Tom Nichols, Professor at Naval College, Right Wing critic discusses crazy left, etc...

[AutumnW]

Tom Nichols, the author of The Death of Expertise, a professor at the Naval War College. He says, " I have excoriated people on the left for most of my career. But only opposing Trump produced harassment, demands to fire me, and death threats. Cancel culture, indeed."

"I mean, I have blistered everyone from Obama to Hillary Clinton, and across the seas to Putin and Assad. For years, I was an outspoken conservative. But I never encountered McCarthyist thuggery like the kind I've gotten from the Cult of Trump."
[I]
"I am not blind to the totalitarian streak on the left. I wrote about it - and at The Federalist, back in the day, no less. Amazingly, no one on the left tried to get me fired for it or told me I'd be hung as a traitor or left endless f-bombs on my voicemail at work."

"The difference is that the GOP is now in power and owned, completely, by its fringe - one that is frantic with fear and anger."

"You want me to worry about college Marxists? Yeah, I'll get right on that as soon as we dislodge the febrile anti-constitutionalists of the GOP.
I have plenty of concerns about the left. But right now, I'd like to deal with the obvious and demonstrated threat from the right."

"So take all your fears of rampaging drag queens and how Joe Biden is controlled by the College Spartacists, and put 'em in a sock, pally. I'll be first in line to oppose extremist left-wing dumbassery - once we defeat far more dangerous people like Barr and McConnell."

https://twitter.com/radiofreetom/status/1279536145903345665

[Arcturian108]

Whoa! What universe did Tom Nichols wake up in? I haven't heard of a single Left-wing speaker being prevented from giving talks at any university, but I have heard of lots of
Right-wing speakers being blocked from talking in front of students.

[AutumnW]

He wouldn't dispute your comments, Arcturian. You might be missing the deeper point he is making. "I'm not blind to authoritarianism streak on the left" covers that pretty well, right?:waving:

[Arcturian108]

I believe the context is the problem. His context is a job at a Naval College, which would be one of the few Right-wing bastions left in academia. No wonder he is out-of-place.

[AutumnW]

The context has nothing to do with death threats.

[AutumnW]

Sorry Arcturian,

I have been really frustrated with this topic lately. I shouldn't have taken it out on you!

[AutumnW]

I am bumping this. Everybody should be reading it, including those who want to create morphic fields.

[Mike]

There are freaks on both sides. This could be argued any number of ways, but the way I see it is that the freaks on the left largely created the freaks on the right by playing identity politics. They went too far and created the very adversaries they so loathe today.

But yes, Trump fanatics can be nuts too! The problem is, the left controls everything at the moment. Trump is our president, sure, but the left is currently dominating the media, the universities, corporate culture, entertainment, and even sports now. Marxism is affecting everything now, not just the universities. The man sounds a little naive. When did he make these comments?

[AutumnW]

There are freaks on both sides. This could be argued any number of ways, but the way I see it is that the freaks on the left largely created the freaks on the right by playing identity politics. They went too far and created the very adversaries they so loathe today.

But yes, Trump fanatics can be nuts too! The problem is, the left controls everything at the moment. Trump is our president, sure, but the left is currently dominating the media, the universities, corporate culture, entertainment, and even sports now. Marxism is affecting everything now, not just the universities. The man sounds a little naive. When did he make these comments?

He made those comments a couple of days ago on Twitter. I linked to it. I agree with you 100% about the freaks on the left creating the freaks on the right. And am sure he would agree as well.

But here is the thing--and it would make a great comedy. Imagine any of these looney left kids in military boot camp. That's where the rubber hits the road. Effete hipsters insisting on being addressed by their favorite pronoun? That would be like walking around with a sandwich board on with "beat me up" in big red letters. It wouldn't fly. None of that nonsense would fly at all.

From a military perspective (and he is a naval professor,) he is remarking on immediate threats and filtering it through his understanding of the constitution.

