Is the Vedas' version of hell truth...? [Archive] - The Project Avalon Community Forum

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mindbend8r

11th June 2019, 16:54

Hervé

11th June 2019, 17:28

im researching hell because im schizophrenic and the voices tell me im going to hell. [...]
Hello mindbend8r, I have moved your thread from "General Discussion" to "Targeted individuals" where it might be better suited.

Jayke

11th June 2019, 17:32

I’ve always considered heaven and hell to be states of mind that people use to navigate life, either residing in nirvana or samsara, as elucidated by the following zen parable.

.....

“the Gates of Paradise”...

A soldier named Nobushige came to Hakuin, and asked:
– Is there really a paradise and a hell?
– Who are you? – inquired Hakuin
– I am a samurai – the warrior replied
– You, a soldier! – exclaimed Hakuin
– What kind of ruler would have you as his guard?
– Your face looks like that of a beggar.
Nobushige became so angry that he began to draw his sword, but Hakuin continued:
– So you have a sword!
– Your weapon is probably much too dull to cut off my head.
As Nobushige drew his sword Hakuin remarked:
– Here open the gates of hell!
At these words the samurai, perceiving the master’s discipline, sheathed his sword and bowed.
– Here open the gates of paradise – said Hakuin.

......

As for energetic realms that the soul goes to inbetween incarnations... just live an honest, good and noble life and one needn’t worry.:sun:

greybeard

11th June 2019, 17:33

mindbender8r
Sorry to hear of the voices in your head.
Having studied spirituality for forty years I have come to the conclusion that there is no hell.
Near death experiencers bring hope to many.
Advaita--Vedas say that there is only One without a second.
I would go with that.

Best wishes
Chris

Iloveyou

11th June 2019, 20:20

Just my personal belief: There‘s hell, but there‘s no eternal hell. There‘s no hell unless we create it ourselves. It is a decision. When I think of the deceased trapped in the low astral realms, bound to all their passions and pain, often even not knowing them being dead, all their inner demons manifesting outside, as their counterpart, suffering and having no clue what is going on . . . such a state of being I‘d call hell. And even these spirits are not lost and will remember and learn. Talking of human souls.

I don‘t know what the Veda version of hell is said to be like. Would be interesting.

I’ve come to believe that the decision is not made in the mind, nor in the heart alone. It is made by heart and mind connecting. It is so essential to find a way into one‘s own heart, to find a way to listen to the heart, where the Voices have no say. Maybe it is easy to talk for someone who has no experience with what you said.

There is this pure place inside each of us where we know the ultimate truth. It does exist even though we may not yet have access to it. I wish you all the strengths and wisdom you can get to find this place of peace.

Soullight

11th June 2019, 22:58

First, if you hear voices and they are telling you things, basically forcing themselves onto you, this is ethically wrong. So, you can deduce that anything voices say is a partial truth at best, but mainly a LIE, or a trick to influence you towards some agenda of theirs.

Second, if the voices are coming from your own mind and without your control you should always strive to do what is right regardless if the voices say something to the contrary. And I think the best way to determine what is right is "THE GOLDEN RULE".

Onto your question...

As a human, there are ONLY a few ways to determine if Hell according to the Vedas is true. As a matter of fact, this holds true for ALL information.

1. You do research and compare texts, stories, etc, and make a theory.

2. You could experience hell by dying and coming back, or experience it in some sort of out-of-body state.

3. You are told about hell from some alien, deity, entity, dimensional being, or source.

NONE of these methods are reliable or can verify the precise truth. At best you can get collaboration and the stronger argument usually wins, although this doesn't make it right, or necessarily wrong.

ulli

11th June 2019, 23:20

The universe is full of voices, and natural telepaths have a hard time protecting themselves from the cacophony out there. Plus one’s own mind, when fragmented or conflicted, can resort to threatening thoughts.

So the advice I have for you is to direct your mind towards the upper strata of the universe, and be assured that there are beings there as well, and they have voices, too, albeit not as intrusive as the darker entities.
They would never bother you with unsolicited threats.

