Changing one's mind

[Catsquotl]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EZsMxEKWAAAAgqI.jpg

[Gemma13]

And that's the koolaid the movement uses to sell and promote their hidden agenda.

I cannot believe, that out of all the words in language to put together for a global slogan, the creators of this slogan did not think it through enough to recognize that it would be confusing and provocative enough to create more harm than good by turning millions of people away from the cause instead of supporting it.

[Sarah Rainsong]

BLM was not started as a global slogan. Take it back to its roots. BLM was used as a phrase in America to address the problem that black lives are treated as expendable by the police and the government that employees them.

The more people change this original intent, the more they are "drinking the Kool Aid" of those that are trying to hijack and subvert what is otherwise a genuine attempt at gathering awareness and addressing systemic problems in the US.

[Catsquotl]

cvz9uSK3zXo

[Catsquotl]

it would be confusing and provocative enough to create more harm than good by turning millions of people away from the cause instead of supporting it.

I am curious as to what you perceive the cause to be.

[Gemma13]

BLM was not started as a global slogan. Take it back to its roots. BLM was used as a phrase in America to address the problem that black lives are treated as expendable by the police and the government that employees them.

The more people change this original intent, the more they are "drinking the Kool Aid" of those that are trying to hijack and subvert what is otherwise a genuine attempt at gathering awareness and addressing systemic problems in the US.

But the original intent evolved and went global because that is what the Movement wanted.  We can't go back to just the original intention. 


WHAT WE BELIEVE - BLACK LIVES MATTER MANIFESTO

https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe/

Four years ago, what is now known as the Black Lives Matter Global Network began to organize. It started out as a chapter-based, member-led organization whose mission was to build local power and to intervene when violence was inflicted on Black communities by the state and vigilantes.

In the years since, we’ve committed to struggling together and to imagining and creating a world free of anti-Blackness, where every Black person has the social, economic, and political power to thrive.

Black Lives Matter began as a call to action in response to state-sanctioned violence and anti-Black racism. Our intention from the very beginning was to connect Black people from all over the world who have a shared desire for justice to act together in their communities. The impetus for that commitment was, and still is, the rampant and deliberate violence inflicted on us by the state.

Enraged by the death of Trayvon Martin and the subsequent acquittal of his killer, George Zimmerman, and inspired by the 31-day takeover of the Florida State Capitol by POWER U and the Dream Defenders, we took to the streets. A year later, we set out together on the Black Lives Matter Freedom Ride to Ferguson, in search of justice for Mike Brown and all of those who have been torn apart by state-sanctioned violence and anti-Black racism. Forever changed, we returned home and began building the infrastructure for the Black Lives Matter Global Network, which, even in its infancy, has become a political home for many.

Ferguson helped to catalyze a movement to which we’ve all helped give life. Organizers who call this network home have ousted anti-Black politicians, won critical legislation to benefit Black lives, and changed the terms of the debate on Blackness around the world. Through movement and relationship building, we have also helped catalyze other movements and shifted culture with an eye toward the dangerous impacts of anti-Blackness.

These are the results of our collective efforts.

The Black Lives Matter Global Network is as powerful as it is because of our membership, our partners, our supporters, our staff, and you. Our continued commitment to liberation for all Black people means we are continuing the work of our ancestors and fighting for our collective freedom because it is our duty.

Every day, we recommit to healing ourselves and each other, and to co-creating alongside comrades, allies, and family a culture where each person feels seen, heard, and supported.

We acknowledge, respect, and celebrate differences and commonalities.

We work vigorously for freedom and justice for Black people and, by extension, all people.


BLM acknowledge that all lives matter.  So why not evolve and change the meme to truly reflect the cause for freedom and justice to all.

It's a no-brainer this movement could seriously create a far more powerful force of unity than the implied division and exclusion currently being experienced.

So why is the hierarchical intelligence in this movement not doing something about it.
We intentionally build and nurture a beloved community that is bonded together through a beautiful struggle that is restorative, not depleting.

We are unapologetically Black in our positioning. In affirming that Black Lives Matter, we need not qualify our position. To love and desire freedom and justice for ourselves is a prerequisite for wanting the same for others.

We see ourselves as part of the global Black family, and we are aware of the different ways we are impacted or privileged as Black people who exist in different parts of the world.