So while people are preoccupied with the looney left, the Christian militarists are dismantling the legal system, such as it was. Trump supporters have been conditioned to believe all liberals are on the looney left, while McConell and Barr dismantle basic checks and balances written into the constitution. It's magic. Ignore the right hand and keep focussed on the left hand. This is metaphorically and almost literally true.

There is an appearance of the left being in control because there is a veneer of acceptance within some of the media empires and tokenism within corporations because they don't want to lose consumers, many of whom are young. But they don't control social media. They don't control the military and they don't control government. The loony left control is a bit like wallpaper. If you tear it off and examine the infrastructure you'd be surprised at what you would find.

The totalitarian tip toe coming from the loony left is just that, a slow process that can be easily overwhelmed by current hard powers.

In truth, most people are arrayed around the middle of the left right divide. It's interesting what is occuring in spite of that.:flower:

[Justjane]

There are freaks on both sides. This could be argued any number of ways, but the way I see it is that the freaks on the left largely created the freaks on the right by playing identity politics. They went too far and created the very adversaries they so loathe today.

But yes, Trump fanatics can be nuts too! The problem is, the left controls everything at the moment. Trump is our president, sure, but the left is currently dominating the media, the universities, corporate culture, entertainment, and even sports now. Marxism is affecting everything now, not just the universities. The man sounds a little naive. When did he make these comments?

He made those comments a couple of days ago on Twitter. I linked to it. I agree with you 100% about the freaks on the left creating the freaks on the right. And am sure he would agree as well.

But here is the thing--and it would make a great comedy. Imagine any of these looney left kids in military boot camp. That's where the rubber hits the road. Effete hipsters insisting on being addressed by their favorite pronoun? That would be like walking around with a sandwich board on with "beat me up" in big red letters. It wouldn't fly. None of that nonsense would fly at all.

From a military perspective (and he is a naval professor,) he is remarking on immediate threats and filtering it through his understanding of the constitution.

So while people are preoccupied with the looney left, the Christian militarists are dismantling the legal system, such as it was. Trump supporters have been conditioned to believe all liberals are on the looney left, while McConell and Barr dismantle basic checks and balances written into the constitution. It's magic. Ignore the right hand and keep focussed on the left hand. This is metaphorically and almost literally true.

There is an appearance of the left being in control because there is a veneer of acceptance within some of the media empires and tokenism within corporations because they don't want to lose consumers, many of whom are young. But they don't control social media. They don't control the military and they don't control government. The loony left control is a bit like wallpaper. If you tear it off and examine the infrastructure you'd be surprised at what you would find.

The totalitarian tip toe coming from the loony left is just that, a slow process that can be easily overwhelmed by current hard powers.

In truth, most people are arrayed around the middle of the left right divide. It's interesting what is occuring in spite of that.:flower:

Yep, this nails it, and this is THE point. The media and corporations arent left wing, they’re virtual signalling for likes and sales, not the same thing at all, and the loony left don’t have any actual political power beyond cancelling some dick on Twitter, sure, it might hurt their livelihood but give it a month or two and they’ll be right back where they were unless they went all out Weinstein or Spacey. In fact, for many, it only ups there credibility.

And focusing on the extreme left also takes away attention from the real issues that the left works for particularly at the root level. These things can’t even get traction now because JK Rowling said people who get periods are called women.

I don’t understand the situation in the US, I never will, your interpretation of left vs right seems to be pretty different to the rest of the worlds where freedom and the rights of the common man was a left wing issue, I’ve realised in some of my conversations recently here and in other spaces that I’ve been at cross purposes with others just because there was a fundamental difference in the way those things were understood.

The same thing your describing is happening here in Australia. Scary times indeed but it’s up to us to do better. To see above what’s happening on all sides.

[spade]

There's left and right, and then there's most people in the middle.

Left is tyrannical rule within the frame of lawlessness, corruption, and chaos.

Right is freedom within the bounds of morality, ethics and order.

The problem is the terms get mixed up with rubbish such as liberalism, libertarianism, liberty, liberal : essentially too subtle for most of the masses to sort out the difference.

