balanced society where parents are free to make parenting their job, instead of split-shifting between careers and family, continually exhausted. Not the way we run things now, but it's something I see as possible.

Now, I believe it's possible this tenancy is encouraged and glorified in media. Like many things. Media and school's all a form of brainwashing, eh? However, the core nature of love is not unnatural. Beings seek companionship and perhaps society arranges it so they feel more comfortable with someone of the same sex. I personally attribute some of this to upbringing, and some of it to past lives, I know I associate powerfully with memories I have of being a man, but distinguish it clearly from who I am now, causing no gender dysphoria but still bringing with it the preference for women, from the point of view of a man. I think this could cause dysphoria for someone who didn't name that sensation as "memory of a previous life" but "a longing for what I want to be now".

Of all the LGBTQ+ people I know, none of them are outright angry about the idea of Straight Pride, they just sort of roll their eyes and view it as trolling. Like Storm Area 51. It's not something that the average real human on the street cares about; most of them are content to wait til Valentine's Day to celebrate screwing. I personally believe many angry hard left liberals are just as much trolls as the crazy hard right conservative trolls. I've never met a real one of those hardcore Tumblr style psycho style left-leaners. Just hurting people who crave love and acceptance and respect.

Sorry to bump the thread after pride's all done and gone and everyone's moved on with their summer. I wanted to drop in though, because I think the perspective I can add as an actual LGBTQ+ person is something this thread hasn't seen yet. ^_^ And maybe a relief to know that all the real gay, trans, bi, etc people I know, myself included, have no problems with straight people and straight people enthusiastically celebrating their desire to have sex with each other. There are trolls trying to push agendas. Not everything you read is the voice of a real person. Some people are just trolling to get high on the outrage factor. It happens here. It happens there. Ask yourself what motivates the person? Hurt, pain? Can you defuse that and make a real human connection? Empathy overrides emotional identity politics by putting a name and a face on what was just a cardboard constructed idea of a cause in a person's mind.

The human factor is what will prevent any AI driven, agenda created, political memes from overtaking the minds of everyone in a generation. They can't recreate that spark of connection between two souls who just understood what it was like to be each other. They can make you despair and forget the power of that connection though, so if the faceless people of the internet begin to get to you, I recommend to anyone to take a break and meet some real people who put a face to what you've been pondering. I meet a lot more people who are hurting than I do people who are really violently angry. They only get there if they really overboil before some lover intercepts. Don't let the internet suck you in when you can be making the real world around you a better place just because someone's view angers you. Now there's another agenda, I think, to create these identity politics and make them so contestable that great people wither away their valuable hearts by screaming text on a screen instead of putting all of that into healing the earth and the hurting people they encounter. Such amazing people get so derailed by some faucet of identity politics, it just chews me up inside. Either side, it doesn't matter, if someone is too angry about pronouns to leave their computer, there's a lot of compassionate heart-based work that won't get done, as the heart gets turned towards "being right".

If anyone wants to celebrate their straightness, that's cool, just don't stomp on the gay fun. It's just one month and rainbows are pretty, it's not like our flag is like, a garish red and purple polka dot on lime green with a flaming skull relief or some astrocity. I love the splashes of rainbows and colors being all over the city! It makes everything happy... and gay! Hee.

Cheers.

[snoman]

nice one Tae.. needed saying