We are guided by the fact that all Black lives matter, regardless of actual or perceived sexual identity, gender identity, gender expression, economic status, ability, disability, religious beliefs or disbeliefs, immigration status, or location.

We make space for transgender brothers and sisters to participate and lead.

We are self-reflexive and do the work required to dismantle cisgender privilege and uplift Black trans folk, especially Black trans women who continue to be disproportionately impacted by trans-antagonistic violence.

We build a space that affirms Black women and is free from sexism, misogyny, and environments in which men are centered.

We practice empathy. We engage comrades with the intent to learn about and connect with their contexts.

We make our spaces family-friendly and enable parents to fully participate with their children. We dismantle the patriarchal practice that requires mothers to work “double shifts” so that they can mother in private even as they participate in public justice work.

We disrupt the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure requirement by supporting each other as extended families and “villages” that collectively care for one another, especially our children, to the degree that mothers, parents, and children are comfortable.

We foster a queer‐affirming network. When we gather, we do so with the intention of freeing ourselves from the tight grip of heteronormative thinking, or rather, the belief that all in the world are heterosexual (unless s/he or they disclose otherwise).

We cultivate an intergenerational and communal network free from ageism. We believe that all people, regardless of age, show up with the capacity to lead and learn.

We embody and practice justice, liberation, and peace in our engagements with one another.


If a strategy to unite blacks is actually causing division amongst them and the movement stubbornly persists without going back to the drawing board to make some changes, then something is seriously wrong.

That's what makes me question the integrity of this movement now.

[Satori]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EZsMxEKWAAAAgqI.jpg

Pure sophistry. And, yes, I would respond with “Save all forests.”

[Gemma13]

Oh, perhaps everyone missed this:
rdpIIiBe7Wc

Then this might start to make sense (in that order):
(edit: worth watching till the end, or skipping to the end. The end where he gives a little talk is the bit)
BEb9Q78W6PY

The first video above shows BLM Founder saying they are trained Marxists.


[QUOTE=Gemma13;1363216][

WHAT WE BELIEVE - BLACK LIVES MATTER MANIFESTO

https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe/

(........)

 Forever changed, we returned home and began building the infrastructure for the Black Lives Matter Global Network, which, even in its infancy, has become a political home for many.

Ferguson helped to catalyze a movement to which we’ve all helped give life. Organizers who call this network home have ousted anti-Black politicians, won critical legislation to benefit Black lives, and changed the terms of the debate on Blackness around the world. Through movement and relationship building, we have also helped catalyze other movements and shifted culture with an eye toward the dangerous impacts of anti-Blackness.

These are the results of our collective efforts.

The Black Lives Matter Global Network is as powerful as it is because of our membership, our partners, our supporters, our staff, and you. Our continued commitment to liberation for all Black people means we are continuing the work of our ancestors and fighting for our collective freedom because it is our duty.

/QUOTE]

[Bill Ryan]

Pure sophistry. And, yes, I would respond with “Save all forests.”Yep.

Sophistry (https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/sophistry) = the use of fallacious arguments, especially with the intention of deceiving.

[Mike]

BLM was not started as a global slogan. Take it back to its roots. BLM was used as a phrase in America to address the problem that black lives are treated as expendable by the police and the government that employees them.

The more people change this original intent, the more they are "drinking the Kool Aid" of those that are trying to hijack and subvert what is otherwise a genuine attempt at gathering awareness and addressing systemic problems in the US.



Hi Sarah, I want to agree that the movement has been hijacked, and to some degree perhaps it has...but much of what they write on their own website is pretty damning

In your opinion, who are the genuine protesters and who are the hijackers? And how does one make that distinction? I'm asking from a space of sincere confusion. I'm truly open to having my mind changed. But this is so murky to me.

The people toppling statues, are they the hijackers or the sincere protesters? What about the movie and book banning crowd? What about the blackmailers, creating lists of people and businesses that haven't expressed support for BLM and making them public so as to extort money? What about the cancelers? What about the "disband the police" crowd? What about the people that want to destroy any Christian imagery that depicts Jesus as a white man? What about the reparations crowd? Are all the looters automatically put in the hijacker category? If so, why?