One uses lust as a motivator which results in guilt and fear of being found out leading to lies and coverup, the other uses love as a motivator, which results in openness, transparency and truth.

No prizes for guessing which side uses what.

[TomKat]

McConell and Barr dismantle basic checks and balances written into the constitution.

The Dept of Justice should go back to gun-running and narco-trafficking as in the previous administration. That way they would avoid all the criticism from the Left. :-)

[AutumnW]

McConell and Barr dismantle basic checks and balances written into the constitution.

The Dept of Justice should go back to gun-running and narco-trafficking as in the previous administration. That way they would avoid all the criticism from the Left. :-)

Please elaborate TomKat. I understand that the Justice Department is corrupt. The corruption goes back decades -- centuries, but this isn't the same as rewriting or ignoring constitutional law. I try to avoid tit for tat dialogue. Hopefully, this thread remains conversational, not sensational.

[Forest Denizen]

There's left and right, and then there's most people in the middle.

Left is tyrannical rule within the frame of lawlessness, corruption, and chaos.

Right is freedom within the bounds of morality, ethics and order.

The problem is the terms get mixed up with rubbish such as liberalism, libertarianism, liberty, liberal : essentially too subtle for most of the masses to sort out the difference.

One uses lust as a motivator which results in guilt and fear of being found out leading to lies and coverup, the other uses love as a motivator, which results in openness, transparency and truth.

No prizes for guessing which side uses what.

Very interesting observation, Spade.

I could just as easily say Right is tyrannical rule within the frame of lawlessness, corruption, and chaos.

Left is freedom within the bounds of morality, ethics and order.

And yes, the Right uses lust as a motivator which results in guilt and fear of being found out leading to lies and coverup, the Left uses love as a motivator, which results in openness, transparency and truth.

This whole Left Right divide does seem to be getting us nowhere fast.

[Justjane]

There's left and right, and then there's most people in the middle.

Left is tyrannical rule within the frame of lawlessness, corruption, and chaos.

Right is freedom within the bounds of morality, ethics and order.

The problem is the terms get mixed up with rubbish such as liberalism, libertarianism, liberty, liberal : essentially too subtle for most of the masses to sort out the difference.

One uses lust as a motivator which results in guilt and fear of being found out leading to lies and coverup, the other uses love as a motivator, which results in openness, transparency and truth.

No prizes for guessing which side uses what.

Very interesting observation, Spade.

I could just as easily say Right is tyrannical rule within the frame of lawlessness, corruption, and chaos.

Left is freedom within the bounds of morality, ethics and order.

And yes, the Right uses lust as a motivator which results in guilt and fear of being found out leading to lies and coverup, the Left uses love as a motivator, which results in openness, transparency and truth.

This whole Left Right divide does seem to be getting us nowhere fast.

Yeah, I categorically disagree with Spades interpretation and so does the rest of the world fortunately.

[Bluegreen]

It is time to leave Left vs Right behind

1275547010213519361
https://twitter.com/diana_murphy613/status/1275547010213519361

[Catsquotl]

There are freaks on both sides. This could be argued any number of ways, but the way I see it is that the freaks on the left largely created the freaks on the right by playing identity politics. They went too far and created the very adversaries they so loathe today.

But yes, Trump fanatics can be nuts too! The problem is, the left controls everything at the moment. Trump is our president, sure, but the left is currently dominating the media, the universities, corporate culture, entertainment, and even sports now. Marxism is affecting everything now, not just the universities. The man sounds a little naive. When did he make these comments?

I think you have your history glasses on wrong. They freaks on the left as you put it have been going wrong for only a few years now. Those on the Right have been far scarier for far longer. I realize where you perceive the danger to be coming from.
Don't let it keep you from contemplating what is happening from a historical context before you start spewing half truths yourself to make your point.

[TomKat]

McConell and Barr dismantle basic checks and balances written into the constitution.

The Dept of Justice should go back to gun-running and narco-trafficking as in the previous administration. That way they would avoid all the criticism from the Left. :-)

Please elaborate TomKat.