So if you can raise your own voice, and start a dialogue, and ask them politely for help, especially for protection against deceptive and malicious voices, they will form an energetic shield and you will gradually regain your trust in life.
Because the path towards goodness and lightness is just as infinite as the path downwards. Absolute goodness is real.

Until you breathe your last breath you always have a decent chance to find that upward path, but you must take heart, focus, and make that step. Heaven is a world of absolute goodness, and hell is a trap, where evil reigns. Both are non physical and more to do with your own consciousness.
Seeking higher consciousness will soon shut up the voices that want to spread fear in your heart.

TomKat

12th June 2019, 00:22

im researching hell because im schizophrenic and the voices tell me im going to hell. Which of coarse freaks me how my living life everyday is hard. Ive researched hell there is the bible version and the veda version. I was wondering if the vedas can be trusted as valid information. I know its the oldest spiritual teachings.

Then there is the contradicting point of view from Dolores Cannon who said there is no hell and all the new age people from psychics and stuff that say there is no eternal hell that any soul goes.

Obviously both cant be truth. I like Dolores cannon because there is a bit of science behind it even though it is hypnosis and no one can really say what is going on if the information coming is real or not.

I would like to hear peoples opinions on this site about if what there view on hell is. Thank you

Jerry Warzinsky has worked with schizophrenics for years in Arizona institutions. He has concluded that the voices schizophrenics hear are not hallucinations, they are entities aka "lying spirits."

And guess where these entities are? Yes, they are in Hell. Unfortunately, Hell surrounds the physical plane, so psychics have to learn to put up with them. They are attracted by your emotional wounds from childhood, so healing those would be a great help. Good luck.

Intranuclear

12th June 2019, 00:59

Dear mindbend8r,

Be careful researching Hell, because there are many forms of it. I can tell you personally that I have experienced it myself and to say that it is overwhelming would be a major understatement.
First, don't be afraid of Hell, because real or not you can absolutely make it real and fear is the vehicle.
Now to your schizophrenia. I assume you have researched it or have at least found a support group or sought medical care.
If not, check out this website: https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/schizophrenia/living-with/

There are many causes of schizophrenia and sometimes they are genetic or even physical.
A close friend of mine's mother had it and eventually, after many years it was discovered that she had a benign tumor the size of an orange growing in her brain. Something like this putting pressure on your brain can easily cause all kinds badness, and clearly death. While the tumor was removed, it has since grown back. By all definitions, she has experienced Hell, including hearing voices and seeing and talking to invisible people (not invisible to her of course).
One of the symptoms of schizphrenia is the inability to trust people especially when you can clearly see things that others cannot.

Have you sought a support group?
Have you had a medical diagnosis?
Are you taking medicine or refusing it?
Have you had a brain scan?
Since schizophrenia is often genetic, do you have parents or siblings that have had this?

These question are for yourself so I am not expecting you to answer them here.

Now back to the question of Hell.
Hell welcomes all who are seeking it and as has been said before it most certainly is a trap. Clearly many find it because they either end their lives and you never hear of them again, or worse, they suffer endlessly. Some may feel they deserve it somehow, and other people may think that certain people deserve it. If you believe that you deserve it, then that is the trap.
Don't go there!
Think of Hell as a vacation destination that you don't want to visit, just as there are many such places on Earth.

Clearly many people can make Hell for others, such as in abusive relationships. Hopefully you are not in one of those or if you are, you can get away.

Can you quiet those voices in your head?
You can for example give them identity and try to ignore them and sometimes that can be enough.

In any case, if you are strong enough to carry a dialogue here, then that already is hopeful.

Eagle Eye

12th June 2019, 02:08

I think to understand heaven and hell, we need to understand first the balance of things and then move our perception beyond this balance. Our planet is in the balanced distance from sun to support life, any distance nearer will make this planet extreme hot, or any distance far away, will make it extreme cold. Thats what makes us think, what lies beyond the balance. So according to Abrahamic texts, Quran/Torah/Bible, Heaven seems to represent the highest order or "maybe" the perfect balance of things and Hell it seems like the opposite of it. That includes the outer world and inner world. So hell can be as much real outside and inside. Since it is the testing ground for us humans in here, we cannot view the big picture from this current state. According to those texts, the ultimate test is to believe in one God while unseen, to be grateful to Him and worship Him alone. To be aware that everything is a creation and to follow the balance and not to transgress within it. To be aware that we humans have one greatest enemy, who has decieved many from us in different ways. To follow the truth and justice in any case of our life. To be aware that it will be a Day of Judgement but not how most percieve, because it is said that on that day everyone will know what has brought forth.

So the questions can be: are we humans the same according to our deeds, I don't think so. So can those criminals that works against the creation, those who deforme and corrupt and brake the balance in every matter, be the same as those who dedicate their life to find the truth, to honor life, to bring order, to spread knowledge.
Now this is what the messengers has warned us since ancient times.

According to your disscussion about the voices in the head, is another topic, because we have a case of a targeted individual, that has many threads in here which you can read them, but most important is to try to ignore those voices, even if sometimes they tell the truth, because they aren't in your benefit.

Justplain

12th June 2019, 04:51

Just a few thoughts on this topic:

1). My uncle was a psychiatrist who found in treating schizophrenia that more than half have developed it via phobias, irrational psychological reactions to something, often caused by trauma. If you find the core phobia and treat it (usually via talk therapy) then the schizophrenia disappears.

2). I definitely have found that there is a cutoff point if you are doing bad things, or not doing what you should. This may be why some people believe that this life is in hell. If one doesn't do what is right you might get tossed into a much worse place. This is likely only a temporary thing, but harsh all the same.

3) Michael Newton's research indicated there was no permanent hell for the soul, however, his patients did identify that some poor souls who couldn't or wouldn't improve from misdeeds were removed from the soul ascension process, and they didn't know what happened to them.

4). In the book 'a Dweller on Two Planets' the spirit, Phylon, went through a temptation and terror scenario that tested his character to the core. The lesson was not to do evil in the cause of good. He indicated his spirit needed to be tested by the worst evil spirits before he 'ascended'.

Newton's research didn't confirm phylon's claim. This may be just what's appropriate for the individual soul.,as mentioned in other posts in this thread. However, I do think there are lines one should not cross, and if you do, you could be in for a rough ride, which may seem 'eternal', tho likely are not.

conk

12th June 2019, 18:27

Dr. David Hawkins says Hell is what you experience in the afterlife, karma you drew to yourself by your negative deeds. Yes, it's understood that karma is complex and not necessarily retribution for evil. Karma is not payback. Hawkins' states that a person will reside in an energy field that resembles the energy emitted during their recent past life. His thinking is closely aligned with several physics gurus. Physicists call them Morphic Fields. Hawkins calls them Attractor Fields. Hell is not eternal, but a transient experience on the journey of learning.

Some schizophrenia can be remedied by the GAPS diet. GAPS certainly helps, sometimes cures ADHD, Autism, and Bi-Polar disorders.

Angels1981

12th June 2019, 20:43

You are not insane and they are right to place it in the targeted individuals. You are not going to hell because I bet you are a really loving person and you love a lot of others and take pleasure in doing things. If you do anything here respectfully use Jesus Christ name and ask them to stop and leave in his name. That works. Secondly, the Government are using voice of God electronically and aliens are putting their ten pc in to create the illusion that you are fear and that you are not from love.
Long story but support groups won't help you because they base their facts that you are loopy and that you need medical attention half the time.
What I would say is you need to learn to love you more, learn to forgive yourself for putting up with the voices and to always remember that they are playing porn with love. They are playing chess with your mind. They attack the mind first then they grab at your soul. They want you to feel the same way as they do. Hell is no existing. Love is the real energy of all of us but they pump lies into the brain as in brain washed until you can put up with no more. There is a lot of money put into mental health these days to put people into dazes and cash in on you being on drugs.
You have to determine what beliefs you want to believe in and set your self free by believing in them and not what other tell you to do so.
I have learned the other thing is to keep affirming that you are love and that I can do no wrong.
At first I was told from the real angels no matter what you hear the horrible stuff is not coming from yourself. They are trying to create hell on earth by mimicking the thoughts of heaven so you don't believe that you are good enough to go to heaven.
It is that deep that unless you have seen what they can do you will never believe that is what they are trying to do.
People are not delusional themselves, but it is placed upon you by other entities trying to stop you from feeling loved because they don't have a heart.
All true to those who experience it. You will never go to hell you love too much .

TomKat

12th June 2019, 23:39

Hell welcomes all who are seeking it and as has been said before it most certainly is a trap. Clearly many find it because they either end their lives and you never hear of them again, or worse, they suffer endlessly. Some may feel they deserve it somehow, and other people may think that certain people deserve it. If you believe that you deserve it, then that is the trap.
Don't go there!
Think of Hell as a vacation destination that you don't want to visit, just as there are many such places on Earth.

The only Hell I've experienced, in lucid dreams, is a darkish cityscape of drug addicts and prostitutes. I find I am attracted to it, or rather, have a morbid fascination with it. Also, I've identified parts of the city on this plane that have a dark feel, and I suspect on the astral level, they are Hell. Most corner bars would fit in this category. An attraction of this particular Hell is that there is free will, as on this plane, and free from any kind of spiritual authority. This isn't my complete feeling on the matter, but is how part of me feels, at the shadow level. I may have picked up these attitudes when I drove a cab for a year, hauling drunks, pimps and prostitutes around. Life on the lawless frontier of society.

7Seven

13th June 2019, 18:21

Hello Brother Human
I am From Earth
Do not worry
Life is our choice and we get to make it Through our thoughts/choices, actions and reactions. what you believe sets a level for the thoughts you recieve

Where is the source? Where do the voices come from? If the voices are yours, whos listening?

Sometimes its good to just take a step back and stop getting outside data for the idea of what truth.
Close your eyes and hold on to the idea of self for few minutes, what are your values? your ideals? your principals?, its very very difficult to not get distracted. but we grow everyday.
if we spend all day worrying about negative voices in our head then you spend a whole day wasted. tell them you love and accept them for them. and most of the time their just doing their jobs trying to make people the best people they can be.
Inside every life is infinity, ive seen a few hell dimensions on dmt, its pretty lit i find it all very hilarious, the screaming wings are so annoying.
but if infinity exist their is only unity, realize we are all one, we are only ever harming or helping ourselves

People bomb people and ****ing occult sex parties so **** whatever else says, **** the labels, just follow your truth, be nice to people, stay virtuous, honest and aware.
Be aware of shiva! om namah shivay there is much greatness and knowledge in the creator/destroyer/preserver archetypes

hell was a created concept by religion to instutionalize people to think that if you do good you go to heaven do bad you go to hell as a way of pushing conformism , now they use teeny pop lol

Learn of Nikola tesla and thoth <3

monitor your dopamine levels over a month in reference to the activities you were doing that month <3

One love
- The other side of infinity

shaberon

14th June 2019, 15:57

In Buddhism, we would say hell is a realm, i. e. a condition of mind. So, this planet, particularly, is hell. At its best, it is full of misery and suffering you might be able to avoid. At its "not quite the best", the agony of any soul plunged into the despairs of hunger, cold, abuse, and the like, are hell mark two. So we are pretty concerned with the fact that it is real, we're in it, and largely we contribute to it.

One of the more challenging paradoxes is from Shantideva, roughly saying, "Because of you, I am going to become a Buddha and purify countless realms. Because of me, you are going to hell to suffer endless agonies". Despite my good intentions, the road to hell is paved with those. Very little of anything I ever said or did has stopped the process. One of the main deity meditations is on Avalokiteshvara, who entered the afterlife hell and was saving beings, but every time one escaped, someone else came in. That is why he has come to the surface of the earth, to try to stop it here.

The vision of afterlife hells is rather vicious. It's not eternal because "you" will be annihilated. Lost. Erased. In which case, you are relatively better off in the hot hells, where it happens faster. In the case of "one who deserves punishment", someone who intentionally spread suffering, they go to the cold hells to be frozen for eons prior to elimination. Divine consciousness continues its existence without you, and whatever was you is re-broadcast as atoms into something else.

None of that is permanent, neither is heaven. Just transitory states.

In most respects, Buddhism is non-different from the Vedas. It is just an extension or a kind of "finishing touch" which we would say is more powerful than Hindu philosophies. Part of what I do is to enter hellish conditions--a tormented mind--and try to get it to change directions. I have lost one time a "voices in the head" schizophrenic person to suicide. It has taken fifteen years to emerge from the resultant wormhole during a related psychic battle, which, to my poor senses, seems that it may have gotten that first ghost some peace. I can't be sure, but I know what I do can help, if someone asks for it. Right now there was recently another death from someone refusing help. It's pretty difficult, there is no holy water I can spray on someone and take care of everything. Any progress is made of pure pain.

The greater the pain, usually, the stronger a being can be if placed firmly in a good direction. In Vedic terms, used in Buddhist meditation, the individual would "become" Indra by gaining all his weapons and armor. These implements are nothing other than the current misery transformed into joy and clarity. Same energy. The worse off you are, the better off you can be. The "lukewarm" people are not such good candidates. Several of our Masters such as Milarepa were outright black magicians. Very many of the subtle beings such as the Four Kings, Hariti, and so forth, were complete monsters, re-directed towards truth.

It is hard to get a straight "Vedic" response, since there are many different schools of it. Buddhism is an extension of Adwaita, and only has a few minor technical differences between its sects. Because the Vedas were something like the Latin bible, Indian culture is just as heavily infused with Puranas, or a common tradition, wherein Durga becomes a chief deity. The normal tradition is something like "thank you for killing the demons", but, we do not think it works this way. Again, the forms of Durga would be something for you to become so you take care of everything yourself. That is our main vision, deities have no objective existence and it does no good just to say they are great and worship them. They are natural powers of the mind which one is suggested to discover by meditation.

The Bible version is just from degraded Manicheanism and is dualistic or Dwaita, so, not particularly valid. At best it may be a "level one" or attempt to seek rebirth in a heaven world, compared to which, most Hindu philosophy (level two) concerns liberation or escape from form, whereas Buddhism is more like a mental liberation from form with a pledge to continue manifesting on behalf of other beings. Philosophy is one thing, but if we look at one of the main meditational deities, Avalokiteshvara, and how he wept Tara into manifestation, then yes, it's massively about getting a handle on the hell's power and turning it into a tool.

greybeard

14th June 2019, 16:45

Eagle Eye

14th June 2019, 19:44

What is the word that describe heaven ?
PEACE
That mean to be free of conflict in and out and everything in perfect balance and order. Thats what can be described as the greatest ultimate destination, for every creation.

So what does hell mean ?
The opposite of peace. CHAOS, everything out of balance, in extreme conflict and also that leads to suffering. Both of them are eternal as realms, that has been created, exists and will ever be, but the creations that inhabit these realms may be permanent in there or not.

So do those extreme condition exist? It's up to you to decide what to believe, because I have found my answers.

Rich

14th June 2019, 21:22

Rich

15th June 2019, 13:41

Jürgen Ziewe on Life after death:
The majority of OBEers and I share a conviction that the environments we travel though are the same as we will inhabit after our physical death.
http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Life_after_death_-_a_description_of_the_afterlife.html

http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Levels_of_consciousness_and_OBEs_files/Dimensions.jpg

TomKat

16th June 2019, 16:13

A state of mind when you are alive is a place when you are dead. So pursuit of happiness while alive takes on more importance.

johnf

16th June 2019, 18:45

Ive read often--"Be care full of you thoughts when you are dying as they will take you to the realm of the mind you are focusing on"
However that is a visit to that particular realm--its not permanent.
So I don't believe in eternal hell and damnation.

My signature was taken from the teaching of the late Dr Davi Hawkins--I think it was good advice which I try to follow.
His books show an exceptional understanding of spirituality

Chris

I quoted Chris because I think the first line of his post points to the most important part of the bigger discussion in this thread.
Although I have experienced strong compulsive thoughts myself I have not been diagnosed as schizophrenic, so I can not really speak to that
there are qualified people for that. However hearing voices that are accusing or negative is bound to drive a person towards an exploration of the actual source of these things. And especially if you have experienced that repetion of a pattern tends to lead to more repetition, you can see how
this might set up some sort of long duration after death experience. And because of my particular experience set of what seem to be various possible realms beyond ,and perhaps below the physical realm, I don't want to be caught in any positive afterlife realms either.
So finding my hook into anything I am experiencing is my main priority in life. If something someone says upsets me I can look at the reaction coming up, hear the words of the thought, see the images, and feel the sensations/emotions, and after each of these steps look for the person that is doing that. This sort of process tends to unhook the overlapping habitual self that creates the victim of my thoughts. I can also look for the person in another who seems to be attacking me, and ask if this is a person, as well as ask what this event says about me.

To this this effectively it usually takes some practice and training, but the main goal is to reverse the vicious cycle of reactive thoughts that

are creating the repeated pattern. So my last thought as John is more likely to be more neutral than my present one. The funny thing is the real goal of the whole thing is not get to a place where thoughts are no longer needed by "me", and any thoughts thoughts that I experience just come and go, and have my blessing.

The main tool I have used ,and am currently using is the unfindable inquiry, and I hope to explore techniques that come from the book focusing in the future. Also in above posts there are various roadmaps that try to describe the realms various qualities of thoughts come and go from and to, I have my favorite one, linked below.

http://www.buddhanet.net/pdf_file/allexistence.pdf

Studying such things, including various alternative ones can really help in the journey, because it will show that we aren't the only ones seeing these things, and that descriptions of them are distorted by culture and limited to the conceptual mind. They are various fingers pointing to the moon, but are not themselves the moon.

I have found that there are endless realms recreated by habitual thought, and people will tend to call many of these heavens or hells, or purgatories, but, they are in the end all just habits.

This is a link to a blog by a professional counselor who uses various tools to help break up mental patterns. He is highly trained, and well versed in

mindfulness I intend to try some sessions from him.

http://robcmatthews.com/index.php/2019/05/18/getting-a-feel-for-felt-exploration/?fbclid=IwAR1altL9eglxrIfiMxSak1K4dVBQHAD9XxJojJFwoSz3vLEfmgD6R6k0I6I

Reading this blog recently triggered a few days of very peaceful clear experience for me.

" I edited the above for punctuation, and was struck by the fact that the spell checker marked my word hells, apparently just because it is unusual in western culture to think there might be more than one"

John

prc

17th June 2019, 17:10

TomKat

18th June 2019, 01:17

Let´s be objective, no DEAD person has ever came back to tell us all about. So most probably, after death, everything is finished, there is no after life, Hell or Heaven. Try to live in the present moment because it is all that is. And secondly, the modern generation of psychiatric drugs is able to supress all the voices in your head if you don´t have a severe form of Schizophrenie. So look for a doctor to prescribe you something so that you can stop listening to those voices and start concentrating on your life.

It's not a great idea to give advice on a subject you know nothing about. Many people have died and come back. And suggesting drugs to suppress symptoms is irresponsible.

conk

20th June 2019, 16:38

Let´s be objective, no DEAD person has ever came back to tell us all about. So most probably, after death, everything is finished, there is no after life, Hell or Heaven. Try to live in the present moment because it is all that is. And secondly, the modern generation of psychiatric drugs is able to supress all the voices in your head if you don´t have a severe form of Schizophrenie. So look for a doctor to prescribe you something so that you can stop listening to those voices and start concentrating on your life.

This is patently untrue. I died at age 13, but was revived minutes later. The experience was beyond description, so I won't even attempt it. It was extraordinary to say the least.

And I agree with TomKat, that drugs are never the right solution. Drugs for mental issues are incredible dangerous, with long term consequences. Nature offers us vastly more choices that are truly effective and safe.

Sorry to pick on you, as you were obviously trying to help.

AutumnW

20th June 2019, 19:52

Hell on earth is experienced by those who have schizophrenia. I agree that lower level entities may have something to do with the voices. And whatever they are telling you is likely not true. They may tell you a few things that are true but that sets you up to be lied to. So don't fall for it. Tell them to p*** off.

The brain acts as a reducing valve for 'mind at large.' If that function becomes damaged and the mind is suddenly forced open to whatever's out there, it can become very Hellish. Drugs for schizophrenia help to put up barriers. In the past, the medication was a blunt instrument that created all kinds of side effects and problems. The new class of drugs restores mental barriers that keep Hell out, without the deleterious side effects.

I wish you the very best and hopes for a life lived without this kind of interference.

Words of Joy

21st June 2019, 15:07

I have pondered on numerous occasions about hell. I've had discussions about hell. And I'm convinced that hell as a burning realm of eternal suffering does not exist. Allow me to offer my perspective. It'll be challenging, but I'll try to be short about it.

The bible has a list of verses (https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=hell&qs_version=NIV) mentioning 'hell'. And another list of verses, insinuating or referencing to fire, to the same extent. If one would take the bible literally, then, if one would sin and not ask for forgiveness, at the end of life the person would end up in some burning realm of eternal suffering. Though these references to hell of the bible are not to be taken literally. It's a metaphor. Unfortunately too many people are not able to grasp this.

First let me explain from the bible why it is a metaphor and support that with some other verses, that will show hell, being an eternal place of suffering, does not make sense.

In the Old Testament there are references to actual burning, like in Leviticus 7:19:
"Meat that touches anything ceremonially unclean must not be eaten; it must be burned up. As for other meat, anyone ceremonially clean may eat it."

The Mosaic Laws were laws of acts: 'do this, do that, don't do this, don't do that'. All very literally. It is important to understand these literal Mosaic Laws were a precursor of the Laws that came into effect after Jesus died on the cross. The difference being that all the acts that Jews had to do under the Mosaic Law, no longer were needed to be done. Example is, where in the Old Testament a sacrifice was literally something one possessed (or bought) like a lam, in the New Testament could be to sacrifice part of a person's way of life, that isn't beneficial to all. But could also be seen as an offer. Any way, the coming of Jesus raised the laws, as love was made the new standard. As Jesus said:

John 13:34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. "

John 15:9 “As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love."

Although this new standard was introduced, some references in speech remained, though now referring to certain coming situation as a result of a person's personal choices in life. Jesus introduced a new level of love in a world surrounded by tribes (world wide) that were sacrificing animals, people, and other stuff. The Maker of our souls, is not happy with sacrificing. Sacrifice in the Old Testament was merely a step in the right direction from sacrificing people. In those Old Testament days, it was the way of the world. Argh... feel I'm drifting again. If someone wants to know more regarding sacrifice and what the Great Good Spirit's opinion on it is, let me know and I'll write something up, that's more elaborate.

Anyways, Old Testament Mosaic Law literally, New Testament more cryptically with metaphores and parables. Book of Isaiah offers a couple of insights. Book of Isaiah although Old Testament is prophesying of what was/is to come. Here's one that provides an insight regarding what to expect regarding fire, Isaiah 47:12-14:
"“Keep on, then, with your magic spells and with your many sorceries, which you have labored at since childhood.
Perhaps you will succeed, perhaps you will cause terror. All the counsel you have received has only worn you out!
Let your astrologers come forward, those stargazers who make predictions month by month, let them save you from what is coming upon you.
Surely they are like stubble; the fire will burn them up. They cannot even save themselves from the power of the flame.
These are not coals for warmth; this is not a fire to sit by."

That is a big clue that in a lot of cases, especially in the New Testament, when is spoken of fire, it is a reference to coming result of personal choices, egocentric choices. Basically not living as Jesus lovingly showed.

Another clue we find in Isaiah 45:23 from the Maker of our souls:
"By myself I have sworn, my mouth has uttered in all integrity a word that will not be revoked:
Before me every knee will bow; by me every tongue will swear."

This verse above is not some short term goal. Not something that will be forced either. This is a process stretching over ages. Strings of incarnations. Some will bow (out of their own will, not by force) sooner then others. But eventually all will, when they come to understand the greatness of the good our heavenly Maker has to offer, which is by nature better than what our universal realm has to offer in any way. And every soul will come to that conclusion. Souls don't die and will not suffer for ever. Though in a realm with free will, everyone can do as he chooses. And there are always consequences. Which can be either good and thoroughly enjoyable and uplifting, or a straight-up nightmare, to put it black and white. The question is: how long will a person keep on accepting suffering rather than loving everyone around him/her and the One that created their soul. How long will a person keep on placing them self as being more important than others? For some it'll take long. For others it has already taken long. Some are open for the love of our Maker and are willing to give to all needy, without expecting anything in return. The bar set by Jesus lies high. If one would fully read and understand what it was Jesus did, and would try to do the same, he would not be able to by himself. No supernatural healing of the diseased, no removal of unclean spirits, no silencing of storms, etc etc. This is because the Holy Spirit is needed within a person to guide and then, with humility, dedication and love, the Good Great One will graciously involve the person into the supernatural occurrences (as the bible says:"the person will bear fruit in it's time"). This is mostly not something that comes from one day on the next (for some it can be). And it can't be forced. It is given. Mostly this follows at a certain point after enduring dedication to the lessons of the Spirit and progress on them.

Now what I've learned from the Spirit regarding dying. Foremost: In short, if one had his heart changed by the Spirit of the Maker of our souls and stays on the path with the Spirit, spiritual progress, after life on earth, is a certainty. Then there are two options left: One is willfully hurtful/unjust to others. Other is allowing others to be hurtful/unjust to others. These two will keep a person in the reincarnation loop. The person will die, hang around earth for support to those left behind, and at a certain point move on to a next life, with a real chance of no recollection of previous life. The 'willfull hurter' will go into a life of more suffering then the 'allower'. But both will go into a life where suffering will have part. The intensity is what differs. I recently learned these souls do have a certain level of choices they can make regarding their next life. But still suffering will be part of it, and the soul is fully aware suffering is needed for spiritual advancement.

About schizophrenia. Can be a mental issue or a spiritual harassment, or I guess possibly even both. If it concerns mental issue, it's important to find a good expert that can help you. I think for most people that would be the first thing to look into. Personally I'd pray for insights and guidance. (I've been guided to doctors to. Not always is a supernatural solution needed.)

The spiritual harassment can range from mischievous or in need of attention, to downright destructive, trying to have a person commit suicide. If it's spiritually, then there are people that work with the Spirit, to free people of spiritual harassment. E.g. in some Pentecostal Communities you might be able to find people that are working with the Spirit to liberate people. Or you could directly pray to Jesus for help. In that case one could pray, in the name of Jesus, open their heart and speak about what is happening and ask Jesus to help you be freed of the harassing spirits. Honesty and openness is important with this.

Be blessed. May a solution to your situation come to you quickly. :flower:

prc

21st June 2019, 20:01

Even the Pope Francis has ackknowledge recently that the Church has invented the Hell Story to manipulate people.

prc

21st June 2019, 20:15

If you were brought back to life is because you haven´t died literally.

amor

21st June 2019, 21:34

Famous research psychiatrists (whose names I cannot now remember) have treated hopeless schizophrenics with huge doses of vitamin C intravenously and reversed otherwise seemingly incurable attacks of this disease. Information about this treatment mode is on the internet. Do a search under treatment of schizophrenia by high dose intravenous vitamin C.

About voices in the head. There is a difference between microwave activated voice transfer to the brain and the kind of voices from demonic entities, which are more like obsessive thoughts which may be mistaken for your own thoughts which you cannot stop from happening. When you determine the difference, which is easy, you make every effort to consciously reprogram your subconscious mind by visualizing the opposite thought and reprimanding the negative thought. Whether this negativity is demonic or your own doing, this is the way to get rid of it. Also, prayers to God or your Guardian Angel will be helpful. Try all of the above. Also go to a naturopathic doctor to check and correct your biochemical/dietary condition.

God Bless.

spade

22nd June 2019, 04:07

mindbend8r, just make sure you don't end up there. Coming to whatever conclusion, we don't wish to find out where there is one when it's too late. I suggest to err on the side of caution. From all the descriptions throughout the ages - it's perpetual sickness, perpetual suffering, perpetual screaming of billion of souls, perpetual heat, perpetual torture, perpetual loneliness (unable to communicate anything but pain). This is one of the few things that have led me to explore the Christian hope in a moslem country