It seems to me that the supporters of BLM are just arbitrarily deciding who the good guys and who the bad guys are as this thing moves forward. Looters? Oh, they're the bad guys. Nothing to do with us. Well, how do you know? I think BLM has to accept that it's a mix of good and bad, and accept responsibility for both

What I see is a disorganized, hodge-podge of ideas and philosophies with no clear intent aside from destroying western civilization and recreating it in the form of a Marxist dystopia. There may have been a wonderful and lovely intent originally, but this is what it appears to be now.

And as I see it we have to deal with what's in front of us, not what we wish was in front of us if a hijacker
element didn't exist.

[Matthew]

WHAT WE BELIEVE - BLACK LIVES MATTER MANIFESTO

https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe (https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe/)

(........)

I see what you mean, their manifesto and actions paint different stories.

If I was to quote the founders of BLM, then some of the things they've said would, quite literally, be inflammatory against what they call 'white people'. I don't want to go there, so I won't but they are very horrible people. Despite this, on the whole, BLM is more of that feeling in peoples heart. It's rather good seeing more cerebral, calm voices, with the right 'virtue authority', speaking out against BLM the organisation

[Bill Ryan]

If I was to quote the founders of BLM, then some of the things they've said would, quite literally, be inflammatory against what they call 'white people'. I don't want to go there, so I won't but they are very horrible people. Despite this, on the whole, BLM is more of that feeling in peoples heart. It's rather good seeing more cerebral, calm voices, with the right 'virtue authority', speaking out against BLM the organisationIt's deliberately designed to be confusing and manipulative.

Of course, black lives matter. That's axiomatic. There's not a single person reading this who'd disagree.

But when one criticizes the organization (in Title Case!), the very wording of their name is then used to imply that you're a racist. That's purposeful.

If the name of the organization was Burn Down America (far more representative of the organizers' core values!) then there'd be very little confusion or misunderstanding about what's really happening here.

[Matthew]

Strange you mention title case. This appeared today: I almost posted it the 'noticed anything crazy?' thread, but didn't think it was crazy enough by today's standards. Three days ago perhaps.


AP Changes Style Guide to Capitalize ‘B’ in ‘Black’
https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2020/06/26/ap-style-guide-capitalize-black/

[Catsquotl]

When minds are made up, it seems unwilling to change. I find it funny to see how on the one hand it is encouraged to think for ones self, to make ones own choices there is an information lashing back which seems to follow a divide and conquer strategy against those that try to make sense of it all.

Suddenly individuals are labeled activists and their psyches analysed and regretted in diminishing and dumbed down phrases and words

Seems to me we picked up a lot from our contemporaries.

What I think we fail to see in this case is that people are struggling and wanting to be heard.
The truth will set one free, but first it will make you angry is a slogan that has been uttered a lot, but when that anger has reached a critical point. There's a slap on the wrist. And an accompanying stories of how and where to direct ones anger to someone else's agenda..

Make of it what you will.

[Islander12]

To me their slogan from the beginning should have been ‘all lives matter’.....I will not change my mind on that, nor will I support their movement.

Sorry I keep getting interrupted when I on here and didn’t finish my thought....I won’t support the movement that singles out one race as deserving something over any other, everyone could have gotten behind the ALM movement with less/no fighting.

[Catsquotl]

To me their slogan from the beginning should have been ‘all lives matter’.....I will not change my mind on that, nor will I support their movement.

Good. No one is forcing you too. And if someone says otherwise. Don't believe them.

[Matthew]

Changing my mind.

BLM is claiming racial supremacy, exclusive rights pieces of identity victim-hood, makes out humans weren't enslaving each other since humanity began, and piggy backs on the feeling in your heart. Yet turns into violent intimidation. Somehow in a swamp of well meaning sympathy, the truth seems to be disrespected; please see the violent movement, because it's quite overtly a real thing and happening in cities near me (London). BLM, in one way or another, is doing more harm to their voice and cause, and that's not my fault. Change my mind

[rgray222]

If someone says save the rainforest you don't respond
Save ALL the forest. Do you?

Yes, I would respond that ALL Forest Matter


By agreeing with the premise put forward you are not agreeing with words you are agreeing with an exceedingly political organization.

As a matter of fact BLM is already transforming into a third political party (https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/23/robert-johnson-urges-black-lives-matter-to-form-a-political-party.html). Most people are not aware of it but it is on the horizon and moving forward at the speed of light. At the end of the day they will be no different than Republicans or Democrats.


BLM's goals are many and some admirable, you can read about them here (https://blacklivesmatter.com/about/).
Oddly enough you won't even find the word racism on their about page (https://blacklivesmatter.com/about/?__cf_chl_jschl_tk__=745e5649200c1b9ffddc74626f788ce16229648d-1593358870-0-AZ-Pp8HwLMBjbsEhMbZOCw6tITo7NBhNBtvtbkrJL6ZZJ2VKaYizye8K-O2KEGrx1LXnVtx9CAmZM2w3_L6NYcFegt9yrGrg8Uu0LhuWEFKFVCEJLK2dzSLKGRXGdu41-CNgmX9Z90MjNde--UvDioXBuMLuhh5wFd_zJ6nv32X6jZEvyzzM4SWUt6HESXnJojtjAr7LsTD83AnIkTyz9wSTKXNim8izvH8cjH7HnAhjZpzdlWoaB VlMBCgjICbpoNg1xW_yITibUF3okAnGgnB3oHWHdSpVXUU0dDlfvCBg6FMZJcJV-2gMSNr4PGhO__sYkrTKxmFO6_aW76ECBCg).
BLM supports Marxism, don't believe it read this (https://www.socialistalternative.org/marxism-fight-black-freedom/black-lives-matter-marxism/)
BLM Supports the Black Panthers, don't believe it read this (https://www.socialistalternative.org/marxism-fight-black-freedom/lessons-black-panthers/)
We have seen over the last several weeks that BLM has actively instigated and participated in vandalism and arson. No amount of justification can condone this behavior.
BLM has publicly stated that one of their major goals is removal of Donald Trump (https://www.texasinsider.org/articles/black-lives-matter-founder-goal-is-to-remove-trump-reveals-marxist-ideology). Can't get more political than that.
BLM is the epitome of identity politics, which most people now understand to cause division not unity.
The nonviolent approach is what wins allies and mollifies enemies. But what we have seen come out of black lives matter is rage and anger — justifiable emotions, but questionable strategy. Learning from history is necessary, powerful and effective and it appears that BLM has made no attempt to do so.


There should be no shame or guilt in saying I do not support black lives matter.

Many people admire activism of BLM but fundamentally disagree with their approach and that is not a bad thing. Not supporting BLM does not automatically make you a card-carrying member of the KKK. The thought police would tell you otherwise.

There certainly should be no shame or guilt for saying I do not support Marxism or the violent tactics of the Black Panthers. This does not mean you support racism.

I have always believed that thought is the most important aspect of human life but running a close second are words. Thought matters and words matter. You cannot speak words and then tell people that they mean something else. Black lives matter does not mean or even imply that all lives matter.

[shaberon]

Well, if you see what else has happened, the Republican Convention has been relocated to Jacksonville.

I am told that if there *was* somewhere that crazy black people would do something to a white politician, it would be there. For the most part, they hate that entire clique.

There is already the appearance of some intimidating, generic cars, which I take to be Secret Service.

It's like changing Kennedy's route in Dallas at the last moment, but, this is already re-routed and everyone knows. It just sounds like a powder keg.

Then I was told to vote Libertarian. I might not complain too much if someone's independent research makes them select a Libertarian candidate.

[william r sanford72]

When I picked up the bee thread..(thank You Bill)..I was already well aware of the state /decline of the environment.my heart..Logical thought process and Intuition led me to fully believe that bringing knowledge of the state and decline of the honey bees could bring awareness to the other issues we were facing and were going to have to face sooner than later regarding the condtions of planet EARTH.The Bees Were a Bridge...to a greater awareness.

for some that is..

Just some thoughts I wanted to throw out there.

now on to the Ranch thread..

William.:flower:

[Constance]

In light of the title of the thread, Changing one's mind, I warmly invite anyone who has not yet seen this thread to take a peek. :heart:

How you really make decisions and the confirmation bias affect.
(http://projectavalon.net/forum4/showthread.php?110875-How-You-Really-Make-Decisions-and-the-confirmation-bias-affect)