Remember gun-running operation Fast and Furious and Obama stonewalling the investigation? And then when HSBC was caught laundering Mexican narco money, Obama let them off with a slap on the wrist.


I understand that the Justice Department is corrupt. The corruption goes back decades -- centuries, but this isn't the same as rewriting or ignoring constitutional law.

Trying to discern the difference between law and constitutional law... are constitutional laws the laws you like and regular laws...? anyway, laws are regularly ignored by various government agencies.

[AutumnW]

TomKat,

Thanks for responding. I consider both the dems and repuglicans to be different teams that play for the same league. You won't get an argument from me here. Most presidents, if I am correct here, don't involve themselves with the justice departments. It's a sewer and is separate from the executive branch. Nixon tried to control the department and now Trump. You can defend his actions but it will derail the thread a bit. But again, thanks for responding.

The hard right from both parties do most of their work through the military. And the American military has become an international fascist organization, with intelligence apparatus and hard control, right now. It isn't a potential threat that presents in effete mannerisms, weird preoccupations, and "rule by victimization." It's an actual hard core threat to those who don't go along with the system.

[AutumnW]

It is time to leave Left vs Right behind

1275547010213519361
https://twitter.com/diana_murphy613/status/1275547010213519361

We should all be aware of media hype while we reflect on the rationality of our biases and or beliefs. Like a perspective study in art class, you could say a fuzzy background informs the middle ground. We have to keep it amorphous and expansive and avoid perspective vanishing points.

We are spiritual beings having a material existence. The foreground of this life is where we live and interact with others. The very obvious concrete nature of reality, lived day to day is softened by ongoing reflection on the background and a willingness to let it's energetic signature bleed through.

But...it is still necessary to experience the obstructive nature of the foreground, because the greatest part of being born into it, is to afford us the opportunity to change our minds.

This is only going to happen through obstruction, through problems, through direct experience of pain and through exposure to ideas that counter our own. This is why conversation rather than debate is important. It is an opportunity, a gift, something experienced in the foreground, the mundane, where we live and work and interact with others.

You don't want to live in a fuzzy, undifferentiated background. It's lacks definition and renders everything meaningless unless it is allowed to bleed through into the middle and foreground. That is satisfying both in art and in life.

[Justjane]

It is time to leave Left vs Right behind

1275547010213519361
https://twitter.com/diana_murphy613/status/1275547010213519361

We should all be aware of media hype while we reflect on the rationality of our biases and or beliefs. Like a perspective study in art class, you could say a fuzzy background informs the middle ground. We have to keep it amorphous and expansive and avoid perspective vanishing points.

We are spiritual beings having a material existence. The foreground of this life is where we live and interact with others. The very obvious concrete nature of reality, lived day to day is softened by ongoing reflection on the background and a willingness to let it's energetic signature bleed through.

But...it is still necessary to experience the obstructive nature of the foreground, because the greatest part of being born into it, is to afford us the opportunity to change our minds.

This is only going to happen through obstruction, through problems, through direct experience of pain and through exposure to ideas that counter our own. This is why conversation rather than debate is important. It is an opportunity, a gift, something experienced in the foreground, the mundane, where we live and work and interact with others.

You don't want to live in a fuzzy, undifferentiated background. It's lacks definition and renders everything meaningless unless it is allowed to bleed through into the middle and foreground. That is satisfying both in art and in life.

For all of this year, I have been trying to refocus the conversation on what people want rather than what they think. There is so much disinformation on both sides that to me at least, trying to work out what I think has become redundant. There’s just no point. What I can be sure of is what I want. What I want the world to look like, what I want my life to look like, and to start taking action towards those things rather than continually wasting my time lost in circular conversations. As I keep saying, I have a feeling that despite our differences, we do want pretty much the same things.

[Bill Ryan]

I have a feeling that despite our differences, we do want pretty much the same things.Yes, well said, and I wholeheartedly agree.

:sun: