The 2nd English Civil War

[boja]

I HOPE THAT I'M WRONG

Blood is already being spilt on a small scale here on the streets of England over this matter, and I can only hope that the violence doesn't escalate.

It's quite simple:- Over 3 years ago we had a referendum as promised years earlier, on whether to leave or remain in the “European Union”.

17.4 Million people, that's 52% of the voters decided to LEAVE, as opposed to 48% who decided to remain. Note :- the largest number of eligible voters for decades actually voted.

As a result the UK government were TOLD by the People to get us OUT of the “EU”.

David Cameron (who voted to remain) was Prime Minister at that time, and because the referendum received the WRONG ANSWER from the People, he was forced to resign.

IN A DEMOCRACY, PEOPLE ABIDE BY THE MAJORITY'S DECISION.

Theresa May (who also voted to remain) was then chosen as Prime Minister, and so was given the task. She was offered a “deal” by the “EU” (under which the EU still controlled our laws, and it was basically WORTHLESS). She then offered the “deal” to the UK government and it was rejected THREE TIMES.

THE PEOPLE DIDN'T VOTE FOR A “DEAL”, THEY VOTED TO LEAVE.

This process took 3 years, and she was then forced to resign.

Boris Johnson (who actually voted to leave) was then chosen as Prime Minister, and so was given the task. He then set about the job “With or without a deal”, although preferably through negotiation, but in order to do that effectively, he needs the “no deal” option on the table.

Unfortunately the majority of UK politicians (and EU politicians) are absolutely TERRIFIED of the UK leaving the EU. Reasons :-

a) Many are under about 58 years old and so don't remember that life here before the “EU” was OK.
b) MONEY.

For mainly these reasons the majority of our politicians are hell bent on bringing down Boris Johnson, and most importantly stopping the UK from leaving, which is CONTRARY TO THE WISHES OF THE MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE.

SO MUCH FOR DEMOCRACY !!

To those who voted “remain”, I would say “YOU LOST, GET OVER IT”.

To all politicians, I would say “DO AS YOU'RE TOLD, YOU'RE THERE TO SERVE THE PEOPLE, NOT YOURSELVES”.

Feelings are running pretty high here where I am in the East Anglian region of England, and I sincerely hope that this matter doesn't result in more bloodshed, as it's already looking very ugly.

[Peter UK]

I sense your passion and frustration. This farcical state of affairs around brexit is becoming very, very, tiresome. Personally I'm all for cutting and running, which may not be the most informed opinion politically speaking but I have absolutely no doubts we could ride the storm, survive any maelstrom and eventually emerge stronger as a country. It's a British trait.

Margaret Thatcher must be turning in her grave.

[Baby Steps]

In the following article we see barriers have gone up supposedly to stop vehicle based terrorist attacks.

https://metro.co.uk/2017/03/28/barriers-put-up-to-stop-terror-attack-at-buckingham-palace-6539707/

What the images do not show is a low steel barrier circling green park, unobtrusively. So if these structures are there for the reason claimed, there appears to be a requirement to protect that particular green space from vehicles, but not others.

I noticed that the low steel barrier has post holes, as if fencing could be inserted.

When I saw this I was stumped as to what kind of scenario would require the palace, and governmental buildings to be protected.

I would say very large disordered mass demonstrations. Like the one that brought down the Thatcher Government, but much larger.
The proroguing announcement caused quite alot of anger in London, and many more demos than were covered in the uk press.

[greybeard]

Strangely enough there was none of this before the referendum--and little trouble in Ireland.
Frankly people get led by the media---all this, I suspect, is pre planned down to the last detail.
Divide and conquer.

Going well back in time.
My parents had a corner shop---the hub of the community.
Government abolished retail price maintenance--all shops up till then sold at the same price a set fair profit margin.
All of a sudden our customers were shopping at supermarkets except when they wanted the groceries on credit.
Many small grocers had to shut up shop.
Then the LSD (Pound,Shillings and Pence)came to a halt---requiring updating tills etc.
Next came VAT---all small businesses saw their overheads shoot up.

So what is beneficial--perhaps to some is not necessarily beneficial to other.
Regardless of how the current situation pans out there will be successes and failures.
Will the UK survive?
Who knows?

Chris

Ps the small corner shops really were the hub of the community and back then there was a community spirit, back then--police respected, teachers the same.
Violence at a minimum---knife crime non existent, In who's interest is it to promote,cause, division?

This why I dont vote or take sides.
I have thoughts about the current situation but not to the point where I feel any need to take action or disagree with peoples choice.
Ch

[enigma3]

As an outside observer, the UK Parliament is putting on quite a show. I see a rather keen disregard for the will of the people and thus for Democratic government.

After reading the latest article on Brexit at Zerohedge I come away with the feeling that Boris and company know what they are doing. I wish we had Prime Minister's questions in the States. Watching the sergeant at arms yell "ORDAAH" is a show in itself!

Joseph Farrell presents a good argument for the Nazis and postwar Germany calling most of the shots in establishing the EU to favor Germany. It sure has worked out that way. If you can't conquer them militarily, conquer them economically. The British economy hasn't been the same since joining the EU. Same for France.

I see a future where the EU dissolves (look out for Italy) and reforms without the German bias. A better win for all. In the meantime I'm enjoying the show.

[TomKat]

I sense your passion and frustration. This farcical state of affairs around brexit is becoming very, very, tiresome. Personally I'm all for cutting and running, which may not be the most informed opinion politically speaking but I have absolutely no doubts we could ride the storm, survive any maelstrom and eventually emerge stronger as a country. It's a British trait.

British are like the Jews, they can survive anything :-)

[shaberon]

How, again, did they get into it in the first place?

Is E-U not the "Fascist" system that some "Great War" was fought against?

It is, and there wasn't any war, just a French--British plot to consolidate Europe. British Fascists may be few in number, but, evidently, quite high in influence. All of the modern, unified Germany has been nothing but a stooge and fall guy for them, as well as Russia, which mostly has slipped from their control. Russian-German rapprochement still does not look good for the Anglos. Since they cannot muster another war, their time is pretty much spent.

First Civil War gave us the gift of Zionism. Since then, the worst fear of governments has been an "American style" revolution anywhere in Europe, especially France, verboten. Whatever happened in most of those countries was merely a pale imitation that just removed monarchs and replaced them with something perhaps even worse. I wouldn't feel too bad about the performance, since here in the U. S., where it succeeded, everything was voluntarily surrendered back. American revolution definitely does not begin "Democracy", it is completely against that, and it is a big lie our leaders repeat that we are one or we stand for it.

I vote for your cultures and if East Anglian is not the same as Lowland Scot, why should you be strangled by the same octopus?

[Rosemarie]

In the following article we see barriers have gone up supposedly to stop vehicle based terrorist attacks.

https://metro.co.uk/2017/03/28/barriers-put-up-to-stop-terror-attack-at-buckingham-palace-6539707/

What the images do not show is a low steel barrier circling green park, unobtrusively. So if these structures are there for the reason claimed, there appears to be a requirement to protect that particular green space from vehicles, but not others.

I noticed that the low steel barrier has post holes, as if fencing could be inserted.

When I saw this I was stumped as to what kind of scenario would require the palace, and governmental buildings to be protected.

I would say very large disordered mass demonstrations. Like the one that brought down the Thatcher Government, but much larger.
The proroguing announcement caused quite alot of anger in London, and many more demos than were covered in the uk press.

Baby Steps. I am completely confuse. The article is from March 28, 2017 ????? Or is it happening again ?

[sunwings]

A civil war is brewing, especially now the majority of British citizens now wish to stay! They did not vote for food and medicine shortages, delays to cancer treatment, massive job losses, businesses going to the wall, our security compromised, peace in Northern Ireland threatened and actual deaths. Unlike the 301 mostly Conservative politicians this week who thought that sounded like fun for the UK.

20 odd politicians from the ruling party have been kicked out for holding moderate views! Several have resigned, including the Prime Ministers brother! The sitting prime minister is playing a game of lies and deceit. Such as refusing to call an election and then the following day trying to call an election.

Although I had no problem with people voting LEAVE after three years of a reality check, if someone still holds these views then I have a real problem with them. And it is not only me that has a problem with Brexiteers you can also include:

Doctors
The law
Parliament
The civil service
The union
The NHS
Experts
Judges
Universities
The BBC
The Good Friday agreement
Business
The City
Reality

[greybeard]

It always amazes me that the various groups for and against appear all uniformly dressed for the demonstrations.
That should be a clear indication of manipulation of the masses to confront and divide.
Yet people seem to have a need to express their opinions/preferences through a group.

I have no problem with people voting for or against but sunwings has made valid points.

Next the country will be divided by home rule for Scotland, Wales and perhaps Ireland.
People think they made a valid choice, that they thought they knew what they were voting for--I think it mass manipulation with a clear view to set up confrontation---for the people-- oh yeah!!!

That's just my thoughts--I could be wrong--I dont mind if people disagree.

It will not go as far as civil war.

Chris

[Violet3]

I was confused when it was reported (can't remember where I read it) that the Queen questioned the value of the UK's membership of the EU, and then she agreed to dissolve parliament as requested by Mr. Johnston. I assume she is a 'globalist' but her stance seems to contradict this.

I do agree with Boja that, given the people's vote to leave the EU, it seems intolerable and incredible that it did not happen promptly, as if we need further demonstration that democracy is so feeble if not dead. Three years after the original vote people may or may not have changed their minds, but that does not change the vote and the mandate given to the government.

Sadly, there now seems to be a 'catch-22' where either leaving the EU or staying now seems equally disastrous because of the divisions and anger the whole situation has engendered. This result may have been planned as Greybeard suggests.

The other thing I wonder about is what is going on underneath all the controversy over Brexit- is the whole divisive performance a distraction from something else?

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

I think it mass manipulation with a clear view to set up confrontation---for the people-- oh yeah!!!

Possibly a very valid observation Chris. The question of staying or remaining may - just saying may - not in reality have the vast, intricate, technical, far-reaching ramifications they've led us all to believe in. It could, in reality, be a smooth, straight-forward process, involving merely the signing and stamping of papers that should legally already exist, contingent as they must be for all eventualities. But as with geo-modification, they may have engineered this entire storm, by spinning it, stoking it, and delaying it, "because details", "because bureaucracy", while it simmers and simmers building up and up toward critical mass.

Because the longer we wait (by design) for a resolution, the more anxious, confused, unsettled, and polarized we become.

A giant scam - a social false flag. Divide the people, turn neighbour against neighbour, incite dissent and rebellion, then push towards the cliff of social collapse. These are the perfect conditions for the introduction of sweeping new policies, securities, and controls. And the exhausted, beleaguered people will by this stage welcome them. Deep, deep, conspiracy stuff. But would anyone here be truly surprised?

[greybeard]

Who --or what started the unrest--"Civil war"?
Was there any great strength of emotion for staying or leaving till there was the referendum?
The big carrot--the red bus--then no its not going to give what its promised--by then people sold on leave or remain.
So yes the unrest comes from what Star Mariner has pointed out.
Basically I havent- got what was promised "yet" -High hopes of better life--more funds for NHS.
Of course politicians know what people want and are very good at promising it.
Not very good at delivering it though.

If I was voting --I would want to know exactly whats in it for me and mine--no one else.

A rational not emotional decision. Nothing to do with being born Scottish.
I wont vote--but im now tending to see the S.N.P point of view.
The S.N.P leader in Parliament comes across well as does the First Minister in Scotland.

The illuminate dont have to do anything other than plant an idea in the heads of people, then watch the "fall out." Pun intended.
Collateral damage every where--no matter the end result.

Who knows where this is going

Chris

[Matthew]

I HOPE THAT I'M WRONG

...

David Cameron (who voted to remain) was Prime Minister at that time, and because the referendum received the WRONG ANSWER from the People, he was forced to resign.

IN A DEMOCRACY, PEOPLE ABIDE BY THE MAJORITY'S DECISION.

...


Representatives of the people vs the people

High shenanigans, with pro-EU supporters calling for a second referendum, and rejecting a general election. And we know why, so they can force against leaving the EU. When they say anything else it blends into the endless lies and excuses used to ignore the legitimate referendum result. We didn't vote to leave with a deal, we voted to leave. The people did anyway, which is what this is about. The people vs MPs


Carl Benjemin rants much better than I ever could, with strong language

If MPs think this is going away, they're in for a political shock sooner or later.

nIoWX9QZdBs

[Matt P]

Oh, woe is me! We cannot survive without bigger, more consolidated government to hold our hands, wipe our bums, make our decisions for us and take care of us til our last day! The store shelves will empty forever! The elderly and poor little children won’t be able to get their big pharma poisons! I know we USED to be fine without their powerful bureaucratic institutions but we can’t live without them now! Everything will fall apart and chaos will ensue!
Pardon the sarcasm but 🙄. The corporate fear mongering has taken strong hold, it’s fingerprints everywhere.

Matt

[Baby Steps]

In the following article we see barriers have gone up supposedly to stop vehicle based terrorist attacks.

https://metro.co.uk/2017/03/28/barriers-put-up-to-stop-terror-attack-at-buckingham-palace-6539707/

What the images do not show is a low steel barrier circling green park, unobtrusively. So if these structures are there for the reason claimed, there appears to be a requirement to protect that particular green space from vehicles, but not others.

I noticed that the low steel barrier has post holes, as if fencing could be inserted.

When I saw this I was stumped as to what kind of scenario would require the palace, and governmental buildings to be protected.

I would say very large disordered mass demonstrations. Like the one that brought down the Thatcher Government, but much larger.
The proroguing announcement caused quite alot of anger in London, and many more demos than were covered in the uk press.

Baby Steps. I am completely confuse. The article is from March 28, 2017 ????? Or is it happening again ?

hi,
the hardware went up then, and just stayed.

[Peter UK]

Carl Benjemin rants much better than I ever could, with strong language



If anybody would like a reality check to the usual British reservation here it is.

Have fun!

:)

[greybeard]

Oh, woe is me! We cannot survive without bigger, more consolidated government to hold our hands, wipe our bums, make our decisions for us and take care of us til our last day! The store shelves will empty forever! The elderly and poor little children won’t be able to get their big pharma poisons! I know we USED to be fine without their powerful bureaucratic institutions but we can’t live without them now! Everything will fall apart and chaos will ensue!
Pardon the sarcasm but 🙄. The corporate fear mongering has taken strong hold, it’s fingerprints everywhere.

Matt

Agreed Matt Which is why it is good to be self employed--"make your own way" should be a catch phrase
Chris

[Peter UK]

David Icke's view of the EU

edited version

He said: It's a choice between being controlled by an unelected people cartel of dark suit bureaucrats dictating the fine detail of our lives from Brussels, overriding national law and Parliaments or having laws that affect the people of Britain made within the land of Britain.

The EU is a straight-jacket fascist, communist bureaucratic centralised super state run by dark-suited fat cat bureaucrats in league with dark-suit fat cat heads of giant corporations, in league with manipulative powers that actually run the EU.

uDiGONVJqcU

[enigma3]

I agree with mpennery here. Those bureaucrats who want to remain are showering the air waves with fear mongering and fear porn. Most all of that has no validity.
How many no go zones do the Brits want in London and other cities? How many more good people get stabbed or suffer an acid attack?
When I think of Brussels I think of the despicable murals on building walls that the EU leadership has never criticized. Brussels is rule by the Rothschilds. No thanks.

[sunwings]

Brexit:

What was promised is undeliverable and what is deliverable is undesirable.

There’s not much more to it.

I fully understand this theme that the EU is just Rothschilds, Nazi or NWO. However, there is a biting reality to leaving a system which has webbed its way into every facet of life. I have friends whose businesses will be closed overnight if Britain were to leave without a deal. And let us not forget about the Irish border! My grandparents had to leave Ireland because of the troubles and yet it is being treated with absolute disdain and disrespect.

I really hate to make this personal but our sitting prime minister once arranged to have a journalist beaten up for speaking the truth! He is a man who cannot even state how many biological children he has! So that brings us to today where he has decided to close down parliament for FIVE weeks, thus avoiding PMQ´s and any scrutiny to his plans. Why? Because Boris Johnson has lost 5 of his first 5 commons votes, the first PM in history to do so.

A civil war is not how I would describe it, a coup certainly does!

[greybeard]

Brexit:

What was promised is undeliverable and what is deliverable is undesirable.

There’s not much more to it.

I fully understand this theme that the EU is just Rothschilds, Nazi or NWO. However, there is a biting reality to leaving a system which has webbed its way into every facet of life. I have friends whose businesses will be closed overnight if Britain were to leave without a deal. And let us not forget about the Irish border! My grandparents had to leave Ireland because of the troubles and yet it is being treated with absolute disdain and disrespect.

I really hate to make this personal but our sitting prime minister once arranged to have a journalist beaten up for speaking the truth! He is a man who cannot even state how many biological children he has! So that brings us to today where he has decided to close down parliament for FIVE weeks, thus avoiding PMQ´s and any scrutiny to his plans. Why? Because Boris Johnson has lost 5 of his first 5 commons votes, the first PM in history to do so.

A civil war is not how I would describe it, a coup certainly does!

I can agree with a lot of your post sunwings.
The trouble is that people dont see beyond the promeses that Dictators make--fighting for freedom a common starting point.

People start to believe that the end justify the means and thats rarely true if ever.

The small businesses are the heart of the economy they employ the most people in total--small businesses are very vulnerable and with a dramatic instant exit many, as sunwings has pointed out, will go to the wall--employees loosing their jobs, less revenue in tax for all the things the Government is currently promising.
Where is that money coming from?
Well you the tax payer.
No free lunch ever.
Small business employers feel a responsibility to their staff--the staff is their business.

Its a reality check

Anything that is built on a false premise--milk and honey-- is doomed to fail.
The ones that support dictators are very often the first to be collateral damage---the end justify s the means--only it does not.

Chris

[Peter UK]

I really hate to make this personal but our sitting prime minister once arranged to have a journalist beaten up for speaking the truth! He is a man who cannot even state how many biological children he has! So that brings us to today where he has decided to close down parliament for FIVE weeks, thus avoiding PMQ´s and any scrutiny to his plans. Why? Because Boris Johnson has lost 5 of his first 5 commons votes, the first PM in history to do so.

A civil war is not how I would describe it, a coup certainly does!

AND YET the Conservative selection process voted him in by a landslide!

What does that tell us about the state of British politics at the moment?

[greybeard]

I really hate to make this personal but our sitting prime minister once arranged to have a journalist beaten up for speaking the truth! He is a man who cannot even state how many biological children he has! So that brings us to today where he has decided to close down parliament for FIVE weeks, thus avoiding PMQ´s and any scrutiny to his plans. Why? Because Boris Johnson has lost 5 of his first 5 commons votes, the first PM in history to do so.

A civil war is not how I would describe it, a coup certainly does!

AND YET the Conservative selection process voted him in by a landslide!

What does that tell us about the state of British politics at the moment?

If your looking for an answer it may be found here---warning spiritual content.
Not saying im correct Chris

http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?860-Enlightenment-and-related-matters.&p=1313400&viewfull=1#post1313400

[Matthew]

Some MP's are still talking sense on the subject:

Ivan Lewis MP explains why democracy is important.



"[Most MP's] have displayed an increasing contempt for our duty as democrats to respect and implement the [referendum] result. They lecture others about democracy, accountability and our national interest - yet they are hell bent on frustrating the will of the majority of the people as expressed in that referendum"


"It is many of the so called progressives in this house who are fuelling right-wing extremism by showing contempt for the result and the majority who voted to leave"


The MP for Bury South makes a great point: democracy has a practical function, and our MP's take the privilege of being voted in as our representative for granted

Fox News youtube
UK Parliament votes against early election in latest blow to Boris Johnson

Direct link to Ivan's speach: https://youtu.be/ghyYynaMJgM?t=2636

Here is the whole video

Ivan Lewis starts 44 minutes into the video and ends at 49 minutes

ghyYynaMJgM

[greybeard]

To my mind the yes vote was based on a false premise ( We would all be better off)--the public were manipulated, fed all kind of information since proved to be some what short of the truth.
Yes some knew what they were voting for--exit deal or no deal.

I have no problem with leaving but I have a problem with the lies told, and avoidance of the consequences of a no-deal by the current Government.

The TUC has now come out in favour of remain.
They are for the working population and will have fully investigated the consequences of a no deal Brexit.

A no deal will lead to untold hardship for many according to the Government report.
Trade deals can not be established the day after a no deal exit--no deal means no deal--full tariff will apply to goods in and out of UK till deals are done and that will take quite some time.

Quite a few of MPs who are angry, are for exit but with a deal---shutting down
Parliament, I suspect, is to avoid question time.
Boris is not good at answering questions and in fact avoids answering them most of the time.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I think it is now time for those who have reached voting age, since the referendum, to be allowed a referendum--the end result will affect them the most.
There is a lot more information now regarding pros and cons of leaving.
A three box one would do.
1leave without a deal
2 leave with a deal
3 dont leave.
simple.

For sure the whole situation is madness.

Chris

[Matthew]

To my mind the yes vote was based on a false premise
...

That will be the Kool-Aid*1. My suggestion: don't drink it

*1 Mainstream media fear porn etc

[Baby Steps]

Here is the image of the barrier around Green Park. Vehicle barrier with holes to insert a fence perhaps

https://i.imgur.com/EKOY9yt.jpg

The following may explain a possible scenario where serious strife is engineered in order to facilitate a kind of martial law:

https://i.imgur.com/KmT293Q.jpg

[greybeard]

Once upon a time I would have said "No way Baby"
Now its all so surreal --anybody's guess where all this is going.
Chris